@Almuhandis u name sound like an arabian?are u a christain?

@altheia ,

aletheia:

 ^^You do realize you are describing yourself---engaging in doublespeak as you do.
^^What do you mean by this, you silly defender of all things pastor Chris? Are the scriptures in error? Do they not condemn anyone who teaches that we should not honor our parents.

 This idea of misquoting someone is getting out of hand. If you have followed my posts , I have consistently talking about honouring parents, in close to ten posts. 

Siyanda posted her story clearly and succinctly:
^^
To which you responded thus:
Forgetting that elsewhere your very own words had corroborated her story:

When you get into a mess you still stubbornly look for out to manoeuvre your way .I have been very consistent in my posts. I said the same thing in that old post . And I will still say it,  The prayer that Jesus taught them called the lords prayer is not for mature Christian . Such may be necessary before the holyghost came, Jesus had said that the holyghost will lead us into all truth.right  now we pray by the spirit. The only two ways you can pray the will of God is  by the the Word and by the holyghost. No more. No less.  
 

They do say liars ought to have good memories. You are a liar and deceiver.

that's your escape route , you false brethren. Sheep without shepherd. Why not just humble yourself .

Kay 17:

^^yet you have not addressed certain issues;
Are tithes compulsory?
If so, what are the consequences of default?
Does a born again need to rehearse?

Sorry, if one is a Christian, what is the use of being born again.?

I didn't intend to comment on rhem before. I have said in several thread . The tithes and offering are Gods financial security for his people. It is by faith , even though its not by force , it is a necessity for any wise person. I am a tither and I know the grace I work in through my tithing . Above all things , it is my honour and worship, recognising God as source of my prosperity. I participated in an art exhibition recently with some great painters. In one day I sold 4 paintings . While some " great painters" haven't sold. Why will I not tithe?. The consequences of not tithing is absence of grace that tithing carries. Every obedience to the word carries a blessing. If you obey some , you have benefit of it's grace, if you don't , you loose the benefit it contains. Tithing is also a primary way by which the work of the ministry is supported. It is came through the revelation of God to men of faith before the law came. God officially made it compulsory through the law. Some say I give offering but not tithe, sorry, they go together to support ministers and work of ministry.

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live[ of the things] of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? 14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.



Malachi 3:8
8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

Joagbaje:

I didn't intend to comment on rhem before. I have said in several thread . The tithes and offering are Gods financial security for his people. It is by faith , even though its not by force , it is a necessity for any wise person. I am a tither and I know the grace I work in through my tithing . Above all things , it is my honour and worship, recognising God as source of my prosperity. I participated in an art exhibition recently with some great painters. In one day I sold 4 paintings . While some " great painters" haven't sold. Why will I not tithe?. . . .

Compare:

Seven year old boy sells his painting for £150,000 --- and nothing to do with tithing!

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/295393


Dead Chimpanzee's painting sells for $25,000 while painting by Renoir and Warhol didn't sell at the same exhibition --- and nothing to do with tithing!

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/06/20/entertainment/main703057.shtml

Nice 

siyanda.N:

