Azuka.O:

@ Truly and Amalaaba

It is a pity the way you reason despite your presumed education. It is obvious that despite your pretensions, you enjoy these bombs and murders by Islamic fundamentalists. You will even sponsor them if you have the money.

I hate it when people bash other people's religion like some people are doing to Islam on this thread, but many non-Muslims get infuriated by the justification many Muslims usually give to senseless and barbaric murders of innocent people and they therefore erroneously conclude that all Muslims are the same.

If you truly love your religion, you should be scandalized about those who murder in the name of your religion and should not in any way justify such acts by telling us how Christians have killed others in the past.

There are Muslims in the South West and Edo State - they are very peaceful unlike those from Northern Nigeria. There are Muslims in Indonesia, Malaysia, etc - they are peaceful unlike those from Arab countries. Why is this so? And how can this Islamic fundamentalism be curbed before the whole world is consumed? These are the issues we expect you to address.

truly:

@Comechop
Read all the posts and say that again
The OP said : Muslims what can we do to stop extremism

Then people jumped in and started bashing Islam. I hope you read all of those posts. So how do all those posts promote the objectives of the original poster. I did not set out to attack christianity. But I will continue to respond to those who attack Islam and if necessary, point out the specks in their own eyes.

This kind of showin hatre towards Islam and Muslims,we dont get suprised because,ALLAH told us that,we will be experiencin such things from others. But Allah said: 'And if you have patience and fearness of God,none of their evil wills harm you,verily,ALLAH has total knowledge on all what they do.' So Muslims,pls dont mind. Keep on seekin knowledge of ur Deen,so as to have true Islamic understandings.

reindeer:

Thank God the OP has a lot more brain tissue than those excusing innocent killings.
For those who think its justified, i hope you, your kids, your family or loved ones have a taste in the next senseless killings then you may have cause to thank your blood lust.

How many times did they taste such. How many women r killed,raped,lost their husbands, How many muslims children were killed and threw inside an old well?! About 250 innocent children heartlessly were slaughtered and threw inside well in jos. Did you 4get that? Or u dont kwow? Get known b4 u say.

@ Saidsalla,

Without meaning any insult, I think you should not be commenting on this thread. I don't think your intellectual capacity measures up to the level needed here. You are simply dragging the discussion down. And it is looking childish. This topic is too serious for pettiness and mediocrity. Pls don't feel offended.

People like us want to know why these cases of violence emanate regularly from Muslims across the world and what can be done to curb them, not bandying words on who is right and who is wrong and other issues not related to the issue on ground.

truly:

You are truly ignorant of the fact that it is not forbidden for a muslim to enter a church! A leader of the Muslim - Uthman (RAA) - entered a church in Jerusalem but said his prayer outside it.
You are as (or even more) ignorant as some of the muslims you criticise

@Truly, you obviously missed the irony in my "defiling" statement. Ignorant ko, ignoramus ni. By the way, how have you as an individual spoken out against extremism in your mosque, to your Imam, to other Muslims?  Have you expounded on these "moderate" views you are posting on Nairaland to them? What was their response if you had the guts to do it?

But this thread is tired and so am I. You say Christians have a good PR machine. Let´s see how far your own PR efforts take your Muslim brothers and your faith´s reputation.

Facts to consider.

1)There is no such thing as "moderacy" in Islam.

2)More Muslims are killed by fellow Muslims than by any other "infidels".

3Muslims women and children are more likely to suffer abuse by their Men and Fathers, underage marriages,torture,honor killings and injustice.

4)Yes there are Christian radicals but they have not maimed,killed,or exploded to death up to a speck of what has been accomplished by the radical Islamists.

Have a nice day

naijangel7:




@Truly, you obviously missed the irony in my "defiling" statement. Ignorant ko, ignoramus ni. By the way, how have you as an individual spoken out against extremism in your mosque, to your Imam, to other Muslims?  Have you expounded on these "moderate" views you are posting on Nairaland to them? What was their response if you had the guts to do it?

But this thread is tired and so am I. You say Christians have a good PR machine. Let´s see how far your own PR efforts take your Muslim brothers and your faith´s reputation.

