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Politics / Good News: Fulani Herdsmen Jailed Over Illegal Possession Of Firearms by AmunRaOlodumare: 5:41pm On May 16, 2016
Hopefully, more actions are taken by gouvernment/police/army/intelligence agency to disarm all the other criminal herders in possession of firearms in the country. Nigeria can't be a safe and modern country if criminals move around with firearms intimidating, killing and stealing people. Even with ancient weapons it was not so easy to kill people than with modern firearms.

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Fulani herdsmen jailed over illegal possession of firearms

May 16, 2016

A Delta State High Court sitting in Asaba judicial division has sentenced two Fulani herdsmen, Hassan Abidu and Yakubu Salem to 10 years imprisonment each for illegal possession of fire arms.

The duo were suspected to be members of a nomadic group terrorizing indigenes of Ibusa and its environs, especially farmers.

Justice Marcel Okoh pronounced the guilty verdict on the two Fulani nomads in a two- count charge of unlawful possession of firearms proffered against them by the Attorney-General of Delta State, punishable under Section 3(1) of the Robbery and Firearms (Special Provision) Act Cap R.II, Laws of the Federation of Nigeria, 2010 and were sentenced to 10 years imprisonment each with hard labour and without an option of fine.

http://thenationonlineng.net/fulani-herdsmen-jailed-10-years-firearms-possession/
Religion / Re: Christianity; The Religion Not Founded By Jesus by AmunRaOlodumare: 1:28am On Apr 21, 2016
People in this thread may find this article interesting:

Discovering a Lost and Forgotten Early Christian ‘Gospel’
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/james-d-tabor/discovering-a-lost-and-fo_b_5748292.html

The most remarkable thing about the Didache is that there is nothing in this document that corresponds to ­Paul’s “gospel” — no divinity of Jesus, no atoning through his body and blood, and no mention of Jesus’ resurrection from the dead. In the Didache Jesus is the one who has brought the knowledge of life and faith, but there is no emphasis whatsoever upon the figure of Jesus apart from his message. Sacrifice and forgiveness of sins in the Didache come through good deeds and a consecrated life (4.6).

The Didache is a precious witness to a form of the Christian faith more directly tied to the Jewish orientation of Jesus’ original followers. It reminds one of sections of the Community Rule (1QS) found among the Dead Sea Scrolls, which provides us with what is perhaps its best Jewish parallel. Along with the letter of James in the New Testament, the embedded source in Luke and Matthew that scholars call Q, and portions of the gospel of Thomas, the Didache preserves for us a glimpse into a more Jewish-oriented, “non-Pauline” version of the early Jesus movement.
Religion / Re: Abraham Was A Pagan by AmunRaOlodumare: 12:00am On Apr 19, 2016
lawani:

I believe ancient Hebrews are
We know where ancient Hebrew came from since it's written in the Bible. They are people from Ur in Sumer (Mesopotamia, modern-day Iraq).

Captivity in Ancient Egypt:

The Biblical account of the history of the Hebrews (later called Israelites and then Jews) begins with the patriarchal clan leader Abraham, called in Genesis 14:15 "the Hebrew" (Habiru). About 1800 B.C. Abraham led his people out of Ur in Sumer, where they had settled for a time in their wanderings, and eventually they arrived in the land of Canaan, later called Palestine.

About 1700 B.C., driven by famine, some Hebrews followed Abraham's great-grandson Joseph, son of Israel (also called Jacob), into Egypt. Joseph's rise to power in Egypt, and the hospitable reception of his people there, is attributed to the presence of the largely Semitic Hyksos, who had conquered Egypt about 1720 B.C. Following the expulsion of the Hyksos by the pharaohs of the Eighteenth Dynasty, the Hebrews were enslaved by the Egyptians. Shortly after 1300 B.C. Moses led them out of bondage and into the wilderness of Sinai, where they entered into a pact or covenant with their God, Yahweh. The Sinai Covenant bound the people as a whole - the nation of Israel, as they now called themselves - to worship Yahweh before all other gods and to obey his Law. In return, Yahweh made the Israelites his chosen people whom he would protect and to whom he granted Canaan, the Promised Land "flowing with milk and honey." The history of Israel from this time on is the story of the working out of this covenant.

http://history-world.org/Hebrews.htm

Since ancient Hebrew were subjugated by Ancient Egyptians (possibly as prisoners of war after the Hyksos invasion), it's quite possible Ancient Egyptians had some influence on the beliefs of those ancient Hebrew people who would later compose the Hebrew bible, but the core belief, language, culture and religion of the ancient Hebrew kept the same core foundation and was quite different than anything in Ancient Egypt. There was a new covenant, so new things introduced in their religions but those new things were mostly based on their own belief as well as people around them (including Ancient Egypt). Similar multiple influences is true for any religion in the world (including in Africa among Yoruba, Igbo, Benin, etc). Christianity was itself based on the religious belief of the ancient Hebrew people (Hebrew bible/Old Testament) adding to it a large number of innovations and changes since it presented itself as a new covenant (again) of some sort. Same thing with Islam with Judaism and Christianity having influenced its writers, as well as being the source of the very idea of writing some sacred scriptures in a book. Islam also present itself as a new covenant of some sort. Every so-called sacred words human write and elaborate is always influenced by the social, cultural and political situation of the individual who came up with them at the time. For example, the Roman subjugation for early Christians writers (speaking Koine Greek). Big changes are often related to big social events.

2 Likes

Religion / Re: Abraham Was A Pagan by AmunRaOlodumare: 5:56pm On Apr 18, 2016
johnydon22:


Both Islam and Christianity has their roots from Jewish Religion of which Abraham is the fore-bear of their origin from a sumerian descent.
I'm not an expert in this, but the ancient Hebrew people were one of the many people under the Mesopotamian/Sumerian civilization. This is where the large part of their religious foundation come from. It is also stated in the hebrew bible/old testament.

