annunaki2:


Even your so called quoran is filled with lies, contradictions, errors, inconsistencies and terror inspiring messages. Is it not the same pathetic quoran that says the sun sets in a muddy pool

lol.. talk is cheap.. bring the errors, incosistencies, contradictions out and LOL, lmao.. bring the sun pool too out

true2god:
I beg to disagree bro. You can't do away with the hadith and the sunnah, as a Muslim, when/if they don't fit into your narrative. over 90% of the sharia law, fatwa and Islamic thought are from the hadith and the sunnah of your prophet. The five pillars of Islam, which Muslims hold and religiously promote, are not in the Quran but in the hadith. The number of times you pray in a day is dictated in the hadith, not the Quran. As a Muslim, you can't run away from the hadith, except you want to abandon Islam altogether.

Lemme break it down for you...
Hadith is just the combo of some life history of the prophets, his own ways, his own addition to islam and his teachings(not revelation)
lol... 5 prayers you mean..? go to Quran [Hood 11:114] and surah 30: Al Rum 17

also the pillars of islam are in the quran, the first is in 3:18.. can't remeber the verse of the remaining 4 they are all there...

lfleak:

you hear yourself, u just compared them to modern day journalist... like the one i quoted before... those things you wrote are all false..
read them again yourself, like : A whisper to B that C is mad... how was the whispered word noted..?
yeas that's your perspective because it suite u more isnt it?

Bro, open your mind, don't close it from logical reasoning.

Let's take this scenario. I want to compile a story, or record, about lord lugard. Of course non of us were alive when lord lugard was in existence, nevertheless, I want to compile an 'hadith' about Lord lugard. What will I do, how will I get my information as regards lord lugard?

The first thing I will do is to confirm, from which city lord lugard operated.

The second thing I will do is to try, as much as I can, to know the towns and villages he visited.

The third thing i will do is to research the people who might had had personal encounter with him.

The fourth thing I will do is to visit those places, interview the oldest and elderly people, who might have had personal encounter with Lord lugard. If I find non alive, I will interview their children and grandchildren, who their late parents might have told the story of their encounter with lord lugard.

The fifth thing I will do is to come back home and compile all my findings. This is exactly what Bukhari, Muslims and Ibn majjah did. And this is what you Muslims today call hadith.

Are their some truth in the hadith (sahih)? Yes.

Are their some falsehood in the hadith? Yes.

Are their bias in the hadith? Yes.

Is the hadith 100% reliable? No.

So we can accept the compilers of the hadith as journalist, depending on the angle you look at it from. My calling Bukhari a journalist may sound strange to Muslims, but in the modern context, he is a mere Muslim journalist, notwithstanding his great scholarly work on Islam.

true2god:
The bible asked 'if the foundation is destroyed what shall the righteous do?'

The foundation of Islam is fraught with lies and deceptions and shall it continue. Muslims will be zealous and aggressive in promoting Mohammed's lies and deceptions.

Perfectly said. And their hatred of the Jews actually compounds their problem.

Lucifer inspired religion.

^^^
I think the term 'Muslim historian' will be more appropriate than journalist. Also I am sure the hadith writers had access to written records by eye witnesses and followers of mohamed who individually documented all his atrocities. It won't just have been a case of oral interviews alone.

annunaki2:
^^^
I think the term 'Muslim historian' will be more appropriate than journalist. Also I am sure the hadith writers had access to written records by eye witnesses and followers of mohamed who individually documented all his atrocities. It won't just have been a case of oral interviews alone.

We also have a historian called altabari, I don't know if I get it perfectly. The work of Bukhari is more journalistic because he was going from place to place to source for information about about Mohammed and his sahabas. Bukhari did not write any history about Mohammed or Islam, but only go from place to place to gather information about the sayings and actions of Mohammed which he later compiled as the current hadith.

