jeff1607:



sir see the reason why I said a show in Nigeria is necessary? when they bring in their own dogs and they see dog performing and theirs can't bear the sight of crowd n chase people out of fear.

think about it

I already asked some judges to come and set up a dog sport in Nigeria but all the so-called dog men I notified are silent so far. It's all about talking in this part of the world.

IamAnderson:

I know it takes experience to raise a dog properly but that's not my issue
My problem is the way they bastardized big dogs like they can't do anything and used the term "experience" to defend their claims
The annoying thing is that they haven't even trained other big dogs like how they have trained their own dogs yet they claim to have "dog experience"

I understand your point sir, each dog has it's strong points as well as weaknesses, it's also not too easy diversifying ,a reputable breeder can sincerely focus on one or two breeds , adding more would be like having a puppy mill.

you can't have everything , take one at a time and be a pro on it.

let's say you become successful in breeding our local dogs here to international standards say 15years you won't be comfortable when a noob comes and tells you stuff know isn't the PRACTICAL TRUTH. we all have our ways

learn about your breed and focus on it, even international dog Judges can't be in every competition of different dog breeds, they need focus also

oluomoadebayo:


I have never claimed to be the best but I'm properly working to improve myself in anything I'm doing. I don't even think I'm better than you but the fact remains that I'm the owner of this thread and I'm a positive advocate of a Malinois breed. I have a practical experience that you don't have. Talk is cheap and people like you won't learn because you always think you know better.

The beauty of social media is everyone has an opinion but it is rude when you take it beyond that and start attacking people with a different opinion to yours. Buhari also thought there was nothing called subsidy before becoming a president. You can always create a counter thread to call out this one if you think I'm wrong but your ego won't let you be. I will stop responding to you at this point but you need to learn if you want to grow in this field. IRE OOOOOO!

My problem with you was the way you made big dogs look like trash because you have smaller dogs
You don't have experience training big dogs but you talked about them like you already knew their reactions and how they work
Now I've proved everything you said wrong you're acting like the victim?
I never said I was better at what you do than you
I always gave you honor about how well trained your dogs are when it was due
I only stated that your opinion was the farthest thing from fact and even went ahead to prove it by posting pics from other dog trainers I follow
I only started commenting on this thread when you started lying about some things and I wanted the public to know the truth
Everything I said, I backed it up with proof meanwhile everything you said, I countered it
You can act like the victim of an " ignorant inexperienced egomaniac" if you want because I know I'm not that person
At least people can go back to the beginning of the thread and read up on the argument... That's another beauty of social media
I'm also tired of replying you so we can just end it here and let the public pick who was wrong here

jeff1607:


I understand your point sir, each dog has it's strong points as well as weaknesses, it's also not too easy diversifying ,a reputable breeder can sincerely focus on one or two breeds , adding more would be like having a puppy mill.

you can't have everything , take one at a time and be a pro on it.

let's say you become successful in breeding our local dogs here to international standards say 15years you won't be comfortable when a noob comes and tells you stuff know isn't the PRACTICAL TRUTH. we all have our ways

learn about your breed and focus on it, even international dog Judges can't be in every competition of different dog breeds, they need focus also

I'm not the one that breeds local dogs that's agbogeh
And my theories have also been put into practical (although not by me) and I was able to get videos of the things happening (turns out I was correct about what I was saying
I also talked about the strengths of a malinois and also their weaknesses
People then denied their weaknesses and made them look like super dogs which isn't true so I had to speak up

IamAnderson:

I'm not the one that breeds local dogs that's agbogeh
And my theories have also been put into practical (although not by me) and I was able to get videos of the things happening (turns out I was correct about what I was saying
I also talked about the strengths of a malinois and also their weaknesses
People then denied their weaknesses and made them look like super dogs which isn't true so I had to speak up

IamAnderson:

I'm not the one that breeds local dogs that's agbogeh
And my theories have also been put into practical (although not by me) and I was able to get videos of the things happening (turns out I was correct about what I was saying
I also talked about the strengths of a malinois and also their weaknesses
People then denied their weaknesses and made them look like super dogs which isn't true so I had to speak up

IamAnderson:

