₦airaland Forum

Mad_Max:
I was shocked when I was first given an inkling that tithing isn't sound, New Testament-wise. I'D been conditioned to believe I had to pay tithe or God wouldn't bless me. It simply isn't true. Give what comes from your heart to give, what you are absolutely willing and perfectly happy to give, and not only to churches but to others as well, who need help. We're not required to tithe.

A lie repeated too often assumes the cloak of truth and this is what is happening. The deception about tithes as been drummed in to most christians(especially pentecostals) for years through anecdotes and conjectures that don't have sound biblical basis by the quoting out of context of a few bible verses especially malachi 3:10. Most of them would even tell you they would rather believe this lie than to investigate the bible properly to see what God really says about tithes for themselves. Can you imagine the tithes these pastors covet so much the same bible says you can use to drink wine / beer and other alcoholic drinks deuteronomy 14: 22-29

It is a pity that alot of nigerians do not understand the God they claim to follow.
How many of you claiming that tithe is necessary can tell me where Jesus collected tithe from anybody?

@KunleOshoh to be frank with you, i have following you up on many religious issues and i have seem that you are one person that is open to knowledge.
Alot of us do not understand what Jesus came to do.
If the Law of Moses was the Law of Jesus, then, there is no need for Jesus coming. Law of Moses was faulty that why Jesus came to set aside.

Please let go beyond what we are taught in church. Please let us go back to the Bible to the Bible

There is a difference between the old testament and the new testament. Except you believe this, you are going to missing up issues

You see, when it comes to religion, nigerians stop thinking.
Anybody claiming that God commands christain to pay tithe should please read the Bible with an open mind. The law of Moses is not for Christains please note this otherwise you are telling us that as christains too we could divorce our wives and give them divorce letters. It is there in the Law of Moses.

If the law of Moses was good enough, Why did Jesus come.

Jesus came to set aside the Law of and to Start a new and a better Law which is not based on tithe and animal sacrifices. But based on HIS BLOOD.

@ threader, TO TITHE

@all
A lie repeated to often, hmmm, assumes the cloak of truth, Gee sounds like most of christianity to me. I thought Christianity was to be christ like, who was Jesus Christ self? Er, From what I read about him he was a very humble man and really nice and simple without all this attachment to absolutely rubbish practices. Lets face it all this tithe and second and third and fourth offering and harvest and this and that boil down to the insatiable hunger of almost all preachers to fleece these believers who are nothing but vulnerable people looking to give their life meaning.
I am sure while the people are trooping out to pay the pastor's own chorus would be "My Maga don pay Shout alleluia".
Chei! I believe during the time of Jesus there were chariots and exotic ways of travelling but the man did not even bother now imagine Oyedepo with "private" jet na you wan try and Efcc dey find yahoo boys up and down when the main chairman them dey for our front.
Abeg any of una hear the beef between Pastor Ayoand benny hinn, lol imagine after big holy ghost crusade and benny hinn don fall many Okpukpuru hand dem no gree give the guy him cut of the offering, lol the guy no even code the yahoozee dance step wey all the ushers dey throway during offering.
Anyway na where man dey work na im if dey chop, dat na why dem call am "Workchop" lol.
Seriously its a good thing this has come up abeg read bible do your research by yourself then anything you believe na im go work for you.
Imagine as I dey type this dem dey call for 4th offering for church lol dem no go kill me, be like I get one 5 naira for my pocket at least make I contribute who know maybe na the new Range Rover the guy wan buy at least my "pepper" go dey the motor.

Tithing is not a new testament commandment. Jesus never collect or commands us to collect tithe. I ama christain and not judiasm.

@seun, our people do not read read the bible, they only go to church.

Jesus never made any mistake when He said you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.

We are christain because we believe in Jesus and not moses.

I do not pay tithe because Jesus did not command me to do so.

Pay tithe to who. Levites.
Who are the Leveites when Jesus had made all of us priests.

Also in the old testament it was never money but land produce or livestoacks that was tithe. Read your bible and show me where money was used as tithe none.

Read Deutronomy

Yes christain should pay tithe

kunle which church do u attend?