Irony where? You meant it literally by saying they would not enter a church and would rather burn it from outside. Have you too as an individual spoken out against christian extremists. No you have not
Read the posts here. Some muslims have not just defended Islam, they pointed out that the terrorists are misguided. I stated that muslims can enter a church.  I explained that attacking a christian for touching the Qur'an is wrong. He could have got it legitimately
But you persist in saying that I must justify to you what I am doing? How?

Some christians have said that muslims are just trying to be politically correct here and would go to terror websites to stir up hate. How irresponsible can people get! Do christians think muslims have advance notice of terror attacks? If they did, most of them would fail. Some innocent Muslims died in the 9/11 attacks. Why should I promote terrorism when I can become a victim anyway. In any case, what I have posted here are enough to earn me the death penalty from these extremists.

But how many christians cautioned the christians promising retaliation here. How many christians bothered to even acknowledge the extremism in christianity? Muslims must "condemn" terror etc I live with muslims and I know a lot about muslims. Really?

You don't fight misguided people by attacking those who are saying "yes, we know that some of our people are not on the right track!" The terrorists are happy when christians come to a thread like this to attack Islam. To them, there is no middle ground and the christians who attack Islam all the time are just confirming that

na hausa people you should direct this message to not muslims, i've met muslims with better intensions than christians and they love peace just as much, heart of a good muslim is undeniable but most hausa people are cut throat die hard criminal, they can be bloody when they have to, no conscience. i'm a christian but muslims are fine by me oh. individual differs
i think some hausa's are a radical that disturbs nigeria at times, epo kin kin t'on ba oju omi je

Guard kills Pakistani governor

Wednesday, 05 January 2011 00:00 Editor News - World

User Rating: / 0
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FOR apparently speaking against the country’s controversial blasphemy laws, the governor of Pakistan’s powerful Punjab Province, Salman Taseer, has been assassinated by one of his guards in Islamabad.

The killing of Taseer was the most high-profile assassination of a political figure in Pakistan since the slaying of former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto in December 2007, and it rattled a country already dealing with crises ranging from a potential collapse of the government to Islamist militancy.

The suspected killer, Agence France Presse (AFP) reported, was taken into custody, and there were conflicting reports as to whether he was wounded.Taseer was a member of Bhutto’s Pakistan People's Party and a close associate of President Asif Ali Zardari, Bhutto’s widower. The governor was vocal on a range of subjects, and frequently used Twitter to get across his views.

In recent days, as the People’s Party has faced the loss of its coalition partners, the 56-year-old Taseer has insisted that the government will survive. But it was his stance against the blasphemy laws that apparently led to his killing.
Interior Minister Rahman Malik told reporters that the suspect in the case had surrendered to police and told them he killed Taseer because “the governor described the blasphemy laws as a black law.”

“He was the most courageous voice after Benazir Bhutto on the rights of women and religious minorities,” said a crying Farahnaz Ispahani, an aide to Zardari and friend of Taseer. “God, we will miss him,” he added.

Pakistan's blasphemy law has come under greater scrutiny in recent days after a Christian woman was sentenced to death for allegedly insulting Islam's Prophet Muhammad.
Under pressure from Islamist parties, the People's Party said recently it would not pursue changes to the law, which has long vexed human rights activists.

Police official Mohammad Iftikhar said Taseer was gunned down after he reached Khosar Market, a shopping center in Islamabad popular with Westerners and wealthy Pakistanis. Five other people were wounded as other security personnel responded to the attack.

Another police official, Hasan Iqbal, said a pair of witnesses told the police that as the governor was leaving his vehicle, a man from his security squad fired two shots at him. Taseer then fell, while other police officials fired on the attacker.
Taseer was believed to be meeting someone for a meal, Malik said. Other members of his security detail were being questioned, Malik said.The security for Taseer was provided by the Punjab government.

“We will see whether it was an individual act or someone had asked him” to do it, Malik said of the attacker.
Bullet casings and blood covered much of the scene at the market, and police quickly cordoned off the area.
Thousands of Pakistanis on Monday mourned Bhutto on the third anniversary of her death and demanded that her killers be brought to justice.

Loyalists from across the country descended on her grave in the southern village of Garhi Khuda Bakhsh, beating their chests and chanting “Bhutto was alive yesterday and Bhutto is alive today.”
Bhutto, the first woman to become prime minister of a Muslim country, was killed on December 27, 2007 in a gun and suicide attack after addressing an election rally in Rawalpindi, near the capital Islamabad.

