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Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church - Religion (27) - Nairaland

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Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by budaatum: 11:51pm On Oct 24, 2017
Go to any church today and you'd hear them say, "In Jesus name, but when someone says "Hail Mary full of Grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed are thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb Jesus. Holy Mary Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death Amen." They accuse them of worshipping idols, and not being Christians. I guess their is a reason it is written that his father's house has many mansions!

"Pray then like this: 'Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.'"
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by gemale(m): 1:01am On Oct 25, 2017
doyinbaby:
arguing with a. Catholic is a waste of time
Yes... Because a true catholic (not just in mouth) has done what Paul instructed in ephesians 4:14 & isn't carried away by charisma, performance, signs & wonders. He/she seeks God whether or not blessings, breakthroughs, wealth, marriage etc comes his/her way. Because instead of hearkening to your seductive words, we do what the Lord advises & look at your fruits. There's little love among you. You guys compete to outshine each other (strife & contention) instead of shining for Christ. So much narcissism is present. Placing adverts with massive billboards where pictures of the preacher is so enlarged. Making it seem as if the MOG is a fount of miracles & teachings instead of being a medium through which God works. Hence, there's a feeling that "Pastor so & so is more anointed than Pastor lagbaja, let me go to Him for prayers. I'm more likely to get answers" . Quasi-deification of men IMO. An average pentecostal is likely to start thinking of changing his/her church at the slightest challenge forgetting that challenges are a part of life. Some people are so spiritually loose that any bit of oratory & sweet talk convinces them that they need to change where they worship because "it no longer works for them". The bible says that signs shall follow them that believe but now people who claim to believe follow signs. The moment they hear somewhere, people get what they desire, they ditch their churches & run there in search of ephemeral things. There is 1 body of Christ, the church that isn't to be divided into sects. That is what a true catholic believes. Look at most movements today. They are focused on the founder/GO. That's why you see a lot trudging to the headquarters even though they have branches close by. When he goes, you start to see cracks, breakaway & tussles even among family members. The church is closely knitted to his family most times. The wife is usually the female leader & the children usually have a post in the church if they decide to become ministers. Because we understand that unity is important than trying to be always be right or wise in our own eyes. Even though the church has been around for 2 millennia, we don't act like we know it all. We realize the hallmark of true wisdom is that no one is a sole custodian of knowledge. We learn that submission & obedience is of great import not just when it's convenient.

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Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Beey(f): 4:02am On Oct 25, 2017
Ubenedictus:


if you didn't change anything, oya show me where the Bible says salvation is by faith ALONE.

Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Beey(f): 4:03am On Oct 25, 2017
zaragoza:


My problem with ur post is that u are insisting that faith alone wld save one. Faith without good work is dead, u wld be judged by the things u did and things u failed to do.

Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Dnaz(m): 6:55am On Oct 25, 2017
[quote author=Beey post=61743923][/quote]

This describes our initial stage of conversion which is dependent on faith. But after we are converted our faith must work for it to be valid otherwise it is still birth

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:10
The Apostle goes further to exhort us

Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, WORK out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
Philippians 2:12
It is so indeed that we are saved by grace through faith and not on our own merits but after that we must work by mortifying our flesh to observe the commandments the greatest of which is love. For so the holy apostle exhorts us and the church fathers asset FAITH, HOPE and LOVE the greatest of this being LOVE and the apostle further goes on
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision is of any avail, but faith working through love.
Galatians 5:6
And this is the justification of the impious just as the holy synod(council of Trent puts it)
n the increase of Justification received.
Having, therefore, been thus justified, and made the friends and domestics of God, advancing from virtue to virtue, they are renewed, as the Apostle says, day by day; that is, by mortifying the members of their own flesh, and by presenting them as instruments of justice unto sanctification, they, through the observance of the commandments of God and of the Church, faith co-operating with good works, increase in that justice which they have received through the grace of Christ, and are still further justified, as it is written; He that is just, let him be justified still; and again, Be not afraid to be justified even to death; and also, Do you see that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. And this increase of justification holy Church begs, when she prays, "Give unto us, O Lord, increase of faith, hope, and charity."
CHAPTER XI.
On keeping the Commandments, and on the necessity and possibility thereof.
But no one, how much soever justified, ought to think himself exempt from the observance of the commandments; no one ought to make use of that rash saying, one prohibited by the Fathers under an anathema,-that the observance of the commandments of God is impossible for one that is justified. For God commands not impossibilities, but, by commanding, both admonishes thee to do what thou are able, and to pray for what thou art not able (to do), and aids thee that thou mayest be able; whose commandments are not heavy; whose yoke is sweet and whose burthen light. For, whoso are the sons of God, love Christ; but they who love him, keep his commandments, as Himself testifies; which, assuredly, with the divine help, they can do. For, although, during this mortal life, men, how holy and just soever, at times fall into at least light and daily sins, which are also called venial, not therefore do they cease to be just. For that cry of the just, Forgive us our trespasses, is both humble and true. And for this cause, the just themselves ought to feel themselves the more obligated to walk in the way of justice, in that, being already freed from sins, but made servants of God, they are able, living soberly, justly, and godly, to proceed onwards through Jesus Christ, by whom they have had access unto this grace.
For God forsakes not those who have been once justified by His grace, unless he be first forsaken by them. Wherefore, no one ought to flatter himself up with faith alone, fancying that by faith alone he is made an heir, and will obtain the inheritance, even though he suffer not with Christ, that so he may be also glorified with him. For even Christ Himself, as the Apostle saith, Whereas he was the son of God, learned obedience by the things which he suffered, and being consummated, he became, to all who obey him, the cause of eternal salvation. For which cause the same Apostle admonishes the justified, saying; Know you not that they that run in the race, all run indeed, but one receiveth the prize? So run that you may obtain. I therefore so run, not as at an uncertainty: I so fight, not as one beating the air, but I chastise my body, and bring it into subjection; lest perhaps, when I have preached to others, I myself should become a cast-away. So also the prince of the apostles, Peter; Labour the more that by good works you may make sure your calling and election. For doing those things, you shall not sin at any time. From which it is plain, that those are opposed to the orthodox doctrine of religion, who assert that the just man sins, venially at least, in every good work; or, which is yet more insupportable, that he merits eternal punishments; as also those who state, that the just sin in all their works, if, in those works, they, together with this aim principally that God may be gloried, have in view also the eternal reward, in order to excite their sloth, and to encourage themselves to run in the course: whereas it is written, I have inclined my heart to do all thy justificatitions for the reward: and, concerning Moses, the Apostle saith, that he looked unto the reward
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by analice107: 7:41am On Oct 25, 2017
Ubenedictus:


I am not making a mistake.


if you are so sure Catholics are idol worshippers, why not set your own canon and get your own new testament?
Wow, this delusion is world class. The Catholic Church wrote the New Testament right? You are a complete joke. No, you are not, you are just to proud to admit your errors
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Nobody: 9:27am On Oct 25, 2017
Ubenedictus:
through the Church he established
I know from where did you get all these analysis? Is the Bible or what?
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by omojeesu(m): 9:56am On Oct 25, 2017
Ubenedictus:


then add this question,

when was the new testament compiled?.

1. 33 AD

2. last one was written about 100AD

3. compiled about 300AD

The Church began at Pentecost. All the books preceded compilation by anybody or group or institution. When did the Catholic Church start? Please answer that.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Proffdada: 10:12am On Oct 25, 2017
zaragoza:


