In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? - Religion (44) - Nairaland
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| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 2:21pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: Why did Jude a good disciple of Christ reference a non canonical book? How uninspiring of Him? If I were a protestant (Those Protesting against the Catholic Church), I will obliterate the book of Jude from the Bible. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 2:31pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: You know better than to derail the discussion, the Word in contention is meant to be COMPILED. Writings are at no time created, whether the Old or New Testament. So lets get on course. IT WILL BE NICE OF YOU TO RESPOND TO THE HISTORY LESSON THAT Chukwudi04 has been giving. He has raised important issues therein. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Kaycee7(m): 2:38pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
Due to my lack of knowledge, I asked the Blessed Virgin to assist me in defending her. She sent Chukwudi and Ktjohnpaul. You guys are the best. May the Blessed Virgin, your Patron Saints and Guardian Angels obtain for you abundant graces in heaven. Over to you, Brothers. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 2:40pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
This resolution 24 of the council of carthage held in 417 CE Canon 24. (Greek xxvii.) That nothing be read in church besides the Canonical Scripture Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture. But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books. The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Tobit. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books. The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book. Let this be sent to our brother and fellow bishop, Boniface, and to the other bishops of those parts, that they may confirm this canon, for these are the things which we have received from our fathers to be read in church. 1 Like |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Kaycee7(m): 2:44pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ochongonoko:Am sorry but how can you be praying to Buddha, dead people, statues, a serial killer and still claim to be in Christ? Your username is really inspired. It describes you exactly. I repeat, so long as you're in Christ, it doesn't matter where you came through. Your no 6 shld tell you that only a way inspired by the Holy Spirit can lead you to Christ. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Kaycee7(m): 2:46pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
Naijadeyhia has turned this thread to an all-out war on Catholicism. I thought we were debating about the Blessed Virgin. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 2:48pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: Nice work in copy and paste but better brace up I still have dozens of non-canonical quotations from the bible for you to deal with. Next here ia Jude 1:9 where Jude goes ahead to quote fromn the assumption of Moses.While I wait for you to spin that off.I will ho and get more for you especially from the OT where over 20 non-canonical books were mentioned |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 2:55pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE OPPORTUNITY TO THE CATHOLIC APOLOGETICS HERE TO ASK ME ANY QUESTION THEY FEEL LIKE PERTAINING THEIR BELIEFS IN THE BIBLE OR ANY QUESTION PERTAINING MINE. OR ANY CLARIFICATION THEY SEEK ON MARY, THE POPE, PETER, JESUS, AND ALL ELSE. Anytime you have the urge to prove your self worth to anybody, always remember Matthew 4:1-11. twice the Devil Challenged Jesus to prove that he was son of God, twice Jesus declined. There is what is called pride, the Bible says in Proverbs 16:18–19 Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall. It is better to be of a lowly spirit with the poor than to divide the spoil with the proud. Like her son Jesus, Mary demonstrated biblical humility when she said, 'because he has looked upon the humble state of his servant.' Lk 1:48 |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by bukatyne(f): 2:56pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ochongonoko: Thanks dear  It's well. I cringe at reading some things |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by bukatyne(f): 3:01pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
Syncan: You did not answer my question |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 3:10pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
El Guapo: I was almost tempted to ask whether you were high when you typed the bolded text. LOL  |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by bukatyne(f): 3:13pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
