Joagbaje:

@ viaro

If you really read Benniny Hinn and Kenyon books as you claim, I will like you to honestly say what it was they taught that change your perception.
thanks

What about all the other things that have been pointed out ----- which one have you gone back to check with the Bible; even if more errors by Hinn, Kenyon & Hagin are pointed out, will you not just return in robot-mode repeating pre-programmed jargon in defence of heresy.

Example: you were told that it is heresy for WoF teachers to teach "you are a god"; you come back with passages including Psalm 82:6 especially saying this:

Joagbaje:

   
So we have classes of gods
Those born of God, Those who mature in God. Those who have recieved the word of God.

Psalm 82:6
   I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

Meanwhile the very next verse 7 and its togetherness with the preceding verse 6 had been pointed out repeatedly (or "severally" Lord knows I hate that word ).

For your benefit once more (if it is not hopeless) here is the passage again together:

Psalm 82:6-7

I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

If you are the "god" in verse 6, are you also the "god" in verse 7 condemned to die like men?

If that does not put you off Hinn what else will? Perahaps that he also taught that "there are NINE of them in the Trinity" (granted he later claimed to repent of that one)?

^^^ Goodness lawd!! If I knew you were this funny!! Every single line!!

Please allow me borrow a quote from yours:

Enigma:

What about all the other things that have been pointed out ----- which one have you gone back to check with the Bible; even if more errors by Hinn, Kenyon & Hagin are pointed out, will you not just return in robot-mode repeating pre-programmed jargon in defence of heresy.

@Joagbaje, I quoted that ^^ for you just to make the point that you seriously need to address the previous issues that have been highlighted in the examples cited from WOF teachers. Even I am beginning to tire from these 'robot-mode repeating pre-programmed jargon' that some of us read in your defence of WOF doctrines. (thanks to nuella though, I really appreciate her frank answers).

Psalms: 82:5: They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
Psalms: 82:6: I have said, ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most high.
Psalms: 82:7: But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

“Robot-mode repeating pre-programmed jargon” You can say the same about your response(s).

Examine the verse five, “They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness” but “I have said, ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most high.” But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.”
It’s like saying “ye are Gods” but you don’t know neither will you understand; you’d walk on in darkness and die like men.

Why so religious? Did anybody say the Christian is God almighty?

What did jesus mean when he said in Joh:15:5: “I am the vine, ye are the branches”. Have you ever seen a tree whose branches and vine bare a different name? the life that flows through the vine isn’t it the same life that flows through the branch?

I beseech you, do not be like those who try to intellectualise truth and spiritualise their faithlessness. Be true to yourself have you ever laid your hand over a sick person and seen him/her recover? Why not? Its your right in Christ?

M'r:16:17: And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
M'r:16:18: They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
Don’t be like those whose minds are old like the children of isreal who having come out of Egypt coundnt make it into the promised land because of unpersuadableness. The old folks wanted to return to Egypt despite seeing all the great miracles God had wrought through Moses. So God swore that they wouldn’t enter the promised land. The only people who did enter where the folks whose minds where still young and who had little or no knowledge of Egypt enough to want to go back into bondage.

We’re free as Christians from these bonds- we’re partakers of the divine nature!

Heb:4:2: For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

Stop castigating “faith” you may think its WOF you are against but it’s the word of God. God gave us his very life-zoe and indeed we have it now.

1Jo:5:11: And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
1Jo:5:12: He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
1Jo:5:13: These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

We’re partakers of the divine nature because we have the same life God has: zoe.

Don’t miss out through ignorance, unpersuadableness and mis understanding

Heb:4:6: Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

Heb:4:11: Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Don’t fall after the same example of the unbelieving believers!

Heb:3:8: Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Heb:3:9: When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
Heb:3:10: Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
Heb:3:11: So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
Heb:3:12: Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

Don’t die like mere men who didn’t believe.
There are a lot of things God has made available to us through Christ Jesus.

