₦airaland Forum

BETATRON:
ok..now let see how far materialism takes you...a lot of concept you believe in haven't been seen by you..for instance d pressure within the human body that balances that outside--pascal..

Two the essence of electricity isn't know likewise the essence of gravity isn't only their effect is felt

Just as we are the effects of God's handiwork..we cannot see Him but feel His presence everywhere in the universe which is filled with precise and beuwiful calculations

This again is untrue. Gravity and pressure can be observed, measured and predicted. Every material experiences gravity and pressure equally. Gravity and pressure have applications. For gravity, as I mentioned earlier, orbiting satellites. As for pressure, people use it all the time in engines, vacuum cleaners etc. We need gravity and pressure to exist in the universe.

On the other hand, God can't be observed, we can't see his/her (for lack of a gender neutral pronoun) effects. God has no application in the world. We don't need God for anything for anything.

KingEbukasBlog:
Yeah .... the theories that get modified were also calculated initially and were assumed to be true . More findings will reveal more truth .

Here's a good joke

That's when things don't add up. But they do.

As for the joke,
5/10. Almost funny.

KingEbukasBlog:
"Philosophy is dead " - Stephen Hawking

Because someone is smart does not mean he cant say stu.pid things

Giving excuses already ? Humans KNOW VERY LITTLE of our vast universe . Its hard a pill to swallow but you have to accept that most explanations are just intelligent assumptions . Or were the scientists there to know what actually happened ?

Only a witness of creation of our universe can tell us how it was done - allegorically , metaphorically (figuratively) or literally

What are you going on about? One example of a good assumption is nobody has actually been to earth's core to know it's made of iron. Scientists just know the planet's density and the fact that we have a magnetic field and assumed we had an iron core. But see, if we had been wrong, then our calculation of earth's mass and therefore it's gravitational constant would have been off. If it had been off, then all those satellites orbiting the earth would have either crashed right back or drifted away.

My point is that all the 'hypotheses' fit together nicely with what we observe later because our calculations are correct.

EDIT: Plural of 'hypothesis' is 'hypotheses'

BETATRON:
lol..I thought you are a person of logic now I see you are being more of materialistic than logical

Materialism and logic aren't mutually exclusive. You can tell me I'm materialistic and I'll tell you that I haven't seen any reason to think otherwise.

KingEbukasBlog:
1. The Bible

2. Infinite regression

3. Logic

4. Science

5. Life

There are many unexplained phenomena in science . And science CAN NEVER have ALL the answers to life's questions . That's why there is philosophy too

Yet. Phenomena that science hasn't explained yet. But most of the time, you'll see that unexplained events only remain so because of lack of data to work, or maybe people just don't care. I don't see the use of philosophy and metaphysics except making people sound intelligent.

BETATRON:
what doesn't work for science isn't necessarily incorrect..metaphysics cannot be subjected to scientific methods and yet science doesn't provlaim that metaphysics is wrong

If I tell you sh!t rainbows can you prove me wrong? If you bring up an open-ended concept how can I disprove it? You're supposed to bring evidence, evidence that doesn't suspiciously resemble natural process. Like, let God regrow an amputated limb. That's very difficult to fake.

winner01:
Before you further make a fool of yourself , make sure you watch the clip.

This clip has been posted before, in fact, it's on my phone and I've viewed it many times.

KingEbukasBlog:
God is eternal

We know that energy cannot be destroyed by modern means and that's a fact. So what is backing this claim up? Because no matter how convinced you are on a topic, it doesn't change whether it's right or wrong. That said, nobody is going to base calculations on a personal hunch or some arbitrary law that for some reason a creator is eternal.

Unless of course the person resorts to pseudoscience which to be honest, hasn't gotten anybody anywhere.

BETATRON:
...infinite regression is impossible my brother..what we say is unintelligence and unconsciousness cannot be the cause of intelligence and grandeur.

Just as we cannot expect a 1mnt old to "by chance" draw the portrait of himself perfectly so also we don't expect beauty and intelligence to be the product of mere chance

Back to God not having a creator..as I have said "infinite regression is impossible because if we keep moving backward to find the creator of each creator there will be no creation

So our concept of God is one who is self existent,infinite knowledge,self dependent et.al ..simply put #eternal#

Oh really, so you've basically created a law that only applies when you say so. That's not how science works.

