The only reason the french, russian and british managed to enforce a common language is that they had a school system and had an alphabet.

Nigerians talk about history a whole lot, but the funny thing is that nigerians are among the least knowledgeable people on the planet when it comes to history. I really wish someone would do something about nigeria's educational system.

Etinosa1234 which lands were conquered by oyo ? I mean conquered in real life, not on revisionist history printed in ibadan ?

There were only 3 empires of which the capitals are within the borders of nigeria:

1) Benin empire (the oldest one and the richest)
2) Borno empire
3) sokoto caliphate (the youngest empire) sokoto was still a young empire when the british came for their colonial wars against us.


There was no other empire whose capital is within nigeria.

Sobasojek:

Anything can put anything in wikki and i guess you know that

Check tao11 posts for detailed knowledge on how Oyo ruled over Benin because i know that you know Tao11

oyo never ruled Benin (whatever that means). tao has sold you deluded guys a lot of fake history. The weird thing is that tao is actually not very smart, yet that troll manages to fool the likes of you. This tells me all I need to know about your own intelligence.


Just show me an eyewitness record of "oyo ruling over Benin" (whatever than means), then I will give you 2000 dollars.
Also, I have never heard of a country ruling over an other, I have heard of an empire having provinces, but never "france rules over mali", it is rather "the king of france rules over mali", an entire country doesn't "rule" over an other, its king might... but anyways you guys like to hang on to crumbs, keep quoting words which you don't understand and which were written by people who were not eyewitnesses. But so long it suits your ego, any mad comment is allowed.

The only truth: europeans have been visiting west africa since the 1400's and they met a Benin empire ruled by the Oba of Benin, they named the sea "Bight of Benin" and drew maps and wrote texts. No where did they witness "oyo ruling over Benin".

I am tired with the likes of you.
(Claiming everything Benin seems to be the new(since the fall of Benin empire) found faith of the yoruba)

wysay:


People need to stop believing every fake news they see on social media, obviously your "documentary" was an ipob hoax and your "ika" man was most likely not Ika but rather an ipob fanatic whom has lived in enugu for his entire life. The ease with which you get yourself fooled about things which are quite easily disproven shows your lack of intellect and the ruin of nigerian education.

The oral story of the Ika is that they migrated from Benin city !

I said the man said he was an Igbo man, but shares the Igbo and Bini culture. They can be Bini if they want to and they can be Igbo. That's why they think they are favoured.

So everyone who doesn't say he's Ika and migrated from Bini is a hoax. Can you see your state of reasoning?

ThickSharon123:


I said the man said he was an Igbo man, but shares the Igbo and Bini culture. They can be Bini if they want to and they can be Igbo. That's why they think they are favoured.

So everyone who doesn't say he's Ika and migrated from Bini is a hoax. Can you see your state of reasoning?

where did I say "everyone who doesn't say he's Ika and migrated from Bini is a hoax" ?

I have talked to many nigerians, you guys are always very arrogant, you act and talk with the authority/arrogance of albert einstein whereas you are always clueless.
You can't intellectually compete with the outside world, but you don't seem to know that !

wysay:


where did I say "everyone who doesn't say he's Ika and migrated from Bini is a hoax" ?

You said, and I quote, "it could be an Enugu man who's saying is Ika becuase of Ipob and all that..." Read your comment. I don't want to tag and pinpoint it here. But an able reader would know where you're driving at.

ThickSharon123:


You said, and I quote, "it could be an Enugu man who's saying is Ika becuase of Ipob and all that..." Read your comment. I don't want to tag and pinpoint it here. But an able reader would know where you're driving at.

So basically, you are substituting reason with your feelings and your assumptions of how people would feel ?
And your "quote" isn't even a quote of me !!!

I have talked to many nigerians, you guys are always very arrogant, you act and talk with the authority/arrogance of albert einstein whereas you are always clueless.
You can't intellectually compete with the outside world, but you don't seem to know that !
I swear God cursed nigeria with dumbness.

wysay:


where did I say "everyone who doesn't say he's Ika and migrated from Bini is a hoax" ?

I have talked to many nigerians, you guys are always very arrogant, you act and talk with the authority/arrogance of albert einstein whereas you are always clueless.
You can't intellectually compete with the outside world, but you don't seem to know that !

Really, we can't compete with the outside world. You're so laughable. I'm not the person who throws tantrums. If you woke up on the wrong side of bed don't come for me. I'm not your problem.

