₦airaland Forum

kats, its ok.
but there are no gospel-truths in history anyways. history is just storytelling and everybody has their own version. so what's ur version of oduduwa and what was his role in ife? lemme hear ur story.

chymax, or wotever the fvck is ur name, where the fck in my post did i say edo history started with the kpotokis? i can see u are one of the deluded idi0ts who enjoy spouting rubbish, don't worry u will soon meet ur kind dat like "theorizing" about shyte they know nothing about on this thread, u can have fun with them, u hear? ozuo.

kats, for an enlightened person, u ought not to take my every word literally. why take the 'alpha' literally and ignore the 'omega'? is oduduwa the end of yoruba or would he be the end? obviously oduduwa toppled whoever was the former yoruba leader and instituted his monarchical govt. that's should be common sense.

If Ghana Empire ( that was a gold civilization, not terracotta) can be dated back to 50BC, what makes you those Empires were not existing in present day Nigeria? Didn't Archaelogists find a boat in Northern Nigeria that was more than 10,000years old - a boat older than the Egyptian first dynasty, huh

well, i have given reason why those empires would have flourished at that time period and not dates where u are placing them. the history of a group is never onesided, it has to be corroborated with groups they were in contact with. and like i said, esigie was in contact with the portuguese and he was the great-great-grand child of ewuare who was the founder of the benin empire but not founder of the kingdom. so unless u are saying the portuguese were in this parts of africa at the dates you claim, then who knows? u are maybe right. it is not really my place to prove u right or wrong. the burden of proof is on u. anyway, . im bored of the thread as of now  . . . bye

shymmex

u are asking for my proof when u have provided none? where is ur proof? abeg go siddon. empires are not born overnight, it takes time and goes thru developmental stages. so it grows from communities to kingdoms to empires/confederacies. and becos igbo-ukwu was dated since thy kingdom come dont mean jack. anyway, those dates may not be exact dates but it was dated around when the leaders reigned. if esigie was in contact with the portuguese and esigie was the great-great-grand child of ewuare so it would fall within that period. and oyo and aro flourished at around the same time, so i dont see how it would be dat far back to dates where u are placing it. unless u have proof to back ur claims which i dont think u have.

emmatok:
See, you have an answer.

Why is the  home of the EDOS ,using an  Itsekiri name BENIN,

i thot we had this convo before? ok, why are yorubas using an hausa name, yereba or Yoruba or whatever they call it?

afam4eva:
What if everything you've been told and read are all lies. What if Oduduwa, eze chima, queen amina never existed. What if they're just fictitious characters created to make histore more interesting.

and that is why i dont believe in jesus christ. jesus na story story wey dem take deceive us. but will dat stop igbos from being devout catholic?

emmatok:
How many Igbo terms,names and titles are used by the EDOS.

google is ur friend.

learn about others and not just about yourself and people u want to claim

emmatok:
Too much bigotry is killing.

how?  

Who did Edos meet when they came to Lagos(IDDO, EBUTE-META and Idumota) ? THE AWORIS(except you tell me the AWORIS are not Yorubas.)

i dont care who they met there and what the aworis are, but that does not negate the fact dat the monarchy was instituted by edo

The ITSEKIRIS you are talking about are part of Yoruba, infact the name BENIN is ITSEKIRI and not EDO.


The OLU OF WARRI(formally Olu of Itsekiri) is a Yoruba title .

just like onitsha people are igbo and not edo. and the obi of onitsha is an igbo title.

The first OLU is a Yoruba man.

and the first obi of onitsha was an igboman ,  eze chima

Most EDO use Yoruba terms and name, but Yoruba don't use EDO term.

yes na, just like most edo use igbo terms and names and igbo do not use edo term. edo even use hausa names and terms and hausa do not use edo term

so wot else is new?