Hallow everyone! I also left Christ Embassy Randburg under Ose Oyakhilome! Some of the reasons:
1 First Fruit Offering - well every January we were required to give all our salaries for the month of January as first fruit offering. Now what we were never told was "to whom was the church giving its firstfruit offering to" Imagine that nonsense.
2. Tithing - I look after my parents since they are both retired. I give them R3000 a month and my sisters and brothers also give them. Now Ose once preached that if we dont tithe we are CURSED. This hurt me and I went to the leaders of the church to tell them that I cant really give 10% of my salary because I support myu parents, my child, my self, I pay my bond, my car, food, clothing, etc I told them my 10% is going to my parents but I do give R1000 towards tithe, they told me STOP giving your aprents money because it is God's money. That grieved me. I prayed and God told me give as your heart desires!
3. Award Ceremony for Best givers - They hold the year end awards ceremony where people who gave more that others are awarded. hahaha such manipulation. Who does that?? they manipulate people to make sure they give during the year so they can also get those awards. You should see people who cant afford to give so much made feel useless.
4. Tongues - I attended a service last year where Ose was preaching on tongues, telling people that they need to "practise" speaking in tongues. She started making some sounds telling people how to speak in tongues. She then told the whole church to stand up and speak in tongues. Now, 5 minutes after they stopped. And Ose called for people who want to be born again, hahaha the same people she was teaching to speak in tongues 5 minutes earlier  GOT UP! I realised that this church is a joke.
6. Pastor Chris - I had a cd from Pastor Chris teaching people to NOT PRAY like OLD christians who prayed "God if its your will let it be" I thought to myself WHAT ? Jesus taught His disciples to pray "Your will be Done" and this Chris is telling people to pray for their OWN will.
7. Healing School - I never understood what went on there! People who were sick on the floor were placed right at the back and people who were quiet well to me were put on stretchers, wheelchairs and were prayed for.
8. They never preached about REPENTANCE never!! Fornication and wordliness in that church!!! and they would speak in tongues whilst they live in with boyfriends and drink themselves sick. But the Ose pays no attention to it
Most of my friends left and I pray for some that are still trapped in that CULT to be released in the Name of Jesus.
If you want more info send me email.

@siyanda.N
Its quite an interesting post you've put up here; I had wanted to sit this one out but again I'm compelled to comment. I'm sure the likes of Joagbaje may have thought I was trying to use a new ID to bring up this thread again, but I can see he read your posts from other threads; at least thats proof enough that you are in SA and that you know what you are saying. I'm happy that more and more people are getting to know the truth and walking out of these grand deception masquerading as the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I may not completely agree with your outburst of hatred against Nigerians in diaspora (as seen from your posts on other threads) but I would rather not talk about that on this thread.

@Kay 17

Kay 17:

^^yet you have not addressed certain issues;
Are tithes compulsory?
If so, what are the consequences of default?

I didn't intend to comment on rhem before. I have said in several thread . The tithes and offering are Gods financial security for his people. It is by faith , even though its not by force , it is a necessity for any wise person. I am a tither and I know the grace I work in through my tithing . Above all things , it is my honour and worship, recognising God as source of my prosperity. I participated in an art exhibition recently with some great painters. In one day I sold 4 paintings . While some " great painters" haven't sold. Why will I not tithe?. The consequences of not tithing is absence of grace that tithing carries. Every obedience to the word carries a blessing. If you obey some , you have benefit of it's grace, if you don't , you loose the benefit it contains.  Tithing is also a primary way by which the work of the ministry is supported.  It is came through the revelation of God to men of faith before the law came. God officially made it compulsory through the law. Some say I give offering but not tithe, sorry, they go together to support ministers and work of ministry.

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live[ of the things] of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? 14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.
     
Malachi 3:8
8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

Does a born again need to rehearse

Yes , but it depends on what you want to rehearse, but if it's spiritual thing, you don't need to rehearse. You yield to the holy spirit.

Sorry, if one is a Christian, what is the use of being born again.?

Being born again is to receive the life of God on the inside and become partakers of his divine nature. Without this , every man is destined for eternal damnation in lake of fire.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-413360.0.html

Joagbaje:

@Kay 17

I didn't intend to comment on rhem before. I have said in several thread . The tithes and offering are Gods financial security for his people. It is by faith , even though its not by force , it is a necessity for any wise person. I am a tither and I know the grace I work in through my tithing . Above all things , it is my honour and worship, recognising God as source of my prosperity. I participated in an art exhibition recently with some great painters. In one day I sold 4 paintings . While some " great painters" haven't sold. Why will I not tithe?. The consequences of not tithing is absence of grace that tithing carries. Every obedience to the word carries a blessing. If you obey some , you have benefit of it's grace, if you don't , you loose the benefit it contains.  Tithing is also a primary way by which the work of the ministry is supported.  It is came through the revelation of God to men of faith before the law came. God officially made it compulsory through the law. Some say I give offering but not tithe, sorry, they go together to support ministers and work of ministry.

