@image123

Martian:

1) how many children were killed during noah's flood?
2) Since kids can't do anything without their parents, was god justified in drowning helpless children just to prove a point?

Image123:

i'm waiting for this showing. i've not cherry picked scriptures like you were cherry picking my words, and the scriptures. i'm not in denial or disbelief of any scripture passage. i can only quote what seems relevant to the discuss or as based on questions you ask. All i've required is that you present them one after the other, in an orderly manner, so that we can perhaps have a profitable discussion, not just a throw up of atheistic frustrations.

Here is what you said. . . .

Image123:

In a similar sense, God has not changed. He still hates sin. He is still powerful, God, merciful, loving, righteous, holy, and whatever quality we call Him from Genesis. God's against witches, sin, and all disobedience to Him/His Word. He's not changed.

Firstly you are picking passages to tell me that God has not changed but am telling you that the God you are saying does not change has changed a great deal. . .A simple reading of the bible shows it. . .Lets take the dietary laws as an example. . .Back in the OT some certain type of diet where prohibited but in the NT everything was permissible to be eaten by the same God supposedly. . . .In the OT some things offend God so much and he was written to have said that those engaged in such acts were to be stoned to death or killed. . . .In the NT the same God allegedly saw nothing wrong with such things any more. . .Example working on the sabbath. . . .This change is due to a simple fact the people who constantly re-invent and manufacture the God change and once they change then their God will also change along with them. . . .

Secondly you gave a litany of some attributes and ascribed to your God among them love and mercy. . . .I didn't see you list the bad once like evil cos we have the God of the bible saying that he is an evil entity, he committed evil several times and apologized for his evil deeds, no?. . . .You were only cheery picking the good attributes and leaving the evil ones out. . . .To be merciful means to treat people better than they deserve. . . .Yet we have your God threatening to have babies killed by wild animals. . . .Will you consider an entity that threatens to have babies killed by wild animals to be a merciful entity?. . .You guys just keep throwing words around with out even knowing what they mean. . . .

mazaje:

NOT true, a simple reading of the OT and the NT will show you that the God the bible talks about has changed a great deal from getting angry and killing people over simple things like picking sticks on the sabbath or setting very strict dietary laws and clothing laws to allowing people to eat anything and forgetting about the sabbath. . . .

A simple reading of the bible shows that this statement is false. . . . .

Very poor analogy and God that very easily kills people and accepts human and animal sacrifice which is completely different from a God that doesn't no? Read the bible. . . .I am talking about the behavior of the God of the bible as recorded in the old and new testaments, that God has changed a great deal. . . .


You see you are still picing and choosing what quailities you want to ascribe unto your God from the bible,

God as a Person or character has not changed. What has changed is God's covenant with man. No one disagrees or disputes that. That's what's called otestament and ntestament. The qualities and characters of God are still the same and i clearly said that.
i'll attend to other issues later, may not be today, i'm busy.haracter has not changed. What has changed is God's covenant with man. No one disagrees or disputes that. That's what's called otestament and ntestament. The qualities and characters of God are still the same and i clearly said that.
i'll attend to other issues later, may not be today, i'm busy.

mazaje:


You see you are still picing and choosing what quailities you want to ascribe unto your God from the bible, you are choosing only the good attributes you want to chose, what about the evil ones, the bible clearly says that God is evil and does evil in some parts, no?. . . .

Exodus 32:14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people (KJV)

Jer 42:9 And said unto them, Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel, unto whom ye sent me to present your supplication before him;

Jer 42:10 If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull [you] down, and I will plant you, and not pluck [you] up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you. (KJV)

Here we have God clearly saying that he did evil and he repented of his evil deeds. . . .I don't see christians quoting any of these verses. . . .Only an entity that has evil as one of its attributes can display evil, no?

