I wish I have the time to reply you explicitly but I will try my best this time.

Let's not even talk about Europe because that's total bullcr.p. If you don't have proper documentation in Europe, that's tantamount to disaster. The only place undocumented immigrants can have some breakthrough is USA. How many Nigerians are doing one job(8hrs/day) and earn above 100k USD/yr even in USA? Give the figure if you have it. There is life and work balance.

I still stand by my take. Japa should be for strugglers but not for 3000 USD/month earner in Nigeria. Na Buhari took Nigeria to it's lowest low. People returned to Nigeria in droves during Jonathan era. Let's pray for better Nigeria because there are many diasporans that don't want to be buried in obodo oyinbo.

As I have said, we are engineered differently. There are people that just wants to live a comfortable lives that are free of working like jackie for the rest of their lives. At your bolded, this is not me actually. Also, I have a friend that have everything to Japa but decided to stay put because he used to visit his relatives in North America when he was doing his PhD(FG sponsorship) and saw the way they are living with complaints about finances. My friend's wife is even a nurse. He told me that he is not relocating anywhere. No one in his neighborhood knows that he used to go abroad for holiday. He always go to the airport with his luggages whenever he wants to catch flight. So, not everyone has those oppression mentality pls. Dont generalized Nigerians. There are good people in Nigeria.


What about Japarians that return to Nigeria and start oppressing from the airport? Are they not part of the society?

If you can be able to reach 20 yrs old before leaving Nigeria, we are all in this together. At some point, many of you will miss home. And if you don't miss home, that's good for you.

Bye bye.

IbeOkehie:


Truth is most Nigerians like to be rich in an environment where there's lots of poor & desperate people, whereas Anglo-Saxons tend to be expansive in their definition of the good life.

What the anti-Japa team is trying to say is that with $3K per month they can inflict a copious dose of physical & psychological sadism on other humans with whom they interact in Nigeria. That's the typical Nigerian mindset, they love to INFLICT suffering on others and watch the results. Why else is Nigeria in perpetual crisis?

Good Luck to Nigerians!

alphabbey1:

Minimum wage in Nigeria in 1990 is 250 Naira
Economics is not your strong point... that's why you don't know 1,000 naira in 1990 is not same as 1,000 naira in 2023. And what 1,000 dollar can buy in 1990 in America, Check it today if same 1,000 dollar have such power now.... The house 50,000 Dollar can buy in 1990 in Nigeria, you think same 50,000 Dollar can buy it now ?
Saving in dollar should be for temporary reason, not a long time project... properties should be your long term project... Or did anyone tell you if naira depreciate, properties depreciate along with it ? Even used cars appreciate if naira depreciate...

If you buy land in 1990, you have any idea how much the land will worth now ?
We bought our land below 10,000 naira in the 90s, pretty sure it will be far lower than that, land in same area is priced 25m naira now


Maybe you should go and check minimum wage in US in 1990 and see if its same minimum wage in 2023


And to your land argument, you ever heard of Certificate Of Occupancy ?
And even without CofO, All land belong to the government doesn't give government right to claim any land. You need to have tangible reason such as a land situated on government road project.... Houses marked for demolition are on government road project and this same rule applies everywhere in the world. If you have CofO, you get paid for it...

And in UK, stop paying council Tax and other necessary fees and see if that your property will not be repossessed back

Yeah and there's NOTHING like fuel subsidy. Nigerians believed that too.

Bottom line -

Selling naira based assets and converting to dollar or pounds sterling automatically produces profits without doing anything. This has been the trend for DECADES and will likely remain so.

Land in Nigeria is owned by government. That's why MORTGAGE isn't so widespread in Nigeria, it's impaired collateral.

That's the economic reality.

Good Luck with all that!

IbeOkehie:


Yeah and there's NOTHING like fuel subsidy. Nigerians believed that too.

Bottom line -

Selling naira based assets and converting to dollar or pounds sterling automatically produces profits without doing anything. This has been the trend for DECADES and will likely remain so.

Land in Nigeria is owned by government. That's why MORTGAGE isn't so widespread in Nigeria, it's impaired collateral.

That's the economic reality.

Good Luck with all that!

Baba said that have been the trend!! Who's following that trend with you...

Be deceiving yourself. When your mate that bought land are reaping x2, x5, profit, you will be struggling to make x1.5 on your dollar....

Gokoyer0:
I wish I have the time to reply you explicitly but I will try my best this time.

Let's not even talk about Europe because that's total bullcr.p. If you don't have proper documentation in Europe, that's tantamount to disaster. The only place undocumented immigrants can have some breakthrough is USA. How many Nigerians are doing one job(8hrs/day) and earn above 100k USD/yr even in USA? Give the figure if you have it. There is life and work balance.

