ikemofepo:

Funny how people try hard to keep the Law. And selectively at that. Most christians don't study the scriptures but love to argue what's in their heads and what their pastors told them. I'm glad the greedy tithing remained until now. I'm sure God just looked on at how the Old Covenant slipped into the new. Greedy and selfish christians would hardly give anything save the tithe! And if that is how they're forced to give all well and good. I have read so much on this blog. There are two sides, people that talk out of knowledge, and people that talk as mouth pieces to their pastors

You said u were gonna upload a book on tithe. I am waiting for it.

shdemidemi: what commandment are you talking about? Be precise pls.

The scripture tells us "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." (I John 3:4) am kinda a busy but i will reply the other post later.

flourishG: are u a Jew by birth?y are u advancing in Judaism like Saul of Tartus?

dumb question..are u arab?

DrummaBoy:



Bidam
That write up said it all. The contention has been on distinguishing what Moses law is and that write up referred us to the 2Corinthians 3 scripture that said the law written on the tablets were being done away with: alwaystrue will say there was Law of God and Law of Moses but this write up shows they are one and the same.

If this doesn't convince U, U are beyond redemption or worse still, it confirms Pastor Kun's accusation that U know the truth but simply choose the path of deception bc it affords U opportunity to defraud people.

did Christ free us from the law or from the curse of the law.lawless folks.smh

Bidam: did Christ free us from the law or from the curse of the law.lawless folks.smh

so why don't you practise other parts of the law, why is your emphasis only on the ONE that supposedly has the $ sign attached to it ?

ikemofepo:

Funny how people try hard to keep the Law. And selectively at that. Most christians don't study the scriptures but love to argue what's in their heads and what their pastors told them. I'm glad the greedy tithing remained until now. I'm sure God just looked on at how the Old Covenant slipped into the new. Greedy and selfish christians would hardly give anything save the tithe! And if that is how they're forced to give all well and good. I have read so much on this blog. There are two sides, people that talk out of knowledge, and people that talk as mouth pieces to their pastors

wrong..wrong and wrong..infact you are actaully showing your hatred for God's word by ur statements here..i can understand your copy and paste doctrines you got all over the internet simply becos you are lazy to read your bible.smh

Bidam: did Christ free us from the law or from the curse of the law.lawless folks.smh

He freed us from the law of Moses as a whole.

Bidam: The scripture tells us "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." (I John 3:4) am kinda a busy but i will reply the other post later.

The bible tells you and I that we are now dead to the sin nature, we are now alive in Christ. Why do you see yourself as though you r still your old self when you are now in Christ

Bidam: did Christ free us from the law or from the curse of the law.lawless folks.smh

Olodo, gentile christians were never under the law in the first instance and the apostles made it clear that the law did not constitute a part of the gospel they were mandated by christ to preach.

