₦airaland Forum

Jamo90:
Oh Yes I know. Some Alfas have probably heard about it and don't want to get involved because they are probably afraid of reprisal attacks, just like most.yg said.

What's your specialty? Let's learn from you Sir.

Yes, some do fear of reprisal attacks, that if enemies of their victims can't get them they go after their children.

But they failed to realize that if they are steadfast, either jinn or human possession, sihr or magic are peanuts PROVIDED their victims are in the right.

Muslims don't have to go to alawo to have their problems solved

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHuJW7vnwGE

Power Of Tongue


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I59IDJTv0eQ

vaxx:
You ask who is oni. Oni is the arole of oduduwa (He symbolised oduduwa on earth, his fore father were the Oracle eye of oduduwa during oduduwa reign)

You dont get it. Remember we all learned this in school. What you are saying is not new to me. But I am asking you for documented reference like revealed Holy Book to Oduduwa etc. I have come to realization that this story dont have authenticity. But look at what God says in the Quran about first creation with proof


And (remember) when your Lord said to the angels: "Verily, I am going to place (mankind) generations after generations on earth." They said: "Will You place therein those who will make mischief therein and shed blood, - while we glorify You with praises and thanks (Exalted be You above all that they associate with You as partners) and sanctify You." He (Allah) said: "I know that which you do not know." [2:30]


See how i cited sacred reference. Where is yours to prove Oduduwa appointed Oni as "arole" on earth?. Are you even saying Oduduwa is God or what?. When did Oduduwa come to existence?

Islam was documented after the demise of Muhammad (i.e)the hadith which is roughly 200 years....while quran itself was documented within the 23 years of Muhammad ministry. Abu bakr compiled them. Being documented does not make it true. It just show the progress of civilization in the Arab word. Arabs have developed a well writing system by then. Yoruba did not have one as at that time but have a robust system that can be trust. Most babalawo learn very hard by memorization and at the same time from the use of symbols and signs.it is well praticed among them till date.

See the other thread where i quoted you?. You should read where the brother said there should have been documented evidence of yoruba religion. We learned about all these things you are saying when we were young. Out of respect for your belief, i wont deny you but, yoruba claims are not substantiated. Interestingly, there is one Alfa who said in his lecture that your Odu Ifa pointed to advent of islamic prophet, just like we see references of prophet Muhammad(saw) in Torah, Gospel, Hindu Book and other religious literature. Thats how we convince them to come to islam. But since you have no written evidence of yoruba religion but only rely on oral tradition, Alfa said your Odu Ifa pointed to Muhammad(saw) according to one of your Alawo. Not long after that, babalawo embraced islam.

He authorised it despite not having the knowledge. I am sure you are not aware of many quran translations error. Go do the findings.

You made allegation and you must provide evidence. I have been studying Quran for far too long.

I lol. I am not a novice.... They are called orisha in Yoruba. Orisha means (ori-ti -a-sha ) The head we specifically selected . They are human like me and you. Nothing make them demi. Except you bro and it is due to ignorance. Go thru my thread. I have written many stuff on this . Oni is not defended but appreciated. I have explain the rationality behind his motive for giving such sophistry. And this idea is not peculiar to him too as it is found in Islam as well

Again, i am not denying they are human being. But you have made them object of worship, period. We dont accept that. It doesnt matter how you try to pain it. Yoruba have made them deities besides God. This is contrary to our fundamental belief. So islam and yoruba religion are opposite. Oni can not deceptively merge islam and yoruba religion. ko se se (not possible)

I ask you for an evidence, didn't I? Let's see. I see you have been trainned to accept motor mechanic as the same as mechanic engineering ....

I directed you to a thread i created. I am sure you didnt read. There are things to learn from there. And i am sure you can find materials online to learn from. Plus bunch of lectures of Sheikh Adam(ra) you can learn from.