I still stand by my take. Japa should be for strugglers but not for 3000 USD/month earner in Nigeria. Na Buhari took Nigeria to it's lowest low. People returned to Nigeria in droves during Jonathan era. Let's pray for better Nigeria because there are many diasporans that don't want to be buried in obodo oyinbo.

As I have said, we are engineered differently. There are people that just wants to live a comfortable lives that are free of working like jackie for the rest of their lives. At your bolded, this is not me actually. Also, I have a friend that have everything to Japa but decided to stay put because he used to visit his relatives in North America when he was doing his PhD(FG sponsorship) and saw the way they are living with complaints about finances. My friend's wife is even a nurse. He told me that he is not relocating anywhere. No one in his neighborhood knows that he used to go abroad for holiday. He always go to the airport with his luggages whenever he wants to catch flight. So, not everyone has those oppression mentality pls. Dont generalized Nigerians. There are good people in Nigeria.


What about Japarians that return to Nigeria and start oppressing from the airport? Are they not part of the society?

If you can be able to reach 20 yrs old before leaving Nigeria, we are all in this together. At some point, many of you will miss home. And if you don't miss home, that's good for you.

Bye bye.

You are replying someone that belive saving in dollar is better than buying properties because government can takeover the property anytime

Gokoyer0:
I wish I have the time to reply you explicitly but I will try my best this time.

Let's not even talk about Europe because that's total bullcr.p. If you don't have proper documentation in Europe, that's tantamount to disaster. The only place undocumented immigrants can have some breakthrough is USA. How many Nigerians are doing one job(8hrs/day) and earn above 100k USD/yr even in USA? Give the figure if you have it. There is life and work balance.

I still stand by my take. Japa should be for strugglers but not for 3000 USD/month earner in Nigeria. Na Buhari took Nigeria to it's lowest low. People returned to Nigeria in droves during Jonathan era. Let's pray for better Nigeria because there are many diasporans that don't want to be buried in obodo oyinbo

Well I live in the USA and I'm glad you at least acknowledge that undocumented workers in the USA can live normal lives. That's the reality.

The percentage of workers in Nigeria that earn $3K (over ₦‎2.5 million!!!) per month is tiny, it's so small that it's peripheral to any discussion of well being. Good data and my personal experience is that less than 0.5% of Nigerian workers earn over ₦‎200K per month. I've already made my case in other posts so I won't rehash.

As for your questions about Nigerians in the USA, there's good data

https://www.google.com/search?q=average+income+of+nigerian+immigrants+usa&rlz=1C1NDCM_enUS837US837&oq=average+income+of+nigerian+immigrants+usa&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIHCAEQIRigAdIBCDkzNjZqMWo5qAIAsAIA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Nigerians earning that amount in the USA and other countries still send remittances back to Nigeria that is higher than the revenues of the Federal Republic of Nigeria.

alphabbey1:

You are replying someone that belive saving in dollar is better than buying properties because government can takeover the property anytime

Saving in dollar is a MINIMUM consideration. The saved dollars CAN ALSO be invested for additional returns.

Anyone can compare the price appreciation of real estate/properties in Anglo-Western countries and compare to equivalents in Nigeria. Compare the stock market returns. There's websites where anyone can directly compare the charts for all these asset classes. The data accurately reflects my own experience.

Compare the risk. The naira was recently DEVALUED by what 30 to 50% overnight by the government, just like that. Similar devaluation also happened before under President Obasanjo. That's REAL money that disappeared into thin air. Same applies to lands and real estate, the RISK of losing control of property is exponentially higher in Nigeria and it has happened to many, many people and I'm sure everyone on this thread knows someone.

Or what about PENSIONS? That's a form of investment too. Many, many Nigeria don't get paid the pensions they were promised. I know literally DOZENS of people who are owed pensions in Nigeria.

Anyway, everybody do what they like. All those who PREFER to save and invest in naira OR Nigerian assets....Good Luck!

alphabbey1:
if they are denying you based on hometies, you should have apply alone and use family as hometies. If based on assets and financial reason and the money is there for real, you should have pay 1 year tuition and do GIC... I belive those are the 2 main reason for disapproval... the career progression own is very much avoidable

I dont hav money to pay 1 year yet.bt i hav account balance of 21m .i also didnt apply ,jst my wife n kid so i am d ties to naija wit a job n good salary all shown in foreign currency.

bdon12:

I dont hav money to pay 1 year yet.bt i hav account balance of 21m .i also didnt apply ,jst my wife n kid so i am d ties to naija wit a job n good salary all shown in foreign currency.

So they guessed right the money was for demonstration purpose

MT:


Op, many people use kids to console themselves after they have seen how miserable they have become abroad.