My problem with you was the way you made big dogs look like trash because you have smaller dogs
You don't have experience training big dogs but you talked about them like you already knew their reactions and how they work
Now I've proved everything you said wrong you're acting like the victim?
I never said I was better at what you do than you
I always gave you honor about how well trained your dogs are when it was due
I only stated that your opinion was the farthest thing from fact and even went ahead to prove it by posting pics from other dog trainers I follow
I only started commenting on this thread when you started lying about some things and I wanted the public to know the truth
Everything I said, I backed it up with proof meanwhile everything you said, I countered it
You can act like the victim of an " ignorant inexperienced egomaniac" if you want because I know I'm not that person
At least people can go back to the beginning of the thread and read up on the argument... That's another beauty of social media
I'm also tired of replying you so we can just end it here and let the public pick who was wrong here

I have trained a CO, Rotweiller, GSD and even a Boerboel but I don't have experience with big dogs?

For instance, I know you can't apply pressure to a Rotweiller until he fully matured. I know A CO needs enough socialization with a slow and gentle approach before he reaches his full potential. Yet, I don't have experience with them. I'm not interested in who is wrong or right but a fair argument with no attack. Like is said before and I'm sorry to respond to this, I'm no longer responding to you. This thread is about my program and not about your ideal or beliefs. I wish you the best and stay safe with your CO.

oluomoadebayo:
It is very funny and strange how many people became an expert on this thread but very sad when I realized many of you cannot create a meaningful thread of your own because you have nothing to say. You don't even have good dogs to boast with but you jumped to the chance to flex your muscle on someone else thread instead of you to watch and learn.

Most of you have not seen a real CO or Kangal in your life, yet, you are talking as if you leave with one.

Nobody can become a medical doctor with information online only, you need to pass through the process of schooling, training and practicing to become one. It is the same as a dog expert, you need to walk the talk and not just be a social media expert.

pls get your facts right before posting
We have nothing to say but what I said in your thread made u think I was a (in ur own words)"seasoned dog guru." until u found out I owned a local dog ...very sad. Well, I don't blame people for looking down on our local dogs ,I blame the owners for nt taking good care of them.
Me owning a local dog doesn't mean I haven't studied and taking care of other breeds. Yea, its true that I haven't seen and gotten to know the kangal in real life because they are mostly found in turkey,america and remote part of Africa but not seeing a Caucasian, come on..they are every where.
Getting experience doesn't necessarily mean just owning a dog for ten years.Research comes in as well.
I know good and experienced dog breeders and I learned from them as well.I av also learned from my fellow nairalanders like Eveezy,rany4all,abbeg and so on.
pls don't confuse research with social media, yes u can Do ur research by viewing peoples opinion on social media but dats not wat research is only.
U are one of those Nigerians that condemn and disapprove our local breed and its because of people like u that I have decided to work and improve them..this is so sad...a true dog lover doesn't condemn any dog.
U said u put some of ur pups DAT were nt up to ur standard down .Any one who loves dogs wouldn't do dat except if they were in a serious incurable pain.No dog deserves to die.
U say we dont have good dogs ,pls kindly tell me d attributes of a good dog so I will understand u better. This is so disappointing.. so sad.

agboedeh:
pls get your facts right before posting
We have nothing to say but what I said in your thread made u think I was a (in ur own words)"seasoned dog guru." until u found out I owned a local dog ...very sad. Well, I don't blame people for looking down on our local dogs ,I blame the owners for nt taking good care of them.
Me owning a local dog doesn't mean I haven't studied and taking care of other breeds. Yea, its true that I haven't seen and gotten to know the kangal in real life because they are mostly found in turkey,america and remote part of Africa but not seeing a Caucasian, come on..they are every where.
Getting experience doesn't necessarily mean just owning a dog for ten years.Research comes in as well.
I know good and experienced dog breeders and I learned from them as well.I av also learned from my fellow nairalanders like Eveezy,rany4all,abbeg and so on.
pls don't confuse research with social media, yes u can Do ur research by viewing peoples opinion on social media but dats not wat research is only.
U are one of those Nigerians that condemn and disapprove our local breed and its because of people like u that I have decided to work and improve them..this is so sad...a true dog lover doesn't condemn any dog.
U said u put some of ur pups DAT were nt up to ur standard down .Any one who loves dogs wouldn't do dat except if they were in a serious incurable pain.No dog deserves to die.
U say we dont have good dogs ,pls kindly tell me d attributes of a good dog so I will understand u better. This is so disappointing.. so sad.