Heb:3:14: For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Heb:3:15: While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
Heb:3:16: For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
Heb:3:17: But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
Heb:3:18: And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
Heb:3:19: So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

The apostles believed (especially John) that’s why they lived the supernatural life. They only let go when they got tired of the world (this world). They felt the world wasn’t worth them.

Heb:11:35: Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection:
Heb:11:36: And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment:
Heb:11:37: They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;
Heb:11:38: (Of whom the world was not worthy they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.

mba emeka:

Why so religious? Did anybody say the Christian is God almighty?

The WOF message of claiming divinity for Christians continues to subtly filter through the teaching of WOF proponents. Sometimes when we ask these folks specific questions about their claims to deity or divinity, they will play games and forever be dodgy. Anyone who cares to know should see an example in Copeland's webpage advertising Bill Winston's book ~

"Understanding Our Divinity, Part III – Kingdom Mentality"

This is why I have been careful to ask questions specifically using the same terms - Deity and Divinity - that WOF teachers use to call themselves 'gods'.

There are other examples I could show in vids, audio clips and electronic publications where the specific term they use is "deity" and "divinity". When I ask questions with these same words, many WOF proponents play games and dribble round the question. Do we take such evasions to be indicative of the fact that they know that teaching is a heresy that has poisoned their faith?

Joagbaje:

@ viaro and Altheia , The anti faith websites you guys are visiting has clouded your mind from the truth. Those websites are Satanic, false brethren. How can someone be teaching against faith and authority of the believers.

What anti-faith websites. Go study your bible and stop spewing forth programmed responses.

Joagbaje:

God told Adam he would die if he ate the fruit. So did he die? God said he would die that very day , So did he die that very day? Did God lie?.

More confusion being exhibited here. What are you saying? The man didn't die? You are repeating your master's lies. In my book anyone who tells me the opposite of what God wrote in the bible is of the devil!

John 8:44 You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Gen 2:16-17 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, "You may surely eat of every tree of the garden,[size=16pt] but[/size] of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

Gen 5:5 Thus all the days that Adam lived were 930 years, and he died.

Psa 90:4 For a thousand years in your sight are but as yesterday when it is past, or as a watch in the night.

2 Pe 3:8 But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Can you begin to see that Adam did not live up to one prophetic day? Incidentally Ps 90 deals with Man's mortality.

I hope this meat is not too strong for you?

Joagbaje:

God spoke in the language the man would understand. Adam was not a perfect man ( I mean maturity) Bible schollars call that time. Dispensation of innocense. He was not yet matured or trained.You tell a little child that blade is dangerous ,going to the road is dangerous. Some mothers tells their little girls that playing with boys will get them pregnant , without explaining details because the innocent child would not understant details . So you give them rules: don't go out. Don't touch razorblade. That doesn't make razor bad. It was not the content of the fruit that was the problem but the disobedience. He ate it at the Devil's command but not at God's command. The fruit was actually meant for man but he ate it prematurely.

What scripture says God intended for man to eat from the tree of knowledge of Good & Evil? You utter lies from the pit of hell. Again for your edification, it is written:

Gen 2:16-17 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, "You may surely eat of every tree of the garden,[size=16pt] but[/size] of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

Joagbaje:

Heb 5:14
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, [even] those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

You and your friend mba emeka keep referring to this as if by persisting in your heretical mormon-gnosticism you feel you are handling strong meat (i.e. have some form of knowledge available only to initiates). But of course this is the MO of gnostic teachers who delight in claiming some form of occult revealed knowledge.

Joagbaje:

@Viaro and Aletheia :A word of advise, Your criticism of teachers of faith are based on those nonsence sites you're quoting from. Why don't you do an independent research yourself . Have you read any Benny Hinn books or Kenyon? If you do, your perception will change. If you visit anti bible site and you've not read the bible, you may call Christians fools.

