₦airaland Forum

shadeyinka:
Nothing!
Except that Mary and Miriam seems to be mixed up somewhere!

it is you and your book that got everything confused. we arent.

shadeyinka:
Can Muslims understand the Qur'an except the so called authorities has spoken

to some extent, yes.

shadeyinka:
What is difficult in understanding a plainly revealed text?

About your question!?
Mary mother of Jesus is the daughter of Imran and sister of Aaron brother of Moses?
Sura 66:12, Sura 19:27-28

But I know of Miriam sister of Aaron who is brother to Moses who is the daughter of Amran.




Human beings can make mistakes but not God

and, what's your issue(s) with this one?

shadeyinka:
I believe you should always operate with the same standard. Not changing the goalpost when there is a problem with what the senior Alfa's have said

who's senior Alfa and what did he say?

shadeyinka:
What is difficult in understanding a plainly revealed text?

nothing. It is you having difficulties

johnlvis:
No be to build school be the wahala. Will they leave begging and go to school?

appreciate something

shadeyinka:
The Al Fathia is plain for all to understand.
It is a prayer of help and salvation

God doesn't need these two. In fact, God is the giver of all help and salvation.

The words of Allah is easy and plain to understand. Why would you distort the Qur'an to fit your interpretation?

You have comprehension problem. Quran is the word of God or not?

shadeyinka:
I was introduced to Islam through the books of Ahmed Deedat. I know enough Islam not to copy-paste other people's argument.
Apart from David Wood, I've not even heard of the other names you mentioned.


This argument will hold water if and only if the Al Fathia was the last revealed Surah. Was it?
If other Surah were revealed after it how can it be the summary of the whole Qur'an?

I do not want to go into the discuss of why the Qur'an was not arranged according to how it was revealed. Could that not be the reason Muslims misunderstand the plain words of Allah in Arabic? You can just imagine if a Textbook was ripped apart and the chapters rearranged in a random manner. Such a text would be difficult to comprehend. Such is the book you hold in high esteem. Who authorized the rearrangement of the suras?


I think you or the Islamic scholars are making this up to escape the problems caused by the words of Prophet Mohammed appearing in the Qur'an that was supposed to be the plain words of Allah.

If Allah was changing how he was addressing himself as first, second or third persons, Allah prayed not to go to hell fire: this is unthinkable for the personality of Allah.

Is that not confusing for Allah to speak changing from first to second to third persons. See, the Al Fathia is a beautiful prayer that can only come from the mouth of a sincere believer seeking help from Allah. It makes perfect sense without any need for augmentation and explanations.

The Qur'an was given by Allah in very easy Arabic language, why do we men try to complicate that which is clearly revealed?


I don't have arguments where the word "say" was stated before a Surah at least for intellectual argument sake.

The Al Fathia cannot be the words of Allah. It is a prayer to Allah. Only an Islamic miracle can make the obvious not obvious as in the Al Fathia.

Apart from that, how come only in the Qur'an does God speak in such confusing language.
Have you read the Taurat or Zabura before?

The confusion is in you. Well said @highlighted. Why you are then confused is what i dont understand. It is disbelief to say that part of Quran is from Allah and Fatiha is not from Him. This is kufr. It is explained to you now. So take it or leave it. We have no problems with it. Sura Fatiha was revealed by Allah and it is very important to the extent that, without recitation of surah fatiha, whether in obligatory or voluntary prayers, such prayers are invalid. We have hadith report on this. So if skipping Surah fatiha in salat is invalid, how could words of human (surah fatiha as you alleged) so much important that it invalidate prayers made to God?

As for chronological arrangement of Quran, don't even go there. You may choked yourself along.

AutoJoshNIG:
https://i0.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge.jpeg?w=600&ssl=1


1. The idea for a 4th Mainland Bridge was first mooted in 2003 during the administration of Bola Ahmed Tinubu.


2. The bridge is intended to provide the required transportation to complement the rapidly growing industrial activities on the Eti-Osa – Lekki –
Epe corridor of Lagos State.


