₦airaland Forum

How can an abstract entity ( imagined by man, which can not be proved or disproved) be accused of having MPD

i'm asking a question from ur perspective and not mine. hypothetical questions are regularly used to question the validity of things. what i am asking is an hypothetical question. i find it strange u guys are arguing about sematics rather than explain why God went from God of war to God of peace. change of hearts??

this is tantamount to hiding behind your finger. You claim God does not exist - prove it!

i'm unable to prove something that can't be experienced by mankind.

Jesus Christ existed in history outside of the Holy Books

no it didn't. the holy books are the principle accounts of jesus christ. any idea of God originated from the holy book and not independent sources. plato himself claimed God couldn't be defined.


Therefore you cannot prove that God does not exist.

you are right, the problem is can u prove it exists??

True. But not all types of logic adhere to your own idea of "proof" - it all depends on the type of "proof" you're asking for.

the kind of proof am asking for is the existence of a "God" and how "God" transformed to the God of peace from the God of war.


I think we have gone beyond that excuse which has become the classic one for many who reason the way you lead us to believe is your basic premise.

in what ways have u experienced God.

Discussing the nature of any being does not disprove his existence

at it can, the bohr atomic model can be discussed but that doesn't mean the atomic model is true. anything, real and unreal is open for discussion and analysis.

Gbosa! And all of a sudden, that is your logic and science! No let me laugh!

just logic, my science deals with the big bang theory and evolution. lets stay on topic please.


Peace and/war do not lead to change in personality

it actually does, there is a big difference between a calm person and a violent person. why anyone would deny this is mystifying.


demonstrate your own logical "proof" of His non-existence!

i told u the reason i am unable to do this already. the ball is in ur court to show he/she/it exists.


It was up to his students to disprove his premise where they disagreed with his developmental thought on calculus, and not vice versa or hiding under the excuse of trying to deny the premise of calculus.

actually no, newton sent a detailed explanation to his peers and this was widely accepted. there are only vague descriptions of this "God"

hey would not have to wait to just the narrow thought of some book before they express their theism.

in sociological experiments, kids that weren't exposed to religion, saw no need or having belief in a supreme being. people base their religious beliefs on what they hear and not what they experienced.

do you mind not having to repeat yourself endlessly on the assertion that God does not exist?

my assertion that god does not exist is based on the FACT that no evidence has been found of it's existence. it's not that complex.

Oh, please flatter me - I just can't wait to dribble you on your own tuff!

u haven't done a great job so far

stimulus, you are completely right. Noticed that pattern of behaviour too; seems they play on the protagonist's mind rather than argue logically.
And the discussion ends in a brawl,,,,original topic forgotten.


logic is backing ur assumptions with proof. logic isn't "the bible says so, then i must believe". the original topic is the nature of this alleged God. how does it God in three persons and why the change in personalities. God of peace to God of war??

We are still waiting for your own proof and answers to the questions that have been offered you guys.

my proof is that u guys have no proof.

Choose one side and stick to it.

no i'm actually criticizing ur side of the argument and displaying it's floors. have u heard of an hypothetical question b4??


why do you cry sometimes or laugh some other times? Isnt that a sign of your own MPD?

no according to psychiatrists, that is called a display of emotion and not a mental disordr. crying or laughing don't lead to a drastic change in personality. why the change from God of peace to God of war. the thread isn't about me but about ur "mystical" god.


ou, on the other hand, are yet to prove outside of the bible that God does not exist and that the theories (speculations) of science are true.

it's the job of u guys to prove to the existence of an abstract concept not me. it was Isaac newton's job to proof the viability of calculus and not vice versa.

Now, WITHOUT biblical references, show me that God does not exist. Or, that He exists and has MPD.

besides holy books, there is no justification or a need for God.

Your rational mind has not been able to disprove the existence of God.

i won't repeat this again. for the last time, an abstract entity imagined my man can not be proved or disproved. may i recommend an intro to philosophy class by the way.

The "trinity" does not exist in the bible so what are you intending to discuss?
You can't be intending to discuss from an untenable position in the first place.

the trinity is accepted as true by many Christian denominations. this is a viable discussion. what about God's mood. why switch from God of war to god of peace. seems drastic doesn't it.

Since you have shown us contradictions in the bible, why are you still referring to the same 'unreliable' bible?

so u agree the bible is inconsistent?? to be honest, u guys avoid every question by asking for proof while providing none of ur know. forget about proof, let's discuss the trinity and the mystical God's mental state

you don't want answers, you're simply confused. Like Imhotep says . . . it is either God does not exist or He does exist AND has MPD. Which one are u choosing?

i'm actually not confused, my stance is that God doesn't exist and it's basically abstract thinking by man. i'm just performing an analysis of the bible and the nature of God as explained by Christians. this is a thread to discuss the trinity and the nature of the Abrahamaic "God". the square root of -1 doesn't exist but it definitely can be discussed.