Ibn Ishaq and altabari can actually be called historians.

true2god:
We also have a historian called altabari, I don't know if I get it perfectly. The work of Bukhari is more journalistic because he was going from place to place to source for information about about Mohammed and his sahabas. Bukhari did not write any history about Mohammed or Islam, but only go from place to place to gather information about the sayings and actions of Mohammed which he later compiled as the current hadith.

Ibn Ishaq and altabari can actually be called historians.

Ok point noted. Given the fact that you are an 'islamic' scholar, I can't doubt any position you take on islamic issues.

annunaki2:


Ok point noted. Given the fact that you are an 'islamic' scholar, I can't doubt any position you take on islamic issues.

Thanks bro. I may not be completely right bro. I will do more research, you might actually be right in your judgement and conclusion.

lfleak:
5 pillars of islam are all in Quran FYI... dont expect me to hump unto that thread... bring them one by one here while I dissolve them..

Bringing the content of that thread here will result to derailing this one. Go there if you truly want to see how barbaric the Quran is.

I believe you've been there and couldn't refute any of the claims, that's why you are using the above tactics.

alBHAGDADI:
Bringing the content of that thread here will result to derailing this one. Go there if you truly want to see how barbaric the Quran is.

I believe you've been there and couldn't refute any of the claims, that's why you are using the above tactics.

am there now...

true2god:
Muhammad orders his son-in-law Ali, to behead Al-Nadr bin al-Harith on page 136.

ibn Ishaq again?.

Remember ifeann did worst in 2015

You notice she's abscent lately. She's quietly studying Islam in Finland. New report came up from that country how many reverted to Islam this year. You never know ifeann might be amongst them

true2god:
Thanks bro. I may not be completely right bro. I will do more research, you might actually be right in your judgement and conclusion.

My broda you be my oga at the top as far as Islamic studies is concerned. I learn a lot from you detailed and incisive write ups. Even the most notorious NL Muslim apologists don't have 10% of your knowledge of Islam.

Empiree:
ibn Ishaq again?.

Remember ifeann did worst in 2015

You notice she's abscent lately. She's quietly studying Islam in Finland. New report came up from that country how many reverted to Islam this year. You never know ifeann might be amongst them

I taught she was studying Islam in Saudi Arabia or Iran. Are you sure she will learn the true wahabi Islam in Finland?

true2god:
I taught she was studying Islam in Saudi Arabia or Iran. Are you sure she will learn the true wahabi Islam in Finland?

**yawn**

annunaki2:


My broda you be my oga at the top as far as Islamic studies is concerned. I learn a lot from you detailed and incisive write ups. Even the most notorious NL Muslim apologists don't have 10% of your knowledge of Islam.

Thanks bro. We are still learning Islam. The further you study Islam, the more you are exposed to Islamic historic atrocities.

Empiree:
ibn Ishaq again?.

Remember ifeann did worst in 2015

You notice she's abscent lately. She's quietly studying Islam in Finland. New report came up from that country how many reverted to Islam this year. You never know ifeann might be amongst them

Do you use stone to clean your pens after urinating?

alBHAGDADI:
Do you use stone to clean your pens after urinating?

As a true Muslim, you must not stand while urinating, according to the apostle of allahh:

Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) said: “Whoever tells you that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to urinate standing up, do not believe him. He only ever used to urinate sitting down.”
Sahih al-Tirmidhi No. 11

Narrated Amr ibn al-'As: AbdurRahman ibn Hasanah reported: I and Amr ibn al-'As went to the Prophet (peace be upon him). He came out with a leather shield (in his hand). He covered himself with it and urinated. Then we said: Look at him. He is urinating as a woman does. The Prophet (peace be upon him), heard this and said: Do you not know what befell a person from amongst Banu Isra'il (the children of Israel)? When urine fell on them, they would cut off the place where the urine fell; but he (that person) forbade them (to do so), and was punished in his grave.
Sunan Abu Dawud 1:22

Empiree:
ibn Ishaq again?.

