₦airaland Forum

mazaje: The bible gave a detailed account of how god created everything in seven days . . . Whether it is 7 periods or 7 normal days, the details are all there for all to see. . .How can god divide day and night?. . .What causes day and night if not the sun?. . .can you see how meaningless your assertion is?. . .What divides day and night if not the sun?. . .Is your god now the sun?. . .Even if we are to go with your creative period the bible still remains a mythical creation narrative that is very false. . .

Wrong! The bible does not give a detailed account of how God created everything in seven days. The Genesis account was not written to show the "how" of creation. Rather, it covers major events in a progressive way, describing what things were formed, the order in which they were formed and the time interval, or "day," in which each first appeared. In the first craetive day, light started to appear. You can't have light without the source.

It still doesn't matter. . .If it means day or periods. . .

Only that you are lying and distorting what the bible is saying. . .From the bible. . .

Gen1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light(sun) to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night(moon): he made the stars also.
Gen 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
Gen 1:1 8 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
Gen 1:19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

If you can read as i assume you can you can see it says the sun, moon and stars were all created on the fourth day of creation and they were all created to give light into the earth. . .All the stuff you wrote about rotating earth and light travel is your OWN making it does NOT appear any where in the bible and remain your own lies. . .I really prefer the YEC that take it as they see it or the apologist that will tell you its an allegory that people that will come about lying through their teeth and keep repeating what was never said. . .Sun and moon in outer space long before the first day according to your lies, but the bible VERY clearly says there were created on the fourth day. . .Or are we reading from two different bibles?. . .

The J.W translation is an apologetic nonsense. . .And non of what you have written here appears in the bible, the bible reading is very clear, sun, moon and stars were all created on the fourth day of creation to give light unto the earth. . .Lie all you want but that is what was written in the bible. . .Light from the sun , eh?. . .How can it be light from the sun when it says the sun was created on the fourth day of created after the earth was already existing?. . .

The translation by Benjamin Wills Newton gives the same picture of continuing development of a process once started.

Rotherham, in a footnote on "Luminaries" in the Emphasised Bible, says: "In ver. 3, 'ôr ['ohr], light diffused." Are they also "apologetic nonsense"?

Why do you guys love LYING SO MUCH?. . .Its disgusting. . .the way you guys just throw the bible and keep making it to say things it NEVER says is disgusting. . .They were only visible but not created according to your own lies, right?. . .

From the bible. . .

Gen 1:16[b]And God made[/b] two great lights; the greater light(sun) to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night(moon): he made the stars also

Gen 1:19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day

It clearly says the sun, moon and stars were made(created) on the fourth day of creation,

When examining the Genesis account, it is helpful to keep in mind that it approaches matters from the standpoint of people on earth. So it describes events as they would have been seen by human observers had they been present. This can be noted from its treatment of events on the fourth Genesis "day." There the sun and moon are described as great luminaries in comparison to the stars. Yet many stars are far greater than our sun, and the moon is insignificant in comparison to them. But not to an earthly observer. So, as seen from the earth, the sun appears to be a 'greater light that rules the day' and the moon a 'lesser light that dominates the night.'—Genesis 1:14-18.

Gen. 1:1 says "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth".
The heavens had bodies and the earth had crust and water covering it. When God called for light to appear in the first creative day, light gradually came forth, not from the earth, but from the light source(s) in the heaven which were later made to appear on creative day 4.

When God made lights, one to rule over the day and the other, the night (Gen. 1:14-18), it wasn't announcement of the birth of the sun, moon and stars, for they had been in existence for untold number of years prior to day 4.The main emphasis were on their appearance and more functions. Where do you think the light on creative day one (Gen. 1:3,5) came from?