Two senior police officers were arrested last week for alleged dereliction of duty over the assassination. Five alleged Pakistani Taliban militants held for nearly three years over the killing have yet to be indicted.
Bhutto's widower President Asif Ali Zardari pledged allegiance to his wife's policies and promised to stamp out Islamist militant groups, which have been blamed for killing more than 4,000 people across Pakistan since July 2007.

Enough of these nonsense let try and do something else that may benefit us because most of your post is done by hatred none of the people is trying to belief any islamical stand or explanation, they just believe to call the muslims terrorist and they must accept

@okunoba, your response to this thread is a manifestation of your ignorance. Your perception of Islam is totaly wrong. You even showed the extent of your misinformation by stating that Islam is called ''imole'' in yoruba land because its a forced religion, this is outright falsehood. Pls u need to upgrade.

Saidsalla:

How many times did they taste such. How many women r killed,violated,lost their husbands, How many muslims children were killed and threw inside an old well?! About 250 innocent children heartlessly were slaughtered and threw inside well in jos. Did you 4get that? Or u dont kwow? Get known b4 u say.

As you have been told, grow up a little, learn some english and then come to make comments.
You are in Kano?wait did you allow your cow type this messages?i don't believe a human will be this low in his thinking.

reindeer:

As you have been told, grow up a little, learn some english and then come to make comments.
You are in Kano?wait did you allow your cow type this messages?i don't believe a human will be this low in his thinking.

YES IM FROM KANO! Where r u from? R u from British royal house? I bliv my english is very low but u understood me anyway. What can u say next? I'm tellin lies? I know one animal that behaves in such a way: PIG !

kawkab:

Guard kills Pakistani governor

Wednesday, 05 January 2011 00:00 Editor News - World

User Rating: / 0
PoorBest


FOR apparently speaking against the country’s controversial blasphemy laws, the governor of Pakistan’s powerful Punjab Province, Salman Taseer, has been assassinated by one of his guards in Islamabad.

The killing of Taseer was the most high-profile assassination of a political figure in Pakistan since the slaying of former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto in December 2007, and it rattled a country already dealing with crises ranging from a potential collapse of the government to Islamist militancy.

The suspected killer, Agence France Presse (AFP) reported, was taken into custody, and there were conflicting reports as to whether he was wounded.Taseer was a member of Bhutto’s Pakistan People's Party and a close associate of President Asif Ali Zardari, Bhutto’s widower. The governor was vocal on a range of subjects, and frequently used Twitter to get across his views.

In recent days, as the People’s Party has faced the loss of its coalition partners, the 56-year-old Taseer has insisted that the government will survive. But it was his stance against the blasphemy laws that apparently led to his killing.
Interior Minister Rahman Malik told reporters that the suspect in the case had surrendered to police and told them he killed Taseer because “the governor described the blasphemy laws as a black law.”

“He was the most courageous voice after Benazir Bhutto on the rights of women and religious minorities,” said a crying Farahnaz Ispahani, an aide to Zardari and friend of Taseer. “God, we will miss him,” he added.

Pakistan's blasphemy law has come under greater scrutiny in recent days after a Christian woman was sentenced to death for allegedly insulting Islam's Prophet Muhammad.
Under pressure from Islamist parties, the People's Party said recently it would not pursue changes to the law, which has long vexed human rights activists.

Police official Mohammad Iftikhar said Taseer was gunned down after he reached Khosar Market, a shopping center in Islamabad popular with Westerners and wealthy Pakistanis. Five other people were wounded as other security personnel responded to the attack.

Another police official, Hasan Iqbal, said a pair of witnesses told the police that as the governor was leaving his vehicle, a man from his security squad fired two shots at him. Taseer then fell, while other police officials fired on the attacker.
Taseer was believed to be meeting someone for a meal, Malik said. Other members of his security detail were being questioned, Malik said.The security for Taseer was provided by the Punjab government.

“We will see whether it was an individual act or someone had asked him” to do it, Malik said of the attacker.
Bullet casings and blood covered much of the scene at the market, and police quickly cordoned off the area.
Thousands of Pakistanis on Monday mourned Bhutto on the third anniversary of her death and demanded that her killers be brought to justice.