El Guapo: What of John the Beloved, Jesus loved Him that he was called 'the Beloved.' Won't he intercede better? Lol! |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by bukatyne(f): 3:18pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: Do you know that the Bible refers to all believers as 'Saints'? The prayer of a righteous living person is effective. The next verse tells the elders to lay their hands on the sick etc. How can a dead elder lay his hands on the living? Funny, the Bible only called about 4 people righteous (Daniel, Noah, David and Abraham) and Mary was not amongst them |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:19pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: [b]ONCE AGAIN I REPEAT, THE HOLY SPIRIT NEEDS TO INSPIRE THE SCRIPTURES SO YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND! JESUS DID NOT REFUSE TO PROVE HE WAS CHRIST TO THE DEVIL DUE TO PRIDE NO! FAR FROM IT. HE REFUSED TO DO SO BECAUSE IF HE HAD SIMPLY OBEYED HE WOULD HAVE COME UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE DEVIL BECAUSE TO WHOM YOU YIELD YOUR BODILY MEMBERS TO YOU BECOME A SLAVE TO THEM. JESUS AS GOD: Jesus never said clearly in so many words, "I am God!" But He did say it indirectly: “At this the Jews began to grumble about him because he said, ‘I am the bread that came down from heaven.’ They said, ‘Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, “I came down from heaven”?’” (John 6:41,42) “‘I tell you the truth,’ Jesus answered, ‘before Abraham was born, I am!’ At this, they picked up stones to stone him…” (John 8:58 ) [Note: “I Am” is the name God used for Himself when He spoke to Moses. Stoning was the punishment for blasphemy prescribed in the Mosaic Law.] (Jesus prayed) “I have brought you glory on earth by completing the work you gave me to do. And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.” (John 17:4,5) JESUS AS MESSIAH: Jesus never stood in the open market declaring publicly, "I am the Messiah!" He did say it privately to the Samaritan woman, and He did not deny it when the Jews demanded He declare whether or not He was the Messiah: “The woman said, ‘I know that Messiah (called Christ) is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.’ Then Jesus declared, ‘I who speak to you am he.’” (John 4:25,26) “The high priest said to him, ‘I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God.’ ‘Yes, it is as you say,’ Jesus replied.” (Matthew 26:63,64) JESUS AS A PROPHET: Jesus almost never called Himself a prophet. Here is the one time mentioned: “And they took offense at him. But Jesus said to them, ‘Only in his hometown and in his own house is a prophet without honor.’ And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.” (Matthew 13:56-58 ) JESUS AS THE SON OF GOD: Jesus very seldom called Himself “the Son of God.” He did not deny it when the Jews demanded that He say clearly whether or not He was the Son of God: “‘If you are the Christ,’ they said, ‘Tell us.’ Jesus answered, ‘If I tell you, you will not believe me, and if I asked you, you would not answer. But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God.’ They all asked, ‘Are you then the Son of God?’ He replied, ‘You are right in saying I am.’” (Luke 22:67-70). Many people spoke to Jesus calling Him the “Son of God” and He never denied it. Here are a few examples: “‘He saved others,’ they said, ‘but he can’t save himself! He’s the King of Israel! Let him come down now from the cross, and we will believe in him. He trusts in God. Let God rescue him now if he wants him, for he said, “I am the Son of God.”’” (Matthew 27:42,43) “And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God.’” (Matthew 14:32,33) “When he saw Jesus, he cried out and fell at his feet, shouting at the top of his voice, ‘What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I beg you, don’t torture me!’ For Jesus had commanded the evil spirit to come out of the man.” (Luke 8:28,29) Jesus certainly implied He was the Son of God by repeatedly calling God His "Father" [117 times are recorded in the New Testament]. He Himself almost never called Himself the “Son of God” (see the only four examples below): “… Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son.’?” (John 10:36) “I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself.” (John 5:25) “When he heard this, Jesus said, ‘This sickness will not end in death. No, it is for God’s glory so that God’s Son may be glorified through it.’” (John 11:4) JESUS AS THE SON OF MAN: Instead, He constantly referred to Himself as, “The Son of Man” (more than 50 times), and, on the face of it, the most obvious meaning of “Son of Man” is an average human being and a descendant of Adam. 2. Furthermore, Jesus Forbid Those Who Recognized His Full Identity to Tell Anyone: a) His disciples: “‘But what about you? Who do you say that I am?’ Simon Peter answered, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the Living God!’ ... Then he warned his disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Christ.” (Matthew 16:15,16,20; see also Mark 8:29,30) b) The demons: “... He also drove out many demons, but He would not let the demons speak because they knew who he was.” (Mark 1:34; see also verses 24,25) “Whenever the evil spirits saw him, they fell down before him, and cried out, 'You are the Son of God.' But he gave them strict orders not to tell who he was.” (Mark 3:11,12) “Moreover, demons came out of many people, shouting, 'You are the Son of God!' But He rebuked them and would not allow them to speak, because they knew He was the Christ.” (Luke 4:41) Those He healed: “... and he healed all their sick, warning them not to tell who he was.” (Matthew 12:15,16) “Immediately he was cured of his leprosy. Then Jesus said to him, ‘See that you don't tell anyone ...’” (Matthew 8:3,4) “Immediately the (dead) girl stood up and walked around. At this they were completely astonished. He gave strict orders not to let anyone know about this.” (Mark 5:42,43) Jesus Refused to Prove His Identity When He Was Challenged to Do So: a) By Satan: “If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread ... If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down ...” (Matthew 4:3,6) b) By the common people: “Those who passed by hurled insults at him, shaking their heads and saying, ‘... Save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God.’” (Matt. 27:39,40) c) By the chief priests, teachers and elders: “He saved others, but he can't save himself! He's the King of Israel! Let him come down now from the cross, and we will believe in him ... for he said, ‘I am the Son of God.’” (Matthew 39:41-43) THE REASONS WHY JESUS THE MESSIAH DID NOT CLEARLY REVEAL HIS FULL IDENTITY: 1. Because Jesus Knew That His Identity Is Beyond Human Understanding, and Is Revealed Only to Believers Who Are Enabled By God to Search For This Truth: If Messiah Jesus has stood on the corner and proclaimed, “I am God! Worship me!” How many people do you think would have believed him and worshiped him? a) There are two things about Christ which a person can understand only as God reveals them: 1) Who Jesus Really is: “Simon Peter replied, ‘You are the Christ, the Son of the living God’ ... ‘Blessed are you, Simon, son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in Heaven.’” (Matthew 16:15-17) 2) The True Meaning of What Jesus Did on The Cross: “For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing … The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.” (1 Corinthians 1:18; 2:14) b) Jesus Reveals Himself Only to Those Who Truly Love Him: “‘Whoever has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me. And he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest [reveal] myself to him.’ Judas (not Iscariot) said to him, ‘Lord, how is it that you will manifest yourself to us, and not to the world?’ Jesus answered him, ‘If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.’” (John 14:21-23) c) This is How God Reveals Jesus to Those Who Truly Love Him: i) God’s Holy Spirit Supernaturally Reveals this Secret Wisdom About Christ to Us: “‘No, we speak of God’s secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.’ ... no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him’ but God has revealed it to us by his Spirit ... we have … received ... the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.” (1 Corinthians 2:7-13) ii) Jesus is Supernaturally Revealed to Us Through the Word of God: “… these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.” (John 20:31; see also John 5:39,40; Romans 16:25,26; Ephesians 3:4,5) iii) True Believers Are Supernaturally Enabled by The Father to Receive Christ: “All that the Father gives me will come to me ... No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him ... This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him.” (John 6:37,44,65) Because He Did Not Want People To Be Distracted From His Basic Purpose And Message: Jesus’ reason for coming to earth the first time was to become a complete and perfect human being just like us, so that he could be our substitute in paying the full penalty for our sin. He was not looking for people to worship or honor Him. Instead, He wanted people to accept Him as a perfect man who had come to be their Savior from the disastrous results of their sins. Showing people that He was God, the King of Israel or a great prophet would only distract them from this purpose. When Christ comes back again He will come to be exalted and honored as King and Lord of Lords. “… the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” (Matthew 20:28 ) “For the Son of Man came to seek and to save what was lost.” (Luke 19:10) “… Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death even death on a cross!” (Philippians 2:5-  “For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men.” (1 Timothy 2:5) “… Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.” (Titus 2:13,14) “For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your forefathers, but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect. He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.” (1 Peter 1:18-20) Because Jesus Knew Many People Have So Hardened Their Hearts And Surrendered To Satan, That They Could Not Recognize Who He Really Is And Why He Came: “The disciples came to him and asked, 'Why do you speak to the