VenumX:

Go and preach to your family members than coming here to compare yourself to Jesus Christ whom you don't even believe in.
You are just reasoning like a lost boko harram vessel.

Your kind said much more than that to our King so no wahala!

MaxInDHouse:

Your kind said much more than that to our King so no wahala!

Keep comparing yourself to Christ who has already rejected you for your Islamic garbage okay.

Your pants are down, every one can see you for who you really are. No pretending and delusions will save you.

Let that sink.

Blue86

I come from a place of what is rational. I always use my power of reason in most things.

Did you read that Chapter and verse in 1st Corinthians where Christians were told not to even eat with someone who claims to be Christian and does a number of nasty things as described?

Do you believe in God i.e the God of the Bible?

If you believe in the God of the Bible, do you believe that those who follow Christ must be obedient to everything written in the Bible? If you believe that, then are you not directly insulting God when you say that an act of discipline in line with God's command is not done "in Christ" because of the subsequent action of the individual who was disciplined in line with God's commandments?

If that is your firm believe, you should understand what you are saying. You are saying you are not a Christian, because following the commands and instructions in the Christian bible is the only basis for being a Christian and a follower of Christ. There is no other basis and there is no room for a Christian to decide which command to obey and which ones not to obey. Please read 2nd Timothy Chapt 3 verse 16 where God states that the Bible is the one and ONLY basis for his instructions to humans. What your church or your pastor teaches you is of no use when and if it contradicts God's words as recorded in the Bible. In this case, God's words are very crystal clear and are not subject to interpretation(1st Corinthians 5 verses 11 - 13).

When God disciplined Cain (the first son of our human parents) and because of the discipline, Cain went and killed his own blood brother and committed the first murder on earth, did it then mean that God's discipline of Cain was "no more of Christ" as you stated? God's discipline led Cain to murder, if I am to quote you (in modification), since you stated that it was discipline that led the woman to murder-suicide. But you also stated that "God's discipline leads to what correction not murdering spree". So which is it? Do you begin to discern that God's discipline had nothing to do with the case of Cain committing murder? That this woman's discipline did not have anything to do with her also committing murder-suicide? These two humans made these decisions to continue doing what is bad on their own. The woman could have accepted the discipline, changed and become a better person just as Cain could have done the same thing.


Cain could have chosen to listen to God and become a better man, so that God will look kindly upon his offerings next time. Instead he chose to kill his innocent brother, the same way the woman under discussion chose to kill her innocent family members who took a stand on what God says, rather than side with her who was their wife and mother. It takes courage in our time for family members to take sides with God and to say the same things that some of the apostles said almost two thousand years ago in Acts 5 verse 29 ASV: "But Peter and the apostles answered and said, We must obey God rather than men".

I am writing you these things because it seems to me that you are someone who is up for what is true, not just to argue. I had tried using my power of logic and reason on some other guy on this same issue, over the weekend and it turned out that he has a challenge with comprehending simple sentences, let alone reasoning and I left him alone.

When I see threads like this and realise that they are simply about logic and reasoning ability, I get involved because I believe that most humans will see logic/truth and accept it.

Blue86:
If a disciplinary committee led you to suicide, it is no more of Christ. Because God's discipline leads to what correction not murdering spree.

And there is a different between God's judgement and suicide spree from rejection.

These should be conversations and conversations only. You use your power of reasoning to take someone through the logic of what is before them. Most important is the need to be respectful, very respectful to anyone you are trying to reason with, not just about this but about anything else in life. It is not everyone that will get it. Some may get it later in the future. But it's more about showing what the bible states and then let men and women of reason make an informed decision. Some of us have believed something different from what is in the scriptures all of our lives. It is difficult and challenging to wake up one day and discard those beliefs, even in the face of truth.

When you tag something negative to someone, you make it more difficult for the person to focus on what you are saying. Let respect lead.

MaxInDHouse:

Your kind said much more than that to our King so no wahala!

VenumX:

Keep comparing yourself to Christ who has already rejected you for your Islamic garbage okay. Your pants are down, every one can see you for who you really are. No pretending and delusions will save you. Let that sink.

That's exactly what the other religious groups in the first century were saying about Jesus and his disciples for standing out!
Jesus kept quoting what the prophets said about the Christ and how he's fulfilling it just as i'm quoting the scriptures and correlating it with what i saw among Jehovah's Witnesses whereas you're just arguing blindly like the first century Jewish religionists who felt Jesus must be wrong for claiming he's the only source of divine guidance! John 14:6

So keep consoling yourself i can understand!