Kids have their lives, you have yours. How many parents can even afford the good private schools abroad?. How many percentage of our kids are in grammar school abroad?. Most schools that Nigerian kids attend abroad are far below average but the parents don't even know in as much as there are white kids attending same schools.

How many parents can eat in good restaurants with their kids? How many parents can even afford to travel with their families to other countries for vacationing? Most Nigeria families abroad do not even enjoy the goodies of life abroad, they can only look at them but can't afford to pay to experience them.

Don't get tripped by "I am doing this for my kids" scheme.

A child who spent his formative years in Nigeria has a huge head start over same who did in Nigeria

That's a fact that I have seen over the decades

MT:


Op, many people use kids to console themselves after they have seen how miserable they have become abroad.

Kids have their lives, you have yours. How many parents can even afford the good private schools abroad?. How many percentage of our kids are in grammar school abroad?. Most schools that Nigerian kids attend abroad are far below average but the parents don't even know in as much as there are white kids attending same schools.

How many parents can eat in good restaurants with their kids? How many parents can even afford to travel with their families to other countries for vacationing? Most Nigeria families abroad do not even enjoy the goodies of life abroad, they can only look at them but can't afford to pay to experience them.

Don't get tripped by "I am doing this for my kids" scheme.

You're definitely correct about the lot of many first generation nigerian families in the UK.

However, their children who were born in the UK are far more likely to succeed. Many look down on the jobs their parents grabbed with both hands.

grandstar:


You're definitely correct about the lot of many first generation nigerian families in the UK.

However, their children who were born in the UK are far more likely to succeed. Many look down on the jobs their parents grabbed with both hands.

EXACTLY 💯

The kids are British/Americans/Canadians and are better positioned to succeed out there than their counterparts who did coconut heads and had their kids in Nigeria

It's the FACT

IbeOkehie:


I'd rather be a restaurant cook in the Anglo-West than live in Nigeria on $3K/month...that is not a big salary in the global scheme of things but in Nigeria it ALSO comes with a big load of TROUBLE. No more than 0.05% of Nigerian workers earn that amount. That means the OP is going to be miserable from the desperate & aggressive BEGGING and attempts of FRAUD that will be directed at him everyday...worst of all from close relatives and friends. I know I've discussed this in my earlier commentary.

Middle class earners can testify to the abuse they get on Nigerian roads everyday, especially in Lagos. Ever been driving and some ruffians will just bang on your car and curse you for no reason? It happens a lot in Nigeria. It's the rage of poverty. It diminishes your quality of life.

And what kind of place can you rent for 2 million/yr in a big city in Nigeria? Again, for the same quality, you can get it cheaper in any Anglo-Saxon country!

Storing grains as an investment for ROI? Why would anyone want to dabble in all that just to assure financial stability? And INFLATION will still wipe out the gains. And you didn't say anything about the new National Commodity Board..... Hope you know government policy will be to stop excessive profits just like they did to fuel marketers with subsidy?

Then there's news just hitting the wires this morning that MONEY SUPPLY in Nigeria set an all time record in June, this past month. I hope we all know what that means for the future?

In short, Nigeria is too RISKY, the risk premium is too high. Nobody ever lost anything betting against Nigeria.

Good Luck to Nigerians!

Well said

IbeOkehie:


Truth is most Nigerians like to be rich in an environment where there's lots of poor & desperate people, whereas Anglo-Saxons tend to be expansive in their definition of the good life.

What the anti-Japa team is trying to say is that with $3K per month they can inflict a copious dose of physical & psychological sadism on other humans with whom they interact in Nigeria. That's the typical Nigerian mindset, they love to INFLICT suffering on others and watch the results. Why else is Nigeria in perpetual crisis?

Good Luck to Nigerians!

Well said once again

lordchiz:

With 250k dollars?
Haba ogaa.....Na you go even employ white guys out there!
Even u fit run restaurant matters with better employees.....Barbing saloon there Na better money....buy one uber ride there.....change go remain!.....
Still dey run your remote job!
Guy u will be made for life even out there.....
U no go remember say u come from Nigeria!
Very useless Nigeria!
When I dey sleep ..I see Japa....wen I dey eat , I still see Japa....even if I dey toilet, my thinking is Japa.....Japa is all I care!
Nothing but Japa!
I repeat, Nothing but Japa oooooooo....
I just collected my passport for a start....
Make I begin find money small small so I fit leave!

That's cool
But please please and please

Just focus on stacking up paper
Opening a dorm acct to be saving to protect from devaluation

Stay focused and avoid agents by all means

tshtsh:
The word japa is vague. Or do people just leave Nigeria for the sake of it ? With $3,000 a month you can live comfortably in Nigeria but please don’t assume that money will keep coming as anything can happen. At the same time please don’t take your hard earned money and give any school for the mere sake of japa. I have nothing against schooling abroad because I also once attended an ancient British university to study computing but it was solely based on academic reasons at a highly rated university.