3. The bridge is also intended to drastically reduce the volume of traffic on Eko, Carter and Third Mainland Bridges.


4. The conceptual design for the 4th Mainland bridge was done by renowned indigenous architecture studio NLÉ Works.


5. In 2008, the conceptual design for the 4th Mainland bridge was approved by the Lagos state government.


6. The Bridge was designed to be a 38km bridge and expressway with a design speed of 140 km.


7. The bridge is designed to be a two-level bridge. The upper level will function as a means for vehicular traffic. Its lower level will stimulate
and accommodate pedestrian, social, commercial and cultural interactions.


8. The Bridge would be made up of eight ( interchanges to facilitate effective interconnectivity between different parts of the State.


9. The proposed alignment passes through Lekki, Langbasa and Baiyeiku towns along the shoreline of the Lagos Lagoon estuaries, further
running through Igbogbo River Basin and crossing the Lagos Lagoon estuaries to Itamaga Area in Ikorodu. It then crosses the Itoikin road
and the Ikorodu – Sagamu Road to connect Isawo inward Lagos Ibadan Expressway at Ojodu Berger axis.


https://i2.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge-2.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

10. The bridge will be a Four-lane dual carriageway with each comprising 3 lanes and 2metres hard shoulder on each side.


11. The bridge will be constructed to have a generous median to allow for both future carriageway expansion and light rail facility.


12. No fewer than 800 structures and shanties have been identified to be destroyed to allow for the construction of the proposed 4th Mainland
Bridge project. The inhabitants of affected structures will be compensated and/or relocated.


13. The 4th Mainland Bridge will be the first construction project (long-span bridge and expressway) of this magnitude that would be
embarked upon without Federal funding.


14. The project would be funded solely (concession) by the private sector.



15. On 25 May 2016, Governor Akinwunmi Ambode signed an MoU with a consortium of firms and finance houses for the financing and
construction of the 4th mainland bridge.

https://i1.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge-4.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

16. The consortium of firms that were engaged to finance and construct the bridge included Visible Asset Limited, Julius Berger Nigeria Plc,
Africa Finance Corporation (AFC) and Access Bank, Hi-tech Construction Limited, Eldorado Nigeria Limited, Nigerian Westminster Dredging
and Marine and J.P. Morgan. Visible Assets Limited would be the coordinating firm.



17. The contract cost for the construction of the 4th Mainland Bridge was N844bn.



18. When completed, the Fourth Mainland Bridge would be will be the longest in Africa. Currently, the 6 October Bridge, Cairo, Egypt (20.5
km) holds the continent’s length-crown.




19. On 22 May 2017, the Lagos State Government announced that it had cancelled the contract it had signed to with a consortium of firms for
the construction of the 4 Mainland Bridge. The delay in commencement by the concessionaire was given as the reason behind the
termination of the contract.


20. On 17 Aprill 2008, the Governor Ambode-led government announced that a new concessionaire will be announced in June 2018. No
the concessionaire has since been announced.



21. On January 2019, during an election campaign, the Lagos State governorship candidate of All Progressive Congress (APC),  Babajide
Sanwo-Olu said the construction of Fourth Mainland Bridge would not be his priority if elected.

https://i0.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge-5.jpg?w=600&ssl=1
https://i2.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge-6.jpg?w=600&ssl=1
https://i2.wp.com/autojosh.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/4th-Mainland-Bridge-3.jpg?w=600&ssl=1





Source:
https://autojosh.com/21-things-to-know-about-the-proposed-lagos-4th-mainland-bridge/

While i appreciate building modern infrastructures, roads and bridges, nigerians must be made aware of the cost or at what expense these things are built. Nigerian govt borrowed money from China to build infrastructures. Where are the recovered looted funds since 1999 to carry out these projects?. When you borrowed money on interest and you can not pay it back, the lender mortgages the country as collateral. Let's break it down. China loans Nigeria and other countries money. I am sure they loaned the money to you with intention that you will not be able to pay it back by maturity date. After that day you still have huge outstanding balance and Chinese take over the country in exchange for the debt. I came across article on naijagists few mins ago and my head almost explode. Chinese restaurant in Nigeria discriminates against blacks in black country.