1. Abraham did not pay tithe, but gave tithe to Melchizedek. To him therefore, tithe was a freewill offering, which was not prompted by a law or a religious custom. (Gen. 14:18-20; Heb. 7:1-4)
2. Abraham’s giving of tithe was not done in order to be blessed. Melchizedek blessed Abraham first before the latter gave tithe to the former. The giving of tithe was only a sign of appreciation to Melchizedek, not an inducement to receiving blessings.
3. Abraham gave a tenth of the spoil of war and not out of his own personal property or earning. (Heb. 7:2) If we wish to follow Abraham’s example strictly, we have to fight a war, win, take spoil and then give a tenth of it.
4. There is no Scriptural evidence that Abraham passed on the ordinance of tithing to his offspring as an obligation. If he did, it would be out of place for Jacob to be promising God tithe, which would be obligatory anyway. I doubt if it is necessary to promise God what is already an accepted tradition.
5. Tithing entered into the Law of Moses partly to make provisions for the sons of Levi who had no inheritance in the Land of Promise. Now that all believers are priests, who pays to whom? (Num 18:20-24; Lev. 27:30-33; Num. 18:25-29; Deut 12:14-7, 11, 17, 18; 14:22-27; Lev. 25:1-12).
6. Now that the Levitical priesthood has been abrogated, the law of tithing that used to keep that institution functional has to go too. This, I think, is the conclusion of Heb. 7:1-12.
7. The summary of Heb. 7:1-12 can be stated in three sentences:
(i) Tithing started with Abraham as a freewill offering. (Heb. 7:1-4).
(ii) It entered into the Law of Moses to provide for the Levitical Priesthood, and so became obligatory for everybody under the Law (Heb. 7:5:10).
(iii) Now that the priesthood has been changed because it could not bring perfection, the law that came with it (including tithing) has to be changed also. (Heb 7:11, 12).
8. Every other practice that came before the Law, which entered the Law, perished with the Law. Saturday Sabbath is no longer required to be observed, not even to be observed as Sunday. (Col. 2:16; Gal. 4:9-11; Rom. 14:1-14) Discrimination between clean and unclean animals is no longer valid. (Acts 10:9-15; I Tim 4:1-5; Gen 7:2,3) Circumcision as a means of entering into Abraham’s covenant is now replaced with water baptism (compare Gen. 17:9-13 with Col 2:11-13). Tithing is now replaced with freewill offering. (2Cor. 9:7) Even Barnabas (a Levite) gave according to NT principle, (Acts 4:36-37) to fulfill Malachi 3:3.
9. The Decalogue, which is the nucleus of the whole Mosaic Law, is described by Paul as:
(i) Ministration of death (2Cor. 3:7). Is it not the Decalogue that was engraved on stones?
(ii) Ministration of condemnation (2Cor. 3:9);
(iii) That which is passing away. (2Cor 3:11)
If Paul used such description for the Law, then, why will a New Testament believer dwell so much on the Law? (Gal. 2:21)
10. Paul seems to suggest in 2Cor. 3:13-15 that the veil that Moses put upon his face is the reason why many people, till today, have not seen the end of the Law Covenant. “Their minds are blinded”.
11. Moses failed to reach his destination just because he relied on a previous instruction to handle a new, though similar, situation. At Rephidim, he was instructed to strike the rock with his rod to supply water for the children of Israel and he did. (Ex. 17:1-7) But at Kadesh, he was commanded to speak to the rock for the same reason, but he struck it twice instead. (Num. 20:1-13) That incidence became a reference point of regret for Moses. (Num. 27:14; Deut. 1:37; 3:26) Hence, he could not finish his race.
12. If Moses forfeited his destiny just on that one point, it is possible for any of us to lose his for that same simple reason. Ignoring the NT provisions is like trampling on the Son of God, counting His blood unholy and insulting the Spirit of grace. God will not leave anybody in such situation unpunished. (Heb. 10:2, 29) “How shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation?” (Heb. 2:3)
13. It is true that God commanded tithe under the Law of Moses, but now under the gospel age, what is His command on giving? (2Cor. 9:7) See Galatians 3:23, 24.
14. In Matt. 5:17, Jesus said that he did not come to cancel the Law but to fulfill it, but in Luke 24:44 he also said he had fulfilled it all by His death.