Remember ifeann did worst in 2015

You notice she's abscent lately. She's quietly studying Islam in Finland. New report came up from that country how many reverted to Islam this year. You never know ifeann might be amongst them

i am still around. i focus my anti jihad efforts in foreign and western forums where i challenge muslims and some foolish Europeans who are pro rapefugees from the middle east. its been far more fun than the noise here in nairaland.

Ifeann:


i am still around. i focus my anti jihad efforts in foreign and western forums where i challenge muslims and some foolish Europeans who are pro rapefugees from the middle east. its been far more fun than the noise here in nairaland.

a screenshot of the challenges?

lfleak:
a screenshot of the challenges?

what am i posting screenshots for
i dont care if you doubt me, it doesnt change what i have done and will continue to do

Ifeann:


what am i posting screenshots for
i dont care if you doubt me, it doesnt change what i have done and will continue to do

lol...

Empiree:
ibn Ishaq again?.

Remember ifeann did worst in 2015

You notice she's abscent lately. She's quietly studying Islam in Finland. New report came up from that country how many reverted to Islam this year. You never know ifeann might be amongst them

Mr lie(nus), I have read the page 321 of Ibn Ishaq sirat-rasul-allah and there is nothing that says he wrote anything about the Arabia prophet in order to sustain himself. The page talked about war booty and how Allah wanted his apostle to share the booty.

In Quran 8:1, allahh wants Mohammed to collect 20% of the war booty while the remaining 80% go to the sahabas.

true2god:
Mr lie(nus), I have read the page 321 of Ibn Ishaq sirat-rasul-allah and there is nothing that says he wrote anything about the Arabia prophet in order to sustain himself. The page talked about war booty and how Allah wanted his apostle to share the booty.

In Quran 8:1, allahh wants Mohammed to collect 20% of the war booty while the remaining 80% go to the sahabas.

It is a serious matter when Muslims started condemning hadiths, the sunnah and the sira all because of the obvious embarrassment most of the writings give about Mohammed's evil and barbaric lifestyle. And ironically, you can't become an Islamic scholar without a great knowledge of the hadith's, especially sahih bukhari and sahih Muslim. You can't become a scholar without studying the sunnah by Ibn majjah or Abu dawood. You can't become an Islamic scholar without studying the life of the Islamic prophet by Ibn Ishaq.

Why are online Muslims deceiving us kafirs by blatantly condemning their own source documents as fake? If Islamic books are fake that means that Islam itself is also fake.

^^^

Sorry,buddy. Islam is not based on stories written by humans. Islam is base on Quran and valid or authentic ahadith. However, any hadith or stories written by anyone that in not in harmony with revelation(Qur'an) is rejected. Qur'an is criterial with which everything is scaled.

Quran does not proclaims virtues of nabi Muhammad(SAW) with tenets of faith or anything else EXCEPT good character.



Indeed in the Messenger of Allah (Muhammad SAW) you have an exalted standard of character to follow for him who hopes in (the Meeting with) Allah and the Last Day and remembers Allah much.

[b]Quran (Surah Al-Ahzab, Verse 21)

So rant all you want

Am also writing a story of Muhammad, my instinct tells me he is a short man... Let me write it down..

I hope true2god will read when am through with it...

If Mohamed is the "exalted standard of character to follow" and what we find about his life in the quran and other Islam's holy books are anything to go by, then no person will be found in Islam's hell.
If Mohamed finds a place with Allah, then Allah has no right to send any other person to his hell.

^^

I dont even understand a thing from your post. Sounds like you speak "anogo"

Empiree:
^^

I dont even understand a thing from your post. Sounds like you speak "anogo"

You need to understand a simple comprehension. What the guy is saying is that Mohammed, going by what th Qur'an and the hadith say about him, can never be a moral example to follow.

true2god:
You need to understand a simple comprehension. What the guy is saying is that Mohammed, going by what th Qur'an and the hadith say about him, can never be a moral example to follow.

