What rational explanation do you people seek to elicit from these people ?
Fact
1. While i see parents of normal people in cars, on foot and on motorcycles taking their tots to school as i post, i can see their abandoned tots in rags with plastic containers roaming the streets in droves singing and begging for alms- there are millions of such children in various states doing this thing they call a religious rite. They are sent away from home by their parents, some from as young as three, to live in the most abominable conditions. Many of the educated ones(even here on NL) defend this life style claiming it is integral to islam, but ofcourse we know there are no almajiris in the middle east and that the educated ones themselves hope to send their children to boarding schools in Togo.
2. While i see young adolescent boys and girls heading for secondary school in uniforms for either morning or afternoon classes, i see our adolescent hausa friends heading the petrol stations with empty jerricans to profit from the petroleum scarcity we currently experiencing. You see they are the young entrepreneurs of hausa land known as black marketers, and this is probably is their apprenticeship in business management.
Now compare both groups and tell me which of the groups has a far higher tendency to grow and end up a menace to the Nigerian society ?

@citizenY,

citizenY:
@richyblack and co

I am glad you are no more a moderator. I always had a sneaky feeling you had
a horn on your forehead and you have just shown your colours . 

I hope there is nothing wrong with your head. When I was a mod, I never hesitated to express my opinion on any issue, okay. Only one horn? I have seven horns on my forehead, mumu.

Can you please mention one mosque you have visited where such sermons were given?

I don't have to put my hand in fire to know it will burn me. It is a fact that many of those misguided youths in Northern Nigeria are fed hate by clerics who preach in some mosques.

Anyway , not to
digress, Edoyad has already given me a peep into his mindset. This is what
education and literacy is all about. Everyone is mouthing What Uncle Sam.

So, we can't make deductions without Uncle Sam? I hope you're joking.

When you assume the moral high ground and arrogate to yourself all righteousness
with pompous postures that do not carry any weight, then you have a problem.
It is only irrational people that will avoid dialogue when all hostilities end up around a table
sooner or later. I have not been appointed by anybody to intercede on any matter whatsoever.
My aim was to just establish a platform of understanding on the issues at stake by understanding more
what can be done but since this has been rejected, I still thank Edoyad for his tenancity. It means a
lot to hold a view and defend it strongly too.

Finally, I sincerely hope he will not relent in his criticism as that is what makes everyone sit up. The only
regret I will have is not getting him to  suggest solutions. Maybe those solutions will go against his beliefs
or to the advantage of an adversary, but then what can I do?

Perhaps it will be necessary to inform Edoyad that those accused of terrorism today by the Americans- Saddam Hussein,
Bin Ladin, Gaddafi, and many others were once friends of CIA and the United States. By extension, I do not see Edoyad
negotiating with anyone because the figures just do not match and there is no platform for such an exercise.

Too much yarn.

When are we going to see reputable, well-known and influential Northern leaders come out and condemn with no reservation the actions of misguided Muslim bands of marauding murderers scattered all over Northern Nigeria?

How can 'Backward Thinking' people possibly advance?

To advance you need to be forward thinking, Therefore this topic is illogical.

@sunofgod, i'm sorry for creating it then, you living so close ignorance it can slowly grow on you too.

Abu-Maryam:

If you delve, u can figure it axiomatically that all those crisis have no religious basis but recently. I put the blame on our greedy politicians who makes use of religion to benefit themself. Since when did the religion of next person became a threat to your existance? I'm convinced something somewhere is wrong in the system. The gainsaying is to keep perpetrating in thesame name of religiong. thus, that does not yet become a reason for me to be defarming and slandering your faith.

I would love to tell you that I buy the argument you give here for this but I can't. The inquisition was politically motivated as well, but RELIGION was used. To this day religion still holds the blame, and rightfully so, because religious minded people claimed they were above it and ought to be, but they did not exhibit this claim of theirs. People decided they had to be held responsible and so they were. That is the way it usually works, and should in this case.