OMG! this is very comical, I cant help but feel so sorry for your ignorance. I am a successful businessman and I seal major deals every month in millions; I DO NOT TITHE!!

Seven year old boy sells his painting for £150,000 --- and nothing to do with tithing!

Mr Enigma,
You can't be comparing me with the boy, Well he sold one , I sold four. But that's not the issue, I had with me artists that are known more internationally , and to have 4 works sold and some of them still came back home with unsold work is a miracle for me. So look at it in that perspective.

There are miraculous things that have been happening to me through my givings, I can't tell them all. A couple gave me a brand new prado jeep, fresh from factory, i didn't ask them for it. They said God told them to give me. Guess what ? I only used it for a year I gave it as a seed this year , I have a principle not to use a car for more than two years. I can't tell all the mind blowing strange things that I experience through giving.

^^^ How much did you sell your four? In any event the boy didn't just sell one; he has been selling paintings consistently! You have his name from my earlier post - google it.

And what about the dead chimpazee ---- did your four paintings sell for more than his sold for?

Remember neither of these two artists are/were involved in this "tithing" of a thing!

SirJohn:

OMG! this is very comical, I cant help but feel so sorry for your ignorance. I am a successful businessman and I seal major deals every month in millions; I DO NOT TITHE!!

Sir John , don't start this, I may back off here because I don't want to sound offensive. But the wicked can prosper for a reason according to scriptures . I haven't said you're wicked . But there are biblical laws principles. But I will warn you not to boast against God. The grace of your good deed in time past and mercy may still be working for you. Couple with how you have followed God from childhood. He grace may have been expanded to cover your error till God brings you out of your distraction .

Joagbaje:

Mr Enigma,
You can't be comparing me with the boy, Well he sold one , I sold four. But that's not the issue, I had with me artists that are known more internationally , and to have 4 works sold and some of them still came back home with unsold work  is a miracle for me. So look at it in that perspective.

There are miraculous things that have been happening to me through my givings, I can't tell them all. A couple gave me a brand new prado jeep, fresh from factory, i didn't ask them for it. They said God told them to give me. Guess what ? I only used it for a year I gave it as a seed this year , I have a principle not to use a car for more than two years. I can't tell all the mind blowing strange things that I experience through giving.  

Petty Minds, small minds!
theres a lot going on out there in the world you know; you sit in your little enclave in yenogoa and think you've seen big things? wake up bro!

Joagbaje:

Sir John , don't start this, I may back off here because I don't want to sound offensive. But the wicked can prosper for a reason according to scriptures . I haven't said you're wicked . But there are biblical laws principles. But I will warn you not to boast against God. The grace of your good deed in time past and mercy may still be working for you. Couple with how you have followed God from childhood. He grace may have been expanded to cover your error till God brings you out of your distraction .

I have said this before and I will say it again: Diligence, honesty and hard work are the sure foundations of wealth not tithing, offering, partnership or , any such form of extortion.
But then on the other hand, these forms of giving does make rich yes it only enriches the collectors i.e the likes of Mr Chris and Joagbaje who prey on unsuspecting followers with sugarcoated lies.

SirJohn:

I have said this before and I will say it again: Diligence, honesty and hard work are the sure foundations of wealth not tithing, offering, partnership or , any such form of extortion.
But then on the other hand, these forms of giving does make rich yes it only enriches the collectors i.e the likes of Mr Chris and Joagbaje who prey on unsuspecting followers with sugarcoated lies.

I laugh, I believe Jesus and Paul have some explanation to do for their extotions. If that's what you call it

Luke 8:3
3 Joanna, whose husband Chusa was Herod's administrator; Susanna; and many other women. They provided financial support for Jesus and his disciples.

