₦airaland Forum

Joagbaje:
I don't really want to repeat myself over . Tithing is a spiritual principle. The structure under the law was strictly for the Jews . The tithes we give today is not based on levitical order. The process or structure is not the issue.

For example the reason Abel offered first fruits  was different from the reason Israel offered first fruits . The way Abraham gave tithes was different from the structure under the law. So the issue is not th process but the principle . So if you want to compare church tithing with levitical ,it doesn't make sense.

OK Joagbaje, let us see who is lying between me and you.

Did you not write the above? Does the above not say that "tithing" today is based on Abraham and not the law or Levitical order  (I can already see you holding to the word "structure" for lifeline, I'm waiting). Does that not mean that tithing is now voluntary as with Abraham and not compulsory as with the law and the Levitical order?

Has Oyakhilome not taught that those not tithing are robbing God? Does that not mean that "tithing" is compulsory?

So we then add the further twisting - that Jesus validated tithing in Matthew 23 - and we arrive at the question below:

Which type of tithing did Jesus validate: Joagbaje's ("spiritual principle" and Abram) or Oyakhilome's ("robbing God" and law/Levitical order)?

wesley80:
^^^ And how many of those that were predicting that decades ago foresaw the death of Gadaffi a year b4 the start of the Arab spring, The death of Michael jackson, The pushing forward of Nigerias election 3times, Nigerias last gasp qualification for the world cup and our subsequent crashing out in good detail, Nigerias failure to qualify for the Nations cup and a specific time in a match a definite goal opportunity would be flunked? Name one of them.

Since you are now getting sarcastic - "decades ago" - I think I am better off to leave you to your view of TB Joshua. It may be that you are the/like the fellow who equated him with God. That is the problem of all of you, not mine.

^^ Oh that was being predicted by many, well over a year ago.

Even though I have not studied TB Joshua well enough, I can tell you the following.

That above there is not a prophecy. Anyone who follows current affairs a little could have written that word for word and even much much better (and I'm not even saying the 'calculation' is true/correct; it is more just a 'potential' for world war).

Second, notice the words "if God doesn't intervene"! That is simply an escape clause if the prediction (ok or "prophecy" fails.

Sorry, that is how I see it.

Ah, dayua!

^^^ You see am? Nonsense!

Serious things dey go on all over the place then some people are plugging some interpreted-to-fit "prophecy" about football.

For the fun of it, I have now added a poll.

Many people say they do not believe in the idea of God as "Trinity". However, quite often when some of them make a few posts it seems that they are supporting that which they deny. I suggest that (leaving aside the "intellectual shenanigans" at Nicea) there is really a simple test for a person to know and or determine whether or not s/he believes that God is "Trinity".   

It consists in the answers that one honestly gives to just FOUR questions.

1. Do you believe that God is ONE?

2. Do you believe that The Father is God?

3. Do you believe that Jesus Christ is God?

4. Do you believe that the Holy Spirit is God?

If one's answer to any of the above is NO ---- then one does not believe in God as Trinity.

On the other hand if one's answer to each of the four questions is YES, then one is indeed a believer in God as Trinity.   

@image123

Well done. One interesting thing I notice about frosbel's posts is that he actually believes in the most fundamental tenets of the Trinity doctrine i.e.:

- (a) The Father is God; (b) Jesus is God; and (c) The Holy Spirit is God; AND
- that God is One

What he had (has?) not realised is that anybody who believes the above already believes in the Trinity at least in one form or another.

Still the hands of Esau and the voice of Jacob.

Zikkyy:
. . . . .  The practice today varies as well. The tithe paid by Snowwy can only be defined by Snowwy, it has nothing to do with what Christ recommended. . . . . .

Now this is an interesting point; see the confusion:

- Joagbaje says tithing today is based on Abraham ("spiritual principle"; that means it is not compulsory. 

- Oyakhilome says those not tithing are robbing God; that means it IS compulsory! 

- Snowwy says Jesus made tithing valid; is it the compulsory one or the non-compulsory one?

How can Jesus be "God" and The Father be "God" ------- at the same time?

How can Jesus be "God" and The Father be "God" ------- at the same time?

I have been screaming that Jesus IS God. I have been defending the Trinity doctrine.

The question is for those who do not believe in the Trinity doctrine to explain how Jesus can be "God" and The Father "God" at the same time ---------- before we even add the Holy Spirit into the mix.

How can Jesus be "God" and The Father also be "God" at the same time?

Of course Jesus called Himself God. 

Rev 1:8

"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,"  says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

See also https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-497445.64.html#msg6785867

^^^ The confusion in part arises from a lack of understanding or misunderstanding of the doctrine of the Trinity.

The Bible says (a) the Father is God; (b) Jesus is God; and (c) the Holy Spirit is God.

