chrmn1:
You see, God will not do something for you if you disallow Him to do same. You must understand the character of God. He is all powerful yet meek. If you read Benny Hinn's account of how he first began to relate with the Holy Spirit (I know you don't believe these 'stories' now but please follow me) or Mike Murdock's account, you'll understand this quality in God. Mike was having a nice time in the presence of God in his hotel room (not other room o ), came out for a short time to have a small chat with a minister friend and talked ill about someone they both knew. He went back to his room but the presence was no longer there. Surprised, He began to ask why, and the Holy Spirit spoke to his heart, "why did you speak ill of that person? I was very displeased by that act."

Benny Hinn recounted how he would tell the Holy Spirit, "just hold on a bit" (sort of snubbing Him when He wanted to talk to him i.e. another way of saying to the Holy Spirit, please I'm not in the mood right now) and the Holy Spirit would gently and meekly give him space as requested. Simply put He doesn't force Himself on anyone. That's His character.

Yes you are right when you say man has not got the ability to stop tsunamis but God does. That power is however released when God's representatives on the earth allow Him room to work. But if they don't, the status quo would be the order of the day. It must be this way for now because legally man has been given the mandate over the earth on request.

It was not for nothing that Jesus asked His disciples to pray that the will of God should be done on earth as it is in heaven.

(read again if you've already read this post as I made some typos previously capable of altering meanings of words)

So the earthquake that happened in Haiti, a predominantly Christian country was because they disallowed God from stopping it... A hundred thousand people died in that earthquake, committed Christians too who pray to God everyday, u God failed to protect them

chrmn1:
Hi friend. I did not read all the posts on this thread for want of time but going through your post and that of ForeverGod, I thought I should give an explanation. Regarding Elijah, this was a gift from God operational. See there is something about miraculous gifts from God that I've got to let you understand. God is the giver but MAN is the recipient. Now Elijah made the pronouncement out of anger and it happened.

This is the very reason why the gifts of God are quite rare. God knows that man can actually use these gifts for good and unfortunately, for evil purposes as well. Before God endues men with miraculous power, He tests them again and again and God continues to test men to prune their hearts from wrong intents as He increases these gifts in their lives. There are gifts from God but there are also levels of demonstration of those gifts. I remember an atheist NLander challenging a christian to heal a blind boy and whilst this is very possible with God, the gifts of God do not just flow except a recipient of such a gift have so grown in the use of the gifts that they can produce it at will. There are levels of demonstration of the miraculous gifts of God.

In this instance, a group of young men were killed because they mocked Elijah. God did not tell Elijah to curse them. It was simply a case of demonstrating a gift that was already operational in the Prophet's life having used this gift time and again

Have a look at the passage below:

'And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying:The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation. And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.' (Acts 16:16-18).

Now the damsel did her divination thing for many days but Paul only undid the spirit after many days. If it was something he could just do with the snap of his finger, he would have done it earlier than many days.

(Side note: the KJV translation of that word 'little children' in 2 Kings 2:23-24 actually does not capture the word properly. 'Young men' would have been a more accurate word as per original hebrew text. But that's by the side)

Regarding the curses placed on the nation of Israel, I'll show you two scriptures that explain the intent of God in all these:

Galatians 3:13 NLT: 'But Christ has rescued us from the curse pronounced by the law. When he was hung on the cross, he took upon himself the curse for our wrongdoing. For it is written in the Scriptures, “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.“ '

Galatians 3:19-28 NLT: 'Why, then, was the law given? It was given alongside the promise to show people their sins. But the law was designed to last only until the coming of the child who was promised. God gave his law through angels to Moses, who was the mediator between God and the people. Now a mediator is helpful if more than one party must reach an agreement. But God, who is one, did not use a mediator when he gave his promise to Abraham. Is there a conflict, then, between God’s law and God’s promises?Absolutely not! If the law could give us new life, we could be made right with God by obeying it. But the Scriptures declare that we are all prisoners of sin, so we receive God’s promise of freedom only by believing in Jesus Christ. Before the way of faith in Christ was available to us, we were placed under guard by the law. We were kept in protective custody, so to speak, until the way of faith was revealed. Let me put it another way. The law was our guardian until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith. And now that the way of faith has come, we no longer need the law as our guardian. For you are all children of God through faith in Christ Jesus. And all who have been united with Christ in baptism have put on Christ, like putting on new clothes.There is no longer Jew or Gentile, slave or free, male and female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus. And now that you belong to Christ, you are the true children of Abraham. You are his heirs, and God’s promise to Abraham belongs to you.'

