Chatinent's Posts
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Juell:What part of my explanation don't you understand? That was an illustration Jesus used to address and explain the prevalent issue of the disparity between the common men and the Pharisees as at then! Jesus used it to explain the change in circumstances. Read my post above. I explained it there. It was an illustration! |
illicit:Since when you last understanding the signs he said. |
Juell:Say your translation of the Bible. Have you compared multiple renderings? Hope you know the Bible was not originally written in English? What we have in English was translated from the original Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic renderings. Of course, a translator who believes in hell fire will definitely substitute Sheol, Gehenna, and Hades to mean hell fire when they are not. |
Human government cannot solve our problems. |
iyambz:The truth of the matter is you believe what you don't know. If people will live forever in the torment of hell, doesn't it contradict the Bible that people will die? Or you don't know what death meant? Funnily enough, the believers of hell fire commit the most crimes. Lol. Such irony. |
Juell:He didn't feel anything. The story was a parable! An illustration! |
Juell:Not that, it's actually because hell fire doesn't exist. Do you know the Bible says Jesus went to hell? Of course, the Bible doesn't support your notion. |
Karlovych:Did you notice in that picture only the church members are falling down? |
SanctifiedSista:Meaningless. 1. Go to the school and seat and learn under anointed men of GOD like apostle Joshua Selman and Bishop OYEDEPO. Am sure of these twoThey preach the same thing we all know their counterparts preach. I'm not sure of them. They need to learn from me. 2. Listen to the music of dunsin, pastor Olawale Daniel, Nathaniel Bassey and orenze VictoriaOk. What next? I'll earn everlasting bliss? I have melodious tunes I listen to..that's wasn't made for the purpose of profit-making. 3. Evangelise by correcting in love,inviting people to church,praying for them and not urself, contributing half of ur fortune to enhancing God kingdom..ur church never see paint for years yet u cannot buy paint for them to do it..babaFunny you. None of my church earth wide looks dirty. 4. Practice practice everyday. Stay away from corruption.unfollow naked women on InstagramI don't follow them, let alone unfollow 5. Gym gym gym by prayers and fasting and going on seminarsPrayer is good. Fasting is not compulsory for salvation. These few things will help u wear that beautiful crown at last..queen Elizabeth own is not near as beautiful as what awaits u. U won't miss ur grand mansion and all the benefitsOkay, but I want to live on Earth...a paradise earth forever. |
Juell:That's not the point Jesus made. Think before this: why did Adam and Eve, the first sinners, not go to hellfire? |
SanctifiedSista:Okay. |
Juell:By the way, if taken literally, it means a tip of his finger in water can quench thirst. Right? Read my post again and compare the scriptures cited. You'd be amazed you have been believing false teachings all this while. |
SanctifiedSista:Aunty, the Bible says the wages of sin is death not hell fire. Why did Adam and Eve the first sinners not go to hell fire? Do you know Jesus went to hell? I'm sure you don't know because your version of hell isn't what the Bible teaches. Your version of hell teaches a fiery torment while the Bible says otherwise. You are free to package your church members, yourself, and your pastor for a bible study if you want to know the truth. You are welcome. |
chiommy123:1. You answered wrongly. I asked if it was everyone who'd go to heaven. I didn't dispute going to heaven. 2. Rich man and Lazarus was merely a parable, and doesn't relate to what is on ground. It may surprise you to know Abraham is not in heaven nor does he have a prospect of going there. Read here to see the explanation of the rich man and Lazarus: https://www.nairaland.com/6447675/misconceptions-hell-fire-thoroughly-examined Please verify scriptures. Also, try to do your research on things not just believing everything you are told! You have a bible! Yes, I'm a Witness. jesusjnr2020:Your problem is mental. 1. Do you know Jesus went to hell? I'm not sure you've read that verse before. Was Jesus tormented? No. 2. Did I say people will not go to heaven? No. You are paranoid. I was expecting answers to my post if you think you have them, but as your forefathers the Pharisees did, you came the same way. Read before you speak. You know nothing. Get behind me. |