I mean shiruku and ibaadah. What is the diffrence between this act. When you answer it. draw the line of reasoning by yourself. I don't feel the urge to expose the paganism nature of islam myself.i want you to do that.

Oh, you spelt it wrong. It is called Shirk(associating partners with One God) which you are involved in and all those Oba and all forms of ebo you do in ile yoruba. One example is you said oduduwa sent Oni to be his arole on earth. So who is Oduduwa and where is he?. Did Oduduwa create the world?. Is Oduduwa human being like you and I?. Ibadah means worship. Act of worship was specifically described in islam which you see muslims do everyday. If you do contrary to that is called Shirk that you asked me to differentiate from Ibadah.

You rased similar veiw upward, oni puporse is to foster unity among his subject while advocating for isese.

This is the point. Isese in yorubaland is ebo(shirk). We will never compromise. You need to leave isese. There is nothing like that. Did you watch Oba Rasheed who refuted Oni on isese?. But when it comes to human and current affairs, we can work together regardless of our religious affiliation for the good of our community to live in peace and harmony with ourselves. But when it comes to Ibadah(worship), we will never agree. We will never worship together. This is what i meant when i said "to you is your religion and to us is our religion"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHuJW7vnwGE

I have repeated it many times that oni is not an historian nor a scholar.. oni purpose is to influence majority decision and is doing that perfectly well. If you want to know how well about this history. Go visit a library or better still consult an historian not oni.

Lol, you admitted Oni is not historian nor a scholar, therefore, he should be the one to visit library. If he was good enough, he should have contacted muslim scholars in Yorubaland before he came out in public to make such ridiculous about islamic history.

vaxx:
it is not what Islam says, it is about what oni says and the rational behind it. Oni is not a scholar just like king fahd isn't one.

smh. Who is On I next to Islam?. Islam was documented. You should have provided written evidence like revealed holy book well known to Yoruba people. And why only this current Oni making this statements?. Did former Oni made similar claim?. As you can see, many people were shocked to hear his utterances because no Oni of Ife never made such claims.

i am saying one of the most popular Qurans in print has King Fahd authorization. For example, The king fahd edition was printed in Medina in 1405 Hijri (1984-1985) with millions of copies distributed throughout the world.

It carries the inscription: “A gift from the Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques King Fahd Ibn Abdul Aziz for the spreading of Allah’s Word.” confirm my source.

what's this about?. He only printed and distributed copies. So?.

I am a proud pagan

I see. That's why you trying hard to defend your Oni. You better leave that religion. Yoruba people were the ones who distorted Islam in Yorubaland. All those things you called odua, obatala, oranmiyan were probably righteous men that you people raised their level to demigods. Or they were woods made by men and laid claim of deities to them.

;ok let see who is spewing nonsense. Provide me a copy of his work that had established stamp from al hazar university or simply provide me one of his work that can be found in unilorin religious department(he is from ilorin that should not be too far ). I just challenge it. None of his work can be study in any academic discipline. His work belongs to omo Ile kewu category or better still marikasi.

You are speaking within your level of thinking faculty. You obviously don't know sheikh Adam

i am giving you the plural form of shirk(idolatry) A typo error there.
And i want you to analysed it from worshiped. What i want you to cover is simply the act..

you need to explain yourself better good I'm not quite understanding you here.

it is the duty of oni to promote peace while establishing the importance of Yoruba ancestral worship. It is your duty to know the truth if you so wish.
Even in islam, when there is conflict between two individual. They are restrictions to setttle the conflict as a third party for example, you can't explain in details where both of them attack each other negatively to avoild futher crisis. Your mission is to promote peace even if some fact will be covered to do so.

peace, unity, tolerance are one thing on the side. Religion it's another thing on the side. Oni is mixing religions on false premises and faulty historical links. Mixing religions is not about peace. I'm good short clip that went viral, he didn't say anything about peace. He is promoting unification of religion on false historical links

vaxx:
if you need a first hand evidence.......go straight to ife....it is not hidden. ...