Ufeolorun:
400 years and where was it located? in your village?biggest faffing man.
I don't know how long the british empire lasted,I don't think its upto 400 but the signs are there through the spread of english language from America to Australia,the spanish and massive south america.
I respect your culture but stop the constant lousy embellishment,even in edo state how many languages do 'ye' have there. You couldn't have spent 400 years and yet your influence is restricted to some areas around you.
I don't think OYO lasted 400 but from Ajase to Kabba,borgu the influence is unmistakable.
Come on!
Lagos,Ogun,Oyo,Osun,Kwara,Ekiti,Ondo,kogi,Ajase,Borgu?,having same cultural identity: the population,the land mass.

benin empire 1440–1897
oyo empire 1400–1836
aro confederacy 1690–1902

go do the maths and arrive at the years that suits you. and i know that history will always be rewritten but those are the dates for now and those were dominant group that flourished in present day southern nigeria and they were all dismantled by the british.

and wot i posted does not suggest dat i dont respect yoruba culture. i am nigerian so i respect every culture in nigeria. and as a so-called blackman, i respect every african culture but that does not mean because i respect it, i wont air my views when need be. do.

Negro_Ntns:
Culturally, there has never been a similarity between Yoruba and Igbo, and there is never going to be one.

really? i have already posted a few words that i know in yoruba and igbo with same meaning. and dont yoruba circumcise their males like igbo?  

We are talking about cultural unity, not geographic placement.

well, geographic placement do influence cultural unity.

In fact even in geography, Edo is not the midway between West and East.

so where is it then? the midwest?

Bini did not create monarchy for Yoruba but Bini created monarchy for Igbo.  Huge difference!!

this is what we are saying, una nor dey accept due to una inferiority complex. forget ife, lets talk about recent ones. it was edo dat instituted the monarchy in eko(lagos)  that is now being claimed by yorubas. the same edo instituted the monarchy in warri with the itsekiris. and guess who are the ones claiming the itsekiris today? na the same yoruba.

by mere looking at the location of edo in nigeria, it is not difficult to understand why edo cannot be said to the closer to yoruba without being close to igbo. edo is right in the middle of the east and west of southern nigeria. and edo enjoyed empire status for over 400 years(?) until it was dismantled by the british a little over a hundred years ago, and that is not even up to half the time edo was an empire. so instead of yorubas and igbos to appreciate the similarities between them, they keep fighting over pettiness and celebrate their differences while claiming to be share similarities with edo.  errr, it doesnt work that way. edo is in this unique position because of its location and the authority it once commanded.

now, unlike the yorubas, oduduwa is not the alpha and omega of the edo people. before oduduwa, edo had developed a monarchical system of govt for centuries and they had over 30 ogisos before oduduwa, and it was this monarchial system of govt that oduduwa took ife and i guess everybody already knows the edo version of oduduwa. the yorubas rejected the edo version of oduduwa and opted for the mythical one or the one from somewhere in arabia.

now granted edo had a connection with the yoruba intially but the growth of edo did not stop there. edo started growing as an empire during reign of oba ewuare who was the 12th or so oba and by the reign of oba esigie, edo grew into igbo areas with by establishing a monarchial system of govts all the way to present day onitsha through eze chime and i guess everybody knows the edo version of eze chime but the igbos rejected the edo version and opted for the eastern version, although, they didnt stretch their version all the way to the far far east in arabia but ended somewhere around imo/abia

but looking at edo today, though it had connection with yoruba people earlier, and it also had connection with igbos later and that is why the edo culture mirrors both east and west, and in recent time mirrors the north due to islamic influence from the north. and that is why we are neither hausa, igbo or yoruba . . . but edo.

PhysicsQED:
lol, thanks for the correction.

i prefer my "thank-you(s)" in a brown envelope. so let me know when u have it.

anyways, laters.

tpia@:
we all know the whiskey bottle is your best friend, but let it [the bottle] have some breathing space occasionally, ok?

cheers.

and we all know the coven is ur room, try to go out more often, u hear?

bye.

adesua is short for adesuwa which itself is a dialectal variant of adesewa.

crown is beauty, or there is beauty in the crown.

fail.

PhysicsQED:
Interesting.