You ask since when did the religion of the next door man become a threat to my existence, and I answer, since the Islamic up north took it upon themselves to KILL those who are not of their belief; since fundamentalists decided they had a right to take my life just because they could. I am sorry but it has gone too far and people, even I, are worried. We tried to turn a blind eye to all this for some time now but it is we cannot continue to deny the reality of things. These elements are a problem, and the elements we speak of claim to be of the Islamic faith.

That the system is wrong is no reason for a particular group, any group, to take it on itself to decide who lives and who dies. Completely unacceptable! You seem more focused on those who are, in their frustration, according to you, slandering your faith, than you are in bringing down those who have perpetrated these acts against their fellow humans and neighbors. Are those who are perpetrating these atrocities not themselves slandering your faith in the worst way? What are you doing about it? Isn’t the fact that they spend innocent blood in their acts worse testimony to your faith than the acts of those on Nairaland posting translations you do not agree with?

I believe another pillar of development or advancement as a people is the ability to critically assess ourselves or be introspective. On NL we constantly hear people from various parts of the country/world criticize propositions/actions put forward/done by people of similar affiliations or inclinations but that is totally lacking in that community.
I'll give a quick example with state governors, who has ever heard a person of hausa origins criticise the dismal performance of a hausa state or governor something which is common place on NL? It may have happened but i'm yet to see it. How can you convince someone from another part of the country that you are concur when we talk of improving this contraption of ours ?
If there were any doubts in my mind as to whether what i believed was prejudiced, the religious riots(just one of many) and reactions from the almajiris has caused the doubt dissipate. They are definitely not on my page.

When they drop their plans for Islamic hegemony, then may be we may listen to their crap

I have actually gone beyond ethno-religious debates on Nairaland politics section and I prefer to take a siddon look these days and do more of reading than engaging in long, often overflogged debates, while just coming out, once in a while of course, to condemn the condemnable, commend the commendable or proffer way forward where I haver idea, but I came across this post by a fellow, Richyblack, on page 4 of this thread, and I dug into my archives of articles to supply him something from Sanusi

There are Imams in Mosques that preach the hatred that encourages this zombie mentality, however, the Northern elite do not seem to be doing anything to deal with these hate-mongering clerics.

When will I read/see a Northern elite, like Rilwanu Lukman or Lamido Sanusi, publicly condemn the specific clerics (by name) that preach that killing Christians is good for Islam. Will I ever see Northern elites/elders give a press conference addressed to those misguided youths littered all around Northern Nigeria, that picking up a machete, running through the street, looking for a Christian teenage girl to despoil and behead, is what savage barbarians do?

 
Richie,
Sanusi had this to say, amongst other lacerative condemnations, in an article he wrote in March 2004 titled MUSLIM LEADERS AND THE MYTH OF MARGINALIZATION

The problem of religious conflict and parochialism  bedevils the north. Of course it is not the only problem, which is why a unified northern forum must address the common problems faced by all northern people. The north suffers from the neglect of agricultural production, the lack of proper access of cash-crop farmers to the international market, the collapse of industry, the debilitation of its infra-structure, lack of alternative source of power to hydro-electricity, among others. Most of all the north suffers from the general massification of its population that is to say, its collective subjection to the intense and deliberate processes of qualitative leveling for the purpose of quantitative maximization. As a result of this, politicians and religious demagogues and fanatics have a ready army of uneducated, unemployed northerners willing to participate in bloody riots and attend rallies where emotional inanities pass for patriotic leadership.

So now, have you 'read/seen a northern elite speak the clerics'?

