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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan (3293 Views)
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Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by wesley80(m): 2:28pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
Gbawe: This kinda sounds self contradictory to me cos on the one hand you've completely derided the GEJ govt for being ruthlessly corrupt, dishonest and incapable of implementing even the simplest of policies while at the same time you've not failed to bash the govt for hesitating on its inherited Privatization programme, so what gives? Do you actually trust the govt enough to want them to start selling our nationally strategic parastatals immediately? Perhaps something you're never going to admit has changed between OBJ and now. Gbawe: Dont be deceived, it takes much more than double digit economic growth and tremendous prospects to get foreign investors into a country. China for all the growth it has managed still has serious issues attracting investment from the West and maybe you've got to study the Asian financial crisis of the 90's to understand the dangers of opening up a market and transparency as required by most of these world class companies and investors. Ask yourself why Western investors are not rushing to the new frontier market with their monies even with all the problems currently bedevilling Western economies, fact is no one - and Nigeria shouldnt be the first - is willing to open up as much as they require to start poaching. I guess for now we are stuck with those we've got and the only solution seems to be what GEJ is proferring; Adequate monitoring and possible sanctions so pls put your ego aside and give him credit! |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 2:49pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
wesley80: My brother, no contradiction at all. I make my submissions with the proviso that political will and sincerity is present. Minus that, and with what I think of GEJ, you don't need to be a rocket Scientist to fathom that I am resigned to the next 4 years being a period of 'bumper harvest' for the AGIPs and owners of Nigeria while Nigerians get nothing but more suffering and platitudes . Team GEJ won and I accept that . He has earned the electoral right to take Nigeria in any direction he wants . Nonetheless , that acceptance of his win does not mean we should all shut up when we see GEJ, as he has done many times, playing to the gallery vacuously and deceitfully . Privatization , implemented transparently and meritoriously , has not failed and GEJ is deceitful in claiming this to be the case merely because it suits his agenda. Privatization , when transparent and sincere, is highly desirable for our Nation because the Government has proven itself to be a disaster at running certain sectors. Despite challenges , Nigeria still has attractiveness , for many reasons, that would sway potential first class investors if the Nigerian Government is not on its usual double mission of deceit - i.e court top companies in public yet deliberately carry on , underground, practices that ensure most top Companies will stay away. Privatization cannot therefore [b]ever [/b]be condemned in its entirety simply because that suits the agenda of a President full of deceit and used to going back on his pledges and promises. Having gained 4 years, it is obvious that GEJ is trying to re-invent the wheel to suit how he wants the AGIPs to take over Nigeria in a profligate, outdated , wasteful and totally inappropriate model of Governance. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Bawss1(m): 2:53pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
I like how this thread is titled on the homepage. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 2:55pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
Bawss1: I like it too because it is the truth i.e " PDP's Corrupt & Insincere Approach To Privatization Has Failed" |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by BetaThings: 4:01pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
ekt_bear:Is AP of Forte Oil really doing so well. Track the price of the share price over the past 3 years and you will be amazed BTW the FD said they made a loss and Otedola said the account must be doctored to show a profit He added that Otedola and his friends did not pay for shares worth over N12.5b Inspite of his petitions to police, SEC etc, Otedola is walking free the irony of it all, is that the FD was arrested and held in custody for several weeks for inciting people against Otedola Note, we say negative things about GEJ (whose actions affect us all) here, but nobody has detained us for incitement, but Otedola who is perhaps fleecing only the shareholders of (investors in) AP is at the risk of incitement |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by VolvoS60(m): 4:59pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