15. Even for the people of Israel, the Law was not meant to be an everlasting arrangement. It only came because of the hardness of the hearts of the people, (Mk. 10:5; Ez. 20:24, 26) to keep them in custody until the coming of the savior (Gal. 3:23-25). The coming of the Law was an aberration, and not in the original plan of God; (Gal 3:23-25) and it was administered by angels. (Acts 7:30-36, 38, 53; Gal 3:19; Heb. 2:2). Jesus is better than angels in all things. (Heb 1:1-14)
16. Satan and the Law of Moses perform practically the same function before God – accusing people. (Rev. 12:10; Jn. 5:45; Rom. 7:9). Anybody under the Law has a permanent accuser before God, even now.
17. The Law is faulty (Heb. 8:7-13), unprofitable and weak, hence the need to change it. (Heb. 7:18, 19)
18. The NT method of giving is based on freewill as stipulated in 2Cor. 9:6, 7.
19. With all the wonderful teachings of Paul on giving, he never at any time appealed to the law of tithing. Why didn’t he if the Law is still for us Christians?
20. There is a clue in Malachi to the fact that the Law should be operational until the coming of “the Lord whom you seek…the massager of that covenant in whom you delight…” (3:1) The implication is that they no longer had delight in the old order; hence they abandoned tithe payment which should keep Levi in office. Prophet Malachi was raised to call the people back to follow the Law of Moses. Without restoration of tithing, the priesthood could not be restored, and without the priesthood, the Law could not be restored. This is why Malachi spoke so forcefully in support of tithes.
21. Nobody can follow the Law of tithing as stipulated under the Mosaic Law. Farmers must not bring money but crops and livestock to be stored in a storehouse. If anybody would convert the farm produce to money, he should add another one-fifth to it. (Lev. 27:31) If we are to follow the law of tithing, we must not amplify it, water it down, put our own idea or panel-beat it to suit our own condition. This is the meaning of not turning to the right hand or to the left as in Josh. 1:7; Deut. 5:32; 17:20.
22. There must be a year of tithe and a mandatory declaration before God that all the tithes have been paid without holding anything back. (Deut 26:12-15).
23. Anybody who stays under the Law of Moses has fallen away from grace (Gal. 5:4) and, like Hagar and her son, must be cast out. (Gal. 4:23-30)
24. The Law has become obsolete (Heb. 8:13), changed (Heb. 7: 11-12); cast out (Gal. 4:30), cancelled (Col. 2:14) and annulled (Rom. 3:27-28). What is the implication of this?
25. For us New Testament believers, we don’t refrain from sin because of what the Law says, but because our new nature puts us above the dictates of the Law (Rom 6. 1-4). The Law was there before our conversion, but yet we broke it. (Jas. 2:10).
26. If anybody gives because of the law of tithing, he has violated a New Testament principle of giving – “Let everyone give as he has purposed in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity (as under the Law), for God loves a cheerful giver.” (2Cor. 9:7) “He who sows…bountifully will also reap bountifully” is an eternal law of giving that is not restricted to the OT!
27. The New Testament of Jesus started at His death (Heb.9:16-18). The Law of Moses was still in operation while Jesus was alive in the flesh; hence he spoke about tithes, offering of sacrifice commanded by Moses for any leper that was healed. It was his death that brought an end to the Law of Moses. (Gal. 4:1-5; Col. 2:14; Eph. 2:13-15). Read the Amplified version.
28. Stephen testified that the people who were given the Law could not keep it. (Acts. 7:51-53) Peter said that keeping people under the Law is like tempting God and putting a yoke upon the disciples, which the original owners of the Law could not carry. (Acts 15:10)
29. Peter suggested building three tabernacles on the Mount of Transfiguration, but God overruled by saying, ‘this is my beloved Son: hear him’, and allowed Moses and Elijah to fizzle out. (Lk. 9:28-36; Mk. 9:5-8; Mt. 17:4-. This is a testimony that Jesus Christ is the final revelation of God’s mind to humanity. (Heb. 1:1-4). There cannot be three tabernacles; God’s Son must have the last say. Mingling the old and the new is not profitable to God’s Kingdom at all. (Matt. 9:16-17)