Fast forward to a few years later people now use study as a pathway to japa spending millions and attending lowly rates schools paying the amount of fees that even Anglo Saxons cannot afford. People have always moved abroad via study but not at this rate. Not everyone is doing great abroad and depending on how you go abroad the system can take much more than you’ll get out of it. There is a cost of living crises in many advanced economies right now and I also had my own share of challenges when I left Nigeria.

I applied to live in Canada via express entry while working as a software engineer shortly after covid. I was 30 and had a good income. It took about a year to get the PR approved but I later developed a cold feet towards moving abroad because it didn’t make sense to me to leave my job and take dollars to Canada. I opted to look for a remote/hybrid job in Canada and accepted one before moving. I landed a few days before the job start day and stayed at a friend’s house for two weeks , earned my first salary before moving to a temporary accommodation.
Renting a house was difficult because no landlord trusted me ( Color , lack of credit history, lack of job history in Canada and other factors ). I saw the good side and the bad side. Canadians were complaining about cost of living and house prices. Housing was a debate everywhere. I began to wonder why Nigerians sold their properties to come and start life in Canada. Most Canadians today cannot qualify for a mortgage hence if you own a house you should be a proud home owner and not dispose it easily to finance flight tickets , school fees and a few months of rental.
If you want to japa try and get a job that will finance your work permit and some of your initial costs. Alternatively apply for one of these tech immigration programs that won’t cost you too much.

For those that went to U.K. as students the will pay international student fees, annual health surcharge and will continue to wary about visa extension/ visa switching / immigration issues till they become ILR holders which will take anything from 7 to 10 years of uncertainty. As with anything in life there are pros and cons . Career opportunities in software engineering are more in U.K./Canada compared to Nigeria there are many other things we want and desire as individuals

Was about to use the Canada study route, but a family friend over there told me it's cheaper for permanent residents to study than international students.

I've began Wes tho, I'll run IELTS probably late this year..
After that, na to find job. Wish I could venture into getting a tech job but my certificate in graphic design is just a 3 months certificate.
Would also venture into learning into ui/Ux, but I'll have to get a normal job in Canada before I switch.

hazinibones:
Hello Nairalanders,

I have this decision bothering me. I know it is a personal problem, but I believe everyone need some guidance at every point in life.

Straight to it, I have been considering Japa for over two years now and I think the opportunity might be here but I am having a cold feet.

I recently started working for a foreign company as a software engineer and the pay is decent when converted to Naira. Enough to live an averagely comfortable life. But my challenge now is that, I have been talking to some friends that are outside the country and they keep telling me how life is not easy there and cost of living is super expensive out there.

I currently earn $3000, which I plan to either save and travel or startup a business here in Nigeria. Please, Nairalanders with experience, is it worth japa to live an almost average life for almost the rest of your life or investing here in Nigeria and growing wealth?

The healthcare and quality education benefit is there as an advantage for japa though.

Thanks in advance for your responses!

bro what area of software engineering are you into and how did you secure the remote work?

hope you dont mind sharing

Slippy:


bro what area of software engineering are you into and how did you secure the remote work?

hope you dont mind sharing

I don't mind man. Someone else gave me the information for FREE!

I do fullstack web with JavaScript. Express, NextJS, NestJS and ReactJS. With a little bit of AWS and Python.

My first remote job was a recommendation from a former colleague I was nice to one (Be nice to your current colleagues, you never know).

Current one, I just followed tips from one Tim Okonkwo guy on twitter. He calls it the Cold Email strategy. You beef up your LinkedIn Profile and send random emails to people in positions like CTO, Head of IT, Recruiters telling them how you can use your skill to help them. That is to grant you an interview. Then go ahead and kill the interview. Impress them so well. DO NOT BE HUMBLE WITH YOUR SKILL! I Repeat, DO NOT BE HUMBLE WITH YOUR SKILL. If you know it, show it off. No lie shah or lie for your CV, na big turn off for these guys from my experience.

Good luck brother!

hazinibones:


I don't mind man. Someone else gave me the information for FREE!

I do fullstack web with JavaScript. Express, NextJS, NestJS and ReactJS. With a little bit of AWS and Python.

My first remote job was a recommendation from a former colleague I was nice to one (Be nice to your current colleagues, you never know).

Current one, I just followed tips from one Tim Okonkwo guy on twitter. He calls it the Cold Email strategy. You beef up your LinkedIn Profile and send random emails to people in positions like CTO, Head of IT, Recruiters telling them how you can use your skill to help them. That is to grant you an interview. Then go ahead and kill the interview. Impress them so well. DO NOT BE HUMBLE WITH YOUR SKILL! I Repeat, DO NOT BE HUMBLE WITH YOUR SKILL. If you know it, show it off. No lie shah or lie for your CV, na big turn off for these guys from my experience.

