nutarious:
Lets solve this like this

You can be a Father to your House

You can also be a Consultant Doctor at work


You can also be a Chief, a Head or a Pastor in Church


All your roles present 3 persons in relationship

The Question will be that, are this 3 personality one?

As a Doctor there is a way you would have behaved,

As a Pastor it will be different

Same goes as a Father to your children


All this talks of relationships

Check this scripture

Isaiah 33:22 For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.

Same person 3 Roles that are not same.


Father, Word =Jesus and the Holy Spirit.


I heard aquirment that Jesus Called God God, but there are scripture where The Father called the Son God too?


You doubt me?

Let's use Jehovah witness scripture

From the Edited version Jehovah witness came up with, God is saying the Throne of the Son Is God.

Funny how the Devil blinded the Author to tru and change this scripture but it doesn't make sence with alignment to Jehovah witness doctrine that Jesus throne will be God?


So let's use other Interpretations or Version, i use King James well accepted most



Hebrews 1:8-9 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.


In King James, The Father called the Son God


The Question the Jehovah Witness Scholars have not answered is if Jesus throne is a God throne then He is God.

Remember Ephesians 1 vs 10 Butress this Point.


The Son was nevee the Son from the Beginning, the disrespect many of you have for Jesus is because He came down and Become the Son and carey Flesh, this was the Revelation J9hn 1vs 1 is helping us to understand especially if you check the Word Was.


3 personality but same God.

Trinity is not God occupying three different offices rather God existing in three distinct consciousness.
Personalities does not mean offices but consciousness.
That is the meaning of plurality of persons.
In Genesis God said let us make man in our image, he wasnt speaking to offices but rather one person of the trinity speaking to the other persons of the trinity.

IS JESUS EQUAL TO JEHOVAH?

*1 Corinthians 15:28 – This verse identifies a change in the Son's position relative to the Father. What is the Son's position before subjecting himself to the Father? Equal to! This verse describes a change in position. The Son "becomes subject" to the Father. This means that at some point he is not subject and he changes position to "become subject." Note the presence of "when" and "then" in the verse.



DOES JESUS SHARE JEHOVAH'S GLORY?

*Isaiah 6:1-5 with John 12:37-41 – Isaiah's vision of Jehovah's glory is applied by John to Jesus in verse 41. He says Isaiah saw his glory. Who did John mean by [his] and who did Isaiah see?
*Isaiah 42:8 with John 17:5 – Jehovah will not share his glory yet Jesus has glory alongside Jehovah
*John 12:45 – Can any creature claim this? No. Jesus is not like any created being.
*Isaiah 48:11 – Jehovah will not give his glory to anyone else.



IS JESUS THE EXACT REPRESENTATION OF THE FATHER?

*John 12:45 – He that beholds me beholds him that sent me
*2 Corinthians 4:4 – Christ, who is the image of God
*Hebrews 1:3 – the exact representation of his very being
*John 8:19 – if you knew me, you would know my Father also
*John 12:44 – he who puts faith in me
*John 14:7-9 – know me, know my Father also
Colossians 2:9 – Theotes vs. Theiotes or (Essence vs. Quality)



IS JESUS MASTER?

*Colossians 3:24 – Slave for the Master, Christ



WHO IS THE STUMBLING STONE?

Jehovah

*Isaiah 8:13-14 – Who? Jehovah.

Jesus

*1 Peter 2:6-8 – Who? Jesus.



HOLY SPIRIT SENT IN WHOSE NAME?

Father

*Luke 10:17 – Father's name.

Jesus

*John 14:26 – Jesus' name

Colossians 2:9 – Theotes vs. Theiotes or (Essence vs. Quality)

The Deity of Christ and the
New World Translation of the Jehovah's Witnesses








Note: verse references marked with a "*" indicate a clear reference to Christ's Deity in the NWT.



WHO IS GOD?

Jehovah

*Deuteronomy 6:4 – Jehovah our God is one Jehovah
*Deuteronomy 32:39 – no gods with Jehovah

No Other "Gods"

*Isaiah 44:6-8 – besides me there is no God. There is no Rock besides me.
*Isaiah 43:10 – Before me there was no God formed.
*Isaiah 45:5, 22 – with the exception of me there is no God.
*Isaiah 46:8-11 – no other God, nor anyone like me.