1 John 5:7 " for there are 3 that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word and the Holy spirit and these 3 are one"

another bible passage reads thus "in the beginning was the word, the word was with God and the word was God"
Mark 13:32 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Proffdada: 10:20am On Oct 25, 2017
zaragoza:


the blessed Virginia Mary was pregnant with Jesus when she visited Elizabeth
was mary still a virgin after giving birth to Jesus and his brothers?
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by labelle123(f): 11:31am On Oct 25, 2017
[quote author=gemale post=61743115]
Yes... Because a true catholic (not just in mouth) has done what Paul instructed in ephesians 4:14 & isn't carried away by charisma, performance, signs & wonders. He/she seeks God whether or not blessings, breakthroughs, wealth, marriage etc comes his/her way. Because instead of hearkening to your seductive words, we do what the Lord advises & look at your fruits. There's little love among you. You guys compete to outshine each other (strife & contention) instead of shining for Christ. So much narcissism is present. Placing adverts with massive billboards where pictures of the preacher is so enlarged. Making it seem as if the MOG is a fount of miracles & teachings instead of being a medium through which God works. Hence, there's a feeling that "Pastor so & so is more anointed than Pastor lagbaja, let me go to Him for prayers. I'm more likely to get answers" . Quasi-deification of men IMO. An average pentecostal is likely to start thinking of changing his/her church at the slightest challenge forgetting that challenges are a part of life. Some people are so spiritually loose that any bit of oratory & sweet talk convinces them that they need to change where they worship because "it no longer works for them". The bible says that signs shall follow them that believe but now people who claim to believe follow signs. The moment they hear somewhere, people get what they desire, they ditch their churches & run there in search of ephemeral things. There is 1 body of Christ, the church that isn't to be divided into sects. That is what a true catholic believes. Look at most movements today. They are focused on the founder/GO. That's why you see a lot trudging to the headquarters even though they have branches close by. When he goes, you start to see cracks, breakaway & tussles even among family members. The church is closely knitted to his family most times. The wife is usually the female leader & the children usually have a post in the church if they decide to become ministers. Because we understand that unity is important than trying to be always be right or wise in our own eyes. Even though the church has been around for 2 millennia, we don't act like we know it all. We realize the hallmark of true wisdom is that no one is a sole custodian of knowledge. We learn that submission & obedience is of great import not just when it's convenient. [/quote so on point dear a true Catholic can not be carried away because of sign and wonders finding solutions were there is none.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by switkaka(f): 11:41am On Oct 26, 2017
dingbang:
Happy birthday switkaka
Thank you dear
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Hahjascho(m): 1:46pm On Oct 26, 2017
internationalman:

is worshipping the mother of Jesus not far acceptable than worshipping d mother of pastor's children and d pastor himself?

Hypocrites everywhere... You will hear them saying daddy daddy.. mummy mummy.. Some would even go as far as cooking and washing for pastors when they don't do the same for their families at home.
showing helping hands...care....for ur pastors doesn't connote what you intend.. that doesn't make them ur gods or intercessor or rather alter ur believe ....There's even a saying that "A prayerful fellow Is d master of prophet"
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Hahjascho(m): 1:51pm On Oct 26, 2017
Spylord48:


so only MFM serve a living God?. you are already judging. Leave Everyman to his own religion. is only God that know the only true religion.
I used to tell people that if really heaven exist, you will suprised that day that those people you are condemning will first you and enter there.
if Catholic are worshiping idols,leave them to worship, if Anglicans are ordaining gays as priest leave them and fight for your own salvation because the race is an individual race,and in the sight of God he doesn't know if you are a pagsin,Anglican, winners, Rccg, Catholic, Muslim, Buddhist, the only identity you will have on that day is your good deeds and not church
....ain't completed... good deeds and a strong belief in Jesus Christ.. d saviour
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Hahjascho(m): 1:58pm On Oct 26, 2017
Andy2274:
Lol! Catholic Church topic today again. The most popular topic on this trend.....we worship images, pray to Mary and saints, we are into idolatry.....leave us alone. Catholics die and Pentecostal also die too. Leave judgment for God and work towards your salvation. If you are not comfortable go hang yourself or hug transformer.
......hang or hug transformer?......It's too harsh for a believer sir
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 8:30pm On Oct 26, 2017
omojeesu:


The Church began at Pentecost. All the books preceded compilation by anybody or group or institution. When did the Catholic Church start? Please answer that.