Good luck brother!

Thanks.

One last thing...how many years of experience and did it help secure an interview?

IbeOkehie:


The Land Use Act is the LAW, many have lost control of lands pursuant to it. There's no right to property in Nigeria, all land in Nigeria belongs to Government.

As for dollar losing value against dollar.....in 1990 the exchange rate was 4 per $1. Check it today.

Bye.

I thought you’re actually smarty but seems like you’re deluded as much as everyone else or maybe economic isn’t ur forte?

Is 1$ in 1990 the same as $1 in 2023 in America?

A person earning $3k in Nigeria today will be far successful financially than the same person in America. But I understand that y’all are living in America for ur unborn kids and all the other yadayada reasons. That’s the consolation you give urself at the end when u realize amassing wealth isn’t what u think it is in western countries

alphabbey1:

Baba said that have been the trend!! Who's following that trend with you...

Be deceiving yourself. When your mate that bought land are reaping x2, x5, profit, you will be struggling to make x1.5 on your dollar....

https://abokifx.com/news/70274/details


(Bloomberg) -- Guaranty Trust Holding Co. reported a $468 million gain from its foreign-exchange holdings, helping Nigeria’s biggest lender by market value post a record profit.

The firm, which operates Guaranty Trust Bank, reported 357.5 billion naira ($468 million) in foreign-exchange gains for the six months to June 30, according to a regulatory filing. That’s after revaluing its overseas assets following the naira’s 40% depreciation and helping more than triple profit to 278.5 billion naira.

Nigeria allowed the naira to weaken in mid-June as part of measures to attract overseas inflows and help revive the struggling economy. The weakness in the naira — among Africa’s worst performing currencies — has helped banks with overseas assets, while manufacturers have reported losses because they have foreign-currency loans.

“Across the banking sector, most of them have a net positive foreign currency position,” said Muyiwa Oni, an analyst at Stanbic IBTC Bank Plc. “The revaluation gain is a trend we should see in the industry.”

Guaranty Trust Holding rose 3.5% in Lagos, heading of the biggest gain since July 21.

Flour Mills of Nigeria Plc, the West African nation’s biggest miller, reported its first loss in about four years this week after marking its overseas loans into naira. Six of the nation’s biggest companies announced a combined loss of $385 million after revaluing their overseas loans and letters of credit.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

Well.. the argument depends on hw much the naira depreciates and how much housing prices in that area increase!!

IbeOkehie:


https://abokifx.com/news/70274/details


(Bloomberg) -- Guaranty Trust Holding Co. reported a $468 million gain from its foreign-exchange holdings, helping Nigeria’s biggest lender by market value post a record profit.

The firm, which operates Guaranty Trust Bank, reported 357.5 billion naira ($468 million) in foreign-exchange gains for the six months to June 30, according to a regulatory filing. That’s after revaluing its overseas assets following the naira’s 40% depreciation and helping more than triple profit to 278.5 billion naira.

Nigeria allowed the naira to weaken in mid-June as part of measures to attract overseas inflows and help revive the struggling economy. The weakness in the naira — among Africa’s worst performing currencies — has helped banks with overseas assets, while manufacturers have reported losses because they have foreign-currency loans.

“Across the banking sector, most of them have a net positive foreign currency position,” said Muyiwa Oni, an analyst at Stanbic IBTC Bank Plc. “The revaluation gain is a trend we should see in the industry.”

Guaranty Trust Holding rose 3.5% in Lagos, heading of the biggest gain since July 21.

Flour Mills of Nigeria Plc, the West African nation’s biggest miller, reported its first loss in about four years this week after marking its overseas loans into naira. Six of the nation’s biggest companies announced a combined loss of $385 million after revaluing their overseas loans and letters of credit.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

IbeOkehie:


https://abokifx.com/news/70274/details


(Bloomberg) -- Guaranty Trust Holding Co. reported a $468 million gain from its foreign-exchange holdings, helping Nigeria’s biggest lender by market value post a record profit.

The firm, which operates Guaranty Trust Bank, reported 357.5 billion naira ($468 million) in foreign-exchange gains for the six months to June 30, according to a regulatory filing. That’s after revaluing its overseas assets following the naira’s 40% depreciation and helping more than triple profit to 278.5 billion naira.

Nigeria allowed the naira to weaken in mid-June as part of measures to attract overseas inflows and help revive the struggling economy. The weakness in the naira — among Africa’s worst performing currencies — has helped banks with overseas assets, while manufacturers have reported losses because they have foreign-currency loans.