No Other "gods"

*Deuteronomy 32:39 – no gods with Jehovah
*Exodus 20:2-3 – must not have any other gods



ALL OTHER GODS OR gods ARE FALSE

Baal

*Judges 6:31 – Baal, God

Dagon

*Judges 16:23-24 – Dagon, god

Satan

*2 Corinthians 4:4 – Satan, god

Herod

*Acts 12:21-23 – Herod, a god



ARE THERE MANY GODS OR MANY gods?

*Psalm 96:4-5 – One True God by nature
*Galatians 4:8 – those who by nature are not gods.
*1 Corinthians 8:4-5 – One God in 8:4. Verse 8:5 is referring to idols who by nature are not gods, as seen in Galatians 4:8

This helps us understand that being God is much more than a title or a name. It is the very nature of the being so described as God. God is God because of who he is, not because people call him God.



WHO IS LORD?

God

*Acts 17:24 – God, Lord of heaven and earth
*Ephesians 4:5-6 – One Lord... one God and Father
*Acts 4:24 – God... Sovereign Lord
*Acts 17:24 – God... Lord of Heaven and Earth

Jehovah

*Deuteronomy 10:17 – Jehovah is Lord of lords
*1Timothy 6:15 – Jehovah is Lord of lords

Jesus

*1 Corinthians 8:6 – one Lord, Jesus Christ
*Jude 4 – our only Owner and Lord, Jesus Christ
*Romans 10:9 – Jesus is Lord
*Revelation 17:14, 19:16 – Jesus is King of Kings and Lord of lords.
*Luke 2:11 – there was born to you today a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.

This verse (Luke 2:11) shows that Jesus was born Lord, not that he became Lord later.



HOW MANY LORDS ARE THERE?

One Lord

*Ephesians 4:5-6 – One Lord... one God and Father
*1 Corinthians 8:6 – one Lord, Jesus Christ
*Jude 4 – our only Owner and Lord, Jesus Christ



WHO IS SAVIOR?

God

*Titus 1:3 – Our Savior, God
*Titus 3:4 – Our Savior, God
*1 Timothy 1:1 – God, our Savior
*2 Samuel 22:3 – God my Savior
*Psalm 7:10 – God, a Savior
*Psalm 17:7 – God, o Savior
*Psalm 106:21 – God their Savior
*Isaiah 43:3 – God your Savior
*Isaiah 45:15 – God of Israel, a Savior
*Luke 1:47 – God my Savior
*1 Timothy 2:3 – our Savior, God
*1 Timothy 4:10 – God, who is a Savior
*Titus 2:10 – our Savior, God
*Jude 25 – the only God our Savior

Jehovah Alone

*Isaiah 43:11 – I am Jehovah and besides me there is no savior
*Isaiah 45:21 – Jehovah alone is Savior
*Hosea 13:4 – No savior but Jehovah
*Isaiah 49:26 – I, Jehovah, am your Savior and Repurchaser
*Isaiah 60:16 – I, Jehovah, am your Savior and Repurchaser

Jesus

*Philippians 3:20 – we are eagerly waiting for a savior, the Lord Jesus Christ
Titus 2:13 – we wait for the happy hope and glorious manifestation of the great God and of [the] Savior of us, Jesus Christ.
NWT introduces [the] into the previous verse to obscure that Jesus is called God there.
*Titus 1:4 – God [the] Father and Christ Jesus our Savior
*Titus 3:6 – Jesus Christ our Savior
2 Peter 1:1 – our God and [the] Savior Jesus Christ.
NWT adds [the] to the previous verse to obscure the fact that Jesus is called God there.
*John 4:42 – the savior of the world
*Acts 5:31 – Chief Agent and Savior
*Acts 13:23 – a savior, Jesus
*Ephesians 5:23 – a savior of [this] body
*2 Timothy 1:10 – our Savior, Christ
*2 Peter 1:11 – the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ
*2 Peter 2:20 – the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ
*2 Peter 3:2 – Who is being spoken of here? Jehovah or Jesus?
*2 Peter 3:18 – our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ
*1 John 4:14 – the Father has sent forth his Son as Savior of the world



WHO IS OWNER AND LORD?