I already answered that the Catholic Church began 33AD
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 8:32pm On Oct 26, 2017
analice107:

Wow, this delusion is world class. The Catholic Church wrote the New Testament right? You are a complete joke. No, you are not, you are just to proud to admit your errors


there are no errors, the new testament was written by the member of the Catholic Church so years after the event.


the Catholic Church completed its canonisation 300 yes later.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Beey(f): 10:24pm On Oct 26, 2017
Dnaz:


This describes our initial stage of conversion which is dependent on faith. But after we are converted our faith must work for it to be valid otherwise it is still birth

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:10
The Apostle goes further to exhort us

Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, WORK out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
Philippians 2:12
It is so indeed that we are saved by grace through faith and not on our own merits but after that we must work by mortifying our flesh to observe the commandments the greatest of which is love. For so the holy apostle exhorts us and the church fathers asset FAITH, HOPE and LOVE the greatest of this being LOVE and the apostle further goes on
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision is of any avail, but faith working through love.
Galatians 5:6
And this is the justification of the impious just as the holy synod(council of Trent puts it)
n the increase of Justification received.
Having, therefore, been thus justified, and made the friends and domestics of God, advancing from virtue to virtue, they are renewed, as the Apostle says, day by day; that is, by mortifying the members of their own flesh, and by presenting them as instruments of justice unto sanctification, they, through the observance of the commandments of God and of the Church, faith co-operating with good works, increase in that justice which they have received through the grace of Christ, and are still further justified, as it is written; He that is just, let him be justified still; and again, Be not afraid to be justified even to death; and also, Do you see that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. And this increase of justification holy Church begs, when she prays, "Give unto us, O Lord, increase of faith, hope, and charity."
CHAPTER XI.
On keeping the Commandments, and on the necessity and possibility thereof.
But no one, how much soever justified, ought to think himself exempt from the observance of the commandments; no one ought to make use of that rash saying, one prohibited by the Fathers under an anathema,-that the observance of the commandments of God is impossible for one that is justified. For God commands not impossibilities, but, by commanding, both admonishes thee to do what thou are able, and to pray for what thou art not able (to do), and aids thee that thou mayest be able; whose commandments are not heavy; whose yoke is sweet and whose burthen light. For, whoso are the sons of God, love Christ; but they who love him, keep his commandments, as Himself testifies; which, assuredly, with the divine help, they can do. For, although, during this mortal life, men, how holy and just soever, at times fall into at least light and daily sins, which are also called venial, not therefore do they cease to be just. For that cry of the just, Forgive us our trespasses, is both humble and true. And for this cause, the just themselves ought to feel themselves the more obligated to walk in the way of justice, in that, being already freed from sins, but made servants of God, they are able, living soberly, justly, and godly, to proceed onwards through Jesus Christ, by whom they have had access unto this grace.
For God forsakes not those who have been once justified by His grace, unless he be first forsaken by them. Wherefore, no one ought to flatter himself up with faith alone, fancying that by faith alone he is made an heir, and will obtain the inheritance, even though he suffer not with Christ, that so he may be also glorified with him. For even Christ Himself, as the Apostle saith, Whereas he was the son of God, learned obedience by the things which he suffered, and being consummated, he became, to all who obey him, the cause of eternal salvation. For which cause the same Apostle admonishes the justified, saying; Know you not that they that run in the race, all run indeed, but one receiveth the prize? So run that you may obtain. I therefore so run, not as at an uncertainty: I so fight, not as one beating the air, but I chastise my body, and bring it into subjection; lest perhaps, when I have preached to others, I myself should become a cast-away. So also the prince of the apostles, Peter; Labour the more that by good works you may make sure your calling and election. For doing those things, you shall not sin at any time. From which it is plain, that those are opposed to the orthodox doctrine of religion, who assert that the just man sins, venially at least, in every good work; or, which is yet more insupportable, that he merits eternal punishments; as also those who state, that the just sin in all their works, if, in those works, they, together with this aim principally that God may be gloried, have in view also the eternal reward, in order to excite their sloth, and to encourage themselves to run in the course: whereas it is written, I have inclined my heart to do all thy justificatitions for the reward: and, concerning Moses, the Apostle saith, that he looked unto the reward