OlawaleBammie:For a time, God did permit a man to have more than one wife. (Genesis 4:19; 16:1-4; 29:18-29) But God did not originate the practice of polygamy. He provided only one wife for Adam. God authorized Jesus Christ to reinstitute His original standard of monogamy. (John 8:28) When asked about marriage, Jesus said: “He who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh.’”—Matthew 19:4, 5. One of Jesus’ disciples was later inspired by God to write: “Let each man have his own wife and each woman have her own husband.” (1 Corinthians 7:2) The Bible also states that any married man in the Christian congregation who is given special responsibilities must be “a husband of one wife.”—1 Timothy 3:2, 12. You are welcome. Have a nice century. |
Monogamy:The doctrine is false. LordIsaac:You've always grown to believe such. Read my post, and compare with the scriptures. You have a misconception about hell. Did you know the Bible said Jesus went to hell? If it meant the regular view people have today, does it mean Jesus was tormented there? |
Definition: The word “hell” is found in many Bible translations. In the same verses other translations read “the grave,” “the world of the dead,” and so forth. Other Bibles simply transliterate the original-language words that are sometimes rendered “hell”; that is, they express them with the letters of our alphabet but leave the words untranslated. What are those words? The Hebrew she’ohlʹ and its Greek equivalent haiʹdes, which refer, not to an individual burial place, but to the common grave of dead mankind; also the Greek geʹen·na, which is used as a symbol of eternal destruction. However, both in Christendom and in many non-Christian religions it is taught that hell is a place inhabited by demons and where the wicked, after death, are punished (and some believe that this is with torment). Does the Bible indicate whether the dead experience pain? Eccl. 9:5, 10: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all . . . All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol,* the place to which you are going.” (If they are conscious of nothing, they obviously feel no pain.) (*“Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB; “the grave,” KJ, Kx; “hell,” Dy; “the world of the dead,” TEV.) Ps. 146:4: “His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts* do perish.” (*“Thoughts,” KJ, 145:4 in Dy; “schemes,” JB; “plans,” RS, TEV.) Does the Bible indicate that the soul survives the death of the body? Ezek. 18:4: “The soul* that is sinning—it itself will die.” (*“Soul,” KJ, Dy, RS, NE, Kx; “the man,” JB; “the person,” TEV.) “The concept of ‘soul,’ meaning a purely spiritual, immaterial reality, separate from the ‘body,’ . . . does not exist in the Bible.”—La Parole de Dieu (Paris, 1960), Georges Auzou, professor of Sacred Scripture, Rouen Seminary, France, p. 128. “Although the Hebrew word nefesh [in the Hebrew Scriptures] is frequently translated as ‘soul,’ it would be inaccurate to read into it a Greek meaning. Nefesh . . . is never conceived of as operating separately from the body. In the New Testament the Greek word psyche is often translated as ‘soul’ but again should not be readily understood to have the meaning the word had for the Greek philosophers. It usually means ‘life,’ or ‘vitality,’ or, at times, ‘the self.’”—The Encyclopedia Americana (1977), Vol. 25, p. 236. What sort of people go to the Bible hell? Does the Bible say that the wicked go to hell? Ps. 9:17, KJ: “The wicked shall be turned into hell,* and all the nations that forget God.” (*“Hell,” 9:18 in Dy; “death,” TEV; “the place of death,” Kx; “Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB, NW.) Does the Bible also say that upright people go to hell? Job 14:13, Dy: “[Job prayed:] Who will grant me this, that thou mayst protect me in hell,* and hide me till thy wrath pass, and appoint me a time when thou wilt remember me?” (God himself said that Job was “a man blameless and upright, fearing God and turning aside from bad.”—Job 1:8.) (*“The grave,” KJ; “the world of the dead,” TEV; “Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB, NW.) Acts 2:25-27, KJ: “David speaketh concerning him [Jesus Christ], . . . Because thou wilt not “leave” Jesus in hell implies that Jesus was in hell, or Hades, at least for a time, does it not?) (*“Hell,” Dy; “death,” NE; “the place of death,” Kx; “the world of the dead,” TEV; “Hades,” AS, RS, JB, NW.) Does anyone ever get out of the Bible hell? Rev. 20:13, 14, KJ: “The sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell* delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire.” (So the dead will be delivered from hell. Notice also that hell is not the same as the lake of fire but will be cast into the lake of fire.) (*“Hell,” Dy, Kx; “the world of the dead,” TEV; “Hades,” NE, AS, RS, JB, NW.) Why is there confusion as to what the Bible says about hell? “Much confusion and misunderstanding has been caused through the early translators of the Bible persistently rendering the Hebrew Sheol and the Greek Hades and Gehenna by the word hell. The simple transliteration of these words by the translators of the revised editions of the Bible has not sufficed to appreciably clear up this confusion and misconception.”