felixomor:


Dont be ridiculous.
Ct Mri for heart?
Please dont disgrace Yourself.
If u dont know anything about medicine, keep quiet.

IamaNigerianGuy:


This is not a miracle. It is a phenomenon well documented in the medical literature. It has happened before and will happen again.

The patient was mistakenly diagnosed as deceased after what was probably a cardiac arrest. He in all likelihood had spontaneous resumption of cardiac and circulatory activity. The technical term is ROSC
"A patient is not dead until he is warm and dead" is what you are taught in emergency medicine courses because cold preserves the vital organs and can allow recovery later.

In 19th century Europe and America , there were so many cases of people mistakenly thought dead who woke up, that a practice was established of keeping the 'corpse' in a room for 24 to 48 hours with a bell beside him/her. Friends and relatives would gather expectantly waiting with hope. If he awoke he was supposed to ring the bell.
That is the origin of the term 'wake keeping'

spacetacular:


Are you in the medical profession? I am a medical practitioner here in the UK and can help you out of your high ground ignorance sir.

What about this young man's ordeal is unbelievable? Is it the artificial heart valve he was fitted with as a result of his heart condition which is a heart failure with severe anatomical damage aka ventricular septal defect or is it the fact that imaging was already done and redone even prior to even the minor surgery where they attempted to close the holes and definitely also in Australia even before they tried cutting him open before he died.

What part of all this gives you problems?

IamaNigerianGuy:

I gave CT, MRI and USS as examples of imaging modalities. Not necessarily for the heart and not all for this patient. Try not to be stupid; read the entire post. You are free to believe in the 'miracles' if you wish

IamaNigerianGuy:


What gives me problems is that you claim to be a medical practitioner and believe second hand accounts without looking at the official clinical records.
I also have a problem with you believing that the patient 'rose from the dead'. I have attempted to give a logical and medical (though dumbed down explanation for the event)

spacetacular:


Are you in the medical profession? I am a medical practitioner here in the UK and can help you out of your high ground ignorance sir.

What about this young man's ordeal is unbelievable? Is it the artificial heart valve he was fitted with as a result of his heart condition which is a heart failure with severe anatomical damage aka ventricular septal defect or is it the fact that imaging was already done and redone even prior to even the minor surgery where they attempted to close the holes and definitely also in Australia even before they tried cutting him open before he died.

What part of all this gives you problems?

IamaNigerianGuy:


What gives me problems is that you claim to be a medical practitioner and believe second hand accounts without looking at the official clinical records.
I also have a problem with you believing that the patient 'rose from the dead'. I have attempted to give a logical and medical (though dumbed down explanation for the event)

IamaNigerianGuy:


If he indeed had a 'hole' in his heart it must have been diagnosed clinically and confirmed by medical imaging - (CT scan, MRI, Ultrasound etc)
Can you show me the 'before' and 'after' radiological images of his heart to prove the 'hole' has disappeared ? Or you are basing your claim on hearsay ?

IamaNigerianGuy:


What gives me problems is that you claim to be a medical practitioner and believe second hand accounts without looking at the official clinical records.
I also have a problem with you believing that the patient 'rose from the dead'. I have attempted to give a logical and medical (though dumbed down explanation for the event)

okuya:
And how about d disappearance of the hole in his heart without undergoing surgery, COULD YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN THE SCIENCE BEHIND THAT TOO?

IamaNigerianGuy:


This is not a miracle. It is a phenomenon well documented in the medical literature. It has happened before and will happen again.

The patient was mistakenly diagnosed as deceased after what was probably a cardiac arrest. He in all likelihood had spontaneous resumption of cardiac and circulatory activity. The technical term is ROSC
"A patient is not dead until he is warm and dead" is what you are taught in emergency medicine courses because cold preserves the vital organs and can allow recovery later.

In 19th century Europe and America , there were so many cases of people mistakenly thought dead who woke up, that a practice was established of keeping the 'corpse' in a room for 24 to 48 hours with a bell beside him/her. Friends and relatives would gather expectantly waiting with hope. If he awoke he was supposed to ring the bell.
That is the origin of the term 'wake keeping'

IamaNigerianGuy:


What gives me problems is that you claim to be a medical practitioner and believe second hand accounts. You make claims without looking for or at the official clinical records.
I also have a problem with you believing that the patient 'rose from the dead'. I have attempted to give a logical and medical (though dumbed- down explanation for the event) based on the information in the article.
You bring in many technical terms without sources into your argument. Where are they mentioned in the article ?
Is this the new standard for medical practice in the UK which you exhibit ?

IamaNigerianGuy:


This is not a miracle. It is a phenomenon well documented in the medical literature. It has happened before and will happen again.

The patient was mistakenly diagnosed as deceased after what was probably a cardiac arrest. He in all likelihood had spontaneous resumption of cardiac and circulatory activity. The technical term is ROSC
"A patient is not dead until he is warm and dead" is what you are taught in emergency medicine courses because cold preserves the vital organs and can allow recovery later.

In 19th century Europe and America , there were so many cases of people mistakenly thought dead who woke up, that a practice was established of keeping the 'corpse' in a room for 24 to 48 hours with a bell beside him/her. Friends and relatives would gather expectantly waiting with hope. If he awoke he was supposed to ring the bell.
That is the origin of the term 'wake keeping'

MzJin:
Wowowoow....thanks to God oooooo.......but he so cute is he married

spacetacular:


I asked you a question sir and rather than answering that you chose to take a swipe at my medical profession which is totally ridiculous.