NemoDatQuod:

These should be conversations and conversations only. You use your power of reasoning to take someone through the logic of what is before them. Most important is the need to be respectful, very respectful to anyone you are trying to reason with, not just about this but about anything else in life. It is not everyone that will get it. Some may get it later in the future. But it's more about showing what the bible states and then let men and women of reason make an informed decision. Some of us have believed something different from what is in the scriptures all of our lives. It is difficult and challenging to wake up one day and discard those beliefs, even in the face of truth.

When you tag something negative to someone, you make it more difficult for the person to focus on what you are saying. Let respect lead.

We follow the footsteps of Christ Jesus who often told critics the truth whether they like it or not. I have to tag them perhaps they can logically refute the fitting tags! Luke 11:47-48

MaxInDHouse:

That's exactly what the other religious groups in the first century were saying about Jesus and his disciples for standing out!
Jesus kept quoting what the prophets said about the Christ and how he's fulfilling it just as i'm quoting the scriptures and correlating it with what i saw among Jehovah's Witnesses whereas you're just arguing blindly like the first century Jewish religionists who felt Jesus must be wrong for claiming he's the only source of divine guidance! John 14:6

So keep consoling yourself i can understand!

You are talking about yourself here but you are to blind to realise it.

That's why you ran from one pedophilia sect to another. And you think Jesus acknowledges your hypocrisy as truth cause you quote and confuse yourself with edited Bible verses.

VenumX:

You are talking about yourself here but you are to blind to realise it.
That's why you ran from one pedophilia sect to another. And you think Jesus acknowledges your hypocrisy as truth cause you quote and confuse yourself with edited Bible verses.

Ecclesiastes 3:7, 39

MaxInDHouse:

You never cry finish. You must embrace your Allah publicly and stop with the deceit. It's not working.

Are you a JW?

NemoDatQuod:
Blue86

I come from a place of what is rational. I always use my power of reason in most things.

Did you read that Chapter and verse in 1st Corinthians where Christians were told not to even eat with someone who claims to be Christian and does a number of nasty things as described?

Do you believe in God i.e the God of the Bible?

If you believe in the God of the Bible, do you believe that those who follow Christ must be obedient to everything written in the Bible? If you believe that, then are you not directly insulting God when you say that an act of discipline in line with God's command is not done "in Christ" because of the subsequent action of the individual who was disciplined in line with God's commandments?

If that is your firm believe, you should understand what you are saying. You are saying you are not a Christian, because following the commands and instructions in the Christian bible is the only basis for being a Christian and a follower of Christ. There is no other basis and there is no room for a Christian to decide which command to obey and which ones not to obey. Please read 2nd Timothy Chapt 3 verse 16 where God states that the Bible is the one and ONLY basis for his instructions to humans. What your church or your pastor teaches you is of no use when and if it contradicts God's words as recorded in the Bible. In this case, God's words are very crystal clear and are not subject to interpretation(1st Corinthians 5 verses 11 - 13).

When God disciplined Cain (the first son of our human parents) and because of the discipline, Cain went and killed his own blood brother and committed the first murder on earth, did it then mean that God's discipline of Cain was "no more of Christ" as you stated? God's discipline led Cain to murder, if I am to quote you (in modification), since you stated that it was discipline that led the woman to murder-suicide. But you also stated that "God's discipline leads to what correction not murdering spree". So which is it? Do you begin to discern that God's discipline had nothing to do with the case of Cain committing murder? That this woman's discipline did not have anything to do with her also committing murder-suicide? These two humans made these decisions to continue doing what is bad on their own. The woman could have accepted the discipline, changed and become a better person just as Cain could have done the same thing.


Cain could have chosen to listen to God and become a better man, so that God will look kindly upon his offerings next time. Instead he chose to kill his innocent brother, the same way the woman under discussion chose to kill her innocent family members who took a stand on what God says, rather than side with her who was their wife and mother. It takes courage in our time for family members to take sides with God and to say the same things that some of the apostles said almost two thousand years ago in Acts 5 verse 29 ASV: "But Peter and the apostles answered and said, We must obey God rather than men".

I am writing you these things because it seems to me that you are someone who is up for what is true, not just to argue. I had tried using my power of logic and reason on some other guy on this same issue, over the weekend and it turned out that he has a challenge with comprehending simple sentences, let alone reasoning and I left him alone.

When I see threads like this and realise that they are simply about logic and reasoning ability, I get involved because I believe that most humans will see logic/truth and accept it.

Blue86:

Are you a JW?