Need full article? Send a mail to jarusnairaland@yahoo.com

@Jarus you know we know ourselves from that other place where we really reveal our innermost selves. I've read that Sanusi dissertation he presented at Arewa house myself, but can you really address problems by presentation of papers at symposiums and conferences ?
Is there anything more infuriating than one's rights being taken for granted especially when it comes to religious matters ? of course they say It's the tonic of the mass. Have you ever been in a bus travelling on a four hour journey only for the driver to stop in middle of no where, slip out and tell the passengers while walking away It's time for his prayers ? Secondly i believe the constitution clearly seperates state from religion, but i guess building mosques in government premises doesn't violate that law, or what do you say ? Many of these things occur and every one Let's it pass for the sake of peace; but when individuals who have, to all intents and purposes never known the love of a mother from growing on the streets attack sons, daughters, cousins etc of people who have invested life and money to develop their wards with BOKO, what do you think the reaction to such a loss would be ?

jarus

Richie,
Sanusi had this to say, amongst other lacerative condemnations, in an article he wrote in March 2004 titled MUSLIM LEADERS AND THE MYTH OF MARGINALIZATION

The problem of religious conflict and parochialism  bedevils the north. Of course it is not the only problem, which is why a unified northern forum must address the common problems faced by all northern people. The north suffers from the neglect of agricultural production, the lack of proper access of cash-crop farmers to the international market, the collapse of industry, the debilitation of its infra-structure, lack of alternative source of power to hydro-electricity, among others. Most of all the north suffers from the general massification of its population that is to say, its collective subjection to the intense and deliberate processes of qualitative leveling for the purpose of quantitative maximization. As a result of this, politicians and religious demagogues and fanatics have a ready army of uneducated, unemployed northerners willing to participate in bloody riots and attend rallies where emotional inanities pass for patriotic leadership.

NOT GOOD ENOUGH

there are countries with more deprivation than in the north; the diference here is u will never see them act like chimps

the north got serious class A wahala need to be addressed just as the niger-delta; kidnapping in east is dealt with

Jarus:

I have actually gone beyond ethno-religious debates on Nairaland politics section and I prefer to take a siddon look these days and do more of reading than engaging in long, often overflogged debates, while just coming out, once in a while of course, to condemn the condemnable, commend the commendable or proffer way forward where I haver idea, but I came across this post by a fellow, Richyblack, on page 4 of this thread, and I dug into my archives of articles to supply him something from Sanusi
 
Richie,
Sanusi had this to say, amongst other lacerative condemnations, in an article he wrote in March 2004 titled MUSLIM LEADERS AND THE MYTH OF MARGINALIZATION

The problem of religious conflict and parochialism  bedevils the north. Of course it is not the only problem, which is why a unified northern forum must address the common problems faced by all northern people. The north suffers from the neglect of agricultural production, the lack of proper access of cash-crop farmers to the international market, the collapse of industry, the debilitation of its infra-structure, lack of alternative source of power to hydro-electricity, among others. Most of all the north suffers from the general massification of its population that is to say, its collective subjection to the intense and deliberate processes of qualitative leveling for the purpose of quantitative maximization. As a result of this, politicians and religious demagogues and fanatics have a ready army of uneducated, unemployed northerners willing to participate in bloody riots and attend rallies where emotional inanities pass for patriotic leadership.

So now, have you 'read/seen a northern elite speak the clerics'?

Need full article? Send a mail to jarusnairaland@yahoo.com

Jarus,

Thanks, that was a good statement by Sanusi.

Speaking out against something is not taking action against it. How many times have you seen a mother censor her son in front of guests only for her to hiss and roll eyes after they exit her front door. The staggering number of almajiris on the roads; the deepening level of poverty; the misconception that violence is a monopoly owned by his people; religious sermons of hate telling people that others are the cause of their problems, all these are just part of the fodder that religious intolerance/violence thrives on.

It will be easier for a pregnant camel to pass through the eye of the needle than for Hausas to be Advanced, cos they dont really want it.

RichyBlacK:

Jarus,

Thanks, that was a good statement by Sanusi.

Statements at conferences are not enough.

What is required is for Muslim leaders to condemn these killings IN ALLAH's NAME ,in no unequivocal terms,on radio,television and the print media.

Besides,Sanusi made that statement in 2004.Can he repeat it on television now that he has a higher position .If he can,it would go a long way to calm the fears of other terrorized nigerians!

