manny4life:

@Katsumoto

Sorry my brother, I was only saying you know, IMO I think this argument is getting everyone worked up.

No sweat; thanks for your contributions so far.

@LA2

To answer @posters question, I doubt his brilliance, and yeah his over-hyped and mediocre; he lacks the knowledge and experience to manage the CBN.

naijaking1:

Everyone lacking sleep?

Sleep? Not me man, I've slept, woke up and working,

Katsumoto:

You really think you can lecture me on Economics? You are too funny? You simply don't understand the basics of Money classifications and you want to lecture someone else. Whether M1, M2, M3 (US) or MO, M4 (UK), an increase in the supply of money results in higher inflation; this is the 9th principle of Economics.

BTW, I didn't blame SLS for the high inflation in Nigeria; I blamed him for increasing the money supply to save Banks that did not have liquidity problems in the short term in an economy with double digit inflation. Your name calling serves no purpose and only exposes your inability to deal with facts and engage in polite debate.

I quoted you when I was attempting to show manny4life that it is foolhardy to blame sanusi for the high inflation in Nigeria because I thought your quoted statement was made in support of his claim. I'm happy to note that unlike the likes of manny4life, you are not blaming Sanusi for this issue.

BTW, I will not attempt to lecture you, of all people, on Economics because I know better. We all know that you are an expert in this area - this is also the reason why I believe that this enquiry of yours, as stated in your first post is bogus.

azoo:
I am very sure u are amongst those idiots thgat their parents force to study medicine or law and fail to choose other career paths, I chose Biochemistry without the option of medicine cos I know what it entails and its fulfilling, My mentioning my discipline was not to brag but just to tell u that even if I'm not an accounting or economics graduate watching that program still made me know that Islamic banking is still the best, whats there to brag about at least I aint the only one in the world,

,

My pal, I don't wanna go down that path. Can't you post a reply without using abusive language. I doubt the quality of your 1st class. I expect a 1st class graduate to show some level of decorum. Pre-emptively flaunting your qualification in public forum is 'bragging'. Do u wanna intimidate us with your CV? I can predict the stuff you are made of by mere reading of your post. Your arguements are not articulate and you readily launch into personal attack. Thank God for NL; some brash individuals like u will be educated on the subject of human relation and the value of superior arguement without being abrasive. Well, I don't wanna derail the topic; therefore your continued tantrum will likely be ignored by me. But, please re-examine your approach to human relation. We are discussing about someone whose decision can have a wide reaching economic, social and political ramification. Someone whose educational and professional qualification to occupy the post that he is occupying is in doubt. Someone who is masquerading as a know-it-all economist just because of his meagre qualification and good command of English language. Let the discussion continue,

azoo:
I am very sure u are amongst those idiots thgat their parents force to study medicine or law and fail to choose other career paths, I chose Biochemistry without the option of medicine cos I know what it entails and its fulfilling, My mentioning my discipline was not to brag but just to tell u that even if I'm not an accounting or economics graduate watching that program still made me know that Islamic banking is still the best, whats there to brag about at least I aint the only one in the world,

,

My pal, I don't wanna go down that path. Can't you post a reply without using abusive language. I doubt the quality of your 1st class. I expect a 1st class graduate to show some level of decorum. Pre-emptively flaunting your qualification in public forum is 'bragging'. Do u wanna intimidate us with your CV? I can predict the stuff you are made of by mere reading of your post. Your arguements are not articulate and you readily launch into personal attack. Thank God for NL; some brash individuals like u will be educated on the subject of human relation and the value of superior arguement without being abrasive. Well, I don't wanna derail the topic; therefore your continued tantrum will likely be ignored by me. But, please re-examine your approach to human relation. We are discussing about someone whose decision can have a wide reaching economic, social and political ramification. Someone whose educational and professional qualification to occupy the post that he is occupying is in doubt. Someone who is masquerading as a know-it-all economist just because of his meagre qualification and good command of English language. Let the discussion continue,

ndu_chucks:

I quoted you when I was attempting to show[b] manny4life that it is foolhardy[/b] to blame sanusi for the high inflation in Nigeria because I thought your quoted statement  was made in support of his claim.  I'm happy to note that unlike the likes  of manny4life, you are not blaming Sanusi for this issue.

BTW, I will not attempt to lecture you, of all people, on Economics because I know better. We all know that you are an expert in this area - this is also the reason why I believe that this enquiry of yours, as stated in your first post is bogus.

eh see me see trouble, please brother leave me alone eh, you want me to start with u this morning, don't you? Again, if you read my posts, I clearly stated that there's inflation in every country including Nigeria, SLS IS TO BLAME for an increased inflation rate as well as other macroeconomic factors. Please keep in mind I do not have this luxury time to debate this topic, I'm working, perhaps give me another 6hrs when I get out of work, then maybe I will have the time to answer u.

Well, time for us simpletons to make a few remarks, even though I think Katsumoto didn't anticipate the direction things would go, and as such hasn't been able to push the discussions into other aspects of Sanusi's tenure. As it is, we haven't gone beyond his qualifications for the job.

Anyway, I am kind of wary of the dude. Sure, he seems to have a lot of good press, and judging by the responses on this thread, a lot of admirers. But there are a number of question marks.

Firstly his experience within the industry cannot possibly be enough to head up the central bank of a country like Nigeria. We are reasonably beyond the 1960s, when a Lt. Col Gowon was made head of state. But, well, you know, the appointment of Charles Soludo set the tone for appointments like this, as he had only academic and no industry experience when he was appointed CBN governor.

Secondly, his political antecedents. As the chief monetary policy formulator of Nigeria, he seems to spend an awful lot of time writing political essays and giving political talks. Dunno about you guys, I am uncomfortable with that.

Thirdly his 'brilliance'. Brilliance is one word loosely used in Nigeria to describe anything from verbosity to display of maverick, and very rarely genius.
It's like we hear some great speech and we go 'wow that guy is brilliant', or we see a CV and we're like 'oh what a smart lady!'. Let's face it people, we lack depth, most Nigerians do, so we are moved easily by words.

Fourth, which is the real crux of the matter? How well has he done as CBN governor? I'll borrow from this post below:

LA2:

My opinion on SLS:

In any other country, a New CBN governor whose actions (barely 2 months into the job) leads to serious unemployment, inflation, capital flight, lack of confidence, etc, will loose his job / or be expected to honourably resign.

Clearly, for a CBN governor, strong grasp of marco-economics is a must. The tools at his disposal are macro-economic in nature.

I share same sentiment, but again, this is Nigeria. Emotion usually prevails over reason, which is always our problem anyway. Yes, he did a good job cleaning out the banking rot, but we are still yet to address the fundamental issues, which was responsible for the collapse in the first place.

