italo:


This cannot be taken seriously by any right thinking person because the person you're quoting does not exist.

Malachi Martin didn't exist?

shadeyinka:


You needn't get upset by the statement quoted.

The early Apostles never put on the kind of robes put on by the catholic priests. They wore their normal day to day dress. If Jesus didn't put on a priestly robe, His disciples did not have any reason to.

It would have been illegal for Jesus to even put on the Jewish priestly robes at his time. So, what example would Peter be following.

You should know that the religious ceremonies taken fore granted now were not possible in the catacombs.

A Bishop was supposed to be a husband of one wife ..NOT celebrate. Mybfriend, there is a huge difference.

Pls check out:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Orthodox_Church

I hope you know that the orthodox church broke from the catholic church btw 1054-1600s and the all have priestly robes, celibate bishops and sirach etc in their bible?
d ceremonies in d catholic church are d same with those found in d catacombs!
So who are ur early xtians?

DoctorAlien:
Walter A. Elwell (editor), "Evangelical Dictionary of Theology" (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Book House, 1984), page 141.

We all know how good the catholic church is at forgery. Indeed, Rome was called "the home forgery" during the dark ages. Moreover, stop deluding yourself: the Roman Catholic church did not produce the Bible. The Bible was written by holy men of GOD who were not Roman Catholics. They didn't pray to Mary, they didn't collect indulgences, they didn't institute any office of celibate priesthood filled with homosexual priests who keep on molesting children and women who come for confession, or unholy, corrupt, greedy and immoral popes.

But one of them (Judas) sold him for 30 silver pieces, one (Peter) denied him 3 times, one (Paul) killed many Christians, one (Thomas) doubted his resurrection, and all (12) struggled to be the greatest.

Who called Rome the home of forgery? Another of your imaginary ex-nuns?

DoctorAlien:


Malachi Martin didn't exist?

Mary Ann Collins didnt exist. Alberto Rivera was never a Jesuit Priest.

Let me add some refreshing history to this thread; to all lovers of the truth.

Constantine and the Council of Nicea

In the early 300s, during the time of the most severe persecution against all professing Christians, the Roman armies proclaimed their favorite general, Constantine, as Caesar. He had claimed victory after defeating his rival, Maxentius, at the Battle of Milvian Bridge outside Rome. Prior to that battle, he was said to have had a vision of the first two letters of the name of “Christ” (in Greek, chi (X) and rho (P)) and heard a voice that told him, “By this sign you will conquer.” He felt that the meaning of the letters he had seen was unmistakably symbolic of Christ and thus, he was indebted to Christianity for his victory, in spite of being an established sun worshiper. Immediately upon becoming Emperor, he issued the Edict of Toleration, which gave Christianity legality in the empire. This ended the ten years of severe persecution against the true Church, but paved the way for false Christianity to rise to prominence in the empire (“The History of the Church of God,” Kelly, part 4).

Constantine recognized the benefit of aligning with the counterfeit movement—which called itself Christian. Not only was he indebted to this “power” which helped to establish him as Emperor, he saw this movement as a potential means of unifying the empire. Yet, the Christianity of the Western empire was significantly different from that in the east and from that of other sects in North Africa. Thus, Constantine took measures to “standardize” his newfound ally—Christianity (ibid.).

Constantine convened the ecumenical council of Nicea in AD 325 to resolve the doctrinal differences between the various Christian denominations. Before this time, he had already decreed that the day of the sun would be kept throughout the empire. This “day of the sun” was the pivotal point to unify various pagan sun-worshippers with those nominal “Christians” who already had accepted Sunday and had never observed the Sabbath anyway—except for the apostates who defected and joined them.

Thus, this entire episode was a marriage of convenience between Constantine and the Church at Rome. The council of Nicea, directed personally by Constantine, condemned the practice of true Christianity. All of the precepts of the emerging Church at Rome were now decreed as part of the state religion. As protector of this counterfeit Christianity, Constantine forced everyone, pagan or Christian, into either conformity or exile (ibid.).

With the enforcement of a false religion upon them, the true Church had no choice but to flee. This was the flight prophesied in Revelation 12:6: “And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.” According to the day-for-a-year principle (Numbers 14:34, Ezekiel 4:4-6), the Church was to be in the wilderness for 1,260 years from this landmark date of AD 325.

NOTE: This happened during the Smyrna Era of God's Church—the second era of God's seventh Church eras (see Rev. 2 & 3)

italo:


But one of them (Judas) sold him for 30 silver pieces, one (Peter) denied him 3 times, one (Paul) killed many Christians, one (Thomas) doubted his resurrection, and all (12) struggled to be the greatest.

Who called Rome the home of forgery? Another of your imaginary ex-nuns?

