JAZES:

I laugh at your ignorance, it is clear in scriptures that its not ordinary
language we speak when we speak in tongues.
I think it is very insulting for you to even try to box speaking in the Spirit to ordinary language.

Ephesians 5: 18-19 makes it clear that we speak in the Spirit.
Ephesians 6:18 says the same thing.
Jude20 emphasize it.

Mr Pastor, when we speak in tongues we speak in the Spirit and that is expressly clear
in the bible.

I need to rest now, when am fully awake i will give you the background story of the whole book of
Corinthians and i will let you see the foundation Apostle Paul was trying to lay for the corithians Church
in 1CORITHIANS.

PS: Let us learn to read the bible in context because thats the only way you can understand God's word.

I've have waited all day for Jazes to wake up and come and tell us what he means. I am almost at bursting point. I'll still wait a little bit more sha. But when you do come back Jazes can you please explain to me whether or not it is possible to speak english in the spirit. Or any other human language in the spirit. Because you make it sound as if speaking in the spirit must perforce mean speaking an inhuman language.

Pastor AIO:

I've have waited all day for Jazes to wake up and come and tell us what he means. I am almost at bursting point. I'll still wait a little bit more sha. But when you do come back Jazes can you please explain to me whether or not it is possible to speak english in the spirit. Or any other human language in the spirit. Because you make it sound as if speaking in the spirit must perforce mean speaking an inhuman language.

Who's the Jazez u r talkin about ?

Of course u can speak English.

Pastor AIO:

I've have waited all day for Jazes to wake up and come and tell us what he means. I am almost at bursting point. I'll still wait a little bit more sha. But when you do come back Jazes can you please explain to me whether or not it is possible to speak english in the spirit. Or any other human language in the spirit. Because you make it sound as if speaking in the spirit must perforce mean speaking an inhuman language.

@Pastor AIO,
Don't be annoyed jare, i really had a very tight schedule since yesterday.
Anyway,back to the topic of discussion and i will quickly answer the above
question.

When we speak in the Spirit, we don't speak human language because 1Cor14:2
clearly say that:
"He that speak in tongues,speak not to MAN but to God cos NO ONE
UNDERSTANDS HIM,how be it in the Spirit he speaks mysteries.

Let me quickly give you a background story of the corinthians church but before i do
that i want to quickly explain what the epistles are.
The epistles are letters that Apostles Paul and other Apostles wrote to the church they
have minister to,most times they are like follow up letters. You will notice that they will always
start with greetings meaning that they have had an encounter with them before.
These letters are not written in chapters and verses,the chapters and verses we have today are
put there for easy understanding. Knowing this really help during bible study cos it allows us to study
well.

Having said that much, the corithains church is one church that Apostle Paul really commended
when it comes to Spiritual gifts because it was very much in operation among them.
In 1Corithians 1:4-7,he thanked God for them and commended that they come behind in no spiritual
gift(verse7). That was why if you study the book of of corithians well,you will notice that it is the only
book where Apostle Paul did extensive teachings on knotty spiritual issues.
He wrote a whole chapter about spiritual gifts here(Chapter12) and he went ahead to write about tongues
in chapter14.

The Apostles had to put so many things in place, that was why you will notice
that he had to correct so many issues.
In Chapter 1,he corrected them about being divided between himself,Apollos,
Cephas and even Christ (verse 12).He has to point their attention to the fact that
it is Christ that died for them and that the Apostles are just servants(verse 13-31).
In chapter 3,he called them babes even canal xtians cos their is still strive and envy among them,
(Chapter 3: 2-5).In Chapter 5,he corrected them about fornication and in Chapter6 he talked about
taking their cases to court and the progression continues.

You will notice that he was trying to put so many things in order in that church and no other person
can instruct them other than him cos he is their spiritual father and of course the one that even started
the church in the first place.

Now in chapter 14 where he talked extensively about Tongues,if you take off your spiritual
googles and read it with a clear mind, you will notice he wrote to put order in their meetings.
Like i said earlier Tongues was never an issue of discussion in the early church because it
was not strange to them.
In fact tongues was a confirmation of your salvation,it is what shows that you are now a xtian.
I think i have said that much before quoting from the book of Acts, the whole book of Acts shows us
the importance of speaking in tongues at salvation and how much vital it is among xtians.

So,if Tongues was not an issue to the Church why would the Apostle  say people should not speak in
tongues? Like i said he was writing to the Corithians church to put order in their midst,so that they can be more
effective and productive in their service to God.

