@becomerich

I share your thought. Enough of the Northern mesmerism, let the west and whoever care to follow move on, solo,

"Re: We Must Achieve 6,000 Megawatts" – Jonathan  

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA  LOL, LOOOOOOLLLLLLLL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

People, Please Please PLEASE , stop wasting your time even discussing this nonsense - The problem is not gas or technology, the problem is the corrupt government we have.

A more meaning discussion would be to suggest how we may be able to get a non-corrupt government.

Furthermore the figure of 6000 MWatts is meaningless, if it does not acheive constant light for the nation.

A meaningful target or promise would be one that tells us when we would get uninterrupted power nationwide, this is a standard that 99% of countries in the world have achieved and is taken for granted.

This nonsense makes my blood boil!!

bawomolo:

oh really, and what is the quality and heating value of this biodiesel? the efficiency? I doubt the product cost is that cheap.
as per algae production, do you think we have the space needed to cultivate algae or some sea weed en mass?

70–95% of the total biodiesel production cost arises from the cost of raw material; that is, vegetable oil or animal fats (depends on how dirty the oil is). many places will actualy pay you to take it off thier hands if you know what your doing. many large scale farms, diarys, orchards, ranches manufacture thier own for thier generators, trucks and farm tractors. many companies sell kits to do it at home. if you recieve free oil (or if someone pays you to remove it) the total production cost is bewtween 85 cents to $1 a gallon though some places offer kits as low as 70 cents a gallon.

algae prodution does not take place in the ocean rather in tanks where conditions can be controled. being that nigeria in land mass is larger then 90% of the worlds countries, i would say yeah there is plenty of room for such.

Interesting points raised by respondents to this topic. Varying from BAT (Best Available Technology) for efficient energy production to Privatisation of the power industry. This topic was once a matter that was severely discussed here on this forum.

In adding my bit, I think Jonathan does not have a clue what he wants to do. 6000Megawatts is all a matter of appealing to the public that he is aware but no definitive solution in sight. First and foremost, he should tackle corruption. Until that is effectively curbed, sorry to say, he is just wasting his time and that of NIGERIANS.

agathamari:

70–95% of the total biodiesel production cost arises from the cost of raw material; that is, vegetable oil or animal fats (depends on how dirty the oil is). many places will actualy pay you to take it off thier hands if you know what your doing. many large scale farms, diarys, orchards, ranches manufacture thier own for thier generators, trucks and farm tractors. many companies sell kits to do it at home. if you recieve free oil (or if someone pays you to remove it) the total production cost is bewtween 85 cents to $1 a gallon though some places offer kits as low as 70 cents a gallon.

algae prodution does not take place in the ocean rather in tanks where conditions can be controled. being that nigeria in land mass is larger then 90% of the worlds countries, i would say yeah there is plenty of room for such.

The cost of the raw materials is low because there is low demand. The moment there is substantial demand, the price is likely to go up accordingly. The main argument would still remain for entities/industries that generate the raw materials as a by-product of their regular production, essentially eliminating it as a waste.

Large scale processing e.g. refineries is a different ball game entirely.

Yes boss,no shaking bros,just talk to and settle the boys for creek so they wont blow any supply lines and megawatts go increase overnight

@Beaf and Biina

I'm appalled at the exchange of personal attacks. It's one thing to disagree with an opinion and it another to present your argument with a condescending tone - this is needless as it does not make your opinion any stronger.

If he can make this happen, he will be a hero . . . .However, i am sure many people will make sure it does not happen.

Jonathan should stop yarning the one wey pass am.

Anyway, my own two-pennies is that the amount of gas flared off every day in Naija is enough to produce the 6000 MW required.

The courts have already declared the gas flaring illegal, and the deadline for oil coys to comply with the courts decision has passed, yet oil coys are still flaring gas and are making no efforts to capture the gas instead.

So if Oga Jonathan wants to achieve 6000 MW, he should know where to start from, and help us kill these two birds with one stone.

so they're still on d issue of 600MW??

Yara'dua did all d dribbling he knew with ds stuff & he came up short.