Jesus

*Jude 4 – our only Owner and Lord, Jesus

IS JESUS MASTER?

*Colossians 3:24 – Slave for the Master, Christ



WHO IS THE STUMBLING STONE?

Jehovah

*Isaiah 8:13-14 – Who? Jehovah.

Jesus

*1 Peter 2:6-8 – Who? Jesus.



HOLY SPIRIT SENT IN WHOSE NAME?

Father

*Luke 10:17 – Father's name.

Jesus

*John 14:26 – Jesus' name



WHO DO WE SERVE?

Jehovah alone

*Matthew 4:10 – Then Jesus said to him: "Go away, Satan! For it is written, 'It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.'"

God and Jesus

*James 1:1 – James, a slave of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ

Jesus

*Romans 1:1 – Paul, a slave of Jesus
*2 Corinthians 5:15 – Live for him who died for us
*Galatians 1:10 – Christ's slave
*Philippians 1:1 – Paul and Timothy, slaves of Jesus
*Colossians 3:24 – slave for the Master, Christ
*Colossians 4:12 – Epaphras, a slave of Jesus Christ
*Jude 1 – Jude, a slave of Jesus Christ



CHRIST'S HUMILIATION OR EMPTYING OF HIMSELF TO BECOME A MAN

*Philippians 2:7 – he emptied himself
*John 14:28 – The Father is greater than I am
*John 20:17 – I am ascending to my God and your God
*Acts 17:30-31 – he purposes to judge by a man he has appointed
*1 Corinthians 11:3 – Is this quality of being? Is man by nature superior to woman? Or is this headship which does not imply any innate superior quality of the one holding the headship? Yes. See 1 Corinthians 15:28.

CHRIST'S HUMILIATION OR EMPTYING OF HIMSELF TO BECOME A MAN

*Philippians 2:7 – he emptied himself
*John 14:28 – The Father is greater than I am
*John 20:17 – I am ascending to my God and your God
*Acts 17:30-31 – he purposes to judge by a man he has appointed
*1 Corinthians 11:3 – Is this quality of being? Is man by nature superior to woman? Or is this headship which does not imply any innate superior quality of the one holding the headship? Yes. See 1 Corinthians 15:28.



WHO HAS WITNESSES?

Jehovah

*Isaiah 43:10 – "You are my witnesses" says Jehovah
*Isaiah 44:6-8 – you are my witnesses

Jesus

*Acts 1:8 – You will be witnesses of me
*Acts 13:31 – who are now his witnesses
Acts 8:35 – Philip witnessed about Jesus

IS JESUS MICHAEL?

*Daniel 10:13, 21 – Michael, one of the foremost princes
*Daniel 12:1 – Michael will stand up
*Jude 9 – when Michael had a difference with the Devil he did not dare to bring a judgment against him
*Luke 4:8 – Jesus rebukes Satan
*Hebrews 1:6 – Let all God's angels worship him
*Philippians 2:9 – the name that is above every other name
*Hebrews 1:6 – Jesus is above all angels. The text does not say "all other angels." It says all angels and shows that Jesus is not included in that group. Thus he cannot be Michael the Archangel.

COME TOGETHER IN JESUS' NAME

*Matthew 18:20 – where 2 or 3 are gathered in my name



HEALING COMES IN JESUS' NAME

*Acts 4:7-10 – Healed a lame man by faith in the name of Jesus
*Acts 3:16 – his name, by [our] faith in his name, has made this man strong



SIGNS COME IN JESUS' NAME

*Acts 4:30 – signs and portents occur through the name of your holy servant Jesus



DEMONS ARE SUBJECT TO JESUS' NAME

*Luke 10:17 – the demons are made subject to us by the use of your name



WHO ANSWERS PRAYER?

Father

*John 15:16 – Father's name

Jesus

*John 14:13-14 – Jesus answers
*Luke 10:17 – Jesus' name
*Acts 7:59-60 – Stephen prayed to Jesus



IS CHRIST IN US?