So 1Cor 14 was not a letter for teaching them how to speak in tongues,it was not
to show them the importance of tongues or tell them about tongues but rather to
put order in their midst.
Remember that the church operates in spiritual gifts with ease though they are babes
because the Apostle has to correct them on so many carnal issues.

Now lets study the chapter together .

Icor14:1-4,was the part that if u dont understand it, you will never understand what the Apostle
was trying to pass across. Most people think he is trying to say that prophesy is more important
than Tongues but rather he was just pointing their attention to the usage of the two gifts when
it comes to church service i.e when they gather together to worship.

1Cor 14:4: "He that speak in tongues edify himself but he that prophesy edify the church"

1Cor 14:5 "I would that u all speak with tongues but rather that u prophesy:for greater is he
that prophesy than he that speaks with tongues except he interprets that the church may receive
edification"

The first bold part of verse 5 above clearly shows that the Apostles is not against anyone speaking
in tongues. He even said that he wants all of them to speak with tongues he said " I would(old english
as touching usage) or better still WISH that u all speak with tongues". If he wants them all to speak
in tongues, then i wonder why people are making a big issue out of tongues today.

The latter part of this verse is where most people get it wrong.Firstly,the word greater there is really making
people feel the apostle is comparing the two gifts(tongues and prophesy) but that is not the case.
He was just pointing their attention to the fact that when u come to church service put edifying the
church first.

Imagine a church service you attend and all u see is a service where people come to just display
spiritual gifts.That is exactly what is happening in the Corithians church service, so much disorder
that they get the new comer confused. It is a church that shows so many flow of the spirit but no
order and that was why he was pointing their attention to blessing others in prophecy cos that
is the purpose of church gathering(to bless others).

I want to say this again and again(please take off ur spiritual google),the first part of verse5 shows
that the Apostle has nothing against speaking in tongues, he said "I WOULD THAT U ALL
SPEAK WITH TONGUES". This part is so very clear that is only an insincere person that
will twist it.

Verse 6: shows clearly that he is pointing their attention to blessing others rather than trying
to show off that they can speak with tongues "If i come to u speaking with tongues,what shall it
profit u?.
Verse 6-11 speak in the same light of putting the person first rather than yourself.

In verse 12:"Even so u for as much as u are ZEALOUS of spiritual gifts,seek that u may excel
to the edifying of the church". This verse simply shows that most folks in the corithians church are just
full of zeal and the Apostle needs to point their attention to the fact that they need to put others in
the church first, that as long as u are in the church the edification of the church should come first.

Verse 13 now says that "let him that speaks in tongues pray that he may interpret" to the effect that he
may bless others or edify the church. He lays emphasis on blessing others in the church(i hope i can just
say this over and over again).

Now verse 14-17 makes it clear that the Apostle wants the church to be bless because he points
them to the fact that when we speak with tongues our understanding is unfruitful,therefore the unlearned
or unbeliever is not blessed. So "In the church speak with tongues and with ur understanding(interpret) that
others may be blessed.
Verse 16-17 makes it clear when will give thanks in tongues or sing in tongues we have given thanks well but that
the unlearned may be bless, we need to say it in a language they can understand.

Verse18 says it all: "I speak with tongues more than u all", sometimes i wonder where some folks get the notion
that the Apostle Paul doesn't want people to speak with tongues or the that he prefers prophecy to tongues.
My question is ,if someone is thanking God for what God has done for him can he be against the thing?If someone
is boasting in God about a spiritual gift, can he be against it at the same time?
The man says he Thank God that he speaks in tongues more than all of them(that is the whole church oo)
,yet some people are saying he is against  speaking in tongues.

Praise God the word of God is Final over all,if not some people will just want us to believe what they say.
If u read further to verse 19,you will notice he is still saying pay attention to others in the church by putting them
first. Bless them in a language they can understand but u can continue in tongues when u get home.

To round up all that i have been saying since, it is clear that the Apostles wants them to put order in their service
and to bless others that comes to church.
In verse 39b,he said forbid not to speak with tongues i.e dont stop anyone from speaking in tongues(Praise God).
Verse40: the last verse he conclude by saying "Let all things be done decently and in[b] ORDER[/b]

PS: I will suggest you take your bible(without ur spiritual google and religious mind) to read the whole of chapter14,
then you will see clearly that no where did the Apostle ask no one to speak with tongues but rather he was pointing
their attention to doing things in ORDER and blessing others that comes to service.
WE WIN. PRAISE GOD

JAZES:


@Pastor AIO,
Don't be annoyed jare, i really had a very tight schedule since yesterday.
Anyway,back to the topic of discussion and i will quickly answer the above
question.