I only hope Goodluck's got a blueprint/plan to tackle ds menace

biina:

The cost of the raw materials is low because there is low demand. The moment there is substantial demand, the price is likely to go up accordingly. The main argument would still remain for entities/industries that generate the raw materials as a by-product of their regular production, essentially eliminating it as a waste.

Large scale processing e.g. refineries is a different ball game entirely.

that's what i was thinking. mass production would be difficult to achieve with bio-diesel.

being that nigeria in land mass is larger then 90% of the worlds countries, i would say yeah there is plenty of room for such.

in a country of 150 million people? i thought some of the land mass was to be retained for wind and solar?

Abeem:

Good News! With Goodluck in the saddle, good luck is trailing Nigeria. The US has entered into joint venture with Independent Power Providers Association of Nigeria to help generate up to 10,000 megawatts of electricity by 2011. Punch Newspapers http://www.punchng.com/Articl.aspx?theartic=Art201002241361743

From the article
The United States government has said it will assist Nigeria to generate 10,000 megawatts of electricity by 2011.
The US Ambassador to Nigeria, Ms Robin Sanders, said this in Abuja on Tuesday during the signing of a Memorandum of Understanding between the US government and the Independent Power Providers Association of Nigeria.
She said, “I am pleased that the US government is collaborating with the government of Nigeria and IPPAN to implement one of its top development priorities by increasing electricity generation to 10,000 megawatts by 2011.
“We are honoured to help Nigeria find a way to generate its electricity requirements through the private sector.‘‘
Sanders noted that the partnership would also help in reducing gas flaring, increase the use of renewable energy and improving clean energy practices.
The envoy, who also inaugurated the Nigeria Energy and Climate Change project, said that the project was part of the US government‘s efforts to promote the generation of clean power.
Sanders said that the NECC aimed at reducing gas flaring, generating clean power, while helping to mitigate the effects of climate change in the country.
She also said that the NECC would also promote commercially viable energy projects in Nigeria.
Earlier, the Minister of State for Petroleum Resources, Mr. Odein Ajumogobia, had said that the current level of power generation in Nigeria was between 2,000 and 4,000 MW per day.
He noted that this represented a mere fraction of the power that some African countries, including South Africa and Egypt, were daily generating.
Ajumogobia, however, noted that by the end of 2010, about 70 per cent of the country‘s electricity would be generated from gas-fired plants.
He said, “As we approach 2015, we expect this proportion to rise to over 80 per cent with the generation of more power from gas-fired plants.

"MW per day"? 
no wonder we have inadequate power supply 

rookie:

@Beaf and Biina

I'm appalled at the exchange of personal attacks. It's one thing to disagree with an opinion and it another to present your argument with a condescending tone - this is needless as it does not make your opinion any stronger.

I didn't draw first blood, I only responded to unwarranted rudeness.

Sadly, Nigeria is held back by people who think that loudness somehow equates to intelligence. Well, they are in for a shock; a confident new generation is pushing through and reclaiming what belongs to Nigerians. . . We are a generation thats not cowered by loudness, we bloody kick a'ss.

Beaf:

I didn't draw first blood, I only responded to unwarranted rudeness.

Sadly, Nigeria is held back by people who think that loudness somehow equates to intelligence. Well, they are in for a shock; a confident new generation is pushing through and reclaiming what belongs to Nigerians. . . We are a generation thats not cowered by loudness, we bloody kick a'ss.

You made uninformed claims (i.e. we needed to decentralize power supply and followed it with some shallow arguments for it) , and I simply called you out on it. I dont see the 'unwarranted rudeness' in pointing out that someone doesn't know what they are talking about. Leaving posts like yours unchallenged will simply misguide less knowledgeable people. All you have done since then is avoid the core issues, hunt and peck at side topics, and tried to use snide remarks to win the argument. You would rather we debate the different  ways to convert energy, without any reference to the feasibility or practicality of such technologies in Nigeria.