You see God already knew they would not keep the covenant. The actual intent or purpose of the law of Moses was to point people to the fact that they are sinful and God loves sanctity so if He was just relating with the nation of Israel without pointing out things they do that offend Him, that would not work out because two cannot work except they agree.

Romans 5:13-14 explains this point succinctly as follows: '(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come'.

All the curses were actually placed on Jesus who took the punishment for all their misdeeds as per the scripture in Galatians above

Took the time to read the whole epistle but was disappointed u didn't address the issue at all... So Elisha was using God's gift to tear boys to pieces and God stood by...
And don't try to do that complicated translation shit here, I have checked three different translations and two of them use boys and the other uses little children... In the actual text the qualifier, little was used... U people try to rewrite the bible to justify God's acts of wickedness

hopefulLandlord:


salvation blackmail, keeping Abrahamic God's adherents in line since time immemorial

Fear is the strongest emotion in the world

Image123:


i should be asking you, i don't recall saying it was good. i asked dalaman and co to tell WHY they implied it evil.

Implied it is evil?? Something that causes the deaths of thousands of people needs not be implied to be evil, it is expressly and inherently evil, no one should have to prove that to you

Image123:


What evil does it do? Last i recall, you are the one with eternal confusion on what is good or evil and why.

What evil does tsunami do?? I guess u must have missed the thousands of lives that were lost last time it happened

chrmn1:
The power to undo natural disaster, He has invested in men who must co-operate with Him to stall these occurences. i'm refering to the Church of Christ for He must work with man as long as the earth is concerned.

Men as of now don't have the power to undo natural disasters but God supposedly does, then why not stop them

Image123:


Why do you and dalaman imply that hurricanes and tsunamis are evil? Some people think thunder and lightning is evil, but others harness them.

Really, in what planet is tsunami good??

U need to be born again, OP... It doesn't matter how honest you are, how generous you are, how gentle you are or another supposed virtue, if you don't become born again, you will roast in hell like boli for eternity...

Blitzerz:


What a conclusion!

Smh.
Anything that helps u sleep.

So God can provide for them, but chooses not to?

Blitzerz:


Death is death.
Irrespective of the means.
Christians were fed to lions.
Its nothing compared to the glory that awaits them

Its obvious you are aloof of the basic tennets of Christianity.
And so are your definitions.

Baba, they can still have that supposed glory that awaits them without dying by hunger... That they died of hunger means God cannot provide for then

PDBonline:


Sit down with the Bible and read with humility to learn. Success is achievement of a set goal. Not accumulation of money. For Joshua, he was meant to lead the people of Isreal into Canaan. Accomplishing that is success.

When it comes to material wealth God guarantees that if you follow His instructions to you, you will not lack. But we are earned again and again not to set our hearts on acquiring wealth because God has promised never to leave nor forsake us.

I will advise you to stop judging God by other people's experience (you were not in their hearts to know what the issues are between them and God) and seek Him to know Him for yourself. Those who get discouraged in the way and give up end up trying to make it hard for those who choose to listen to God: "DO NOT BE AFRAID OR DISMAYED(meaning to feel disappointed)" There is so much to learn. Quiters don't win and their failures- no matter how hard they complained and abuse God- can never turn the success of others to an hoax.

Thanks for the advice but been there done that

PDBonline:
@ foladara777
Let me give you another one to talk about. I hope that one day you'll stop giving excuses for your loss of Faith and you will actually humble yourself and repent of your lack of faith.

I was told by my department in school to withdraw and go to another department because of a policy that they discovered affected me. That was when I was in 200 level.
I got home that day looked at my text books and thought "so this is the end of the journey?"
Trying to console myself I picked my Bible to read. A chapter came to my heart so I opened it. It was Psalm 37. As I read on verse 7 seemed to jump out of the book into my heart. IIt knew that's one of the ways God speaks to people. Some say " the verse came alive to me". It reads
"Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for Him " The latter part actually read "Do not be hasty for God to act" in the translation I read that day.
I knew immediately that God will act on my behalf but I have a responsibility not to become impatient and not to act in fear (exams were about starting in other department and if I wanted to change department, the rational thing to do was to move immediately).

Because God is not an idea to me but He is very real and my Father whom I honour, I obeyed Him. I must confess I had to fight to keep my mind from fear. I did my best to continue taking lectures in the same department while some other affected course mates had changed department.

Time passed (I don't remembee how long now but it naturally looked so long)And then, one day we were in class when our "class governor" as we called him came in and announced that a meeting was just concluded and those who fulfilled a criteria among those affected had been allowed to continue. Of course, I happened to be one of them.