Management policy is that no black person can attend the restaurant unless he is accompanied by chinese or light skinned person. I am afraid that in the coming decades, African will be recolonized again. Doesn't Nigeria has money to execute these projects?. Doesn't Nigeria has qualified contractors and engineers that are capable of roads, bridges construction?. This is why lending money on interest is forbidden in religions. The earlier these issues are addressed the better. Nigerian politicians have sold nigerians big time. How the heck in the world this chinese have the audacity to be racist against black people on black soil?. Lagos state should simply fine or close down this restaurant. If they dont do something about this - means your politicians have traded you in exchange for Chinese takeover.


Racist Chinese Restaurant In Lagos

https://naijagists.com/racist-chinese-restaurant-in-ikeja-lagos-nigeria-where-blacks-are-not-allowed-exposed/


Watch this short clip for clarification

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClfMyhfA9MI

I even heard that in Zambia, Chinese have divided the country by setting up their own military and police station within a sovereign nation. What a pathetic sad situation!. Obviously Zambia have bite more than it can chew. It had borrowed money it could not repay. Watch Chinese Money Trap above.

true2god:
You are mixing things up here as a result of excessive brainwashing. Your submission could have been 'the Quran should not be translated' instead of 'the quran cannot be translated'. There is no book that cannot be translated while retaining the context of the original language, unless you want to tell me that all Arab speakers are ignorant (of other languages) that they cannot do a good job of translatiing their quran to other languages. The issue is that you are merely using semantic to cover the inadequacies and inconsistencies in your quran. The submission you give now is one of the dumbest I have ever seen in my life.

The reason you cannot pray in other language is that if you do, the prayer will not make any sense to a crtitical mind of the person listening to it in his mother-tongue. And since many muslims do not even understand the meaning of the prayers, vis-a-vis Arab language itself, it is same parroting it to the gullble while they say 'AMIN' at the end. Your Al-fathia (the beginning, quran 1:1-7) is a great testimony to this fact. As a take away, who was speaking in quran 1:1-7? Is it Allah, Jibril or mohammed?

You dont get it, do you?. God revealed Quran simply in a language that we would understand enough to make Janna. But you can not translate God's infinite words and meanings. They are limitless. and are not bound by anything. If what i said confuses you, whose fault is that?. Me?

true2god:
Islam also presented a more difficult dilemma here. The muslims major text document is not the quran (the quran is only a fraction of Islamic information) but the hadith. If you place 5 Islamic scholars side by side and read an ayah, they will all give a different meaning to it based on the finding they got from either the hadith or the seerah.

rolling on the floor Try harder buddy. Why did you pretend like you dont understand my point?. You talking about ayah but i talked about basic tenets. There is no disagreement on the basics. Our basics are believe in Allah is One God. Believe that prophet muhammad is prophet and messenger not God. Let me stop here. No muslims disagree with these. But can you as christians give this clear, unambiguous statements about God and Jesus? As for muslims, there is no different understanding on this except for what is clearly and plainly established. If I put 3 christians next to one another and ask them who is Jesus?. I swear by God they would give different answers. You know this.

shadeyinka:
I agree with you. The Qur'an is the words of "Allah" not Jehovah.
And that is why:



1. (Quran 113:1)
Allah take refuge with the Lord of the Dawn



2. Quran 6:104)
Now have come to you, from your Lord, proofs
(To open your eyes): If any will see, it will
be for (the good of) his own soul; If any will
be blind, it will be to his own (harm): Allah is not
(here) To watch over your doings.

3. (Quran 27:91)
Allah has been commanded to serve the
Lord of this city, Him Who has sanctified it
and to whom (Belong) all things; and Allah is
commanded to be of those who bow in Islam to
Allah's Will

4. (Quran 84:16-19)
Allah swear by the afterglow of sunset, and by the night, and by the moon when she is at the full.

sagenaija:
You are mistaken. I was pointing out that you did not answer the questions Shadeyinka asked.

?

As I said before, this criticism is baseless and would come only from one who has never studied the Qur’an with any serious thought, let alone sincere evaluation. I accused you of copy paste bcuz this is exactly how it is documented in evangelical christian websites like David Wood, James White, sam shamoun etc. And i think true2god or truth2man, mavisguy or ifeann posted same criticism years back. Now, the entire Qur’an, according to Muslim beliefs, is a revelation from Allah and hence is given to us, for us to recite. The first word revealed chronologically was iqra’ (Read! or Recite!), and so the rest of revelation follows as a recital for Muslims.