If you must know I have read books by the aforementioned including Benny Hinn of the "nine persons in the trinity dogma" and even have a few in my library. Their doctrines led me into serious trouble.

aletheia:

What anti-faith websites. Go study your bible and stop spewing forth programmed responses.
More confusion being exhibited here. What are you saying? The man didn't die? You are repeating your master's lies. In my book anyone who tells me the opposite of what God wrote in the bible is of the devil! Can you begin to see that Adam did not live up to one prophetic day? Incidentally Ps 90 deals with Man's mortality.

I hope this meat is not too strong for you?
What scripture says God intended for man to eat from the tree of knowledge of Good & Evil? You utter lies from the pit of hell. Again for your edification, it is written:
You and your friend mba emeka keep referring to this as if by persisting in your heretical mormon-gnosticism you feel you are handling strong meat (i.e. have some form of knowledge available only to initiates). But of course this is the MO of gnostic teachers who delight in claiming some form of occult revealed knowledge.
If you must know I have read books by the aforementioned including Benny Hinn of the "nine persons in the trinity dogma" and even have a few in my library. Their doctrines led me into serious trouble.

I dont subscribe to mormon doctrines, The mormrons believe God was once a human being.That is a lie . It is against what the bible teaches, The gnostics have a form of truth but they dont have the truth. But what baffles me is that some of these false religion have some level of truth than some so called christians.


Let me help you out here. I was only using children language because of your level of understanding. Adam died instantly he ate the fruit. The death was not a physical death, Man is a spirit. God is a spirit, he created man a spirit also. he put man in physical clay. The body of clay is not the man. God didnt create man to live for only 1000 years. You are using your own head knowledge there. God created man to live for ever. Death was not Gods plan. Adam died spiritualy that day. Spiritual death is a separation from God.

That is why a man has to be born twice. The moment a man receives Christ ,life comes into him. Spiritual death was instant, and recieving life in Christ is intant also. You dont get born again gradually. God didnt teach on gradual death. or gradual salvation.

Everybody is born dead in sin. A man has to be born righteous also.

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Joagbaje:

Everybody is born dead in sin. A man has to be born righteous also.

Does this make you a Deity?

Enigma:


What about all the other things that have been pointed out ----- which one have you gone back to check with the Bible; even if more errors by Hinn, Kenyon & Hagin are pointed out, will you not just return in robot-mode repeating pre-programmed jargon in defence of heresy.

Example: you were told that it is heresy for WoF teachers to teach "you are a god"; you come back with passages including Psalm 82:6 especially saying this:

Meanwhile the very next verse 7 and its togetherness with the preceding verse 6 had been pointed out repeatedly (or "severally" Lord knows I hate that word ).
For your benefit once more (if it is not hopeless) here is the passage again together:
Psalm 82:6-7
If you are the "god" in verse 6, are you also the "god" in verse 7 condemned to die like men?

They have not pointed out any teaching , by Kenyon and Hagin, I am still waiting for it. This matter is beingg blown beyond proportion unnecessarily.

Psalm 82:5-7
They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course. [6] I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. [7] But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

Verse 5 explained why they would die like men. because of their ignorance so they walk in darkness even though they were gods but they will die like men. It is like a Christian that is not walking in love. sicness and deseases will attack him.

1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death

So its not like the case of Viaro ignorantlly saying joeagbaje will die like men, emeka mba wil die like men

A god is a magistrate, a god is an enforcer, Na me write bible?

Exodus 7:1
And the Lord said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.

Joagbaje:

They have not pointed out any teaching , by Kenyon and Hagin, I am still waiting for it. This matter is beingg blown beyond proportion unnecessarily.

I was going to post a few before you spilled it all out in the other thread for "non-WOF" on Faith - my comments about your 'divinity' is there also.