people in parables?' He replied, 'The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them ... This is why I speak to them in parables: "Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand." In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: "You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes ...”’” (Matthew 13:10-11,13-15) “He [Jesus] was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. He came to that which was his own (Israel), but his own did not receive him.” (John 1:10,11) “The god of this world [Satan] has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the good news of the glory of Christ …” (2 Corinthians 4:4) “No, we speak of God’s secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.” (1 Corinthians 2:7,8 ) IN FACT, GOD’S WORD IS FILLED WITH STATEMENTS ABOUT GOD’S SECRET WISDOM UNDERSTOOD ONLY BY THOSE TO WHOM GOD REVEALS IT: “The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but the things revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may follow all the words of this law.” (Deut. 29:29) “... He brings hidden things to light.” (Job 28:11) “It is the glory of God to conceal a matter.” (Proverbs 25:2) “Truly you are a God who hides himself.” (Isaiah 45:15) “From now on, I will teach you of new things, of hidden things unknown to you.” (Isaiah 48:6) “Call to me and I will answer you and tell you great and unsearchable things you do not know.” (Jeremiah 33:3) “He reveals deep and hidden things; he knows what lies in darkness, and light dwells with him.” (Daniel 2:22) “It is written in the prophets: ‘They will all be taught by God.’” (John 6:45) “When I came to you, brothers, I did not come with eloquence of superior wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God. For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and him crucified ... My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words ... not the wisdom of this age ... we speak of God's secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden ...” (1 Corinthians 2:1-8 ) “... that they may know the mystery of God, namely, Christ, in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge ... the mystery of Christ ...” (Colossians 2:2,3; 4:3; see also 1:26,27) [/b] |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:23pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: DWELL ON THE TRUTH!! THE SAME CATHOLIC CHURCH FED YOU LIES WHEN OUT OF NOWHERE THEY CAME UP WITH THE ASSUMPTION OF MARY, IMPLYING THAT MARY DID NOT DIE BUT WAS TAKEN UP INTO HEAVEN. SINCE YOU KEEP ASKING ME TO SHOW YOU THIS AND THAT SCRIPTURE FROM THE BIBLE AND I HAVE BEEN RESPONDING. I FEEL IT IS ONLY FITTING FOR ME TO ASK IF YOU CAN POINT OUT TO ME EITHER FROM THE OLD OR NEW TESTAMENT WHERE IT STATES THAT MARY DID NOT DIE BUT WAS TAKEN UP INTO HEAVEN WITHOUT SEEING DEATH. SHOW IT TO ME AND I PROMISE YOU, I WILL BECOME A CATHOLIC IMMEDIATELY! LET ME EVEN EXTEND YOUR SEARCH PARAMETER. YOU CAN INCLUDE THE BOOKS OF 1ST AND 2ND MACCABEES, SIRACH, WISDOM, JUDITH, TOBIT AND BARUCH |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by bukatyne(f): 3:38pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: And he did not marry her after the Birth of Jesus? Read Luke 2:41, 48 |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 3:39pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
bukatyne: It obvious that you need biblical lessons on the saving GRACE of God, and I will gladly oblige you that in the context of our discuss. Angel Gabriel used a royal greeting for Mary, when he said "Hail". This term "Hail", as in "Hail Caesar" or "Hail, King of the Jews", wasn't used for peasants. It is a term used for royalty, as in the Queen of the King of Kings, or the Queen Mother of Heaven. Notice too, that Angel Gabriel did not address her by her name of Mary, but rather by her new title - "Full of Grace". To be "full of grace" means that there can be NO room for sin anywhere in your body or soul. And we know from Romans 6:14 that the more grace one has, the less sin one has: Romans 6:14: For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace. Ephesians 4:7 But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift. The word measure speaks to the amount of grace we may receive. Mary's was FULL, giving no room for sin. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:39pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: I USED THE WORD CREATE BECAUSE YOUR FELLOW APOLOGETIC CHUKWUDI44 USED THE SAME WORDS. I WAS ONLY HUMORING HIM. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:41pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