“Across the banking sector, most of them have a net positive foreign currency position,” said Muyiwa Oni, an analyst at Stanbic IBTC Bank Plc. “The revaluation gain is a trend we should see in the industry.”

Guaranty Trust Holding rose 3.5% in Lagos, heading of the biggest gain since July 21.

Flour Mills of Nigeria Plc, the West African nation’s biggest miller, reported its first loss in about four years this week after marking its overseas loans into naira. Six of the nation’s biggest companies announced a combined loss of $385 million after revaluing their overseas loans and letters of credit.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

America debt is $32T. I’ve never seen u talk about this. I know you’ll follow the idiots that say America debt is the debt they owe themselves lol

Alakori07:


America debt is $32T. I’ve never seen u talk about this. I know you’ll follow the idiots that say America debt is the debt they owe themselves lol

Actually I've commented on the financial irresponsibility of US government policies numerous times, but you're more concerned about upholding the image of Nigeria as a paradise, so you haven't noticed. Here's something I wrote just a few days ago -

IbeOkehie:


The USA is a great and productive nation and generally good for the world. No doubt about it. Whether it's arrogance, irresponsibility or political expediency, the USA government has been exploiting and abusing the status of the dollar for a long time. The consequences will be ugly. I hope we can manage the inevitable outcome.

Just in the last 4 years or so, the USA government has printed more dollars than have been printed since the country came into existence. The more dollars produced, the less valuable it is. Inflation is one real life consequence of their profligacy. The prices of regular goods and services have risen steeply. It's uncomfortable.

Add to that, the USA government uses the currency as a weapon of diplomacy and war. So other countries are now doubting the value of keeping the dollar as reserves. It's all good, but there's a price to be paid.

Good Luck to us all.

We moved to a new business premises about 3 years ago. There's a breakfast sandwich I started buying at a nearby restaurant, when we got here it was $6, now it's $8. I've owned some apartments since 1997, from that time until 2015 the rent was $500 to $650....today the tenants pay me $1200. So I'm personally aware of how much prices have gone up and why. In Nigeria, a bag of rice has gone from ₦7000 in 2014 to over ₦40K right now. At least in the USA basic salary has risen significantly, whereas in Nigeria it's static or not risen by much. Basically the APC in Nigeria and Democrat Party in the USA have the same socialist policies and the results are similar. No surprise there at all.

I've also made this statement numerous times on this forum - EVERYTHING good or bad that happens in Nigeria also happens in the the USA, the only difference is the REACTION of the society and the BASIC LAWS & CULTURE that make the reaction possible or impossible. For example, my wife's car was stolen from a parking lot exactly a week ago. The police were called and they deployed and found the car the next day. Before that, insurance had already called offering a rental car (we declined) and asking us to submit a police report to process compensation. I wonder what would have happened in Nigeria.

The real issue is that the DEGREE of deterioration in Nigeria is so much worse because that country has a MUCH MORE EMBEDDED CULTURE OF SOCIO-POLITICAL SOCIALISM than the USA. That's the real problem. For instance, the USA that produces dollars has never tried to fix the value, but Nigeria has a legally mandated price for that currency and also the naira. So while producers can rapidly adjust to changing conditions in the USA, they can't do so in Nigeria.

Summary being, the situation is what it is, I didn't cause it. I just say what I know. Conditions and standard of living will automatically improve for almost any Nigerian that migrates to any Anglo-Western country. I've lived it and seen it happen to dozens of people over the last 30 years. Nigeria is the POVERTY CAPITAL of the World and the endemic suffering there is reflective of that fact.

Have a good weekend...and Good Luck to you all.

IbeOkehie:


Actually I've commented on the financial irresponsibility of US government policies numerous times, but you're more concerned about upholding the image of Nigeria as a paradise, so you haven't noticed. Here's something I wrote just a few days ago -



We moved to a new business premises about 3 years ago. There's a breakfast sandwich I started buying at a nearby restaurant, when we got here it was $6, now it's $8. I own some apartments I rented out for $650 in 2015, today the tenants pay me $1200. So I'm personally aware of how much prices have gone up and why. In Nigeria, a bag of rice has gone from ₦7000 in 2014 to over ₦40K right now. At least in the USA basic salary has risen significantly, whereas in Nigeria it's static or not risen by much. Basically the APC in Nigeria and Democrat Party in the USA have the same socialist policies and the results are similar. No surprise there at all.

I've also made this statement numerous times on this forum - EVERYTHING good or bad that happens in Nigeria also happens in the the USA, the only difference is the REACTION of the society and the BASIC LAWS & CULTURE that make the reaction possible or impossible. For example, my wife's car was stolen from a parking lot exactly a week ago. The police were called and they deployed and found the car the next day. Before that, insurance had already called offering a rental car (we declined) and asking us to submit a police report to process compensation. I wonder what would have happened in Nigeria.

