aletheia:

I notice you no longer have the "liver" to directly address me and must always be making tangential references to my person.

Stop flattering yourself in fantasy, the bible says to avoid you, that's what I did. If you see a naked man with cutlass on the street won't you cross to the other side?

In refusing to return the stolen property after it was clearly established that they were stolen, Chris and the Christ Embassy cult committed a felony. . .no matter how your pack (and I use the word deliberately) tries to spin it.

Was the money chris oyakhilome s money? Did pastor chris know the man? was he in the branch pastor chris is? . False accusers don't look at facts. You're blinded by your ungodly passion for hate. Like a frustrated widow /wer. I'm not defending anything . I only want you guys to look at facts , lay your bias aside.

If you shout thief from morning to evening, it doesn't change the fact. If a man gives me a gift , maybe a car or television, and I learnt it was stolen . I don't need a preacher to tell me to return it. It is common sense to return it. But if a man gives to "God" offering , or if a man gives for a project like tv programme, orphanage ,and the money was used for such project. It's gone! Will you ask taxi man to return money, or the meat seller to return money because the buyer of the meat stole the money? It doesn't make sense. If he give to God he should go and ask God. If he gave for tv programme ,he should ask tv station to refund the money. Not pastor chris. It's not a personal gift . It didn't go to pastor chris personal account. He didn't know the guy. Any guy can contribute anything in church. The pastor has no business to stop them . He only teaches them the word . And pastor chris has taught several tines against criminality and tendencies. We can only have issues if pastor chris says it is scriptural to steal and claim "THE VIOLENT TAKE IT BY FORCE"

If such a refund is encouraged, what if someone shows up and claim he gave 2million 3 years ago in a church. And he's lying. If there's any wrong doing legally by the church, we have a law. It spares no one. If the law clears the church , so where is your one coming from? Take your animosity out of the way and look at facts.

Shey I don address you directly now.

Joagbajee:
. . .
Was the money chris oyakhilome s money? Did pastor chris know the man? was he in the branch pastor chris is? .

From http://www.newswatchngr.com/editorial/prime/2003/24032003/sr10323144038.htm

Chris Oyakhilome, pastor of Christ Embassy Church , Oregun, prophesied in a letter to him {i.e. Agada the thief} that God would do mighty things in his life. “He will cause you to excel and lift you up so high that the world can’t but take notice of you, in Jesus name. Amen.” Agada attracted the prophecy for sowing a seed of a 250 KVA generator valued at N4.4 million to the headquarters of Christ Embassy.

The letter is sent randomly, just as SMS is sent randomly in acknowledgement for certain level of contribution . It is already programmed.

Why do you lie so much?

Why are you so unashamed in lying?

Prophesying randomly?

Letter specifically to someone who made a notable and noted donation or "seed" is "random"?

I have recieved e mails and personal SMS . Of appreciation for certain contributions . I believe customise bulk SMS is sent to every partner right now. And e mail for some others.

The guy was not even in the main church. Pastor chris doesn't write letters, but there's a structure by which certain givings are acknowledged and appreciated  and prayed for. How many thousands of people will he be writing to. Just to append signatures is enough work for a busy person.

Every healing school partner receives a magazine monthly with their names inscribed on it. In administration such thing is common. It's customise personal to the individuals as much as possible.

So Oyakhilome's prophecies are fraud then --- if they are generic and random!

Cool!

So long as he order the structure and approves such letters ,it is by the spirit, it's a prayer.

^^^ Alright, and when the matter was brought to Oyakhilome's attention what did he then do about it? Remember that a generator was "sown" to the headquarters!

Similarly, what did Oyakhilome do about his thugs beating up Simon Ateba three years or so ago?

If he did anything, why did his thugs still man-handle and almost beat up Seyi Rhodes recently? What has Oyakhilome done since the Seyi Rhodes incident to prevent his thugs beating up and man-handling innocent people ever again?