John 15:4-5 – NWT says 'in union with us'. This is especially inconsistent seeing that similar Greek construction 'in the vine' doesn't have 'union with' inserted into it.
John 17:23, 26 – Why 'union with' added to verse 23? In verse 26 same phrase of love 'in them' doesn't say 'in union with'.
Romans 8:9-10 – God's spirit in you... Christ in union with you. Vs. 9 shows the Spirit "in you." Vs. 10 says Christ is "in union with you." This obscures our deep personal relationship with Christ, with him living "in us." In verse 9 "in you" comes from Greek [en humin]. Vs. 10 also says [en humin] but the NWT chooses to obscure the issue by translating it as "in union with." Why the inconsistency?
2 Corinthians 13:5 – Jesus in us is the test of the faith. Once again NWT has added 'union with.' More examples of addition of 'union with': Galatians 1:15-16, Galatians 2:20



IS CHRIST'S SPIRIT EQUAL TO GOD'S SPIRIT

*Romans 8:9 – True Christians have God's spirit and Christ's spirit dwelling in them.



WHO RAISED JESUS?

God

*1 Thessalonians 1:9-10 – Whom he [God] raised up from the dead
*Acts 2:24 – God raised Jesus from the dead.

Jesus

*John 2:19, 21 – I will raise it up



WHO IS THE JUDGE OF MAN?

Jesus

*John 5:22-23 – Jesus
*2 Corinthians 5:10 – Jesus



WHO IS LORD OF THE SABBATH?

Jesus

*Matthew 12:8 – Jesus



JESUS' CLAIMS ABOUT HIMSELF

*John 5:18 – The Jews understood Jesus made himself equal with God.
*John 10:28-33 – The Jews said "You make yourself God."
*John 10:36 – "I am God's Son" is a claim to a unique relationship with God. Jews considered it blasphemy because Jesus was claiming to be God by saying this. They wanted to stone him. There are five reasons for stoning:

Spiritism Leviticus 20:27; Blasphemy Leviticus 24:10-23; False Prophecy Deuteronomy 13:5-10; Stubborn son Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Adultery or rape Deuteronomy 22:21-24 Leviticus 20:10



JESUS AT BIRTH

Lord

*Luke 2:11 – there was born to you today a Savior, who is Christ the Lord. Did Jesus become Lord later or was he Lord from birth?

Christ

*Luke 2:11 – there was born to you today a Savior, who is Christ the Lord. Did Jesus become the Christ at his baptism by John? This verse shows that Jesus was born the Christ. Born today, who is the Christ, not "who will become" the Christ

Janosky:


**1)
Isaiah 7:14...
10 And יהוה spoke again to Aḥaz, saying,
11 “Ask a sign for yourself from יהוה your
Elohim; make deep the request or make it
high.”
12 But Aḥaz said, “I do not ask nor try יהוה!”
13 And he said, “Hear now, O house of
Dawiḏ! Is it not enough that you weary men,
that you weary my Elohim also?
14 “Therefore יהוה Himself gives you a sign:
Look, the maiden conceives and gives birth
to a Son, and shall call His Name
Immanu’ĕl "
Compare Isaiah 9:6.

Solite3 FRAUD theorist exposed....
Isaiah 7:10-14, Yahweh NEVER said he is the son conceived by the maiden.
Solite3 ,Isaiah 7:10-14. 9:6. Matt1:23, do NOT support the FRAUD you have manufactured.

**@2).

Dubious solite3, Daniel 7:13,14, "He was given authority, glory and sovereign power",
who gave Jesus ( the son of man ) that "authority" in heaven?
** I challenge You to dodge my question.

"Greek "ego eimi" meaning ' I exist'
John8:58 Jesus says,"before Abraham was born, I have been in existence."
,John8:1-59, Christ NEVER said he is the God of Abraham.
Acts 3:13 and Exodus 3:14,15, Jesus Christ is NOT the God of Abraham and Moses.

**John10:29,33-36 ,Jesus DISPROVE your fraud of John10 vs30-33.
Rom15:6,'one voice' means agreement.
Matt 19:5,6 'one' means agreement.,NOT one being.
1 Cor6:16,'one' is agreement of illicit (sex) covenant, NOT one being.
John10:29, "my Father is greater than all.
John10:30" my Father and I are (in agreement).