So Hebrew people, beside their own belief were largely influenced by Mesopotamian religious belief. They were pagans, like all people in the world at that time, and behind a very large and advanced civilizations. But of course, with time as with any religious belief, the religious belief of the ancient Hebrew people changed throughout the various events in their history (wandering in the desert, subjugation under Ancient Egypt, conflicts with other populations and kingdoms in the region, creation of Hebrew kingdoms, etc). Beside Ancient Egypt, most of the other influence on hebrew people seem to be other people who were part of the Mesopotamian empire like Persians, Philistines, etc. Their religious beliefs had similarities and differences with the ancient Hebrew people.

So even after the fall of the Mesopotamian/Sumerian civilization, most of the religious belief of the people around ancient Hebrew people were still a legacy of the Mesopotamian/Sumerian civilization. This is where you find the core roots of the religious belief of ancient Hebrew people. Later on of course, ancient Hebrew have innovated and introduced transformations and changes in their beliefs (as it happens in every religious beliefs around the world with time). Those changes, innovations, transformations are always done in continuity with their past, their past beliefs, their past history (as it is the case around the world for every religious belief) all while adapting and facing new situations and changes in the lifestyles of their people.

Edit:the influence of the Mesopotamian civilization on ancient Hebrew religious belief and the hebrew bible/old testament can be easily searched on the internet. It's well known (floods, garden of eden, genesis, etc) and stated in the bible as the origin of the ancient hebrew people.
Religion / Re: Christianity; The Religion Not Founded By Jesus by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:59pm On Apr 05, 2016
hydeehip:
[color=#006600][/color]

BROS I Sincerely agree wit u thru d explanatn nd ur understandin which many christians will nt agree wit, even d bible said "seek d truth and d truth shall set you free"
Thank you but I think many Christians scholars hold similar thought as me since (beside the sentence I wrote with the word personally) I'm practically repeating what was written in the books I read and I know some of those authors are Christians. It's mostly based on the book with the amazon link I provided above.

For example, if you're catholic you can always say God was present when the Roman Church has chosen which books to include in the bible or even say that god was present when this pope or that pope took certain decisions. Gnostic people could develop the same kind of reasoning. You can always justify things (like the historical realities, modern sciences, etc) without denying your religions. I'm saying this because many people who study the history of Christianity are Christians!
Religion / Re: Christianity; The Religion Not Founded By Jesus by AmunRaOlodumare: 5:05pm On Apr 05, 2016
hydeehip:
Message of Jesus was clear and as u said the message was mis-interpreted nd Paul change everything He said Do not follow d commandment which not church will nt say do not eat pork, al female should dress modestly by covering dere head which Mary n Nun sisters are emulating 2day.

Everything you say is ok. I even mentioned earlier Matthew 15:24 where Jesus basically says that he came only for Jewish people. You have the right to your own interpretations of what Jesus said and what Christianity means to you.

Everything we know about Jesus comes from what humans, early and later Christians, wrote about him. So you and I can't claim to know historical Jesus more than any of the past people. Even them, those who wrote things in the bible and other early christian works (Gospel of Thomas, Gospel of Mary, James, Gospel of Mark, Paul, etc), didn't have full knowledge of the historical Jesus.

People who wrote in the Bible and other early Christians works, wrote what was important to them and their christian communities at the time of their writings. What they wrote was influenced by what they knew about Jesus and their current social situation. After the disappearance and end of influence of the first christian church called the Jerusalem Church. Different branches of Christianity started to develop away from the Jerusalem Church and its Jewish roots. For example, IIRC Mark's gospel seems closer to its Jewish roots while John the least closer iirc. It's influenced by the political situation of their christian communities when "Mark" and "John" wrote their gospels. John's christian community at the time must have faced harsh criticism and opposition from Jewish people in the roman empire practicing Judaism. Paul on the other hand was more concerned in making Christianity as something acceptable to the Romans authority (respecting the law, a slave must obey its master, etc). At the time, Romans view Christians just as another Jewish sect. Every writers in the Bible and other early christian works were influenced by the current situation of their community.

After the fall of the Jerusalem Church (which was led by the brother of Jesus, James). The first Christian Church. There was many different branches of Christianity. Different communities. Maybe the Ethiopian Church or the Protestants or the Catholics (with a large influence of paul) or the Gnostics have a message closer to Jesus's message or not. Clearly Jesus didn't write directly anything in the Bible. It doesn't really manner. What is important is what Christianity has become and what it means to you. Personally, since I'm not a christian or followers of any Abrahamic religions I see Christianity as a very influential religions (especially because of the Roman empire in Europe, and later, European colonialism) among many other equally interesting religions in the world (Buddhism, African religions, Chinese and Native Americans religions, Shinto, Islam, different branches of Christianity, Druidism, new religions, etc, etc). I guess I'm a bit more interested in African religions because I'm African.

In term of history, it seems the 4 Gospels chosen by the Roman Church (and other gospels like the Gospel of Thomas, Gospel of Mary, etc), beside the influence of the christian community the writers were part of, were also influenced by a collection of Jesus saying called Q source. This Q source must have been similar to the Gospel of Thomas in its form. That is a collection of Jesus sayings. The Q source doesn't exist anymore.

Since Jesus didn't himself leave any writings or recorded messages, what is Christianity (a word Jesus didn't know), is what early Christians writers in the past and what Christians today make out of it.
Religion / Re: Christianity; The Religion Not Founded By Jesus by AmunRaOlodumare: 2:21pm On Apr 05, 2016
I suggest people to read books about the early history of Christianity (up to Constantine at least).