The Bible doesn't say that God is evil. You're a liar just like the devil is.
God permits evil to happen,ot or nt. Evil still happens, no? Destruction is evil. God wanted to destroy the Israelites in Exodus32 but verse 14 says that He didn't. This was because of Moses' prayer for them. I mentioned WHATEVER QUALITY from Genesis, don't know why you said i missed some out. God is Judge. And as Judge, God rewards both with good and evil. You reap what you sow. If you sow good, God rewards you good and vice versa. That's a Judge, that's justice. It's the same in Jeremiah 42. The people received evil(punishment) from God because of their backsliding but the moment they supplicated(v9), God had mercy. It's the same today for every sinner like you. This is elementary comprehension of context. Gloat all you want on word picking and you'd remain never learning anything.

mazaje:
Will you consider any being that threatens to have children eaten by wild animals a loving being?. . .


My friend you are just giving me your opinion as if that is what the bible says. . . .The bible talks about two people coming together and asking for things through prayers and promising that their request will be granted and here you are trying to spin it to mean something else. . .If that is what the bible was trying to say it would have been written inside the bible, no? I thought you guys claim the bible is the word of God, or do you not believe in what it says again?. . . .The bible is clear when two people come together and ask with faith in prayers their request will be granted if it meant to say something else it would have been written as part of the verse, I know why you chose to spin it to mean something else. . . .


Those that disobey are also sinner no? And the bible says that the wages of sin is death, no?. . . .What you are saying is that the bible can be taken to mean anything with also proves my point. . . .

The Leviticus 26 passage you quoted is similar, it's judgemet, punishment. Punishment is a result of wrongdoing, it's unpleasant. God loves man and doesn't want man to sin. He even forgives man of his sin. But if a man sins, he simply gets punished, fact. I'm not going to coat it for you to make it look pleasant. i can only make analogies hoping you see from these, since you can't see from the original.
Punishment is everywhere. A CEO may love all his staff, give incentives, promotions, hope to do good for staff and their families. But if one employee steals or is incompetent or does something evil, he gets sacked, that's punishment. Who wants to get sacked/punished. It's unpleasant, or can we say evil, but it happens every other day. You may love your dog, train it, treat it etc but it suddenly gets 'mad' and bites or kills someone close to you. It's not irrational to punish the dog in some way. Some may starve it for a day, beat it, sell it. Some may even kill it. All these is not good but evil, at least to the dog.

What did i spin Matthew 18v19 to mean, mazaje?
There are different command, different obedience, different disobediences and different punishments. A child that did not finish his food, and the one that woke 5minutes after mummy woke him up, and the one that partied with the money he was told to pay for school fees all disobeyed. But they are not in the same class and will not/should not all receive the same equal punishment. It even gets more complicated when it's not your child and you're to punish. i told you earlier, the Bible is not an exact science, just like humans, plants, relationships are not.ier, the Bible is not an exact science, just like humans, plants, relationships are not.

globexl:

@Image123:
You religious people are just too hilarious. you always shout hat god created me and created everyone in his own image. God created white people, black people, indians, chinese, tall people,pigmies, left handed people, right handed people, ugly people as well as attractive people, right
Now, did god not create Same-sex people as well? Or was it his evil brother, Satan,that created homosexuals while god was resting on the seventh day? LOL.
By christian logic, god created everyone with their different talents of traits. If god created homosexuals, then why would that same god punish homosexuals for being exactly whatgod created them? Is something wrong with god? Is god schitszophrenic or is it your understanding of god that is schitszophrenic?

And by the way is there a hierachy of sin? That is , is one form of sin more sinful than another form of sin? for example, assuming that god forbids homosexuality, as well as forbiding fornicaton, lying and envy. My question is:Would a Same-sex recieve more eternal punishment than a heterosexual fornicator? or a lier? or an envious person?

Pls answer:

God created all human beings. Unfortunately, no one is born as a saint. We're all tempted to sin, do wrong, do evil. Good news is that we're expected and empowered by Jesus Christ to overcome the temptations and live right. We were all born sinners whatever form of sin you may specialise in, and we can all repent and be converted and begin to please and serve God.
Sins are different just as sicknesses are different, and so also punishments/judgements would be different. But there's a broad class of being separated from God forever to be in hell fire, and being with God forever. Jesus said something about judgemet being more tolerable for Sodom than for some people, an indication of variety in judgement.