Loyalists from across the country descended on her grave in the southern village of Garhi Khuda Bakhsh, beating their chests and chanting “Bhutto was alive yesterday and Bhutto is alive today.”
Bhutto, the first woman to become prime minister of a Muslim country, was killed on December 27, 2007 in a gun and suicide attack after addressing an election rally in Rawalpindi, near the capital Islamabad.

Two senior police officers were arrested last week for alleged dereliction of duty over the assassination. Five alleged Pakistani Taliban militants held for nearly three years over the killing have yet to be indicted.
Bhutto's widower President Asif Ali Zardari pledged allegiance to his wife's policies and promised to stamp out Islamist militant groups, which have been blamed for killing more than 4,000 people across Pakistan since July 2007.

Thanks for putting that up, I was just about to post it myself.

There are no moderates in Islam,and this story confirms it

As quoted by okunoba, December 30, 2010.

Okunoba, it seems you are absent minded, an illiterate and a coward, you black mail muslims all over the world, islam is a true religion and the most peaceful religion on earth.
Go back to history, may be you did not even go to a primary school or you don't have one in your locality that is why now , you are opportuned to say anything you like.

come to hausa land, see how many thousands of your people are living peacefully with the hausa muslims

i should warned you that you should stop accusing the prophet (SAW), the Qur'an, they are not meant to be played with ,otherwise we shall pray to ALMIGHTY GOD to destroy you whereever you are, are a calamity befall you that you will suffer until the end of your life.

Therefore, you should immediately seek forgiveness of all what you have being saying now, we don't curse any other religion nor their books, but what you have done simply shows that you are the greatest illiterate on earth.

Thank you and i pray to Allah to guide you to the straight path.

@Amadi1, I must have touched a nerve, I am sorry for upsetting u, that was not my intention. Getting back to the issue, your reaction proves me right. Islam breeds intolerance and encourages violence based on the Koran and the hadith. If what am saying is wrong or sinful, let Allah be the Judge not u or any man. If u believe in God, then let him do his job, he doesn`t need u to do it for him.

I ask again, how did Usman Danfodio spread Islam in Nigeria and Can u explain the Koran verses of the sword? Did the messenger of Allah not personally lead more than 60 armed raids on unbelievers, where the loot from the raids were shared. 1/5 for the messenger and the rest for for his soldiers.
"Let there be no compulsion in religion; truth stands out clear from error" (Sura 2.256). this was before Mohammed had a strong army

"Slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them, and confine them, and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush" (Sura 9.5). "Fight those who believe not in Allah and the Last Day and do not forbid what Allah and His Messenger have forbidden -- such men as practice not the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book [i.e. Jews and Christians] -- until they pay the tribute out of hand and have been humbled." (Sura 9.29)These "verses of the sword" abrogates 2.256, since they were revealed later, when he had a much stronger army. I can quote more violent verses but what will be the point when I know it`s like talking to a brick wall.

No need to Insult or call me names, I am sure u can debate issues without resulting to that low human denominator.
I await ur response.

Be quiet,aboki amadi and read the post above yours, them explain to us what part of Radical Islamist Terrorism it is that you dont understand.Degenerate like yourself.

@Saidsalla,  "This kind of showin hatre towards Islam and Muslims,we dont get suprised because,ALLAH told us that,we will be experiencin such things from others"

U don`t need any Iman or a prophet to tell u about hate, hatred is a natural and common human feeling. Before Islam or any other man made religion, human beings have been dealing with hate, it`s just a fact of life.  Hate comes when people have a strong disagreement.

okunoba:

@Amadi1, I must have touched a nerve, I am sorry for upsetting u, that was not my intention. Getting back to the issue, your reaction proves me right. Islam breeds intolerance and encourages violence based on the Koran and the hadith. If what am saying is wrong or sinful, let Allah be the Judge not u or any man. If u believe in God, then let him do his job, he doesn`t need u to do it for him.