When God made the dry land to appear on creative day 3 (Gen.1:9,10), that was not announcement of the birth of the earth's crust, for it had been in existence for untold number of years prior to day 3.- Gen 1:1

Contrary to your claim, the bible does not give a detailed account of how God created everything in 7 days. Also, it was not written as a science book, but has given us the order in which things were formed/made to appear, and the time interval, or "day," in which each first appeared - like the sun, moon and stars that first appeared on creative day 4, though had been in existence for untold number of years.

already the grasses were already created in the earth on the 3rd day of creation. . .Keep lying for Jesus. . .
By the way what is a firmament and how can the sun, moon and stars be placed in any firmament?. . .Are the sun , moon and stars in any firmament?. . .

Why wouldn't there be grasses in day 3? Light gradually appeared from creative day 1 - Gen.1:3. The diffused light would have become quite strong by then, ample for the process of photosynthesis so vital to green plants.

Genesis creation account is as correct as the creation account to be found in the verders or any of the japaness and chinese creation myths. . .You are ONLY trying to lie through your teeth to make scientific discoveries rhyme with the genesis creation myth, but saying that the bible does not really mean what it says, or that was was written does not mean what was written but something else according to your own lies and spin. . .

What has this got to do with the mythical creation account in genesis that says the earth was created before the sun and starts?. . .keep spinning and lying to yourself. . .Those that are honest just take it as it was written(YEC), those that know it doesn't agree with reality say it is an allegory. . .

Lol.. you have omitted the greatest myth - undirected explosion.

Area_boy: ^^^

watch this video. Based on a book by Karen Armstrong


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlnnWbkMlbg

Sorry to say, I don't have time for any video. Watch and leave your comment(s) on my post, and don't forget my question when commenting.

mazaje: We can start on the very first page, the 7 day creation account is VERY false, the universe did NOT come about the way the bible said it was created in 7 days by Yahweh. .

The bible has never said the universe came about in 7 days. Can you point to any statement or verse that suggests that? The first part of Genesis indicates that the earth could have existed for billions of years before the first Genesis "day," though it does not say for how long. However, it does describe what earth's condition was just before that first "day" began.
Many consider the word "day" used in Gen. 1 to mean 24 hrs. However, in Gen. 1:5 God himself is said to divide day into a smaller period of time, calling just the light portion "day". In Gen.2:4 all the creative periods are called one "day":

"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created , in the day (all the creative periods) that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens ," - Gen 2:4
The Hebrew word "yohm", translated "day", can mean different lengths of time. It would seem reasonable that the "day" of Genesis could likewise have embraced long periods of time - millenniums. The account indicates that the creative process continued throughout a period of, not just 144 hours (6 x 24), but over many millenniums of time.

.According to the bible the earth was in existence with water in it before all the stars were created, it says the earth was created before the sun,

"'Let light come to be.' Then there came to be light. And God began calling the light Day, but the darkness he called Night. And there came to be evening and there came to be morning, a first day."—Genesis 1:3, 5.
Gen. 1:3 does not announce the birth of the sun or other luminaries. The sun and moon were in outer space long before this first "day," but their light did not reach the surface of the earth for an earthly observer to see. Now, light evidently came to be visible on earth on this first "day," and the rotating earth began to have alternating days and nights.

Apparently, the light came in a gradual process, extending over a long period of time, not instantaneously as when you turn on an electric light bulb. The Genesis rendering by translator J. W. Watts reflects this when it says: "And gradually light came into existence." This light was from the sun, but the sun itself could not be seen through the overcast. Hence, the light that reached earth was light diffused.

it also says the sun and the moon were created on the same day. . .It says stars were being created to give light unto the earth. . .All these are VERY false. The sun and its gravitational force was actually what lead to the creation of the earth and all the other planets. . .Without the sun there would have been nothing in our solar system. . .The sun came first before every other thing in our solar system and it is what keeps the solar system together. . .The earth did NOT come before the sun. . .

On the first "day" diffused light evidently penetrated the swaddling bands, but the sources of that light (sun, other stars and the moon) could not have been seen by an earthly observer because of the cloud layers still enveloping the earth. Now, on this fourth "day," things apparently changed. Had there been an earthly observer, he would be able to discern the sun, moon and stars, which would "serve as signs and for seasons and for days and years." (Genesis 1:14) The moon would indicate the passing of lunar months, and the sun the passing of solar years. They were only visible, but not created on the fourth creative day.