Interesting. Once again, we are confronted with more evidence of the sleight of hand (and foot and mouth and all other body parts) of the PDP and its current manifestation (in the form of the GEJ administration). The problem now, according to the man in charge, is "unserious investors". Not a venal Nigerian political party (the PDP) with the mentality of sea pirates. Not PDP hacks determined to grab their share before it all comes crashing down.Not bent Nigerian bureaucrats. Not corpulent Nigerian plutocrats. Not the most insiduous strain of home grown, crony capitalism ever to take root in sub-Saharan Africa. Not a PDP 'reform' program rigged to fail from the word go. Not an unholy alliance of politicians and businessmen determined to privatize the gains and socialize the losses. No. The problem now is "unserious investors". Banality personified. You see, some of these things we see in this strange place called the FRN (Federal Republic of Nigeria) would be funny if they were not so tragic. I can see where this is going - it seems the GEJ administration wants to provoke a debate in which the advocates and the opponents of so-called reform (or privatization or whatever the hell you want to call it) engage each other in lengthy theoretical arguments over the propriety of statism versus privatisation. This will serve as a distraction while the federal behemoth continues to munch quietly away on the commonwealth. I put it to you, team GEJ: the issue with you and the party your principal represents is ethical. Not ideological. Your party's basic philosophy (if it can be called that) is "the more unethical, the better". If indeed, Nigeria's laws were to be enforced, most PDP officials (and their collaborators in the civil service and the private sector) would be trussed up against diesel drums waiting for the phalanx of marksmen to take their positions. You know this to be true. I know it to be true. Even the dead in the grave know this to be true. What I also know to be true is: If it (the PDP) were an ethical party running a left-of-centre government, then the men responsible for running public enterprises into the ground would have been twisting in the wind by now. If it (the PDP) were an ethical party running a right-of-centre government, then the men responsible for running a fraudulent and deceitful 'privatisation' programme would have been sitting pretty in their jail cells right now. Tell your principal to stop the obfuscation. Some of us know who he is and exactly what he stands for. Unserious investors indeed. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by VolvoS60(m): 5:21pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
@ Gbawe, You and I hold opposing views on some aspects of privatisation and reform. I do not agree with the notion that public enterprises are primed to fail. I do accept however, that public enterprises in Nigeria have failed miserably. My view, which unsurprisingly is an unpopular one, is that someone, somewhere has to pay for the mismanagement of Nigeria's public enterprises. Till that is done and the slate is wiped clean, we will continue to have, as you so eloquently put it, 'mutton dressed as lamb". Having said that, you are one of the few to have seen through the subterfuge of the PDP and its cronies, long ago. There are times when I go through your posts and your many challenges thrown to the forces of reaction on this board. And I wonder why you even bother. Nigerians have an extreme case of the Stockholm Syndrome. They made their choice in April and they must be prepared to live with the consequences. But keep up the good work. Maybe the light will shine through someday. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by dayokanu(m): 5:56pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
Basically PDP has failed |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 6:42pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
VolvoS60: We are on the same page and I agree with you. Nonetheless , for where we are and for what we are, transparently conceding some of our parastatals to competent private hands could make some vital sectors to work as they should. Systematic rot , over many decades , means that PHCN , for example, must be fundamentally reformed if it is to perform as an efficient Public entity. Do we have the time for that considering that our electrification needs are dire and impeding our national progress greatly? My view, which unsurprisingly is an unpopular one, is that someone, somewhere has to pay for the mismanagement of Nigeria's public enterprises. Till that is done and the slate is wiped clean, we will continue to have, as you so eloquently put it, 'mutton dressed as lamb". I concur but that cannot happen while the same set of like-minded 'padis' pass the baton to each other every 4 to 8 years . Naturally, they have each others back , so impunity continues. A very crude yet effective strategy. Having said that, you are one of the few to have seen through the subterfuge of the PDP and its cronies, long ago. There are times when I go through your posts and your many challenges thrown to the forces of reaction on this board. And I wonder why you even bother. Nigerians have an extreme case of the Stockholm Syndrome. They made their choice in April and they must be prepared to live with the consequences. My brother , I don't even understand it myself sometimes . I guess my motivation and passion stems from how the sufferings of Nigerians never fails to move me deeply. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Nobody: 8:22pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