Despite posing you some direct questions to help you get started, I am still waiting for you to  explain how your proposed decentralized solution will work (I mean practically, and not some abstract ideas like solar panels that seem to have dropped from the sky).

biina:

You made uninformed claims (i.e. we needed to decentralize power supply and followed it with some shallow arguments for it) , and I simply called you out on it. I dont see the 'unwarranted rudeness' in pointing out that someone doesn't know what they are talking about. Leaving posts like yours unchallenged will simply misguide less knowledgeable people. All you have done since then is avoid the core issues, hunt and peck at side topics, and tried to use snide remarks to win the argument. You would rather we debate the different  ways to convert energy, without any reference to the feasibility or practicality of such technologies in Nigeria.

Despite posing you some direct questions to help you get started, I am still waiting for you to  explain how your proposed decentralized solution will work (I mean practically, and not some abstract ideas like solar panels that seem to have dropped from the sky).

Every thing you have suggested is either negative or from pre-history, that goes for the so called "questions" you have asked.

I made statements about areas that would never occur to a technological dinosaur and spare tyre, so you were shocked, confused and said the foolish things that led me to respond both with deep knowledge and in kind.
If you don't know something, the proper thing to do is ask nicely and not pose like some "expert know-all".

You have shamelessly promoted the copying of technology from others. How do you imagine those countries got their technology? Who did they copy? [size=14pt]Olodo![/size]
We, the progressive minds will soon free your negative type to join Boko Haram.

Empty, unprogressive loudmouths like you want to sit down, hold fellow Nigerians back and scream, "oh gas and coal are the only way". . . Truth is, gas and coal are the only way to negative, mentally enslaved, less creative, wooden and unsophisticated minds that can never in a million years, think outside the box.
[size=14pt]It is the duty of younger generations to force progressive and desired change through, we must develop regardless of your negative, timid, doubting, unprogressive type. We will forcefully promote those who can see around the curve and dictate a rich and fulfilling future; the era of the blind pointing the way forward is gone. You sir, are a dinosaur.[/size]

These are some of the things I pointed out;
[list]
[li]We can generate electricty from our abundant solar energy (as an example, I pointed out that Spain, a European country with much less sunshine than us generates more electricity than Nigeria's current output)[/li]
[li]Expensive solar cells and batteries are not required to convert solar energy into electricity[/li]
[li]Thermoacoustic engines are cheap, robust and simple ways to convert solar energy, FREE[/li]
[li]The manufacture of thermoacoustic engines is easy and will provide ready employment for Nigerians[/li]
[li]Wave energy is an abundant FREE source that is currently wasting in Nigeria, while we throw rocks into the sea at bar beach[/li]
[li]Biogas is yet another cheap and wasting source of FREE energy in Nigeria[/li]
[li]Biogas can be obtained from our everyday waste products (food, faecal etc)[/li]
[li]The US is very interested in the Indian energy decentralisation through the harnessing of biogas (I gave you a link to a 17 MB US DOE research file)[/li]
[li]Wind energy, particularly at our beaches (where there are always strong winds) is yet another source of untapped FREE energy[/li]
[/list]

I can almost bet it that you work in PHCN (or similar backward agency); I'm waiting for you confirm it, cos I've got some spare tears waiting . Right now, I have better things to do than engage with a backward thinking dimwit.
Nigeria is sick and tired of people who keep saying, "we will do it like tradition says, because our fathers did it that way".

[size=14pt]Oniparaga! Olodo![/size]

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

@Biina and @Beaf you guys are really great guys in your own individual rights cos you both helped us to see matters from both sides of the coin. I am however appalled at how you have allowed the differences in your opinion to degenerate into a personal level where you are not taking snipes at each other. Please it is not acceptable and debases both of you.

This somewhat epitomises our significant problem in Nigeria where to find people to collaborate effectively is a big challenge. There will always be difference of opinion but the example of the rainbow shows we can have a blend where all the opinions unite and point us to the pure divine the truth, the light that shines out the darkness of ignorance,

Guys, I wish to aknowledge your contributions and give a toast to your uniqueness, Anyone supports me, please give a toast to this too, a new beginning of mutually benefically collaboration and discourse.