Drummer boy I did, and I am doing it again, but for more information on the "tithe" doctrine, grace inspirations and many more, you could read my blog. These arm twisting of Christians has to stop. I attributed my failures or financial and material successes to the tithe. I was so wrong. Bidam, it was infact when I started reading my bible myself that I stopped paying tithes. It is silly to give God a miserly 10 percent of your income and free him till the next month. There's nothing generous about that. It is easier to give tithes after being scared with a curse or enticed with a blessing, than to give up to 40 percent of your income to one who you know has already blessed you. Baby Christians are always looking through the bible for a list of dos and dont's. Christ the call us to that. You need to know what the NEW COVENANT is...!

Here is the download link

http://mb.mettalloids.com/tithe-and-you-the-book/

OLAADEGBU:

Christians tithes according to the Abrahamic system. True Christians are children of Abraham in faith and they must walk in his steps except you are not a child of Abraham. Romans 4:12; Hebrew 7

did abraham pay tithes to a store house? Where in the bible are we instructed to pay tithes through Abram system?

Sincere Bigot: did abraham pay tithes to a store house? Where in the bible are we instructed to pay tithes through Abram system?

I'm still shocked that people could buy that idea! Anyway, I once bought it. It's funny how our grace teachers will tell you how all the law has been abolished except one - the tithe. Do we know how to even walk the steps of Abraham? Abraham circumcised, tithed, sacrificed...you want us to do all these? Married two wives, impregnated a house made, fought a war...ha! Christians. And this is what they tried to make the Galatians do, claiming circumcision was not a law thing. He told them blatantly in Galatians 3:9 - So then, those who are of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. Take it or leave it, that's the Word of God. Trying to "do" anything to avoid a curse or attract a blessing, and you have taken yourself back - straight under the law!

Thanks ikemofepo, I will check it up.

I maintain that the challenge with the tithe is the fruits its bearing in Christendom. In addition to what ikemofepo has said I believe Jesus talking about putting new wine in old wine skin was with reference to Judaizers who will confuse law with grace after his death.

Also Jesus, Paul and Stephen, three leading grace exponent where accused of preaching about abolishing the law by the Jews. The truth is the gospel of grace does emphasise the end of the law, it is just that for Jesus he spoke of what was to come but Paul and Stephen spoke of what was already.

Something happened to me yesterday which was a personal confirmation that God Himself has been leading on the path on tithing. Farmafric, is a NLander. I just discovered he is my long time friend from our University days. He called to tell me he had been reading my post on tithing and that he not only agrees with me but had stopped tithing too.

Now this friend of mine is a farmer. He had practised overseas and while there he not only tithed, he gave firstfruits - all to no business breakthrough.

Now both of us independently discovered this issue. Just as we discovered the falsehood in prosperity teaching in our University days together. What further proof that the Spirit is one.

Tithing is dead and buried and like Christemmbassey said here 'the fly wey dey follow dead body, go enter grave with am'. Tithing is a perfect example of making void the grace of God; it is falling from grace; Galatians 5:3-5.

And it is exhilarating to know that more and more people are being removed from its bondage

shdemidemi:
He freed us from the law of Moses as a whole.

Wrong again.The scripture tells us "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." (I John 3:4).Christ emphasized that God's law allowed for mercy and the Pharisees were completely wrong in elevating their harsh, humanly devised regulations above everything else, including mercy.

shdemidemi:

The bible tells you and I that we are now dead to the sin nature, we are now alive in Christ. Why do you see yourself as though you r still your old self when you are now in Christ

Yes..we are dead to the SIN nature but the flesh is an enemy of God even Paul had like passions as we are.. and that is why we confess our sin so clean with the blood of Jesus or are you telling us you are perfect already?

Pastor Kun:

Olodo, gentile christians were never under the law in the first instance and the apostles made it clear that the law did not constitute a part of the gospel they were mandated by christ to preach.

When Adam disobeyed God in Eden he "sinned" (Romans 5:12). How could Adam be called a sinner clear back in Eden if God had no law back then to define sin?

Bidam: When Adam disobeyed God in Eden he "sinned" (Romans 5:12). How could Adam be called a sinner clear back in Eden if God had no law back then to define sin?

We obey the law of God written in our hearts and NOT the law of moses written for the Jews. However I do agree there are overlaps btw the laws of moses and the one written in our heart especially regarding morals but the tithing ordinance which you want to kill yourself over falls strictly under mosaic laws which are now dead, buried and done away with.