Solite3 fraud theorist, eleyi gidigaan of lie,lie.

I have shown you countless facts and all you could do is throw insult. Only the truth can set you free.
Jehovah witness organisation demostrated their hatred for christianity in their magazines and teachings.
Christianity is has the truth only the spirit of antichrist hate the truth.

solite3:



fullness of the Godhead (see Colossians 2:9). A better analogy is that space contains three dimensions, yet the dimensions are not ‘parts’ — the concept of ‘space’ is meaningless without all three dimensions.

The Hebrew word used in the above verse of scripture is ELOHIYM. That's what your English bible rendered as Godhead.
So what do you make of that?

solite3:
Trinity is not God occupying three different offices rather God existing in three distinct consciousness.
Personalities does not mean offices but consciousness.
That is the meaning of plurality of persons.
In Genesis God said let us make man in our image, he wasnt speaking to offices but rather one person of the trinity speaking to the other persons of the trinity.

Hello dhear, Dealing with Jehovah Witness all over the years have made me realise they are not interested in discussing but winning theological point.

Am only trying to use logic for those that's interested in learning.

Now trying to understand that what you call office is unique to Trinitarian, The Offices has three consciousness of persons heading it.

John arqueing says 3 bear witness and yet are one in their consciousness. But since its a JW thread, i need no go further.

Nobody can talk much of God among creation other than God Himself.

All Men are Rebellious, as much as Adam is, Rebellion is a seed sold to Abraham.

Rebellion has to do with self control, self aggravation, pride etc.

Now tracing the Deity of Jesus will be hard without John the Beloved revelation.

Because Men are Rebellious its easy to never believe God can come in Flesh. Even Thomas doubted despite everything he Heard until he saw.

So either way you want to believe, Rebellion lives in us all.

But John wanted to trace the Deity of the Man Jesus to Origin. He told us His name was not Jesus from Origin but The Word.

The Word was never a Son from beginning and if we dwell on that then you wouldn't disrespect The Word and utter all form of ridiculous statements.

John said the Word became and that's why problems started for JW.

Lets go back to the Deity of the Word and give me a Scripture that makes the Word inferior? None, but immediately The word carried Flesh, inferiority started which is understandable base on his assignment.


There is an Office of the Christ, the Christ is an office that must be occupy by anyone who can open the Scroll.

Such one will rule the whole creation and even that which was existing in God.

The Word, transformed to Jesus a Flesh Man became he won solve the riddle and became the Christ.

Note especially in Ephesians 1 vs 10


Ephesians 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:


If its really knowledge, why would God allow a lesser creation to Administer Authority over even the reality in God as the last part of 1 vs 10 said, "even in Him" ref to God.

The Trinity is a hard nut to crack for small mind like those on this platform. Why? They are sourcing information from letters and comparing letter for letter, that's foolishly.

The letter killleth.

solite3:

@1)
IS JESUS EQUAL TO JEHOVAH?

*1 Corinthians 15:28 – This verse identifies a change in the Son's position relative to the Father. What is the Son's position before subjecting himself to the Father? Equal to! This verse describes a change in position. The Son "becomes subject" to the Father. This means that at some point he is not subject and he changes position to "become subject."


@2)
IS JESUS THE EXACT REPRESENTATION OF THE FATHER?

*John 12:45 – He that beholds me beholds him that sent me"

@1)
"It Is Only Fools Who Dont Believe Jesus Is The Almighty God And They Will Die ! by bingbagbo(m): 7:24am On Sep 24"

**** 1 Cor15:24-28,bingbagbo and solite3, your "Almighty God " is subject to his Father in heaven (Rev3:5,12) and earth (John 14:28)...
You guys are amateur ,apprentice comedians.


@2*)
John 12:45,He that beholds Osinbade, beholds bubu who sent Osinbade.. ..
You know what. ... Osinbade is "THE EXACT REPRESENTATION OF bubu.....
Osinbade is bubu ...
Oh what aa "bingbagbo" and "solite3" qwarashion! !!!!

nutarious:


Hello dhear, Dealing with Jehovah Witness all over the years have made me realise they are not interested in discussing but winning theological point.

Am only trying to use logic for those that's interested in learning.