Disappointing, so sad that I put down an inferior dog? What am I supposed to do with the poor dogs?

agboedeh:
thanks,its good to know that our argument educated some people.having a dog is more than just feeding it.U need to dedicate ur time and effort into training .The type of training depends on d breed.I currently own a local dog but am I preparing to devote 15 years into making them a standard breed.I am studying d behaviour of my dog, doing my research online ,seeking advise from other experienced breeders cos I see a lot of potential in my dog.

this your project won't be easy and 15 years will be too small plus you need community effort o

IamAnderson:

do you need to have a cheetah to know it's the fastest land animal?
do you need to be a doctor to know malaria is caused by plasmodium?
some things are just facts that experience isn't needed to confirm
I have visited several forums and websites of dog breeders far more experienced than you are and they all say one thing then you're out here telling us you have "experience" because you train malinois?
I presently have videos in my phone showing kangals and COs doing things that you tell us they can't to back up all my claims and the only thing you have is the "experience" card you're so eager to play every time
you only have experience with one breed(which is the one you favour BTW) so stop flaunting your inadequate experience
anybody with logical reasoning and the internet not clouded with childish bigotry will be able to see what we are saying is very true
I have watched videos of it happening, I have a brain to understand what's going on, people all around the world have verified it as a fact and yet the only thing you have is "experience"
you are not the only breeder/trainer in the world, you are not even the best so you have no right to say the googled facts and videos are false
I get you love your dogs but facts are facts...you and all the people supporting you still haven't given any proof of the things you're saying
meanwhile, I have posted the specs and pics of the dogs I'm arguing about and I also have numerous videos of the things happening (which I'm not able to post) and yet your greatest counter argument is " you have more experience "
I have videos of COs and kangals flipping grown men,countering agitation sticks,being beaten with rods and overpowering the intruder with the rod without backing down even after you said they have lost their glory over the years.
I even have videos of COs jumping fences to get to intruders and taking on multiple attackers at once without backing down missing their target and turning back to attack immediately again, all things you made it look like they couldn't do
until you can share valid proof to back up your claim, stop telling us about experience or gameness
either you give any other valid point of argument that hasn't already been successfully dismissed as stipulation by me or someone else or you accept defeat, stop all this experience bullcrap

Oluomoadebayo had a rott from one of the best bloodlines in Europe he gave out for free don't think he only has experience with malinois.

oluomoadebayo:


I have trained a CO, Rotweiller, GSD and even a Boerboel but I don't have experience with big dogs?

For instance, I know you can't apply pressure to a Rotweiller until he fully matured. I know A CO needs enough socialization with a slow and gentle approach before he reaches his full potential. Yet, I don't have experience with them. I'm not interested in who is wrong or right but a fair argument with no attack. Like is said before and I'm sorry to respond to this, I'm no longer responding to you. This thread is about my program and not about your ideal or beliefs. I wish you the best and stay safe with your CO.

Well you have trained a CO Before and you stated things that the CO wasn't able to do, but I showed you screenshots of videos of COs doing all of them
That just shows that you're not as good a trainer as you made us believe
This argument was as fair as can be,
you stated your opinion,
I said they where wrong,
you insisted,
I posted googled facts,
you said googled facts could be inaccurate,
I posted video clips of the things I said happening,
you still call them my beliefs even though I proved them to you as facts.....
The videos weren't animated where they?
You are still my favourite Nigerian trainer despite all this....I just had to call you out on your mistake
Even professors are wrong sometimes just take your "L" like a man

space9880:


Oluomoadebayo had a rott from one of the best bloodlines in Europe he gave out for free don't think he only has experience with malinois.

The guy is undoubtedly a good trainer he's just wrong about the things he said
There are also people that can train dogs better than he can, and he can't just put down things that are happening as opinions and beliefs because he trained a couple rotts and COs in Nigeria

oluomoadebayo:

I have an idea of every ringsport in the world but you won't see me saying anything when the real sportsmen or women are talking. All I do is to listen and learn because I don't have the privilege to be where they are.

