rhymz:

Come'on ekt_bear, what fact do I need from a straight person I have always known who recently turned gay.
I dont know how the social systems in the west works but I can say without any fear of equivocation that a majority of the people down here in the act were not born that way, nature never made them like that.
Have you been to our boarding and secondary schools? Do you know how much of such habit a new entrant there can pick up? Not to talk of our Universities where we have some very popular gay groups with enviable access to , who make such habit look very attractive and fashionable to wanna-be(s).
Well, I may not have written evidence to show that homosexuality has almost nothing or very little to do with genetic make up but more to do with the product of ones environment and value system; however, I have personal experiences and stories from the horses mouth to prove my case. And pls, i would realy love it for you to show that there are scientifically proven cases of homosexuality in human genetic make-up.

I don't buy all that stuff of people being converted into homosexuality or whatever. It doesn't make sense to me. . . why would anyone choose something that is stigmatized socially and in some societies greatly increases the chance of you being lynched/attacked by a mob? Only a m.o.ron would choose homosexuality if it were optional for him, I think.

Anyway, if we don't approach it scientifically and just resort to personal experience, hearsay, then not much good can come of this discussion.

A few years ago I read some stuff on the subject. From what I recall, research seems to indicate it is genetic. . . most people are either born gay or straight. 10-15% of people are gay, iirc.

I don't really have time to dig up the stuff I read at that time, but I'm sure you'll be able to find plenty of material discussing nature vs nurture for homosexuality.

They should give birth to their own child rather than adopt one.

Hrm, actually, it isn't so cut and dried I guess.

There is a ton of stuff on the relevant Wikipedia articles, and some links to scientific research. Draw your conclusions, I guess.

But for me, based on what I've read in the past and what makes sense to me, I think it is mostly genetic.

ekt_bear:

A few years ago I read some stuff on the subject. From what I recall, research seems to indicate it is genetic. . . most people are either born gay or straight. 10-15% of people are gay, iirc.

I don't really have time to dig up the stuff I read at that time, but I'm sure you'll be able to find plenty of material discussing nature vs nurture for homosexuality.

If my knowledge does not fail me, I think most sources for such arguments only offer hypotheses and not scientific facts.

I am yet to see any proven.

It will shock me if anyone can prove it since homosexuality genes will only exist in humans, out of the multi-million of species on Earth.

Something tells me it is a choice or a biological dysfunction.

Cure it, not accept it.

Beaf:

Pseudo-liberalism always shoots itself in the foot in defense of the indefensible. Can you hate armed robbery, but love the armed robber?
To be gay is to be anti-society, because gay couples do not replenish or build populations by procreating, rather they rob it off some of those abilities. To encourage gays is to encourage the death of the community.

@Beaf

No one is encouraging anyone, so dont tow that line. Simple question, what have we done to the people who have held the enitre country hostage with bad government and killed people in the process? Do we consider those with different sexual preference that us worse than the Politicians who have fhucked Nigerians from every hole possible?

And I repeat, this is not about encouraging anything, but taking a measured pespective on things

monkeyleg:

@Beaf

No one is encouraging anyone, so dont tow that line. Simple question, what have we done to the people who have held the enitre country hostage with bad government and killed people in the process? Do we consider those with different sexual preference that us worse than the Politicians who have fhucked Nigerians from every hole possible?

And I repeat, this is not about encouraging anything, but taking a measured pespective on things

I think I am yet to see any enlightened Nigerian that does not hate our thieving politicians, so I really don't get what your distraction arguments is all about.

Maybe you will soon start telling us to shut up when we condemn a wife that misled her husband into fathering 4 kids that are not his because "Ah, our hate should be directed at our politicians. Lets get things in perspective and focus on our bigger picture/problem".

Ibo can do anything for money,

@Sagamite,

A young man coming back to Nigeria with partner is not as big an issue as that which plagues us right now "corruption", and like I keep saying, this is not a problem as Nigeria as a society would naturally take care of if. Funny enough, there might already be loads of people who fit your description that coming into nigeria everyday.