I read a couple of books but this one is pretty good:
Christianity: The First Three Thousand Years by Diarmaid MacCulloch

www.amazon.com/Christianity-First-Three-Thousand-Years/dp/0143118692/

I'm not a christian or follower of any Abrahamic religions but I'm interested in History (especially of Africa but the world too).

I don't think it's fair to say Jesus didn't create Christianity because Paul (who probably never met him or heard him preaching) was very important in the history of Christianity. It's evident that what Jesus was preaching to the Jews wasn't exactly the form of Christianity there's is today in its various forms and denominations. All religions change with time. Even Christianity today is not a single block. There's catholic, protestant, orthodox, ethiopian, independant churches, gnostic, mormons, etc. Saying Jesus didn't create what would become Christianity because it's different now than it was before is not fair imo.

Jesus was a Jewish itinerant preachers like there was many of them at that time among Jewish people. Preaching different views and branches of Judaism at that time (Sadducee, Pharisees, Essene, itinerant preachers, etc). There's John the baptist, the teacher of Jesus but there was also many other ones. Itinerant preaching was part of the culture of the Jewish people at that time. Like Christianity and Islam today, Judaism also had different branches. There was no normative Judaism. All the early disciples of Jesus were Jews. Even Paul later on first started preaching in Synagogues among converted gentiles speaking Koine Greek (Jesus was speaking Aramaic not Koine Greek like Paul). Beside John the Baptist mentioned in the bible, there's other itinerant preachers like Jesus mentioned in the Bible like Elijah and Jeremiah.

In general, in Jewish history, there was a lot of messiah claimants (messiah announced in the Jewish tradition):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Messiah_claimants Some more popular like Simon of Peraea and Jesus, some less popular. John the Baptist was the teacher of Jesus.

Jesus was also a revolutionary. While still preaching the religion of his ancestor (Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, fidelity to the law of Moses, torah, etc) to fellow Jewish people, he was opposed the the Sadducee temple leaders/priests/jewish elite, who were also roman collaborators. Israel was under Roman occupation at the time of Jesus.
Religion / It’s Winter Solstice So Druids, Wiccans And Pagans Are Having A Banging Party by AmunRaOlodumare: 2:25pm On Dec 22, 2015
Religion / Re: Isekhure Of Benin Visits Pope Francis In Rome: A Great Message by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:35pm On Nov 22, 2015
Isekhure of Benin visits Pope Francis in Rome

November 4, 2015


The Isekhure of Benin, Chief Nosakhare Isekhure has said that no religious knowledge or practice is superior to the other as the supreme God loves every human being equally.

Chief Nosakhare Isekhure made the statement when he visited the Catholic Pontiff, His Holiness Pope Francis at the Vatican City Rome, Italy on the occasion of the celebration of fifty years of World Peace through religious dialogue, understanding and communication.

Chief Isekhure who was chosen by the International body of peace seekers in the Vatican to represent the African Continent at the Conference told the delegates that a good and peaceful community reveals the presence of God.

He said that being a member of the African traditional religion, he has attended activities in churches and mosques in Canada, United States of America, Switzerland and the United Kingdom.

Chief Isekhure in his presentation pointed out that the traditional African religion sees God in everything in creation and does not discriminate.

According to Chief Isekhure, African traditional religion promotes world peace and advised that mankind should engage the most profitable business of seeing God in everything in creation, adding that no religious knowledge or practice is superior to the other.

He said that he felt God’s presence when he met with Pope Francis by virtue of the sincerity and harmony of the conference.
Religion / Isekhure Of Benin Visits Pope Francis In Rome: A Great Message by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:34pm On Nov 22, 2015

The Isekhure of Benin, Chief Nosakhare Isekhure has said that no religious knowledge or practice is superior to the other as the supreme God loves every human being equally.

^^Nice message there

http://itvradionigeria.com/news/28156-2/
Politics / Re: What Should Happen Now And Should Have Happened In Nigeria To Prevent Boko Haram by AmunRaOlodumare: 11:45pm On Nov 03, 2015
nikkiking:
Source or adonbilivit undecided
You must have missed it. It's in the article posted: BBC Africa

http://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-africa-34629243
Politics / What Should Happen Now And Should Have Happened In Nigeria To Prevent Boko Haram by AmunRaOlodumare: 11:28pm On Nov 03, 2015
Senegal arrests two imams over 'Islamist threat'

Abdourahmane Dia

BBC Africa


Senegalese authorities are stepping up efforts to prevent the spread of radical Islamist ideology.

In the past two weeks, two imams have been arrested over allegedly making comments in sermons that could pose a threat to national security.

The authorities have so far not commented on the arrests, but the family of one of the imams, as well as the local association of preachers, have denied that the preachers were involved in any attempt to destabilise the country.

Senegal - where more than 90% of the people are Muslim - has not experienced any Islamist-inspired violence, but the government thinks it is a possibility.
Religion / Re: Question For The Christians and Jews by AmunRaOlodumare: 10:46pm On Oct 30, 2015
OgundeleT:
please where was God when he was creating the world? Reason for my question: it is no more an argument that earth is not flat, whenever we are experiencing darkness here some are experiencing daylight somewhere(absence of light) and it is written in the bible how God started his creation from day one to the sixth day. Now my question is where exactly is God's location on earth when he was creating the universe?
Do you believe in those abrahamic fairytales? I'm not quite sure but I think those middle eastern creation myths are not meant to be taken literally. Those who do would be crazy.

2 Likes

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 8:27pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


Atheisms is nothing but the noise of people who cannot justify a religion belief.

They are not ignorant about spiritualism. I can tell that they are mostly ex-faith men. So they know about their ex faith but only make noise, curse and wail because they justify their ex belief
I understand what you mean.

For this discussion, we can say there's 2 kinds of atheists.