Now we have very powerful telescopes like the Hubble space telescopes and the Kepler space telescopes, these space observatories have shown us how planets from other distant solar systems were created, the sun(star) always comes first, usually from a supernova, then the planets form afterward, its actually the sun's(star) gravitational pull on the surrounding dust and debris that creates the planets, these are things that can be seen. . .Many of the stars out there came into existence long before our own sun came into existence because many of them are older than our own sun which is also a star, unlike the bible that falsely states that the earth was created before the stars and the stars were created to give light to the earth, the stars are also suns and many have earth like planets revolving round them, and they number in trillions of billions and were not created to give light to the earth, just like the earth was not created to give light to any other earth like plant in our galaxy take the earth away and the universe will still remain the way it is. .
.Even the best christian apologist have now relegated the genesis creation account into the realm of mythology, they now regard at as an allegory, because of observable evidence, when the genesis myth was written it was never written as an allegory. . .The first page of the bible begins with a false creation account that was been shown to be false by observable evidence, even christian apologist agree and say the genesis creation account is an allegory. . .

Genesis creation account is as correct as mazaje is a humankind. Those who dismiss it as myth or allegory are very ignorant. The account is in harmony with the discoveries of modern science.

Questions for you: Does observable evidence show that undirected explosion can result in better organization? Do the bombs that fall on cities in wartime produce superbly designed buildings, streets and signs with traffic laws? What does experience by the Japanese cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in 1945 show?

truthislight: I dont know where you get your information from(maybe you have to verify the more).

When i read the bible, the first thing i see is this :

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." (Genesis 1:1).
...........................................................

^
what i understand by that is the creation of earth and the expands above (heaven) it.

Like the bible says the "birds of the heavens", do this birds fly in outter space? No.


I dont know why you wish to belief that an account of the creation to Jews 4k years ago was talking about outter space instead of their known evironment. curious

So you believe that all the Jews of that time had and were educated on knowledge of the outter space right?

Lol.

When you come round, you can Rephrase or ask me question with scripture specific quotes of the falsity of the bible.

*though the bible is not a science text book, when it touches on science it is spot on*

this is a time the bible was talking about outter space at Job 38:31-33.

It was in the form of a question to Job as to things he or humans of that time did not know.(talking about Constellations and asking if they can be brought into the earth).

Ciao.

I like that question up there. In his post i think he mentioned "Christian apologists" ... Lol.


The more many try to disprove Genesis 1:1, the more they prove that the heaven and the earth can't be the products of one undirected/unguided explosion, but were carefully designed.

phoneport: A man who ruined his clothes during a recent laundry session says a heavy-handed mishap led to a holy discovery. Martin Andrews was doing laundry and spilled some fabric softener on a shirt, according to the United Kingdom’s Metro.

When he took a closer look at the fabric softener stain, he says he saw 'Jesus Christ'. In the splotch, one can make out a man with his two arms outstretched. It appears the figure also has a halo on his head. Still, it might be a bit of a stretch to call it Jesus. “I showed my mates at work the picture and one of them said, ‘I’ve heard you can find
comfort in Jesus but you’ve found Jesus in Comfort,’” he told Metro. Andrews is not the first person to see the Son of God in an unusual place. An Ohio man says he saw Jesus in some bird poop that had landed on the windshield of his car back in February. “It’s like a perfect portrait,” he said in a video filmed from the inside of his car. “It’s like Jesus staring right at me.”

In 2010, a 26-year-old Southampton man said he saw Jesus in a Google maps image while searching for vacation destinations online. He said he could make out the face of Christ in a satellite image of farmland near Puspokladany, Hungary.

And since 2006, a photo has been circulating showing what is supposed to be the body of Jesus on a dog’s bottom.