I ask again, how did Usman Danfodio spread Islam in Nigeria and Can u explain the Koran verses of the sword? Did the messenger of Allah not personally lead more than 60 armed raids on unbelievers, where the loot from the raids were shared. 1/5 for the messenger and the rest for for his soldiers.
"Let there be no compulsion in religion; truth stands out clear from error" (Sura 2.256). this was before Mohammed had a strong army

"Slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them, and confine them, and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush" (Sura 9.5). "Fight those who believe not in Allah and the Last Day and do not forbid what Allah and His Messenger have forbidden -- such men as practice not the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book [i.e. Jews and Christians] -- until they pay the tribute out of hand and have been humbled." (Sura 9.29)These "verses of the sword" abrogates 2.256, since they were revealed later, when he had a much stronger army. I can quote more violent verses but what will be the point when I know it`s like talking to a brick wall.

No need to Insult or call me names, I am sure u can debate issues without resulting to that low human denominator.
I await your response.

This u said can not b explained in this short time. But since u research I can only request u to read the biography of prophet. U can get the books in different languages or visit one of the Islamic websites or visit www.islamworld.net

@[b]Kabukabu50 Facts to consider.
[/b]

1)There is no such thing as "moderacy" in Islam.

2)More Muslims are killed by fellow Muslims than by any other "infidels".

3Muslims women and children are more likely to suffer abuse by their Men and Fathers, underage marriages,torture,honor killings and injustice.

4)Yes there are Christian radicals but they have not maimed,killed,or exploded to death up to a speck of what has been accomplished by the radical Islamists.

Have a nice day

@kabukabu50-1) Is there such thing as "Moderacy" in 'Christianity' Pls explain.

2)How did you arrive at such conclusion? What do you think of the killings/ wars in Europe East/West, Colombia,Peru, Mexico, South-Africa during Apartheid, Iraq still under occupation, Lebanon and Palestine under Israeli invasion/occupation-  I guess they are 'Islamic' inspired killings in your opinion or they do not count?

3)Abuse of women and children is not peculiar to 'Muslim' men/fathers- Is it? Under age marriages, torture, so called honour killings and injustice -how are they peculiar/ related to 'Islam'? keep in mind that So called 'muslim' men in societies whose social structure and values predate the arrival of Islam obviously interpret their age old sexist/patriarchal misdemeanour as 'Islam' as the date palm- Really? Pls a cursory awareness/knowledge of local history will go a long way in understanding some of the misconceptions about people from predominantly muslim populated societies/countries-  Turkey, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran,Iraq, Bangladesh, The 'Arabian' peninsular and Muslims in India, muslims in Nigeria and the rest of Africa. Old habits die hard

4)Really? think about it

@chiek

1)There are no moderates in Islam,if there were they would have already stood up against the radicals among thier fold,but they don't because for the most part they agree with such tactics, even though they themselves are scared or hesitant to use them.

2)I will repeat it since you probably don't understand, more Muslims die at the hands of other Muslims, than are killed by "Infidels".
Does not mean infidel on infidel violence, means muslim on muslim violence kills more of them than "foreigners" do.
Egypt,Pakistan,Iraq,afghanistan,Syria,Saudi arabia,Lebanon muslims walk into their mosques and blow their fellow muslims up, every day of the week.

3)Muslim men are more likely to abuse women and children through honor killings, which you won't find happening anywhere else
They marry underaged girls who are subjected to daily ravages by these often older men, denying these girls of their pride and innocence.
These young girls are subjected to harsh conditions, and have no rights whatsoever, which is supported by Islamic laws.

Old habits dont die hard, they are changed with Modern law not Sharia law, you don't have sex with underaged girls,wifes have as much rights as husbands in a marriage,and Religion has no place in government.

kabukabu50:

@chiek

1)There are no moderates in Islam,if there were they would have already stood up against the radicals among thier fold,but they don't because for the most part they agree with such tactics, even though they themselves are scared or hesitant to use them.

Taking you as an example, there is no moderation in christianity. Who provided the evidence to the US to foil the bomb mailed through DHL - Saudi Arabia
Why does Yemen allow US to bomb terrorists within its country? Ditto For Pakistan allowing drone attacks

There is nothing here that has been said about christianity on this thread that has been rebutted. The cheap and typical strategy is to keep harping on things done by muslims

Again if there is moderation in christainity, why do christians tell lies in support of their religion. Why do christians publish fake Qur'an
The christians who tied people to the stake during the inquisition, are they moderates. Why do mainstream christians carry out acts of violence while the muslims that carry out violent acts are renegades.

kabukabu50:

@chiek

2)I will repeat it since you probably don't understand, more Muslims die at the hands of other Muslims, than are killed by "Infidels".
Does not mean infidel on infidel violence, means muslim on muslim violence kills more of them than "foreigners" do.
Egypt,Pakistan,Iraq,afghanistan,Syria,Saudi arabia,Lebanon muslims walk into their mosques and blow their fellow muslims up, every day of the week.

where is it that brothers don't fight. There have been ethnic clashes in SE, SS, SW and the North. The violence going on in Iraq was precipitated by the US.
Imagine if Rwanda had been a muslim country, or Congo, you would have instantly jumped on that as muslims being intolerant
Christian countries have fought more wars than Muslim countries
Christian countries have made and used more deadly weapons than muslim countries. Weapons that would kill innocents, children and women are forbidden in Islam

Please provide evidence of your daily [/b]bombing story in Syria, Lebanon (which is 60%/40% muslim/christian), Saudi Arabia, Egypt. And of course you rejoiced when a Jew entered a mosque in Hebron (Palestine) in 1994 to kill muslims worshipping on a Friday. But you would count it as a muslim act
[b]Like I have said, for a christian who is attacking Islam/defending christianity, lying is an act of worship

kabukabu50:


3)Muslim men are more likely to abuse women and children through honor killings, which you won't find happening anywhere else
They marry underaged girls who are subjected to daily ravages by these often older men, denying these girls of their pride and innocence.
These young girls are subjected to harsh conditions, and have no rights whatsoever, which is supported by Islamic laws.

Old habits dont die hard, they are changed with Modern law not Sharia law, you don't have intimacy with underaged girls,wifes have as much rights as husbands in a marriage,and Religion has no place in government.

The age of consent in the Vatican is 12

"Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything." (Ephesians 5:22-24)

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church." (I Corinthians 14:34-35)

The Nigerian Stock Exchange closed at 12noon on Christmas Eve, but not on the Eve of the Islam's festival of sacrifice. so does religion have a place in government?

What is honor killing? Is it part of Islam? Of course not. But lying is a habit to you. It is practically impossible to eliminate all pagan practices from people who have embraced a religion. You cannot hold Islam responsible for ancient practices that Islam expressly prohibit
Please provide evidence that Islam approve these - honor killing, "ravaging of girls by men", treating women harshly

calaway, and other christians that hammering on us (muslims) with your wrong informations on our religion, i ask you to please download this paper and go thru very well. For you calaway especially that use your little know how on your search on wrong info about my region.

For you Calaway and your likes

please people.
I have friends (no brother) that are moslems. they are modest, responsible and peaceful. their dispositions contradicts what i see some other moslem guys doing in the name of Allah---killings and tormenting innocent/guilty souls.

Could it be that these aggressive groups are the true adherents or vice versa. you could argue it all you can but I am yet to see a consistent and passionate appeal by moderate moslems to stop and discourage these killings especially in Nigeria.

Two things can be done. 1. Every responsible adult should preach tolerance irrespective of religion. I dont care if you implement sharia in a democracy (so far it is supported by majority of the people).
2. The government should interfere in religious meetings/teachings that encourage hate/intolerance

I stand to be taught.

Islam is a peaceful religion as long as:

1. Sharia is discarded - there is no form of jurisprudence more barbaric than Sharia.
2. Intolerant, violent and outdated aspects of the Quran are completely ignored - killing "infidels" is pure lunacy.
3. Women are guaranteed rights - flogging one's wife is a crime.
4. More Muslims embrace education (Western, Eastern, etc. doesn't matter), learn to resolve issues without violence and embrace peace as a virtue.

SoulAssist:

please people.
I have friends (no brother) that are moslems. they are modest, responsible and peaceful. their dispositions contradicts what i see some other moslem guys doing in the name of Allah---killings and tormenting innocent/guilty souls.

Could it be that these aggressive groups are the true adherents or vice versa. you could argue it all you can but I am yet to see a consistent and passionate appeal by moderate moslems to stop and discourage these killings especially in Nigeria.

Two things can be done. 1. Every responsible adult should preach tolerance irrespective of religion. I dont care if you implement sharia in a democracy (so far it is supported by majority of the people).
2. The government should interfere in religious meetings/teachings that encourage hate/intolerance

I stand to be taught.