Pastor Kun:

We obey the law of God written in our hearts and NOT the law of moses written for the Jews. However I do agree there are overlaps btw the laws of moses and the one written in our heart especially regarding morals but the tithing ordinance which you want to kill yourself over falls strictly under mosaic laws which are now dead, buried and done away with.

i have said times without number in this forum that tithing is a principle just like other principles found in the OT.

Bidam: i have said times without number in this forum that tithing is a principle just like other principles found in the OT.

Story!

Pastor Kun:

Story!

I would like to hear the story. Because I cannot understand why Bidam believes tithes is of the law but still says it remains a "pricinple"; what principle? Like, same way the law of Moses say do not kill; and the law of God in our hearts says do not Kill, because it would not be compatible with love. Now how does the law of Moses which command tithing to Levites that had no inheritance, and needed it for their sustenance equal pay tithe in church so that ministers can have money to run church? When the NT has shown more than enough scriptures on how church must be financed? And when these discourses where going on in 2Corinthians 7-9; 1Corinthians 9; all the pastoral epistles; Paul's admonition in Acts 20 that it is more blessed to give than to receive; and Hebrew 13 that says God is pleased with sacrificial giving (that about all I can remember in NT giving); how do all of them equate to Tithing today? Even the Hebrew 7 scripture that discussed tithes in the NT was simply talking about the supremacy of Jesus' priesthood to that of Aaron, that was sustained with tithe. And since Aaron's priesthood was abolished, the means of sustaining it, the tithe, is done away with also. There is no other way to interprete that scripture without reading our prejudices into it. And, when the NT teaches doctrine or practise, it is explicit about it; it does not teach something and then expect us to see it in another light. Those who choose to get revelations from Hebrew 7 to tithe are finding revelations to support their greed and fraud.

So, Bidam, we await your story...

Bidam: Yes..we are dead to the SIN nature but the flesh is an enemy of God even Paul had like passions as we are.. and that is why we confess our sin so clean with the blood of Jesus or are you telling us you are perfect already?

what is sin nature and what is flesh, Isn't our flesh the carrier of the sin nature we inherited through Adam?

What is your yard stick for measuring perfection?

shdemidemi:
what is sin nature and what is flesh, Isn't our flesh the carrier of the sin nature we inherited through Adam?

you have answered your question.

What is your yard stick for measuring perfection?

Holiness.

Bidam:

What is your yard stick for measuring perfection?

Holiness.

FAILURE!!!!!!!

Holiness is NOT a measure of perfection. It may be YOURS but it is not the bible's. There is such a things as the righteosness of God, perfect righteosness, that can only be obtained by imputation, by faith.

No wonder you bandy the law of Moses around and potray some filthy thing called holiness. Hebrew 12:14 - without holiness no man shall see the Lord. Read it well, it is not saying holiness will earn God's kingdom; it is saying the showing of true perfection, obtained by faith, is holy living. No more, no less...

Don't even fool yourself... why are my even wasting my time with you, you kuku will not hear!

DrummaBoy:

I would like to hear the story. Because I cannot understand why Bidam believes tithes is of the law but still says it remains a "pricinple"; what principle? Like, same way the law of Moses say do not kill; and the law of God in our hearts says do not Kill, because it would not be compatible with love. Now how does the law of Moses which command tithing to Levites that had no inheritance, and needed it for their sustenance equal pay tithe in church so that ministers can have money to run church? When the NT has shown more than enough scriptures on how church must be financed? And when these discourses where going on in 2Corinthians 7-9; 1Corinthians 9; all the pastoral epistles; Paul's admonition in Acts 20 that it is more blessed to give than to receive; and Hebrew 13 that says God is pleased with sacrificial giving (that about all I can remember in NT giving); how do all of them equate to Tithing today? Even the Hebrew 7 scripture that discussed tithes in the NT was simply talking about the supremacy of Jesus' priesthood to that of Aaron, that was sustained with tithe. And since Aaron's priesthood was abolished, the means of sustaining it, the tithe, is done away with also. There is no other way to interprete that scripture without reading our prejudices into it. And, when the NT teaches doctrine or practise, it is explicit about it; it does not teach something and then expect us to see it in another light. Those who choose to get revelations from Hebrew 7 to tithe are finding revelations to support their greed and fraud.