Documenting it does not solidify it.

no fossil and scientific evidence in ile-ife

AlBaqir:
# First, according to scientific research, Yoruba, ibo emanated from eastern part of Africa. But when exactly is what is not clear. Of course that region is believed to have been where origin of man begun. Likewise, there is a possibility that was where "Yoruba religion" also came from. Naturally man migrates with his ideas and beliefs.

# Second, Yoruba claimed that ile ife is the "source" of mankind. Unfortunately there is no single fossil record to that effect. What Ife boast of is "òpá oranmiya" which they believe is brought by Oduduwa. According to them, the òpá when its age was estimated dated millions of years
That is yet to be recorded in any world known scientific research record. Besides, what is the reality of Oduduwa, Orunmila, obatala etc. Their reality or fossil record will help determine and estimated their arrival record to that region.

Interestingly, every tribe, community etc has her own story, folklore etc pertaining to the creation of the world. For now, the only standard verification we have is scientific method via fossil records.


Third, the Oduduwa, Obatala, Orunmila etc were probably human beings who were unique in one way or the other. And of course, after their death, they were probably immortalized and made demideities over the time.

From Ibrahim to Musa to Dawud to Sulayman to E'esa etc, there was 1000s of years, we expect stories to have been corrupt. The fact that there was no written record. You only keep record from mouth to ears stories. Thats why biblical stories different from Quranic account in many areas. And Quran style is narratives rather than detailed stories. In short history books are filled with lies. Imagine a community (like Yoruba) with no concrete record?!


Have you not heard that Queen Balqees kingdom was in Ijebu? It is believed that was from where ifrit (or whatever the name of that Jinn was) brought her throne within twinkling of an eye. It could be true and it could be false. Tracing historical location has always been the most problematic research today. New land and water formed over the years making a once upon a time "small world" expands. Earthquake, landslide etc enveloped and buried other historical locations making it almost non-existent in history.

Really our best bet today is scientific method and approach to verify theories and claims.

I am sorry I have to quote you in this section, vaxx. Maybe you can read some materials here

vaxx:
if you need a first hand evidence.......go straight to ife....it is not hidden. ...


Documenting it does not solidify it.

AlBaqir:
# First, according to scientific research, Yoruba, ibo emanated from eastern part of Africa. But when exactly is what is not clear. Of course that region is believed to have been where origin of man begun. Likewise, there is a possibility that was where "Yoruba religion" also came from. Naturally man migrates with his ideas and beliefs.

I don't think Igbo would agree with this

# Second, Yoruba claimed that ile ife is the "source" of mankind. Unfortunately there is no single fossil record to that effect. What Ife boast of is "òpá oranmiya" which they believe is brought by Oduduwa. According to them, the òpá when its age was estimated dated millions of years
That is yet to be recorded in any world known scientific research record. Besides, what is the reality of Oduduwa, Orunmila, obatala etc. Their reality or fossil record will help determine and estimated their arrival record to that region.

Honestly, i was never proud of this unconfirmed historical account. Never for once talked about it outside.

Interestingly, every tribe, community etc has her own story, folklore etc pertaining to the creation of the world. For now, the only standard verification we have is scientific method via fossil records.

Yoruba was bad at keeping record.

Third, the Oduduwa, Obatala, Orunmila etc were probably human beings who were unique in one way or the other. And of course, after their death, they were probably immortalized and made demideities over the time.

possible. We have no choice but to use Islamic standards to rectify this mess.

Have you not heard that Queen Balqees kingdom was in Ijebu? It is believed that was from where ifrit (or whatever the name of that Jinn was) brought her throne within twinkling of an eye. It could be true and it could be false. Tracing historical location has always been the most problematic research today. New land and water formed over the years making a once upon a time "small world" expands. Earthquake, landslide etc enveloped and buried other historical locations making it almost non-existent in history.