Judas was not converted in the heart, we know.

Peter later repented and never denied Jesus again. He also did not act like a pope over the church, nor was did he claim to be lord over the monarchs of the earth.

Paul killed Christians when he was still in Judaism. When he met Christ, he repented and never killed anyone again.

Ubenedictus:
I hope you know that the orthodox church broke from the catholic church btw 1054-1600s and the all have priestly robes, celibate bishops and sirach etc in their bible?
d ceremonies in d catholic church are d same with those found in d catacombs!
So who are ur early xtians?

Their claim is that you Catholics broke away from them and became stronger

DoctorAlien:


Judas was not converted in the heart, we know.

Peter later repented and never denied Jesus again. He also did not act like a pope over the church, nor was did he claim to be lord over the monarchs of the earth.

Paul killed Christians when he was still in Judaism. When he met Christ, he repented and never killed anyone again.

They were all sinners. Period.

DoctorAlien:


Judas was not converted in the heart, we know.

Peter later repented and never denied Jesus again. He also did not act like a pope over the church, nor was did he claim to be lord over the monarchs of the earth.

Paul killed Christians when he was still in Judaism. When he met Christ, he repented and never killed anyone again.

Absolutely correct....

shadeyinka:


Their claim is that you Catholics broke away from them and became stronger

What is your claim?

Splinz:
Let me add some refreshing history to this thread; to all lovers of the truth.

Constantine and the Council of Nicea

In the early 300s, during the time of the most severe persecution against all professing Christians, the Roman armies proclaimed their favorite general, Constantine, as Caesar. He had claimed victory after defeating his rival, Maxentius, at the Battle of Milvian Bridge outside Rome. Prior to that battle, he was said to have had a vision of the first two letters of the name of “Christ” (in Greek, chi (X) and rho (P)) and heard a voice that told him, “By this sign you will conquer.” He felt that the meaning of the letters he had seen was unmistakably symbolic of Christ and thus, he was indebted to Christianity for his victory, in spite of being an established sun worshiper. Immediately upon becoming Emperor, he issued the Edict of Toleration, which gave Christianity legality in the empire. This ended the ten years of severe persecution against the true Church, but paved the way for false Christianity to rise to prominence in the empire (“The History of the Church of God,” Kelly, part 4).

Constantine recognized the benefit of aligning with the counterfeit movement—which called itself Christian. Not only was he indebted to this “power” which helped to establish him as Emperor, he saw this movement as a potential means of unifying the empire. Yet, the Christianity of the Western empire was significantly different from that in the east and from that of other sects in North Africa. Thus, Constantine took measures to “standardize” his newfound ally—Christianity (ibid.).

Constantine convened the ecumenical council of Nicea in AD 325 to resolve the doctrinal differences between the various Christian denominations. Before this time, he had already decreed that the day of the sun would be kept throughout the empire. This “day of the sun” was the pivotal point to unify various pagan sun-worshippers with those nominal “Christians” who already had accepted Sunday and had never observed the Sabbath anyway—except for the apostates who defected and joined them.

Thus, this entire episode was a marriage of convenience between Constantine and the Church at Rome. The council of Nicea, directed personally by Constantine, condemned the practice of true Christianity. All of the precepts of the emerging Church at Rome were now decreed as part of the state religion. As protector of this counterfeit Christianity, Constantine forced everyone, pagan or Christian, into either conformity or exile (ibid.).

With the enforcement of a false religion upon them, the true Church had no choice but to flee. This was the flight prophesied in Revelation 12:6: “And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.” According to the day-for-a-year principle (Numbers 14:34, Ezekiel 4:4-6), the Church was to be in the wilderness for 1,260 years from this landmark date of AD 325.

NOTE: This happened during the Smyrna Era of God's Church—the second era of God seventh Church eras (see Rev. 2 & 3)

Going by what you wrote, the true Church came back in 1585.

Where is it? It is invisible abi?

We have shown a list of Popes from St. Peter, we have pointed out that Carthage 397 had 73 books, we have demonstrated that the 7 books could not have been added by Catholics in 1548 because the Orthodox Church also has them.

The only attempt to prove that early Christians werent Catholics is being lifted from imaginary sources.

Thats very telling.

shadeyinka:


Intersting read:
However, you always contrast Catholic vs Protestant and this prevent you from seeing that you did not invent history.

Permit me to paste this from Wikipedia:



So, you can see that your historical records could be biased.

Are the Orthodox Christians under the authority of the Pope?
If they are not Catholics, then your dispute should be with the Orthodox Christians.

The orthodox christians actually broke away from catholicism in 1054-1600. They are the worst example you can give because orthodox also believe the roman church was began by st peter and st paul, with primacy, their doctrine are abt 90% similar to catholic. Infact the pope is going to egypt this year and the orthodox patriarch will be joining in the trip.