Who in this generation ever saw Jesus & can tell us his looks? What make of camera was in existence and used to take his photo then?... "It's like a perfect portrait"...of someone you once saw?

Does any of your family members have a photo of your great great great great great great .... grandfather? Would you believe me and recognize him if I present a satellite image of him?

Joel.:
He was not the first born but satan was. darkness existed before light. read revelation. the dragon try to kill the baby

Joel.:
And God said, Let there be light (Jesus): and there was light (Jesus). 4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light(Jesus) from the darkness(satan). 5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

john 1 In the beginning was the Word,(that was the first word, that says let there be light) and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made(through the light “Jesus”all things were made); without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the “light of all mankind”. 5 The light(Jesus) shines in the darkness(satan), and the darkness has not overcome it

I would like you to reconcile the bolded.

Joel.:
He was not the first born but satan was. darkness existed before light. read revelation. the dragon try to kill the baby

Whose do you want me to accept as the truth, your word or God's? Col. 1:15 says Jesus in the firstborn of every creature, you said he was not, that satan was. If you can understand when the event described at Rev 12:1-17 took place, then you will know that scripture is no proof that satan existed before Jesus.

Who is the woman, and who impregnated her? How possible is it that she clothed herself with the sun, had the moon under her feet, and wore a crown of twelve stars on her head? Where did it happen, in the heaven or on earth?

Your answers to the above will show if you really understand that Rev. 12:1-17 you quoted. Moreover, should we say that Paul lied at Col. 1:15?

Joel.:
And God said, Let there be light (Jesus): and there was light (Jesus). 4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light(Jesus) from the darkness(satan). 5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Darkness existed before light. Viewing this in the light of your explanation, it means satan existed before Jesus. It's in contrast with the following:

"Who (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God , the firstborn of every creature" Colossians 1:15

jacobscros: Read those verses and still come and argue....

You don't know what tithe is? That scripture is about honoring God with the best of what we have. It can be our time, talents, strength, and material possessions.

Zikkyy: it will be wrong of me to do something that was not instituted by Jesus only if i am acting contrary to a commandment that says i cannot do anything good on my own. i.e. am restricted to precedence.

^ ^ ^ Stories!
Did you wake up one day and know it's good to pray, sing, make offerings, observe the Lord's supper etc all on your own? What is precedent (note the spelling), and who is a Christian? See if your definitions are at variance with the following scriptures:
"For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:" 1 Pet. 2:21 "Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ." 1Cor. 11:1 NKJV

since there is no such commandment, there is no way i can be condemned for doing a good thing just because Jesus did not do it. we have freedom to do every good and acceptable to God, why do you want to restrict that freedom?

How do you know easter celebration is good and acceptable to God? Things are not good and acceptable to God merely because a mortal man declares them good and acceptable. "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death." - Prov. 14:12

You are speaking from a position of ignorance cos you don't even know me or what am capable of doing >:

You are rather the one ignorant. Easter is not defined by who you are, what you believe in, nor by what you are capable of doing. Your refusal to celebrate Easter the way others do, does not alter its status as an idol and its customs from being pagan's.

( you don't know what people celebrate as individuals and the frequency of celebration. There are lots of activities going on within churches either as a church or as groups or individuals within the church. we cannot not say they are wrong simply because we don't see Jesus or the apostles doing them.

If you like celebrate the heavens and the earth a milion times per second, if that has never being the will of the father, all will be vain.
"Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!" Matt. 7:21-23.

Who among you can prove that Easter celebration is the will of the Heavenly Father?

Yes they observe Easter; their version of Easter and not your version. If they worship God with sincerity of heart, who are you to say they are worshiping Ishtar?

It's not about sincerity of heart, but about doing the will of the father. "And in all things that I have said unto you be circumspect : and make no mention of the name of other gods , neither let it be heard out of thy mouth." Ex. 23:13 KJV.