The church i attend as nothing to do with this, i rely on the scripturefor inspiration and not what my pastor or church tells me. If you must know tithing is preached in my church but it is still wrong and i tell any body that cares to listen, there is too much biblical evidence that confirms to me that tithing in churches today is a fraudulent manipulation of scripture. If you want to know more about tithes check out this thread https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-113108.0.html enjoy

sunyx:
I do not pay tithe because Jesus did not command me to do so.

I'm sure there are a whole lot of things that you do - and yet for which Jesus did not "command" you.

Such topics are interesting - and we all have our various understandings and persuasions about them. But to argue that Jesus did not "command" tithing at any point (or even speak about it) only reveals that such brethren have not carefully read what He did say about the subject.

Hebrews 7: 18 describes tithing as a weak, useless and unprofitable law

It can only get more interesting.

My friends went into a frenzy, calling me, texting me

saying they are praying for me, asking me to read Malachi

When i told them the Truth about Tithing.

i sent one a message to read Leviticus, and she didnt get.

i told her i was also praying for her and everyone esle who is still

caught in the web of deceit.

you need new friends

KunleOshob:
Hebrews 7: 18 describes tithing as a weak, useless and unprofitable law

Hebrews 7:8 says 'but there He receives them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth'.

pilgrim.1:
Hebrews 7:8 says 'but there He receives them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth'.

he said hebrews 7;18 not 7;8

@helpee,

helpee:
he said hebrews 7;18 not 7;8

Please grow up - I wasn't trying to correct his quote of Heb. 7:18 by quoting ch. 7:8 - they are two different things.

(1) Heb. 7:18 - "For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before. ." etc.

(2) Heb. 7:8   - "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, . ." etc.

Just because you can't make out the difference does not mean you have to force yourself to comment on all my posts. That is just plain childish.

pilgrim.1:
@helpee,

Please grow up - I wasn't trying to correct his quote of Heb. 7:18 by quoting ch. 7:8 - they are two different things.

(1) Heb. 7:18 - "For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before. ." etc.

(2) Heb. 7:8 - "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, . ." etc.

Just because you can't make out the difference does not mean you have to force yourself to comment on all my posts. That is just plain childish.

i can see your frustration building. on the contrary you bundled your ass into my posts
there is nothing fantastic about your post that i will be pursuing
if you care to know, your arguments are usually pretty obvious and when you started with me you thought it was one of those shallow minded you have been showing off to as if you are the only the born again with knowlegde.
ive only tackled you for less than 24hrs and you are getting angry. if you cant survive the heat, too bad. as for me, i am fun.

@helpee,

helpee:
i can see your frustration building. on the contrary you bundled your ass into my posts
there is nothing fantastic about your post that i will be pursuing

I hear. Nothing frustrating about me if you're just too unstettled to reason things through.

helpee:
if you care to know, your arguments are usually pretty obvious and when you started with me you thought it was one of those shallow minded you have been showing off to as if you are the only the born again with knowlegde.

I would rather be shallow than plain accusative and lying against people as your arguments show.

helpee:
ive only tackled you for less than 24hrs and you are getting angry.

Lol. . . try harder. I'm not angry; and if I asked you to look carefully before drawing the wrong inference, how does that translate into anger? And oh, you live to 'tackle' me? What a laugh!

helpee:
if you can't survive the heat, too bad. as for me, i am fun.

Good luck to your self-adulation. I must be too boring for not being too self-congratulatory. Enjoy.

Tithes must be paid only in Jerusalem where the temple is, and it must only be given to a priest of the line of Aaron.
If you can go to Jerusalem and you can locate any priest in the line of Aaron, why not?

And of cause this is the only time you sell your produce and use the money to buy whatever you desire.
Check this!
Deut. 12:6, 7, 11, 12, 17, 18, "And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your TITHES, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flock.

And there, ye shall eat before the Lord your God, and ye shall rejoice in all that ye put your hand unto, ye and your households, wherein the Lord thy God hath blessed thee.

Then there shall be a place which the Lord your God shall choose to cause his name to dwell there; thither shall ye bring all that I command you; your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, your TITHES, and the heave offering of your hand, and all your choice vows which ye vow unto the Lord.