The real issue is that the DEGREE of deterioration in Nigeria is so much worse because that country is has MUCH MORE EMBEDDED CULTURE OF SOCIO-POLITICAL SOCIALISM than the USA. That's the real problem. For instance, the USA that produces dollars has never tried to fix the value, but Nigeria has a legally mandated price for that currency and also the naira. So while producers can rapidly adjust to changing conditions in the USA, they can't do so in Nigeria.

Summary being, the situation is what it is, I didn't cause it. I just say what I know. Conditions and standard of living will automatically improve for almost any Nigerian that migrates to any Anglo-Western country. I've lived it and I seen it happen to dozens of people over the last 30 years. Nigeria is the POVERTY CAPITAL of the World and the endemic suffering there is reflective of that fact.

Have a good weekend...and Good Luck to you all.

Ok

being:
Well.. the argument depends on hw much the naira depreciates and how much housing prices in that area increase!!

Dear Sir, your comment is meaningless and conveys nothing, running in circles just to confuse issues. Read the report, if you doubt it go and find and read GTB earnings report, I'm sure it's on their website because it's a legally mandated and audited public document that ANYONE is entitled to read.

GTB made a huge profit by converting naira to dollars & pound sterling and holding the forex and then converting back to naira as opportunity presented itself. Nothing else. It's basic arbitrage. That's how banks and big wigs like Peter Obi, Aliko Dangote and Adenuga have been making mad money in Nigeria for a looooong time, most people just don't know it.

CBN recently tried to curtail the practice by restricting the use of dollars as collateral to borrow naira. It's a futile effort. As long as the Federal Government of Nigeria continues to rig the forex market, this carry trade will never die.

You were simply WRONG, sorry about that.

Good Luck to you.

For the GTB issue, this particular gain was not about converting to naira and back etc. They gave out loans in $.and the loans are still active but they report in naira so it gave rise to the revaluation gain..
What I meant with my statement is what gives you a better ROI buying $ or buying land/houses is determimed by hw much naira depreciates compared to how house prices increase in the area you purchase it.

IbeOkehie:


Dear Sir, your comment is meaningless and conveys nothing, running in circles just to confuse issues. Read the report, if you doubt it go and find and read GTB earnings report, I'm sure it's on their website because it's a legally mandated and audited public document that ANYONE is entitled to read.

GTB made a huge profit from converting naira to dollars & pound sterling and holding the forex and then converting back to naira as opportunity presented itself. Nothing else. That's how banks and big wigs like Peter Obi, Aliko Dangote and Adenuga have been making mad money in Nigeria for a looooong time, most people just don't know it.

CBN recently tried to curtail the practice by restricting the use of dollars as collateral to borrow naira. It's a futile effort. As long as the Federal Government of Nigeria continues to rig the forex market, this carry trade will never die.

You were simply WRONG, sorry about that.

Good Luck to you.

being:
For the GTB issue, this particular gain was not about converting to naira and back etc. They gave out loans in $.and the loans are still active but they report in naira so it gave rise to the revaluation gain..
What I meant with my statement is what gives you a better ROI buying $ or buying land/houses is determimed by hw much naira depreciates compared to how house prices increase in the area you purchase it.

Wroooong again But that's OK, it takes time and experience to understand some of these things. Most people never think about them.

How did GTB get the DOLLARS to make DOLLAR loans? The bulk of their deposit base is in Nigeria. They converted naira into dollars and then loaned it out, basically the same thing.

Here's something to think about - lending rates in Nigeria are generally over 25%, dollar lending right now are less than 8 to 10%. That GTB didn't concentrate on exploiting domestic lending and went to the trouble of converting to dollars and lending out, should tell you how terrible the Nigerian economy is. One of the best and biggest banks in Nigeria doesn't want to hold naira or lend it.

In the last decade real estate has gained more value in the USA & UK than in Nigeria, and I'm willing to bet it's been the same measuring as far back as 30 years ago. If the ROI is better in Nigerian Real Estate, GTB would be making more profit in that market. They're not. So your claim is baseless. This story is a distress signal telling us the worst is yet to come for the Nigeria Crisis.

Good Luck to Nigeria.

Alakori07:


I thought you’re actually smarty but seems like you’re deluded as much as everyone else or maybe economic isn’t ur forte?

Is 1$ in 1990 the same as $1 in 2023 in America?