Image123:

The Bible doesn't say that God is evil. You're a liar just like the devil is.

. . . .Am not a lair. . . .The bible says God is evil because it talks about God doing evil and apologizing for the evil he did. . . .



Jer 42:9 And said unto them, Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel, unto whom ye sent me to present your supplication before him;

Jer 42:10   If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull [you] down, and I will plant you, and not pluck [you] up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you. (KJV)

The bible does not say God is omnipresent as well but people use some of his attributes as written in the bible to come to that conclusion. . . .An entity that is capable to doing evil must have evil attributes, no?. . . .One of the attributes of Yahweh according to the bible is his ability to commit evil, he even apologized for the evil he committed making him an evil entity, no?. . . .

God permits evil to happen,ot or nt. Evil still happens, no? Destruction is evil. God wanted to destroy the Israelites in Exodus32 but verse 14 says that He didn't. This was because of Moses' prayer for them. I mentioned WHATEVER QUALITY from Genesis, don't know why you said i missed some out. God is Judge. And as Judge, God rewards both with good and evil. You reap what you sow. If you sow good, God rewards you good and vice versa. That's a Judge, that's justice. It's the same in Jeremiah 42. The people received evil(punishment) from God because of their backsliding but the moment they supplicated(v9), God had mercy. It's the same today for every sinner like you. This is elementary comprehension of context. Gloat all you want on word picking and you'd remain never learning anything.

Why then was Yahweh repenting for the evil he did if he was administering Justice? What kind of Justice is that the judge repents after administering it? . .  .The passage says I repent of the evil I did, no? A fair judge can never repent , do you know what mercy is? Mercy means to treat people better than they deserve. . . .The acording to the bible thus say the lord
"I repent of the evil I have done unto you" I didn't say that. . .The bible did. . .

Image123:

The Leviticus 26 passage you quoted is similar, it's judgemet, punishment. Punishment is a result of wrongdoing, it's unpleasant. God loves man and doesn't want man to sin. He even forgives man of his sin. But if a man sins, he simply gets punished, fact. I'm not going to coat it for you to make it look pleasant. i can only make analogies hoping you see from these, since you can't see from the original.
Punishment is everywhere. A CEO may love all his staff, give incentives, promotions, hope to do good for staff and their families. But if one employee steals or is incompetent or does something evil, he gets sacked, that's punishment. Who wants to get sacked/punished. It's unpleasant, or can we say evil, but it happens every other day. You may love your dog, train it, treat it etc but it suddenly gets 'mad' and bites or kills someone close to you. It's not irrational to punish the dog in some way. Some may starve it for a day, beat it, sell it. Some may even kill it. All these is not good but evil, at least to the dog.

Will you consider your CEO a merciful person if he sends wild animals to eat up your kids for your wrong doings?. . . .Will you kill you puppies because their mother bite another person?. . . .Why is your God threating to send wild animals to kill people's babies for the wrong doings of their parents? Is that what you call a loving or merciful God?. . . .

what an insightful thread.

i can say this thread can turn many christians away from their faith. well commended.

Image123:

i told you earlier, the Bible is not an exact science, just like humans, plants, relationships are not

What does this mean in "layman's " terms?

Martian:

@ Image123.

1) how many children were killed during noah's flood?
2) Since kids can't do anything without their parents, was god justified in drowning helpless children just to prove a point?

globexl:

@image123:
You just admitted that the bible is not an exact science. That sounds to me like an indictment of author(the infallible word of GOD?). why would the words of an infallible god be inconsistent and confusing? And why are the words of an infallible omipotent god be sujected to constant revisions by churchmen(mortals). You can only revises or edit something to improve it or make it better . How do chruchmen make better what is the infallible word of god?