I have to admit.. Am enchanted by your enthusiasm and am happy u didn't have to leave your department but this could have happened to anyone

naijadeyhia:


Their daily mantra seems to be, “I object.”
Other people are always the source of an argument, not them.
“It’s your fault” and “You are to blame” are some of their favourite phrases.
It’s almost impossible to get them to consider your views – in their mind they are always right.
They can come up with heaps of reasons why you, and not they, are the ones causing all the trouble.

Everything u typed applies to you too

PDBonline:

Does Joshua 1:8 say the "success" is immediate without passing through any process? You should have also pondered on why God told you in the next verse not to get discouraged or feel disappointed.

Secondly, "serious committed Christian" will not replace walking by faith with God. If you don't believe what God says about you in your heart, it doesn't matter how "committed" you are, God's standard won't change because of you.

"...do not become sluggish, but imitate those who THROUGH FAITH AND PATIENCE inherit the promises." Hebrews 6:12

The problem is not that the success is not immediate, it's that the success never comes, especially for those that die of hunger.
And are u claiming every Christian that never has success in their lives- who are many BTW, don't have success because they don't have faith??

naijadeyhia:
[/b]

Their daily mantra seems to be, “I object.”
Other people are always the source of an argument, not them.
“It’s your fault” and “You are to blame” are some of their favourite phrases.
It’s almost impossible to get them to consider your views – in their mind they are always right.
They can come up with heaps of reasons why you, and not they, are the ones causing all the trouble.

Yes, that's what u are doing right now, u know... Everything u wrote up there

naijadeyhia:


I need for you to read this..

[b]The Argumentative Personality

Here is some insight into The Argumentative Personality. Does this sound like anyone you know?

Do you feel like some people you know enjoy arguing just for the sake of arguing? You could be right. While some people like to debate ideas and opinions, others argue out of habit: – they can’t help themselves, and will make a fuss about the most trivial things, just to cause conflict. This can drive those around them up the wall because they are almost always on the defensive, even about what might seem like the most insignificant things. Meet the argumentative personality – the friend, colleague, or relative who will find fault with you or a situation just to engage you in seemingly pointless verbal sparring matches. Other identifying characteristics include:

Their daily mantra seems to be, “I object.”
Other people are always the source of an argument, not them.
“It’s your fault” and “You are to blame” are some of their favourite phrases.
It’s almost impossible to get them to consider your views – in their mind they are always right.
They can come up with heaps of reasons why you, and not they, are the ones causing all the trouble.

You know you are the argumentative type when:

1) Not a day goes by without you having an argument with someone.
2) Feeling you have control and power over everyone and everything all the time is critical to you.
3) Other people, not you, are always to blame for starting an argument.
4) The opinions and feelings of others don’t matter to you.
5) You feel good about yourself when initiating and engaging in arguments, which is why you can’t do without them.
6) The worst thing in the world is feeling you are wrong.
7) Relationships filled with conflict are normal for you.[/b]

This aptly describes u, my friend... And if u feel questions about why God allows evil to happen is trivial then so be it... U always try to argue with anyone who opposes your idea of God and now am responding to your argument and u say the argument is trivial...
I just asked someone why God allows some Christians to die of hunger and his response is that Christians are not afraid to die.. That's not trivial, that's troubling

Blitzerz:


And what is "death" to you?

U think real Christians are afraid to die?

Jesus... Would u choose to die by hunger What is the purpose of people dying by hunger??... How can u try to justify the death of people by hunger by saying real Christians are not afraid to die

naijadeyhia:


So in other words the person could have had this money all along but probably chose not to pay you until you presented his case before God.

Proverbs 21: 1

The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD, as the rivers of water: he turneth it whithersoever he will.

Or he might not have had the money... Even if he had the money, are u sure he wouldn't have paid if you didn't pray??

Blitzerz:


What is ur definition of "successful"? 3 square meals?

You actually think God's uses your carnal dictionary?

Really?? That's your explanation?? God actually provides for them but our carnal minds can't comprehend it?? U know there are Christians that have died of hunger right?? So, it's not just my carnal dictionary, it's the actual experiences of these victims

PDBonline:
That's your experience. This one is online transfer. NOTHING LIKE POSSIBILITY. It states it was a transfer.

U didn't state that in your testimony but whatever... It still doesn't prove it is God's doing... If the guy failed to pay you your money, u wouldn't say God is involved, it's double standards

Blitzerz:


Who told u God doesnt ochestrate things in the life of unbelievers?


Job 34:19 How much less to him that accepteth not the persons of princes, nor regardeth the rich more than the poor? for they all are the work of his hands.

That verse is talking about God's impartiality towards poor people, it is not apt to the issue here
But Joshua 1:8 says if u meditate an the word of God, u would be successful and prosperous, Psalms 35:27 says God delights in the prosperity of his people.. So why do we have serious committed Christians who can't afford three meals a day.