—The Encyclopedia Americana (1942), Vol. XIV, p. 81. Translators have allowed their personal beliefs to color their work instead of being consistent in their rendering of the original-language words. For example: (1) The King James Version rendered she’ohlʹ as “hell,” “the grave,” and “the pit”; haiʹdes is therein rendered both “hell” and “grave”; geʹen·na is also translated “hell.” (2) Today’s English Version transliterates haiʹdes as “Hades” and also renders it as “hell” and “the world of the dead.” But besides rendering “hell” from haiʹdes it uses that same translation for geʹen·na. (3) The Jerusalem Bible transliterates haiʹdes six times, but in other passages it translates it as “hell” and as “the underworld.” It also translates geʹen·na as “hell,” as it does haiʹdes in two instances. Thus the exact meanings of the original-language words have been obscured.Is there eternal punishment for the wicked? Matt. 25:46, KJ: “These shall go away into translates it as “hell” and as “the underworld.” It also translates geʹen·na as “hell,” as it does haiʹdes in two instances. Thus the exact meanings of the original-language words have been obscured. Is there eternal punishment for the wicked? Matt. 25:46, KJ: “These shall go away into everlasting punishment [“lopping off,” Int; Greek, koʹla·sin]: but the righteous into life eternal.” (The Emphatic Diaglott reads “cutting-off” instead of “punishment.” A footnote states: “Kolasin . . . is derived from kolazoo, which signifies, 1. To cut off; as lopping off branches of trees, to prune. 2. To restrain, to repress. . . . 3. To chastise, to punish. To cut off an individual from life, or society, or even to restrain, is esteemed as punishment;—hence has arisen this third metaphorical use of the word. The primary signification has been adopted, because it agrees better with the second member of the sentence, thus preserving the force and beauty of the antithesis. The righteous go to life, the wicked to the cutting off from life, or death. See 2 Thess. 1.9.”) 2 Thess. 1:9, RS: “They shall suffer the punishment of eternal destruction* and exclusion from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might.” (*“Eternal ruin,” NAB, NE; “lost eternally,” JB; “condemn them to eternal punishment,” Kx; “eternal punishment in destruction,” Dy.)Jude 7, KJ: “Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.” (The fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah ceased burning thousands of years ago. But the effect of that fire has been lasting; the cities have not been rebuilt. God’s judgment, however, was against not merely those cities but also their wicked inhabitants. What happened to them is a warning example. At Luke 17:29, Jesus says that they were “destroyed”; Jude 7 shows that the destruction was eternal.) What is the meaning of the ‘eternal torment’ referred to in Revelation? Rev. 14:9-11; 20:10, KJ: “If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: and the smoke of their torment [Greek, baseverlasting punishment [“lopping off,” Int; Greek, koʹla·sin]: but the righteous into life eternal.” (The Emphatic Diaglott reads “cutting-off” instead of “punishment.” A footnote states: “Kolasin . . . is derived from kolazoo, which signifies, 1. To cut off; as lopping off branches of trees, to prune. 2. To restrain, to repress. . . . 3. To chastise, to punish. To cut off an individual from life, or society, or even to restrain, is esteemed as punishment;—hence has arisen this third metaphorical use of the word. 2 Thess. 1:9, RS: “They shall suffer the punishment of eternal destruction* and exclusion from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might.” (*“Eternal ruin,” NAB, NE; “lost eternally,” JB; “condemn them to eternal punishment,” Kx; “eternal punishment in destruction,” Dy.) Jude 7, KJ: “Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.” (The fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah ceased burning thousands of years ago. But the effect of that fire has been lasting; the cities have not been rebuilt. God’s judgment, however, was against not merely those cities but also their wicked inhabitants. What happened to them is a warning example. At Luke 17:29, Jesus says that they were “destroyed”; Jude 7 shows that the destruction was eternal.) What is the meaning of the ‘eternal torment’ referred to in Revelation? Rev. 14:9-11; 20:10, KJ: “If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: and the smoke of their torment [Greek, basa·ni·smouʹ] ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.” “And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.” What is the ‘torment’ to which these texts refer? It is noteworthy that at Revelation 11:10 (KJ) reference is made to ‘prophets that torment those dwelling on the earth.’ Such torment results from humiliating exposure by the messages that these prophets proclaim. At Revelation 14:9-11 (KJ) worshipers of the symbolic “beast and his image” are said to be “tormented with fire and brimstone.” This cannot refer to conscious torment after death because “the dead know not any thing.” (Eccl. 9:5, KJ) Then, what causes them to experience such torment while they are still alive? It is the proclamation by God’s servants that worshipers of the “beast and his image” will experience second death, which is represented by “the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone.” The smoke, associated with their fiery destruction, ascends forever because the destruction will be eternal and will never be forgotten. When Revelation 20:10 says that the Devil is to experience ‘torment forever and ever’ in “the lake of fire and brimstone,” what does that mean? Revelation 21:8 (KJ) says clearly that “the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone” means “the second death.” So the Devil’s being “tormented” there forever means that there will be no relief for him; he will be held under restraint forever, actually in eternal death. This use of the word “torment” (from the Greek baʹsa·nos) reminds one of its use at Matthew 18:34, where the same basic Greek word is applied to a ‘jailer.’—RS, AT, ED, NW. What is the ‘fiery Gehenna’ to which Jesus referred? Reference to Gehenna appears 12 times in the Christian Greek Scriptures. Five times it is directly associated with fire. Translators have rendered the Greek expression geʹen·nan tou py·rosʹ as “hell fire” (KJ, Dy), “fires of hell” (NE), “fiery pit” (AT), and “fires of Gehenna” (NAB). Historical background: The Valley of Hinnom (Gehenna) was outside the walls of Jerusalem. For a time it was the site of idolatrous worship, including child sacrifice. In the first century Gehenna was being used as the incinerator for the filth of Jerusalem. Bodies of dead animals were thrown into the valley to be consumed in the fires, to which sulfur, or brimstone, was added to assist the burning. Also bodies of executed criminals, who were considered undeserving of burial in a memorial tomb, were thrown into Gehenna. Thus, at Matthew 5:29, 30, Jesus spoke of the casting of one’s “whole body” into Gehenna. If the body fell into the constantly burning fire it was consumed, but if it landed on a ledge of the deep ravine its putrefying flesh became infested with the ever-present worms, or maggots. (Mark 9:47, 48) Living humans were not pitched into Gehenna; so it was not a place of conscious torment. At Matthew 10:28, Jesus warned his hearers to “be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” What does it mean? Notice that there is no mention here of torment in the fires of Gehenna; rather, he says to ‘fear him that can destroy in Gehenna.’ By referring to the “soul” separately, Jesus here emphasizes that God can destroy all of a person’s life prospects; thus there is no hope of resurrection for him. So, the references to the ‘fiery Gehenna’ have the same meaning as ‘the lake of fire’ of Revelation 21:8, namely, destruction, “second death.” What does the Bible say the penalty for sin is? Rom. 6:23: “The wages sin pays is death.” After one’s death, is he still subject to further punishment for his sins? Rom. 6:7: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.” Is eternal torment of the wicked compatible with God’s personality? Jer. 7:31: “They [apostate Judeans] have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that had not come up into my heart.” (If it never came into God’s heart, surely he does not have and use such a thing on a larger scale.) Illustration: What would you think of a parent who held his child’s hand over a fire to punish the child for wrongdoing? “God is love.” (1 John 4: Would he do what no right-minded human parent would do? Certainly not! By what Jesus said about the rich man and Lazarus, did Jesus teach torment of the wicked after death? Is the account, at Luke 16:19-31, literal or merely an illustration of something else? The Jerusalem Bible, in a footnote, acknowledges that it is a “parable in story form without reference to any historical personage.” If taken literally, it would mean that those enjoying divine favor could all fit at the bosom of one man, Abraham; that the water on one’s fingertip would not be evaporated by the