So how many of those enlightened Nigerians have actually pressed for corrupted politicians to be tried and jailed? How many? Most would shut their mouth up, not wanting to face up to the threat that comes with tackling this issue

monkeyleg:

@Sagamite,

A young man coming back to Nigeria with partner is not as big an issue as that which plagues us right now "corruption", and like I keep saying, this is not a problem as Nigeria as a society would naturally take care of if. Funny enough, there might already be loads of people who fit your description that coming into nigeria everyday.

So how many of those enlightened Nigerians have actually pressed for corrupted politicians to be tried and jailed? How many? Most would shut their mouth up, not wanting to face up to the threat that comes with tackling this issue

Cut the crap my friend!

A young man coming home with his gay and seeing it necessary to announce it in the media to us in a country where it is illegal and hated is a fcking big issue.

And no other big issue would stop it being a big issue. Stop distracting the debate with silly arguments.

So we must not condemn anything else in Nigeria until enlightened people actually pressed for corrupt Nigerians to be jailed?

By the way, where the fck have you been since Nigerians everywhere in the world have been screaming and petitioning for EFCC to jail certain people?

Stop giving silly distraction arguments to suppress a valid uproar!

@Sagamite,

Learn how to argue with our resorting to words like silly, it tells a lot about you. By the way I see you live in the UK where those with differing views than you are allowed to live free of caustic words like oyurs, if you are so anti whoever why dont you retrun back to Nigeria where you can practice your belief fully and probably build yourself an army of haters

monkeyleg:

@Sagamite,

Learn how to argue with our resorting to words like silly, it tells a lot about you. By the way I see you live in the UK where those with differing views than you are allowed to live free of caustic words like oyurs, if you are so anti whoever why dont you retrun back to Nigeria where you can practice your belief fully and probably build yourself an army of haters

Learn how to argue logically, it is your responsibility.

Differing views is not a problem, illogical views are an insult to the "having a right to an opinion" we try and advocate.

With rights comes responsibilities.

@Sagamite,

The fact that I dont support your idea of purnishing those who have differning sexual orientation from us, does not make my arugument illogical. My view of Nigeria is that we have more pressing issues at hand that running after some chap and his boyfriend.

What would you prescribe the Nigerian government and Nigerians do in this situation?

Well, really not surprising that the gay is Ibo. This is a group that almost brought down the Catholic Church, and Christianity, just because of their male specie's love for "Wood"!!!! Or, how the hell has anyone forgotten this story:





Chinedu Ehiem: Vatican Usher Link to Gay Prostitution Sex Scandal


Share:     by Scott Wu | March 5, 2010 at 12:51 pm

2031 views | 8 Recommendations | 4 comments
Chinedu Ehiem Dismissed by Vatican amid Gay Prostitution Sex Scandal

Chinedu Ehiem, a Nigerian ceremonial usher in Vatican, was dismissed after his name appeared in police wiretaps transcripts for an unrelated investigation. Chinedu Ehiem was in regular contact with Angelo Balducci, who was initially arrested on corruption charges before the sex scandal emerged.

Transcripts of the wiretaps between Chinedu Ehiem and Angelo Balducci show that their subject of discussion was gay sex. Police say Balducci was in contact with Ghinedu Ehiem and another Italian who were part of "an organized network ,  to abet male prostitution."

Vatican Slams Avatar
The Simpsons Praised In Vatican's Newspaper
Chinedu Ehiem was dismissed from the Giulia Choir on Wednesday. Angelo Balducci was an engineer and construction consultant for Vatican. Balducci was already arrested, and he has been dismissed from the elite group of ushers.

Balducci was a member of the elite usher group "Gentlemen of His Holiness." The group carried the coffin of Pope John Paul in 2005.