Are you not ashamed of a "pastor" associated with such thuggery? Are you not yourself ashamed to be associated with such thuggery as a pastor/member of Chris Embassy?

Remember that both Ateba and Rhodes were acting totally lawfully when taking pictures of Chris Embassy headquarters, a public place, from a public road!

Enigma:

^^^ Alright, and when the matter was brought to Oyakhilome's attention what did he then do about it? Remember that a generator was "sown" to the headquarters!

I'm not aware of that. Im aware he bought generator for the branch where he worshipped .

Similarly, what did Oyakhilome do about his thugs beating up Simon Ateba three years or so ago?
If he did anything, why did his thugs still man-handle and almost beat up Seyi Rhodes recently? What has Oyakhilome done since the Seyi Rhodes incident to prevent his thugs beating up and man-handling innocent people ever again.

These "thugs" are police men.  I can't say what I don't know. Pastor chris was not even in the country. He wouldn't order such. But if any action was taken ,I don't know. I know what he teaches. He said recently that we should mind how we treat people who work for us . He said even if it's a bricklayer or Capenter who we pay wages to,we can still buy them free lunch despite the wages. And by this we can reach them with the gospel. The pastor chris you people potray is a strange one from the one we know.

Are you not ashamed of a "pastor" associated with such thuggery? Are you not yourself ashamed to be associated with such thuggery as a pastor/member of Chris Embassy?

Remember that both Ateba and Rhodes were acting totally lawfully when taking pictures of Chris Embassy headquarters, a public place, from a public road!

Its nothing to be proud of. The press are obviously not happy with him , because he doesnt give them money. And doesn't grant them interview. Since they can't make money legally out of him,they use every other way to do it even illegal means. Such publications Hightower have provoked the security men. But from what he teaches about love. We should know he would not order such actions. If not for anything the press man can still be won to christ if he wasn't saved.

Security men have their own issues. They feel they are doing their job. One have to constantly remind them. "THIS  IS A CHURCH"

Just two things:

1. Seyi Rhodes works for Channel 4 in the UK --- he and his organisation are not the types to be seeking "dash money" from Oyakhilome. So try another lie! 

2. It was not just policemen who beat up Ateba ---  the policemen/soldiers handed Ateba over to Chris Embassy members who then beat the poor chap up. Read the extract below from The Punch  report copy of which is at http://www.nigerianbestforum.com/index.php?topic=22522.0;wap2

In fact, they came in a violent way. I think those guys were policemen or soldiers. Before I knew it, they just grabbed me with my belt and dragged us inside the church building. In fact, they did not mind the traffic. In fact, a car was approaching and could have killed all of us. The photojournalist was angry and he told them that they should not drag us like criminals because we are journalists. They said that we needed to take permission and we said they you should have told us that. In the course of dragging us, the camera of the photo journalist dropped. They picked it up and carried the man into the church. They started beating him, hitting him on the head. They made him to sit on the floor. I told them that a journalist should not be treated that way. They said ok, we should follow them. At that time, they had not touched me. So they took us to the office of the chief security officer of the church. I believe he is a pastor in the church. When I got to the office, I quickly called my News Editor and explained the situation to him. They told me to stop the call. I switched off my phone as they insisted.

There were four men and one lady in the room. They locked the door. They told me to stand behind the office cabinet and face the wall. I asked them why, but one of them hollered, ‘Mr Man, you don’t know where you are. If you say anything silly, we will beat you silly.’ I thought they were joking. For Christ sake, this is a church. I put my hand in my pocket to hold my phone. They just rushed at me and collected the phone. They them removed everything on me, including my I.D card. They pushed me behind the cabinet and insisted they wanted to listen to the photo journalist first. They then started saying all kind of things. They said journalists write rubbish, that they didn’t need my story. They said their pastor had made a name and so did not need my story.