The Fatiha is a summation of the entire Qur’an, and the verses of addressing Allah (“You alone do we worship…”) are sent by Allah to us, to teach us the most proper way of turning to Him and calling on Him in supplication.

One of the secrets of the Qur’an is in its change of “person” with respect to pronouns, a rhetorical device in Arabic called iltifat. As an example, the Fatiha begins by Allah addressing Himself in the third person, “In the name of Allah, All-merciful, All-compassionate. All praise be unto Allah, Lord of all the worlds. The All-merciful, All-compassionate. Master of the Day of Judgment.” Then Allah switches from the third person to second person and states, “You alone do we worship, and You alone do we seek help from.”

In His own revelation, directed towards us so that we may recite it back to Him, Allah is teaching us a very powerful lesson through a mere change of person. As Imam Baydawi explains, this switch reflects the spiritual ascent of the believer, who begins by knowing his Lord through His names and attributes, yet progressively draws nearer to his Lord to the extent that his knowledge of Allah goes from “talking about” to “talking to.” The believer now directly addresses his Lord, as if “He Who was merely known has become seen, and He Who was merely comprehended has become directly experienced, and He Who was [seemingly] absent is now present.” [Baydawi, Anwar al-Tanzil wa Asrar al-Ta’wil]


As for the surahs that begin with the word “Say” (qul), Allah Most High chose this word for those specific surahs alone, again due to the rhetorical impact that this word brings in the context of those particular surat, namely, Jinn, Kafirun, Ikhlas, Falaq, and Nas. There is something unique about these surahs, such that to begin with the word “Say” is most appropriate and impactful. For example, for Surah al-Kafirun alone, Imam Razi lists 43 possible reasons as to why Allah began the first verse with the word “Say.” Some of these reasons are as follows:


The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) was gentle by nature, and was commanded to deal with his people in a gentle manner. So to emphasize the fact that this surah was revealed by Allah, Allah begins by “Say,” highlighting thereby that the intensity and harshness of this surah is not from the person of Muhammad, but rather pure revelation from his Lord.


another example


The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) was surely going to convey this surah to the polytheists of Mecca, regardless of whether Allah began with “Say” or not. Yet this surah deals particularly with the distinction between monotheism and polytheism, and so for Allah to begin with “Say” only emphasizes the gravity and utter crime of their polytheism. This is only a glimpse into the miraculous word choice of the Qur’an. Its language incapacitated the very best of Arab rhetoricians.


There is hadith in Sahih Muslim and Sunan An-Nisai


The Prophet (SAW) said; “Allah the exalted said, ‘I have divided the prayer (Surah Al-Fatihah) into two halves between Me and My servant. A half of it is for Me and a half for My servant, and My servant shall acquire what he asked for.

If he says, ‘All praise and thanks be to Allah, the Lord of existence,' Allah says, ‘My servant has praised Me.’

When the servant says, ‘The Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.’ Allah says, ‘My servant has glorified Me.’

When he says, ‘Master of the Day of Judgment.’ Allah says, ‘My servant has glorified Me.’

When he says, ‘You (alone) we worship, and You (alone) we ask for help.’ Allah says, ‘This is between Me and My servant, and My servant shall acquire what he sought.’

When he says, ‘Guide us to the straight path. The way of those on whom You have granted Your grace, not (the way) of those who earned Your anger, nor of those who went astray.’ Allah says, ‘This is for My servant, and My servant shall acquire what he asked for.’


So Surah Fatiha is the word of God not of Angels or human beings. And this is not about esoteric explanation.

sagenaija:
You are mistaken. I was pointing out that you did not answer the questions Shadeyinka asked.

This is what he said:


He also said:


What do you say to these?

His questions are very simply and the reason I didn't wanna bother myself answering is bcus I know you guys well. This was the reason I gave him logical answer to ponder on when I posted The Lord's prayer. Don't you guys get it?.

However, since you insist on answering, I will. Just give me time to finish with task I am on and I will get back.

Pending that time, what you guys don't understand is that surah fatihah was not the first revelation. And the more reason I refused to engage you guys is because you don't even understand your Bible and you wanna talk about Quran?. That's funny.