So its not like the case of Viaro ignorantlly saying joeagbaje will die like men, emeka mba wil die like men

Neither Psalm 82:7 nor Jeremiah 10:11 were penned down in the Bible by viaro. The inspired authors of those verses left you and your ilk a most important warning, which you will do well to heed.

pastor joe, please dont mind the likes of viaro, he has just fail to understand that what you dont know is biger than you and that and that as far as naira land is concern viaro is history .Heb 5:13 For every one that useth milk [is] unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. {is skillful: Gr. hath no experience}
Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, [even] those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. {of full age: or, perfect} {use: or, an habit, or, perfection}viaro is a babe.

inedi:

pastor joe, please dont mind the likes of viaro, he has just fail to understand that what you dont know is biger than you and that and that as far as naira land is concern viaro is history

. . . viaro is a babe.

Thank you. When you're done complaining, please proceed to talk like a grown up.

@ viaro,
There is noway we-christisns can relate with God with FAITH .Do you agree with me?
if you bible the bible and act accordingly the you (ACTION as a result of your believing)is what FAITH is.
whta WOF is saying is DO THE WORD PERIOD!
EXAMPLES:MARK 11:22-23-that is one of the reasons for confessions!
                   1 CORINTHIANS 5:17
                    EPH 5:1-2 ETC.
                   you see there is always a balance in this, and the parameter for the balance is not what you think or what others think
the parameter is THE WORD OF GOD-ACCORDING TO REVELATIONS.
AND THIS REVELATIONS ARE IN DEGREES
AND THIS DEGREES are BASED ON YOUR PERSONAL INTIMATE FELLOWSHIP WITH THE SPIRIT OF GOD.
That ihe reason i suggested to you that you should take time out of your busy schedules,distractions from anywhere including NL and invest it in quality fellowship on the subject matter.
I personally i have done a research and i have THE BALANCE! by the spirit of God.
and all these arguement will end.

This advise is also for the NLers!

inedi:

pastor joe, please dont mind the likes of viaro, he has just fail to understand that what you dont know is biger than you and that and that as far as naira land is concern viaro is history .Heb 5:13 For every one that useth milk [is] unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. {is skillful: Gr. hath no experience}
Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, [even] those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. {of full age: or, perfect} {use: or, an habit, or, perfection}viaro is a babe.

I appreciate to be addresed as joagbaje.

But You are right Inedi any knowledge seeking person going through the thread should be clear on this issue at least to a great extent. I have recieved several mails of appreciation for some of these expositions of deep truth. Execpt an insincere individual that will kep asking thesame babish questions over an over, . It is waste of my precious time. especially when Viaro said Matt 24 is talking about the church and not tribulation of Israel . The ignorance and arrogance displayed just put me off.

We are just scratching the surface , there are yet deeper things.What is so had to understand of our union with God and Christ.

Ephes. 4:13
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

John 1:16
And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

1 John 4:17
Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

Col. 2:9-10
For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. [10] And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Ephes. 1:22-23
The church, Which is his body, the fulness of him

Ephes. 4:13
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

John 17:21-23
That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. [22] And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: [23] I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Viaroooo ,if you are there can you read this scriptures again and explain your understanding.

jaffi:

@ viaro,
There is noway we-christisns can relate with God with FAITH .Do you agree with me?

I don't have a blipp what you're on about - so I can't agree with or disagree.

if you bible the bible and act accordingly the you (ACTION as a result of your believing)is what FAITH is.

Okay.

whta WOF is saying is DO THE WORD PERIOD!

Okay again. I just know that no part of the Word says I should call myself Deity or Christ.

EXAMPLES:MARK 11:22-23-that is one of the reasons for confessions!
1 CORINTHIANS 5:17
EPH 5:1-2 ETC.
you see there is always a balance in this, and the parameter for the balance is not what you think or what others think
the parameter is THE WORD OF GOD-ACCORDING TO REVELATIONS.
AND THIS REVELATIONS ARE IN DEGREES
AND THIS DEGREES are BASED ON YOUR PERSONAL INTIMATE FELLOWSHIP WITH THE SPIRIT OF GOD.
That ihe reason i suggested to you that you should take time out of your busy schedules,distractions from anywhere including NL and invest it in quality fellowship on the subject matter.