Adesuwa is a child born in wealth/prosperity. What does Adesua mean in Yoruba?

aha, finally! i have been looking fwd to the day i will know something u dont know in edo.

adesuwa means "the middle/centre of wealth" just like adesogbe is "the middle/centre of ogbe"

abieyuwa is the name u are looking for which means "born into wealth" just like abiemwense meaning "i was born well"

odumchi:
Orisakwe is a variant of Olisakwe or Osawke which are derived from Osebuluwa meaning God who carries the world. This has no connection with the Yoruba goddess Orisha. Besides "Orisa" in Yoruba is pronounced "Oh-ree-sha" while "Olisa" is pronounced "Oh-ri-sa" or "Oh-li-sa". Howvwer, you're right, there are dialectal differences.

cotdamn u are funny . . . u sound like someone trying to explain the difference between igbo and ibo

odumchi:
Masquerade in Igbo is "nmanwu". Only a few communities say "ekpo". The word for stone also varies in dialects. Nri-Awka says Okute, my people say Nkuma. Money is alo various. Everyone says "ego" but some say "ikpeghe or okpogho". By the way, money in Edo is "ikpogho".

as if yoruba and igbo are not full of dialects that have variants for words.  

And how did you arrive at the bolded?

orisakwe is an igbo name meaning god-agrees. and i actually saw an igbo person wit dat name here on NL posted abagworo a proper igboman.

tpia@:
Yes, yoruba magically jumped over edo and delta states to dance with igbos on the other side of the niger.

Makes sense.

and u think that is not possible?

or have u forgotten how yoruba magically jumped over the atlantic ocean go to the dance with the natives in brazil?

if dem fit jump atlantic ocean wetin be river niger wey i fit use leg cross

the cultural myth is that yoruba is not close to igbo.

stone/rock
yoruba - okuta
igbo - okute

masquerade
yoruba - ekpo
igbo - ekpo

money
yoruba - ogho
igbo - ego

amen
yoruba - ase
igbo - ise

orisha is a diety in both yoruba and igbo, and they both had bronze/brass casting.

and dat was just from the top of my head and im not an expert. so imagine if  experts in language and customs are to probe further, the results would be astonishing and you will find out these two noise makers in south of nigeria are actually one and same people formerly known as yorugbo

adesua is not a yoruba name. it is the esan variant of adesuwa meaning "the centre of wealth"

bini - adesuwa
esan - adesua

just thought i should clarify that coz im 100% sure of that.

For instance, you talked about Calabar christianity and Olumba Olumba. You talked about Edo Christians, Muslims and Traditionalists. You mentioned different religions in the US, etc but none of them is completely the same as the Yorubas.
For instance, the Calabars are mainly in Nigeria and a sizable number are Christians. Edo are also mainly in Nigeria and are mainly Christians but they do take their Culture very seriously (thats why in my view, Oba of Benin is one of the most respected Monarchs in the world). The Americans are made up of many ethnicities who all reside in one country

how do u it expect it to be completely the same when they are not same ethnic groups with same circumstances? for u to expect it to be completely the same does not make sense. well, to any rational being coz even twins born of same mother do not have same behavior and thought-process due to different circumstances and experiences that they go thru, not to talk of ethnic groups who had little or nothing to do with each other.

and how does residing mainly in one country negate the fact the they were able to modify foreign religions? something u thought only the yorubas could do? how does it negate the fact that they have had religious tolerance? another thing u thought was incapable by others apart from yorubas.

Find me one ethnic group who are spread in more than one country and have sizable worshipers in at least three different religions and who practice tolerance for other religions besides their own.

lol, find u? and how do u begin to define this your "spread in more than one country" wey u nor wan let me take hear word? is it those who spread to the diaspora voluntarily through migration? or those who got there through slavery?  or those demarcated by europeans? anyway, i have already given u the groups i know with good examples and dont have time to start googling anything for u. so it is either u accept it or not which was the reason i didnt bother debating the issue in the other thread in the first place and just left u to your beliefs.

btw, u keep using the the word "sizable" to make your points but is there any reliable data to show the proportion of yoruba muslims to christians and to traditionalist apart from just hearsay? maybe u should go find me that before throwing "sizable" around to make your point.