My earlier post quoted from Quran sums my point and it stands.

lfleak:
Am also writing a story of Muhammad, my instinct tells me he is a short man... Let me write it down..

I hope true2god will read when am through with it...

Stop making mockery of your prophet. You will be beheaded if you do that in Saudi Arabia. Ibn Ishaq sira-rasul-allahh is the most authentic and widely used biography of Mohammed worldwide, I wonder why Muslims in Nigeria are disassociating themselves from this book. Have you seen a single Saudi Arabian Muslim condemn this book?

Let me digress a bit. The biography of Mohammed by Ibn Hisham was compiled in 833AD.

The hadith of bukhari was compiled in 870AD.

The tasfir was written in 923AD.

Some of what was written in the hadith were copied or lifted from the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Hisham. Why do you reject the works of Ibn Hisham but accept some of the hadith by bukhari, since bukhari palgarized Ibn Hisham'works?

Muslims are very confused about their own sacred and religious documents.

true2god

I wonder why Muslims in Nigeria are disassociating themselves from this book.

why do you disassociate yourselves from Old Testament

Empiree:
^^^

Sorry,buddy. Islam is not based on stories written by humans. Islam is base on Quran and valid or authentic ahadith. However, any hadith or stories written by anyone that in not in harmony with revelation(Qur'an) is rejected. Qur'an is criterial with which everything is scaled.

Quran does not proclaims virtues of nabi Muhammad(SAW) with tenets of faith or anything else EXCEPT good character.



Indeed in the Messenger of Allah (Muhammad SAW) you have an exalted standard of character to follow for him who hopes in (the Meeting with) Allah and the Last Day and remembers Allah much.

[b]Quran (Surah Al-Ahzab, Verse 21)

So rant all you want

Then why did you falsely claimed that Ibn Ishaq said he wrote falsehood about the prophet of Islam in order to sustain himself? You gave me a reference, that is page 321 of Ibn Ishaq sira rasul Allah which turned out to be a lie. Don't you know I have the complete works of Ibn Ishaq on my laptop to confirm any lie you might tell me? Bros respect yourself.

You said Islam is not bases on stories written by human, that is funny. Who wrote the Koran? Angel Gabriel or allahh? Who compiled your so-called hadith? Angel Gabriel or Bukhari? Bros, you know nothing about Islam.

The quran and the hadith, in your house, are written by men, long after the death of your prophet. There was nothing like the Quran when Mohammed was alive. The Qur'an you have at home was compiled by the instruction of uthman, the 3rd khalifa, after he ordered all the surviving sahabas to start penning down what they memorized from the alleged 'revelations' Mohammed received from one entity whom he called allahh. The Quran is the compilation of what the sahabas claimed they hear allahh's messenger got as a revelation and there is many variance of the compilations. Some of the 'revelations' were either forgotten or eaten by goat. See Aisha's testimony below:


Sunan Ibn Majah, Book of Nikah, Hadith # 1934:

Narrated Aisha 'The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times were revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept
under my bed. When the Messenger of Allah (SAWW.) expired and we were preoccupied with his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper."

Sahih Muslim 3422—Amra reported that she heard Aisha discussing fosterage which (makes marriage) unlawful; and she (Aisha) said: There was revealed in the Holy Qur'an ten clear sucklings, and then five clear (sucklings) .

Sahih Muslim 3417—Allah's Apostle said: Being suckled once or twice, or one suckling or two, do not make marriage unlawful.

Sahih Muslim 3421—Aisha reported that it had been revealed in the Holy Qur’an that ten clear sucklings make the marriage unlawful, then it was abrogated by five sucklings and Allah’s Apostle died and it was before that time (found) in the Holy Qur’an (and recited by the Muslims).

If you look at all the above hadith and sunnah, you will discover that, going by Aisha's own words, the revelation of stoning and suckling was not included in the Koran. It is not my word, it is Aisha's own testimony. Who do I believe, with respect to Islam? Your claim or Aisha's testimony?