Who are you to say they are doing the will of the father? Who are you to say they are not worshiping God in the name of another god, an idol? Who are you to say that a holy beign can compromise his pure worship with easter's, a goddess, an idol?

What you have seen is where colored egg and rabbit came from. you have not seen where the celebration of Jesus resurrection came from.

Celebration of Jesus' resurrection was an add-on to easter to enable the church fathers christianize this pagan celebration. If you have anything contrary to this, put it up!

Zikkyy: for someone that have never seen an Easter egg, bunny or Easter buns, what would make me uncomfortable? you don't even know if i celebrate Easter!

What difference does it make, as you see nothing wrong in its celebration?

even when i kept repeating that i don't have a clue, you come up with comment like the one above i see that i have been wasting my time with you. am sure it is stated in the checklist you are reading from that the opposition will boast that he/she is very knowledgeable. it's becoming obvious am not discussing with an adult.

Does my question differ from that of op? You don't have a clue then what are you doing here? See an adult defending what he has no clue of.

i don't claim to rely on precedence in my daily living. am guided by the instructions/commands/teachings/events in the scripture to distinguish good and acceptable behaviors from bad. of course this cannot be done without the holy spirit as your guide.

if you ever bothered to read my posts, you would observe that nobody been arguing with you over the origin of egg, bunny or buns. is anybody saying colored egg was never used by pagans?

Use what you claim you are guided by and prove to us that Easter celebration is biblical, not pagan way of worship. As an adult, if you dodge this again, I will be disappointed in you.

Zikkyy: this is not news, a good number of 'so called' Christians don't even understand what Christianity is all about. same way you criticize without first understanding what people do.

What does it take to know that some people celebrate Easter, a goddess, an idol, unknowingly thinking they are celebrating the resurrection of Christ. Is it hard to know that lots of Easter customs are pagan's? Is it difficult to know that Easter celebration is unscriptural?

...and you think you are not speaking for the people you accuse of pagan worship (including zikkyy). why not let them speak for themselves? why don't you let me tell you what i worship?

Speaking for? Lol.

Zikkyy: You continue to make the same blunder. There's no way Easter celebrants will take you seriously when you continues to speak in strange tongues.

What you fail to know is that, some Easter celebrants do so ignorantly - without knowing Easter was a goddess, an Idol. Not everyone's heart is impervious to the truth. Recall Jesus' illustration of different types of soil. Speak for yourself and leave others alone.

When I say you have a lot to learn, it's not just about knowing more information, it's also about your approach to showing people what they are doing is wrong. You have been talking like a pre-programmed computer that will repeat the same solution irrespective of what the problem is.

I knew you won't be comfortable with those posts. Truth can never be hidden. I will keep posting them till you lay those eggs. Since you are so knowledgeable as you boast, why not present, at least, a single line of scriptural proof to show that Easter is scriptural, and not pagan. If those customs are not pagan, why did some attempted to get rid of them? See the quote below and cry as usual. "Eating special buns at the festival of the pagan goddess Eostre has long been an established custom among the natives of Britain. Early Christian missionaries who tried to stop this practice got nowhere. Eventually.... converts ... were permitted to continue eating buns at the time of the spring festival...." - How It Started, p. 50.

I have done my best to give your thoughts on Easter a direction that Easter celebrants will easily identify with, but you continue to resist preferring instead to stick to the comfort of your world. In your long write-up above you did not say anything of relevance to the Easter celebrant.

Can you point to any meaningful post of yours that can assure Easter celebrants that easter feast is not pagan, but scriptural? Here you are cackling like fowls that want to lay Easter eggs.

Zikkyy: You are not saying anything. I asked that you show evidence that the first set of worshipers were celebrating ishtar. If you cannot do that, there is no way I can begin to make sense of your posts. Its the starting point.

You are thinking of making sense of my posts when you can't make a single sense of your posts. Prove that you are the one saying something by showing us the scriptural supports for Easter.