It's not an indictment on the scriptures. You've misunderstood me, and it's the same way that many misunderstand the scriptures, and make their misunderstandings bold.
The Word of God is infallible, and anyone trying to improve it is only wasting his/her time.
The scriptures is not an exact science, just like humans are not. In exact science, one plus one is two. Measurements are 'exact', machines operate on this principle. Humans/living things are more complex, plus the Word of God is living(don't bite yourself). Our makeup is complex, language is complex, relationships are complex and intertwined. My "i'm coming" may mean more than one thing depending on context. Your asking "what's your name?" may result in varied responses from me at different times, it may even be considered an insult. Scripture passages are intertwined/interlaced with respect to one another.ines operate on this principle. Humans/living things are more complex, plus the Word of God is living(don't bite yourself). Our makeup is complex, language is complex, relationships are complex and intertwined. My "i'm coming" may mean more than one thing depending on context. Your asking "what's your name?" may result in varied responses from me at different times, it may even be considered an insult. Scripture passages are intertwined/interlaced with respect to one another.

Martian:

@ Image123.

You know my views on religion, the holy books and gods being products of mythology but I'll assume the bible is factual in this instance.

The questions I have are

1) how many children were killed during noah's flood?
2) Since kids can't do anything without their parents, was god justified in drowning helpless children just to prove a point?

Thanks for your impatience. Actually, the Bible is factual. It's more real than you're if that's possible. So to your questions, i wonder what you aim to achieve by it.
I don't know the number of children that died in Noah's flood. It's not stated, and i'm not omniscient, it's God that is omniscient. What we know is that all other humans died except for daddy Noah and family. And it was not a point proving flood. It was judgement. And another judgement day is coming on this earth. That one was by water, this one's going to be fiery. Sin brings judgement. If a man's poor, his family's likely to suffer it. You never know the extent and importance of the choices you make each day. You can give your life to Christ still.

Martian:

@ Image123.

You know my views on religion, the holy books and gods being products of mythology but I'll assume the bible is factual in this instance.

The questions I have are

1) how many children were killed during noah's flood?
2) Since kids can't do anything without their parents, was god justified in drowning helpless children just to prove a point?

Assume you were God, would you have wiped out all parents and left the children all by themselves? Who would have tended to the babies?

davidylan:

Assume you were God, would you have wiped out all parents and left the children all by themselves? Who would have tended to the babies?

Assuming he were God you think he would have acted the way the bible said Yahweh acted?. . . .What exactly are you trying to show? That Yahweh is a very human character and not even a very nice human at that at all. . . .I thought the bible says that Yahweh is all power and can do all things if that is true then he can take care of the children himself and tend to them by himself because they were innocent , no?. . . .He could have severed as their parent, no? Even humans don't kill babies, during conflict in today's world, no?. . . The myth of the Noah flood makes absolutely no sense because after destroying humans humans still continued to sin and disobey Yahweh, making Yahweh to come down and fight them sometimes on his own according to some of the ridiculous stories of the bible so what exactly did killing all the babies really achieve assuming that the myth was true?. . .

Please, look at Genesis 6.7

I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of this earth, both man and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowl of the air. . . .

You will notice that Yahweh did not even name Satan as part of his list of things to be destroyed at all even though everything was his fault according to the story and he remains your Yahweh's worst enemy that lead his creation astray. Yahweh is all powerful, he hates Satan yet he can't do anything to him. . .He kills all the humans including all the innocent babies with a violent flood but could not kill Satan who lead them astray in the first place. . . How does this convoluted story make any sense please?.

mazaje:

Here is what you said. . . .