@ Topic It is unfair to say that privatization failed in Nigeria. There are many formerly mismanaged government owned companies that are now doing well under private hands. Examples include Oando, Conoil, Nicon, Nigeria Reinsurance, Unity Bank, BCC, Ashaka, Indorama, Notore etc. There are a few that dying primarily due to unfavorable government policies towards them e.g. PAN, Delta Steel etc The reason our corrupt elites are crying out about privatization is because their avenues for illicit gain and patronage is gone. This includes Labor who oppose privatization because their inept and corrupt members will be thrown out. That is why Nitel staff despite their trumpeted "competence" can't find places in private telcos and are instead dying to receive salary backlog from a mismanaged company that packed up years ago. Government run enterprises are primed to fail in Nigeria because they don't operate under private sector discipline. They are hamstrung by: 1) hiring based on federal character and quota so mediocres and inept people man positions they have no business in e.g Anenih, Bode George etc 2) Management and staff see the enterprises as cash cows to be looted e.g inflated contracts, ghost workers etc 3) The public see their goods and services as socio-political thereby demanding uneconomic pricing e.g fuel, electricity, water, tuition etc There are many more but the above are part of what is colloquially known as the Nigerian factor. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Kobojunkie: 9:23pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
Good roads have failed Nigeria too because they have failed to construct and maintain themselves in much of Nigeria. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by 1025: 11:39pm On Aug 05, 2011 |
since 1999, we v had 3 different presidents and one thing is common of which our able messiah(president) just mentioned it in the article - FAILURE. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Reference(m): 12:54pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
Technically I think its not the business or concern of government to check the successes or failure of private companies. Concessions I agree but private, no. If Dangote industry fails, its not the government's business beyond the fact of tax revenue losses and perhaps unemployment figures. All government needs to do is to create the enabling environment and check for malpractices by regulatory agencies, period. This is suspect may be the first step in re-nationalization obviously backed by enemies of the country, cliques seeking corruptly acquired riches through government patronage. The very reasons that up-til today the power and petroleum sector remains under government control while billions are wasted in so-called investments. If a company fold for its inability to generate revenues, conduct business and offer tangible products and services, Nigerians probably do not need them. Not all government companies privatised were worthwhile anyway, some have been overtaken by technology such as NITEL and should just be allowed to die. We need to develop the culture of paying our bills in this country for the day crude oil will run its course and one of these measures is to guarantee free enterprise. GEJ should not review anything. Let the private sector determines who lives and who dies. That is free market which guarantees free-dom. A lot better than free stuff that perpetuates slavery. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Beaf: 1:31pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
^ What GEJ is saying is that there have been corrupt practices in the past that led to govt parastatals being sold to unsuitable people. That is what led companies built with Nigeria's money to simply crumble away with nothing to show and no improved value for the populace. There must be accountability to the Nigerian people and thats the line GEJ is pushing. In addition to GEJ's words, there is a Senate probe into what went on in the recent past, and I believe it will lead to several criminal convictions. Government MUST be accountable to the people, we cannot continue to have shady deals that cost the Nigerian people dearly; that is GEJ's line. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Bliss4Lyfe(f): 1:40pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
Beaf: Word! GEJ just keeps shooting in the right direction. Very Wise Leadership. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 2:16pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
@Wesley80. My brother, nothing brings home the truth more than real and current analogy/illustrations. Below , Okonjo-Iweala is laudably soliciting for FDI (foreign direct investment) by lobbying the likes of George Soros , other top financiers and prime global investors. We all know Soros legend as an investor and his 'level' so no need to belabour that aspect of issues. Where in the article has anyone said "go away . Nigeria is not attractive to us". Rather , they give conditions. If those conditions are then not met because political will is absent from GEJ , and seubsequently we do not see Soros or his ilk investing in Nigeria, can you then say Nigeria is not attracting FDI from top Avenues because we are intrinsically unattractive or will you conclude that what needs to be done to boost investor confidence , for top tier players, remain undone? We simply cannot attract the best Private sector players without the reforms and actions they would want to see . Traditionally, the PDP cannot commit to those reforms and actions because it will put sand in the gari of 'awon boys'. http://www.thisdayonline.com/ Okonjo-Iweala Hunts for FDI, Meets Soros, Others |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by ranlaen: 2:28pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
so he admits his party has failed |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by wesley80(m): 3:02pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