Continue reading at NowPublic.com: Chinedu Ehiem: Vatican Usher Link to Gay Prostitution Sex Scandal | NowPublic News Coverage

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/chinedu-ehiem-vatican-usher-link-gay-prostitution-sex-scandal#ixzz1NStI2k6c


http://www.nowpublic.com/world/chinedu-ehiem-vatican-usher-link-gay-prostitution-sex-scandal

monkeyleg:

@Sagamite,

The fact that I dont support your idea of purnishing those who have differning sexual orientation from us, does not make my arugument illogical. My view of Nigeria is that we have more pressing issues at hand that running after some chap and his boyfriend.

There is one thing to say Nigeria has more pressing issues.

It is a completely different other thing to say Nigeria should only focus on other more pressing things like you have been saying. That is completely illogical!

monkeyleg:

What would you prescribe the Nigerian government and Nigerians do in this situation?

I have said it before.

If you have the audacity and idiocy to announce that you are coming to the country to do or be what is illegal, then you should be watched and dealt with if you engage in any act that is illegal.

You don't go to Saudi and announce in advance in the Newspapers that you plan to use the Quran to wipe your arse, do you?

Lmao @ Matrimonial home. On a serious note, how does his action affect u and I? You people are hyperventilating over what two men chose to do with each other? Yall have problems. I beg make una leave alone make m go attend to his duties in his matrimonial home. Lol
He is gay and all that so what? His sexuality is one part of him not all so we should focus on that.

udezue:

Lmao @ Matrimonial home. On a serious note, how does his action affect u and I? You people are hyperventilating over what two men chose to do with each other? Yall have problems. I beg make una leave alone make m go attend to his duties in his matrimonial home. Lol
He is gay and all that so what? His sexuality is one part of him not all so we should focus on that.

He can explain his sexuality is one part of him to the inmates in Kirikiri.

@Sagamite, but he is going to Kirikiri anytime soon so tough luck. You can't even get ur corrupt, criminally minded murderous leaders to even answer questions or stand trial for their crimes yet u arte concerned what some dude does in the bedroom with the other? A lot of you overly homophobes are closet gays and bisexuals anyways. I don't trust yall.

udezue:

@Sagamite, but he is going to Kirikiri anytime soon so tough luck. You can't even get your corrupt, criminally minded murderous leaders to even answer questions or stand trial for their crimes yet u arte concerned what some dude does in the bedroom with the other? A lot of you overly homophobes are closet gays and bisexuals anyways. I don't trust yall.

You must be reetarded!

Let him go and try is homo in public in Nigeria and I can guarantee you that he would not see Kirikiri. He would see a strong white light he is involuntarily floating to.

Cretin, so because we have not tried all our criminal-minded leaders anything goes?

Fooool!

Maybe you have been assaulted up the arse as a child and you loved it or you are a gay hence your blind support for faggotism.

Ewu!

@Sagamite, your father is a STandard Basttard and I hope you get rapedd by a man. Fooool like you. So because I don't the criminalization of ppl's sexuality then I musta been sexually assaulted? What a freakin morron? I'm not in Nigeria to know what will happen to them but if they are to be lynched just because they are gay then it goes to show and prove again how barbaric and violent Nigerians can be. Like I said go and face the real criminals who have rendered over 100 million poor and destitute not some batty boiz who are going through the same struggles with u and I. Olodo 5 kobo. Bytch a$$$

U probably @ home suckin a dyck right now while fronting on NL.

udezue:

U probably @ home suckin a dyck right now while fronting on NL.

, easy abeg na!!!

Sagamite:

If my knowledge does not fail me, I think most sources for such arguments only offer hypotheses and not scientific facts.

I am yet to see any proven.

It will shock me if anyone can prove it since homosexuality genes will only exist in humans, out of the multi-million of species on Earth.

It does exist in the wild.

Sagamite:
Something tells me it is a choice or a biological dysfunction.

By choice, no. Well, not likely. Apart from the fact that the evidence argues against it, it is counterintuitive to think anyone would chose to be branded, despised and rejected. Biological dysfunction? Probably. In fact, highly probable.

Sagamite:
Cure it, not accept it.