I don't know much about Islamic banking, but I wonder why this is a headline topic for SLS at this time, given all the issues with the economy right at this point, i.e. combating rising inflation, and getting the confidence back into the financial sector. CBN should be a regulator, providing the framework for models like non-interest banking just like they're doing for mobile payments. Especially in an environment as sensitive as Nigeria, our chief monetary policy formulator can't be the chief promoter of any banking model. Or am I missing something somewhere?

Well well well interesting so far.

SLS is definitely not one of the best trained or experienced for the Job of a CBN Governor, but IMO one of the most courageous to do the job. Unfortunately I think his limited knowledge and experience made him handle this job improperly, as Katsumoto said, like a butcher at an abattoir rather than a surgeon in a theater room.

He would have done better if he listens and takes advice from his more knowledgeable aids and provides courageous leadership. Because Nigeria lack leaders with courage to do the right thing.

The moral question about him working with a conventional bank applies to all the Muslims saving their money in these banks and earning interest. I bet many Nigerian Muslims will be  equally guilty. Lets just leave that aspect alone.

I have no problem with Islamic Bank, but it is morally wrong for the CBN Governor to be its crusader. And I sincerely hope that in the event they fail, they would not use public fund to bail them out.

Second part of excerpts from the book, Interest-free Banking by A.L.M. Abdul Gafoor.

4.3.5 Other disincentives

Among the other disincentives from the borrower’s point of view are the need to disclose his accounts to the bank if he were to borrow on the PLS basis, and the fear that eventually the tax authorities will become wise to the extent of his business and the profits. Several writers have lashed out at the lack of business ethics among the business community, but that is a fact of life at least for the foreseeable future. There is a paucity of survey or case studies of clients to see their reaction to current modes of financing. As such we are not aware of further disincentives that might be there.

4.3.5.1 Accounts

When a business is financed under the PLS scheme it is necessary that the actual profit/loss made using that money be calculated. Though no satisfactory methods have yet been devised, the first requirement for any such activity is to have the necessary accounts. On the borrowers’ side there are two difficulties: one, many small-time businessmen do not keep any accounts, leave alone proper accounts. The time and money costs will cut into his profits. Larger businesses do not like to disclose their real accounts to anybody. On the banks’ side the effort and expense involved in checking the accounts of many small accounts is prohibitive and will again cut into their own share of the profits. Thus both sides would prefer to avoid having to calculate the actually realised profit/loss. To quote Iqbal and Mirakhor:23

  , the commercial banks do face an element of moral hazard owing to the non-existence of systematic book-keeping in this sector. Additionally the reluctance of small producers to submit their operations to bank audits and the perceived enormous cost of auditing and monitoring relative to the small size of the potential credits makes banks unwilling to extend credit on the basis of new modes of financing to these small producers. These reduced lending to small producers may also explain the existence of excess liquidity in the banking system.

4.3.5.2 Tax

The bank is a big business and it has to declare its profit and loss and is legally required to present an audited account of its operations. Once the bank’s accounts are known it doesn’t take much for the tax collectors to figure out the share of the businesses financed by the bank under the PLS scheme. Thus it’s no surprise that businesses are not too very happy about the situation. [/b]The fact that suggestions have been made to use the banks to collect taxes due has not helped the matter either.

4.3.6 Excess liquidity

[b]Presence of excess liquidity is reported in nearly all Islamic banks. This is not due to reduced demand for credit but the due to the inability of the banks to find clients willing to be funded under the new modes of financing. Some of these difficulties are mentioned under section 4.3.1 Financing. Here we have a situation where there is money available on the one hand and there is need for it on the other but the new rules stand in the way of bringing them together! This is a very strange situation -- specially in the developing Muslim countries where money is at a premium even for ordinary economic activities, leave alone development efforts. Removal of riba was expected to ease such difficulties, not to aggravate the already existing ones!

4.3.7 Uneasy questions of morality

The practices in use by the Islamic banks have evoked questions of morality. Do the practices adopted to avoid interest really do their job or is it simply a change of name? It suffices to quote a few authors.

The Economist writes:

   , Muslim theoreticians and bankers have between them devised ingenious ways of coping with the interest problem. One is murabaha. The Koran says you cannot borrow $100m from the bank for a year, at 5% interest, to buy the new machinery your factory needs? Fine. You get the bank to buy the machinery for you -- cost, $100m -- and then you buy the stuff from the bank, paying it $105m a year from now. The difference is that the extra $5m is not interest on loan, which the Koran (perhaps) forbids, but your thanks to the bank for the risk it takes of losing money while it is the owner of the machinery: this is honest trading, okay with the Koran. Since with modern communications the bank’s ownership may last about half a second, its risk is not great, but the transaction is pure. It is not surprising that some Muslims uneasily sniff logic-chopping here.

Dr Ghulam Qadir says of practices in Pakistan:

   [b]Two of the modes of financing prescribed by the State Bank, namely financing through the purchase of client’s property with a buy-back agreement and sale of goods to clients on a mark-up, involved the least risk and were closest to the old interest-based operations. Hence the banks confined their operations mostly to these modes, particularly the former, after changing the simple buy-back agreement (prescribed by the State Bank) to buy-back agreement with a mark-up, as otherwise there was no incentive for them to extend any finances. The banks also reduced their mark-up-based financing, whether through the purchase of client’s property or through the sale of goods to clients, to mere paper work, instead of actual buying of goods (property), taking their possession and then selling (back) to the client. As a result, there was no difference between the mark-up as practised by the banks and the conventional interest rate, and hence it was judged repugnant to Islam in the recent decision of the Federal Shari’ah court.[/b]

   As banks are essentially financial institutions and not trading houses, requiring them to undertake trading in the form of buy-back arrangements and sale on mark-up amounts to imposing on them a function for which they are not well equipped. Therefore, banks in Pakistan made such modifications in the prescribed modes which defeated the very purpose of interest-free financing. Furthermore, as these two minimum-risk modes of financing were kept open to banks, they never tried to devise innovative and imaginative modes of financing within the framework of musharakah and mudarba.

Prof. Khurshid Ahmad says:

   Murabaha (cost-plus financing) and bai’ mu’ajjal (sale with deferred payment) are permitted in the Shari’ah under certain conditions. Technically, it is not a form of financial mediation but a kind of business participation. The Shari’ah assumes that the financier actually buys the goods and then sells them to the client. Unfortunately, the current practice of “buy-back on mark-up” is not in keeping with the conditions on which murabaha or bai’ mu’ajjal are permitted. What is being done is a fictitious deal which ensures a predetermined profit to the bank without actually dealing in goods or sharing any real risk. This is against the letter and spirit of Shari’ah injunctions.

   While I would not venture a fatwa, as I do not qualify for that function, yet as a student of economics and Shari’ah I regard this practice of “buy-back on mark-up” very similar to riba and would suggest its discontinuation. I understand that the Council of Islamic Ideology has also expressed a similar opinion.