Aww, I can't view the video on my crappy device. I wish you used a youtube link.

EDIT: Please is there another link for the vid, 'cause I don't do facebook.

This guy said the Big Bang was the 'beginning' of our universe? That's utter fu,cking bullsh!t he's passing off as science there. The Big Bang represents when the universe began to expand.
We don't know when the universe began or if it ever even began.

Also, he keeps making the weak creationist argument that everything must have a cause. So assuming a god caused the universe to exist then what caused that god to exist?

This is an obviously intelligent man suffering from cognitive dissonance here.

winner01:
abiogenesis simply means without begining and its the only theory on the origin of life that has been proved entirely false. Even though most other scientific theories are clinged to desperately despite overwhelming evidence to discredit them.

Maybe is been proven false by pseudoscientists. What evidence has been brought?

winner01:
Its funny you believe life came from non-life through extraordinary processes, and still fail to acknowledge the forces of the supernatural, its also funny you care less about how "non-life" itself initially came into existence.

There's nothing extraordinary about inorganic substances reacting to form organic compounds. There's nothing extraordinary about hydrocarbons reacting with ammonia to form to form amide. There is nothing extraordinary about the self-assembly of formamide to form RNA at 130 degrees celsius in the presence of ultraviolet light (the temperature and ultraviolet radiation were much higher during the formation of earth's atmosphere.
That's the thing about science, you can slice it, and grind it, and tear it to bits but the pieces always fit back together quite nicely.

winner01:
Maybe you should back your claims with evidence on the observation of abiogenesis happening in nature,
Or tell us if scientists have they been able to create a lifeform through controlled experiments.

Scientists have observed the formation of the components of RNA by simulating a asteroid impact. But the truth is that scientists still need time. They've only being doing this for so long now. But I have confidence in the same system that has provided cars and landed on the moon.

winner01:
Also tell us the probability of a single protein forming through purely natural processes and how acceptable it is based on the law of probability.
Finally, What is the minimum number of parts necessary for an autotrophic free living organism to live, and could these parts assemble by naturalistic means?

The first question cannot be answered without involving a supercomputer, sorry.

The second is tricky also, but a protocell will require a lipid cell membrane (lipids are capable of self-assembly, try putting an egg yolk in a glass of water), nucleic acid and an iron-sulphide environment for assimilation of carbon for energy.

Bollinger:
They have it plenty in stores here. Especially in sex shops.

Nice. Don't get caught though.

logica:
End time...prediction.

well, no sh!t

Bollinger:
Bro's, you gave me a great idea. I'll probably do it next week.

Where will you get the blow-up dolls?

winner01:
And Where did the simpler species come from.

Abiogenesis. Life from complex organic compounds.

winner01:
where did the ancient worms come from

They evolved from simpler species, all the way to abiogenesis.

Sometime in 2032, I'll fill up a bunch d blow-up dolls with helium and let them free. Then I'll buy second-hand clothes and scatter them all over the place to mess with people.

Who am I kidding? I'll be too mature for such pranks by that time... Or will I?

KingEbukasBlog:
Oh ok ... I thought you meant if you meant that on a closer look MRIs are not designed

So what about evolution of the brain . Has this process been observed ? Or we gona read an epistle as a response ?

The process hasn't been observed in real time, but there is evidence like I said before. Evolution can be observed in bacteria that build resistance to antibiotics. It can also be observed in dog breeding, with new species of dogs being formed over a number of generations.

KingEbukasBlog:
similarities (belief from assumption) or observation ?

I need to know if this evolution has been observed

It can be observed in the way bacteria become resistant to antibiotics over time.

winner01:
And the simpler brain came from? thin air?
I see how much you questioned you beliefs.

Of course not! What am I, a creationist? (Kek). Primitive neural structures can be observed in ancient worms. All it takes is a series of specialized to coalesce to perform a certain task over time.

KingEbukasBlog:
So has this process been observed?