Nice, thanks.

I personally i have done a research and i have THE BALANCE! by the spirit of God.
and all these arguement will end.

Cool.

Joagbaje:


We are just scratching the surface , there are yet deeper things.What is so had to understand of our union with God and Christ.

Ephes. 4:13
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

John 1:16
And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

1 John 4:17
Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

Col. 2:9-10
For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. [10] And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Ephes. 1:22-23
The church, Which is his body, the fulness of him

Ephes. 4:13
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

John 17:21-23
That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. [22] And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: [23] I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Viaroooo ,if you are there can you read this scriptures again and explain your understanding.

Are you expecting me to write a whole encyclopedia? Look sir, writing exegesis on them is unnecessary, for none of those verses warrants any Christian calling himself or herself "deity" or "Christ".

@viaro,
what i meant was WITHOUT FAITH there is noway we will/can relate God.
secondly,i really wonder why you'r finding it so difficult understanding this-divinity stuff.
Jesus is the head.you agree?
and we are His body.agree?
so,now answer me,Is your head different from your body?
which happens to be the same you?

so if Jesus is divine then are we divine.
don't you get?
This thing is by revelation and revelations comes by studing,meditation and praying.
Not by human assumptions.

^^^ You say Jesus is Head and we the body. Fine - that is Biblical. Well, whist Jesus walked earth, even HE said he was Man. We know He is God but maybe, just maybe, He looked into the future and saw WOF and decided to clarify and show humility by claiming Manhood. Where's your own humility. Plus we all know you are sin-filled men. Now, the Lord is spirit. Does your physical body have a literal "spirit" head. Why not wait till you're spirit before you claim what is of the spirit? Then, did you ever visit the Spirit World? Is it the same as the Physical world? Why do you assume that a perfectly allegorical statement is literal. Jesus is Head, you are the body. What part are you? blood cell or blood clot? Or waste waiting to be expelled in the smallest room in the house? I can just imagine what part you all are.

Why can't you people get the truth - There is One God. Moses said it, so did Elijah, so did Jesus. When people called Paul a "god", the guy went demented frantically correcting them (Paul O, who claimed to live off his JOB and not any man's offerings yet wrote all the stuff you're mis-representing today) and here we have you guys claiming divinity yet you say its "strong meat" for balanced people who study prayerfully the Bible. What do you do except read pamphlets and listen to staged television shows. Evidence? - consider the one who said Jesus never called them Brethren till He resurrected. See how Viaro's rebuttal of that "lie from hell" made him go slinking away.

Strong meat?  Strong meat?  for who? Viaro and Alethiea who are following the Bible or you following excitement.

Bah, Its like you guys have been sniffing cheap gum and not getting enough sleep

@Viaro:

Chairman, my respects as always. Just a point here - I wonder if these people ever consider what they suggest when they keep going "He is the Vine, we the Branches" or "He is the Head, we the body" and make it LITERAL PHYSICAL RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW as in cut off Jesus Head and both He and this body will die!

Is it just me or is there implied the idea that without us, there can be NO God or Jesus? I thought God could raise up the very stones in lieu of anybody. Isn't WOF suggesting God is nothing without this "us"?

Understanding faith is not much of a great deal, except you don't have a teacher over you, which should be your Pastor
1 Timothy 6:12 says Faith the good faith of faith.
If there is a fight to faith, then there are enemies to faith or hindrances to faith. We are looking at a vital subject where a lack of understanding can hinder your faith.
Romans 10:17 says so then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
A lack of knowledge of God's word is the greatest hindrance to faith. Naturally, if faith comes by hearing the word of God as Romans 10:17 says, then it follows that a lack of hearing and understanding God's word produces a lack of faith.

@viaro

viaro:

Are you expecting me to write a whole encyclopedia? Look sir, writing exegesis on them is unnecessary, for none of those verses warrants any Christian calling himself or herself "deity" or "Christ".