1-Those who describe themselves as atheists. They use the word 'atheist'. Usually intellectuals who rejected Christianity or Islam and hold to the label of Atheism with pride. For them, Atheism is a self-affirmation position. A rejection of what their parents or societies told them about religion. They are proud to tell you they are atheist. It's almost a religion. It's a strong ideology based on their rejection of anything religious. They see it as irrational.

2-Those are not intellectual, never use the word atheism, but still don't believe in religions. They don't make a big case out of it but they, trying to use their words "don't believe in religion and all those religious god stuff". They received education in science and even if they are not necessarily good in schools they can gather religion is irrational. Made up beliefs. But in reality, those people have limited spiritual knowledge (they also, most of the time, have no interests in receiving any spiritual knowledge either. They are almost allergic to anything religious based on their limited experience with it).

The people you talk about are from the 1st category. For them, Atheism is a strong belief. They have completely rejected christianity and/or islam. They also reject any traditional religions, buddhism, shinto, wiccan, druids stuff they know little about but still place in the same category as christianity and islam. So a lot of them are ignorant about spiritualism. Their spiritual knowledge is basically Abrahamic faiths and mainstream knowledge of traditional religions which are tainted by Abrahamic propaganda.

Even recently, I watched some shows about the Vikings, but the religion of the viking are presented from an abrahamic point of view. For example, they refer to the creator god in plural, they are almost proselytising ("fukk your gods, we believe in Thor" paraphrasing what they tell christian priests in the TV shows/movies about them, when in reality they would view the christian faith, at least at first, as any other faiths. As the beliefs of any neighboring towns or ethnic groups). Under those circumstances I understand people who view any religious knowledge as wrong.

The people you talk about have a restricted view about religions which they see through the abrahamic prism. So a lot of them are ignorant about spiritualism. Their spiritual knowledge is basically abrahamic faiths and mainstream knowledge of traditional religions which are tainted by abrahamic propaganda.

2 Likes

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 7:36pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


This is nicely put.

I agree traditional religion is more related to agnostic theism. We care less about if God exist or not in our religion.

The point I disagree with you is where you said Africans were atheists before contact with western atheism.

We could be agnostics but far from atheism because every Africans agree that Supremem God exists
Yes, I don't think Africans were atheists either (under this restricted definition). In general, traditionalists acknowledge the existence of a divine creator of all things even if they admittedly don't know much about those far away times. Although atheism is a perfectly understandable position for someone who doesn't have any or limited spiritual knowledge (which I think was rare in traditional African societies).


ifeness:


And since we are at the beginning of the Age of Aquarius,the energy is changing,more people will become atheist.There will be less and less theist due to access to information via social media. And obviously Agnostics are not barrier to science,in fact they are extremely supportive.
There's no doubt more people will abandon religion and become atheist with the spread of literacy, science and education. It's already the case. Science and education is based on observation and experiment. And you can't rationally believe something you didn't experience in any way. Let's recall that even in Europe most people converted were illiterate and had little knowledge of science. The modern education system is recent. As in Africa, it was done with the 'carrot and stick' approach. Most of them did it eventually because it was socially the right thing to do to avoid being burned like a witch and to gain/maintain advantageous position in the society/government/kingdom. When the social pressure from following a specific religion is removed, many people won't follow any religion as a personal choice. As it it the case actually around the world.

1 Like

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:54pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


Do you in anyway mistaken agnostic atheism to agnostic theism?
It is a possibility. grin My own graph show that agnostic theism is a different category than atheism. I've seen different categorization before but can't find it which included agnostic theism in the atheism category. Let's say it's part of the same scale in a in-between position between theists and atheists. As a agnostic theist, we can gather, you completely understand people who don't believe in god, religion, spirits, metaphysical world if they have not experienced it. There's no "leap of faith" in traditional religions. Religions is something to be experienced and lived in everyday life. It's not a doctrine but knowledge about the universe which according to them include the metaphysical world.

1 Like

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:40pm On Oct 29, 2015
ifeness:
I wouldn't call myself an Agnostic tho. I am certainly none of the three.
As I said above, many people in the world who are agnostic don't know or use the word. Atheist, agnostic, etc are mostly intellectual words used by scientists to categorize people. In real life, there's more gray areas and it's hard to pigeonhole people and their beliefs. People don't like to be pigeonholed either. It is a scholar outlook (analysis) of traditional beliefs. The most important aspect is that our traditions are viewed by traditionalists as knowledge about the metaphysical world. They are knowledge. That's why it leads to science, medicine, metallurgy, agriculture, etc.

2 Likes

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:19pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


Thanks for your contribution sir.

Agnostic theism is opposing to atheism. African theists relate with God through intermediaries like demigods and orisha. This proof that they believe these gods exist to which atheism oppose

Agnostic theism is a form of Atheism

upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d8/Theological_positions.svg/513px-Theological_positions.svg.png

In the image above, it is included in the Atheist circle (atheist category).
Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:17pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


Thanks for your contribution sir.

Agnostic theism is opposing to atheism. African theists relate with God through intermediaries like demigods and orisha. This proof that they believe these gods exist to which atheism oppose

Agnostic theism is a form of Atheism

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d8/Theological_positions.svg/513px-Theological_positions.svg.png
Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 6:06pm On Oct 29, 2015
Remilekun101:

Check the addition.. i have continued the topic
I also have answered your questions there:

https://www.nairaland.com/2697168/atheism-hypocrisy#39473201
https://www.nairaland.com/2697168/atheism-hypocrisy/1#39490384
https://www.nairaland.com/2697168/atheism-hypocrisy/1#39491658

But I have yet to see a reply to them from you.
Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 5:48pm On Oct 29, 2015
WarRLaY:
I think our fore father are to be blamed for making research about blackmagics rather than science .
Ancient Greeks and Ancient Egyptians who are at the foundation of modern science were traditionalists. As I said more explicitly above, most traditionalists like Ancient Greeks and Ancient Egyptians view religion as knowledge about the metaphysical worlds (not doctrines to be accepted or risk ending up in hell or anything of that sort).