Our country's military is not just the sole power in west africa, but the mainstabilising force here and in Africa as a whole. And that is a fact.

the egyptian, libyan and south african forces could be considered stronger than the nigerian army. stop with the generalizations

Everything that is moved is moved by a mover.

so who moved God then.


Therefore, there must be an uncaused cause of all caused things

how are we sure the uncaused cause of all caused things is God. this isn't a proof but a more intellectual presentation of theist assumptions.


Therefore, there must be a necessary being whose existence is not contingent on any other being(s).
* This being is what we call God.
hmm what philosopher said this?? why must it be that must only be ONE being whose existence is not contingent on any other being(s). that's a flawed and biased philosophical argument.

Various perfections may be found in varying degrees throughout the universe

not true, nothing is perfect including the instruments/people that gauge these "perfections"

All natural bodies in the world act for ends

the universe is still being explored and would continue to be explored. using words such as All is a gross assumption and far from a proof

Therefore, there exists an intelligent being which guides all natural bodies to their ends.
This being we call God.

BS, u see how none of the philosophical arguments skirt around the issue rather than try to explain the nature of God, the same he is infinite and independent of time argument disguised as philosophy.

i want answers people. why does God seem to have mood swings and a change of heart. accusing me of blasphemy is away of avoiding basic questions. why is God contradicting himself in the book he inspired.

God can be accused of MPD only if He exists. So we see the foolishness of atheism

it's an hypothetical question, i'm just testing your faith. u asked me to examine your mystical God through the scientific approach. checking for personality disorders is part of the process


I need answers, bamowol. Why do you suffer from the same psychosis

i have never been deemed mentally unstable in mylife, nor doi claim to be three people. do not divert the thread please.

It is not suprising that you folks try divert discussion with cheap psychology

actually u guys are the one doing it. the idea of trinity is an aspect of religious fundamentalism that has not been answer. how does God in one person appear as three differentiated entities. science and technology wouldn't have advanced without the effort of the greek and egyptian philosophers u accuse of "cheap" human philosophy.

As i said earlier Chist Remains the answer

an example of religious fundamentalism, are u worshiping jesus chris or god the father


In which case I haven't taken to the street to behead anybody, nor do I intend to do so.

smarten up, there's a difference between religious EXTREMISM and religious fundamentalism

And that constitutes the non-existence proof? Grin The entity "bawomol" cannot be seen, felt, touched, communicated with or experienced - and it would be great to see that entity substantiate its physical account.

we are communicating with something called the WWW on something called a message board. behind bawomol is an human being whose identity can be verified. God can't be verified even though he is allegedly omnipresent.

Ha! Grin You have also proposed an idea, dude - that God does not exist. That is as much a proposition you have made - and it would be interesting to see you prove it as well.

my idea that God doesn't exist comes from the notion that theists are unable to prove the existence of their mystery God. this isn't an original proposition but a response.

Then prove that God is abstract in the first place.

God can't be seen,felt, touched,communicated with or experienced. do u have any substantiated physical accounts of God??


let me give u a scripture to inform u what He had said not me about people like you,

the bible was written by men. how do u know some mystical figure that can't COMMUNICATE in human terms was able to write the bible

uptil now you have not convince me about the origin of matter

it's strange u refuse to read about abogenesis, probably because that would sway ur beliefs. there is no concrete explanation of the origin of matter. different scientific theories are available in journal. there's one thing we know for sure. a collision/explosion was involved in the creation of earth. it's funny how u want to be convinced but refuse to convince anyone other than using bible passages that have been known to be historically inaccurate.

based on the idea of trinity, why was jesus praying to God and asking for God's direction. isn't jesus God 2. what about the holy spirit, does he lay around in the universe doing nothing. why is God so evil/dictatorial in the old testament but became humane in the new testament?? why didn't God eradicate any chances of sin after sending his son(God the father and God the son are allegedly the same by the way) to give us salvation. wouldn't it make sense to destroy the devil once and for all after sending the messiah.

1. God of Peace
1. (Isaiah 2:4) - "And He will judge between the nations, and will render decisions for many peoples; and they will hammer their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, And never again will they learn war."
2. (Romans 15:33) - "Now the God of peace be with you all. Amen."