You have written longer ones than these . I'm not really disappointed , I don't really feel you would be able to explain those scriptures . But if I were you , what I don't know , I would say I don't know instead of arguing ignorantly.
Let me ask you a simpler one : Is Jesus God?

@Joagbaje: Let me answer for viaro. YES. Jesus is God. NEXT!?

InesQor:

@Joagbaje: Let me answer for viaro. YES. Jesus is God. NEXT!?

Me too! Indeed Jesus is God, so NEXT?

Let Viaro answer

WoF - poison
Peddlers and purveyors of poison - Joagbaje, mba emeka, et al

2Pe 3:15-18 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability. But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

jaffi:

@viaro,
what i meant was WITHOUT FAITH there is noway we will/can relate God.
secondly,i really wonder why you'r finding it so difficult understanding this-divinity stuff.
Jesus is the head.you agree?
and we are His body.agree?
so,now answer me,Is your head different from your body?
which happens to be the same you?

so if Jesus is divine then are we divine.
don't you get?
This thing is by revelation and revelations comes by studing,meditation and praying.
Not by human assumptions.

In relation to the question in bold:

Yes, the head is different from the body.
How?
Simple. The body is the sum total of the body parts; while the head is a part.

Or will you say the head has legs and arms apart from those which the body has?
Or the arms have ears eyes and teeth apart from the ones which the body has?

Below is probably how you guys look based on your interpretation:

Mass LOLage at the drawing above!

nuclearboy:

@Viaro:

Chairman, my respects as always. Just a point here - I wonder if these people ever consider what they suggest when they keep going "He is the Vine, we the Branches" or "He is the Head, we the body" and make it LITERAL PHYSICAL RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW as in cut off Jesus Head and both He and this body will die!

Is it just me or is there implied the idea that without us, there can be NO God or Jesus? I thought God could raise up the very stones in lieu of anybody. Isn't WOF suggesting God is nothing without this "us"?

@commander nuclearboy, howdy?
Infact, you just captured it all in a nutshell for me. I can hardly improve on that, and we have seen more than enough of WOFers to point in that direction.

Joagbaje:

@viaro

You have written longer ones than these . I'm not really disappointed , I don't really feel you would be able to explain those scriptures .

Oh you bet I could! I just didn't feel it necessary upon myself to bore any reader with any exegesis, nor was it contingent upon the fact that you've been claiming your super-status on Nairaland - left, right and center! There's hardly an exegesis at this point that would defrag you of the WOF bug, trust me.

But if I were you , what I don't know , I would say I don't know instead of arguing ignorantly.

I never tend to argue what I don't know. I happen to know indeed that you've been parading yourself as the lordly "Christ" and super "God" (critical or not on small or big 'c/C' or 'g'/G). That much, I know - and that much, we have seen with our eyes (that goodness we survived the blindness that would have followed the dazzling flash).

Let me ask you a simpler one : Is Jesus God?

Absolutely YES! Infact, absolutely YESES!

Joagbaje:

Let Viaro answer

I have answered and will answer again: Absolutely YESES!

________

InesQor:

@Joagbaje: Let me answer for viaro. YES. Jesus is God. NEXT!?

Enigma:

Me too! Indeed Jesus is God, so NEXT?

Now viaro again: Three YESES - Jesus is God.

So, Joagbaje, what's next up your sleeves?

@ttalks
wonderful drawing . I will like to see your drawing of the Godhead too!

@ Viaro

viaro:

I have answered and will answer again: Absolutely YESES!
Now viaro again: Three YESES - Jesus is God.
So, Joagbaje, what's next up your sleeves?

What is next up my sleeves is for you to tell me what you make of Deut 6:4

Deut. 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:

If jesus is God and lord also, more with the consederation of what God expressly stated in Isaiah 48:11

Isaiah 48:11
I will not give my glory unto another.