You accuse me of same thing you are doing. You chose to discredit without knowledgeable proof and you conveniently ignored the names he mentioned and the fact that he is easily reachable for sake of authentication.

Do you think his tests in Nigeria and Australia were in error? Under what probability did that happen? Would you think that the Aussie surgeons would begin cutting him open without carrying out their own imaging?

By the way I do not "claim" to be a medical practitioner, I AM!

CoCoLav:


Your quote does not address my question.

IamaNigerianGuy:


This is not a miracle. It is a phenomenon well documented in the medical literature. It has happened before and will happen again.

The patient was mistakenly diagnosed as deceased after what was probably a cardiac arrest. He in all likelihood had spontaneous resumption of cardiac and circulatory activity. The technical term is ROSC
"A patient is not dead until he is warm and dead" is what you are taught in emergency medicine courses because cold preserves the vital organs and can allow recovery later.

In 19th century Europe and America , there were so many cases of people mistakenly thought dead who woke up, that a practice was established of keeping the 'corpse' in a room for 24 to 48 hours with a bell beside him/her. Friends and relatives would gather expectantly waiting with hope. If he awoke he was supposed to ring the bell.
That is the origin of the term 'wake keeping'

IamaNigerianGuy:


This is not a miracle. It is a phenomenon well documented in the medical literature. It has happened before and will happen again.

The patient was mistakenly diagnosed as deceased after what was probably a cardiac arrest. He in all likelihood had spontaneous resumption of cardiac and circulatory activity. The technical term is ROSC
"A patient is not dead until he is warm and dead" is what you are taught in emergency medicine courses because cold preserves the vital organs and can allow recovery later.

In 19th century Europe and America , there were so many cases of people mistakenly thought dead who woke up, that a practice was established of keeping the 'corpse' in a room for 24 to 48 hours with a bell beside him/her. Friends and relatives would gather expectantly waiting with hope. If he awoke he was supposed to ring the bell.
That is the origin of the term 'wake keeping'

spacetacular:


I asked you a question sir and rather than answering that you chose to take a swipe at my medical profession which is totally ridiculous.

You accuse me of same thing you are doing. You chose to discredit without knowledgeable proof and you conveniently ignored the names he mentioned and the fact that he is easily reachable for sake of authentication.

Do you think his tests in Nigeria and Australia were in error? Under what probability did that happen? Would you think that the Aussie surgeons would begin cutting him open without carrying out their own imaging?

By the way I do not "claim" to be a medical practitioner, I AM!

spacetacular:


You are obviously a vexed being who attempts to stand toe to toe with God. Heck yeah I am a medical practitioner who loves and believes in God and His miraculous ways. The young man was the person who went through this and he sounds intelligent enough to ask questions and know the details about his condition as this interview clearly showed.

You are trying way too hard to sound "medical".

GreyLaw:
That guy you quoted, his responses are so dumb.

So he thinks the sick man was diagnosed with ventricular septal defect without CT or MRI, given a make-shift surrogate heart still without proper medical tests and investigations, and then finally flown to India and Australia, all without proper tests?!?

Some people just sound crazy, but they fail to know it.

It's OK not to believe in miracles, but sounding stupid just to hold onto the last thread of disbelief, is just appalling.

IamaNigerianGuy:


If he indeed had a 'hole' in his heart it must have been diagnosed clinically and confirmed by medical imaging - (CT scan, MRI, Ultrasound etc)
Can you show me the 'before' and 'after' radiological images of his heart to prove the 'hole' has disappeared ? Or you are basing your claim on hearsay ?

IamaNigerianGuy:


You are not writing like one.

I stand by my statement that the patient was erroneously categorized as dead. That is very clear to me maybe not to you. If you have taken an ACLS course at the minimum you would have come across this explained.
No retreat on that point.EVER.

I also state that to prove that a VSD in this adult has closed spontaneously, I must see evidence, and not oral evidence from a layman, journalist or the patient viz IMAGING supporting the claim with comparison data taken before the alledged closure.

Is that an issue for you ?

I

spacetacular:


Word of advice and caution. Rather than your current display of ignorance based on your inner vexation why not make some effort to reach out to the young man or his doctor and prove or disprove him.

You sound like you need antidepressants.

IamaNigerianGuy:


You are a medical practitioner and you believe he was raised from the dead ?
The Raising of Lazarus was a textbook or course in your days in medical school?

IamaNigerianGuy:


That is a brilliant question and I will answer it.

No it does not represent a double standard @FullDepth.
In medicine, there are two diagnosis that laymen may make (although they may be wrong) - a diagnosis of pregnancy and one of death. Because of long tradition and experience, these diagnosis are almost always correct. In some cases, like this one, they may be wrong (another example of a layman error in diagnosis is a woman with fibroids who thinks she is pregnant.)
A case of spontaneous resolution or closure of a VSD (hole in the heart) is not made lightly and not made by laymen. It must be supported with medical 'pictures'. We term these images.

Closure of a 'hole' can occur but this is usually in children. It may recur later in life especially if the person is physically active. This is the cause and explanation of some of heart problems in footballers from Africa which we read in the news.
So to sum up, such an occurrence in this age group is rare, it must be backed by evidence and it may not be permanent.