.

***2 Corinthians 11:31. Ephesians 1:3.
"The God and Father of the Lord Jesus, He who is blessed forever, knows that I am not lying. "

The Holy scriptures ,Ephesians 1:17 says your logic is Faulty and FRAUD.
.

nutarious:






*@1)



The Word was never a Son from beginning and if we dwell on that then you wouldn't disrespect The Word and utter all form of ridiculous statements.

John said the Word became and that's why problems started for JW.

@2)
Lets go back to the Deity of the Word and give me a Scripture that makes the Word inferior? None, but immediately The word carried Flesh, inferiority started which is understandable base on his assignment.


@3)

Note especially in Ephesians 1 vs 10

Ephesians 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:


If its really knowledge, why would God allow a lesser creation to Administer Authority over even the reality in God as the last part of 1 vs 10 said, "even in Him" ref to God.

The Trinity is a hard nut to crack for small mind like those on this platform. Why? They are sourcing information from letters and comparing letter for letter, that's foolishly.

The letter killleth.

@1)
Which letter killeth?
John 17:17,the words of the Father of Jesus is Truth. If you really believe it,please Explain Romans8:3 ,who is Jesus before he took on the likeness of men?

@2)
John 14:28,Jesus says he is the Son inferior to his Father.
Revelation 3:5,12 .Is Jesus Christ the Father's Son in the spiritual realm?
Is the physical realm stronger than the spiritual realm?

Ephesians 1:3-10, by whose will are all things gathered together in the Christ?
Ephesians 1:17, 2Cor11:31, is Paul in agreement with your claims?
Your honest answers, please Nutarious.
Dodge none.

solite3:
I have shown you countless facts and all you could do is throw insult. Only the truth can set you free.
Jehovah witness organisation demostrated their hatred for christianity in their magazines and teachings.
Christianity is has the truth only the spirit of antichrist hate the truth.

You resort to throwing tantrums because the Holy Bible has exposed your fraud.
The Antichrist doesn't believe that Jesus says he is the son of God in heaven and earth.
Revelation 3:5,12 and John 20:17.14:28. 6:46.

donnie:


The Hebrew word used in the above verse of scripture is ELOHIYM. That's what your English bible rendered as Godhead.
So what do you make of that?

Godhead refers to the nature of God meaning the very essence of God.
Its greek word for it is theotes or so.

nutarious:


Hello dhear, Dealing with Jehovah Witness all over the years have made me realise they are not interested in discussing but winning theological point.

Am only trying to use logic for those that's interested in learning.

Now trying to understand that what you call office is unique to Trinitarian, The Offices has three consciousness of persons heading it.

John arqueing says 3 bear witness and yet are one in their consciousness. But since its a JW thread, i need no go further.

Mostly true but there are some Jehovah witness I have meant that showed interest for theological change perhaps because of how I poimted out their error from the bible but unfortunately I didnt spend enough time with him it takes tact, and wisdom in dealing with Jehovah witnesses.

Yes the three persons of the trinity occupy different offices but the three different offices is not what makes God trinity but the different persons of the Godhead.
I have head many people say Jesus is the same person as the father and the holy Spirit, no that is not correct rather Jesus is not the father neither is the father the holy Spirit (different persons completely) but they all are one same God. In the case of an office or a position , one person can occupy different offices but he is still the same person.
It is not omnipresence, as one person can be everywhere at the same time but he remains same person.
All persons of the trinity has been from eternity, their personality do not change or interchange.
Jesus remains the eternal son of God from eternity, God the father remains so eternally, the Holy Ghost remains so eternally. The name father, Son and Holy Ghost reflects their order, personality and relationship with themselves, it does not denote superiority or inferiority.

Janosky:


@1)
"It Is Only Fools Who Dont Believe Jesus Is The Almighty God And They Will Die ! by bingbagbo(m): 7:24am On Sep 24"

**** 1 Cor15:24-28,bingbagbo and solite3, your "Almighty God " is subject to his Father in heaven (Rev3:5,12) and earth (John 14:28)...
You guys are amateur ,apprentice comedians.