Cure it? Well, nothing has really worked yet.


Here's an old post I made in some thread:

MyJoe:
I did not mean to convey that genes are responsible for homosexuality. I am hardly qualified to make that assertion or any similar one. The point I was making was that we do not know that genes are not responsible – there is already so much militant misunderstanding of homosexuality about. What we do know is that homosexuality is mostly not something you pick up at all-boys school or decide to go into for recreation as many believe. It appears most, if not all, homosexuals grow up to find that their sexual orientation is inverted. There are several possibilities and the gene theory is one of them, though not a particular strong one.

I personally would pay closer attention to the theory that it is a congenital disorder which may, in some, be amenable to drugs, psychotherapy or hypnotism and not be in others. People exhibit signs of homosexuality early in life. To drive home this point, I think we need to consider the case of transvestism. This problem occurs with or without of the sexual orientation. There was a popular story of the kid in, UK, I think, who had this problem – the boy thought he was a girl. (I heard this on British radio over a year ago, so I hope I recall it right.) Growing up he slipped into girls clothes, played with girls and behaved like them. Unfortunately the law in his country did not allow him to have what is called “gender reassignment surgery” until he turned 18 to CORRECT his system. So he was flown to the US where he was given female focal places and he now lives a NORMAL life. I believe it is easily deducible that hermaphroditism is a physical manifestation of a similar disorder.

The congenital nature of homosexuality is backed up by scientific studies which found that the female-type sexual behavior can form in genetic males and the male-type sexual behavior can form in genetic females as a result of hormonal misbalance during a certain stage of embryogenesis. This problem with all the scientific studies that have been conducted on this subject, though, is that they have found no single factor, such as the one above, explains all cases of homosexuality.

So a 1976 study throws more light. Can homosexuality be acquired? That has not been ruled out.

Permit me to quote Dr Antonov:

Basing on examination of homosexual men in 1976, we pointed out different origins of the active and the passive forms of the disease.

The observations of homosexual patients that we conducted during the next several years allowed us to classify homosexual people not into two, but into three groups — by the mechanism of the origin of the disease:

1) Men with the passive and women with the active form of congenital homosexuality. Such men and women felt themselves respectively girls and boys since their childhood; they preferred to play games and wear clothes typical of the opposite intimacy. Many men had congenital feminine features, while women — congenital masculine features. In sexual relationships, the men felt themselves as women, while the women — as men. A high percentage of them have some kind of hereditary anomalies and report pregnancy pathologies or premature birth.

2) Men with the passive and women with the active form of acquired homosexuality. These patients do not have congenital homosexual mentality and perverted feminine or masculine features. Their attraction to the same intimacy forms on the basis of conditioned reflex during the stage of adolescent intersexuality.

3) Men with the active and women with the passive form of acquired homosexuality. Such men look masculine and possess male-type sexuality. Correspondingly, the women possess feminine features and female type of sexual behavior. Their pathological attraction to the opposite intimacy forms also on the basis of conditioned reflex, usually at the juvenile age. Later on their homosexual attraction either a) transforms into regular but then reverts to homosexual as a result of mental traumas caused by heterosexual contacts or impossibility of heterosexual contacts due to various reasons, or b) moves on to their adult life either totally displacing the regular-type sexual attraction or coexisting with it. A significant fraction of patients of this group report hereditary abnormalities, various serious somatic diseases in their childhood as well as pregnancy pathologies and premature birth. Such anamnesis indicates an influence of some injuring factor, which could impair the brain structures that regulate the congenital component of one’s sexual orientation.