I tried to explain to them that I believed that a church is a public place and that I did not know that I could be subjected to such violence in a church. They asked what I meant by that statement. It was the lady that said so. The lady was the worst person there. She looked at my suit and insulted it. By the way, that was my best suit. I bought that suit for the Diamond Awards for Media Excellence, because I won an award for action photography. That was the suit I wore that day. I bought it two days to the award. It is my best suit for now. But she looked at my suit and said, ‘See your suit, journalist. If you are poor, you should come to this place so that we can give you money.’ I did not know what to say. She got angry and said that if I kept looking at her she would slap me. I was shocked. I mean, a lady behaving this way? Later, they took us to another office. They checked the camera but they did not see anything because we had not taken any shot. Still, they refused to let us go. They started advising us. They told me never to come to Christ Embassy again. I told them that it is a public place because it is a church. They became furious and started giving me all kinds of blow. Then the chief security officer {addendum: believed to be a CE pastor} hit me on the left side of my head. He gave me a blow and I fell to the ground. I was not unconscious, I was just dazed, but I could hear what they were saying. They said I should sit on the floor. I tried to sit down but I fell again. They started laughing. They said maybe I was possessed. They said that was how their pastor used to deliver people at deliverance sessions. They said if I wanted to die, I should die. They said M.K.O Abiola died in this country and nothing happened. They started making jest of my shoes. I bought the shoes with 25 per cent of my salary and they were laughing at it. They said it was poverty that was deceiving me. Ah! They said all kind of things. Meanwhile my editor was trying to call me, but they had confiscated my phone.

Did you see? The policemen/soldiers evidently took Ateba to people who were certainly members and maybe pastor/s of Chris Embassy - who then beat him up!

So it is evident that the thugs included Chris Embassy members and maybe even pastors!

Joagbajee:
. . . The pastor chris you people potray is a strange one from the one we know. . . .

Maybe you are too blinkered to see what we see!

1. The "pastor" Chris that does the trick of making acolytes "fall" with his shadow ---- is a deceiver!

2. The "pastor" Chris that says "don't pray to or through Jesus Christ" ----- is a false teacher!

3. The "pastor" Chris that says "nowhere in the New Testament are we told to obey God" ---- is a heretic and false teacher!

4. The "pastor" Chris that says he and his followers are "gods" ---- is a false teacher!

5. The "pastor" Chris that says 'non-tithers' are robbing God ---- is a false teacher!

6. The "pastor" Chris that does the slain in spirit/falling under anointing thing ---- is a deceiver!

7. The "pastor" Chris that says don't pray 'Thy will be done' --- is a heretic and false teacher!

@Joagbaje

Sorry, I should have added the below to post #201 above.

Well, yes. I asked the lady what was wrong in being poor even if I were poor. The good thing to me was to work hard. They were just talking as if they were not born again. The level of violence in their words was out of this world.

Did the commotion not attract any of their senior people?

The people in suits were their top guys. They were actually pastors in the church. The ones that arrested us were mere security guys but the people in suits, including the lady, were actually the people that make decision.

Only in Nigeria Pentecostal movement will one find these bunch of apologists for a WHOLLY IMMORAL AND UNCHRISTIAN practice.

I posted earlier today that both the Catholic and Anglican communion don't rough you up for taking a photo of their MAGNIFICENT buildings, I've been to the Basilica here in DC plenty of times with no security in sight but yet CEC has Police and private security, got to protect the cash must be their motto.

@Enigma,
May God our creator and our ancestors bless you and your family abundantly. I have followed your painstaking lesson for that lost soul, worshiper of "Chris Oyakilome". Africans are truly, truly lost. Imagine going through that 140 million times for each Nigerian, explaining logical reasonable things in tiny, tiny detail for each brainwashed zombie. They believe they can cheat and rip off other people like their pastors and Imams. It is so sad that Joabgajee is accorded rights of an adult in Nigeria, will marry and teach these garbage to his/her family and so forth. I will bet he and the originator of this thread are typically fornicators, cheats and tribalists, but somehow they believe they are going to "heaven" with their jerry curled idol.