@2*)
John 12:45,He that beholds Osinbade, beholds bubu who sent Osinbade.. ..
You know what. ... Osinbade is "THE EXACT REPRESENTATION OF bubu.....
Osinbade is bubu ...
Oh what aa "bingbagbo" and "solite3" qwarashion! !!!!

You display illogical foolishness smh
Proverbs 9:13
A foolish woman is clamorous: she is simple, and knoweth nothing.

johnw47:


how duh can one be, Jesus had a beginning as a man

lie lie™ barrister, so as to not cause you further confusion, i'm not replying for anyone else
who may believe diffrently to me, i am replying just for me





of course God(Father and the word) is the source of creation
as to your confusion about "sons of Jesus" it's been clearly explained to you
although i know that nothing is clear to you, by the way Jesus the man never had any flesh offspring




yes it's clear, but not to you, of course we are sons of the Father
we are sons of God
God is Father and the Word, john 1:1

No one is son of Jesus. He isnt the source ... He isnt the Creator . thats why no one is called his son.

solite3:
show me where it was written that all things were created through the father.

Heb 2:10 : What was created THROUGH through the Father ?

solite3:
Jesus is the source of God's creation Rev 3vv14.

Thanks for the bolded , Creation isnt even his own, how can he be source ?

Colossians 1vv16, says he created all things
John 1 says without him nothing can be created which was created.
This makes Jesus the source of creation and himself uncreated.
Being called the sons of God is base on relationship with the father and bearing his image . Animals are not called sons of God although they God's creation but they have not the image of God and do not have such relationship as a son to a father.
So being a Son to God is not the same as been created by him.

U are a liar , if your point is valid

Why is no one called son of Jesus ??

So if Jesus is source, Why is no one in his image ?

@ Solite3


Matthew 5:45 "
so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. "

Isnt it clear who is the source ?

In whose image are people made ?

.

Barristter07:


No one is son of Jesus. He isnt the source ... He isnt the Creator . thats why no one is called his son.

™lie lie barrister

truly, Jesus is God, john 1:1 plus many
Jesus is creator, john 1:3, plus more
which equals: Jesus is creator God, but of course you false jw's don't believe God's word, just mens words



Joh 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 
 
Joh 1:3  All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

solite3:
show me where it was written that all things were created through the father.

Below in the book of mark 13:19
Jesus himself reaffirms that his God his father is the creator of all things.

Mark 13:19 "For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be".

Here we are told that it was God that made all things through Christ Jesus.
Ephesians 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

God the Father is the creator of all things which he did through the agency of his son Jesus Christ.

Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Isaiah 45:18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he to be inhabited.

solite3:
Jesus is the source of God's creation Rev 3vv14.
Colossians 1vv16, says he created all things
John 1 says without him nothing can be created which was created.
This makes Jesus the source of creation and himself uncreated.
Being called the sons of God is base on relationship with the father and bearing his image. Animals are not called sons of God although they God's creation but they have not the image of God and do not have such relationship as a son to a father.
So being a Son to God is not the same as been created by him.

Another fact to prove that God is not a trinity.

Malachi 2:10 Have we not all one father? hath not ONE God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?

You can see the Israelites believed that God is one.

Barristter07:

@ Solite3

Matthew 5:45 " so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. "
Isnt it clear who is the source ?
In whose image are people made ?

Good point

solite3:

Mostly true but there are some Jehovah witness I have meant that showed interest for theological change perhaps because of how I poimted out their error from the bible but unfortunately I didnt spend enough time with him it takes tact, and wisdom in dealing with Jehovah witnesses.

Yes the three persons of the trinity occupy different offices but the three different offices is not what makes God trinity but the different persons of the Godhead.
I have head many people say Jesus is the same person as the father and the holy Spirit, no that is not correct rather Jesus is not the father neither is the father the holy Spirit (different persons completely) but they all are one same God. In the case of an office or a position , one person can occupy different offices but he is still the same person.
It is not omnipresence, as one person can be everywhere at the same time but he remains same person.
All persons of the trinity has been from eternity, their personality do not change or interchange.
Jesus remains the eternal son of God from eternity, God the father remains so eternally, the Holy Ghost remains so eternally. The name father, Son and Holy Ghost reflects their order, personality and relationship with themselves, it does not denote superiority or inferiority.