Firstly, I mentioned your moniker because my original post on this subject in another was addressed to you. I did that for clarity.

Secondly, you are making assumptions about my religion and ethnicity. In any case, you are wrong on both cases. I was just enjoying having a debate with you on a subject that I have read a lot about. I made no assumptions about your ethnicity or religion. I haven't used any denigrating language on you and I resent your use of 'inferior' on me even though you are wrong about the context.

we all fall victims to assumptions online because it is difficult to tell the true intent/identity of someone u are having a conversation with who u cannot see physically. so my apologies if my assumptions came off as an insult.

however, if u are not yoruba and maybe who knows, you are probably not nigerian? why are you still adamant that this topic is only unique to yorubas even though i have clearly stated in my comments how it is not?

It appears that you are taking this debate as some sort of superiority of the Yorubas over others. That is not the case. All groups are unique and special in their own ways. I am only debating about the UNIQUENESS of the Yoruba vis-a-vis subjective harmony in a multi-cultural and multi-religious society. The Yorubas were not the only groups in the world that were taken as slaves to new countries. There are many examples of that all over the world. The Yoruba are however the only group that were transplanted in strange lands that not only continued with their system of beliefs, culture, and religion but also converted and assimilitated other cultural and religious beliefs.

well, for starters i never took it as some sort of superiority because when u initially posted your write-up, i didnt debate it because to me there wasn't anything unique about it but just had to leave u to your belief system. and i guess because u felt inferior after i gave reason why hausa-fulani muslims do not respect yoruba muslims, u insinuated that i made that comment because i felt they were the ones who introduced islam to yorubas. and then decided to post your comment again with my moniker addressed to it, and that was why i debated and gave u reasons why it is not unique to yoruba alone and i gave u examples of how nigeria groups have been able to modify religion to suit their customs and language but  it wasn’t good enough for you cos to you it is only yoruba that can do such because you only understand the dynamics of yorubaness and not those of other nigerian groups. the people in calabar were even able to modify christianity and ended up with olumba olumba obu.

For instance, there are Yorubas in Salvador who can not point out the location of Yorubaland on a map but are ardent Ifa worshippers.

and isnt it ironic that some yoruba who have never set foot outside nigeria do not know anything about yoruba religious traditions and are ardent christians and muslims, while those taken as slaves to far away land were able to preserve the religion? and that also applies other nigerians groups who have people who have never set off outside the country but na dem believe in christianity pass even the oyinbos wey bring am? not to talk of those wey carry mohammed for head.

Similarly, Santeria and Candomble are religions that are mixtures of Ifa/Orisha worshipping and Catholitism in Cuba and Brazil respectively. The Yorubas that were taken to the US and other English Caribbean countries were mixed with other groups so as to stop them retaining their identity. The Yorubas that were taken to Spanish and Portuguese colonies on the other hand were allowed to not only retain their identities but also their religious and cultural beliefs. But guess what, they weren't the only ones allowed to do so but they certainly were the only ones ABLE to do so.

the reason why slaves were taken, where they were take to, and why they were mixed up is none of my business. and they may have been able to do so because they were the dominant group and it may all boil down to numbers. 1000 yoruba-slaves will certainly swallow up 100 slaves from another region. population do help in sustaining culture and the smaller groups who do not have an organized social and political system to fall back on that would resist that of the dominant group are bound to get assimilated into the dominant group over time.   

There are parks and man-made lakes built in Salvador symbolizing Orisha worship. Next month, during the Carnival week in Brazil, there will be carnivals in Rio and Salvador. One of the three parades in Salvador will be one in Pelourinho. Because of the historical significance of Pelourinho, the parade their is more cultural and spiritual unlike the parades in Ondina and Campo Grande which are witnessed by more party revelers. In Pelourinho, there is African music and dance and don't be surprised to see some Yoruba Orisha procession (not a real one). There is a group called Olodum (short for Olodumare) that is very popular in Brazil.

oh really? good.