Ancient Greece is called the cradle of western civilization. This where modern science was developed first in Europe (as well as democracy, human right, freedom of speech, etc).

1 Like

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 5:08pm On Oct 29, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


You said atheism is African?

Can you pls tell us how you arrive at this. I will leave every other things you said not countered. Just tell us atheism is african. Thank you
I think I said it simply but I can explain it to you again. Of course atheism, agnotism are new words that didn't exist in African languages in their exact dictionary definition. Those are words that even ordinary people (Europeans, Americans, English speakers in general) don't often use. Even those people who are actually agnostic and atheist. Intellectuals and scientists use words like atheism or agnosticism. But said simply, most African traditions don't worship the creator god directly while the creator god is said to have existed, he is viewed as distant. Which is a view that approach Agnostic theism. A form of agnostic theism. A greater importance is given to our ancestors, our own spirit, our community, our values and customs, etc.

Take a look at the definition of Agnostic theism (sorry for using Wiki but it's ok for simple definition sometimes):


Agnostic theism is the philosophical view that encompasses both theism and agnosticism. An agnostic theist believes in the existence of at least one deity, but regards the basis of this proposition as unknown or inherently unknowable. It can also mean that there is one high ruler, but it is unknowable or unknown who or what it is.[1] The agnostic theist may also or alternatively be agnostic regarding the properties of the God or the gods they believe in.

Consider this: It can also mean that there is one high ruler, but it is unknowable or unknown who or what it is.

Isn't it very close to African traditional belief? No African traditions pretend to know god directly. Any human who do is obviously lying to you.

I'm sure you can nitpick the exact definition of Agnostic theism and find many contradiction with traditional beliefs (for example, the high god is unknowable but the spirits are much more knowable. They can even be our grandfather for example). Does all "Agnostic theists", whoever they are, really allow so much knowledge about spirits and ancestors, etc. Still I think traditional belief in Africa can be viewed as a form of Agnostic theism. Would traditionalists define themselves as such: no. Very few English speakers beside intellectuals do anyway (some ordinary people are agnostic theists without knowing the dictionary definition of it). It's just us, me and you and those reading those lines, as intellectuals, that we can see the similarities.

As a scientists you understand why African religions were developed that way. It is preposterous to pretend to know what god is thinking, what god wants, the exact nature of god, etc. It can lead to many contradiction (why does god -the most powerful being- allow this and that, why doesn't he speaks to us directly, etc, etc). Nobody saw him, knows his exact intentions with humans either, but many people feel him through the spiritual essence given to our ancestors and all matter around us. African traditions are knowledge about the spiritual world, not blind faith. This knowledge can have some differences from one family to another, from one town to another, one ethnic group to another, etc. For example, some people could have knowledge of Ogun either under a different name or with different attributes and stories around him, etc. Some could have no knowledge of him at all. It is the nature of knowledge to be different from one person to another, from one period of time to another. Ancient Greeks (and Ancient Egyptians) were themselves traditionalists who, combined with the development of writing, lead them to science, because their traditional belief were not about blind faith or doctrines (about what god wants or not wants) but simply knowledge about our universe which according to them included the metaphysical world as well as mathematics, chemistry, medicine, etc.

2 Likes

Religion / Re: Atheism & Hypocrisy by AmunRaOlodumare: 8:19am On Oct 29, 2015
Remilekun101:
[size=16pt]Atheists on Nairaland claims the Christians are white ass lickers (Meaning the Christians are Worshipping White Man Religion)

But on another look, They are the real white ass lickers because most of their preconceive opinion about other religions or God are based on white man's research/ view about life... To be continued
[/size]
Yes, based on logic, rationality and science (History, Theology, etc), Christians are white ass lickers. The bible was written by Europeans and Jewish people. It's quite different than most traditional religions in the world (which they call pagans).

As most religions, Christianity, along with Judaism, Shinto (japan), Buddhism (India), Islam, Ancient Greek religions, Celtic traditions, etc, has some good aspects. It's just a religion created by other people like Shinto, Buddhism, Native American religions, etc. I mean a religion among many others. There's some bad aspect like the proselytising/fascist nature of Abrahamic religions which create divisions including among themselves (catholics vs protestants vs independants churches vs buddhism vs islam vs shiite, vs shia, etc). Proselytism is very rare for most religions in the world beside Abrahamic ones which are all related to the same Jewish tradition.

Atheism and agnosticism(a type of atheism) is very African. God is a great mystery to all of us humans but many of us can feel his presence by his divine essence given to everything in the world. The exact nature of god is unknown. We can seek god inside our soul and through our ancestors but it's never a one on one conversation with god like a phone call. It's mostly within ourselves and our community we can find him.

No book, no man or no organization can speak in the name of God. Those who pretend they do are obviously lying to you (for example, why would god choose the Jewish people as his chosen people, that's stupid. Jewish people understandably said that because they wanted to create some authority to their own religious Judaic belief which was new at a time).

No book, no man or no organization can speak in the name of God. We all just use intermediaries until (and if) we can speak/interact with him in person. Those who say to you they know exactly what god wants and wants you to do are obviously lying to you as if you were some naive child.

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Religion / China (re-)embraces Traditional Beliefs And Religion by AmunRaOlodumare: 4:19pm On Aug 31, 2015
http://knowledge.ckgsb.edu.cn/2015/08/10/culture/traditional-beliefs-in-china-beyond-the-bottom-line/

Traditional beliefs in China: Beyond the Bottom Line?