A person earning $3k in Nigeria today will be far successful financially than the same person in America. But I understand that y’all are living in America for ur unborn kids and all the other yadayada reasons. That’s the consolation you give urself at the end when u realize amassing wealth isn’t what u think it is in western countries

Very, very few people earn $3k per month in Nigeria, for sure it's not up to 0.05% of the population. So there's no justification in using such an outlier to make comparisons. Makes no sense at all. Even then, I'd take $3K per month in the USA over the same salary in Nigeria. It's just a starting point and I know I can make the best of it in America and overall live a better and richer life.

I just saw this your comment now and this is the bit that really intrigued me -

But I understand that y’all are living in America for ur unborn kids and all the other yadayada reasons. That’s the consolation you give urself at the end when u realize amassing wealth isn’t what u think it is in western countries

What does the above mean? Is there a difference between WEALTH in Nigeria and USA that I don't know?

Good Luck to you all.

Let's be calming down. By law from sanusi's time as CBN gov, no bank can go into real estate. U can only own operate banks within & outside the country! And there are many reasons to issue fx loans-- for instance a loan to an indigenous IOC to buy equipment or well assets is most useful in FCY. Btw, the GTB FCY assets being revalued are mostly those from its subsidiaries outside Nigeria!

IbeOkehie:


Wroooong again But that's OK, it takes time and experience to understand some of these things. Most people never think about them.

How did GTB get the DOLLARS to make DOLLAR loans? The bulk of their deposit base is in Nigeria. They converted naira into dollars and then loaned it out, basically the same thing.

Here's something to think about - lending rates in Nigeria are generally over 25%, dollar lending right now are less than 8 to 10%. That GTB didn't concentrate on exploiting domestic lending and went to the trouble of converting to dollars and lending out, should tell you how terrible the Nigerian economy is. One of the best and biggest banks in Nigeria doesn't want to hold naira or lend it.

If the ROI is better in Nigerian Real Estate, GTB would be making more profit in that market. They're not. So your claim is baseless. This story is a distress signal telling us the worst is yet to come for the Nigeria Crisis.

Good Luck to Nigeria.

being:
Let's be calming down. By law from sanusi's time as CBN gov, no bank can go into real estate. U can only own operate banks within & outside the country! And there are many reasons to issue fx loans-- for instance a loan to an indigenous IOC to buy equipment or well assets is most useful in FCY.

They can LEND naira to real estate operators in Nigeria. Whatever ELSE that GTB is doing, the greatest source of their profits is forex arbritage.

Good Luck to Nigeria.

This might be true this year because of the near 100% jump in official rate from 460 to 750. But loans supplied most of the profit in previous years... I mean in the Jonathan years, $ rate moved marginally 155(2011) to 185(2014). Hw were the banks making huge profit then going by ur theory?
Or would it have been more sensible to invest in FX than to invest in lands in a growing area in those 3 years (d original argument)

IbeOkehie:


They can LEND naira to real estate operators in Nigeria. Whatever ELSE that GTB is doing, the greatest source of their profits is forex arbritage.

Good Luck to Nigeria.

being:
This might be true this year because of the near 100% jump in official rate from 460 to 750. But loans supplied most of the profit in previous years... I mean in the Jonathan years, $ rate moved marginally 155(2011) to 185(2014). Hw were the banks making huge profit then going by ur theory?
Or would it have been more sensible to invest in FX than to invest in lands in a growing area in those 3 years (d original argument)

Sir I'm a Nigerian. This is my real name. I've been quite open. Who are you and what gives you the credibility that I can believe?

I know the rewards...and risk....of real estate in Nigeria and the USA. I've lived between both countries for 30 years and owned real estate in both places as far back as 1993.

My summary is that real estate gains more value in the USA, UK and Anglo-Western countries than Nigeria. Also dollar has gained more value in Nigeria than Nigerian real estate. My pocket is my witness. That’s what I know and I challenge you to either use official data or your own experience to measure it. You can come to no other conclusion.

Good Luck to Nigeria.

Lol at who am I question-- I'm surely not an American
U don't need my credibility or experience-- it's just figures that can be verified..
I don't dispute what your pocket tells u over say 30 years, I'm saying just because u summed up 30 yrs effect and FX trumps real estate doesn't mean it will for a period of 3 yrs or it will be d same result in another 30 yrs! One has to look at the direction of the driving factors to make a decision!!

IbeOkehie:


Sir I'm a Nigerian. This is my real name. I've been quite open. Who are you and what gives you the credibility that I can believe?

I know the rewards...and risk....of real estate in Nigeria and the USA. I've lived between both countries for 30 years and owned real estate in both places as far back as 1993.

My summary is that real estate gains more value in the USA, UK and Anglo-Western countries than Nigeria. Also dollar has gained more value in Nigeria than Nigerian real estate. My pocket is my witness. That’s what I know and I challenge you to either use official data or your own experience to measure it. You can come to no other conclusion.

Good Luck to Nigeria.