Enigma:

Maybe you are too blinkered to see what we see!

1. The "pastor" Chris that does the trick of making acolytes "fall" with his shadow ---- is a deceiver!

2. The "pastor" Chris that says "don't pray to or through Jesus Christ" ----- is a false teacher!

3. The "pastor" Chris that says "nowhere in the New Testament are we told to obey God" ---- is a heretic and false teacher!

4. The "pastor" Chris that says he and his followers are "gods" ---- is a false teacher!

5. The "pastor" Chris that says 'non-tithers' are robbing God ---- is a false teacher!

6. The "pastor" Chris that does the slain in spirit/falling under anointing thing ---- is a deceiver!

7. The "pastor" Chris that says don't pray 'Thy will be done' --- is a heretic and false teacher!

Twisted propagandas. Well it's your opinion.

@Post,
I lost my respect for the dude a long time ago,

Roman14v4:who are thou that judgeth another man's servant? To his master he standeth or falleth,
God has not ordained you to judge pastor Chris, and stop deceiving people with your false doctrines.You have said a lot of things out of ignorance,there is no problem that you don't know. The big problem is that you don't know that you don't know

pastor chris can be respected just like other men are respected. just as obasanjo is one of the most respected man in nigeria, just like dangote is a respected businessman, just as 2face is a respected accomplish musician. to me pastor chris should be respected as these people in his field of endeavour.

The man is just another pastor as far as i am concerned.

Pastor Chris this,Pastor chris that. Am really disturbed the way we christians attack each other at full glance and amusement of non xtians in this forum.Why cant you people leave pastor chris alone?

9ijaprince:

Pastor Chris this,Pastor chris that. Am really disturbed the way we christians attack each other at full glance and amusement of non xtians in this forum.Why cant you people leave pastor chris alone?

Psalms 82:5

5 They know not, neither will they understand;

they walk on in darkness:

all the foundations of the earth are out of course.

Pastor Chris is noting but a common thief like the rest of them. The day I stop going to his church was when he came to London years ago on one of his bliss crusade claiming to be fasting for 7 days when he came-out he look to me like someone from the moon. He looks as if he had just cam-out of one of those gas chamber Michael Jackson use to sleep years ago. someone who have been fasting for 7 days you will know from a distance. More-so if you want to him of any of his pastors is like looking for a nidle in a hale stack. They will keep u waiting for months so when you see them they look like God to you. They are noting but a bunch of clever 419 people.

mabell:

Matthew 13:13
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

Your pastor is a con.You know & I know,& you know that I know he's a con.Period!

[size=15pt]The world can only truly judge the likes of Pastor Chris ,Adegboye or TB Joshua long after their death(s) to see what happens to the congregation(sheep) they've built and left behind. Idahosa's story is still fresh in many minds.  The catholic church in spite of all their perceived past and even present evils still has structures which has touched mankind over hundreds of years. One pope dies another one takes over, and it goes on like that. Pentecostals lay more emphasis on their GREAT MAN OF GOD. Once their 'Great man of God' passes on,ten assistant pastors recieve the 'holy spirit' and decide to form their new church,two out of the ten see another 'holy spirit' and decide to form their own individual churches. And the congregation begin to move from from one church to another just like sheep without shepherd that they truly are [/size]

The CEC multiple ID gang are DELUDED to say they least, Their leader and the pastors under him are called by their STOMACH and not our LORD and Savior.