There is no ETHNIC group that is African-American. They are a group all right. If I am correct, the American cencus does not use Ethnic groups; it uses groups such as Caucasian, hispanic, African-American, Asians, etc

so what is the purpose of that categorization if not to determine ethnicity? african-americans have their own culture within the US and even have their own language ebonics which just like nigerian pidgin and jamaican patois, is a modification of english language to suit their tongue.

You really must name these other groups in Nigeria that have sizeable Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Traditional, etc groups.

i have already given u groups and u said because they were not scattered around african countries demarcated by europeans and do not have enclaves in the diaspora due to slave trade, their case is different. and btw, apart from islam,christianity and traditionalist, do yoruba have a sizable amount of the other religions amongst them? anyway, if it will make u happy, there is a hindu temple in benin and they do have followers who are allowed to practise their religion peacefully without persecution from others.

Your use of America in this case is irrelevant because Americans do not belong to one Ethnic Group. You have to keep up.

and that was why i wondered why u included americans in the first place because if it is the caucasians u were talking about, they are just like african-american who cannot tell what part of europe they came from without going to ancestry.com or taking a dna test so they just identity as "white" while AA identify as "black". however, i was still able to give u an example of how white-americans modified a religion like christianity to suit themselves or was it the black-americans were u talking about? well, those were also able to modify islam to nation of islam to suit themselves, something only the yorubas can do, in your book. so u have to keep up and be clear. which of the americans were u taking about?

You keep saying other groups but you fail to name these other groups.

really? im sure i threw in ijaw. how could u not see that? u are dumb and getting high on amala again.

and keep pushing that igbo line, that is what u always resort to when u aint got shyte to say. ok, lets forget islam since islam is just like one of the several religions in nigeria. so are there not traditionalists and xtains amongst nigerian groups? why are they not slaughtering each other due to religious differences?

Negro_Ntns:
Exclude your people from this and exclude Hausa, since the two of you do not fall in that category of tolerant practitioners of the faiths.  Beside the Yoruba, which other group exist that practice Islam, Christianity and indigenous faith and the diversity has not caused a division on their land?

so are u saying apart from igbo xtains, there are no igbo muslims and traditionalists? or there or no muslims and traditionalist in other groups? like ijaw?  and from what i seem to be getting from this conservation is that u guys genuinely believe islam is a problem, and because the yoruba muslims have not had any religious conflicts with other yoruba religious practitioners’, u are patting yourselves on the back as if it is something unique in nigeria. and tagged it "sophistication". btw, why do yorubas always use that word a lot? because i have come to notice anytime una wan give unaselves blowjobs to seem special that is always the choice word. is there no other word? abi sophistication nor get synonym again? haha.

Does that even make sense to you? Every group is entitled to its wisdom, system of beliefs, etc. I didn't even suggest that the Yorubas were the only group with such beliefs. I started by identifying other groups that share similar beliefs and identified the differences between them. You are arguing just for the sake of it.

and i never said the yorubas were the only group with the concept. i just stated that the yoruba own sounded plagiarized, like what was written in romans, thats all. the concept is common amongst africans. the edo say "ama mien ason ai mien owie" meaning "without nightfall there will be no sunrise/morning" which can also be translated to "without darkness there will be no light" so the two elements complement and balance each other. and africans generally believe everything happens for a reason whether good or bad, and that is why we easily adopt foreign religions in the first place.

Did you read my post in it's entirety? I stated and I quote "Can you name any ethnic group in the world that practices 4 or 5 different religions
in multiple countries but is not involved in any religious conflict? Any apart from the Yoruba?"