It follows from the above stated data that homosexuality represents a disease of polymorphic origin, which accounts for the difficulties that exist in its treatment. This is why there can be no universal method applicable to all those who want to be cured of homosexuality; the specific treatment has to be chosen depending on the etiologic group that the patient belongs to. Apart from psychotherapeutic measures various medications can also be used.

udezue:

@Sagamite, your father is a STandard Basttard and I hope you get rapedd by a man. Fooool like you. So because I don't the criminalization of ppl's sexuality then I musta been sexually assaulted? What a freakin morron? I'm not in Nigeria to know what will happen to them but if they are to be lynched just because they are gay then it goes to show and prove again how barbaric and violent Nigerians can be. Like I said go and face the real criminals who have rendered over 100 million poor and destitute not some batty boiz who are going through the same struggles with u and I. Olodo 5 kobo. Bytch a$$$

udezue:

U probably @ home suckin a dyck right now while fronting on NL.

You are a cretin!

Maybe you are a gay since you are a diehard supporter of gays. It annoys you I am bashing your community?

Pervert!

Believe me, not everyone does what you do at home everyday and grew up sucking Dickson instead of a child's dummy. Contrary to your beliefs, such is not normal. It was child abuse.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MyJoe:

It does exist in the wild.

Nope.

All I have seen is people trying to prove seemingly homosexual acts in animals as proof that animals are homosexuals. That doesn't wash.

Some freak performing homosexual acts (on Udezue) does not necessarily mean that freakish thing is homosexual (like Udezue).

MyJoe:

By choice, no. Well, not likely. Apart from the fact that the evidence argues against it, it is counterintuitive to think anyone would chose to be branded, despised and rejected. Biological dysfunction? Probably. In fact, highly probable.

I have not seen the evidence.

Yet I have seen some Whites that have said they have "experimented" by choice.

MyJoe:

Cure it? Well, nothing has really worked yet.

If there is belief, hope and attempt that a cure will be found for paedophilia, I see no reason why we can not attempt same for gays.

We need to rescue Udezue.

This appears to me as something that requires a cure or prevention at least:

3) Men with the active and women with the passive form of acquired homosexuality. Such men look masculine and possess male-type sexuality. Correspondingly, the women possess feminine features and female type of sexual behavior. Their pathological attraction to the opposite intimacy forms also on the basis of conditioned reflex, usually at the juvenile age. Later on their homosexual attraction either a) transforms into regular but then reverts to homosexual as a result of mental traumas caused by heterosexual contacts or impossibility of heterosexual contacts due to various reasons, or b) moves on to their adult life either totally displacing the regular-type sexual attraction or coexisting with it. A significant fraction of patients of this group report hereditary abnormalities, various serious somatic diseases in their childhood as well as pregnancy pathologies and premature birth. Such anamnesis indicates an influence of some injuring factor, which could impair the brain structures that regulate the congenital component of one’s sexual orientation.

It is very similar to the childhood trauma of Udezue.

Sagamite:

Nope.

All I have seen is people trying to prove seemingly homosexual acts in animals as proof that animals are homosexuals. That doesn't wash.

There's your subjective interpretation to an act which appears to be sex performed by two animals of the same sex. Fair enough. The US Supreme Court certainly accepted the other interpretation in striking down anti-homosexuality laws in some states.

Sagamite:
I have not seen the evidence.

Yet I have seen some Whites that have said they have "experimented" by choice.

Yeah. Like I once experimented with weed at Bar Beach. There are crazy people who try all sort of things. And normal people who try all sort of crazy things at times. But most homosexuals appear to evince a clear rejection of intimacy with the opposite sex. There are married men who abandon their wife and sneak out to seek fellow men.

Sagamite:
If there is belief, hope and attempt that a cure will be found for paedophilia, I see no reason why we can not attempt same for gays.

I'm unaware there is much yet beyond "voluntary chemical castration", which the Canadians seem particularly interested in, and the usual psychotherapy. On the contrary, a lot has  been done to try to "cure" homosexuals with no success.

monkeyleg:

@Sagamite,

A young man coming back to Nigeria with partner is not as big an issue as that which plagues us right now "corruption", and like I keep saying, this is not a problem as Nigeria as a society would naturally take care of if. Funny enough, there might already be loads of people who fit your description that coming into nigeria everyday.