fire of Hades; that a mere drop of water would bring relief to one suffering there. Does that sound reasonable to you? If it were literal, it would conflict with other parts of the Bible. If the Bible were thus contradictory, would a lover of truth use it as a basis for his faith? But the Bible does not contradict itself. What does the parable mean? The “rich man” represented the Pharisees. (See verse 14.) The beggar Lazarus represented the common Jewish people who were despised by the Pharisees but who repented and became followers of Jesus. (See Luke 18:11; John 7:49; Matthew 21:31, 32.) Their deaths were also symbolic, representing a change in circumstances. Thus, the formerly despised ones came into a position of divine favor, and the formerly seemingly favored ones were rejected by God, while being tormented by the judgment messages delivered by the ones whom they had despised.—Acts 5:33; 7:54. What is the origin of the teaching of hellfire? In ancient Babylonian and Assyrian beliefs the “nether world . . . is pictured as a place full of horrors, and is presided over by gods and demons of great strength and fierceness.” (The Religion of Babylonia and Assyria, Boston, 1898, Morris Jastrow, Jr., p. 581) Early evidence of the fiery aspect of Christendom’s hell is found in the religion of ancient Egypt. (The Book of the Dead, New Hyde Park, N.Y., 1960, with introduction by E. A. Wallis Budge, pp. 144, 149, 151, 153, 161) Buddhism, which dates back to the 6th century B.C.E., in time came to feature both hot and cold hells. (The Encyclopedia Americana, 1977, Vol. 14, p. 68) Depictions of hell portrayed in Catholic churches in Italy have been traced to Etruscan roots.—La civiltà etrusca (Milan, 1979), Werner Keller, p. 389. But the real roots of this God-dishonoring doctrine go much deeper. The fiendish concepts associated with a hell of torment slander God and originate with the chief slanderer of God (the Devil, which name means “Slanderer”), the one whom Jesus Christ called “the father of the lie.”—John 8:44. ________________________ Comments are welcome. |
Mehn. Life hard. |
ikorodureporta:It has zilch to do with time. SanctifiedSista:Bringing the devil into everything is not a last resort to every bad. Sometimes, we cause our problems. It could be by over-speeding, getting drunk, or being in right places at wrong times. Of course, we should value our life at all times. Righteousness2:If sb had an accident and died, is the devil to be blamed? |
Donspicey:
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I hear a large number of people say they are avoiding sin because they want to go to heaven. My questions: 1. Why do you want to go to heaven? 2. What will people who go to heaven do? 3. Did the Bible say that eternal bliss is heavenwards only? 4. Do you have any scriptural backup supporting the doctrine that all good people will go to heaven? 5. What will happen to earth in the generic sense? From my check, God created the earth as humankind's home with his purpose for humans to live forever in it. Although, the eternity on it was cut short by our first human parents, does it mean God changed his plans and redirected the eternity to heaven for everyone? 6. Where does the promise at Rev. 21:3, 4 apply? Heaven or earth? Of course, we know there is no death in heaven. 7. Doesn't it contradict the Psalmist at Psalm 37:29 who said the meek will inherit the earth and live forever in it, and Eccl 1:4 which firmly says the earth will remain forever? Isaiah 65: 21, 22 also listed promises on what that new paradise will be like. One point he made is 'they will build houses and live in them, plant vineyards and eat its fruitage.' Does this apply to heaven or earth? |
sapphiere:I am not saying God is not merciful but the others who died in accidents wasn't because of God not being merciful. Whatever happens to us is caused by today's anxieties, and sin. Read James 1:13, 14. Of course, we should be grateful for the miracle of life always! About the future being female, I believe. ..but your explanation isn't the connotation of what the original founders of the sentence meant. |
sapphiere:Okay, if he is an armed robber, hello criminal? See? That's not the meaning, and clearly a wrong justification. |
DaddyRochie1642:Na wa o |
Job. No fastest way to legit hustle. |
Was the snake pursuing the rat, or was the rat pursuing the snake? What's the connection? |
Clearly, chridtendom's version of 'marry in the Lord' is different. ...to the extent of supporting polygamy, and converting. |
What does being born again mean to you? |
Talking about a billion years is too far. Jesus prophesied that the end is this period. We are living in the last of the last days. |
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