Really our best bet today is scientific method and approach to verify theories and claims.

lol, yes. At Oke ERI, ijebu. Although where she died didn't really matter. It could be possible she didn't die in the Middle East territory just because she belonged there. Some believe the tomb is not hers but just another pious person.

AlBaqir:
Too much insults. Lack of intellectual argument. I think it's high time for the Yoruba Muslims (especially scholars) to put down Yoruba claims in written record, research on them and refute. Muslims we see things too often with the eyes of "Quran and hadith". Unfortunately none of them is history or scientific book.

This would be responsibility of Yoruba altogether. Problem is, Yoruba tradition rarely made reference to Islam and all their evidences were only base on oral tradition. Written traditions could only be found in small cities like ijebu-ode etc but that's now cultural than Yoruba religion. Some Alfas tried due to Ayah of Quran which says Allah sent prophets to every nation. Which means they explored Yoruba Odu ifa, they found traces of our Prophet (saw) therein just as we found evidence of him(saw) in Tawrah, Injil and Hindu book. Oni however should have made a little effort to reach out to Muslim scholars before making such unguarded statement on national TV. I am sure there are people like Baba Elebuibon who would disagree with Oni because what his claimed was never heard of. He may be conspiracy as well. Meaning, there may be people trying to promote orisha religion.

vaxx:
No where from that video you posted oni ever talk against islam or Christianity, he rather solidify it by making it look like indigenous religious. Which i earlier agree that it is sophistry. The idea is to spread unity and nnot division. It is part of his duty to unify his subjects regardless of religious background.

bro, why is it difficult for you to understand my point?. Religious differences are separate from tolerance. What your are saying is to combine religions is what you defined as "tolerance". That's not the definition of tolerance in Islam. You practice your religion and I practice mine. But when it comes to activities that binds is as human we can work together. Quran reaches us "to you is your religion, to us is our religion"

check the front page of your Quran translation and read the acknowledgement notice or better still check the publication company of your quran.

I don't know what you talking about. You can as well keep it simple by posting screenshot

No any academic decipline will ever have a copy of adam ilori in its chamber as a reference backup

what's your religion?

..in an academic cycle adam ilori is not a schloar. I have read his opinion on how islam enter yoruba land. It is basically faulty.and rooted in false assumption.

you are too young to come up with this nonsense. From your responses does that you agree with Oni which means that, just as Oni doesn't know what he was saying, you too have no idea what you are saying. Sheikh Adam Abdullah Al-ilory was a scholar. You can't challenge that.
https://www.nairaland.com/2042359/shaykh-adam-abdullah-al-ilory

So you don't even know Islam is the monotheistic political version of Arab paganism? What is shukro, what is ibaadah? When you get this . analysed it

I guess you wanna teach me something?. Well, shukroh(Thanks). Ibadaah(worship).

Yes isese is Yoruba mythology and it is totally diffrence from arab myth as well.

Then Oni should keep his mythological story to Yoruba religion. Islam has nothing to do with it.

So because muhammed said 1240000 prophet existed and were sent across all nation you believe it withhout any external evidence. Welldone . What if shango is a prophet? Or do you have evidence to rebuked it. Perhapbs you have hadith to rebuked it.

Yoruba only have oral traditions. But we have oral and written. So 124k sent was documented. Yoruba can not prove their deities.

Saheed Shittu replied Oni Of Ife

This gotta be some funny stuff


Oni deserves it

I was hearing "ogun oshoshi" first time by kabiyesi


Is like christian guy who debated Mallam Yusuf Adepoju. He said Quran ordered muslims to build church in his yoruba language he said Quran so pe ke ko shoshi. Mallam Yusuf asked for reference and he said sura "Ko shoshi" He was referring to Surah Qasas


Orisirisi

vaxx:
You don't get the comparative ...i am telling you that both line of thought is to establish solidarity among member of their community......even politician use this techniques.