Dr Hasanuz Zaman is more scathing in his condemnation:

   It emerges that practically it is impossible for large banks or the banking system to practise the modes like mark-up, bai’ salam, buy-back, murabaha, etc. in a way that fulfils the Shari’ah conditions. But in order to make themselves eligible to a return on their operations, the banks are compelled to play tricks with the letters of the law. They actually do not buy, do not posses, do not actually sell and deliver the goods; but the transition is assumed to have taken place. By signing a number of documents of purchase, sale and transfer they might fulfil a legal requirement but it is by violating the spirit of prohibition.

Again,

   It seems that in large number of cases the ghost of interest is haunting them to calculate a fixed rate percent per annum even in musharakah, mudarba, leasing, hire-purchase, rent sharing, murabaha, (bai’ mu’ajjal, mark-up), PTC, TFC, 30etc. The spirit behind all these contracts seems to make a sure earning comparable with the prevalent rate of interest and, as far as possible, avoid losses which otherwise could occur.

To sum up, in Dr Hasanuz Zaman’s words:

   , many techniques that the interest-free banks are practising are not either in full conformity with the spirit of Shari’ah or practicable in the case of large banks or the entire banking system. Moreover, they have failed to do away with undesirable aspects of interest. Thus, they have retained what an Islamic bank should eliminate.

4.4 Islamic banking in non-Muslim countries

The modern commercial banking system in nearly all countries of the world is mainly evolved from and modelled on the practices in Europe, especially that in the United Kingdom. The philosophical roots of this system revolves around the basic principles of capital certainty for depositors and certainty as to the rate of return on deposits. In order to enforce these principles for the sake of the depositors and to ensure the smooth functioning of the banking system Central Banks have been vested with powers of supervision and control. All banks have to submit to the Central Bank rules. Islamic banks which wish to operate in non-Muslim countries have some difficulties in complying with these rules. We will examine below the salient features.

4.4.1 Certainty of capital and return

While the conventional banks guarantee the capital and rate of return, the Islamic banking system, working on the principle of profit and loss sharing, cannot, by definition, guarantee any fixed rate of return on deposits. Many Islamic banks do not guarantee the capital either, because if there is a loss it has to be deducted from the capital. Thus the basic difference lies in the very roots of the two systems. Consequently countries working under conventional laws are unable to grant permission to institutions which wish to operate under the PLS scheme to functions as commercial banks. Two official comments, one from the UK an the other from the USA suffice to illustrate this.

Sir Leigh Pemberton, the Governor of the Bank of England, told the Arab Bankers’ Association in London that:33

       It is important not to risk misleading and confusing the general public by allowing two essentially different banking systems to operate in parallel;
       A central feature of the banking system of the United Kingdom as enshrined in the legal framework is capital certainty for depositors. It is the most important feature which distinguished the banking sector from the other segments of the financial system;
       Islamic banking is a perfectly acceptable mode of financing but it does not fall within the definition of what constitutes banking in the UK;
       The Bank of England is not legally able to authorise under the Banking Act, an institution which does not take deposits as defined under that Act;
       The Islamic facilities might be provided within other areas of the financial system without using a banking name.

In the United States, Mr Charles Schotte, the US Treasury Department specialist in regulatory issues has remarked:34

   There has never been an application for an Islamic establishment to set up either as a bank or as anything else. So there is no precedent to guide us. Any institution that wishes to use the word ‘bank’ in its title has to guarantee at least a zero rate of interest -- and even that might contravene Islamic laws.

4.4.2 Supervision and control

Besides these, there are other concerns as well. One is the Central Bank supervision and control. This mainly relates to liquidity requirements and adequacy of capital. These in turn depend on an assessment of the value of assets of the Islamic banks. A financial advisor has this to say:

   The bank of England, under the 1979 Act, would have great difficulty in putting a value on the assets of an Islamic institution which wanted to operate as a bank in the UK. The traditional banking system has much of its assets in fixed interest instruments and it is comparatively easy to value that. For example, if they are British Government instruments they will have a quoted market value; and there are recognised methods for valuing traditional banking assets when they become non-productive. But it is very difficult indeed to value an Islamic asset such as a share in a joint venture; and the Bank of England would have to send a team of experienced accountants into every Islamic bank operating in the UK as a bank under the 1979 Act, to try to put a proper and cautious value on its assets.

Another financial analyst states:

   Even if a method could be found for assessing the risks to calculate the capital necessary, little comfort could be taken from the profitability which is usually relied upon to cover day-to-day losses arising from the bank’s business, because a substantial part of an Islamic bank’s portfolio is venture capital without any guaranteed return.

It is evident then that even if there is a desire to accommodate the Islamic system, the new procedures that need be developed and the modifications that need be made to existing procedures are so large that the chances of such accommodation in a cautious sector such as banking is very remote indeed. Any relaxation of strict supervision is precluded because should an Islamic bank fail it would undermine the confidence in the whole financial system, with which it is inevitably identified. As Suratgar puts it:

   There could be potential dangers for the international system, where the failure of such an institution could bring with it the failure of other associated institutions, or of all the Western banking institutions which come closely tied to with such an operation.

The question has engaged the attention of Central Banks in Muslim countries as well. But reliable satisfactory methods are still to developed.

4.4.3 Tax regulations

Another important consideration is the tax procedures in non-Muslim countries. While interest is a ‘passive’ income, profit is an earned income which is treated differently. In addition, in trade financing there are title transfers twice -- once from seller to bank and then from bank to buyer -- and therefore twice taxed on this account decreasing the profitability of the venture. The Director of the International Islamic Bank of Denmark says:

   Tax laws are against the Islamic philosophy and pose the greatest difficulty. In most OECD countries Mudarabha is constrained by fiscal acts which define profits as an after tax item for the profit creator and a fully taxable item for the profit receiver.

4.5 Discussion and suggestions

People have needs -- food, clothes, houses, machinery, services; the list is endless. Entrepreneurs perceive these needs and develop ways and means of catering to them. They advertise their products and services, peoples expectations are raised and people become customers of the entrepreneur. If the customers’ needs are fulfilled according to their expectations they continue to patronise the entrepreneur and his enterprise flourishes. Otherwise his enterprise fails and people take to other entrepreneurs.

Banks too are enterprises; they cater to peoples’ needs connected with money -- safe-keeping, acquiring capital, transferring funds etc. The fact that they existed for centuries and continue to exist and prosper is proof that their methods are good and they fulfil the customers’ needs and expectations. Conventional commercial banking system as it operates today is accepted in all countries except the Islamic world where it is received with some reservation. The reservation is on account of the fact that the banking operations involve dealing in interest which is prohibited in Islam. Conventional banks have ignored this concern on the part of their Muslim clientele. Muslims patronised the conventional banks out of necessity and, when another entrepreneur -- the Islamic banker -- offered to address their concern many Muslims turned to him. The question is: has the new entrepreneur successfully met their concerns, needs and expectations? If not he may have to put up his shutters!