Igbos are great and the greatest in the country. it's a fact and I can't spell it out. There's an Igbo renaissance happening, and even the foreigners are coming out to say they are from this great tribe. So don't speak more than what you don't know.

The Albert Einstein who claims to know it all may actually be you.

ThickSharon123:


Really, we can't compete with the outside world. You're so laughable. I'm not the person who throws tantrums. If you woke up on the wrong side of bed don't come for me. I'm not your problem.

Igbos are great and the greatest in the country. it's a fact and I can't spell it out. There's an Igbo renaissance happening, and even the foreigners are coming out to say they are from this great tribe. So don't speak more than what you don't know.

The Albert Einstein who claims to know it all may actually be you.

Areafada, you have been talking to an ipob fanatic, look how he just exposed himself.

wysay:

So basically, you are substituting reason with your feelings and your assumptions of how people would feel ?
And your "quote" isn't even a quote of me !!!

I have talked to many nigerians, you guys are always very arrogant, you act and talk with the authority/arrogance of albert einstein whereas you are always clueless.
You can't intellectually compete with the outside world, but you don't seem to know that !
I swear God cursed nigeria with dumbness.

Your view is, you want every Ika man born or not born to say they are either migrants from Bini or they are Bini, which isn't the case. Don't you think you want colonies?

Some Ika people say they are Bini but that isn't enough, you want more. You want all Ika man, even the ones who have ties with Igbo to say they are Bini, funny.

wysay:


Areafada, you have been talking to an ipob fanatic, look how he just exposed himself.

Areafada is way more better reasoning than you, except it's Areafada using the same account and trying to make me feel silly.

ThickSharon123:


Your view is ...

Already with the first two words you are making a logical mistake, indeed:

1) mind reading doesn't work
2) don't speak for me, that is not how a conversation works. I speak for me, you speak for you ! Got it ?

wysay:


Areafada, you have been talking to an ipob fanatic, look how he just exposed himself.

A

wysay:

Already with the first two words you are making a logical mistake, indeed:

1) mind reading doesn't work
2) don't speak for me, that is not how a conversation works. I speak for me, you speak for you ! Got it ?

Take a hand. Please, I'm not your problem. Mtcheww

ThickSharon123:


A

Illiterates don't get to give grades to professors, so thanks for your fanboyism, but it isn't worth much. Areafada is well respected by myself and by many. Now you can go back to your ipob gutter and get drunk and tell tales by moonlight.
Nobody there will takle you on logics or facts.

wysay:

Illiterates don't get to give grades to professors, so thanks for your fanboyism, but it isn't worth much. Areafada is well respected by myself and by many. Now you can go back to your ipob gutter and get drunk and tell tales by moonlight.
Nobody there will takle yoou on logics or facts.

Excuse me, that was a mistake. Seriously, you got issues, you need to fix your mind. Jeez.

I believe this is Areafada's second handle. Stop being silly.... IPob gutter and Bini has what?

There's a lot of things about Bini, read the comments in this post and you'll see whats more about Bini. That even the Igbos or the real Igbos rebuke to have any association with.

Bini is nothing to the Igbos.

wysay:
The language thing:

1) There are only 3 empires which managed to enforce a common language: french, british and russian. All other empires didn't manage to do that.

2) Without the existance of schools, it is impossible to impose a language on people, most of you guys don't seem to understand that the circumstances of today and those of the precolonial era are entirely different.

3) Even france didn't have a common language until around 400 years ago. And france had an alphabet !

4) to conlude with, you need two things to enforce a common language within a country (1) a school system (2) an alphabet. Our region of Africa had none of those two things, therefor it was impossible to enforce a language.

Although the language teaching part is correct, it depends on the aims of those colonising new lands. Egypt conquered new lands and they were literate but didn't expand that literacy or language to colonies. Romans on the other hand Spread their culture, lifestyle and language everywhere they went. St Paul in the Bible for example was a Romanised Jew.

Spain and Portugal also spread their language. Today Brazil speaks Portuguese and also Angola and Mozambique in Africa, many countries in Latin America speak Spanish. Agreed, many of the white colonists remained in these places. The Arabs took Arabic to Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco, Mauritania and other parts of North Africa. These were not Arab lands before. They were on a religious and cultural conquest.

Benin didn't have a large population and so had no plans to disperse Benin people anyway.