That's why it is called a fraud because it does not exist neither does God claim to be a trinity.

solite3:
your problem us that you dont understand trinity.

Trinity simply states that God is one being but exist as three individuals and that each individual or persons are distinct from each other but are one God.
God is a trinity of persons, we humans are not hence we find it dufficult to understand. It is like trying to understand four dimension using three or lower dimension. Your problem is that you are trying to box God into your level.

And where in the Bible is it stated?
If God wanted us to believe he was a trinity he would have alrightly told us rather than tell us he fathered a son, Jesus but he did not becos he is never a trinity.

solite3:
Jesus is God

Jesus is God – What does the Bible say about Jesus’ deity?
Does the Bible, which is the earliest and most historically reliable source, actually say Jesus is God? What does it tell us about Jesus and His identity?

Let’s take a brief look at a few of the many passages that clearly and consistently answer that question, straight from the pages of Scripture. We’ll begin by going back an additional 700 years before the life of Christ, to the Old Testament book of Isaiah.


Jesus is God – Prophecies
Divine Messiah predicted in the Old Testament
Isaiah 7:14: “Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.”1

“Immanuel” literally means: “God with us.” See also Matthew 1:23; Jesus was “God with us.”

This Messiah would be born a human son, but have a higher nature
Isaiah 9:6: “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.”

This was a radical statement coming from a monotheistic Jewish prophet -- especially calling a human being “Mighty God”; but one that God fulfilled centuries later in Christ.

A couple hundred years later, but still more than half a millennium before Jesus walked the earth, more was predicted about the Messiah’s divine nature
Daniel 7:13-14: “There before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven . . . He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.”

“Son of Man” was the primary title Jesus used for Himself -- and this passage shows that this was a clear and strong claim of deity. And in Mark, the earliest of the four Gospels, He also included the unmistakable phrase, “coming on the clouds of heaven” and applied it to Himself (Mark 14:62). His listeners got the point, refused to believe it, and added it to their reasons to try to kill Him.

Jesus is God – His Earthly Ministry
The baby Jesus worshiped by the Magi
Matthew 2:11: “On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him.”

Along with being led to the site where Jesus was born, these Magi were apparently informed by God about Jesus’ divine identity, and so they responded appropriately by worshiping Him.

Jesus accepted worship from His disciples
Matthew 14:32-33: “And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God.’”

In a Jewish culture, only the one true God can be worshiped; their actions show that they acknowledged Jesus as being divine. And Jesus didn’t correct them or say, “Don’t you realize that I’m just a mortal prophet? Stop worshiping me!” Rather, He accepted their worship, knowing He really was God in human flesh.

Jesus’ claim about Himself
John 8:58-59: "‘I tell you the truth,’ Jesus answered, ‘before Abraham was born, I am!’ At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.”

This is a powerful double claim from Jesus: first, that He pre-existed His human birth and was actually alive and present (as God) before Abraham; second, that His title was “I am” -- which was the same title used for Jehovah God in Exodus 3:14. His listeners again got the point, and picked up stones to execute Him!

Another of Jesus’ claims of deity
John 10:30-33: “‘I and the Father are one.’ Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus said to them, ‘I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?’ ‘We are not stoning you for any of these,’ replied the Jews, ‘but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.’”

What kind of lame logic is this?

solite3:
Trinity is not God occupying three different offices rather God existing in three distinct consciousness.
Personalities does not mean offices but consciousness.
That is the meaning of plurality of persons.
In Genesis God said let us make man in our image, he wasnt speaking to offices but rather one person of the trinity speaking to the other persons of the trinity.

Here is another clue that proves that the trinity doctrine is false.
In the book of Daniel 7:9, the prophet Daniel was given a vision of Heaven, in that vision he saw God the Father(Ancient of days) seated on his throne.

He also saw Jesus (Son of Man) been brought to the father.
and Dominion,glory and a kingdom that consists of the all people ,nation's and languages were given to him and his Dominion was an everlasting one. verse 13.

Here are key points to learn.
*God the Father ( ancient of days is different from his Son (Son of Man)
* Power,glory, Dominion were given to the son,Jesus by the father.


Daniel 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. 7:10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened. 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.