Broadly speaking, banks have three types of different customers: depositors, borrowers and seekers of bank’s other services such as money transfer. Since services do not generally involve dealing in interest Muslims have no problem transacting such businesses with conventional banks; neither do Islamic banks experience any problems in providing these services. Among the depositors there are current account holders who too, similarly, have no problems. It is the savings account holders and the borrowers who have reservations in dealing with the conventional banks. In the following paragraphs we will see how well the Islamic banks have succeeded in addressing their customers’ special concern.

4.5.1 Savings accounts and capital guarantee

As pointed out earlier, our concern here is the savings account holders. As the name itself indicates the primary aim of the saving account depositor is the safe-keeping of his savings. It is correctly perceived by the conventional banker and he guarantees the return of the deposit in toto. The banker also assumes that the depositor will prefer to keep his money with him in preference to another who might also provide the same guarantee if the depositor is provided an incentive. This incentive is called interest, and this interest is made proportional to the amount and length of time it is left with the bank in order to encourage more money brought into the bank and left there for longer periods of time. In addition, the interest rate is fixed in advance so that the depositor and the banker are fully aware of their respective rights and obligations from the beginning. And laws have been enacted to guarantee their enforcement. In Economic theory the interest is often taken to be the “compensation” the depositors demand and receive for parting with their savings. The fact that the depositors accept the paid interest and that, given other things being equal, they prefer the bank or the scheme which offers the highest interest proves the banker’s assumption correct.

The scheme is simple, transparent and seems to have satisfied the requirements of all types of savers -- from teenagers to old-age pensioners, from individuals to large institutions, pension funds and endowments, from small amounts to millions, and from a few weeks or months to years -- that it has survived over centuries and operates across national, cultural and religious borders.

[b]The situation is very different in the Islamic banks. Here too the depositor’s first aim is to keep his savings in safe custody. Islamic bankers divide the conventional savings account into two categories (alternatively, create a new kind of account): savings account and investment account. The investment accounts operate fully under the PLS scheme -- capital is not guaranteed, neither is there any pre-fixed return. Under the savings account the nominal value of the deposit is guaranteed, but they receive no further guaranteed returns. Banks may consider funds under the savings accounts too as part of their resources and use it to create assets. This is theory. In practice, however, the banks prefer, encourage and emphasise the investment accounts. This is because since their assets operate under the PLS scheme they might incur losses on these assets which losses they cannot pass onto the savings accounts depositors on account of the capital guarantee on these accounts. In the process the first aim of the depositor is pushed aside and the basic rule of commercial banking --capital guarantee-- is broken.[/b]

It is suggested that all Islamic banks guarantee the capital under their savings accounts. This will satisfy the primary need and expectation of an important section of the depositors and, in Muslim countries where both Islamic and conventional banks co-exist, will induce more depositors to bank with the Islamic banks. At the same time, it will remove the major objection to establishing Islamic banks in non-Muslim countries.

But the question is how does the bank make an income from these deposits? We will examine this in the next section.

4.5.2 Loans with a service charge

We have already seen that all the problems of the Islamic banks arise from their need to acquire their assets under the PLS scheme. A simple solution does, in fact, already exist in the current theories of Islamic banking. It need only be pointed out and acted upon. We will examine the provisions in the Iranian, Pakistani and the Siddiqi models.

All three models provide for loans with a service charge. Though the specific rules are not identical, the principle is the same. We suggest that the funds in the deposit accounts (current and savings) be used to grant loans (short- and long-term) with a service charge. By doing this the Islamic banks will be able to provide all the loan facilities that conventional banks provide while giving capital guarantee for depositors and earning an income for themselves. Furthermore, and it is important, they can avoid all the problems discussed in section 4.3. This would also remove the rest of the obstacles in opening and operating Islamic banks in non-Muslim countries.

The bonus for the borrowers is that the service charge levied by the Islamic banks will necessarily be less than the interest charged by conventional banks.

Let us now look at the existing relevant rules in the three models. The Iranian model provides for Gharz-al hasaneh whose definition, purpose and operation are given in Articles 15, 16 and 17 of Regulations relating to the granting of banking facilities:42

   Article 15

   Gharz-al-hasaneh is a contract in which one (the lender) of the two parties relinquishes a specific portion of his possessions to the other party (the borrower) which the borrower is obliged to return to the lender in kind or, where not possible, its cash value.

   Article 16

   , the banks , shall set aside a part of their resources and provide Gharz-al-hasaneh for the following purposes:

   (a) to provide equipment, tools and other necessary resources so as to enable the creation of employment, in the form of co-operative bodies, for those who lack the necessary means;

   (b) to enable expansion in production, with particular emphasis on agricultural, livestock and industrial products;

   (c) to meet essential needs.

   Article 17

   The expenses incurred in the provision of Gharz-al-hasaneh shall be, in each case, calculated on the basis of the directives issued by Bank Markazi Jomhouri Islami Iran43 and collected from the borrower.

In Pakistan, permissible modes of financing include:44

   Financing by lending:

   (i) Loans not carrying any interest on which the banks may recover a service charge not exceeding the proportionate cost of the operation, excluding the cost of funds and provisions for bad and doubtful debts. The maximum service charge permissible to each bank will be determined by the State Bank from time to time.

   (ii) Qard-e-hasana loans given on compassionate grounds free of any interest or service charge and repayable if and when the borrower is able to pay.

Siddiqi has suggested that 50 percent of the funds in the ‘loan’ (i.e. current and savings) accounts be used to grant short-term loans.45 A fee is to be charged for providing these loans:46

   An appropriate way of levying such a fee would be to require prospective borrowers to pay a fixed amount on each application, regardless of the amount required, the term of the loan or whether the application is granted or rejected. Then the applicants to whom a loan is granted may be required to pay an additional prescribed fee for all the entries made in the banks registers. The criterion for fixing the fees must be the actual expenditure which the banks have incurred in scrutinising the applications and making decisions, and in maintaining accounts until loans are repaid. These fees should not be made a source of income for the banks, but regarded solely as a means of maintaining and managing the interest-free loans.

It is clear from the above that all three models agree on the need for having cash loans as one mode of financing, and that this service should be paid for by the borrower. Though the details may vary, all seem to suggest that the charge should be the absolute cost only. We suggest that a percentage of this absolute cost be added to the charge as a payment to the bank for providing this service. This should enable an Islamic bank to exist and function independently of its performance in its PLS operations.

@Katsumoto

A summary of the entire page will do.

ndu_chucks:

I quoted you when I was attempting to show manny4life that it is foolhardy to blame sanusi for the high inflation in Nigeria because I thought your quoted statement  was made in support of his claim.  I'm happy to note that unlike the likes  of manny4life, you are not blaming Sanusi for this issue.

BTW, I will not attempt to lecture you, of all people, on Economics because I know better. We all know that you are an expert in this area - this is also the reason why I believe that this enquiry of yours, as stated in your first post is bogus.