Galatians 6:6-7
6 Anyone who receives instruction in the word must share all good things with his instructor.
7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.

It is the giver that benefits my dear friend, not the receiver. Read the bible well.

Acts 20:35
35 ----- and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

Joagbaje:

I laugh, I believe Jesus and Paul have some explanation to do for their extotions. If that's what you call it

Luke 8:3
3 Joanna, whose husband Chusa was Herod's administrator; Susanna; and many other women. They provided financial support for Jesus and his disciples.

Galatians 6:6-7
6 Anyone who receives instruction in the word must share all good things with his instructor.
7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.

It is the giver that benefits my dear friend, not the receiver. Read the bible well.

Acts 20:35
35 ----- and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

Dont try to hide behind bible passages young man, you and your mentor are not anywhere close to Paul and Jesus. Deal with it!

God still heals today, and that is without doubt. But he does it by His Own Will. Not cos someone blew air at somebody and asked him to "receive"!

The bone of contention here is how you have trivialized the miraculous healing power of God and brought it to a level where people try to buy their way in, and revert Glory to a man. In an attempt to keep up the magic, you manufacture anecdotal evidence and pay fake-backside gangsters to come and lie that they got healed. Its a tower of babel that you build, and soon everything crashes like a pile of cards.

How do I know God heals? I was born dumb. I was dumb till I was 4 years old. My mother, now late, used to wake me up at midnight, take me to her room and pray hotly for one or two hours depending on how passionate she felt. All i could do was hum and make guttural sounds, I dont think I had faith as such in God but I had hopes to talk so I would hum Amen to the prayers even though I slept off many times. Well God did it. My evidence? Besides my excellent pre-school grades on my report sheet at the Sabol school for the deaf and dumb, my vague memories of hand sign language, and my family, ENT medical reports (Ear nose and throat) and family doctors & friends, I have little evidence.

If I got healed of dumbness at an age when I was wiser, I would chase the evidence like a bloodhound, but I was just 4! So all these grown people who cant step to the plate with valid evidence, I wonder what excuse they have. Then many of my friends today would call me talkative.

Speaking of being talkative, I started talking but I was wheezing cos I used to be asthmatic too as a kid. While still dumb, I used to faint many times cos I couldnt even wheeze, couldnt really gasp for air. A dumb asthmatic is a terrible combo. So i started talking but if you introduce Dust, smoke, pollen grains, any tiny particles and Im in trouble. Almost died many times. Bronchial asthma, "asthma" for which medicine has no cure, just maintenance. My mother's prayer was simple, she said to God, You gave (insert my name here) his speech. Heal him on the inside too. Guess what? He did too.

The greatest lesson here is that my mother hardly even knew God. She had a need and she wept to God like no man's business. She knew him eventually, and she's with him now. Lesson: it does not take a man of God for you to get anything from God. All it takes is faith. Heartward, deep faith.

#Okbye

ETA: emphasis in bold text and in red.

Amen InesQor, you are very blessed and may the faithful departed rest in peace and rise in glory.

InesQor:

The greatest lesson here is that my mother hardly even knew God. She had a need and she wept to God like no man's business. She knew him eventually, and she's with him now. Lesson: it does not take a man of God for you to get anything from God. All it takes is faith. Heartward, deep faith.

#Okbye

^I was almost in tears reading your testimony. May God be praised. God bless you my brother.

God bless you both, Enigma and Aletheia.

I give God thanks that both of you have yielded yourself to God to keep using you here.

The darker the night, the brighter the light!

InesQor:

The bone of contention here is how you have trivialized the miraculous healing power of God and brought it to a level where people try to buy their way in, and revert Glory to a man. In an attempt to keep up the magic, you manufacture anecdotal evidence and pay fake-backside gangsters to come and lie that they got healed. Its a tower of babel that you build, and soon everything crashes like a pile of cards.

As much as you meant well ,  may God forgive your blasphemy, who would go and get gangsters to pretend for healing. It is unnecessary . If a man will use gangsters to give false testimony, what will now happen to the souls of the gangsters will they believe in God ever again ?.