Exactly why I said I get you, it is actually annoying for someone who doesn't have as much experience as you to correct you but get this.....
How would you feel if one of the ringsport players says that there is a technique he used in which him and his opponent levitated throughout the length of the match?
Would you just "listen and learn" or just realize the person is lying immediately.
Then what if you later check the websites of other ringsport legends and you see that no such technique exists then you tell that other guy only to watch him tell you that you can never understand because you are not a ringsport player?
That's how I feel when you tell me what I'm seeing in other countries is my opinion because I don't have experience like you
I may not have experience but I have eyes, a brain to understand, and internet to see what other experienced people are doing
The videos are not animated and I have like 20 of them.

ImFortress:


Paul?

Yes, Paul was the photographer.

oluomoadebayo:


It is obvious you know nothing about dogs other than the online information. Working dogs is about effectiveness, not size. I will stop arguing with you because I have less time for facebook trainer like you. Good luck with your theory and stay safe. Before, I leave here is a link where caucasian are being trained to attack.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL-lnkKoS5o

@IamAnderson are you blind to what I wrote here before you are saying rubbish? I guess you are only interested in attacking me without even reading my comment on CO. You are just here wasting people's time with your ranting. Read between the lines again and stop the nonsense you are writing. I know the strength and weaknesses of a proper CO but you know nothing.

oluomoadebayo:


Most dogs you mentioned will run away under serious pressure from an intruder. People are breeding them for size now instead of the spirit.

This is what you said that caught my attention.. The way you made it look like big dogs weren't effective
I'm not wasting anybody's time here because I'm the only one here with pics to back up what he's saying
I'm not here to attack you I'm just trying to tell you what you said is wrong

oluomoadebayo:


I will not even test with a bullet. I only need a water bottle or a little agitation stick.

I showed you pics of COs countering the water bottle and agitation stick attack without backing Down unlike you said they would.....

oluomoadebayo:


I will not ruin your dog by any means but I can hit with my legs. No weapon and I might wear a padded costume. You are free to record. If your dog attacked without running away, you win.

I can do it anytime this week.

This was also wrong, I have a video of COs dodging the kicks of intruders and still attacking them without backing down

I'm just going to be quoting all the things you said that I proved were wrong so you'll see that I'm not attacking you, rather correcting the false things you were telling people

oluomoadebayo:


Anyone that is reading silently, do not buy Caucasian in the name of security in Nigeria. If you do, find a dog trainer to test the dog before risking your life on the animal.

You made it look like they where terrible guard dogs here also, I also showed that they were awesome at their jobs when well trained like other guard dogs

If internet knowledge is so dismissable, how come you taught I was a trainer before you found out I didn't even have a pure bred CO?
I still Stand by the same facts you still haven't proven wrong, malinois are excellent dogs for tracking chasing and sniffing out things but they are not better guard dogs than well trained pure bred COs and other guard breeds
COs and other big dogs are also more lethal In an attack than any malinois
A malinois cannot take down a kangal or CO in a fight
A malinois is not a very strong or deadly dog
Malinois are only used in the military because of their speed,size, health,agility and mental capability not because they are better than every other dog
A well trained kangal or CO can properly attack intruders and guard a place or person well, they are not as slow, stupid and useless as you made them seem
Malinois are better working dogs but not better guard dogs
These dogs are two different dogs for two different purposes, don't make it look like the malinois can do the work of every dog better than the dogs that were actually bred for them
They are both good at what they do, don't downgrade a breed to hype your product

I don't have any vendetta against you olumoadebayo and I'm not trying to attack you
I'm still a fan of your work and I still admire your dogs
I'm not looking for any bad blood between us, don't take it personal....they're just facts that even you can't change

This thread derailed so hard...
Please those of you battling olumuadebayo here should kindly delete your previous comments.I've deleted mine already to free up space.So people actually interested in the malinois topic shouldn't be disappointed.