It is fine to be suspicious of my motives. I alluded to the point that I remained unconvinced of Sanusi's brilliance in my original post and was hoping that some of his supporters/fans would provide the evidence to support such unfounded characterisations. Instead, we have been told that he received International awards; if such International awards were so credible, SLS would have been mentioned as one of the candidates to take over at the IMF as were Carsten (Bank of Mexico Governor), Stanley Fischer (Bank of Isreal), Trevor Manuel (Finance Chief South Africa), Arminio Fraga (ex-Governor, Brazil) but all we got was silence as far as SLS was concerned.

AjanleKoko:

Well, time for us simpletons to make a few remarks, even though I think Katsumoto didn't anticipate the direction things would go, and as such hasn't been able to push the discussions into other aspects of Sanusi's tenure. As it is, we haven't gone beyond his qualifications for the job.

Anyway, I am kind of wary of the dude. Sure, he seems to have a lot of good press, and judging by the responses on this thread, a lot of admirers. But there are a number of question marks.

Firstly his experience within the industry cannot possibly be enough to head up the central bank of a country like Nigeria. We are reasonably beyond the 1960s, when a Lt. Col Gowon was made head of state. But, well, you know, the appointment of Charles Soludo set the tone for appointments like this, as he had only academic and no industry experience when he was appointed CBN governor.

Secondly, his political antecedents. As the chief monetary policy formulator of Nigeria, he seems to spend an awful lot of time writing political essays and giving political talks. Dunno about you guys, I am uncomfortable with that.

Thirdly his 'brilliance'. Brilliance is one word loosely used in Nigeria to describe anything from verbosity to display of maverick, and very rarely genius.
It's like we hear some great speech and we go 'wow that guy is brilliant', or we see a CV and we're like 'oh what a smart lady!'. Let's face it people, we lack depth, most Nigerians do, so we are moved easily by words.

Fourth, which is the real crux of the matter? How well has he done as CBN governor? I'll borrow from this post below:

I share same sentiment, but again, this is Nigeria. Emotion usually prevails over reason, which is always our problem anyway. Yes, he did a good job cleaning out the banking rot, but we are still yet to address the fundamental issues, which was responsible for the collapse in the first place.

I don't know much about Islamic banking, but I wonder why this is a headline topic for SLS at this time, given all the issues with the economy right at this point, i.e. combating rising inflation, and getting the confidence back into the financial sector. CBN should be a regulator, providing the framework for models like non-interest banking just like they're doing for mobile payments. Especially in an environment as sensitive as Nigeria, our chief monetary policy formulator can't be the chief promoter of any banking model. Or am I missing something somewhere?

To the point

but we have discussed just more than his qualifications - Banking Reform, fallouts from policies on growth, investment, stock value, etc and the controversial Islamic Banking have all been covered. Next we will delve into Sanusi's attempt at being a regulator as well as a competitor in the Nigerian economy vis-a-vis his recent proposals for CBN operations.

OAM4J:

Well well well interesting so far.

SLS is definitely not one of the best trained or experienced for the Job of a CBN Governor, but IMO one of the most courageous to do the job. Unfortunately I think his limited knowledge and experience made him handle this job improperly, as Katsumoto said, like a butcher at an abattoir rather than a surgeon in a theater room.

He would have done better if he listens and takes advice from his more knowledgeable aids and provides courageous leadership. Because Nigeria lack leaders with courage to do the right thing.

The moral question about him working with a conventional bank applies to all the Muslims saving their money in these banks and earning interest. I bet many Nigerian Muslims will be  equally guilty. Lets just leave that aspect alone.

I have no problem with Islamic Bank, but it is morally wrong for the CBN Governor to be its crusader. And I sincerely hope that in the event they fail, they would not use public fund to bail them out.

Correct - Job of Central Bank Governor should simply provide framework and guidelines and not act as marketer speaking from conference to conference. Instead of giving speeches, Sanusi should be working on trying to overcome the issues being experienced by Islamic Banks in Muslim and non-Muslim countries. Instead, we have the What (Islamic Banking) without the how (framework, laws, training, taxation, depositor safety nets, social fallouts, etc)

chamber2:

@Katsumoto

A summary of the entire page will do.

In a bit.

Ok, I have tried to summarise the long write-up from that book I quoted earlier. To get a clearer picture, you can still try to read the two parts over a period of time.

1. There are four main areas where the Islamic banks find it difficult to finance under the PLS scheme: a) participating in long-term low-yield projects, b) financing the small businessman, c) granting non-participating loans to running businesses, and d) financing government borrowing
2. Banks do not have the required expertise and experience required for time consuming complicated assessment procedures and negotiations. Evaluation of all projects is required and banks don’t have the capacity for this.
3. Despite excess liquidity in the banks, small businesses are unable to obtain financing. Similarly, many businesses can’t obtain working capital funding because it isnt provided for in the banks
4. Legislation is required to regulate islamic banking and this is lacking particularly in non-muslim countries where conventional and islamic banking operate in parallel. The lack of proper definitions of property rights may have constrained bank lending.
5. Bank staff will have to acquire many new skills and learn new procedures to operate the Islamic banking system. This is a time consuming process which is aggravated by two other factors. One, the sheer number of persons that need to be re-trained and, two, the additional staff that need to be recruited and trained to carry out the increased work.
6. Businesses need to disclose full accounts to the banks which most entrepreneurs do not like to do for tax purposes. The first requirement for any such activity is to have the necessary accounts. On the borrowers’ side there are two difficulties: one, many small-time businessmen do not keep any accounts, leave alone proper accounts. The time and money costs will cut into his profits. Larger businesses do not like to disclose their real accounts to anybody. On the banks’ side the effort and expense involved in checking the accounts of many small accounts is prohibitive and will again cut into their own share of the profits. Thus both sides would prefer to avoid having to calculate the actually realised profit/loss.
7. Presence of excess liquidity is reported in nearly all Islamic banks. This is not due to reduced demand for credit but the due to the inability of the banks to find clients willing to be funded under the new modes of financing
8. The practices in use by the Islamic banks have evoked questions of morality. Do the practices adopted to avoid interest really do their job or is it simply a change of name? It seems that in large number of cases the ghost of interest is haunting them to calculate a fixed rate percent per annum even in musharakah, mudarba, leasing, hire-purchase, rent sharing, murabaha, (bai’ mu’ajjal, mark-up), PTC, TFC, 30etc. The spirit behind all these contracts seems to make a sure earning comparable with the prevalent rate of interest and, as far as possible, avoid losses which otherwise could occur.
9. While the conventional banks guarantee the capital and rate of return, the Islamic banking system, working on the principle of profit and loss sharing, cannot, by definition, guarantee any fixed rate of return on deposits. Many Islamic banks do not guarantee the capital either, because if there is a loss it has to be deducted from the capital. Thus the basic difference lies in the very roots of the two systems. Consequently countries working under conventional laws are unable to grant permission to institutions which wish to operate under the PLS scheme to functions as commercial banks.
10. Spervision and control by Central Bank - The bank of England, under the 1979 Act, would have great difficulty in putting a value on the assets of an Islamic institution which wanted to operate as a bank in the UK. The traditional banking system has much of its assets in fixed interest instruments and it is comparatively easy to value that. For example, if they are British Government instruments they will have a quoted market value; and there are recognised methods for valuing traditional banking assets when they become non-productive. But it is very difficult indeed to value an Islamic asset such as a share in a joint venture; and the Bank of England would have to send a team of experienced accountants into every Islamic bank operating in the UK as a bank under the 1979 Act, to try to put a proper and cautious value on its assets.
11. Comment from a financial analyst - It is evident then that even if there is a desire to accommodate the Islamic system, the new procedures that need be developed and the modifications that need be made to existing procedures are so large that the chances of such accommodation in a cautious sector such as banking is very remote indeed. Any relaxation of strict supervision is precluded because should an Islamic bank fail it would undermine the confidence in the whole financial system, with which it is inevitably identified. As Suratgar puts it:

There could be potential dangers for the international system, where the failure of such an institution could bring with it the failure of other associated institutions, or of all the Western banking institutions which come closely tied to with such an operation.
12. Tax laws are against the Islamic philosophy and pose the greatest difficulty. In most OECD countries Mudarabha is constrained by fiscal acts which define profits as an after tax item for the profit creator and a fully taxable item for the profit receiver.
13. Islamic bankers divide the conventional savings account into two categories (alternatively, create a new kind of account): savings account and investment account. The investment accounts operate fully under the PLS scheme -- capital is not guaranteed, neither is there any pre-fixed return. Under the savings account the nominal value of the deposit is guaranteed, but they receive no further guaranteed returns. Banks may consider funds under the savings accounts too as part of their resources and use it to create assets. This is theory. In practice, however, the banks prefer, encourage and emphasise the investment accounts. This is because since their assets operate under the PLS scheme they might incur losses on these assets which losses they cannot pass onto the savings accounts depositors on account of the capital guarantee on these accounts. In the process the first aim of the depositor is pushed aside and the basic rule of commercial banking --capital guarantee-- is broken.
14. To avoid the label of Riba, some Islamic Banks are levying charges interest. This is the practice in Bangladesh and Malaysia where one of the biggest Islamic Banks, Grameen banks levies interests on loans which are lower than interests in conventional banks but argue that since it is lower, it is not Riba.

@Katsumoto you have definitely made your point and further enforced my believe that Nigeria got it wrong in the person of sanusi as CBN governor. One evil that Yar'adua's administration has done us is sanusi. I only pray that generations of unborn Nigerians will not suffer for this.

1.   There are four main areas where the Islamic banks find it difficult to finance under the PLS scheme: a) participating in long-term low-yield projects, b) financing the small businessman, c) granting non-participating loans to running businesses, and d) financing government borrowing
2.   Banks do not have the required expertise and experience required for time consuming complicated assessment procedures and negotiations. Evaluation of all projects is required and banks don’t have the capacity for this.
3.   Despite excess liquidity in the banks, small businesses are unable to obtain financing. Similarly, many businesses can’t obtain working capital funding because it isnt provided for in the banks
4.   Legislation is required to regulate islamic banking and this is lacking particularly in non-muslim countries where conventional and islamic banking operate in parallel. The lack of proper definitions of property rights may have constrained bank lending.
5.   Bank staff will have to acquire many new skills and learn new procedures to operate the Islamic banking system. This is a time consuming process which is aggravated by two other factors. One, the sheer number of persons that need to be re-trained and, two, the additional staff that need to be recruited and trained to carry out the increased work.

Good work.One good thing about you is in your level of objectivity.This is unlike most folks here who are swayed by emotion and sentiments rather than reason and insight.But, on a more serious note does it mean SLS and his cohorts overlooked the above five items in their campaign for the introduction of islamic banking in Nigeria?If that is the case, then there is an underlying motive for this vigorous campaign by sanusi.I wish this your findings could be published in our dailies.We are lazy in this country, nobody bothers to do simple research on national issues like this.Everybody seems to rely on the opinion of these so called regulators turned religious leaders.

superior1:

@Katsumoto you have definitely made your point and further enforced my believe that Nigeria got it wrong in the person of sanusi as CBN governor. One evil that Yar'adua's administration has done us is sanusi. I only pray that generations of unborn Nigerians will not suffer for this.

He's simply awe-inspiring

kasumoto, no need for all the long post, no need for SLS qualification, just ask what are the functions of a cenbank and what are the duties of a cenbank guvnor has SLS fulfilled those duties, when we get the answers we then judge, my answer -Mediocre

SLS is pure Mediocre, by their fruits we shall know them.

By his procedures, actions, deeds and words, he is a failure.

He doesnt have what it takes to be a CBN Governor,

He was already boosting while in First bank that he is CBN Governor in waiting.

Just like his boosting of emir in waiting.

its only in first bank that sanusi could av rising 2 an MD.wit Msc in SHARIA study he would av been retired as a branch manager in my bank.Fed.character my foot!!!!!!!

@OP
BTW SLS does not have an MSC
Can we please be clear on that ?

But I still think he is smart.
I just think that from his actions and exposure he is not conversant with modern banking and Macro economic systems.

With those excerpts from Mr Kats, now we can understand further how irrational it will be for Mr Sanusi to keep emphasizing on Islamic banking model like it is bereft of any problem when in fact, it comes with its own very many problems.
Little wonder there is hardly any success story to tell about the model, even Iran and Pakistan, countries with the highest numbers of Islamic banks are struggling to follow the sharia principles of finance to its letter. Yet our bigoted CBN governor is busy telling everyone that cares to listen that it's the best thing since his catastrophic reforms.
They only mouth off about non-interest lending but go silent on the stipulated bureaucratic bottlenecks for obtaining these so-called non-interest loans.
They argue that the bank will avail many northerners and muslims who find it hard to reconcile their religious beliefs on profit and loss, the opportunity to be account owners and enjoy products that will help their small businesses. However, with the revelation that one has to be an investment account holder with the bank and make available the true profit made, one wonders where these peasant farmers that make up the population for their target market will get all these prerequisites.
Then you have to consider the compatibility of the existing financial laws with the one that set up the sharia model.
I keep asking these question, does Sanusi consult widely before going out to make announcements? Or does he intend to single-handedly change existing laws just to accommodate Islamic banking. Of course if a civil case arises, judgements and assessments will be based on existing laws and regulations that guide finance in Nigeria.