We have 2 kinds of healings .1, through the gifts of healing 2,by faith . So some heal by the healing gift and others by prayer of faith.

Please watch these 2 videos open heartedly


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpajHwwuzig&feature=youtube_gdata_player


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIoURmoCn-o&feature=related

@Joagbaje:

Baba is this supposed to be a compare-and-contrast exercise between T.B. Joshua and Chris Oyakhilome? The methods may be different, but until real non-anecdotal evidence is produced, there is basically no difference between this and magical showmanship in either case!

Blasphemy? What BLASPHEMY? Blasphemy is deifying your pastor as the one who worked out a healing. . . and making a monetary business out of healing.

InesQor:

@Joagbaje:

Baba is this supposed to be a compare-and-contrast exercise between T.B. Joshua and Chris Oyakhilome? The methods may be different, but until real non-anecdotal evidence is produced, there is basically no difference between this and magical showmanship in either case!

What evidence do you need than a live undoctored  service? Is it Paper and documents? If you can't believe live miracle how will you believe paper? Your skeptism will never be satisfied.

Blasphemy? What BLASPHEMY? Blasphemy is deifying your pastor as the one who worked out a healing. . . and making a monetary business out of healing.

And what do you mean by making monetary business out of healing? Do they pay for healing? 

Don't just throw words, if you are a Christian , you should seek truth. You claim God only do healing at his will.meaning we don't have a say. This is contrary to what jesus taught. About the church.
There are men God has anointed for healings and miracles. The point is for you to see that miracles are not faked . They are real. We may not have 100% result. If we have 80% today we thank God for it. Tomorrow we will have 90. We are still growing and learning. 

Pastor chris is not trying to be superstar among Christians , but rather wants every Christians to do the same thing that Jesus had died for , we ought to work in the supernatural . Every one of us. Those who have ope heartedly follow these teaching like some of us have been working miracles as well at our own level of grace. Glory to God!

Mark 16:17-18
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

@Joagbaje: I am deciding not to respond. Or at least, respond yet. Cheers.

SirJohn:

Dont try to hide behind bible passages young man, you and your mentor are not anywhere close to Paul and Jesus. Deal with it!

Dude , is this Another escape from reality of the word? Where did you find us different from christ and Paul in the context of this discussion. In what bible. Do you want to write another bible dude?

@Inesqor:

Now THAT, is a testimony; not a mish mash of nonsense peddled by a coalition of crooks and never do wells seeking a pay-off and masquerading as affiliated to God. Now that missed appointment becomes really painful

@Joagbaje:

Go read of Mr Tortoise.

And what happened to tortoise? ----

^^ His disgrace came eventually bet on it.

@nuclearboy: Thanks sir The Immortal, Invisible, Only-Wise God be praised!

We can schedule (another) one. . . hmm. . . I know I've said that before. But please believe we will. And really soon too.

Hardly come near this thread, guess InesQor's testimony 'drew' me. Thank God for the miracle. That Brook video too catch mi eye, smooth

Lol thanks, Image123. I love that musical video. I have played it so often it's like I know each and every aspect of it. Lol.

Funny enough I saw it for the first time like a week ago!

Wonderful message too.

[center]"Shadowfeet"

Walking,stumbling on these shadowfeet
toward home,a land that i've never seen
I am changing: less and less asleep
made of different stuff than when i began
and i have sensed it all along
fast approaching is the day

[CHORUS]
when the world has fallen out from under me
I'll be found in you, still standing
when the sky rolls up and mountains fall on their knees
when time and space are through
I'll be found in you

There's distraction buzzing in my head
saying "in the shadows it's easier to stay"
but I've heard rumours of true reality
whispers of a well-lit way

[CHORUS]

You make all things new

[CHORUS]

[CHORUS 2]
When the world has fallen out from under me
I'll be found in you, still standing
Every fear and accusation under my feet
when time and space are through
I'll be found in you [/center]

@Joagbaje: Ok Im back. I was very angry yesterday at your reply so if I replied you, I wont have made a useful post.