So, Bidam, we await your story...

Tithes and offering were given before the law. This is a fact you cannot remove from the Word.
Tithes and offering are under the giving blanket.
There is still no scripture or apostle that says we should not give tithes and offerings.
You are on your own.

Image123:
Tithes and offering were given before the law. This is a fact you cannot remove from the Word.
Tithes and offering are under the giving blanket.
There is still no scripture or apostle that says we should not give tithes and offerings.
You are on your own.

This is not the story... It is another story

Image123:

Tithes and offering were given before the law. This is a fact you cannot remove from the Word.

Circumcision was also giving before the law; with a direct commandement from God to Abraham (unlike tithe) in Genesis 17, why did the Apostle Paul labor hard to show that it has gone with the law

Tithes and offering are under the giving blanket.

What blanket? Who said it was cold? That something is giving does not mean that it is acceptable to God. Check your bible, motive and scriptural standards determine if what we do in the NT is acceptable to God.

There is still no scripture or apostle that says we should not give tithes and offerings.

There is still no scripture by the apostles that say we give tithes. Period. But there are legion of scriptures that shows that the Mosaic tithes has been abolished along with the levithical rights, unless, ofcourse, you refuse to see them.

You are on your own.

One with God is majority: I am content that way

Bidam: Yes..we are dead to the SIN nature but the flesh is an enemy of God even Paul had like passions as we are.. and that is why we confess our sin so clean with the blood of Jesus or are you telling us you are perfect already?

Bidam: you have answered your question.

if you know your body/flesh carries the sin nature and you are dead to sin from its root, why would you make the bolded statement then?

The issue is not the confession of your sin but the renewal of your mind. What Paul is saying is that we carry two forces that propel us believers- force of sin and the force of righteousness. A believer that does not build a relationship with God through the truth of God's word would have more of the force of sin controlling him (although he is dead to the root of sin). On the other hand, If you have a relationship with God without any law, you would gradually minimise the force of the sin nature.
Romans 6:11
11 Likewise reckon (consider, think as though) ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Back to the issue of the law of moses. No man is made righteous by the deeds of this law, Paul used three illustrations to present his case-

PLANT- He said just as a seed is buried in the soil to bring forth fruit, we were likewise buried with Christ and we rose with him.

SERVANT- Just as a slave that has a new master, the slave must not leave with the new master as though he is with his old master. Christ is our new slave master, He has bought us from the old master (law), we must leave with this new master according to his own terms.

MARRIAGE- A woman is bound to the laws of her husband as long as the husband is alive, when the husband dies, he is free to marry another husband. Christ died as a fulfilment of the law for me to be married to the risen Christ. Therefore, if you leave in Christ as though you are under the law, you are committing a spiritual adultery.

5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Image123:
Tithes and offering were given before the law. This is a fact you cannot remove from the Word.
Tithes and offering are under the giving blanket.
There is still no scripture or apostle that says we should not give tithes and offerings.
You are on your own.

As a church we are married to Christ, we must obey the laws and principles of Christ. Bringing any other story that led us to Christ is spiritual adultery according to Romans 6 and 7. The risen Christ did not give you a mandate to pay tithes, it is totally wrong to force your old into the new.

Image123:
Tithes and offering were given before the law. This is a fact you cannot remove from the Word.
Tithes and offering are under the giving blanket.
There is still no scripture or apostle that says we should not give tithes and offerings.
You are on your own.

Thanks for answering what i wanted to say jare.this obstinate fellow keeps going round in circles, may be he is scared of accountability.lol

Bidam: Thanks for answering what i wanted to say jare.this obstinate fellow keeps going round in circles, may be he is scared of accountability.lol

bro, waiting on you to react to my post. Are you of Abraham or Moses or John the Baptist. By whose name were you baptized?