As for France and common Language, that applied to many European countries. English was not standardised until about time of Shakespeare. Germany had many dialects too. Many spoke only their own dialect.

Remember that in Europe, Latin was a common language. Isaac Newton and contemporary scientists across Europe published their work
mostly in Latin to reach a wider audience.

The romans didn't spread their language, if anything, the romans (their elite) took in the language and culture of the greeks.
The romans spread some parts of their culture, but not their language, as I said, such is impossible without a schools system the likes of which we have today.

AreaFada2:


Although the language teaching part is correct, it depends on the aims of those colonising new lands. Egypt conquered new lands and they were literate but didn't expand that literacy or language to colonies. Romans on the other hand Spread their culture, lifestyle and language everywhere they went. St Paul in the Bible for example was a Romanised Jew.

Spain and Portugal also spread their language. Today Brazil speaks Portuguese and also Angola and Mozambique in Africa, many countries in Latin America speak Spanish. Agreed, many of the white colonists remained in these places. The Arabs took Arabic to Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco, Mauritania and other parts of North Africa. These were not Arab lands before. They were on a religious and cultural conquest.

Benin didn't have a large population and so had no plans to disperse Benin people anyway.

You are very knowledgeable.
But you can not generalize the case of st paul to that of every jew.
Except the elite in judea or israel or whatever its name was, the rest of the people didn't speak a language other than their ancestral language, eventhough they had an alphabet. The thing is you also need a school system to actually teach the language to the general population.

AreaFada2:


St Paul in the Bible for example was a Romanised Jew.

ThickSharon123:


Excuse me, that was a mistake. Seriously, you got issues, you need to fix your mind. Jeez.

I believe this is Areafada's second handle. Stop being silly.... IPob gutter and Bini has what?

There's a lot of things about Bini, read the comments in this post and you'll see whats more about Bini. That even the Igbos or the real Igbos rebuke to have any association with.

Bini is nothing to the Igbos.

Sharon, I do not tolerate any nonsense. I have no need for two monikers. Only cowards or people who cannot be straight do so.

No tribe depends on another for food.

I for one support Igbo to be given a chance to do a referendum. Mind you, it was Zik who fought to remove referendum clause from Nigeria statute. Because back then, Igbo dominated civil service and were all over 9ja. Imagine that Zik's parents were already living in Zungeru, Niger State in 1904 when he was born.
If not for Zik, Nigeria would probably have broken up by now. 9ja is big for nothing, so I wonder what anybody has to drag.

Bendel left Western Region in 1963 when we felt that our voices were being tribalistically silenced. The only region democratically created in 9ja. So today I support referendum for people to decide where they want to go. Benin and Igbo will DEFINITELY not be in same country if that happens. We don't need each other.

AreaFada2:

Remember that in Europe, Latin was a common language. Isaac Newton and contemporary scientists across Europe published their work
mostly in Latin to reach a wider audience.

Actually, only the elite in europe knew latin, the general population didn't understand latin at all.
Actually it is a well known historical fact that in europe messes in churches were conducted in latin whereas the masses didn't understand latin, the priests used that lack of knowledge from the people to basically make them believe all kinds of rubbish and do all kinds of nonesense.
It is for this reason that there was a push in europe to translate the bible to the language of the common man: english, french...And that is what happened.

To make a people speak a language, you need 2 things:
(1) an alphabet
(2) a school system

AreaFada2:


Sharon, I do not tolerate any nonsense. I have no need for two monikers. Only cowards or people who cannot be straight do so.

No tribe depends on another for food.

I for one support Igbo to be given a chance to do a referendum. Mind you, it was Zik who fought to remove referendum clause from Nigeria statute. Because back then, Igbo dominated civil service and were all over 9ja. Imagine that Zik's parents were already living in Zungeru, Niger State in 1904 when he was born.
If not for Zik, Nigeria would probably have broken up by now. 9ja is big for nothing, so I wonder what anybody has to drag.

Bendel left Western Region in 1963 when we felt that our voices were being tribalistically silenced. The only region democratically created in 9ja. So today I support referendum for people to decide where they want to go. Benin and Igbo will DEFINITELY not be in same country if that happens. We don't need each other.

Don't be angry boo, I'm sorry. That guy sounded so angry like he woke up from the wrong side of bed. Do you stay in Benin?

AreaFada2:

Benin didn't have a large population and so had no plans to disperse Benin people anyway.