It's obvious he's on the side of the truth so no hypocritical blabbing crowd can mislead him into judging wrongly! Exodus 23:1-2

MaxInDHouse:


Don't allow emotional blackmail to carry away with the faithless crowds {Exodus 23:2} Judas Iscariot committed suicide because he felt bad after considering what Jesus taught the group and compared to what he did.
What Judas Iscariot did isn't as bad as you may think going by the way people reason but why did he commit suicide?
Well he was contemplating on the teachings of their master Jesus Christ, so do you think Jesus' teachings is occultic since that's what led Judas to commit suicide?

Oga Intelligence Officer, so going contrary to what Jesus taught should ordinarily lead to suicides?

E de beru Olohun.

Lukuluku69:

Oga Intelligence Officer, so going contrary to what Jesus taught should ordinarily lead to suicides?
E de beru Olohun.

Ordinarily going against Jesus' order is suicide already but you need to be wise before you can grasp that!

Muhammad is your prophet and you believe in what your Qu'ran says about your prophet.
Please tell me in one word what a person who turned his back on Muhammad did after knowing that he is a true servant of God?

Well i will call it "SUICIDE" because going by what your Qu'ran says whoever turns his back on God's prophet awaits the wrath of God and going by your religious beliefs such a person will be tormented, not so?

That's exactly what Judas Iscariot felt after betraying the best friend he ever had!

MaxInDHouse:


Ordinarily going against Jesus' order is suicide already but you need to be wise before you can grasp that!

Muhammad is your prophet and you believe in what your Qu'ran says about your prophet.
Please tell me in one word what a person who turned his back on Muhammad did after knowing that he is a true servant of God?

Well i will call it "SUICIDE" because going by what your Qu'ran says whoever turns his back on God's prophet awaits the wrath of God and going by your religious beliefs such a person will be tormented, not so?

That's exactly what Judas Iscariot felt after betraying the best friend he ever had!

Let leave Prophet Muhammad out of this for now.

So, what you are saying is that there is no turning back from an erring ways with your Assembly?

Jesus did not condemn that woman taken in Adultery you know?

Lukuluku69:

Let leave Prophet Muhammad out of this for now. So, what you are saying is that there is no turning back from an erring ways with your Assembly? Jesus did not condemn that woman taken in Adultery you know?

Oh no you can't hide your prophet away from this case because it's closely related!

So answer my question first: what do you call a person who deliberately turned his/her back on your Muhammad yet believing that he is a prophet of God?

Remember that such a case differs from one who has begun to doubt Muhammad because he may feel he's escaping a trap but let's say the person still believes in Muhammad but somehow turned his/her back due to some circumstances!

MaxInDHouse:


Oh no you can't hide your prophet away from this case because it's closely related!

So answer my question first: what do you call a person who deliberately turned his/her back on your Muhammad yet believing that he is a prophet of God?

Remember that such a case differs from one who has begun to doubt Muhammad because he may feel he's escaping a trap but let's say the person still believes in Muhammad but somehow turned his/her back due to some circumstances!

Oga, two different scenarios. Not related at all. I took to you up on that comment that says once you go contrary to what the Nazarene teaches, na suicide straight for the person

And I asked is there no way for a come back?

Lukuluku69:

Oga, two different scenarios. Not related at all. I took to you up on that comment that says once you go contrary to what the Nazarene teaches, na suicide straight for the person
And I asked is there no way for a come back?

Of course there's a way for a come back but such a way is for humble people who believes they're nothing before God.
Judas Iscariot was a proud man who used to steal from the pus of the group {John 12:4-6} the other disciples knew all these but since Jesus never called him out Judas felt he doesn't need their approval.
So after betraying Jesus and seeing that Jesus has been killed Judas Iscariot couldn't return to the group because the only person who doesn't judge him despite his mischief is the same person he betrayed to death.
That's why he choose suicide instead of a come back.
Most people do find themselves in this same situation that's why Jesus taught us to be humble {Matthew 20:27} always seeing ourselves as nothing in the midst of our fellow believers, this will really help when we commit blunders and need their face, it will be easy for us to come back and plead in repentance! James 5:14-15

MaxInDHouse:


Of course there's a way for a come back but such a way is for humble people who believes they're nothing before God.
Judas Iscariot was a proud man who used to steal from the pus of the group {John 12:4-6} the other disciples knew all these but since Jesus never called him out Judas felt he doesn't need their approval.
So after betraying Jesus and seeing that Jesus has been killed Judas Iscariot couldn't return to the group because the only person who doesn't judge him despite his mischief is the same person he betrayed to death.
That's why he choose suicide instead of a come back.
Most people do find themselves in this same situation that's why Jesus taught us to be humble {Matthew 20:27} always seeing ourselves as nothing in the midst of our fellow believers, this will really help when we commit blunders and need their face, it will be easy for us to come back and plead in repentance! James 5:14-15

You are still not getting my drift but I will let it rest.