August 10, 2015 By Chris Russell (Additional reporting by Nancy Gong)


Beyond-the-Bottom-Line

As China re-embraces traditional beliefs and religion, just how is this
affecting business in the country?

In downtown Shanghai, only a stone’s throw from a busy, traffic-clogged
road, sits the White Cloud Daoist temple. The air heavy with the scent
of incense, priests ring bells and bang drums, breaking the relative
peace inside the high temple walls as a man bows repeatedly before a shrine.

The setting might seem to contrast with Shanghai’s avowedly, and
proudly, commercial nature, but such places of worship have been making
a strong comeback, having previously fallen out of favor. That said,
they are perhaps the last places you would come to look for business
advice, yet here, as with so many things, China defies expectations.

“Quite a lot businessmen come to visit here,” says Song, a priest at the
temple. “They have different purposes for coming—some people pray for
more business and money and some people pray for having good health…
[but] many of them also come to learn.”


*State of the Nation*

As a country whose culture stretches back thousands of years, China has
naturally played host to all manner of religions and schools of thought
throughout its history, and many still have great relevance today. From
the country’s five officially recognized religions—Buddhism, Islam,
Protestantism, Catholicism and Daoism—to the country’s myriad folk
religions and traditional beliefs like feng shui, spirituality and
superstition inform much of the population, even if the country lacks
the overt religiosity found elsewhere. And in addition there are also
the philosophies bequeathed to China by the likes of Confucius


With China today, in the view of many people, suffering from a crisis of
trust and a vacuum of faith, Chinese people have begun to reacquaint
themselves with their traditional and spiritual heritage. Exact numbers
of the followers of some of these schools of thought are hard to
estimate, for a number of reasons—some, such as Confucianism and folk
religions, are poorly recorded, or not at all, and many individuals are
happy to combine beliefs from several different religions or philosophies.

Nonetheless, a 2012 Pew Research Center report
estimated China had 244 million Buddhists, 294 million followers of folk
religions, 68 million Christians and 9 million believers in “other
religions” (including Daoism). The number of religiously unaffiliated
people stood at 700 million. Within those figures for believers are
millions of business people, and their ideas and practices are now
manifesting themselves in the management of China’s companies.


*The Good Books*


“For quite some time businesspeople in China have employed feng shui,
geomancy, and other Daoist practices for warding off bad fortune and
ensuring success,” notes John Osburg, author of /Anxious Wealth: Money
and Morality Among China’s New Rich/ and Assistant Professor of
Anthropology at the University of Rochester.

But a key change has been the way that traditional religions and
philosophies, as well as ‘new’ belief systems such as Christianity, have
begun to have a tangible impact on business management and practice. A
number of the country’s leading business people have spoken of how such
beliefs in China have influenced their business thinking.

Alibaba’s Jack Ma, when asked about his management philosophy in a 2013
interview with Washington University professor Xiao-Ping Chen for
Chinese Management Insights, made frequent mention of the role
traditional Chinese beliefs in providing a basis for his management
ideas. “Through endless thinking, I have groomed, little by little, my
own management philosophy in the company, based on Tai Chi, Daoism and
Buddhism,” Ma said. “I never talked about this directly, but they are
the source and nutrition of our management philosophy.”

He’s far from the only one in looking to these beliefs for management
inspiration. Chen Feng, CEO of Hainan Airlines and a devout Buddhist,
has spoken of how Buddhism, Daoism and Confucianism play a role in the
company’s corporate culture and approach to social responsibility. All
employees are required to read up on traditional Chinese culture, points
of which they recite daily during their training, and senior executives
are given additional reading materials—staff are occasionally tested on
their knowledge of these points. Moreover, managers are encouraged to be
“a model of virtue”.

“I believe that if the Chinese do not learn and understand the core
values of the traditional culture, there will be no foundation for
future growth,” Chen said in an interview with The Boston Globe.

Moreover, Shalom Saada Saar, Professor of Managerial Practice at the
Cheung Kong Graduate School of Business, identifies Fosun, popular
hotpot chain Haidilao and energy firm Kaidi as just a few examples of
companies drawing upon Buddhism, Confucianism and Daoism in their
decisions about how to operate. “Now [there are] really a growing
number,” he says.

Such thinking has laid the foundations for a number of business
management books in recent years that have incorporated religion or
traditional beliefs—The Analects of Confucius: A Management Diary by
Shao Yu, Management Wisdom of the Book of Changes by Zeng Shiqiang and
the Chinese Management Diaries series, which looks for inspiration
from, amongst others, Chinese emperors and philosophers, have all been
successful entries in the genre.

Confucius

Confucius looms large over Chinese society, and his influence is felt in
business too

“The books are selling quite well and company managers want to read
these kinds of books,” says one editor, who declined to be named, at
Times Bright China, a company involved in the publishing of /Management
Wisdom of the Book of Changes/ and similar volumes. “Regarding our
future publishing plans, we definitely will publish similar books that
combine company management and traditional Chinese culture.”

These ideas flow into the classroom too. “We collaborate with
universities such as Fudan, who have classes for tutoring CEOs, and give
a one or two-day class teaching something like management concepts
mentioned in the Tao Te Ching,” says Song at White Cloud Temple.


*Practice Makes Perfect*


Given the diversity of beliefs and the range of industries they are
applied to, their actual manifestation in business practice is equally
varied. Still, Saar identifies tenets from three of the major belief
systems that businesses can learn from, all centered on the concept of
harmony.

From Confucianism, a crucial idea is harmony among people. “What does it
mean if you don’t create harmony with people around you, if you don’t
create the culture that cares about people? Then you cannot grow the
organization—people will escape, either physically, or [in] their mind,”
says Saar. “You must create harmony among people if you want to succeed.”