DoctorAlien:


Here is a true Roman Catholic who doesn't know jack about his church and what they can do. He gobbles down whatever he is fed by the priests.

Bro, the Roman Catholic church has forged many documents and writings, and edited countless others, simply to lend credence to whatever lies they've decided to teach their flock. The Catholic encyclopedia even admits these forgeries!

The Donation of Constantine is only one, and a good example, of such forgeries. You can read about the Donation of Constantine on Wikipedia.

Please tell me the source where it is written that it was the roman church that forged the donation of constantine...which pope comissioned the forgers?

DoctorAlien:
The church in Corinth, the church in Ephesus, the church in Galatia, etc.

Walter A. Elwell, "Evangelical Dictionary of Theology" (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Book House, 1984), page 141.



We know that the council of Carthage met to recognize properly as canon those books that were already canon by concensus of use. Did Christians even around the time of Origen use the book of Maccabees or Sirach? The answer is NO. So, you have no point.

Actually yes, the christians at the time of origen use book like sirach.

Follow the link below to find an excellently articulated piece debunking the "Pope Peter" fraud. Included in that article are quotes from even the Catholic encyclopedia admitting that the early Christians didn't see Peter as Pope, and that Damasus was the first to refer to himself as "Pope".

www.excatholicsforchrist.com/articles.php?PageURL=Peter.htm

DoctorAlien:


For what it's worth, Mary Ann Collins could be a pen name. The person behind the name may have chosen not to reveal her true identity. We all know how the catholic church murdered Alberto Rivera(a former priest) after he left the catholic church and exposed them.

Please where is the police report that shows alberto rivera was murder by the church.

or that is just one of the jack chic lies u believe. Do u also believe that the church has a big super computer that has d names of all protestants?

Ubenedictus:
The orthodox christians actually broke away from catholicism in 1054-1600. They are the worst example you can give because orthodox also believe the roman church was began by st peter and st paul, with primacy, their doctrine are abt 90% similar to catholic. Infact the pope is going to egypt this year and the orthodox patriarch will be joining in the trip.

If the Orthodox account is correct, then Pope Francis is the 265th successor of St. Peter...That is proof that early Christians were Catholics.

Where will you turn now, shadeyinka?

DoctorAlien:
Walter A. Elwell (editor), "Evangelical Dictionary of Theology" (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Book House, 1984), page 141.

We all know how good the catholic church is at forgery. Indeed, Rome was called "the home forgery" during the dark ages. Moreover, stop deluding yourself: the Roman Catholic church did not produce the Bible. The Bible was written by holy men of GOD who were not Roman Catholics.

who canonised the bible? [b]They didn't pray to Mary, they didn't collect indulgences, they didn't institute any office of celibate priesthood filled with homosexual priests who keep on molesting children and women who come for confession, or unholy, corrupt, greedy and immoral popes.[/quote] Oya let us begin the moral grandstanding...only catholic priest are sinner, protestants are saints.
If u are looking for impecability then u are a dreamer.

Ubenedictus:
Please where is the police report that shows alberto rivera was murder by the church.

or that is just one of the jack chic lies u believe. Do u also believe that the church has a big super computer that has d names of all protestants?

Lol...

...and that the Church created Communism, the Ku Klux Klan, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormonism, and Islam

italo:


Going by what you wrote, the true Church came back in 1585.

Where is it? It is invisible abi?

no, he is saying the true church was the arians and that d council of nicea persecuted them.

italo:


Lol...

...and that the Church created Communism, the Ku Klux Klan, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormonism, and Islam

Lol, let us add buddism and african traditional religion.

DoctorAlien:
Follow the link below to find an excellently articulated piece debunking the "Pope Peter" fraud. Included in that article are quotes from even the Catholic encyclopedia admitting that the early Christians didn't see Peter as Pope, and that Damasus was the first to refer to himself as "Pope".

www.excatholicsforchrist.com/articles.php?PageURL=Peter.htm

by ur reasoning It was in antioch that people where 1st called xtians, so before then, there were no Christians.

Ubenedictus:
no, he is saying the true church was the arians and that d council of nicea persecuted them.

The true Church was the arians that believed Jesus was not co-eternal with the Father?

Lol...these guys are just latching unto any anti-Catholic writing on the internet without even digesting them.

Ubenedictus:
by ur reasoning It was in antioch that people where 1st called xtians, so before then, there were no Christians.

I know you would not read that article, lest you be cured of your delusion.

DoctorAlien:


I know you would not read that article, lest you be cured of your delusion.

actually, whenever i discuss with people even those who i know are lying i do due diligence. i read d article top to bottom and had a good laugh.