@Publisher
These pastors are not sowing the seed for the future is all about what they can get now. They build all these Universities and charged their parishioners hundred thousands of Naira just like what they would charged someone through the door. They have the least respect for their parishioners. They are in big business, they don't give a dam what happen after their death they are only concerned about how much money they left for their families. Don't tell me they should not be judged if you wait for God to come and judge them you will wait for ever they knows that. They are liar and a thief. We are receptive race they knows that is why they are taking advantage of us. Oyinbo that brought churches to us never know how to make business of it but Nigeria people did. They are laughing at you all in London. They can't believe someone is saying to you give me 10% of your money God will bless you, you did. You have to be a bloody foolllllllllllllllll. This is like those childish tricks we use to play on our very junior brother and sisters in those days. You asked them to look up saying there is a bird, when they look up you pinched a bit of their food they are eating.

cold:

Your pastor is a con.You know & I know,& you know that I know he's a con.Period!

Sorry to disappoint you stone cold,
I know nothing of what you talk about
Cheers

Joagbajee:

Stop flattering yourself in fantasy, the bible says to avoid you, that's what I did. If you see a Unclad man with cutlass on the street won't you cross to the other side?

Was the money chris oyakhilome s money? Did pastor chris know the man? was he in the branch pastor chris is? . False accusers don't look at facts. You're blinded by your ungodly passion for hate. Like a frustrated widow /wer. I'm not defending anything . I only want you guys to look at facts , lay your bias aside.

If you shout thief from morning to evening, it doesn't change the fact. If a man gives me a gift , maybe a car or television, and I learnt it was stolen . I don't need a preacher to tell me to return it. It is common sense to return it. But if a man gives to "God" offering , or if a man gives for a project like tv programme, orphanage ,and the money was used for such project. It's gone! Will you ask taxi man to return money, or the meat seller to return money because the buyer of the meat stole the money? It doesn't make sense. If he give to God he should go and ask God. If he gave for tv programme ,he should ask tv station to refund the money. Not pastor chris. It's not a personal gift . It didn't go to pastor chris personal account. He didn't know the guy. Any guy can contribute anything in church. The pastor has no business to stop them . He only teaches them the word . And pastor chris has taught several tines against criminality and tendencies. We can only have issues if pastor chris says it is scriptural to steal and claim "THE VIOLENT TAKE IT BY FORCE"

If such a refund is encouraged, what if someone shows up and claim he gave 2million 3 years ago in a church. And he's lying. If there's any wrong doing legally by the church, we have a law. It spares no one. If the law clears the church , so where is your one coming from? Take your animosity out of the way and look at facts.

Shey I don address you directly now.

^Hogwash. . .Trash

KJV: I Corinthians Chapter 11
[19] For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Stop giving such precedence onto man. If you ask my opinion,
1) the word of God is all in the bible. You do NOT need any decorated pastor to 'preach a word into your life' cos the Bible says u have full access to the word and God

2) the best pastor is your local pastor. You know, the humble guy who knows you by your name, probably isn't even rich himself, and preaches holiness and can actually go a whole month without bringing money, finances etc into the equation

3) blessings are better than miracles. Why? Miracles are temporal, blessings are permanent. Live a blessed life.

I've no doubt that pastor Chris is a man of God. But why on earth people flock to these mega churches is beyond me. These guys are just men, the messages they preach can only be very general cos they are preaching to so many, rather than to a specific community where he knows there particular needs. And when did this 'celebrity pastor' thing all start? Certainly not in the bible. For me, the likes of pastor Chris, oyedapo I like to listen to their podcasts just out,of convenience but nothing more.

Just my 2 cents tho, each to his own

aletheia:

^Hogwash. . .Trash

KJV: I Corinthians Chapter 11
[19] For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Hope you have returned enigmas manuscript to him. Ok sorry na mail

Pastor JoAgbaje, You people have no shame at all!

Your behind haven't been able to answer any of the multiple questions directed your way but think you can somehow jest your way out of it, you are SUPPOSED to be a Christian last time I checked and a Pastor too(allegedly)

I feel sorry for those who actually learn from your likes!

Rather be sorry for your Own sorry life.

^
Joagbaje has been reduced to personal insults on this thread. . .seeing that he can not bamboozle his way out of the fact that his god Chris Oyakhilome is a thief.

Talk about an emperor and his "new" clothes.