And ye shall rejoice before the Lord your God, YE, and your SONS and your DAUGHTERS, and your MENSERVANTS, and your MAIDSERVANTS, and the LEVITE that is within your gates; forasmuch as he hath no part nor inheritance with you.

You may not eat within thy gates the TITHE of thy corn, or of thy wine, or of thy oil, or the firstlings of thy herds or of the flocks, nor any of thy vows which thou vow, nor thy freewill offerings, or heave offering of your hand: But YOU MUST EAT THEM before the Lord thy God in the place which the Lord thy God shall choose, "

i have never believed in this tithe of a thing.tithing was among the laws handed by moses during the old covenant.that covenant is now dead. we no longer live by the law,but by grace .jesus abolished he law by dying on the cross.

chukwudi44:
i have never believed in this tithe of a thing.tithing was among the laws handed by moses during the old covenant.that covenant is now dead. we no longer live by the law,but by grace .jesus abolished he law by dying on the cross.

Let's even imagine the law was still in existence, biblical tithing was food meant to be eaten in God's presence. Money was never tithable cos it couldn't be eaten. Tithing as we have it today is at best a manipulation of the scripture, but in reality it is just a scam.

The sermon last sunday in my church was on tithing and my pastor repeated these often told lies about tithes, i felt so disappointed and betrayed i walked out of the church during the service.

2) Heb. 7:8 - "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, . ." etc.

AMP bible version will tell that's Melchizedek not Jesus:

8Furthermore, here [in the Levitical priesthood] tithes are received by men who are subject to death; while there [in the case of Melchizedek], they are received by one of whom it is testified that he lives [perpetually].

The sermon last sunday in my church was on tithing and my pastor repeated these often told lies about tithes, i felt so disappointed and betrayed i walked out of the church during the service.

Kunle, is there a church not so keen to this type of sermon one can be attending, I like giving but the way pastors preach tithes these days is discouraging

sarmy:
2) Heb. 7:8 - "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, . ." etc.

AMP bible version will tell that's Melchizedek not Jesus:

8Furthermore, here [in the Levitical priesthood] tithes are received by men who are subject to death; while there [in the case of Melchizedek], they are received by one of whom it is testified that he lives [perpetually].

@sarmy,

Thank you for taking the time to highlight Hebrews 7:8 - the very verse so many of us are not so careful to remember when expression aversion to tithes. In the New Testament, God will not force even those who call ourselves His children to do anything - and definitely not even tithing. Does your heart move you to tithe? Give as you are led - He "receives" them, not demand them.

Cheers.

Some scriptures, I think do not support tithing according to the Law esp mal 3:8-10

Bible AMP version

Heb 7:8
5And it is true that those descendants of Levi who are charged with the priestly office are commanded in the Law to take tithes from the people--which means, from their brethren--though these have descended from Abraham.
(Tithe as of the Law of Moses)

11Now if perfection (a perfect fellowship between God and the worshiper) had been attainable by the Levitical priesthood--for under it the people were given the Law--why was it further necessary that there should arise another and different kind of Priest, one after the order of Melchizedek, rather than one appointed after the order and rank of Aaron?
(Jesus came and  replace the Levitical Priesthood)

12For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is of necessity an alteration of the law [concerning the priesthood] as well.
18So a previous physical regulation and command is cancelled because of its weakness and ineffectiveness and uselessness--
   19For the Law never made anything perfect--but instead a better hope is introduced through which we [now] come close to God.

(Priesthood was changed, Law also changed including Tithing)

girl 3:13
13Christ purchased our freedom [redeeming us] from the curse (doom) of the Law [and its condemnation] by [Himself] becoming a curse for us, for it is written [in the Scriptures], Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree (is crucified);(A)

(Jesus has delivered Christians from Mal 3:8-10)

Romans 8:32
32He who did not withhold or spare [even] His own Son but gave Him up for us all, will He not also with Him freely and graciously give us all [other] things?