Interesting discourse. . i believe true federalism will help put an end to all these
and perhaps a creation of a southern kaduna state. . .

let each settlers in a state respect the indigenes laws and traditions
and if possible put it in the Nigerian constitution . .

with true federalism,if the core north wants to be backwards,it is their right to be. . .
as life will go on in the rest of the country

Nigeria will ALWAYS be a fractured land.

Its the way your colonial masters devised it.

You nolonger hate the Whites.

You HATE passionately each other.


and



corporate money

MandingoII:

Nigeria will ALWAYS be a fractured land.

Its the way your colonial masters devised it.

You nolonger hate the Whites.

You HATE passionately each other.


and



corporate money

Mandingo, I know that you usually have nothing positive to say about Nigeria; but my god you hit the nail this time.
In a country that directly supports the segregation of her people on ethnic/religious grounds is it no wonder that like Mandingo has said we "passionately hate each other"

Like I have advocated Nigeria needs to:
1) Get rid of State of Origin/Indigine
2) Get rid of zonal/rotational representation
3) Stop government support of Chiefs/church/mosque
4) Stop govenrment support of Hajj/Pilgrimages and embrace secularism
5) Get rid of Sharia law, Jungle justice and any other forms of either cultural or religious influence on Law

These changes if implemented would have positive effects in uniting and building

JosBoy4Lif:

Mandingo, I know that you usually have nothing positive to say about Nigeria; but my god you hit the nail this time.
In a country that directly supports the segregation of her people on ethnic/religious grounds is it no wonder that like Mandingo has said we "passionately hate each other"

Like I have advocated Nigeria needs to:
1) Get rid of State of Origin/Indigine
2) Get rid of zonal/rotational representation
3) Stop government support of Chiefs/church/mosque
4) Stop govenrment support of Hajj/Pilgrimages and embrace secularism
5) Get rid of Sharia law, Jungle justice and any other forms of either cultural or religious influence on Law

These changes if implemented would have positive effects in uniting and building

The root of Nigeria's problem is every state going to beg for money in Abuja. It isn't any of the above.
Whenever we decide to practice true federalism, both the monthly governors Abuja begging bowl congregation and all other ill's will die out.
If we practice true federalism, those who want to practice sharia will have every opportunity; business and development will simply move elsewhere.

@ Mr edoyad

You achieved all what you intended in posting this thread. i.e abuses to Islam and Muslims, increasing unnecessary hatred to Hausas and good people of the north who fought for Nigeria's independance when your grandparents were illiterates, so unheard and hiding in valleys and rocks like snakes or wild reptiles eating ALADE, without even having proper cloths to cover their body. But a silly Alade eater like you who dont even have respect for christianity in its real sense is now trying to take advantage of tribalism dominated nairaland and make Hausa people to advance. The people (HAUSA) specialised in both local and international trade, mining, fishing (KAMUN KIFI), textile (MASAKA) manufacturing (KIRA) building (GINI) architecture (MAI ZANE) tanning (JIMA or MAJEMA), different types of traditional musical instruments such as drums, local guitars, pianos and so on. They are also educated through both traditional and Islamic education which is still regarded by educationist from all over the world. Ask any of your fellow ALADE eaters provided they hold or are about to hold NCE, B. Ed or any recognised education certificate, they must have studied History of Education in Nigeria which no doubt start with the advent of Islamic education in Nigeria. Where were your grand parents then?
illiterates, so unheard and hiding in valleys and rocks like snakes or wild reptiles eating ALADE Who then need to advance?
@good christains/southerners in da house Good day, i dont mean to hut anyone but tribalists.

edoyad & co think twice pls.