Meanwhile, Daoism promotes harmony between people and the environment.
“Daoism in one sentence is: ‘harmony with the environment’,” he says.
That has implications for business in terms of energy, recycling,
pollution and so on, as well for creating a company culture in which
people can grow and develop.

Finally, from Buddhism, Saar identifies the idea of being at peace with
oneself as important to business. If you don’t have that, he says, then
it is very hard to influence others.

According to John Osburg, the main influence that these beliefs have on
some business people is in terms of their own personal conduct, with
them foregoing hedonistic or shady business practices as a result. In
many cases, that has a negative impact, straining professional
relationships, but not always.

“Some of the Buddhist businessmen I interviewed also spoke of positive
effects of their beliefs,” says Osburg. “They explained that now many
view them as more trustworthy as a result of their faith, and this has
helped them win clients and investors. Furthermore, in both Christian
and Buddhist circles you find business networks forming around those
with shared religious beliefs.”

But the engagement of Chinese businesspeople with religions and
traditional beliefs isn’t without complications, and not everyone uses
them as a route to an enlightened business philosophy. “For the
majority, their engagement with religion is really just a means of
ensuring good fortune and warding off bad luck,” says Osburg. “In other
words, it’s just another means of enhancing their business success.”

While the White Cloud temple might play an unexpected role in the
grooming of China’s executives, it still only plays a small part in the
hectic, commercial city. Similarly, traditional beliefs overall have
only a modest influence on the thinking of Chinese businesspeople for
the majority of whom the bottom line will remain the bottom line.

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Religion / Re: If Your Fellowship Holds These Teachings, Then It's Time You Moved On by AmunRaOlodumare: 2:52pm On Aug 23, 2015
FOLYKAZE:


They didnt tell you to follow the Gods of your ancestors.

They didnt tell you you aint an Isrealite.

They didnt tell you Jesus died for Israelite as he claimed and not you.

So why gullibly folowing a foreign religion that brings no positive changes to your land since the 400 yrs? Why are you not like the Indians, Chineses and Japanese who succeded in their ancestral path?

In fact, when you begin to center your beliefs, history, interests around yourself instead of the European, Jewish or Arab people, you begin to develop self-knowledge, self-confidence leading to self-development and self-sufficiency as individuals and people.

Ironically, when this is completed, it often lead to openness towards other people's culture, beliefs and history. Because you're so much solid in your own identity and development, than the next step is exploring other people's, but always with the solid self-knowledge/self-interests core. For example, Japan have a solid self-confidence and identity (religions, language use in their school system (japanese), culture, arts, etc), but at the same time love American culture. Don't get me wrong, they still go to school in their own language, maintain and develop their own beliefs, independent political institutions and culture, but they are open to the world.
Religion / Re: Religious Extremism And Intolerance In Kano: 9 People Sentenced To Death In Kano by AmunRaOlodumare: 11:19pm On Aug 22, 2015
Pls leave those books to the Jewish, European and Arab people who wrote them smiley

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Politics / Religious Intolerance: Nigerian Court In Kano Sentences 9 People To Death by AmunRaOlodumare: 4:04pm On Aug 22, 2015
Religion / Re: Religious Extremism And Intolerance In Kano: 9 People Sentenced To Death In Kano by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:59pm On Aug 22, 2015
Secular groups write to Nigerian President over blasphemy death sentences

Posted: Sun, 02 Aug 2015 07:00
Secular groups write to Nigerian President over blasphemy death sentences

The National Secular Society has joined other secularist organisations in calling for a full pardon and civil protection for nine people recently sentenced to death by a Sharia court in Nigeria.

The letter, organised by the Secular Policy Institute, expresses deep concerns over the death sentences handed out for blasphemy and appeals to the Nigerian President, Governor, and Ambassador to ensure the preservation of the individuals' rights of free conscience and religious expression.

The so-called 'Kano Nine' were sentenced to death by a sharia court in the Nigerian state of Kano after what the BBC described as a "speedily done" and "secret" trial.

The charges centred around claims that the nine accused said that Niasse, the founder of the Tijaniya sect, was "bigger than [the] Prophet Muhammad".

The nine are alleged to have made the comment at a religious gathering held to honour Niasse, in a venue which was burnt down by a mob before the nine (eight men and one woman) were arrested by police over the accusations.

The head of the religious police in Kano told the BBC: "We quickly put them on trial to avoid bloodshed because people were very angry and trying to take law into their hands."

There were reports of celebrations across parts of the city when the death sentences were announced.

The Secular Policy Institute note that "comments by local-authorities expressing relief at stemming further vigilante acts" give the impression that the verdicts were the result of "political expedience rather than a fair administration of justice."

The 'Kano Nine' are "being sacrificed to pacify a mob", the signatories write.

There was extreme secrecy around the trial, and even the names of all of the accused are not known.

Nigeria operates two countervailing jurisprudences – Customary and Sharia. The Customary Criminal code would call for a maximum two-year sentence for purported violation, with the Sharia code specifying a death sentence.

The letter argues that at the very least the State should uphold civil over religious law.

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2015/08/secular-groups-write-to-nigerian-president-over-blasphemy-death-sentences
Religion / Re: Religious Extremism And Intolerance In Kano: 9 People Sentenced To Death In Kano by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:57pm On Aug 22, 2015
Religion / Re: Religious Extremism And Intolerance In Kano: 9 People Sentenced To Death In Kano by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:56pm On Aug 22, 2015
Protests over blasphemy.

It's not surprising that within such context, mixed with poverty and criminality, extremist groups such as Boko Haram can be born and build a following.


--------------------------------------

Sharia Court Burnt as Protest Hits Kano over Alleged Blasphemy

23 May 2015

brahim Shuaibu in Kano

Thousands of Muslim youths on Friday, stormed the Kano State government house and the palace of the Emir of Kano, Muhammad Sanusi II to protest the blaspheming of Prophet Muhammad by a Tijjani preacher Abdul Nyass.