... please explain this

Human brains share more similarities to other mammals, most similar to chimpanzees before others. The similarities become less and less until as we move out of the mammalian class to reptilian and so on. It also happens that several other organs seem to follow this progression.

People have been hooked up to MRIs and CAT scanners and asked to perform simple tasks or images would be shown to them while doctors monitor brain activity.

EDIT: Forgot to answer the first question.

KingEbukasBlog:
Evidently an atheist doesn't know what faith is . If He has the faith he will obviously get healed .



Josephus made us know about Jesus ben Ananias and Jesus Christ . It was clear these were entirely different persons . Atheist took the story and twisted it

I'm talking about christian amputees.

You're making it look like there is some conspiracy theory against christianity but there really isn't. Besides, no miracle was recorded by Josephus and he was the one who lived in Jesus' time. Shouldn't he have noticed if a guy was just waltzing around the place and performing miracles?

KingEbukasBlog:
I believe God can but the level of faith is too low . Its like this is too much for God , how sure I'm I God can do this . I believe it will be done some day.

You see, this is just an excuse, are you telling me that people were just magically more faithful then? Really? There must be amputees that live and breathe God but still nothing. Poor guys.

KingEbukasBlog:
There were many JESUSes during his time , notably Jesus ben Ananias. Atheists know of this so they tend to mix things up to promote their godless ideologies

Come on. I'm sure someone who lived in his timeline would've noticed. Instead, we just have four conflicting stories that written after the time of his death.

KingEbukasBlog:
A complex brain that supports emotions and intelligence needs no designer but the MRIs that monitors the brain needs a designer .

He now ends it with "put my LOGICAL REASONING and SCIENCE to shame" .

You just shot yourself in the foot

But you see, a complex brain can evolve from a simpler one. And we've seen a series of brains from complex to simple.

The MRI monitor needs a designer but if we see a series of monitors that get smaller and more rudimentary with time up to a molecule. Then maybe we'll think that there doesn't have to be designer.

KingEbukasBlog:
I dont post videos of miracles . I witness them myself . I've experienced one myself .

Why God has not healed amputees ?

Jesus healed Marcus' ear and made a leper whole in the bible . Jesus is a historical figure , so indeed He has healed amputees

Nah bruh, tell me you didn't just play that card. Jesus' story wasn't covered by contemporary historians at that time. There are even arguments that he is a composite character of a number of wandering preachers at that time, filled with embellishments. He's timeline even has a few hiccups (check it out). So whether he's historical is at least up for debate.

But even with that, he's the one who said "greater works than these". But amputees still aren't being healed. The only unambiguous miracle that can be performed, hasn't been done. Not looking very good for your argument.

KingEbukasBlog:
Should I believe men now shoot laser beams from their eyes and spider webs from the wrists because I saw it in a video ?

Ah, but we know that Spiderman movies only look so good because they have giant budgets. Also, there are people who are skilled at looking at editing tricks in videos.

winner01:
It is very true and i just cited examples. you keep emphasizing flaws. KingEbukasBlog asked you to mention them, you became dumb, why then should i take you serious.

Ahem, I'll start with scientific flaws. Try to help me explain these few:

God creates light before the sun or stars, creates a 'firmament' that separates the waters (wtf is that?), plants are made before the sun, God spends a day making the sun and moon and then all the stars in the universe, God creates the universe in 6 days.

winner01:
There is no evidence of God but there is evidence of the human mind. Do you mind showing us a picture of the human mind as proof that it exists, Any attempt will be appreciated.
Typical, sorry dude, logical reason and science have absolutely nothing to do with atheism. Like i said, you guys are desperate and will cling on anything to remain relevant.
Logical reason or science does not support creation out of nothing. Dont flatter yourself, think instead.
Most of the worlds greatest inventors and scientists believed in God, go figure.

Evidence of the human mind:
1. A complex brain to support emotions and intelligence.

2. Monitoring of the brain when (through MRIs) when tasks are being performed.
1/10. Needs improvement.

I'm just saying, prove that God exists. Put my logical reasoning and science to shame. Don't back out.

winner01:
Do you remain poor cos you were born into a poor family
Why do you struggle to succeed when you werent born into success
Got it
You could be born into anything, i care less, the most important thing is to be free, and only the truth will set you free.