Will be right back

Franklyspeakin:
Cos the others no sabi maintain bilateral relationship.

No. Because:

# those are the people that corrupted him


# he was the first president of the so called democracy in Nigeria.


# he was their stooge

Now you can understand why he had bilateral relationship with them.

sagenaija:
MR. Empiree,
You seem not to have answered the question asked.
That portion of the koran clearly show that Allah is not
the one speaking there.
Resorting to some esoteric explanation does not do justice
to the matter.
Christian Prince has shown very clearly these flaws in the koran.
Refusal to face the truth does not remove the truth. It only makes
such a person, in the words of Christian Prince, to be an Abdul.

I am trying to diagnose your problem. You posted several verses and i showed you your "Thy Lord's prayer" and since then you have been at my throat. Now, highlight your question again where you said Allah is not the one speaking?

shadeyinka:
Are you implying that you concur to the fact that other words different from that of Allah exist in the Qur'an?

what other word?. Listen, I am ahead of you in all respect. Dont even think you can outsmart me. I have been in the game for 15yrs.

shadeyinka:
Why do you like using double standards.

When you interpret the Bible, you go with the plain meaning of the texts however whenever you are required to do the same with the Qur'an, you whip up excuses and sentiments.

Don't forget that the genesis of everything was an unfounded claim that "all the words of the Qur'an are direct words of Allah" unlike the Bible. I have given at least five ayas with no rebuttal except manifestation of escapist tendencies.

You are a small evangelist to take on me. I dealt with fellow CHRISTIANs who know more than you 4-5yrs ago right here in this platform. And you expect me to go over everything again?. No.


@bold, the simple reason for this is bcus, the foundation on which CHRISTIANITY stands is very shallow and substandard. This paves ways for possible criticisms.

The foundation I am talking about are the tenets of your religion. No Christians have been able to align the dots and explain obvious differences in your Bible is the reason for distortion. For example, if you put 3 CHRISTIANs next to each other and ask them who is Jesus?. You are gonna get different answers. For this reason, no sane human would take your religion serious except for worldly gain.

shadeyinka:
I am just putting "Allah" in your Qur'an so that you know that it doesn't fit in those texts. In fact, absurd!

You are already added to my list of bigots. I smelled your bigotry from far. Thats why i didnt wanna waste my time with explanation bcuz your mind was already made up before you got here.

Rilwayne001:
Even if we know our right here, we don't have right according to government, unless one wants to get his right on the other side. That's how terrible it is.

nigerian govt is neither dictatorship nor democracy. I called it a "friendly tyrannical system of govt". Also, people are part of the problems. Sometimes govt fixes roads and we have citizens who created artificial potholes in order to sabotage motorists. Again, this is still govt's fault bcus here, once report reaches govt that such thing is happening, police officials deploy officers to the location to monitor 24/7. This can be done two ways, covert or overt operation to catch the criminals. This is what nigeria needs to work on.

Govt can not always prevent crimes but they can definitely prosecute criminals. Therefore, citizens that are messing up newly constructed roads or bridges should be surveilled and jailed. This is not president duty. President can only influence it. This is why you have local govt chairmen/local police to state and federal police. Nigeria does have the laws in the constitution but they dont have them in place for immediate use due to corruption bcuz, a citizen who is found guilty of this is sure will not be persecuted because their are local politicians involved in his crimes behind closed doors. This is why it is difficult for president to pass some laws. Nigerians dont understand this is the reason they always blame president for everything. They dont know about separation of powers. They studied it in schools and colleges but the moment they graduated, they refused to process this thought. They think it is for the book and not reality. However, president may use veto power sometimes but it can be met with severe backlash from Houses of senate and rep if they don't like him.

Rilwayne001:
There's tendency that the pothole would be repaired within a week, but in Nigeria, it'll take at least 2years or maybe when election period is around before they'll have time for it.

That's the difference. Lol

yes, told the guy who posted it on FB that. But truth be said, there is shenanigans everywhere. There are instances local govt do snub or do wuruwuru jobs. Again, the difference is that govt probes officials in charge here if he gets the contract and didn't carry out the task or used inferior quality materials. They are fined, jailed or both here. That's what Nigeria needs to work on.