I think for all those that do not like Sanusi, it is your problem.He may not have a PhD like your President who is spineless but he has got, courage and integrity. He did not only write on Islam


Below are some of the articles he wrote


BUHARISM: Economic Theory and Political Economy

BUHARISM BEYOND BUHARI: A Response to Mohammed Haruna

i dont know why the whole beaf for this brilliant man

donguutti:

kasumoto, no need for all the long post, no need for SLS qualification, just ask what are the functions of a cenbank and what are the duties of a cenbank guvnor has SLS fulfilled those duties, when we get  the answers we then judge, my answer -Mediocre

The primary goal of a central bank is to ensure price stability. The Governing Council of the European Central Bank  and the Federal Open Market Committee of the Federal Reserve Bank decide how to interpret its duty to achieve price stability. The Bank of England also ensures price stability but unlike the ECB and the FOMC, the BOE does not get to decide how to interpret its duty to achieve price stability. The Chancellor of the Exchequer has that responsibility. To achieve price stability, a Central Bank will use the following tools.

Functions of a Central Bank
1. Open Market Operations
2. Refinancing Rate
3. Mandate Reserve Requirements

SLS has only been in the role for approximately 2 years. In that time, the refinancing rate has gone from 8% (June 2009) to 6% (August 2009)  to 6.25% (Sept 2010) to 6.5% 9(Feb 2011) and back to 8% (May 2011). In that time, inflation was increasing steadily, so why the erratic refinancing rate?  Looking at the data, the refinancing rate went from 8% to 6% in August 2009, which coincides with the supply of 420bn by Sanusi into the economy.

Whilst Sanusi can not be blamed solely for the high inflation and high refinancing rate, one would expect Sanusi to have unveiled plans on how he intends to tackle double digit inflation, high refinancing rate, and the huge disparity between the refinancing rate and the commercial lending rate (approx. 16%). Instead, he has spent his time giving Islamic speeches at Islamic conferences and getting political. In this regard, he has failed because he has not even attempted to fix the problems he met in office.

In the absence of an effective and efficient fiscal policy (we all know Nigerian politicians are dullards), a brilliant Bank Governor will use the powers he has as far as Monetary policy is concerned, to influence growth and development. Low inflation (1-3%) and low refinancing rates (0-4%) are prevalent amongst the developed world.  In the developing economies of the BRIC countries (Brazil, Russia, India, and China), inflation is higher (5-9%) as a result of economic activity while refinancing rates are high (2-8%).

Bizhop:

I think for all those that do not like Sanusi, it is your problem.He may not have a PhD like your President who is spineless but he has got, courage and integrity. He did not only write on Islam
Below are some of the articles he wrote

BUHARISM: Economic Theory and Political Economy

BUHARISM BEYOND BUHARI: A Response to Mohammed Haruna

i dont know why the whole beaf for this brilliant man

Wow, at last we have an expert on Buharism
I beg which economic journal did these academic papers appear?

odedele:

its only in first bank that sanusi could av rising 2 an MD.wit Msc in SHARIA study he would av been retired as a branch manager in my bank.Fed.character my foot!!!!!!!

Do you know who was chairman at First bank and who helped make Sanusi MD?
Umaru Mutallab, the retired police officer/federal commissioner/al queda financier whose son turned out to be the shoe bomber over Detroit.

And do you know who took Sanusi to a sick and confused president Yar'dua and "assured him that Sanusi was the best man for the job"?
The same nepotic Umaru Mutallab

And who is inflamming ambers of religious instability at a time when al queada/Boko Haram is already threatening the corporate existance of Nigeria by misinterpreting the already existing rules about non-interest banking into Islamic banking?
Yes, you guessed it, Umaru Mutallab Sanusi.

I think for all those that do not like Sanusi, it is your problem.He may not have a PhD like your President who is spineless but he has got, courage and integrity. He did not only write on Islam
Below are some of the articles he wrote

BUHARISM: Economic Theory and Political Economy

BUHARISM BEYOND BUHARI: A Response to Mohammed Haruna

i dont know why the whole beaf for this brilliant man

.


very "brilliant" articles from a cenbank guvnor, what concerns our economy with buharism, yes he has courage but integrity why did he not submit details of his budget after accusing the parliament of profligacy.lets be objective here

@ KASUMOTO a cenbank guvnor must be consistent in policies also to create confidence,the whole bailout cum liquidation thats #620b gone, the off premises ATM roundabout, etc

i have read the comments of most people on this forum, and what i see is deep bigotry and bias.

Nigeria is filled with paper professionals that have all the M.Sc , PhDs and DSCs, but little impact .Nigerians are crazy for all the degrees which is just ego tripping.The questions here is Service Delivery.Prof Soludu was aware of the rot in the banking sector but was not man enough to effect the change.


Why this beaf///

@ poster, My problem with southerners from Nigeria is that they have no guts whatsoever. you can have all  the degrees from the ivy league universities in the world, without guts and courage IMO, It amounts to nothing in Nigeria, That is why you find the likes of aganga cower b4 the senate inspite of his so called credentials. Mr katsumoto seemed to have so studied SLS that he has become an encyclopaedia on him. He comes to nairaland where he can hide his identity and spin all the knowledge of micro/macro economics just to discredit SLS, If he disagrees with CBN policies, As an intellectual, there are academic forums where fellow professsionals can argue ur points but no he chooses nairaland so he can appear to be intelligent to people who know little or nothing about the subject and are likely to go with their emotions. We have had the likes of olu falae, kalu idika kalu and many technocrats over the yrs in Nigeria, Nothing happened with these folks, while Time people, Financial Times of london have all honored sanusi, we have a spin doctor with no identity claiming to know more than these folks. If you know ur onions as you are claiming, let us have ur own resume and your publications in International journals and then you can go to forums where fellow professionals can argue with you. The failed banks and financial institutions across europe and america were maned by ivy leaguers with resumes as long as textbooks, i would exchange all those CV's with honesty and guts in Nigeria, And by the way the united states is still in deep shit wit its economy even though they have ivy leaguers as head of their regulatory agencies, So Mr katsumoto, we know ur motives, stop stalking SLS, get a life

Bizhop:

i have read the comments of most people on this forum, and what i see is deep bigotry and bias.

Nigeria is filled with paper professionals that have all the M.Sc , PhDs and DSCs, but little impact .Nigerians are crazy for all the degrees which is just ego tripping.The questions here is Service Delivery.Prof Soludu was aware of the rot in the banking sector but was not man enough to effect the change.