Now my point of interest, I hate people who talk to much, what actions can we elicit from all this discussions? I have come to a point where I believe, find the right people with the right ideas, we should be able to get the bulldozers to bring focus to the ideas because ideas alone don't move mountains of corruption and ineptitude, executors do.

@beaf
Typical response 
Its funny how you increase font sizes as if they will make your statements more credible.
Nothing in your posts supports your earlier claim for a decentralized system.

1. You claim expensive solar cells are not required, then please answer how much your proposed alternative cost (per unit of output for a fair comparison)
2. You claim that Thermoacoustic engines are cheap. How much do they cost that makes them cheap?
3. You claim the manufacture of TAEs is easy. Have you manufactured one or know of a low tech company mass producing them?
4. You claim wave energy is 'free'. How much do wave generators cost (including transmission installation to deliver the power to the user unless you plan for us to be living on the sea)?
5. You claim Biogas is 'free' in Nigeria. What is the current and projected cost  per unit watt of this Biogas (including the generator to convert it to electricity)?
6. Biogas can be obtained from our everyday waste products. Yes, but what are the associated processing cost?
7. You claim the US is very interested in Indian energy decentralization. How much decentralization has the US done since then, and more so India itself? (and I am not talking about rural areas i.e you cant decentralized what was not centralized)
8. Yes wind energy is a potential source of energy. Is it feasible? what are the typical wind speeds and forces available in Nigeria? How much per watt will this source cost?

These questions should be answered off the cuff by someone who thought things over before making a post like yours, but then I doubt it is applicable to you.
You have again failed woefully to make a coherent defence for your earlier claims. Instead your a dropping renewable energy techs as if they will magically come and solve Nigeria's problem.
You accuse me of preaching copying, and yet you are yet to mention one relevant technology that is indigenous to Nigeria. Why is that so?  
You want each individual to provide their own energy without consideration for the affordability. There is a reason that the bulk of the worlds electricity comes from fossil fuels, but then you wouldn't know anything about that.

Like I said before, it is obvious you dont know what you are talking about, and that is why you keep trying to use snide remarks and name calling to save your face.
Its just pathetic that the internet is nondiscriminatory towards contributors.

BTW where are the details on you 'decentralized' solution.?

elbat:

@Biina and @Beaf you guys are really great guys in your own individual rights cos you both helped us to see matters from both sides of the coin. I am however appalled at how you have allowed the differences in your opinion to degenerate into a personal level where you are not taking snipes at each other. Please it is not acceptable and debases both of you.

This somewhat epitomises our significant problem in Nigeria where to find people to collaborate effectively is a big challenge. There will always be difference of opinion but the example of the rainbow shows we can have a blend where all the opinions unite and point us to the pure divine the truth, the light that shines out the darkness of ignorance,

Guys, I wish to aknowledge your contributions and give a toast to your uniqueness, Anyone supports me, please give a toast to this too, a new beginning of mutually benefically collaboration and discourse.

Now my point of interest, I hate people who talk to much, what actions can we elicit from all this discussions? I have come to a point where I believe, find the right people with the right ideas, we should be able to get the bulldozers to bring focus to the ideas because ideas alone don't move mountains of corruption and ineptitude, executors do.

Thanks for the kind words. They are much appreciated.

===pours cold water to revive fainting biina. . . hugs him ===

Beaf:

Thanks for the kind words. They are much appreciated.

===pours cold water to revive fainting biina. . . hugs him ===

No need for hugs. Like I said, its nothing personal, but that (when i am privileged) I will always take to task you (or anyone) that makes unguarded declarations on things they know little to nothing of. Nigeria is rife with bungalow experts, from the roadside political analyst, to the beer palour based national team coach. When in truth, being unqualified makes the question of competence moot.

^
. . .But you were tasking yourself . You had nothing new.
I surely never felt tasked.

===Since biina refused the hug, Beaf would have donned the champion gloves again to deliver some more intellectually wicked and deft left hook, straight jab and uppercut combinations. . . But I respect the civilised forumers who have asked for to the exchange to end. O yes, I'm a gentleman! ===

. . .Some PHCN workers sha

Beaf:

^
. . .But you were tasking yourself . You had nothing new.
I surely never felt tasked.