Firstly you are picking passages to tell me that God has not changed but am telling you that the God you are saying does not change has changed a great deal. . .A simple reading of the bible shows it. . .Lets take the dietary laws as an example. . .Back in the OT some certain type of diet where prohibited but in the NT everything was permissible to be eaten by the same God supposedly. . . .In the OT some things offend God so much and he was written to have said that those engaged in such acts were to be stoned to death or killed. . . .In the NT the same God allegedly saw nothing wrong with such things any more. . .Example working on the sabbath

Like i've earlier written, it's the covenant/testament/document agreement that has changed not God. There is the Old and now the New. The attributes/characters of God are still v.much the same. Like i've shown you, He still hates sin of any form. He's still holy, He's still love, He's still Judge and just, He's still faithful, righteous etc just like in the OT. Those are some of His clearly stated attributes/characteristics. Your line of questioning should perhaps be 'why the change of testament'. The testaments/covenants are likened to two different classes. It's like the Old been primary school and the New been say College. The law/OT was like our schoolteacher when we were children. 'We' referring to humanity's relationship with God.
Now we're in college, relationship wise. Syllabus is not exactly the same. Not that it contradicts but that it's higher. That's the sense in which it's different. There were rules your parents laid when you were young, that you've now kindof outgrown. Nothing's wrong with the rules or with your parents. If your parents probably had another kid today, he'll probably go through the same rules. Jesus' coming changed a lot of things and should change you, you're the major purpose for which He came.

mazaje:

Secondly you gave a litany of some attributes and ascribed to your God among them love and mercy. . . .I didn't see you list the bad once like evil cos we have the God of the bible saying that he is an evil entity, he committed evil several times and apologized for his evil deeds, no?. . . .You were only cheery picking the good attributes and leaving the evil ones out. . . .To be merciful means to treat people better than they deserve. . . .Yet we have your God threatening to have babies killed by wild animals. . . .Will you consider an entity that threatens to have babies killed by wild animals to be a merciful entity?. . .You guys just keep throwing words around with out even knowing what they mean. . . .

God never said at any time that He is an evil entity, neither was He apologizing for his evil doings. It is His love for us that makes Him grieve(or as the kjv put it 'repent') at punishing the disobedient Israelites. Punishment/judgement is messy/unpleasant. Nobody wants to go through it. It shows that God feels for us, even in our sinful state. Like Romans says, God loved us while we were yet sinners.
God treats us better than we deserve. In judgement, we(the human race) deserve death. God told Adam he'll die if adam disobeyed Him. Our judgement is death(i.e eternal separation from God) but God organised a redemption, a rescue, and sent Jesus Christ to take our judgement. That's mercy, that's love. No other sacrifice could atone for us. There was a time i compared it to an infected os/computer. The whole things's infected, it's not exactly the fault of some files but they may have to be deleted or formatted to save the hard disk.

mazaje:

Assuming he were God you think he would have acted the way the bible said Yahweh acted?. . . .

depends. You seem to have a personal idea of what God should be and how He should act.

mazaje:

What exactly are you trying to show?  That Yahweh is a very human character and not even a very nice human at that at all. . . .

that there are 2 sides to a coin . . .
Martian claims God must be bad for killing the kids with the parents . . . well should God have spared the kids who would have raised them?

mazaje:

I thought the bible says that Yahweh is all power and can do all things if that is true then he can take care of the children himself and tend to them by himself because they were innocent , no?. . . .He could have severed as their parent, no?

exactly why i said you have a personal idea of who you think God should be. Moulded to mazaje's image.
Should God be required to come down and personally feed the kids then earth might as well not exist . . . it could simply be an extension of heaven no?

mazaje:

Even humans don't kill babies, during conflict in today's world, no?.  . . The myth of the Noah flood makes absolutely no sense because after destroying humans humans still continued to sin and disobey Yahweh, making Yahweh to come down and fight them sometimes on his own according to some of the ridiculous stories of the bible so what exactly did killing all the babies really achieve assuming that the myth was true?. . .

the flood was to destroy the angels who came down to dwell among men and bear offspring through the daughters of men.

mazaje:

Please, look at Genesis 6.7

I will destroy man whom I have created [size=17pt]from the face of this earth[/size], both man and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowl of the air. . . .