(God bleses His children freely by His Grace, children of God can give but willingly not by cursing them or through manipulation & fear)

@sarmy,

sarmy:
Some scriptures, I think do not support tithing

I understand - many people imagine so, and we can all bear with one another on our various persuasions. Let's examine a few of them and then ask some salient questions:

sarmy:
Bible AMP version

Heb 7:8
5And it is true that those descendants of Levi who are charged with the priestly office are commanded in the Law to take tithes from the people--which means, from their brethren--though these have descended from Abraham.
(Tithe as of the Law of Moses)

Agreed - that verse is one of those in Hebrews that was dealing with tithes under the Levitical priesthood; however, did you see again that Heb. 7:8 was also highlighting that He "receives" them (tithes) under the Melchizedek priesthood?

sarmy:
19For the Law never made anything perfect--but instead a better hope is introduced through which we [now] come close to God.

God never presented tithing as part of the sacrifices of perfecting anyone - it was rather the gift of His Son that perfects us. When people assume that tithing was the "perfecting" element in that verse, they immediately lose sight of the gist of that chapter. This is why you may have arrived at this inference:

sarmy:
(Priesthood was changed, Law also changed including Tithing)

Ahh - that's where the problem is. Abraham was not under the Law, but he gave tithes to Melchizedek. What Law was binding on Abraham to give tithes of all? That is often the question we all miss when we assume the wrong inference about that chapter in Hebrews.

sarmy:
girl 3:13

That's supposed to be Galatians 3:13. If you spell it as "[color=Black]G[/color]al 3:13", you will find it turns to "girl 3:13". . . just as if you wrote "I'[color=Black]d[/color]" and it becomes "I'D".

sarmy:
(Jesus has delivered CHristians from Mal 3:8-10)

Maybe. But hey, did Jesus also deliver us from Proverbs 3:9-10?

           __________________________________________

              Proverbs 3:9-10
              Honour the LORD with thy substance,
              and with the firstfruits of all thine increase:
              So shall thy barns be filled with plenty,
              and thy presses shall burst out with new wine. "
           __________________________________________

sarmy:
(God bleses His children freely by His Grace)

But that doesn't nullify the admonition to give - and that "giving" of our substance involves tithes which He "receives" in Hebrews 7:8 (cf. this with the giving in 1 Cor. 9:13-14).

Blessings.

Christian giving is free will and not compulsory, unlike tithes which people are being mis-led to believe is compulsory and a precondition for God's blessings. Besides as i stated earlier biblical tithing as nothing to do with money unlike the fraudulent version which is being encouraged today.

Hi @KunleOshob,

KunleOshob:
Christian giving is free will and not compulsory, unlike tithes which people are being mis-led to believe is compulsory and a precondition for God's blessings.

Sometimes we have issues that we oursleves have picked up along the way and use them to suppose that others are misled. An example is on this issue about tithes.

Let's get a few things right:

           (a) under the Levitical priesthood, tithing was by commandment (Heb. 7:5)

           (b) before the Levitical priesthood, Abraham gave tithes to Melchizedek
                without a commandment (Heb. 7:4)

           (c) comparing both events above, it is wrong to always assume that
                tithing was always a matter of commandments (Heb. 7:16)

It seems that the one difficulty people have in seeing the rich instruction in Hebrews is that they often assume by default that tithing was always connected to the Law of the old covenant. My humble question has always been this: under what "LAW" did Abraham give tithes to Melchizedek - the same Melchizedek which did not spring out of Levi? Come to even think of it, we often fail to remember that even Levi gave tithes to Melchizedek - through Abraham (Heb. 7:9)! And that being so, by what "LAW" did Levi pay tithes to melchizedek? The simple answer is that the "LAW" was not even enacted at the time of Abraham's tithing to Melchizedek -

                     ______________________________________________________

                     Deut. 5:2-3

                     The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.
                     The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us,
even us, who are all of us here alive this day.
                     ______________________________________________________


That is one confirmation of the fact that Abraham was not under the "LAW", for it was not unto Abraham that the Mosaic LAW was given. The patriarch Abraham gave tithes unto Melchizedek - even without any Law - and yet, when we get to Hebrews 7, we learn that both Abraham and Levi gave tithes to Melchizedek. The fact that tithing did not begin and stop with the Levitical priesthood is underscored by Hebrews 7:8 - which the AMP version succinctly elucidate:

       (a) "Furthermore, here [in the Levitical priesthood] tithes are received
              by men who are subject to death;

       (b)  while there [in the case of Melchizedek], they are received by one
              of whom it is testified that he lives [perpetually]".