Blitzerz:


And u r making sense?

I dont think.

So someone paid him back the money owed and that means there is God... When people owe me money they also pay me back and I don't even believe there is God

I personally don't see how similarity in different mythologies lends credibility to any or all of them

naijadeyhia:


smh. The force is strong with you.

??

naijadeyhia:
.


Juveniles argue. Men discuss! You enjoy arguments so this makes you a juvenile. On my threads we discuss of which only intelligent minds would know the difference.

Really, seems you don't know the meaning of arguments...
A fact or statement used to support a proposition; a reason.
A verbal dispute; a quarrel.
A process of reasoning.
If u claim your comments on this thread are not arguments, then you have another thing coming.. If Juveniles argue, then I guess u are a juvenile too

naijadeyhia:


Lmao this guy! I am sure he does not know anything about demographics.

You think your post is actually a eureka moment for you. We have trudged this path with more experienced and better put together atheists here on NL so I would not bother taking your bait for an argument.

I do know you would claim I am running away again but would that be the truth simply because u said so?

I have a track record on NL and being unnecessarily argumentative isn't one.

enjoy your day

U are usually around this corners arguing with every atheist who dares oppose your point of view... That's definitely being unnecessarily argumentative.
And saying there is God doesn't make it true because you say so too. It goes both ways

naijadeyhia:


Ahh so you also flirt with autotheism alongside being agnostic?

Flirt with auto theism?? What's this one saying?? I don't even call myself an atheist in the first place...

naijadeyhia:


lol this guy actually thinks he is some guru who has discovered the answers to all lifes questions.

Dont flatter yourself! Youthful exuberance isnt wisdom nor is it knowledge.

You just simply have a need to be heard! Something I think you have been denied for a while.

Wise people do not respond to every "argument" simply because wrestling at the level of ignorance with the ignorant would only expose you to serious beating in ignorance.

A man who does not know and refuses to know because he thinks he already knows is a very dangerous person.

Am arguing with logic and reasoning, the only basis for your argument is personal experience and u are the wise one?? And plss, u are replying every of my comments so u obviously have the intent to respond but you don't know how to... If u think it's youthful exuberance to question bare assertions made by another person without any iota of proof, then let me be an exuberant youth
The difference between you and myself is that I question everything especially my beliefs and test them on their merit but you only create defenses for your beliefs and seek to protect them

naijadeyhia:


lmao @ expose

Greater have tried to do worse over thousands of years. They all died and yet their object of ridicule which is Christianity is still herr and waxing stronger.

Keep on trying your best. lmao

Well, thousands of years ago, these people were being hunted down and killed by the church
And u think Christianity is waxing stronger, try Islam which is actually the fastest growing religion in the world... That still doesn't make Islam valid. In fact, Christians are becoming less religious so it's not waxing stronger at all. See http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/27508 http://www.patheos.com/blogs/wwjtd/2015/05/pew-christians-leaving-the-faith-in-droves-atheists-gaining-about-as-fast-as-theyre-losing/

naijadeyhia:


Your penchant for imaginary arguments will soon see you being totally ignored by everyone on Nairaland.

This atheism thing seems to be a new fad for you so its still an intoxicant with you.

Imaginary arguments?? Because u don't know how to respond to them?? I really don't mind if u ignore, it only confirms that u have been silenced by reason and as usual are running for cover...
And for God's sake, how is it imaginary to assert that Christians don't have the advantages they claim to have, that they don't enjoy any special benefits because they pray to a god. I have chatted with u long enough to know that if u have a counter argument, u would surely respond and where u don't, u look for red herrings and try to attack the person making the argument

naijadeyhia:
Besides this is a testimony thread/post by the OP and not a thread to argue ignorantly on. If you want to argue then head up to shiloh or stroll into any church and when they begin to share testimonies you can put up your hand and say you wish to interrogate the testifiers.

Abegii.. The Op stated at the end of his post that atheists don't know what they are missing and am trying to show him that we're not missing anything...
If u angry because I tend to expose bull crap of Christians then too bad

naijadeyhia:


When you guys lie do so with some dignity or at least save some lies for the next 1 week of your life. Dont spew all in one day.

All of a sudden you too made a deposit yesterday? Lol

I make deposits daily and people do same to me daily and all have always reflected same day so hush it.

I suggest you simply hush it and move along. Like i said a personal experience is not something an armchair atheist can refute with so much ignorance.

I make deposits daily for my dad, sometimes more than once a day... That your alert has never been delayed does not mean it has never happened anywhere before... It has happened more than one or two times to me
U want me to move along because u can't address the issue I raised... If your only argument is that I should hush and move along, too bad