2. God of War
1. (Exodus 15:3) - "The Lord is a warrior; the Lord is His name."
2. (Joel 3:9-10) - "Proclaim this among the nations: Prepare a war; rouse the mighty men! Let all the soldiers draw near, let them come up! Beat your plowshares into swords, 10And your pruning hooks into spears; Let the weak say, “I am a mighty man.”


EDIT- this is a serious question and not meant to be blashphemy. in the Bible, we are all supposed to worship only One God but in a weird way there are God the father, God the son, and God the holy spirit. If God is a spirit according to some people, why do we need a separate "holy" spirit. either God is doing a helluva multi-tasking job or he has multiple personality disorder. as children of God, it's our job to help our father find it's identity.

Now you are sounding dogmatic. We don't have to take your word for it, you know,

it's an irony u are calling me dogmatic when u are asking for proof of an idea proposed by u. abstract things can't be proved.

Can all atheists admit that they cannot disprove the existence of God, and therefore cannot defend their position?

the burden of proof lies on theists that propose the idea of a creator. u proposed the idea, now prove it.

God does not have multiple personality disorder; and we are quite familiar with people using such mundane expressions to kill a discussion. Do I suspect that resorting to such derogatory verbiage is a pointer to your uneasiness in seeking reason in discussing this subject?

i am serious, does God have MPD. jesus was once praying to God in heaven(aren't they the same person) the idea of trinity is part of religious fundamentalism and bible literalism

ALL WE SEE BEYOND AND ABOVE ARE PROOFS THAT HE EXIST

the only thing above us are magnetic fields, planetary bodies and galaxies. i still haven't seen a boogie man above.

ASK JESUS TO REVEAL HIMSELF IF HE IS REAL THEN I TELL YOU ALL YOUR QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED.

why ask jesus to reveal himself when he can talk to God directly. or are jesus and God the father different people. does God have multiple personality disorder. do we have to ask the holy spirit to reveal himself too. by the way, talking to an abstract entity won't yield any results. how can god reveal himself if he is allegedly beyond human comprehension.

unions in nigeria should be fragmented. in the US, each university usually have their own separate union. paralyzing the whole academic system of a country because of the actions of one school is ludacris.

can Christians all admit that their religion is based on assumptions that can't be verified??

ok now what made matter or rather how did matter come to exist? and yes u may simplify as further as you can for the forum to understand as much as possible.

science for dummies

http://www.nyu.edu/pages/mathmol/textbook/whatismatter.html

the theory is that matter has always existed. the reaction of matter leads to the creation and destruction of planetary bodies.

so if a factory worker can create/make a ball, then look at this intricate, beautiful world and you will tell me that there is nobody that made it but just appears? oh com'on think my friend.

the earth was created through matter reaction. there aren't many inert elements or compounds on earth. who created something as powerful and omnipresent as God then. read about abiogenesis please

ok so u agree that "it" exist abi?

no i am politely asking u to prove it "exists". how do u know it exists if u can't see,feel, touch, or communicate with the boogie man. claiming there must be a creator is an assumption by narrow minded people. the square root of -1 exists in math but it's an abstract entity in reality.

if using c14 u could determine the age of the earth, how come it is impossible to deterine a snail that lives in a pool fromed from a limestone sinkhole? is the pool not part of the earth?

carbon dating isn't useful for environments were c14 is absent. there are other dating techniques other than carbon-dating used in these cases.

In other words, the apparent age of 27,000 years for these snail shells is another example of the reservoir effect. The springs, from which the snails came, were fed by carbonate aquifers. As this water percolated through the enclosing carbonates, it dissolved limestone and dolomite hundreds of millions of years old. The dissolution of limestone and dolomite introduced considerable quantities of "dead carbon" into the groundwater. As a result, the groundwater which fed the spring and in which the snails lived was significantly deficient in carbon-14 relative to what is found in the atmosphere. When the snails made their shells, they incorporated an excess amount of "dead carbon," relative to modern atmosphere, into their shells, which resulted in the excessively old apparent date.

Contrary to the complaints of creationists, conventional scientists are well aware of this problem. They test for it and take it into account when interpreting radiocarbon data. In cases where corrections for presence of dead carbon cannot be made, such dates are readily recognized as erroneous and can be safely disregarded. This is not the fatal flaw to radiometric dating that some creationists claim it to be. It just shows that dates from mollusks from streams and lakes need to be carefully evaluated as to their reliability. Other materials, such as wood, charcoal, bone, and hide, would remain unaffected by this type of reservoir effect. If found with shells in the same layer, these materials could be dated to determine if shells are locally affected by the reservoir effect and, if so, how much their radiocarbon dates have been skewed by it.

it's a religion and a cult.

Christian: The Big Bang is impossible because you can't have something from nothing.