He is not an oba, he is oni (arole oduduwa).oni is promoting tolerance of isese while advocating and pushing the front line of oduduwa which he represent as arole. And he is doing it in a diplomatic means rather than scholarly aproach.

listen, this is not tolerance. If he wanted to preach tolerance, that's a different subject. You don't preach tolerance by making up history that was not there. Islam has nothing to do with obatala, oduduwa etc. Those are Yorubaland mythology. Oni preached religion not tolerance.

King fahd abudulasis of blessed memory has authotized many quran translation which many scholars agree is ambiguous. Yet the position of fahd was honoured despite not being a scholar because thier position is to influence people decision . So if you want to learn history or scholarly information ...meet the right people for that.

can you provide reference for this?.

Sheikh adam will better face islamic scholar or simply a student of islamic studies rather than engaging a monarchy. Even alfa agaba (taju adabi) will not be be able to face the nitty gritty discussion of islamic studies discussed in classrom today.

sheikh Adam already talked about history of Islam in Yorubaland and Nigeria general. He made no significant reference to what Oni said.

Religion come from the latin word relegare(meaning to bind ) which means adam religion is basically binding by submitting to the will of allah. So if you say adam religion was islam, then you MUST say he was the first Muslim AFTER he was the first pagan and the first Jew, and the first Christian because the Muslim religion came AFTER pagan , Jewish and Christian faiths.

you just sounded like Oni. You confused yourself. Submmision means Islam. Very simple. But to worship something else is not submmision which means to ébó as they do it in Yorubaland and anywhere is it done is opposite of what Adam believed.

Therefore, the so called "ìsésé" is nothing but Yoruba mythology. Yoruba might had Islam but they distorted the religion of their prophet. Reason for this is because Quran says that God sent prophets and messanger to every nation on Earth but their messages were distorted just like Christianity until prophet muhammad(saw) was sent to rectify them.

^^^

That means secular laws that you clamour for are tantamount to setting partner with God, right?

AlBaqir:
Lets put aside the compound rubbish of Ooni.

Yoruba as a race, where did we originated? There is absolutely no scientific evidence for the claim that it was in Ife. What is proven so far is that human origin starts in East Africa. Could be where Yoruba emanate?


The reason why I put this forth is that possibility of Ifa to have been in existence for long is high. And there is a chapter in it which the readers used to confirm that it talks about the coming of E'esa (Jawesun) and later the holy Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him and his purified household.

Yoruba religion is not totally idolatry. I am of the believe that it was later polluted just like other religion. Therefore, there is a possibility that Yoruba (or wherever we emanated from) had their sent Prophet(s).

Today, you can still feel part of Tawheed in their religion. Even Messengerhood. And of course day of judgment. And it encourage good deeds etc.

Yea, talking about ifa, it did speak about coming of Nabi Muhammad (saw). But all these oduduwa, obatala etc have compromised their religion.

I don't know where they got all that from. I believe those things were images made of woods later raised to level of deities.

Now, Yoruba religion, even though it was tawhid and later corrupted, it is badly corrupted to the point of no return. The best position is to eradicate it and only stick to fair cultural aspect like cultural dances, Aló apamó atí apagbe etc. No festivals like Oro, Osun, egungun, agemo, Eyò etc all these are Yoruba religions and we condemn these.

Interestingly, I just watched a newly released video by other oba Rasheed of Iwo few mins ago. He's calling all oba to turn away from ébó/égbé. He said because Obas are involved in these things was the reason for rituals activities and kidnappers along political line.

AlBaqir:
His questions are not philosophical. And his replies are not convincing. He talks more with emotion.

His message, from my understanding, was to create awareness. He wanted prominent Muslim scholars in Yorubaland to refute the king

JeromeBlack:
If Islam has nothing to do with Yoruba religion, why then are you a Muslim?