You will notice that Yahweh did not even name Satan as part of his list of things to be destroyed at all even though everything was his fault according to the story and he remains your Yahweh's worst enemy that lead his creation astray. Yahweh is all powerful, he hates Satan yet he can't do anything to him. . .He kills all the humans including all the innocent babies with a violent flood but could not kill Satan who lead them astray in the first place. . . How does this convoluted story make any sense please?.

Because you forgot to read the verse more thoroughly.

mazaje:

Will you consider your CEO a merciful person if he sends wild animals to eat up your kids for your wrong doings?. . . .Will you kill you puppies because their mother bite another person?. . . .Why is your God threating to send wild animals to kill people's babies for the wrong doings of their parents? Is that what you call a loving or merciful God?. . . .

They say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. This is what i've been saying all this while. In the grand sense/scheme, God is merciful and loving. It's like a schoolteacher, to one, he's a very wicked man(because one scored zero). To his kids, dad is the best man in the universe. The relationship kindof alters the perspective. The good news is that God seeks a Father-child relationship with each one of us. He's not willing that any should perish but that we all come to truly know Him. If only you truly knew my dad/God, you'll know He's not just the nicest/loveliest, He is Love.of us. He's not willing that any should perish but that we all come to truly know Him. If only you truly knew my dad/God, you'll know He's not just the nicest/loveliest, He is Love.

davidylan:

depends. You seem to have a personal idea of what God should be and how He should act.

Am assuming God is what people say he is. . . People ALWAYS use human behavior to explain God's behavior ,no?. . . .If he were God i doubt if he will act that way, .

that there are 2 sides to a coin . . .
Martian claims God must be bad for killing the kids with the parents . . . well should God have spared the kids who would have raised them?

Yes, because according to the God hypothesis he is all powerful and can do all things, he can raise the kids without their parents,no?. . . .

exactly why i said you have a personal idea of who you think God should be. Moulded to mazaje's image.
Should God be required to come down and personally feed the kids then earth might as well not exist . . . it could simply be an extension of heaven no?

Last time I read the bible it has some stories about God sending manna from heaven to feed his chosen men that were stranded in the desert,no?. . Did the earth stopped existing when manna was falling from heaven when Yahweh wanted to see to it that his chosen people survived in the desert assuming the story was true?. . . . .God can save the little kids and take care of them since he can do all things, no?. . .

the flood was to destroy the angels [/b]who came down to dwell among men and bear offspring through the daughters of men.

Really?. . . .Where did you get that from?

Genesis 6.7
[b]I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of this earth, both man and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowl of the air. . . .

Yahweh CLEARLY talks about destroying man, beast, creeping things and fowl of the air. . . . .No mention of destroying angles there(or even satan). . . .I don't know if you are reading from the Koran or some other ancient Mesopotamian text. . . . .

Because you forgot to read the verse more thoroughly.

Really?. . . .

Possibly he got it from the book of Enoch.

davidylan:

Should God be required to come down and personally feed the kids then earth might as well not exist . . . it could simply be an extension of heaven no?

Yes, because he is all-powerful as You claim. why do you give excuses for God?

Image123:

God never said at any time that He is an evil entity, neither was He apologizing for his evil doings.

The bible never said that God is omnipresent as well but that was deduced based on some of his alleged attributes from the biblical stories. . . .Are you lying about God not apologizing for his evil deeds? Here it is once again. . . . .

Jer 42:10 If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull [you] down, and I will plant you, and not pluck [you] up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you

I will go with what the bible says over your baseless apologies and opinions. . . .The bible says Yahweh apologized and repented of the evil he did, I will go with what the bible says. . . .

It is His love for us that makes Him grieve(or as the kjv put it 'repent') at punishing the disobedient Israelites. Punishment/judgement is messy/unpleasant. Nobody wants to go through it. It shows that God feels for us, even in our sinful state. Like Romans says, God loved us while we were yet sinners.