But here is better than dishonest Nigerian politicians bcuz people here know their rights and they would bring officials in charge to book.

shadeyinka:
I agree with you. The Qur'an is the words of "Allah" not Jehovah.
And that is why:



1. (Quran 113:1)
Allah take refuge with the Lord of the Dawn



2. Quran 6:104)
Now have come to you, from your Lord, proofs
(To open your eyes): If any will see, it will
be for (the good of) his own soul; If any will
be blind, it will be to his own (harm): Allah is not
(here) To watch over your doings.

3. (Quran 27:91)
Allah has been commanded to serve the
Lord of this city, Him Who has sanctified it
and to whom (Belong) all things; and Allah is
commanded to be of those who bow in Islam to
Allah's Will

4. (Quran 84:16-19)
Allah swear by the afterglow of sunset, and by the night, and by the moon when she is at the full.

cry baby. Allah is God. Some of your fellow christian wont even agree with you on "Jehovah" mtcheew

...

.....

shadeyinka:
I maintain not true. I didn't copy this from anywhere. It was one of those things I figured out a long time ago when A Moslem like you told me that unlike the Bible which contains a mixture the words of prophets, sinners and God, the Qur'an contain only the pure words of Allah!

Ahmed Deedat: you remember that South African Muslim apologist was my mentor then. He rubbished Christianity so much that the little faith I had then shook.

However, It was the Qur'an that led me back to Christ!

I was seeking the truth!
I counted the cost!
At the last moment, my eyes were opened.

So, my dear I can chat with you on Islam without copy/paste of internet texts.

This things you said here are emotional outburst to garner emotional support. You didnt say anything. Quran was revealed by Allah to prophet Muhammad(saw) through Jubril(as). Word for word. And you "perfectly" answered your questions when i posted your "Thy Lord's prayer". Quran is word of Allah.

OkunrinOloro:
Hahahah! What a lame and pathetic evasion of the core issue I raised. Why did you neglect the World Health Organisation warning that drinking an animal's waste product is a sure road to infections and diseases? Are enzymes the same thing as waste products? Sigh. I actually expected to find signs of intelligent life in you, but all I discovered is that the same ignorance and wilfull stupidity is alive and well in all MOOslimes.

You are the guinea pig that confirmed what I've always suspected all along

Animal pee A.K.A waste products are also enzymes! Classic garbage!

[

WHO that changes policies when it suit them?. The one that gave you vaccines this years and by the following years it says vaccines cause flu. I never took WHO serious beyond primary School.

And yes, there are people who lick private parts and claim health benefits are derived from it. Go and research before posting nonsense. Not long ago researchers said licking your partner's private area reduces cancer

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.popdust.com/studies-show-that-eating-pussy-prevents-cancer-1892261093.amp.html

And besides, camel urine prescription was specific to ailment at the time. Do all Muslims drink camel urine in your world, Mr bigot?. Go on YouTube and you see this white girls drink camel urine

true2god:
This is very lame and arrogant excuse. There is no any language, in this modern era, that can never be translated to another language. If this is the official policy of Islam with respect to the Arabic quran then the Arabs should not tell us that Islam is a religion for all. Over 80% of muslims cannot speak Arabic and so, by your own submission, Muslims must learn Arabic in order to understand the quran. This is purely brainwashing and mental slavery! The truth is that the quran, if translated to Yoruba language, will make no sense to any Yoruba man since there will be no Yoruba hadith or Yoruba seerah to clear up the confusions and inconsistencies in the quran.

you are a known bigot. I didn't say Arabic in itself can not be translated. I said Quran can not be translated. Quran is the word of Allah. You can not translate Allah's word. You can only explain it. The moment you translate from arabic Quran it loses the ingredients and authenticity. That's why, if you read English quran or other language, your are only reading the "translations of the meaning".

This is why we can not pray daily salat in language other than language of The Quran. And because Quran is in Arabic does not mean all Arabs understood it. No. You can not translate God's words. You may only explain the meanings. But the translated meanings are sufficient for us to get things done.

shadeyinka:
Escapism!

Have your way, the TRUTH is invariant irrespective of how we refuse to acknowledge it.