For you to understand how I view your comments so far, I'll tel bout an experience growing up in my hometown back in the days. I had this neighbor, a pagan that always wanted to participate in every celebration around him . At Xmas or New year celebrations he would buy goats and offer to his gods, pray to his gods. For him holidays were season you celebrate to your gods. He had two gods he was worshiping. You can imagine freksy coming to advise zikkyy based on his (freksy) understanding of my neighbor's activities. you cannot accuse me of worshiping my neighbor's gods. If you believe what I do is wrong you must address what I do, and not what you think I do.

As sugar attracts ants, so do your celebrations attract pagan practices. Your pagan neighbor knew exactly when to offer those things. The early Christian missionaries who tried to stop this practice got nowhere, the best advice is found at 2 Cor. 6:17,18; Rev. 18:4,5.

I don't see you can communicate effectively when you go about creating your own version of my activities. Like I said, you still have much to learn.

Here you want to make a mockery of yourself. Are you saying I am the creator of those quotes in catholic encyclopedia, encyclopedia Britanica etc?

The Catholic Encyclopedia tells us: "A great many pagan customs, celebrating the return of spring, gravitated to Easter. The egg is the emblem of the germinating life of early spring. . . . The rabbit is a pagan symbol and has always been an emblem of fertility."—(1913), Vol. V, p. 227.

Is the above my creation?

Zikkyy: Its very obvious you don't have a clue regarding the celebration of Jesus resurrection by Christians. You have not been able to show that the first set of celebrants were actually celebrating ishtar. You spend time creating your own version/world of pagan worship, then you put your target celebrant in it an then accuse them of pagan worship. You have absolutely no clue bout the activities opeople you are accusing. You should do away with what your church been feeding you and spend time reviewing the true activities of christian celebrants .the truth is that I have difficulty reconciling all you have been saying with what I observe during the celebration. You don't advise people if you don't understand their problem. It's very wrong of you to create your version of their problem and advice them base on that. You will achieve nothing. I think you still have a lot to learn.

"Amongst the Anglo-Saxons the month of April was dedicated to Eostre or Ostara, Goddess of Spring; and her great feast has given its name to our Easter. Here again the Church was quite frank about it, and Bede states that the feast in England was simply `the old [pagan] festival observed with the gladness of a new solemnity.'" - Paganism in our Christianity, Weigall, p. 261, Gordon Press, 1974 (Reprint of the edition published by Putnam, New York.)

Curiosities of Popular Customs explains: "It was the invariable policy of the early Church to give a Christian significance to such of the extant pagan ceremonies as could not be rooted out. In the case of Easter the conversion was peculiarly easy. Joy at the rising of the natural sun, and the awakening of nature from the death of winter, became joy at the rising of the Sun of righteousness, at the resurrection of Christ from the grave."

Zikkyy: Its very obvious you don't have a clue regarding the celebration of Jesus resurrection by Christians. You have not been able to show that the first set of celebrants were actually celebrating ishtar.

It was a dcelebrate thing by the church fathers. They perceived that if Christianity was to conquer the world it could do so only by relaxing the too rigid principles of its Founder, by widening a little the narrow gate which leads to salvation. Pope Gregory I continued this defiling trend. According to Natural History magazine, "instead of trying to obliterate peoples' customs and beliefs, the pope's instructions were, use them. If a group of people worship a tree, rather than cut it down, consecrate it to Christ and allow them to continue their worship." Both Jesus Christ and the apostle Paul predicted that Christianity would be infiltrated by false teachings.

It was the policy of the early Church to give a Christian significance to the pagan ceremonies that could not be rooted out. In the case of Easter the conversion was peculiarly easy. Joy at the rising of the natural sun, and the awakening of nature from the death of winter, became joy at the rising of the Sun of righteousness, at the resurrection of Christ from the grave.