Did you miss the phrase 4 or 5 different religions in multiple countries? African-Americans are not an ethnic group. In any case, they are only found in the US. Same with the edos who are mainly found in Nigeria. Before you reply with there are edo people in Europe, I am referring to multiple generations living in a place. Besides, a majority of Edo people are christians. It is difficult to find a clear majority amongst the various religions practiced by Yoruba people. In Nigeria, it is between Christians and Muslims but globally, it is difficult to ascertain because of the high number of traditionalists in Brazil, Cuba, Haiti, and other Caribbean/Latin countries.

so what countries are yorubas in apart from african countries that were recently demarcated by europeans? the so-called yorubas in the diaspora were taken there as slaves and they are not entirely yorubas so to label them as yoruba is dishonest. anyways, slaves didnt have any reason to fight amongst themselves due to religious differences when they had a common enemy to unit and fight against . . . . the slavemaster. so i dont see how that is a point. and yes, african-americans are classified as an ethnic group. and apart from the us govt, they classify themselves as an ethnic group. unless na u wan define their identity for them.

In case you missed the point - the Yoruba are in this unique position because of their belief system otherwise they would have been followers of one religion just as the Igbos, Europeans, Americans, Efik-Ibibio are Christian, the Hausa-Fulani and Arabs are Muslims. To buttress my point let me use the example of India. How many religions are in india? There are three major religions. Are they co-habiting peacefully? Was it not religious violence that led to India been broken into India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh?

the problem is that u are limiting religion to only christianity and islam. well, that is not the case. a lot of groups in nigeria still worship their indigenous gods even though they have christians and muslims amongst them, and they all co-exist peacefully. and the fact that yorubas have a higher amount of muslims does not score points because it only takes a few amount of people to use religion to stir trouble. and btw, americans dont have one religion, they have all sorts of shyte they believe in. and they even modified christianity to suit themselves and they have the mormons. the current republican front runner mitt romney who would likely run against obama is a mormon. and as for the indians, i dont think they are all one ethnic group, but u can always correct me if i am wrong.

It was religious because the leader of the conquest called it a JIHAD and reason given before and after the Fulani conquest was Islam. Was it only fulanis who could introduce Islam? Anyway, through trade and commerce travellers introduced Islam to Yorubaland. Even though there were no Muslims in Oyo, it built its first mosque in 1550 to cater for foreign travellers. (this is tolerance and cultural sophistication). Well, not one group of people introduced Islam to Yorubaland. After the fall of Oyo ile, many Muslims leaving in Oyo moved to other towns and thats how it spread to other places (and not for the reason you were suggesting earlier). These Muslims came from far and wide.

ok.

On Queen Amina. . . you fool, who taught you Nigerian history?  Amina ruled in the times when Huasaland was worshipping idols and before Islam.  Queen Bilkisu was not a muslim, yet that is an Islamic name.  Names existed that were of AfroAsian descent but the people were not necessarily Muslims, even though it became Arabicised into Islam.

lol, i can always count on u to be a dumbass. so a queen will adopt a muslim name without being muslim? and of course dummy, they were still predominately idol worshippers coz at that time although they had muslims amongst them, it was after the jihad that they became islamized because that was the religion dan fodio used a tool to organize the jihad. and is it any diff from what is happening today with boko haram? imagine boko haram having their way with their jihad, wont nigeria both north and south be islamized if they are to succeed? ozuo.

That is a very ignorant comment. When was the book of Romans written? Were there no religions/philosophy before the coming of Christ? Secondly, there can only be one True God. Is it not possible that early societies all had similar beliefs. I also CLEARLY explained the differences in interpretations amongst different groups but you naively reduced it to 'plagiarism'.

i had reduce it to plagiarism because the yoruba saying is not recorded anywhere in history. so it could as well be a modern construct, who knows?

England did not break away from Rome for cultural or religious reasons. That was political. Anyone that has attended a Church of England mass will tell you that it is almost identical to the Catholic mass. Having a localised name for God is not the same as modifying religion?

of course the break away was political. the king wanted to get laid with some new pvssy, the pope wont grant him a divorce from his old hag, so he said fvck the pope, im starting my own church and dragged his people with him. but the bottom-line is a break away is bound to happen be it cultural or political. and how are christian dominions different from each other? they all go through the same routine:

-pray to jesus
-sing songs
-take communion
-and most importantly, take offering and tithes.

the only major diff i see is the time duration. catholics and most modern churches perform the service sharply so dat they can organize serveral services a day to collect more money.