According to the records of the british in the colonial era, Benin had the fourth or third largest population during a census I think in the 1930's, and that census didn't even count all Edoid people as Edo, if it did then Benin would have been the largest ethnic group.

This is a thing which I keep trying to drive home: the situation of today and that of the precolonial era are entirely different.
Just because Benin is not seen as very populous today, doesn't mean Benin didn't have a large population in the precolonial era.
Many people who claim one ethnic group or the other today, their ancestors claimed Edo...

You have to take a scientific approach towards history and eliminate any sort of guess work or impression or feeling. That is how you get to the facts and that is what i generally do. I question every single thing, i have no certitudes, I need things proven before I believe them.

Have a nice day.

wysay:


Actually, only the elite in europe knew latin, the general population didn't understand latin at all.
Actually it is a well known historical fact that in europe messes in churches were conducted in latin whereas the masses didn't understand latin, the priests used that lack of knowledge from the people to basically make them believe all kinds of rubbish and do all kinds of nonesense.
It is for this reason that there was a push in europe to translate the bible to the manguage of the common man: english, french...And that is what happened.

Fact is literacy level was low in Europe back then. Anybody with a decent level of education did Latin, even Greek to some extent. By 1500, literacy level in England in men was around 11% and much less in women.

ThickSharon123:


Don't be angry boo, I'm sorry. That guy sounded so angry like he woke up from the wrong side of bed. Do you stay in Benin?

Is ok.
To the bolded, No.

wysay:

According to the records of the british in the colonial era, Benin had the fourth or third largest population during a census I think in the 1930's, and that census didn't even count all Edoid people as Edo, if it did then Benin would have been the largest ethnic group.

This is a thing which I keep trying to drive home: the situation of today and that of the precolonial era are entirely different.
Just because Benin is not seen as very populous today, doesn't mean Benin didn't have a large population in the precolonial era.
Many people who claim one ethnic group or the other today, their ancestors claimed Edo...

You have to take a scientific approach towards history and eliminate any sort of guess work or impression or feeling. That is how you get to the facts and that is what i generally do. I question every single thing, i have no certitudes, I need things proven before I believe them.

Have a nice day.

The population of Benin-City was one of the largest in this part of West Africa. It was like the Lagos of those days. But compared to the size of the areas where it held sway, the population still wasn't enough to spread across the whole empire. Benin needed men to fight wars, so it needed to retain its population. Remember that some of those warriors never returned as they stayed to form and or protect new colonies.

Consider distance of Lagos, Yenagoa, Degema, Igede in Benue State, Ga in Accra, Ghana, from Benin Kingdom of today. Not to mention nearer parts like Ondo/Ekiti or Delta State. I am very much aware of the many Benin descendants across West Africa today.
Yes, Edoid people if counted together will likely to 4th in size in 9ja but we do not want to tell people how to identify themselves. We can throw light into history and create awareness. It's up to those people to identify. Some are already coming to identify with their roots on their own.

AreaFada2:


The population of Benin-City was one of the largest in this part of West Africa. It was like the Lagos of those days. But compared to the size of the areas where it held sway, the population still wasn't enough to spread across the whole empire. Benin needed men to fight wars, so it needed to retain its population. Remember that some of those warriors never returned as they stayed to form and or protect new colonies.

Consider distance of Lagos, Yenagoa, Degema, Igede in Benue State, Ga in Accra, Ghana, from Benin Kingdom of today. Not to mention nearer parts like Ondo/Ekiti or Delta State. I am very much aware of the many Benin descendants across West Africa today.
Yes, Edoid people if counted together will likely to 4th in size in 9ja but we do not want to tell people how to identify themselves. We can throw light into history and create awareness. It's up to those people to identify. Some are already coming to identify with their roots on their own.

Benin city was just the capital of Benin kingdom, there were many other cities within Benin kingdom, Lagos was one, warri was an other, auchi also, Onitsha was an other one...
So the population of Benin city is not relevant to the history of Benin kingdom.

The people of Benin are the people of Benin kingdom of which those who live in Benin city are only a subset.
It is true that in the precolonial era and even in the colonial era, the population size of the region was not as important as that of today at least in the period in which colonization happened. It is believed that wars and slavery among many other things reduced the population of our region and precolonial country

ThickSharon123:


Don't be angry boo, I'm sorry. That guy sounded so angry like he woke up from the wrong side of bed. Do you stay in Benin?