===Since biina refused the hug, Beaf would have donned the champion gloves again to deliver some more intellectually wicked and deft left hook, straight jab and uppercut combinations. . . But I respect the civilised forumers who have asked for to the exchange to end. O yes, I'm a gentleman! ===

. . .Some PHCN workers sha

So you want something new? for what? just for the sake of being new?
The speed of light in vacuum is exactly 299,792,458 m/s and it is not new. Should we then discard it?
Laws of motion have been same since the days of Einstein, should we also disregard them?
What we need is something right, which could be new, old or whatever.
That in Nigeria, like most parts of the world, fossil fuels currently have the lowest total cost per watt  and offer great economies of scale is a fact. But you would rather we ignore the facts and go on a fool's errand towards failure, simply because you want something new?

What you seem to be confusing with 'new' is 'right change'. Nobody can claim that the current PHCN setup is working, but instead of suggesting the right changes that would fix the problem (which requires understanding the existing problems), you just want to simply discard the existing setup for something 'new'. It is ironic that your 'decentralization' solution that you think is 'new', if implemented, would leave us in our old state, with only those rich enough being able to afford it. You yourself identified that our current state is like your proposed decentralized system, with everyone trying to fend for themselves, and we all know how well that is working for us.  

People like you try to reinvent the wheel in a 'bound to fail' bid at innovation. If you have a problem that someone else has solved, you should learn from them, and not waste resources perambulating.

biina:
. . .
People like you try to reinvent the wheel in a 'bound to fail' bid at innovation. If you have a problem that someone else has solved, you should learn from them, and not waste resources perambulating.

Scenario;
you get married to a pretty babe and its time to start a family. Your neighbour has ten kids (he has obviously solved the problem of impregnating women). . . So will you decide not to "waste resources perambulating" and call him in to "reveal the knowhow" to your pretty babe?

Damn! You're soooooooooooo entertaining.

PS; the laws of motion have been around since Newton. Stop "inventing" the history of physics.

larrymilla
at least someone with sense online. here is the truth. the bulk of electricity use in nigeria is by the yorubas, edo,delta and bayelsa state, if you remove them, you would have better chance of electricity.

load is the word.


And I just was Ait, saying there are ijaw in akwa ibom state. AIT should please correct sure information. There are no ijaw people in Akwa Ibom state. There should check satellite picture.

Beaf:

Scenario;
you get married to a pretty babe and its time to start a family. Your neighbour has ten kids (he has obviously solved the problem of impregnating women). . . So will you decide not to "waste resources perambulating" and call him in to "reveal the knowhow" to your pretty babe?

Damn! You're soooooooooooo entertaining.

Another hunt and peck job.
It is a wrong analogy, but still I will humor you. If you keep missing the target or are simply firing blanks, you definitely need the help or else be willing to stay childless. There is nothing wrong is you asking your neighbor how you can get it done, and if he is the type that does his job in public view, I advise you watch closely.

PS; the laws of motion have been around since Newton. Stop "inventing" the history of physics.

WTF
I doubt you know much about physics. Either you never took classes in physics or you were just a poor student in physics or you simply have a problem with reading and comprehension. I would suspect the last of the three.
I said laws of motion have been 'same' i.e. unchanged since the time of Einstein. The newton's laws of motion (like kepler's) are a subset applicable in classical mechanics, as they apply at low speeds (when compared to the speed of light), while the contribution of Einstein was in general and special relativity. Newton's laws of motion are inaccurate at high speeds.
Do not accuse someone of 'inventing' the history of a field when you are less knowledgeable on the subject in question.

@becomrich
I can see 3 Ijaw people in the satellite picture.

biina: Another hunt and peck job.
It is a wrong analogy, but still I will humor you. If you keep missing the target or are simply firing blanks, you definitely need the help or else be willing to stay childless. There is nothing wrong is you asking your neighbor how you can get it done, and if he is the type that does his job in public view, I advise you watch closely.