Gbawe: Okonjo Iweala soliciting for investment from George Soros and others only proves me right, Nigeria has failed to attract competent investors to her market! The reasons for that is another issue entirely, of course you can choose to blame GEJ and PDP for that but let me also remind you that privatization didnt start in 1999, Nigeria has got a long history of failures as concerns privatization. the fact that there hasnt been competent investors seeking to invest in our parastatals like Ghana had with Vodafone has only left us with the Indians and mostly dubious local investors which makes GEJ's idea of Monitoring and Sanctions appropriate. If you think GEJ is wrong I'd luv to hear your better ideas cos IMO it would take decades for NGR to attain the kind of level that makes Ghana and SA look attractive to such first class investors. Disagree? Our Development cant wait till decades so what's your solution? I'm a follower of Welfare economics so naturally, I'm not a big fan of Okonjo Iweala and I dont know how much she'lld be willing to concede to attract foreign investment. Yes we need foriegn investment and expertise, but I do not believe they MUST be present for Nigeria to make progress more so when we hvae to bend backwards to accommodate them. A week ago China overturned an investment of Google in alibaba ( a chinese online retail coy) when they felt they were about to gain too much of a foothold in the country. Google cried blue murder and it was pointed to by other investors as further reason why they mustnt go to China, but get the full picture; THEY PROTECTED THEIR ECONOMY. Question is; Would Iweala be able to do same to safeguard our economy or would we end up opening to our detriment in the long run? |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 3:53pm On Aug 08, 2011 |
wesley80: My brother, Vodafone was interested in Nigeria as far back as 2008. See for yourself: Vodafone Targets Telecoms Market My brother, an Uncle (actually now a SW Nigerian Senator) made his money in telecoms , so I know , first hand , a thing or two regarding the Nigerian Telecom sector. My Uncle actually collaborated directly with BT (British Telecom) . He made me realize that the likes of BT are and will always be favorably disposed towards entry into a market like Nigeria. Did you , for example , know that Vodafone (see below) were actually very interested to take over NITEL? That is why , even though I did not mean it ungraciously, I said that you lied before when you were seeking to show that Nigeria intrinsically , in comparison to others, is unattractive to top Companies. I hope we can now move on, since I have shown Vodafone was interested in Nigeria and NITEL, and focus on the cronyism, lack of reform, non-transparency and self-interests putting off the right caliber of private sector participants Nigeria needs to make its privatization efforts successful. http://www.telecomsinsight.com/file/71107/vodafone-interested-in-nigeria.html Vodafone Interested In Nigeria |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 10:59am On Aug 11, 2011 |
@Wesley80 and co. Sey una see wetin we dey talk about below? GEJ should simply admit that Privatization failed because the PDP , directly eschewing transparency and a genuine developmental agenda, runs the "biggest black Nation", replete with unmatched opportunity that will interest the best anytime and any day, like a cheap corner shop family business!!! look at the alleged current squabble between Sambo and the Senate as regards NITEL. When everyone should be thinking and acting in consonance to patriotically subjugate themselves to a transparent and thorough scheme that will see the best bid carry the day, "key" PDP players have already pitched their tenth with those who have sorted out their "10%" . Next minute we will hear , falsely, that Vodafone "are not interested in Nigeria" while the simple truth remains that the Government , for the sake of the copious aggrandizement of a few, is not interested in Vodafone and others like that who may not be willing to 'play ball'. http://www.champion.com.ng/displaycontent.asp?pid=11609 Mark is alleged to be at war with the vice president over the renewed plan to sale the Nigerian Telecommunication Limited (NITEL). |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by wesley80(m): 11:40am On Aug 11, 2011 |
^^^ I'm not trying to absolve the PDP of blame but I'm sure you know Privatization didnt start in 1999 right? About the ALLEGED squabble between the VP and Mark, I'm left to wonder if either of them should be calling the final shot when there's a bureau charged with doing just that, and as much as its convenient to blame the PDP, we also should be asking ourselves what is wrong wit our institutions. Why is the BPE nothing but a rubber stamp of the executive and legislative arms of govt when its duties are Statutory and fully backed by law? Why cant we press for the bureau to assert itself and accept the blame when it fails? Why cant we simply strengthen our institutions instead of focusing on the centre all the time? Just a thought. I'm sure the squabble if any really exists is a somewhat healthy one as there are arguments for both sides but what makes it seem really bad (apart from our collective cynicism) is the inappropriateness of the people involved to be makin such decisions let alone squabble over it. strengthen our institutions instead of focusing on the centre all the time? Just a thought. I'm sure the squabble if any really exists is a somewhat healthy one as there are arguments for both sides but what makes it seem really bad (apart from our collective cynicism) is the inappropriateness of the people involved to be makin such decisions let alone squabble over it. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by jayflex: 12:53pm On Aug 11, 2011 |