Good points. So far, we know that Western Education is no solution to the problem . . . I believe all of the bombers in the UK received western education, some to the highest levels.

I also agree that if the majority in a democracy want this Sharia law, they ought to be able to get but from what I have seen, I don't think it is such a good idea . . . considering what we have up north, I doubt the people were consulted before Sharia was imposed on many of the people there. Plus, the courts seem to have too much power now than they ought to.

[b]Kabukabu50[/b]1

There are no moderates in Islam,if there were they would have already stood up against the radicals among thier fold,but they don't because for the most part they agree with such tactics, even though they themselves are scared or hesitant to use them.

2)I will repeat it since you probably don't understand, more Muslims die at the hands of other Muslims, than are killed by "Infidels".
Does not mean infidel on infidel violence, means muslim on muslim violence kills more of them than "foreigners" do.
Egypt,Pakistan,Iraq,afghanistan,Syria,Saudi arabia,Lebanon muslims walk into their mosques and blow their fellow muslims up, every day of the week.

3)Muslim men are more likely to abuse women and children through honor killings, which you won't find happening anywhere else
They marry underaged girls who are subjected to daily ravages by these often older men, denying these girls of their pride and innocence.
These young girls are subjected to harsh conditions, and have no rights whatsoever, which is supported by Islamic laws.

Old habits dont die hard, they are changed with Modern law not Sharia law, you don't have intimacy with underaged girls,wifes have as muchights as husbanrds in a marriage,and Religion has no place in government.

@Kabukbu50 1) Do you really believe that?

2) Do you think that much of the killings by so called muslims 'dressed-up' as 'Islamic' inspired, are actually typical of 'Islam'/muslims? Are the countries you mentioned 'Islamic' societies? They are societies in search of an 'identity' or societies in flux. Egypt, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Lebanon and Iraq are certainly  places where 'Islam' is used as an easy galvanising ideology for purposes that are anything but 'spiritual' or 'religious'. Besides Saudi Arabia, 'Islam' as a religion, arrived those other places just like in Nigeria. It's still Foreign and not home grown whatever religious zealots may think! They all learn 'Arabic'(Saudi version) with its nuances and ambiguities. Is it any wonder there is confusion? Many things are lost or added in translation hence the essence of 'Islam' is lost on everyone .

3) I pointed out already that it is not because they are 'muslim' men but because they come from societies with 'older' socio-cultural systems /values that predate the arrival of the new 'civilising' value system(Islam) - hence I wrote- 'Old habits die Hard'. You cannot runaway from your culture or history Unfortunately 'Islam' bears the 'brunt'/ blamed for cultural practices which predates Islam itself. You are aware of fetish beliefs(witch craft)etc by so called Christians in many places but are they seen as fundamentally bad Christians or human beings?

Pls try to read the 'Koran' with an open mind perhaps you'll be enlightened about 'Sharia' and maybe discover also that the 'law' / 'rights' as it relates to Women, in my humble opinion is very enlightening and food for thought. keep in mind that there are no 'perfection' in any so called 'Law' and 'Government'.

RichyBlacK:

Islam is a peaceful religion as long as:

1. Sharia is discarded - there is no form of jurisprudence more barbaric than Sharia.
2. Intolerant, violent and outdated aspects of the Quran are completely ignored - killing "infidels" is pure lunacy.
3. Women are guaranteed rights - flogging one's wife is a crime.
4. More Muslims embrace education (Western, Eastern, etc. doesn't matter), learn to resolve issues without violence and embrace peace as a virtue.

You are entitled to your own opinions. But Muslims will NEVER be dictated to by you or by anyone Why do you think you can sit in judgement and dictate conditions?

Please can you tell me christian jurisprudence to enable us see if it is barbaric or not.
Tell me the portions of the Bible that have been completely ignored so that we can determine what is left of christianity or get a new name for it so that at least all the pretensions to being followers of christ can be laid to rest

Why do your type always think women are forced to do what they do in Islam. Are you saying even in the US, somehow these women cannot resist this "imposition".
Do you know that some girls (even in Nigeria) cover their faces in school but don't at home because their parents do not want them to
When will you defend the rights of these women to cover their face
Is it really freedom or democratic for a woman who wants to appear unclothed in some beaches in Europe to be able to but those who want to cover their bodies are not allowed to as in France
Why do you not believe that those who appear in adult films are forced while assuming those who cover their bodies are?