Also, the Sharia court located in Rijia Lemo where the preacher was suppose to appear on Friday was equally set ablaze by some youths after waiting for a long time without his appearance.

Nyass was supposed to appear before the court for trial over the blasphemy allegedly uttered by him against the holy prophet. No explanation was given for his failure to appear in court.

The demonstrators who were mainly underage youths took to the streets of Kano carrying sticks and other weapons to indicate their annoyance over some alleged blasphemous statements against the prophet Muhammad.
Their attempt to gain entrance into the Kano State government house were prevented by the security who had hectic time calming the apprehensive youths.

They chanted “Allahu Akbar, Allahu Akbar”; meaning God is great, God is great and attempted to temporarily seize the government house which caused stampede for about an hour before the intervention of government officials and security agents who also formed a barricade to prevent the youths from gaining entrance into the government house.

However, the quick intervention of Governor Rabiu Musa Kwankwaso saved the situation that would have snowballed into a bloody clash between the demonstrators and the security agents manning the gates and those drafted by the state commissioner of Police, Ibrahim Idris.
The governor who was represented by the Commissioner for state Affairs, comrade Aminu Abdulsalam Gwarzo and the Commissioner for Water Resources, Dr. Yunusa Dangwani who told the leader of the sect, Sherriff Sani Jan-bulo that was invited in the government house to calm the nerves of the restive youths.

Abdulsalam explained that immediately they got information of the blasphemous statement against prophet Muhammad, a Security Council meeting was summoned to avert any untoward event that may erupt in the city.
“This act was very unholy and the state government has already taken appropriate action to avert any ugly situation. Now that you are here with me as the leader of the sect, I will want you to control your faithful not to cause any mayhem or riot that might lead to an unpleasant situation in the state, so what I want from you is to talk to your members to move back to where they are coming from peacefully”, he admonished him.

The leader in his response, acknowledged the statement of the governor and instant promised to calm the frayed nerves of the youths who on being addressed, immediately obeyed by turning back.
Meanwhile, the house of the “Tijaniyya” preacher, Abdul Nyass was on Friday torched by some irate youths at Gaide, Kumbotso local government area of the state.

This development has attracted wide spread condemnation across the state and prominent Tijaniyya leaders, Sheik Dairu Usman Bauchi, and Califa Sheik Isyaka Rabiu who said such comments could not have come from a disciple of a Tijaniyya.

http://www.thisdaylive.com/articles/sharia-court-burnt-as-protest-hits-kano-over-alleged-blasphemy/210037/
Religion / Religious Extremism And Intolerance In Kano: 9 People Sentenced To Death In Kano by AmunRaOlodumare: 3:52pm On Aug 22, 2015
Nigeria court in Kano sentences nine people to death for blasphemy

An Islamic court has sentenced nine people to death for insulting the Prophet Muhammad in the northern Nigerian city of Kano.

The accused, who were all Muslims, had pleaded guilty, the head of Kano's religious police, Aminu Ibrahim Daurawa, told the BBC.

The trial was speedily done in secret after a section of the court was burnt down by angry protesters last month.

It is not known if they will appeal against the sentence.

The alleged offence was committed last month at a religious gathering in honour of Sheikh Ibrahim Niasse, the Senegalese founder of the Tijaniya sect, which has a large following across West Africa.

The nine, eight man and a woman, were reported to have said that "Niasse was bigger than Prophet Muhammad", triggering unrest.

The venue was burnt to the ground by an angry mob and the nine were arrested,

"There has been consensus among Muslims scholars that insulting the prophet carries a death sentence," Mr Daurawa told the BBC Hausa service.

"We quickly put them on trial to avoid bloodshed because people were very angry and trying to take law into their hands," he added.

Kano has a predominately Muslim population and Islamic courts operate alongside secular courts.

BBC Kano reporter Yusuf Yakasai said people celebrated in some parts of the city when news of the judgement emerged.

The Sufi sect of Tijaniya was founded in Algeria in 1784 by Ahmad ibn Muhammad al-Tijani.

It spread all over the world, with large following in north and west Africa. It also has followers in South Africa, Indonesia and other parts of the world.

There are other Sufi sects in Islam but Tijaniya is the largest.

They have three main daily practices: Asking the forgiveness of God; sending prayers to the Prophet Muhammad and affirming the Oneness of Allah.

Senegalese-born Sheikh Ibrahim Niasse was credited with reviving the sect in the 20th Century. People travel from across the continent to visit his shrine.

They have several factions including the Haqiqa (Realist) group, whose leaders were convicted accused of blasphemy in Kano.

Several states in predominantly Muslims northern Nigeria have introduced Sharia law after the country returned to civilian rule in 1999.

This is the first time a death sentence has been handed down for blasphemy in northern Nigeria.

The sentence has been delivered for other offences such as adultery but none has been carried out.


http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-33283261
Culture / Re: What Igbo History Book Is The Closest To Igbo's Oral History? by AmunRaOlodumare: 8:03pm On Jul 05, 2015
ChinenyeN:

Now, on the case-by-case level, there aren't a lot of books. In fact, as disappointing as it is, literature on the Igbo is scanty at best.

Thank you for your answers and recommendations. Yes, I prefer case-by-case level because I think it's mostly how people saw themselves in the past. As part of a distinct community (sometimes as large as kingdoms and empires) while also (a bit or a lot) related to others around them. I'm open to both Igbo and English litterature.

By chronology. I don't mean carbon dated chronology. Just the succession of kings and reigns. For example, the first King of this X chiefdom did this and that blablabla. The second king did this and that. Etc. I guess archaeologists, geneticists and linguists can also help to put an exact dates on those chronological events. Local chronicles are welcome.

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