Like every right minded leftist I knew from the get-go that privatisation especially in nigeria could never work. Obj borrowed a leaf from the russian experience where the likes of abramovich and that yukos oil gang sold the states assets to themselves for pennies and became kings overnight. When you examine the manner in which symbols of our heritage like the 1004 flats and ajaokuta steel project were sold its obvious it wasn't privatisation just plain old fraud |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Gbawe: 3:38pm On Aug 11, 2011 |
jayflex: Indeed. Yar Adua carried on where OBJ left off and GEJ has now received the baton and is doing admirably well in protecting the interests of our own ruthless Oligarchs who are just as visceral as their Russian counterparts. only a fool will not see the "business as usual" motivation that led to GEJ directing the home of corruption (NNPC) to turn our refineries round within 2 years when everyone, from how GEJ spoke before the election, assumed the privatisation of our refineries was a done deal. "The nation's economy remains parlous, introverted and import-dependent because it has always been run by political power holders on behalf of these economic barracudas who have become the closest friends of Aso Rock and the main financiers of the ruling party. How do we expect the local refineries to work when these vampires are reaping bountifully from refinery turn-around maintenance contracts and fuel importation?" http://allafrica.com/stories/201107150650.html
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Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by Nobody: 4:33am On Aug 12, 2011 |
^^^^^^ Can these cabals prevent private refineries from operating? let the government deregulate fuel prices and then see private refineries spring up! We'll the see what cabal will prevent a refinery run by Shell for example from operating efficiently and putting the inept and mismanaged government run refineries out of business |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by VolvoS60(m): 4:39pm On Aug 12, 2011 |
jayflex: The poster above beat me to it. I have long wanted to mention on this board the parallels between Nigeria's and Russia's journeys of 'reform'. I have said before: crony capitalism is no capitalism. The apostles of privatisation would do well to remember this. It is fashionable nowadays to deride statism as a failed, broken ideology but the defenders of the free market should note that crony capitalism may well turn out to be 'true' capitalism's nemesis. Back to Nigeria. We cannot say we are truly better off now (than we were in the 'evil' days of state owned enterprises) if all we can point to as evidence of our own 'privatization' is a bastardized monstrosity that is neither truly left nor truly right in its orientation, processes or outcomes. It makes no sense to replace public monopoly or inefficiency with private monopoly, inefficiency or extortion. Particularly in key industries with strategic importance. None whatsoever. kalokalo: @ Kalokalo Sir, Correct me if i am wrong, but i was under the impresssion that only PMS prices are still being regulated by the state? My memory sometimes fails me but I think i can remember one of the key arguments put forward for the full deregulation of AGO & LPF oil prices was that supply shortages of these fuels would become a thing of the past. Is that the case today? Are we certain that full deregulation of PMS prices will lead to the supply side el dorado we are all looking for? And one more thing. . . Do not undereestimate the crony factor in Nigeria's capitalism. Your point about privately-owned refineries running state-owned refineries out of town is well noted. But it IS entirely possible that a 'cabal' could wake up tomorrow and use the instruments of government and the law to make it impossible for a privately run, efficient refinery (be it Shell's or anyone elses's) to continue its operations. Its called nationalization. For the 'cronies' and their allies. |
Re: Privatisation Has Failed, Says Jonathan by VolvoS60(m): 5:13pm On Aug 12, 2011 |
Beaf: Sir, GEJ has taken the safe way out, telling us what we all know to be true. But the veil of deception can only stay in place for so long. GEJ belongs to a political party that has held power at the centre for over a decade. GEJ himself has been at the highest decision making levels of government for about half a decade now. He CANNOT, sir, be absolved of responsibility for the failure which his party (and the governments it has produced) has visited upon this country. You mention probes. We have had quite a few, sir. The power sector probe for example, if i'm not mistaken. But what were the outcomes? How many convictions? When the trail in some of these probes began to get uncomfortably close to individuals at the highest levels of the government and the ruling party, it became clear that it would be impossible to pursue the matter to a logical conclusion (without having up to half of Nigeria's super power elite standing in the dock) in court. And there's no way that's going to happen. It didn't under OBJ's watch. And it certainly will not under GEJ's watch. You said sir, and i quote: "there is a Senate probe into what went on in the recent past, and I believe it will lead to several criminal convictions". You sir, believe "it will lead to several criminal convictions". The question is: does your principal share the same belief? |
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