Can you name any ethnic group in the world that practices 4 or 5 different religions in multiple countries but is not involved in any religious conflict? Any apart from the Yoruba

so yoruba is the only ethnic group to do this? now u are displaying your naivety. let me use example that i know, the edo people have muslims amongst them and they also have traditionalists. have u heard of edo people fighting each other due to religious differences? another example that easily comes to mind, african-americans. they have all sorts of belief systems within their group, have u heard them fighting each other due to religious differences?

As I mentioned in my earlier post, the sacking of Oyo was as a result of the sige laid on it by another Yoruba king. Or was Lanloke also a Muslim?

Islam had been introduced into Hausa states mainly by Fulani scholars from the 15th century. Hausa elites, however, did not follow the tenets of Islam. The lived idolatrous lifestyles. They worshipped all kinds of animals and didn't treat their subjects fairly. Dan Fodio seized on this by silently preaching about the benefits of Islam to the people. The strength of his strategy was that the citizens would not protect their kings when the wars began and that is exactly what happened. The Fulani conquest of Hausa states were religious. No learned person would argue against this.

so how can it be religious and not cultural even though the hausas also had muslims and traditionalist fighting on the same side? btw if it was the fulanis who introduced islam to the hausa, then who introduced it to the yorubas? was there another group apart from this same hausa-fulani?

Hey Exotic,

let me give you history since you are taking us that far back into the Jihad war.

good. i always like your version of history because it is full of fairy tales and that are quite comical.

Every Sultan of the Sokoto Caliphate since Uthman dan Fodio himself spoke Yoruba.  It's a custom in the Fodio dynasty.

is there any history from the caliphate to confirm this? because i know u like theorizing a lot about shyte that never happened.

Their founder, Usumani bii Foduye (popularly known and called Uthman dan Fodio) was born in Gobir of a Yoruba mother.

and what does that change? shango who became a yoruba god was born of of nupe woman. i actually like shango though, and i see him no different from the likes of arab mohammed. they were both killers/warriors who became revered as deities . and dont come and tell muslims dont worship mohammed but allah, when na mohammed dey tell dem wetin to do.

Everytime you reference the battle and defeat of Ilorin, you need to be aware that Fulani had also suffered politically in the hands of Yoruba kings that sold them off as slaves.

well, i never doubted that. the mere fact that oyo once enjoyed empire status proves that without reasonable doubt.

Wrong.  The Hausas were converted into Islam by the Fulani jihad.  The only people in North that practiced Islam before Fodio were the Kanemis - Gambari and Kanuri.

when did queen amina of zaria reign? and when did the fulani jihad take place? queen amina from the name alone already says they were muslims. or wasn’t queen amina the queen/or wife of king of an hausa state?

sbeezy8:
urhhhhh
Majority of People in Ilorin were not a yoruba group and never were. they were actually Bariba and Nupe muslim prior to Yorubas reaching Ilorin and then Fulanis. so Ilorin being Muslim because of "conquest" makes no sense, Igbomina aswell, Majority back then were NOT yoruba- but today they have assimilated into being yoruba with Language/culture Mainly Language.

Some Kwara people will tell you they are not yoruba- cause they technically aren't - Thats like calling Eguns in Lagos, yoruba- cause many dont speak Egun but only yoruba- they still arent yoruba.
I have Ilorin family that are NOT yoruba but technically Nupe/Bariba and call themselves yoruba because of assimilating.

Whether ilorin is Yorubaland or not varies from opinion to opinion.