The videos mean nothing. The way it should work is the Biblical pattern: there was a man/woman, everybody around them knew their problem. God healed them. Here is what they had. Here's what they have now. Spot the difference. Simple! Someone on TV or even a live show who gets "healed" may as well be an actor or actress. Yes, I believe in documented reports. You know why? If the problem concerned you, you would have gone to places! Several physicians wont produce shady details at the same time. Doctors that have at least completed the housemanship program, know their onions!

Are you familiar with the term "Advanced Fee Fraud"? When you ask someone to sow a seed to guarantee their healing, while simultaneously signing a Caveat Emptor saying they cant sue if it fails, then you have defrauded such a person. Thats social engineering ("Yahoo yahoo runs"! The more subtle "healers" will give myriads of examples about those for whom it worked. Details will be glossed over. The buyer gets comfortable and believes he/she is ready to exercise faith. Then the final phase is the placebo and/or fear factor phase. Either the buyer keeps dying inside, thinking its their faith that is weak but they are actually healed; or else they are scared to say it didnt work cos that would make them look faithless, or that would make the "healer" look fake and they dont want to incur God's wrath. So they live in falsehood. We say, come forward with evidence. They cant. Cos there's none. They are either wallowing in a placebo or else they are scared of what people will say. (I believe Its the same reason some people make a conscious effort to "fall under the annoying-thing" when they should rather have the anointing of God coursing through them). There was nobody Jesus healed who wasnt ready to download every detail. Why? It was real.

Did it ever strike you that some of the diseases Jesus healed then, had no herbal or orthodox medical cure at the time? Some others transcended the physical realms and influenced the patient's health. I think it is folly when God has produced some people today with answers in medicine and one chooses to sit tight and believe it is faithless to use medicine but they can send that money to an MOG. Or, as they have called themselves, a god. For the healing miracles that have medical solutions, there is an alternative path to this pattern. BUT its still by faith! You need faith to take drugs and get well cos it doesnt work for everybody! God sees your faith and does His part of the agreement, whether you chewed leaves with Quinine, took Chloroquin or prayed it out. Its your faith He deals with!

I never said we have no part to play. When I said God heals by His Will, I meant in dealing with us He establishes a platform, a framework. When you agree with God by faith you step onto that platform and BUILD upon it. You wont start extending the platform to make it wider. My analogy there might be a riot, my point is that there are people who God has willed in a certain circumstance to take orthodox medicine. Because in the process, a new cure will be found. If that is part of the plan and this person goes to a church where he believes his seed will fetch him healing, he has missed it and put his trust in a man.

The fundamental question that comes before all of this is: what is the person's relationship with God and how ready are they? Cos when its down to brass tacks, its between that person and God, as long as the person is a free agent who understands the import of the healing. Any MOG cannot tell God what to do if it isnt according to the plan. The person to be healed must align with God. Its like being in a heavily perfumed room for a while. You will definitely leave with the scent strongly infused in your clothing! If you have a personal relationship with God, he will watch out for those details. Thats what a father does. But for those who dont, it is up to you to lead them to God, they start taking steps, even if baby steps, in God & God will do the rest (rather than asking them to exercise faith and make a seed as evidence of their faith. Faith in who or what?). Of what use is a healed sinner to the Kingdom?

, Now i don't OVERSTAND what this whole discussion is about!, , what are you people driving at really?, 'the truth about christ embassy healing school',

i am not a member of believer's loveworld but with which name does the man uses in healing people?, come off all this arguments and lets advance the gospel, 650million muslims are available worldwide to reach out to, i am talking about people that are blindfolded by a 'religion' (and xtianity is not a religion), people that are controlled and trapped by just one man's ideology and if we are to do what Christ says we should do,reach out to them, you guys are here saying crapsssssss,