If sin makes God grieve why doesn't he just take sin away so that he wouldn't be grieving?. . . .Now its how the KJV puts it abi?. . . .Why will good need to grieve over anything? I thought the bible says he knows everything from the beginning?. . .It is us humans that grieve when things get out of control for us because we don't know everything and we don't have the power to do everything, a God that is alleged to know everything, and has the ability to do all things is not supposed to be caught grieving since he already knew that humans will disappoint him already. . . .A God that is all powerful, all knowing and still displays grief is impossible. . . .And it is a lie when you say God loves because it is very clear in the bible that Yahweh chooses whom he loves and whom he hates. . He does NOT love every body according to the bible both in the old and new testaments

God treats us better than we deserve. In judgement, we(the human race) deserve death.

By sending wild animals to kill innocent children for the sins of their parents abi?. . . .You are a joke. . .

God told Adam he'll die if adam disobeyed Him. Our judgement is death(i.e eternal separation from God) but God organised a redemption, a rescue, and sent Jesus Christ to take our judgement. That's mercy, that's love. No other sacrifice could atone for us. There was a time i compared it to an infected os/computer. The whole things's infected, it's not exactly the fault of some files but they may have to be deleted or formatted to save the hard disk.

If Jesus christ has taken the judgement of people then why will people still be judge when they die according to the christain hypothesis?. . .So the best way was for your God to sacrifice himself unto himself?. . .Whats that?. . . .That's not mercy, read the OT and you will see where Moses was even advising and pleading with God to be merciful and God listened to him and did as he said. . . .An all powerful being that can do all things can still save the files without deleting anything since he is alleged to have the ability to do all things, no?. . .

Image123:

They say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. This is what i've been saying all this while. In the grand sense/scheme, God is merciful and loving. It's like a schoolteacher, to one, he's a very wicked man(because one scored zero). To his kids, dad is the best man in the universe. The relationship kindof alters the perspective. The good news is that God seeks a Father-child relationship with each one of us. He's not willing that any should perish but that we all come to truly know Him. If only you truly knew my dad/God, you'll know He's not just the nicest/loveliest, He is Love.of us. He's not willing that any should perish but that we all come to truly know Him. If only you truly knew my dad/God, you'll know He's not just the nicest/loveliest, He is Love.

This one is just regurgitating old tales that mean nothing. . . .God is love you said, but when I read the bible I see God doing things that even some of the most vilest humans will NOT do, I see Yahweh killing babies for things that know nothing about, requesting for humans to be burnt and sent to him as a sacrifice, encouraging plunder, slavery and war. . .Telling people to stone to death their disobedient children, confusing people and killing them for it, killing people for no just cause etc. . . .Where is the love?. . . .Will you consider a being that send animals to kill innocent Children for the wrong doings of their parents a loving entity?. . .

Are you lying about God not apologizing for his evil deeds?

i meant apologizing in the sense of saying sorry, asking for forgiveness or pardon. That's what i mean by He was not apologizing.
i agreed and explained that He was grieving. i use the KJV and i'm in love with it. Nonetheless, the english is not contemporary and some words may be blind to some people like this passage seems to you. For instance, you might see a word like 'suffer' which in contemporary is 'permit or allow'. This word 'repent' in that passage is clearer to the majority when translated 'grieve'. Like i said God was grieved at punishing the Israelites. He's not a sadist. Judges give sentences in court every other day, it's not done with glee. Some even get personal but are professional not to let their emotions interfere. We're created in the image of God, not the other way round. You're seeking to create God in your own mould. It won't fit, don't burst a fuse.

Image123:

Thanks for your impatience. Actually, the Bible is factual. It's more real than you're if that's possible. So to your questions, i wonder what you aim to achieve by it.
I don't know the number of children that died in Noah's flood. It's not stated, and i'm not omniscient, it's God that is omniscient. What we know is that all other humans died except for daddy Noah and family. And it was not a point proving flood. It was judgement. And another judgement day is coming on this earth. That one was by water, this one's going to be fiery. Sin brings judgement. If a man's poor, his family's likely to suffer it. You never know the extent and importance of the choices you make each day. You can give your life to Christ still.