NemoDatQuod:
@True2god.

Are you really true to God? If you are, you would have studied your copy of the bible and you would have read and understood where God told His followers, through Paul thus :
1 Corinthians 5:11 — The New King James Version (NKJV)

11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person.

A Christian would know this command from God. The question you need to ask yourself is why is it that you, who most likely identify as Christian, did not know that God commanded you not to associate with and hang out with someone who claims to be Christian and practice any of the above things. If you had known , you would not have put the blame on " The 8 so-called 'elders' in Brooklyn Street NY, the headquarters of the JW".

Though you did not mean to, you effectively blamed God for administering "poison into the psyche of His followers".

I have maximum respect for the JW. They teach ONLY what is in the scriptures, no matter how difficult it is. They simply teach what the bible says without adding or removing. They believe the scriptures to be the word of God and hence do not think they have a right to be selective on what they believe from God and what they do not believe.

Let me ask you a practical question. If your wife breaks the JW laws and she stops being a member, would you and your kids also isolate her and stop relating with her?

Lukuluku69:

You are still not getting my drift but I will let it rest.

What you're trying to say is that since a woman committed suicide for rejection then the people that rejected her should be blamed but you're not bothered about what made them reject her.
Go to Iran and solve the problem caused by your Muslim rule forcing women to wear hijab, a woman was arrested (not shunned) and due to the way she was beating by the police she died.
How incomparable that is to JWs who will only shun her for going against our rules.
Even your own Muslim people are now protesting against the hijab your religion imposed on their women!

tctrills:

Let me ask you a practical question. If your wife breaks the JW laws and she stops being a member, would you and your kids also isolate her and stop relating with her?

It's not JW laws but what we all agreed upon before getting baptized as members of the global family. So she remains the wife to the man and mother to her children but all other JWs will no longer relate with her as a member of our global family and this will affect her husband and children because when i am with one of her children or husband i must take my leave immediately she comes around since the scriptures says i must not greet her! Romans 16:17; 2John 10-11

MaxInDHouse:

It's not JW laws but what we all agreed upon before getting baptized as members of the global family. So she remains the wife to the man and mother to her children but all other JWs will no longer relate with her as a member of our global family and this will affect her husband and children because when i am with one of her children or husband i must take my leave immediately she comes around since the scriptures says i must not greet her! Romans 16:17; 2John 10-11

interesting

tctrills:
interesting

So it's not JW laws but what is WRITTEN in God's word for all law-abiding and faithful servants of God to comply with!

MaxInDHouse:

So it's not JW laws but what is WRITTEN in God's word for all law-abiding and faithful servants of God to comply with!

Let's just be honest here, it's not God's law but you church interpretation of God's law.

tctrills:

Let's just be honest here, it's not God's law but you church interpretation of God's law.

So are you honest at all?

OK, present your church interpretation of what God's word says at Romans 16:17; 1Corinthians 13:12-13 and 2John 10-11

Tell me how true Christians can apply what is written in those verses if you're not a lawless individual as Jesus foretold about religionists claiming believers today! Matthew 7:21-23

MaxInDHouse:


So are you honest at all?

OK, present your church interpretation of what God's word says at Romans 16:17; 1Corinthians 13:12-13 and 2John 10-11

Tell me how true Christians can apply what is written in those verses if you're not a lawless individual as Jesus foretold about religionists claiming believers today! Matthew 7:21-23

Sorry, I do not represent a church.

tctrills:

Sorry, I do not represent a church.

WORKERS OF LAWLESSNESS! Matthew 7:21-23

So in other words you're not ready to uphold God's word so you won't be blamed for keeping the standard of your God!

MaxInDHouse:


WORKERS OF LAWLESSNESS! Matthew 7:21-23

So in other words you're not ready to uphold God's word so you won't be blamed for keeping the standard of your God!

I uphold the word of God not the words of a church. That's the difference between you and me. I do not ask any church to help me interpret a verse. I have God's spirit to teach me all things. There is a difference between you and me.

tctrills:

I uphold the word of God not the words of a church. That's the difference between you and me. I do not ask any church to help me interpret a verse. I have God's spirit to teach me all things. There is a difference between you and me.