So how many of those enlightened Nigerians have actually pressed for corrupted politicians to be tried and jailed? How many? Most would shut their mouth up, not wanting to face up to the threat that comes with tackling this issue

Mehn I can't believe that Nwa Afor like you will make such a careless declaration that an Igbo young man taking a fellow male as his second half to meet with his parents in the east is not worthy of discussion. Nwanna, ima kwa ihie wu alu-that such a man could be bold and brazen to bring his gay lover to see his family in the village-whatever happened to your sense of decency and customary accepted values. Do you know the kind of violence that brainless act could spark. If homosexuality was inconsequential as you would like us to believe how come recently, was it in kenya or so, there was a wildly publicized media attention on a gay couple who tried to do thesame rubbish by marrying each other in the African country. They almost got killed and I think they almost got jail terms for such. Are you saying there government and people should not have taken decisive steps to nip such rubbish in the bud, may be they should have waited until they solve all their so called "pressing issues" before dealing with that sociatal malignancy.
Do you know increasingly hedious homosexuality is?
I can't even count how many times my elder sister was disturbed by this bunch in different occassions.
No need acting like it is not a problem my brother cos it is. This efulefus are getting brazen by the day and it is only logical to condemn botj them and their acts cos they are inseparable.

MyJoe:

There's your subjective interpretation to an act which appears to be sex performed by two animals of the same sex. Fair enough. The US Supreme Court certainly accepted the other interpretation in striking down anti-homosexuality laws in some states.
Yeah. Like I once experimented with weed at Bar Beach. There are crazy people who try all sort of things. And normal people who try all sort of crazy things at times. But most homosexuals appear to evince a clear rejection of intimacy with the opposite sex. There are married men who abandon their wife and sneak out to seek fellow men.

No, it is not my subjective interpretation. It is a robust interpretation. And, yes, the supreme court judges of America can be wrong. I am not one to see them as right always or some Gods.

All my interpretation requires is evidence of animals that "evince a clear rejection of intimacy with the opposite sex" as well before I can accept the proof that there are Gay animals, not animals that swing both ways and have "gay behaviours". The objective and robust approach is that gay animals need to be gay, not act gay.

Furthermore, I don't think (I might be wrong) the supreme court of US made their judgement based on "natural" qualifications, they did it based on "rights" qualification. The latter is more subjective than the former. So, hey, I am more objective.

MyJoe:

I'm unaware there is much yet beyond "voluntary chemical castration", which the Canadians seem particularly interested in, and the usual psychotherapy. On the contrary, a lot has  been done to try to "cure" homosexuals with no success.

I am sure I have heard of therapy for paedos.

So if they feel therapy might cure paedos, why can't we explore same for gays?

Na wa o

@Udezue,

Well done my brother. I have been trying make our bro Sagamire understand we are rasing dust over an issue not as pressing as others.

@Sagamite, like u said there are laws of the land that take care of things like these, why all the sweating? But more importantly, what are you guys doing about the thieving politician and bankers walk free? have they not damaged more lives than Chika and his Oga? Please let us focus on that which should deserve higher priority

monkeyleg:

@Udezue,

Well done my brother. I have been trying make our bro Sagamire understand we are rasing dust over an issue not as pressing as others.

@Sagamite, like u said there are laws of the land that take care of things like these, why all the sweating? But more importantly, what are you guys doing about the thieving politician and bankers walk free? have they not damaged more lives than Chika and his Oga? Please let us focus on that which should deserve higher priority

Please stop asking me silly questions.

How many times do I have to educate you that some mutually exclusive situation should not prevent actions on another situation?

@Sagamite, the 3 ppp's (Proportion, pespective and priority), please understand those before you start insulting people who disagree with you

monkeyleg:

@Sagamite, the 3 ppp's (Proportion, pespective and priority), please understand those before you start insulting people who disagree with you

Understand this: MT-CG

Multi-tasking, comprehensive governance.

even in a govenment that multitasks, priorties, pespective and proportion are set. I can bet you even the most corrupt and wicked in our society will queue up to mistreat this person. What a country