When we speak in the Spirit, we don't speak human language because 1Cor14:2
clearly say that:
"He that speak in tongues,speak not to MAN but to God cos NO ONE
UNDERSTANDS HIM,how be it in the Spirit he speaks mysteries.

I no vex, it's okay.  Glad to have you back to discuss.  I must admit that I was a bit surprised at your submissions above.  I thought you were going to address the fact that repeating 4 or 5 syllables in various permutations and combinations was not the Tongues spoken of in the bible.  Nobody is denying that there is a gift of the spirit called 'speaking in Tongues'.  What I am saying is that it is a coherent language foreign to the person speaking it.  What I am saying is that the babbling that is going on in all these pentecostal churches is not the Tongues that the christians were talking about. 
However you have not provided any argument that proves that the Tongues spoken of in the bible is what is going on in these pentecostal churches. 

You've started off quoting 1Cor14:2 for me.  Yet straight away you veer off context.  That verse is not specifying that it is a communication with God for God alone.  Check out the whole paragraph.


1Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. 2For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church. 5I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

When you see a conjunctive in any language then most definately you cannot understand the sentence without know what came before.  A conjunctive in grammar is words like 'and', 'but', 'because', 'for', 'then'  etc. 

If I say to someone  ' . . but there is amala in the oven' you cannot fully get what I am saying if you didn't hear what I said before the word 'but'.  If prior to the 'but' I had said 'Sorry o, the jollof rice is finished . . .' then you can understand that the person I'm talking to probably was looking forward to eating jollof rice but he now has to make do with amala.  If on the other hand I had said, 'The is no amala on the table . . . ' , then you understand something totally different.  Perhaps the person I'm talking to was looking forward to eating amala but he had expected it to be already served on the table but now he will have to get it for himself from the oven. 
These are two totally different inferences drawn due to the fact that the phrase preceding the conjunctive is different.  These things are the basics of english comprehension.  I don't know why people like to read the bible as if they never went to school. 

You very disingeniously misquoted the phrase in 1Cor14:2. You missed out the conjunctive 'for' so your reader is totally misled about what is been said.  In modern english 'for' is now 'because'.  There is a reason why the person speaking in tongues is only speaking to God. What is that reason.  Please let us read that full sentence again like educated people who have gone to school and can read and comprehend what they are reading.

1Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. 2For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him;

I will interprete again:  Follow Love, and desire spiritual gifts.  But preferably that you should prophesy BECAUSE (for) He who speaks in an unknown language is not speaking to men but to God because no man can understand him.

There is an expression in english.  'only God knows'.  For example, 'Only God knows what I'll do without you.'  It is use to show that you are out of your depth, you wouldn't know what you'd do without the person spoken about.  If you are referring to something that nobody know anything about you can say 'only god knows about that'. 
Similarly if you are speaking a language that no one around you understands then they only person that can understand you is God. 
Look at the passage again.  Why is the person speaking in tongues speaking to God?  Answer: Because no man can understand him. 

Now I'm fully aware that anyone can pull and stretch the interpretation any text in which ever direction suits them, but there are limits.  The limits must include being unable to actually change the text being interpreted. By omitting the conjunctive 'for' thereby obscuring the fact that the preceding phrase is essentially important in understanding the text you are in effect changing the text.  Very bad!! 

@Jazes,

The other posts you've put up simply do not address what we are talking about and are based on a false foundation. No one is arguing about whether Corinthians spoke in tongues or not. What we are saying is that the tongues that they spoke is not the incoherent babbling that you hear in nigerian and american churches today.

If you have evidence that it is please present it to us. This thread is not about Order or Disorder in Corinthian churches.

speaking in tongues is rubbish and must be discouraged among speakers because pastors and prophets etc use it to cage and decieve ignorant people in churches because they lack the strange unbeleivable power of jesuschrist to save parishioners just like they use fasting and night vigil to prolong bondages and cage people in churches ?if the raw power of jesuschrist is with you as his JESUSCHRIST follower which he promised those who follow him you dont need those long suffering as if God and jesuschrist is very far where as those people they call witches and wizards and native doctors and occult people of all sorts whom they see as evil dont fast and night vigil still they exhibit power and those powers they use belong to jesuschrist why not see discover jesuschrist real powers which you can seek from us to enable you stop suffering in silence but even after speaking in tongues witches and wizards still oppress you at night and you still fear the occult world?cant you see that something is missing in your life which is the LIGHT of Jesus christ?have you asked yourself why jesuschrist said i am the light of the world?behold Evil marine,occult world rules and many claiming to know JESUSCHRIST or dont know CHRIST and secular have their roots and power from there and pretend before spiritual ignorant humans aand thats why lots of evil are all over the place evn with speaking in tongues?