I don't know how you arrived at the conclusion that it's the initial stage of conversion.Working out one's own salvation , basically Would loosely translate to walking in a manner worth one's calling.We can go on and on about this topic.But I'd like you to remember the thieves on the cross next to Jesus.The thief who asked Jesus to remember him when he got to paradise was promised by Jesus that he'd be with him inparadise.He was saved but if his works were anything to go by, salvation was far from him.But Jesus gave him eternal life despite the kind of life he had been living.It wasn't works that saved him.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by analice107: 7:47am On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:



there are no errors, the new testament was written by the member of the Catholic Church so years after the event.


the Catholic Church completed its canonisation 300 yes later.
Yeah right. Hold that as a testimonial when you stand before the White Throne Judgment.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 9:21am On Oct 27, 2017
[quote author=Beey post=61743914][/quote] I still can't find faith alone there
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by omojeesu(m): 10:50am On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:


I already answered that the Catholic Church began 33AD

By who?
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 12:50pm On Oct 27, 2017
asuustrike2009:

I know from where did you get all these analysis? Is the Bible or what?
the Church Jesus himself established on the apostles and gave power to teach.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 12:51pm On Oct 27, 2017
omojeesu:

By who?
Christ Jesus and his apostles
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 1:01pm On Oct 27, 2017
analice107:

Yeah right. Hold that as a testimonial when you stand before the White Throne Judgment.
of course I'm happy to be in the Church Jesus himself established and I'm happy with that testimonial on the day of judgement.

Jesus, I am you son and brother, justified by your grace and bathed in your blood, a member of your body that Church you established on Peter and the apostles and gave your spirit and promised the gates of hell will never prevail against.... I believe in your promises. I don't deserve it but you have merited it for me.
open for me the doors of immortality and life eternal.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Nobody: 1:40pm On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:
the Church Jesus himself established on the apostles and gave power to teach.
You're joking. Which church? How day you know about it?
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Beey(f): 1:46pm On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:
I still can't find faith alone there
Scriptures are clear so am not sure what else you were expecting.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Dnaz(m): 2:50pm On Oct 27, 2017
Beey:
Scriptures are clear so am not sure what else you were expecting.
James 2:24 So you see a man is justified by Works and not by faith alone
What can be clearer than this
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 4:45pm On Oct 27, 2017
Beey:
Scriptures are clear so am not sure what else you were expecting.
yes the scriptures are so clear that there is nothing like faith ALONE, IT IS A FIGMENT OF IMAGINATION.
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 4:55pm On Oct 27, 2017
asuustrike2009:

You're joking. Which church? How day you know about it?
the Catholic church, which other?
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Nobody: 5:47pm On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:
the Catholic church, which other?

Catholic church indeed! It then means they're not Christians as said by others
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by omojeesu(m): 7:37pm On Oct 27, 2017
Ubenedictus:
Christ Jesus and his apostles

CHRIST'S CHURCH WAS BORN AT PENTECOST.
YOUR CHURCH AFTER CONSTANTINOPLE'S 'HIJACK'
Re: Why Do Pentecostals Believe That Catholic Church Is Not A Bible Believing Church by Ubenedictus(m): 7:54pm On Oct 27, 2017
omojeesu:


CHRIST'S CHURCH WAS BORN AT PENTECOST.
YOUR CHURCH AFTER CONSTANTINOPLE'S 'HIJACK'
no sir.


that church born when Jesus died and empowered at Pentecost IS the Catholic Church

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