How many muslim neighbours of yours have you had cause to call to order because they always resolve issues by violence?
A lot of people talk about some muslims based on poisoned opinions while totally ignoring that muslim they see at work or in the neighbourhood everyday

SoulAssist:


I am yet to see a consistent and passionate appeal by moderate moslems to stop and discourage these killings especially in Nigeria.

2. The government should interfere in religious meetings/teachings that encourage hate/intolerance

I stand to be taught.

Have you been following lectures by muslims in Nigerian on the issue of terrorism?
Please do you remember the original intent of this thread?
Did you notice what these "peaceful"christains turned it to?
How many christians cautioned them about hijacking the thread?

These people can abuse as much as they want, but I am sure they really do not want violence to stop. I believe the game is for the violence to continue so that they can indulge in their pastime of denigrating Islam

Spreading hate is something extremists in both Islam and Christianity are guilty of. The interference should be directed at both.

@ Righton

Do you know that some girls (even in Nigeria) cover their faces in school but don't at home because their parents do not want them to
When will you defend the rights of these women to cover their face

You are entitled to your own opinions. But Muslims will NEVER be dictated to by you or by anyone Why do you think you can sit in judgement and dictate conditions?

[b]What about the females who do not want to cover their heads or faces but are forced to do so, and in this our Nigeria? Are these females, though not being muslims being DICTATED TO? What about those who want to leave Islam but are not allowed to? Why should Sharia APPLY TO NON-MUSLIMS? Is it right that Islam dictates to others but others cannot dictate to them?

Answer this question, would those who enforced IMPOSED SHARIA IN THE NORTH BE HAPPY TO HAVE MOSAIC LAW or CHRISTIAN LAW AS THE LEGAL CODE OR EVEN ALONGSIDE SHARIA? Why should others tolerate imposed Islam when Islam cannot tolerate what others impose?

Non-Muslims just want some peace! Is it hard for peaceful muslims to IMPOSE 'PEACEFUL ISLAM' on EXTREMIST MUSLIMS just like it imposes Sharia on those who do not want it? Or is it a case of the 'dog who breastfeeds her puppies but ONLY BITE the other dog's puppies?

Most people DID NOT START OUT HATING MUSLIMS; they STARTED OUT HATING THE VIOLENCE OF EXTREMIST MUSLIMS which seems to be supported by peaceful Muslims who kept quiet on the terror being unleashed across the world! More peacefull Muslims need to speak out against the atrocities being committed in the name of their beloved religion!

How many muslim neighbours of yours have you had cause to call to order because they always resolve issues by violence?
A lot of people talk about some muslims based on poisoned opinions while totally ignoring that muslim they see at work or in the neighbourhood everyday

Poisoned opinions? Would you tell those whose family members died in 9/11 or July 7 incidents that there opinions of Islam are poisoned, considering that they experienced Islamic extremism 'first-hand'? WHO POISONED THEIR OPINION OF ISLAM? Radicalist Muslims untamed by peaceful muslims perhaps?

These people can abuse as much as they want, but I am sure they really do not want violence to stop. I believe the game is for the violence to continue so that they can indulge in their pastime of denigrating Islam

If Saints are insulted; how much more murderers and oppressors! The matter of the insults you do not like is like that of the one-eyed man who goes everywhere with his one-eyed goat but takes offence when people say 'Look at that one-eyed goat' as those who do not really like him might actually be referring to him and not the goat! Peaceful muslims need to do something about the 'one-eyed goat' of extremism!


THE VIOLENCE WILL STOP, WITH THE EFFORTS OF SENSIBLE MUSLIMS OR WITH THE EFFORTS OF SENSIBLE AND AGGRAVATED NON-MUSLIMS! TO THINK THAT THE WHOLE WORLD WILL WATCH EXTREMIST ISLAMISTS TURN EARTH INTO A PLACE HOTTER THAN HELL IS A DREAM THAT WILL NEVER COME TRUE!
[/b]

^^


http://www.standard.net/topics/pakistan-violence/2011/01/04/pakistani-governor-opposed-blasphemy-law-assassinated



http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110105/wl_nm/us_pakistan_politics_31