That already tells us that there is something to grapple with beyond normal human perception.

From a purely intellectual (rather than a spiritual) perspective, a proper understanding of the concept of consubstantiality can be of considerable help.

By the way, the Trinity doctrine is indeed a catholic doctrine but not simply a Roman Catholic doctrine. To say it is a c[/i]atholic doctrine simply means it is a doctrine of the [i]universal church. Check the following link to see how far back the Trinity doctrine had been recognised in one form or another waaaay before the Roman Catholic Church. https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-497445.64.html#msg7181702

goshen

'ghost' is simply in this context a very old English word for 'spirit'; so you are right about their usage for the same thing. (Edited for clarity: modern usage is better as Holy Spirit; but with proper understanding there is nothing wrong with saying Holy Ghost) 

There are many things people do not understand and which cause confusion: take e.g. the word "conversation" used in some older Bible translations (in e.g. Phillipians 1:27) --- a misinformed person would think it means "speech" when it was really being used to denote "conduct" based on old usage.

Another example: if I say "John was lawfully abroad", what do you think I mean.

Actually, not an original; rather from: the hymn Firmly I believe and truly sung below to the tune 'Shipston' (one of "fat Ralph's".


[flash=400,300]http://youtube.com/v/ESKkgR16VZc[/flash]


EDIT: Just check out the last verse! 

Adoration aye be given
With and through th'angelic host
To the God of earth and heaven
Father, Son and Holy Ghost

^^^Or, God is Three and God is One. 

goshen360:
^^^ Oh yea, you just reminded me. Am sorry, I over-spoke the truth. Just curious brother on the post, maybe you have an answer. Is this the true gospel of Jesus Christ?

I was not rebuking you! I was being ironic!

Some people have said in the past that no criticism should be made of the wolves in the video* because of "touch not mine anointed".

*Yes the video has passed through the forum a number of times.

"Touch not mine anointed and do my prophets no harm" !

@ tbaba1234

I suppose copies of the book are online already but you really should be careful about copyright issues.

Link http://kondori./2011/01/23/man-in-the-red-underpants/

or PDF version of book http://d1.islamhouse.com/data/en/ih_books/single/en_the_man_in_the_red_underpants.pdf

Oh and of course the RoR has also stated that those not paying tithes are robbing God!

What about civil servants who get given extra money beyond their salary (let's not even say bribe) by people going to their offices for various services - should they also pay tithes on those gifts?

Regarding the content of RoR:

Obviously many of the entries will be useful, helpful and maybe even biblical.

On the other hand, RoR gave us such gems as:

1. Nowhere in the New Testament are we told to obey God!
2. Christians should not pray to or through Jesus Christ!
3. You are God!
4. You are Christ!
5. Jesus' (The Lord's) prayer is not for mature Christians!

Zikkyy:
Bros, this na simple question. i go score 100/100 for this one you know oyaks is a 'god' just like our man joagbaje & others. 'robbing God' (by withholding oyaks 10%) is simply denying oga oyaks of his 'godly' egunje As a 'Don' sorry 'god' the 10% is simply protection money compensation for his effort on the pulpit how you expect the man to 'chop', ehn or even pay his goons sorry, i meant junior 'gods' boys, like joagbaje & co

Edit: e be like i don write 'out of point' for this question

Nna bros, I go try not to be stingy with the marks ----- so I go award you 160/100. I tink dat one dey fair enough!

^^ I agree completely that the better focus on this thread is the kind of gullibility that makes people do what we see in that video (assuming it isn't staged). That is why this Religion section is disappointing in the particular respect of frequent rants against "religion" or against Christianity specifically.

Is it not interesting that the person who started the thread is a Christian and is pointing out the daftness or even evil that some are perpetrating in the name of "religion" or in the name of Christianity?

Question to anyone interested:

Why has religion done so much good in the world and for humanity?

^^ I pray that your eyes open further and that the truths about the prosperity "gospel" are revealed to you. 

Government is evil: it is in its genes; it oppresses people; it causes wars; it breeds corruption etc etc

Politics is evil: it is in its genes; it breeds corrupt people; it encourages people into diabolical and dark things; it encourages corruption etc etc

Petrol is evil: it is in its genes; it causes fires and kills; it causes people to be corrupt; it causes people to do bunkering; it causes people to cheat on subsidies etc etc

The car is evil: it is in its genes; it causes accidents; it causes people to die etc etc etce etc


Of course, wise people would catch the drift. 

Listen to the Bible:

"The heart of man is evil and desperately wicked"

"Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God".

Simples

Yes it is in the genes; in the genes of human beings ----------- until they are truly regenerated by the Holy Spirit of God and become born again; until they become true new creations spiritually.