[size=14pt]CALL IT YORUBA INFLUENCE[/size]

now that it came to conquest, they are no longer yorubas but assimilated yorubas? dat was funny. so who are the "real" yorubas that are not assimilated yorubas when the yoruba construct itself is a contemporary identity?

i actually wanted to leave u alone to your belief system and not quote it but since u decided to post it again, lets see wot is so special

Zoroastrianism is similar to Yoruba in that both believe in the concept of good and bad but differ in that the Yoruba believe that good and evil exist for the common good of the universe while Zoroastrianism believes that good and bad are in an eternal fight. This is why the Yoruba say "Buburu ati fere ni o nrin po ("Bad and good things work together" amongst many other sayings. On the good side, you have the orishas and on the bad side, you have death, curse, sickness, etc

i dont know anything about zoroastrianism abi na rastafarianism but the concept of ying-yang, darkness and light, good and evil complementing each other is nothing new. and the so-called yoruba saying sounds like a plagiarized version of romans 8:28 -- all things work together for the good

Behind this belief system, the Yoruba are able to accept, assimilate and modify any religion. This is why there isn’t too much of a difference between a Yoruba Muslim, Yoruba Methodist, Yoruba Catholic, Yoruba Anglican. These similarities breed tolerance. This is also why You have Yoruba Christians, Yoruba Muslims, and Yoruba traditionalists living in harmony in places such as Nigeria, Benin Republic, Cuba, and Brazil.

and not to burst your bubble, but all religions are modified by indigenous people to suit their customs and language. even the british had to break away from rome to go form the church of england. and dat is why we all modified our indigenous name for god to suit the christian god for example olu,chukwu,oghene,osa,etc and praise and pray to the xtain god in their native tongue and not in latin. and also why so-called nigerian christians can comfortably marry three wives under same roof and attend same church every sunday with the entire family and see nothing wrong with it. and i really dont see how yoruba methodist would be diff from catholic and anglican anyways, they are all christians at the end of the day. as for yorubas xtains living in harmony with yoruba muslims and traditionalist, clearly they are not the only group doing that in nigeria. so wots the big deal?

Dan Fodio’s conquest of the Hausa states,

if the hausa-fulani conquest of old oyo was not religious because the yorubas had muslims fighting on their side, then how was it religious in the hausa in the states? the hausas were already muslims for centuries before dan fodio's conquest but u term that religious and the yoruba conquest cultural. it doesnt make sense.

Please remind me of when Yoruba people were conquered by Fulani folks? Islam existed in Yorubaland long before Afonja betrayed his people. Solagberu, one of Afonja's close aides was the leader of the Yoruba Muslims at Oke Suna. Alleging that Islam was introduced into Yorubaland by Fulani smacks of ignorance. Similarly, it is mischievous to suggest that Yoruba people were conquered by the Fulani. Don't confuse Hausa with Yoruba.

i never said the fulanis introduced islam to the yorubas. i only answered the question why hausa-fulani muslims do not respect yoruba muslims. and it is quite simple, because a yoruba group whether they were muslims, xtians, or shango worshippers were conquered by the hausa-fulani group unless u want to say ilorin is not a yorubaland. and whether u agree with it or not, the fall of old oyo to the hausa-fulani, did help spread islam amongst yoruba groups. kinda like how the british didnt introduce christianity to the edos, but the fall of of benin to the british did help spread christianity amongst edo groups.

Even Ilorin that went under Fulani control was not conquered militarily.

i actually dont care how it was conquered. the bottomline is, it was conquered. and that was how ilorin became one of the bastard seven. and because the people in ilorin were a yoruba-group, the disrespect from the hausa-fulani group, rubbed off other yoruba groups who didnt come under the control of the hausa-fulani.

it is just like today any white person can call u a nigger as derogatory term even though we were never called niggers by the whites who conquered what is today known as nigeria but the fact that we share that same "black" identity with black americans, the term rubbed off on us.

Olodostein:
I have a question prease .

Why do Hausa Muslims call Yoruba Muslims FAKE Muslims? And why do Arab Muslims call black African Muslims "Slave follow follow fake Muslims"?

Just curious .

because the conquered will never be fully accepted by the conquerors. it is like waiting to see an igbo pope. that will never happen, no matter how well igbos embrace catholicism.