I have read benin history to an extent of understanding, and thankGod benin history was writing down by European that was only gift the Europeans could have given the benins to for their hospitality... To them...


Benins didnt just invade any territories without
Importance to that area the ika land was believed to have the native white chalk in abundance, and in other to control such vital resources, ika areas had to be occupied by force by the benins,

When benin conquers a territory they only sends down military commanders and few traders who were mainly chiefs, their wives and children were forbidden to go with them, to this new territories, these benin nobles occupying this new territories takes upon new wife's in the conquered territories and have children and the children and their mothers would be left behind if he returns back to benin,...


So to say, the ikas were original igbos, who later were mixed with benins, any benin man who is saying ikas were originally benin is egoistic and deluded, i am benin myself.... Even the esans were not originally benins, but were invaded by we benins and a full mass migration happened from benin to esan at a time that made them edo like...

ThickSharon123:


Don't be angry boo, I'm sorry. That guy sounded so angry like he woke up from the wrong side of bed. Do you stay in Benin?

But is that the pics of your ass, and if it is iwhy upload it

gregyboy:


I have read benin history to an extent of understanding, and thankGod benin history was writing down by European that was only gift the Europeans could have given the benins to for their hospitality... To them...


Benins didnt just invade any territories without
Importance to that area the ika land was believed to have the native white chalk in abundance, and in other to control such vital resources, ika areas had to be occupied by force by the benins,

When benin conquers a territory they only sends down military commanders and few traders who were mainly chiefs, their wives and children were forbidden to go with them, to this new territories, these benin nobles occupying this new territories takes upon new wife's in the conquered territories and have children and the children and their mothers would be left behind if he returns back to benin,...


So to say, the ikas were original igbos, who later were mixed with benins, any benin man who is saying ikas were originally benin is egoistic and deluded, i am benin myself.... Even the esans were not originally benins, but were invaded by we benins and a full mass migration happened from benin to esan at a time that made them edo like...

We have to be more careful and thoughtful the way we look at these matters.

You authoritatively claim to be a Benin person.

My question is, what makes someone a Benin person?

1. Is it by birth, meaning anyone born in Benin irrespective of were their parents comes from.

2. Is it by being born into one of the Benin numerous families?

Starting from option one above, are you aware that there are established families in Benin that originally migrated from elsewhere.

Are children born to Benin people in diaspora less Benin than those born in Benin City?

During the days of empire, numerous Benin family migrated out of Benin just the way thousands have migrated to Europe and America in recent years. Are the children of these immigrants that migrated to Rivers, Imo, Anambra, Benue, etc in the olden days and recently to America and Europe, Benin.

Who then have the right to say someone is either Benin or not? If Wike in Rivers says his ancestors were Benin, who has the right to say he his lying, if Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe said his ancestors were Benin, who has the right to say he lied.

On classification of various ethnic groups, are you not committing the same error as those that thinks Benin people are yoruba by claiming that Ika were originally Igbo. Are you aware that numerous Ika people will be offended by such claim just the way you are offended when someone classify you as yoruba.

Why would you be offended when you are called a yoruba person, it's because Benin is much more older and established as an ethnic group to come under any newly formed name such as Yoruba, Benin has been in existence centuries before the word Yoruba came into existence.

Similarly, Ika is much older than the word Igbo, so if you wouldn't like to be call a yoruba, why do you think majority of Ika people wouldn't take offence when called Igbo. Mind you there are Edo people or some Benin people that wouldn't mind being called Yoruba just as there are Anioma/Ika people that identify with the Igbo identity , but these people are usually in the minorities and it's their right to identify with any ethnic groups they are comfortable with.

There is a post on Idu here on nairaland, the author said he is not Igbo, he is from Abia state, but his people were just classified as Igbo, if someone from Abia state can make such claims, why would you think Ika were originally Igbo.

To the average southerners, everyone in the North is Hausa/Fulani, to the average northerners, anyone in the south is either a yoruba or Igbo, to the average yoruba, you are either Hausa or Igbo.

To the average Igbo person, Benin is yoruba and the average yoruba sees Benin as Igbo.

Those of us interested in history should be more sensitive to the various ethnic groups in Nigeria and identify them the way they want to be identified. We daily fight those that call us yoruba and shouldn't be making the same mistake, Most Ikas don't identify as Igbo.