IamAnderson:

See what I said earlier?
You are now focusing on my untrained impure CO to make it look like you're right about your claims
We both know im not a dog trainer so why not focus on the dogs of other professional dog trainers like the ones I posted let's see if you were right about the things you said

Bros, I really dont know y u re pained. The fact that someone picked a particalar breed doesnt mean he has not worked with others. You are taking this argument too emotional, probably cos u own a cauc. I do not own a malinois either, but I have owned a Gsd, Cauc, rott, Boerboel, Neopolitan mastiff, local dogs. I may also not be a proffesional dog trainer, but I have seen trainers work thier dogs, A caucasian is a strong breed, a good guard dog, but when u want to get a work done effectively, you dont use a caucasian. I didnt wanna speak on this thread again because it seemed like u ve already made up ur mind, nd no one can try convince u.

There are so many things a malinois will do, that a caucasian cant be used for as regards guarding.
When Olumoadebayo is talking about first hand experience, he is not saying it to rub it on ur face, but to make u understand that its not just by seeing on videos, u need to go out of ur way and watch how these breed of dogs are handled, u watched videos which dey uploaded, but u didnt know how dey got dere, u didnt see d rigorous training nd task carried out, a cauc will not handle d training a malinois will. Guarding and also been used for general security goes beyond barking nd attacking an intruder as depicted in d screenshots u uploaded. Now this staged scenerio u uploaded, arent dey like scenes? But forget abt dt, lets take dis scenario, u parked ur car to open ur gate wit ur glass down, you have a cauc and malinois in ur compound, a car jacker, quickly entered ur car and wanna drive away, which of those dogs would be able to stop the car thief?

If u check some of my thread, I visited a known cauc breeder, there is this guy pumba, he is big and fvcking aggresive, his size is an added advantage in taking an intruder down, but there are so many things that pumba cant do, even if trained, pumba cant be given the task that a malinois will do.

When I talk about effectiveness, u should say malinois. I am not saying malinois is the best in the world, we also have the Working Gsds that do what Malinois do.

Do not take this personal, am not trying to support anybody. To an average Nigerian, an aggressive big dog like cauc an co is sufficient, but to a proffesional dog trainer, what they look at is efficiency nd effectiveness. The videos u uploaded, check the trainers out and see the dogs they keep, do a background check, do not jst watch d videos of dogs they train

Eveezy:

Bros, I really dont know y u re pained. The fact that someone picked a particalar breed doesnt mean he has not worked with others. You are taking this argument too emotional, probably cos u own a cauc. I do not own a malinois either, but I have owned a Gsd, Cauc, rott, Boerboel, Neopolitan mastiff, local dogs. I may also not be a proffesional dog trainer, but I have seen trainers work thier dogs, A caucasian is a strong breed, a good guard dog, but when u want to get a work done effectively, you dont use a caucasian. I didnt wanna speak on this thread again because it seemed like u ve already made up ur mind, nd no one can try convince u.

There are so many things a malinois will do, that a caucasian cant be used for as regards guarding.
When Olumoadebayo is talking about first hand experience, he is not saying it to rub it on ur face, but to make u understand that its not just by seeing on videos, u need to go out of ur way and watch how these breed of dogs are handled, u watched videos which dey uploaded, but u didnt know how dey got dere, u didnt see d rigorous training nd task carried out, a cauc will not handle d training a malinois will. Guarding and also been used for general security goes beyond barking nd attacking an intruder as depicted in d screenshots u uploaded. Now this staged scenerio u uploaded, arent dey like scenes? But forget abt dt, lets take dis scenario, u parked ur car to open ur gate wit ur glass down, you have a cauc and malinois in ur compound, a car jacker, quickly entered ur car and wanna drive away, which of those dogs would be able to stop the car thief?

If u check some of my thread, I visited a known cauc breeder, there is this guy pumba, he is big and fvcking aggresive, his size is an added advantage in taking an intruder down, but there are so many things that pumba cant do, even if trained, pumba cant be given the task that a malinois will do.

When I talk about effectiveness, u should say malinois. I am not saying malinois is the best in the world, we also have the Working Gsds that do what Malinois do.