Your religion of Islam despises your Yoruba culture.

there is difference between culture and religion. Islam doesn't despise culture unless it's in conflict with Islam. All these festivals, Eyò, Egungun, Osun, Agemo, Oro etc are not cultural practices but religions. Therefore they are forbidden in Islam. But cultural dances like we used to do at school, cultural improvement of community, language, Ewi, Aló apamó atí apagbe etc are cultural things that are allowed.



Refutation Of King Adeyeye Enitan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24TjtkUhxK8

vaxx:
oni ogunwusi is not a trainned historian or a scholar. I will rather say he is just good at sophistry because his position demands that for peace to prevail among the muslim , Christian and traditionalist. Some youruba suffi muslim also use this line of thought to accomodate all other religion veiws.


But let me dance along with your reasons....

What is prophet adam religion?

Yoruba Sufi Muslims use the line of thought to accommodate all religions views along cultural and tolerance scope. Not mix of religion. There is difference. Islam doesn't forbid muslims from engaging other religions in anything except worship. This Oba is promoting worship or mix of worship by citing false historical record. Therefore he must be refuted.

If Sheikh Adam Abdullah Al-ilory (ra) was alive today, he would shut his mouth.

Adam's religion was (submmision to God) Islam




Refutation Of King Adeyeye Enitan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24TjtkUhxK8

Refutation Of King Adeyeye Enitan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24TjtkUhxK8

Refutation Of King Adeyeye Enitan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24TjtkUhxK8

Refutation Of King Adeyeye Enitan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24TjtkUhxK8

AlBaqir:
# Yeah I agree with you. Although their filthy excuses that he was not a law-bringer prophet doesn't count. However, that does not nullify their muslim identity as kufr caller wanted the gullible to believe.

yes, one of them told me @bold a while back on this platform. What do they mean by that?. If he was not Law bringer who else was?.

I'm not in position to make kufr declaration of them. But their belief that another prophet came after him(saw) was too heavy. Could lead to trash talk like king Adeyeye Enitan. He could say it was obatala that came after nabi(saw)

Yoruba muslims and Christians must take note of this fake king, especially muslims. Islam has nothing to do with Yoruba religion.

If sheikh Adam Abdullah Al-ilory (ra) here today, he would have refuted his nonesense. Sheikh Habeeb Al-ilory should respond to this trash


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjFuRQhb48k


Read video discriptions. Spread this video and let your Muslim family and friends know this king is a liar.

Yoruba muslims and Christians must take note of this fake king, especially muslims. Islam has nothing to do with Yoruba religion.

If sheikh Adam Abdullah Al-ilory (ra) here today, he would have refuted his nonesense. Sheikh Habeeb Al-ilory should respond to this trash


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjFuRQhb48k


Read video discriptions

...

Yoruba muslims and Christians must take not of this fake king, especially muslims. Islam has nothing to do with Yoruba religion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjFuRQhb48k


Read video discriptions

Yoruba muslims and Christians must take not of this fake king, especially muslims. Islam has nothing to do with Yoruba religion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjFuRQhb48k


Read video discriptions

spyder880:
We're always determined to give homes a classy look.

Front yard looks identical like yours in Enugun

Wow, how did I miss this. It is been a while I vacated property section. Time to return.

You started in May and by October you don do. A usual, oga Spyder, kudos

Hummm this house, still remember it

But I can't get over that house in PH I think

^^^

But I believe that section of Ahmadiya that believes there is prophet AFTER nabi(saw) needs strong condemnation.

So far, in my opinion, I have identified three different aqeeda amongst Ahmadiya:


*** those who believe Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was manifestation of return of Jesus.



*** those who believe Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was Imam Mahdi (as)



**** those who believe he was the prophet after Nabi Muhammad (saw)


First and second points are not major detrimental to religion because many crazy people have claimed to be Mahdi anyways.

But the last point is out of it. They need to be rebuked