Two positions are contrasted there:

              (a) HERE - Levitical priesthood; and
              (b) THERE - Melchizedek priesthood.

The amazing thing is that even Levi paid tithes to Melchizedek without even the LAW. Does that not ring a bell to us? Let's not be put off by what men have argued back and forth to turn tithing into. The one beautiful thing we see is that in the NT, God does not "command" or "force" or "cajole" anyone to tithe. If the heart is willing, He "receives" them from the tither who knows indeed that tithing preceded the Law. It was by faith Abraham was moved to see something in his day that many of us take for granted, even though we often read Hebrews 7:8.

Regards.

Ahh - that's where the problem is. Abraham was not under the Law, but he gave tithes to Melchizedek. What Law was binding on Abraham to give tithes of all? That is often the question we all miss when we assume the wrong inference about that chapter in Hebrews.
   
@pilgrim 1

  The tithes Abraham gave was a tithe of booty - spoils of war, it was not his income.
And he did not even keep the rest for himself, plus there was nowhere again in the bible that he paid it after that.

pilgrim.1:
The amazing thing is that even Levi paid tithes to Melchizedek without even the LAW. Does that not ring a bell to us? Let's not be put off by what men have argued back and forth to turn tithing into. The one beautiful thing we see is that in the NT, God does not "command" or "force" or "cajole" anyone to tithe. If the heart is willing, He "receives" them from the tither who knows indeed that tithing preceded the Law. It was by faith Abraham was moved to see something in his day that many of us take for granted, even though we often read Hebrews 7:8.

Regards.

I will like to know where the highlighted qoute of yours is in the bible.

@obatoro,

Hi, and thanks for your questions and concerns.

obatoro:
The tithes Abraham gave was a tithe of booty - spoils of war, it was not his income.
And he did not even keep the rest for himself, plus there was nowhere again in the bible that he paid it after that.

Lol, if it was not his, then who did the spoils of war belong to? In any case, your assumptions leaves many many questions unanswered. let me highlight a few of them:

  (a) the excuse that Abraham gave a tithe of the spoils of war does not negate the fact that
       he gave tithes, whether it was tithe of the spoils or anything else;

  (b) the one to whom he gave the tithes also should be of interest to us: Melchizedek was
       the priest of the most high God (Gen. 14:18). A priest would immediately know that it
       was unlawful/unrighteous to give such things to God if He discountenanced them;

   (c) Melchizedek, apart from being a priest, was also significant for the fact of his name -
        both King of righteousness and King of peace (Heb. 7:2) - these two qualities should
        humble us to know that what Abraham offered as tithe was not regarded as either
        unrighteous or unholy;

   (d) let us even assume the idea that spoils of war could not be given as tithes in Abraham's
         case; then the question is this - what infact would Abraham had given to Melchizedek
         when the priest met him (notice, the priest met Abraham, not the other way round)?

   (e) even then, before Abraham there is something which many of us have not realized
        about giving - and that is the assumption that he gave only once, and therefore it
        was not significant! Such an excuse is retired out of argument - for the simple reason
        that the one act of Abraham did two very significant things:

                         (i) it established Melchizedek's pronouncements of blessings upon him
                             Hebrews 7:1 and Gen. 14:19 ("he blessed him"

                        (ii) it covered Levi as well (Heb. 7:9)

If ONE act of Abraham's giving had such a tremendous effect both upon himself and for his unborn generation (Levi), it seems to me that we often miss the weightier issues for mere excuses! Yes, Abraham gave only once - but are we often failing so much in realizing the great significance of that one act of tithes? So, just because he gave once, does that make it any less a TITHE? How frequently would you have to keep giving before you qualify it as "tithe"?

If God says that the one act of Abraham's giving was called "TITHES of ALL" (Genesis 14:20), why are men so driven with excuses to argue as if they fail to see what God calls it in the Bible? Lol, if God says it is TITHES (plural), it is of no significance to argue that Abraham did not repeat the act several times. To argue that way is to miss the most important fact in that event!