I doubt you know much about physics. Either you never took classes in physics or you were just a poor student in physics or you simply have a problem with reading and comprehension. I would suspect the last of the three.
I said laws of motion have been 'same' i.e. unchanged since the time of Einstein. The newton's laws of motion (like kepler's) are a subset applicable in classical mechanics, as they apply at low speeds (when compared to the speed of light), while the contribution of Einstein was in general and special relativity. Newton's laws of motion are inaccurate at high speeds.
Do not accuse someone of 'inventing' the history of a field when you are less knowledgeable on the subject in question.

[size=14pt]Sharap dia![/size]
I have published academic papers in physics and I can lose you forever and ever when it comes to relativity or quantum physics. Why do you make yourself look stup!d? If I ask you what the Yukawa constant is, you will think I'm speaking Efik.
Why are you even talking about speed of light, abi do you people in NEPA use nuclear physics to take light?

Abeg stop derailing this thread jare, at least we now know that you are the type that will allow strangers sleep with your woman. Damn!

Beaf:

[size=14pt]Sharap dia![/size]
I have published academic papers in physics and I can lose you forever and ever when it comes to relativity or quantum physics. Why do you make yourself look stup!d? If I ask you what the Yukawa constant is, you will think I'm speaking Efik.
Why are you even talking about speed of light, abi do you people in NEPA use nuclear physics to take light?

Abeg stop derailing this thread jare, at least we now know that you are the type that will allow strangers sleep with your woman. Damn!

Again with the enlarged fonts - you need to learn that it doesnt improve your dilapidated credibility.
Academic papers in physics? now that is the funniest thing I have heard in years.  Someone, that doesnt appreciate the contributions of Einstein, claims he has academic papers in physics.
Where and when were they published - in the Biafran Science Group journal?

BTW you are right, while i have heard of Hideki Yukawa's contributions in particulate physics, I have no idea what the Yukawa's constant is. I am not a practicing physicist. Unlike you I don't claim to know what I dont know. People that think they know what they dont know are semi-illiterates.

Beaf:

You have shamelessly promoted the copying of technology from others. How do you imagine those countries got their technology? Who did they co[/b]py? [size=14pt]Olodo![/size]

[size=14pt][b]Oniparaga! Olodo![/size]

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

Beaf, so olodo now means fullstop to you, ko? Who be the copy copy now? Wait make I read una posts finish, I suspect say biina get stronger points. I dey go come.

biina:

Again with the enlarged fonts - you need to learn that it doesnt improve your dilapidated credibility.
Academic papers in physics? now that is the funniest thing I have heard in years. Someone, that doesnt appreciate the contributions of Einstein, claims he has academic papers in physics.
Where and when were they published - in the Biafran Science Group journal?

BTW you are right, while i have heard of Hideki Yukawa's contributions in particulate physics, I have no idea what the Yukawa's constant is. I am not a practicing physicist. Unlike you I don't claim to know what I dont know. People that think they know what they dont know are semi-illiterates.

There is nothing worse than talking stup!dly with those who know more than you. Yes, academic papers. Die!
Help yourself here http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Yukawa+constant&hl=en&rlz=1I7ADSA_en&sa=2.

[size=14pt]Olodo![/size]

ndu_chucks:

Beaf, so olodo now means fullstop to you, ko? Who be the copy copy now? Wait make I read una posts finish, I suspect say biina get stronger points. I dey go come.

ndu_chucks, I didn't mean to infringe on your copyright, but I'm a fast learner.

Beaf:

There is nothing worse than talking stup!dly with those who know more than you. Yes, academic papers. Die!

A statement that I agree with in its entirety. Its just sad that you lack the needed introspection to make optimal use of it.

Help yourself here http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Yukawa+constant&hl=en&rlz=1I7ADSA_en&sa=2.

[size=14pt]Olodo![/size]

Thanks for the link, but I 'll pass. I have no intention of mastering yukawa interaction nor particulate physics in genral. I am content with my 'little' area of expertise.