@hadone, thank you for your meaningful contribution to this discourse. Could you please enlighten us as to what part of the country you're from and challenges you're facing ? Cos at the moment i being of southern kaduna origin and resident in kaduna seem to believe that religious dogma and illiteracy are the bane of the hausa society. More disturbing is their clamour for political power but failure to use that power to improve their fortunes. Have you seen the number of beggars and almajiris around the area you live recently ? I swear i get nightmares while i sleep sometimes. My cousin tells me that if i visit kano and see the amount there that my nightmare could turn to a cardiac arrest.
But why must this be ? Don't the "alhajis" you people serve feel the suffering of those children singing and clapping, begging for alms with plastic cups in hand ?

edoyad:

@hadone, thank you for your meaningful contribution to this discourse. Could you please enlighten us as to what part of the country you're from and challenges you're facing ? Cos at the moment i being of southern kaduna origin and resident in kaduna seem to believe that religious dogma and illiteracy are the bane of the hausa society. More disturbing is their clamour for political power but failure to use that power to improve their fortunes. Have you seen the number of beggars and almajiris around the area you live recently ? I swear i get nightmares while i sleep sometimes. My cousin tells me that if i visit kano and see the amount there that my nightmare could turn to a cardiac arrest.
But why must this be ? Don't the "alhajis" you people serve feel the suffering of those children singing and clapping, begging for alms with plastic cups in hand ?

[size=16pt]You are now coming up and changing your previous arrogant face to a good Nigerian. Meanwhile, as u insist to know, iam a proud  indigene and resident of Katsina State (same geo-political zone u hailed from). And the second part of your question insist to know the challenges iam facing. But i dont understand the type of challenges you are talking about. With regard to the number of beggers and almajiris u are talking about, i can strongly agree with u that it is a serious set back to Nigeria and the north respectively. Most of all, Hausa people and Islamic religion suffer worst than anything. This is simply because about 95 or even 100% of street beggers are Hausas and muslims or begging in the name of Islam. But let me use this medium to tell everybody that begging is prohibited in Islam. Islam encourage self reliance and discourage any form of begging. Therefore if any muslim begged a kobo or its kind, that person in solely abusing Islamic religion. Unless if he or she is not on occasional critical condition or difficulty that lead him to helpless situation. In such circumstances he can beg for assistance from fellow muslims and non-muslims alike who can assist him. But to make it day-to-day activity or business, islam prohibit it. And about the "alhajis" you are talking about, that is why Islam mandated them togive alms to the needy. Remember, they are not only encouraged to give but Allah make it necessary for them to give. And this almsgiving is outlined among the five pillars of Islam. One good thing to look into at this stage is that even if religion categorize you as a needy and capable of recieving the alms. You are not allowed to go to any Alhaji and start asking him to give you. Because if you ask him, then you commit a sin, If you remember, i initially told you that begging is prohibited in Islam.[/size]

I think if we opt to understand and bear with each other, we can really move forward. But it is quite annoying to always generalise. In this recent crisis of Jos, some good pastors in kuru jenta tried as much to stop the massacre of muslims by some christain youths. But is it justice for me to generalise the whole christains of that village and start cursing on them? How would that innocent pastor feel for God sake? That is similar to what is presently happening in this country. Even if your own father or son killed somebody, why should some one charge you for killing? You never killed before and dont even pray for a day to kill someone. This is the kind of troubles we muslims especially Hausa/fulani are facing. Our religion did not encourage us to harm anyone not to talk of killng. NO! Not muslim of my type.

^
The thing is Nigerians are not blind. Each time there is one of the regular pogroms up North, it is the Hausa/Fulani that go around killing Southerners. It isn't Gwari or Angas or any of the other Northern ethnicities. It is strictly Hausa/Fulani. Call a spade, a spade! Those people don't value life.

If you don't want the tag, talk to your brothers and sisters to stop their evil behaviour.

Ok

Ok

emy_nike:

honestly, i pity this group of africans.

Only this group?

It is unfortunate that Nigeria going through this crisis but it is not good to label every body bad cos one or a few make mistakes. If we keep doing this thing there will be no forward movement but we continue to hang on to bitterness.

The only good almajiri is a dead almajiri!!!

Oops! How did i get here ?

EzeUche:

The only good almajiri is a dead almajiri!!!

True talk bro!