Dude, you were indoctrinated. Nothing else. That's why you don't question your beliefs. If your parents were muslim, chances are that you would have been on NL defending Allah and Prophet Muhammad.

You are mentally caged, thats why you have restricted your thinking to the visible.
You cant see force or energy, but you can feel and sense its effects, does it mean it dosent exist.
The universe was created by forces, and its definately not natural forces, and those forces act on the natural.
Open your mind, you will find answers.[/quote]I knew you'll talk about force and energy. Let me tell you this, I know that they exist because they can be measured. I'll throw a pen up 100 times and it will always fall to the ground. See that's how science works. God, on the other hand works exactly like random chance, isn't that curious?

Open YOUR mind, why do you believe there is supernatural force, if it - as you just stated - works like natural forces?

Take any isolated 'supernatural' event you've seen in your life, examine all its aspects, do some research and see if you can break it down to simple natural processes or peoples actions.

KingEbukasBlog:
Miracles prove God's existence

There are clear evidences Jesus exist . He is a historical figure ( google it and take your time to fill yasef with knowledge )

'Miracles' are ambiguous at best, based on anecdotal evidence. Non-repeatable or testable events that always seem to happen off-camera. The few that happen on camera can easily be debunked.

Why doesn't God heal amputees? If that was done on a camera, I'll shut the mess up.

Please can you post a video link of something like that?

Merry Christmas, man, hope 2016 would be good for you because it will be big for me. As a matter of fact, it will be the end of my life as I know it.

KingEbukasBlog:
Abegi , stop embellishing atheism . Unbelief is unbelief . You are either an atheist or agnostic .

I respect agnosticism . It scrutinizes both atheism and religion with no predilection for either side

You've not done enough research into this to make such a false a statement. I am what I am, and won't embellish anything. I'm just saying you should prove that your god exists. Or are you going to tell me that it's through faith?

KingEbukasBlog:
oh .. sorry then

Fine.

KingEbukasBlog:
I apologized to an atheist and still got an abuse from an atheist .

Oh well ...

Yeah, after I saw your thinly-veiled jab at me that you were disguising as an apology, I may have been a bit harsh.
For that I apologize too.
I just want you to engage people with respect or else nobody is going to get anywhere around here.

winner01:
Lol, In short you are still confused on why bad things happen to "good people".
No human declares that there is no God through "logical reasoning", it all has to do with emotions. Even though some employ "logical reasoning" as a facade to validate their emotion-deducted conclusion.

just like a similar minded atheist created this thread:
https://www.nairaland.com/2806657/father-not-healed-before-year/4#41133797
Its all emotions.

Logic/science and atheism are two lines that never meet.

You really need to ask yourself who a "good person" is.

John the baptist was beheaded, and so what.
Stephen was stoned, and so what.
Some disciples were murdered, and so what.

Look, We do not look up to the one who is able to attack the flesh
God forbid me to forgo a celestial glory for a terrestial. Flesh is just dust, glory is all.
Afterall, death is just a transition.

So my friend, you need to stop thinking that death is the ultimate, its just a transition to Glory. A glory that cant be compared to any other.

Stop caging your mind, it didnt begin here and so it dosent end here. Late Bimbo odukoya might just be in a better place.

This is untrue, while some base their decisions on emotion., it isn't all. I deconverted when I saw how flawed the bible is both scientifically and morally, coupled with the fact that there is no evidence of a god. But I don't think you'll understand that.

Why? Because you've been programmed to discredit logical reasoning and science once it comes into conflict with your religion.

One thing I've noticed in life is that logic is constant, the scientific method is constant and they have both worked out for us with appreciable evidence (such as: the vehicles we ride in, the internet we're using, etc).

Religion on the other hand, comes with several factors, the religion of your family, geographical location, the people who colonized you, etc.

Any belief that cannot be questioned by a believer is exactly the kind of the belief you SHOULD question. You shouldn't be close-minded or afraid, take a small step to see where the atheist is coming from, instead of blocking out all that they say.