Atheist: Ok, so where did God come from?

Christian: God is omnipotent, omnipresent. He has always been. He doesn't need a creator.

Atheist: Ummmm, right. So the Big Bang needs a creator, but God doesn't. Good logic example there.

christianity practiced today was influenced by egyptian and greek pagan practices.

guys to be honest, other than circular reasoning i doubt we would get any answers to our questions.  u know something is wrong when u use the work of a geoscientist to counter evolution. 


Yes, God did it. Study His works, but don't deny Him the credit due to Him.

i would ask this question again, how did God do it and how do u KNOW god did it. is the question to question

The more it answers, the more questions are asked.

that's the beauty of science, more and more questions and answers are revealed everyday. the study of nature never ends since the nature is always changing or evolving blah blah blah. how do u know God's work doesn't obey mathematics. is that an assumption or a fact proven by WHAT.

religion gives rigid and bland explanation for things. God did it but please don't question God or challenge the accuracy of the bible.

Perhaps you should READ about NDEs. Don't limit yourself to hearing.

i have read about it, not moved.

Science will never pin-point the origins of the universe. No amount of string theory or any such thing will lead anywhere satisfactory.

would u admit u have nothing to show the creator has no origin. at least attempts are been made to experiment on string theory. what empirical evidence do u have of the creator. pls i want to see more than just the "infinite" cop-out.

Good, the DNA and proteins were put there by a Great Scientist, only to be discovered by a junior scientist who is basically groping in the dark.

when and how did the Great Scientist put the DNA and proteins there?? u seem to know a lot about this Great Scientist, can u tell me more about him/her/it. or are we going to fall back on the "he is too infinite to understand cop out"


You have not read the NDE articles (from wikipedia or wherever). Are you afraid it might affect your much cherished views

i have heard and read about NDE, it doesn't move me at all.

Science, for instance, has failed to discover the origins of the universe. Why do u think this is so?

science hasn't failed, by saying science has failed, then science must have given up on finding the origins of the universe. actually research and theories are still being verified about the origins of the universe. why have theists failed to describe the origins of the creator by the way??

Of course, science is deficient. Who teaches new born babies how to suckle, or when to cry?Huh Can science explain that

Some aspects of knowledge are pure (not taught by anyone). God is closer to pure knowledge that some lowly knowledge derived from restricted experiments.

actually there are scientists whose sole job is to find genes and proteins responsible for certain bodily functions. year after year, more breakthroughs are being made. actually aspects of knowledge are either in our DNA or through socialization. there is nothing supernatural about it. all u are doing is attributing the unknown to some "God". science is about finding logical answers to problems while religion is about having faith in God controlling our destiny and actions.



Perhaps you should read about Near Death Experiences (NDE). A number of atheists (and theists) have had this experience. What they 'saw' is at variance with the concepts they carry about in their minds.

am sorry using wikipedia as ur primary reference in a science or philosophy conference would make u a laughing stock. did people that had NDE see God or something. i thought was too infinite for humans to comprehend??

Beautiful. Now we see where science has failed woefully. So, why do you use scientific arguments to discuss God?

actually that doesn't help your argument, an abstract entity is something that doesn't exist and is all imagination. god doesn't really exists and is basically imagination and hallucination by a few folks. the square root of -1 doesn't exist in reality but it can be used to solve Fourier transforms

Before science can discuss God, it has to prove (or disprove) his existence using the scientific methods

don't theists have to prove God exists before they can discuss him 2. do i smell double standard here??

I am on your side. God does not exist. But I need scientific proof. There should be something you can do in your lab to debunk those who claim that God exists somewhere.

u don't get it do u. a scientific proof can't be given for an abstract entity. theists have to give scientists something more than "faith", "love" or "belief" before anything can be done in a lab. what do u expect scientists to do, a lie detector test?? u can only argue against God's existence using logic and philosophy not science.

again people, where did God come from and how do u have a personal relationship with him.

Since you are scientific in your approach, perhaps you can conduct an experiment to show that God does not exist.

I would like to read your publication as per this experiment. I am waiting

what would be the parameters of the experiment. u know this God more than me. tell me how i can perform an experiment to study the effect of this god. u have any ideas. it's kind of stupid to perform an experiment on something that is deemed infinite and abstract.

You, on your part, have failed to prove (convincingly) that God does NOT exist.

you are the one that made the claim that God exists not me. if i told u that my poop was blue, it's my job to show some evidence relating to this. u theists brought up the idea of an "infinite" god. u dodge the question repeatedly while asking for proof of an abstract entity.


by the way, what does the work of a geoscientist have to do with evolution. no one was arguing about the rock's magnetic field