So Mr. God created deficient humans, then drowned them all in other to cleanse the world of sin. This god of yours mustn't be that smart because the world is still messed up. Why don't he kill Satan and be done with it?
He is like George Bush who got attacked by al queda and the Taliban then retaliated against Iraq.


If the bible is factual, do you think your black skin is a result of some  jewish guy in the bible cursing his son's descedants? Thats the excuse the wonderful christians who gave you the religion used while turning people who look like you into chattel.

davidylan:

depends. You seem to have a personal idea of what God should be and how He should act.
that there are 2 sides to a coin . . .
Martian claims God must be bad for killing the kids with the parents . . . well should God have spared the kids who would have raised them?
exactly why i said you have a personal idea of who you think God should be. Moulded to mazaje's image.
Should God be required to come down and personally feed the kids then earth might as well not exist . . . it could simply be an extension of heaven no?
the flood was to destroy the angels who came down to dwell among men and bear offspring through the daughters of men.
Because you forgot to read the verse more thoroughly.

Well the fact humans the world over have different depictions of god means all gods are created in the image of whatever human and culture that worships them. That's why yoruba mythology claims that life started in Ile Ife and that god used black clay to create his chosen  people. Its the same reason the jews said yahweh loved them more than every other ethnic group,it's  the reason zeus loved the greeks and allah speaks arabic. Man created god.
The same god who could make it rain 40 days and 40 nights couldn't spare kids?  How omnipotent!! 
The flood was meant to destroy angels  Further proof that everyone just gives their own interpretation to biblical myths because your fellow christian thinks the flood was judgement against men notangels. Regardless of the reason, a god that willfully drowns kids because he is drowning their parents is evil by human standards and humans are  supposed to be the evil and sinful creatures?

In essence, what image123 keeps repeating is that god is not changing, it is human pertceptions and human relationships with god that are changing. Am I correct?
If so, does that not prove that god lives is in the human mind and therefore can take the shape, habits, preledictions, nuances, and prejudices in the mind of the believer?
Could that explain why greedy pastors preach a god that needs your money, wicked pastors preach a god that is vengeful and punishes you, superstitious pastors preach that the devil and demons are out to get you, kind pastors preach kindness and love of god , and bigots preach hate for non-believers?

Image123 is trying so hard to defend schitzsophrenic attributes of the biblical god. It is futile because it is all there in black and white. I had problems with making sense of the god of the bible even when I was a child.
When pressed too much on these horrible attributes of a supposedly loving god, I am often told that god is mystery that we cannot understand.
If god is a mystery, then, is religion, not useless and irrellevant?
If for several thousand years of reading and studying the infallible word of god, we have still have so much inconsistancies and contradictions, does that not tell us something?

@Martian
God did not create humans deficient, neither is your black skin caused by a curse. You guys continue to prove your utter ignorance of scriptures. This is common christian religious knowledge found so cheaply in Genesis. What happens if we decide to discuss deep spiritual issues. If you're so boldly wrong on simple things how can you make an headway in real things. If i'd told you plainly that you were dead and blind, you won't believe.

Image123:

@Martian
God did not create humans deficient

What exactly do you mean by this statement?

^
That man and earth was initially created perfect/good. It was Adam who fell and allowed in sin, satan, sickness and friends.

Image123:

^
That man and earth was initially created perfect/good. It was Adam who fell and allowed in sin, satan, sickness and friends.

So according to your hypothesis, the world was without any form of evil before the Mythical Adam and Eve eat from the fruit, eh?. . .Meaning that humans would have been populating the earth without them dying. . . .Do you know what that means?. . . .There would have been no natural disasters etc. . . .Pls do you have any evidence to show that there was no sickness and death on earth 6 thousand years ago? We were told that Adam lived 6000 years ago. . . .Any evidence to back up this ridiculous assertion and la la la tale?. . . . .

Unfortunately for you, the Bible is my evidence.