bukatyne: THEY DO NOT KNOW THAT MARY COULD HAVE ONLY CALLED JOSEPH "JESUS FATHER" ONLY SINCE THEY WERE MARRIED! |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:46pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: WOW! MY YOUNG MAN HAIL SIMPLY IS A GREETING GIVEN IN ORDER TO ATTRACT THE ATTENTION OF THE PERSON YOU WISH TO SPEAK WITH. ITS A SIMPLE GREETING AND THERE IS NOTHING ROYAL ABOUT IT. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 3:50pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: GRACE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SIN BUT RATHER HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH FAVOR. UNDESERVED FAVOR. MARY WAS HIGHLY FAVORED BUT NOT SINLESS. GO OUTSIDE, TAKE SOME FRESH AIR, CLEAR YOUR HEAD AND THEN COME BACK AND SPEAK INTELLIGENTLY AND VIA THE HOLY SPIRIT |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Syncan(m): 3:53pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
bukatyne: Because it wasn't meant for me. Take it out with Jesus. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:07pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: You have already been told about the illogicality of sola bible yet you insist on foisting it on us.For the umpteenth time we ll tell you that the catholic church does not operate on the doctrine of sola bible.We also have a rich sacred tradition comprising of the writings of the church fathers who gave us the bible |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 4:12pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: Favour is a word that undermines grace Grace is the sanctifying power of God, given to us unworthy servants without merit. God favours us when each time he gives us his grace Ephesians 4:7 But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift. The word measure speaks to the amount of grace we may receive. Mary's was FULL, giving no room for sin. Titus 3:7 And so,since we have been justified by his grace, we become heirs with the confident expectation of eternal life." 1 Justification means Righteousness 2 We are made Righteous (without sin) by GRACE 3 Then we become heirs of the Kingdom, since nothing with stain can enter the kingdom of Heaven. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:13pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
chukwudi44: WHAT YOU SHOULD SAY IS THAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS ACTING MORE LIKE A SECRET CULT BECAUSE ONLY SECRET CULTS KEEP SECRETS. EVEN GOD REVEALS HIS SECRETS TO THOSE WHOM HE LOVES. CALL IT SOLA BIBLE OR WHATEVER, IF YOU CATHOLICS HAVE A DIFFERENT BIBLE SAY IT HERE AND ALSO POINT OUT TO ME WHERE IT IS WRITTEN IN YOUR OWN VERSION OF THE BIBLE THAT MARY DID NOT DIE BUT WENT UP TO HEAVEN WITHOUT SEEING DEATH AND I REPEAT I WILL BECOME A CATHOLIC IN NO TIME |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 4:20pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: I will love to become your real life friend. But again, am not sure... |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:21pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: [b]The word 'grace' (CHEN in Hebrew, CHARIS in Greek), as it is used in the scriptures, literally means 'favor', to bend or stoop in kindness to another as a superior to an inferior. It has the idea of graciousness in manner or action. When used in reference to God, it is the benevolent action of Him stooping down to us in His kindness to reach us in our need, and convey upon us a benefit. His grace has been termed 'unmerited favor' but it is more than an attitude of favor or mercy. His mercy is an expression of His compassion toward us, but His grace is an extension of benevolence translated into action that releases His enabling power into our lives. Seeing that we never merit His favor, we are always indebted to Him to extend to us His mercy and bestow upon us His grace whereby we may respond to Him in an acceptable manner. From beginning to end we are dependent upon Him, for life itself, for all sustenance by which we continue to live and have our existence, and most importantly for our spiritual life without which we are but the "living dead".[/b] |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 4:29pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: There's some verbosity going on here, and I will cut the crap and keep things simple Grace is a free gift from God to man. There is nothing man can do to merit grace, because it is a gift, after all. Faith is also a free gift AND a response to grace. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:38pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: Now you are making sense. Grace is from God to man. The superior to the inferior. It is only shown to the undeserving such as Mary was. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by ktjohnpaul(m): 4:42pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
naijadeyhia: Thanks for the last line about Mary, on point. It just confirms Mary's position too about her unmerited Grace. |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:44pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: 'Skewed' analogy, Na wetin una need  bukatyne: The List goes On...Statues here and thee, all Interceding |
| Re: In Jesus Name, All Knees Bow; In Mary's Name, What Happens? by Nobody: 4:44pm On Jul 16, 2013 |
ktjohnpaul: If you understood the meaning of grace as i outlined and when i used the word "undeserving" then you would catch my drift. |
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