My friend you're a worker of lawlessness!

The first century Christian congregation can all read the scriptures each by themselves but a body was established by Jesus Christ known as the Apostles {Luke 6:13} it's whatever they concluded that's binding on all members of the church {Act 2:42} that's why Jesus said whatever they bind on or loosen on earth will be granted in heaven {Matthew 16:19} this is what made all the congregations have the same line of thought {1Corinthians 1:10} just as Christ Jesus prayed to his father! John 17:22

That's why you can't interpret that scripture at Romans 16:17; 1Corinthians 5:12-13 & 2John 10-11 because there's no way you can interpret these verses without complying to the conclusion of the first century Apostles and their modern day brothers GOVERNING BODY of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES.
That is what is bound on earth that the heavens have bound and loosen on earth that the heavens have loosened. Matthew 16:19
God's Holy Spirit is not the author of confusion {1Corinthians 14:33} it only help each Christian to quote and cite related verses when needed and how to respond efficaciously during times of persecution by faithless people {Luke 12:12-12} but when it comes to rules that's binding on all members of the Christian congregation globally it's whatever the group serving as Apostles agree upon with God's Holy Spirit that's binding on all! Act 15:28-29

MaxInDHouse:

My friend you're a worker of lawlessness!

The first century Christian congregation can all read the scriptures each by themselves but a body was established by Jesus Christ known as the Apostles {Luke 6:13} it's whatever they concluded that's binding on all members of the church {Act 2:42} that's why Jesus said whatever they bind on or loosen on earth will be granted in heaven {Matthew 16:19} this is what made all the congregations have the same line of thought {1Corinthians 1:10} just as Christ Jesus prayed to his father! John 17:22

That's why you can't interpret that scripture at Romans 16:17; 1Corinthians 5:12-13 & 2John 10-11 because there's no way you can interpret these verses without complying to the conclusion of the first century Apostles and their modern day brothers GOVERNING BODY of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES.
That is what is bound on earth that the heavens have bound and loosen on earth that the heavens have loosened. Matthew 16:19
God's Holy Spirit is not the author of confusion {1Corinthians 14:33} it only help each Christian to quote and cite related verses when needed and how to respond efficaciously during times of persecution by faithless people {Luke 12:12-12} but when it comes to rules that's binding on all members of the Christian congregation globally it's whatever the group serving as Apostles agree upon with God's Holy Spirit that's binding on all! Act 15:28-29

Actually, you are wrong. The Lord poured out his spirit on the Christians and he promised them that his spirit would teach them all things.
All Christians are entitled to the spirit of God. Without the spirit of God in your life, there is no difference between you and any other religion.
Do we need human teachers? Yes
But our greatest teacher is the spirit of God.

tctrills:

Actually, you are wrong. The Lord poured out his spirit on the Christians and he promised them that his spirit would teach them all things. All Christians are entitled to the spirit of God. Without the spirit of God in your life, there is no difference between you and any other religion. Do we need human teachers? Yes But our greatest teacher is the spirit of God.

Of course the Holy Spirit is WORKING with all OBEDIENT members of the Congregation but the work differs that's why it's gifts are listed in the Bible book of Ephesians 4:11 as follows:

© Apostles ~ Overseers of the congregation in all the earth, it's their conclusion with God's Holy Spirit that matters most when it comes setting rules that's binding on all members of the Christian family worldwide! Matthew 16:19 compare to Act 2:42; 15:28-29

© Prophets ~ Those telling people God's decree as stated in His word.

© Evangelizers ~ Preachers of the good news.

© Shepherds ~ Organizers of the Christian family worldwide.

© Teachers ~ Those teaching members within the Christian congregation.

Of course contradicting views may come up on rules that's binding on all members {Act 15:1-2} that's why we have the Apostles (Governing Body) who has the final say that all members must comply with throughout the earth {Act 16:28-29} after this we all agree on what the spirit of our God concluded with them, that's how we have the same line of thought globally {John 17:22 compare to 1Corinthians 1:10} and whoever feels he/she is wiser than them must be shunned! Romans 16:17

That's why Jesus said:

“I have spoken these things to you while I am still with you. But the helper, the holy spirit, which the Father will send in my name, that one will teach you all things and bring back to your minds all the things I told you. I leave you peace; I give you my peace. I do not give it to you the way that the world gives it. Do not let your hearts be troubled nor let them shrink out of fear. John 14:25-27

Christ Jesus laid this foundation {Matthew 16:18-19} all those claiming believers or worshipers out of this arrangement can't unite as God's people! Luke 11:23