Why this beaf///

You see people here are discussing very real points which people like you don't seem to understand. Why don't you just go to another section where you can curse and yell at each other for no reason.
If not, please state your position like others in an objective manner.

kbdrim:

@ poster, My problem with southerners from Nigeria is that they have no guts whatsoever. you can have all the degrees from the ivy league universities in the world, without guts and courage IMO, It amounts to nothing in Nigeria, That is why you find the likes of aganga cower b4 the senate inspite of his so called credentials. Mr katsumoto seemed to have so studied SLS that he has become an encyclopaedia on him. He comes to nairaland where he can hide his identity and spin all the knowledge of micro/macro economics just to discredit SLS, If he disagrees with CBN policies, As an intellectual, there are academic forums where fellow professsionals can argue your points but no he chooses nairaland so he can appear to be intelligent to people who know little or nothing about the subject and are likely to go with their emotions. We have had the likes of olu falae, kalu idika kalu and many technocrats over the yrs in Nigeria, Nothing happened with these folks, while Time people, Financial Times of london have all honored sanusi, we have a spin doctor with no identity claiming to know more than these folks. If you know your onions as you are claiming, let us have your own resume and your publications in International journals and then you can go to forums where fellow professionals can argue with you. The failed banks and financial institutions across europe and america were maned by ivy leaguers with resumes as long as textbooks, i would exchange all those CV's with honesty and guts in Nigeria, And by the way the united states is still in deep poo wit its economy even though they have ivy leaguers as head of their regulatory agencies, So Mr katsumoto, we know your motives, stop stalking SLS, get a life

If you're paid to defend SLS, you have totally failed, because you have offered not one word of constructive arguement to support him.
Attacking Katsumoto maybe our typical way of doing things in Nigeria, but it doesn't help your client one bit.
Tell us for example if Nigerian banks, their staff, and customers are better off today than when SLS took over, that should be easier

Honestly, I must confess that I found it surprising to see that some fellow NL still sees 'brilliancy' in the person of SLS.  People says he is cleaning up some 'mess'. A 'mess' that was created out of excessive risk, an excessive risk that he cannot manage - That exactly what he termed 'mess'
I would not want to compare his administration with that of Prof Soludo era, but I had expected a CBN Governor that will grow the economy from where Soludo left it. I listened with heartfelt pity how some of Importers/ manufacturers lament how almost impossible it is to access loan facilities from bank these days. No bank want to take any risk again, yes! U must be covered @ list 130% b4 lending out. Non performing loans (NPL) becomes a monster appearing as if it was never expected, forgetting the fact that in the business of lending, some will pay and some won't ! (the hard truth). I know that some NLs Will argue that the level of these NPLs were high, yes, and it calls for reductions. Reductions by persuasion, negotiations, restructuring, rate change, financial advise, and above all boosting the economy, and not by publishing debtors name on pages of newspapers. Maybe Nigerian name should be appearing on the journal of IMF periodically to enable us pay.
SLS has been asked on several occasion to submit his blueprint, he is yet to. Maybe that's what give him the chance on his stance on ATM machines.
On Islamic banking, non interest banking have been existing before nw, the questns should be why SLS decided to narrow it to Islamic banking? Why the sudden brouhaha on Islamic banking as if it his inventions?
In fact SLS is a mistake that has happened to Nigeria and the earlier this mistake is corrected the better for us all.

Dude, I have not been paid, Im just saying the poster is being smart by half, There are intellectual forums for such discourse, It is certainly not nairaland, facebook or other social networking sites. If you want to be taken seriously as the poster wants to be made out let him go to such forums or better still publish his research in dailies, If SLS was the poster he wont hide his identity and spin crap on people who might not have an idea of what he is saying. Serious minded folks dont do that, He wants us to believe that he has done his homework maybe he has but Nairaland is not the place to dump his crap period. If you are an activist come out openly lets know who you are, That is my point, If you do not have the courage to do that then u certainly are a coward and Nigeria doesnt need his type now. AN INTELLECTUAL WHO KNOWS HIS SALT WONT BE HAVING THIS DISCOURSE HERE, PERIOD

naijaking1:

You see people here are discussing very real points which people like you don't seem to understand. Why don't you just go to another section where you can curse and yell at each other for no reason.
If not, please state your position like others in an objective manner.

If you're paid to defend SLS, you have totally failed, because you have offered not one word of constructive arguement to support him.
Attacking Katsumoto maybe our typical way of doing things in Nigeria, but it doesn't help your client one bit.
Tell us for example if Nigerian banks, their staff, and customers are better off today than when SLS took over, that should be easier
[/

naijaking1 link=topic=710377.msg8697217#msg8697217 date=1310416648:

You see people here are discussing very real points which people like you don't seem to understand. Why don't you just go to another section where you can curse and yell at each other for no reason.
If not, please state your position like others in an objective manner.

If you're paid to defend SLS, you have totally failed, because you have offered not one word of constructive arguement to support him.
Attacking Katsumoto maybe our typical way of doing things in Nigeria, but it doesn't help your client one bit.
Tell us for example if Nigerian banks, their staff, and customers are better off today than when SLS took over, that should be easier

naijaking1:

You see people here are discussing very real points which people like you don't seem to understand. Why don't you just go to another section where you can curse and yell at each other for no reason.
If not, please state your position like others in an objective manner.

If you're paid to defend SLS, you have totally failed, because you have offered not one word of constructive arguement to support him.
Attacking Katsumoto maybe our typical way of doing things in Nigeria, but it doesn't help your client one bit.
Tell us for example if Nigerian banks, their staff, and customers are better off today than when SLS took over, that should be easier

^^^
Attack the message, not the messanger.

^^^^^^
Again The message is in the wrong place or perhaps the messenger is in the right place, conspiracy theorist

^^^^
Unfortunately, you or me don't have to dictate where public discusses take place: beer parlour, national assembly, church/mosque, market place, or even town square. The important thing is that its taking place at all.
For example, if you disagree with anything this erudite scholar-Katsumoto has written or said, argue your part, don't attck him, his modus operandi, or his persona.
You see, revolution can start with simple efforts like this, especially if true and factual.
Furhter example, we argue that SLS is not educated enough to head our national economic team, via CBN. If you disagree, tell us why, and how. If you have any evidence that the guy completed his master's degree requirements in economic for example, let's know about it.

We think that many of his mistakes are simply due to inadequate education. It is important to tackle this problem at the source, not because of his ethnicity or religion, but because he'll continue making the same mistakes in the foreseable future.

^^^^

Listen to the words of wisdom.

Leave him be. He has said the truth.

kbdrim:

Dude, I have not been paid, Im just saying the poster is being smart by half, There are intellectual forums for such discourse, It is certainly not nairaland, facebook or other social networking sites. If you want to be taken seriously as the poster wants to be made out let him go to such forums or better still publish his research in dailies, If SLS was the poster he wont hide his identity and spin crap on people who might not have an idea of what he is saying. Serious minded folks dont do that, He wants us to believe that he has done his homework maybe he has but Nairaland is not the place to dump his crap period.[size=18pt] If you are an activist come out openly lets know who you are, That is my point, If you do not have the courage to do that then u certainly are a coward and Nigeria doesnt need his type now[/size]. AN INTELLECTUAL WHO KNOWS HIS SALT WONT BE HAVING THIS DISCOURSE HERE, PERIOD

My sentiments exactly.

This is not the age of bojuboju. Only cowards hide behind the internet to sully people's reputation.

Cowards!  Shame on cowards!! 

May you live longer than your enemies, Kbdrim!