Do not take this personal, am not trying to support anybody. To an average Nigerian, an aggressive big dog like cauc an co is sufficient, but to a proffesional dog trainer, what they look at is efficiency nd effectiveness. The videos u uploaded, check the trainers out and see the dogs they keep, do a background check, do not jst watch d videos of dogs they train

u just mentioned wat the malinios has over the Caucasians and kangals.Yes,wen its a "chase and hold down" situation,the Mali has more advantage but when its a "face head on"situation, the Caucasians and kangals has more advantage. For example,A girl is in her yard alone with a very huge kangal by her side,if a heavily bodied man decide to come and attack her ,the kangal would simply do more damage to the man than a malinios would do.
it's not in every situation that guarding involves just chasing and biting down an intruder.Sometimes it involves brutal strength ,intimidation and bravery.A kangal would do more damage than a malinios .
U talked about effectiveness. U can't say a malinios is more effective than a caucasian. They were both bred for diff purposes.
U said wat a dog trainer looks for is effectiveness and efficiency. Efficiency in what exactly? A trainer might decide to train dogs that are effectively used in guarding livestock, are u trying to say a Mali is more efficient than a co in that field.A trainer might also decide to train dogs used in d military and other task forces which the malinios is obviously better.
What started this argument is when the op said that all those big dogs like Caucasians, kangal ,rott would run away under serious pressure from an intruder and i simply told him its not true.

oluomoadebayo:


Disappointing, so sad that I put down an inferior dog? What am I supposed to do with the poor dogs?

Well,U must have heard of a kennel called DARK DYNESTY K9.He trains top security dogs.In an interview, he said that when his bitch litters, he would watch them closely and choose the best dog that has more drive to learn and protect,while he sells off those that are not up to his standard.
Maybe that would have been a better option for u than to kill them.

agboedeh:
u just mentioned wat the malinios has over the Caucasians and kangals.Yes,wen its a "chase and hold down" situation,the Mali has more advantage but when its a "face head on"situation, the Caucasians and kangals has more advantage. For example,A girl is in her yard alone with a very huge kangal by her side,if a heavily bodied man decide to come and attack her ,the kangal would simply do more damage to the man than a malinios would do.
it's not in every situation that guarding involves just chasing and biting down an intruder.Sometimes it involves brutal strength ,intimidation and bravery.A kangal would do more damage than a malinios .
U talked about effectiveness. U can't say a malinios is more effective than a caucasian. They were both bred for diff purposes.
U said wat a dog trainer looks for is effectiveness and efficiency. Efficiency in what exactly? A trainer might decide to train dogs that are effectively used in guarding livestock, are u trying to say a Mali is more efficient than a co in that field.A trainer might also decide to train dogs used in d military and other task forces which the malinios is obviously better.
What started this argument is when the op said that all those big dogs like Caucasians, kangal ,rott would run away under serious pressure from an intruder and i simply told him its not true.

Like u said more damage, but a malinois would do damage, murder is a crime punishable by law, if ur dog kills, u re d one to be charged after the dog has been put down. In ur scenario of the heavily bodied man, if a kangal and malinois were there, the malinois will be d first to apprehend the intruder. Effectiveness in carrying out all guarding functions in a home. kangal and cauc are restricted to bark nd attack. But they wont be effective in certain scenerios like d one I gave earlier

Eveezy:

Like u said more damage, but a malinois would do damage, murder is a crime punishable by law, if ur dog kills, u re d one to be charged after the dog has been put down. In ur scenario of the heavily bodied man, if a kangal and malinois were there, the malinois will be d first to apprehend the intruder. Effectiveness in carrying out all guarding functions in a home. kangal and cauc are restricted to bark nd attack. But they wont be effective in certain scenerios like d one I gave earlier

self defence is not murder. If a kangal kills a man DAT wants to attack or kill his owner,its nt murder and the kangal would nt be put down.In my scenario, there was no chasing and apprehending involved. What was involved was the dog standing its ground and defending its owner by all means.

Eveezy:

Effectiveness in carrying out all guarding functions in a home.

Yea,but a malinios is nt more effective than a kangal in guarding the yard.A trained kangal would attack under orders and would stop if asked to.Let me remind u that kangal are fast and can actually chase down thieves.They are nt as bulky and lazy as other big dogs.Most kangal are actually tall and lean with heavy muscles.
They carry out all guard functions ,they jump,they chase,they are loyal,they are smart and will fight to the death.I would love to know other functions that I am missing cos like I said,we are all here to learn.