Lol I am here to read comments carefully and as usual, underline some important things.

Ubenedictus:
. oga you are arguing a strawman, everybody agrees that Jesus came as man and is Divine, he also established a church matt 16:14-17, the question is whether or not, this same church that Jesus establish is d same one called 'd way' in d 1st century and catholic church in the 2nd century?
dat is d issue.

Someone may establish something, but it may deviate from the original concept and idealogy, especially when the founder is no longer available (physically or otherwise) .

In simpler terms, Jesus Christ establish Christianity, many denomination have come from it, Catholic just happened to be amongst first denominations that came into existence from Christianity.

UAC, created the gala concept and idea, but today many other companies have created their own type of gala (biggie, rite etc), it all originated from the concept of UAC.
Another example
Seun created Nairaland, if for some reason he is no longer physically available to pilot the affairs of Nairaland, the person who will take over, may change many things about Nairaland, which was never in Seun's plan or idea, and S.eun where ever he will be, will not be happy about this

Same applies to Christianity, Jesus Christ created Christianity, but many other individuals have created their OWN concept of Christianity.

Almost all denominations in Nigeria are guilty of this, Catholic inclusive.

Something being old or ancient Don't make it Right or Legitimate!!!!! ...

Catholics have been adoring and praising Mary since centuries, nd bowing down to sculptures, but that is not RIGHT

JESUS CHRIST did not create Catholic Church, rather some early Christians created Catholic Church using the Christian concept.

Show me any evidence that a Jesus Christ is a Catholic or he created Catholic Church denomination..
Jesus Christ rightly said, I'm the way the truth and the life, no one cometh to the Father except through me...

I don't know where Catholics saw Mary in the text, I never heard when Jesus Christ said people should ask Mary to intercede for them to the father or to him..
You guys will always say at the wedding at Cana , Mary begged Jesus Christ for a Miracle

The Holy trinity is God the Father, God the son, God the Holy Spirit... Mary name no dey diaaa

Catholics like many other Denominations are Brainwashed people deluding themselves. Making mockery of Christianity (Pun intended).

I'm a lapsed Catholic, I know almost everything about the Catholic Church, Catholic Church is Far from Christianity

Mcowubaba:


Someone may establish something, but it may deviate from the original concept and idealogy, especially when the founder is no longer available (physically or otherwise) .

In simpler terms, Jesus Christ establish Christianity, many denomination have come from it, Catholic just happened to be amongst first denominations that came into existence from Christianity.

UAC, created the gala concept and idea, but today many other companies have created their own type of gala (biggie, rite etc), it all originated from the concept of UAC.
Another example
Seun created Nairaland, if for some reason he is no longer physically available to pilot the affairs of Nairaland, the person who will take over, may change many things about Nairaland, which was never in Seun's plan or idea, and S.eun where ever he will be, will not be happy about this

Same applies to Christianity, Jesus Christ created Christianity, but many other individuals have created their OWN concept of Christianity.

Almost all denominations in Nigeria are guilty of this, Catholic inclusive.

Something being old or ancient Don't make it Right or Legitimate!!!!! ...

Catholics have been adoring and praising Mary since centuries, nd bowing down to sculptures, but that is not RIGHT

JESUS CHRIST did not create Catholic Church, rather some early Christians created Catholic Church using the Christian concept.

Show me any evidence that a Jesus Christ is a Catholic or he created Catholic Church denomination..
Jesus Christ rightly said, I'm the way the truth and the life, no one cometh to the Father except through me...

I don't know where Catholics saw Mary in the text, I never heard when Jesus Christ said people should ask Mary to intercede for them to the father or to him..
You guys will always say at the wedding at Cana , Mary begged Jesus Christ for a Miracle

The Holy trinity is God the Father, God the son, God the Holy Spirit... Mary name no dey diaaa

Catholics like many other Denominations are Brainwashed people deluding themselves. Making mockery of Christianity (Pun intended).

I'm a lapsed Catholic, I know almost everything about the Catholic Church, Catholic Church is Far from Christianity

Oh.. So you know everything.. Please give the Part of the Catechism where the Catholic Church teaches that its followers should ADORE MARY...
please I need the Paragraph number... am curious... prove it using the Catechism which contains all Catholic teachings

italo:

Jesus established the Catholic Church in 33AD.
Martin Luther established protestantism 1500 years later.
So, in a sense, Jesus is Catholic.

easymancfc:


Oh.. So you know everything.. Please give the Part of the Catechism where the Catholic Church teaches that its followers should ADORE MARY...
please I need the Paragraph number... am curious... prove it using the Catechism which contains all Catholic teachings

Me too. I'm waiting.