Have a nice day!

Point of Correction:
I almost recited the sahada in my 200L in my search of the truth. I know Islam more than you think

Oh really?. I have heard enough of this. You know Islam now than I do but backtracked?. If you know Islam more than I do you would be Muslim by now. Your argument is not unique at all. We will keep going on rollercoaster about this is the reason I don't even wanna engage you. I know you have it all copied from those evangelical Christians. That's why I am simply not interested in this back and forth.

For record, Quran was revealed to Nabi Muhammad through Jibril(as).

OkunrinOloro:
Very true. Animal products and enzymes find their way into some pharmaceutical products. But only after they have been subjected to rigorous and industry standard testing. It is never done on the authority of an ignorant illiterate who doesn't know any better. And it is very clear that science has laid bare the folly of ingesting an animal's waste products:

Nothing else to say. You have confirmed camel urine might be present in pharmaceutical products. It is the same way some of you lick one another private parts and swallow semen or leaking dogs. As disgusting as drinking camel urine is to you is the same way licking dog or licking private part is disgusting to some. Case closed.

shadeyinka:
Unfortunately, if you know the Qur'an a little bit beyond what you are presenting, whenever the almighty Allah want to teach Something in the Qur'an, he would use the words "Say!"

Eg.

Quran 112:1 Say: He is Allah, the One!

In fact there are several verses if not hundreds of verses where Allah used "say.....". And the best argument you could find is that Allah was teaching dua!

In the Lord's prayer that you quoted, even Jesus said "when you pray, say Our Father heaven...!" Conveniently, you removed the words "say" from your quotation so that the two verses will look similar. Is that not deception?

Let me give you other examples so that you can use the same rule

1. (Quran 113:1)
I take refuge with the Lord of the Dawn

2. Quran 6:104)
Now have come to you, from your Lord, proofs
(To open your eyes): If any will see, it will
be for (the good of) his own soul; If any will
be blind, it will be to his own (harm): I am not
(here) To watch over your doings.

3. (Quran 27:91)
For me, I have been commanded to serve the
Lord of this city, Him Who has sanctified it
and to whom (Belong) all things; and I am
commanded to be of those who bow in Islam to
Allah's Will

4. (Quran 84:16-19)
I swear by the afterglow of sunset, and by the night, and by the moon when she is at the full.


Was Allah also teaching dua in the four ayas above?

So you see that it is Muslims who change the plain words of Allah. The Qur'an is plain and simple to understand!

as I said before, you have your questions answered by yourself. Thanks for saving me time. I need not waste my precious time with you. We can keep going on and on. It is never gonna end. And thanks for copy/paste. Everything you brought up isn't new. David Wood and Co did worst.

In the Lord's prayer you said Jesus was teaching his people Dua(prayers). So that answered you. Anything else?

OkunrinOloro:
The universal remedy prescribed by a certain "prophet"

your ignorance knows no boundaries. Do you have idea what's inside those pills you take?. Some of them have animal products or enzymes in them. Educate yourself, buddy and stop irrational hatred.

shadeyinka:
Since you are so impatient:


Sura1:1-7 who was speaking here?
vs2. Who is the one ascribing praise to Allah? Mohammed, Jubril or one of the Caliphs

vs5. Who is the one worshiping Allah here?

vs6. I believe only a mortal or a jinn need fear the punishment that comes from going astray or what do you think? Is the Almighty Allah afraid of doing wrong to Himself?

vs6. Since God cannot go on a wrong path, who does this aya refer to?

vs7. Who is the THOU in ayat7?
Or the Thee an Thine in vs5

In case you need a jog

That's all?. I thought you have something very serious to come up with. Therefore, instead of endless argument with you over this, knowing too well you may never concur, i rather give you analogy. If you understand this i have nothing to explain. It is said that Jesus taught his disciples "Thy Lord's Prayer"




'Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.'"





So you have example. I am not making comparison. Quran is way beyond this similarity. I am just giving you answer indirectly. If you answer correctly, you have your questions answered by yourself. Fair enough?

shadeyinka:
You'll need to address the above except you agree then I'll give the the scripture. This is important so that the goalpost wouldn't change in the midst of play!

I guess you have nothing to post. Have a good day