In an attempt to justify Easter celebration, see below part of italo's post. Judge for yourself whether it's not the same policy as mentioned above that was at work.[/quote]

italo: Most historians believe Halloween originated with the ancient Celtic festival of Samhain (pronounced SOW-in, SAH-vin, or SAM-hayne meaning “End of Summer”). During this festival people would light huge communal bonfires and wear costumes, mostly comprised of animal heads and furs, to ward off roaming spirits and ghosts.
When the eighth century rolled around, Pope Gregory III designated November 1 as “All Saints’ Day”, this was to be a time to honor all of the saints and martyrs who had passed on. This new holiday incorporated many of the traditions of the Samhain festival.

{Think of it this way, it’s much easier to paint an old building and put up a new sign than it is to tear it down and start from scratch. This was nothing new and had been done many times before. For instance, many Pagan customs were combined with Christianity when Constantine converted the official Pagan religion of the Roman Empire to Christianity between 320 and 330 A.D.}
Now, the evening before “All Saints’ Day was known as All Hallows’ Eve and this later became Halloween. Over the centuries, Halloween has evolved into a secular and very commercial celebration embraced by communities as more of a child-centric holiday with activities like trick-or-treating or decorating your home to look spooky.

Read the following scripture carefully and pay attention to your conscience - is it saying the actions of the church fathers were scriptural?


"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers : for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness ? and what communion hath light with darkness ? And what concord hath Christ with Belial ? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel ? And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols ? for ye are the temple of the living God ; as God hath said, I will dwell in them , and walk in them; and I will be their God , and they shall be my people . Wherefore come out from among them , and be ye separate , saith the Lord , and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you , And will be a Father unto you , and ye shall be my sons and daughters , saith the Lord Almighty." - 2 Cor. 6:14-18

You spend time creating your own version/world of pagan worship, then you put your target celebrant in it an then accuse them of pagan worship. You have absolutely no clue bout the activities opeople you are accusing. You should do away with what your church been feeding you and spend time reviewing the true activities of christian celebrants .the truth is that I have difficulty reconciling all you have been saying with what I observe during the celebration. You don't advise people if you don't understand their problem. It's very wrong of you to create your version of their problem and advice them base on that. You will achieve nothing. I think you still have a lot to learn.

Isn't it funny that you are blaming me for what your church fathers did? Zikkyy, it's true that i have a lot to learn, but how come you that have known it all are absolutely blank about the history of your celebration.

Zikkyy: you see the way you people think. too much assumptions learn to base argument/discussion on facts. why assume i know? the truth of the matter is i don't know.

What single fact have you offered so far to prove that worshiping God in the name of a goddess, an idol, is scriptural?

Can you prove that am celebrating a spring festival? more 'faulty assumption' and false accusations. you guys sit in the comfort of your living room or kingdom hall (if you are JW) and begin to accuse people you've never seen in your life not to talk of knowing what they do. what is my business with the origin of spring festival, when we are discussing the celebration of Jesus resurrection. You people go about creating your own version of a practice and accuse some others of engaging in that practice. that is not a good thing to do.

New year celebration is about new year; new yam festival is about new yam; Christmas celebration is about Christmas; birthday celebration is about birthday. Easter celebration is about Easter. Who was easter? She was the pagan goddess of spring and fertility! Many of the customs originally used in worshiping this ancient European goddess are the same ones used today in celebrating Easter.

the origin of the spring festival is pagan, what about the origin of the celebration of Jesus resurrection?

The spring festival was easter celebration. Amongst the Anglo-Saxons the month of April was dedicated to the goddess of Spring. The Roman Catholic Church once stated that her (Easter) great feast has given its name to our Easter. The church went on to say that the feast in England was simply the old pagan festival observed with the gladness of a new solemnity.

Now tell me, what else would you like to hear from me before you are convinced that Easter celebration is rooted in pagan.
Your 'mantra' about the celebration of the resurrection of Christ was just an add-on to christianize it. The origin remains the same, my brother.

Zikkyy: na wa oo! you avoiding everything i have been saying and sticking with a written script. please show me where the original celebrants of Jesus resurrection called their celebration Easter!

I will only show you when you put your question in unwritten form.

"Origin of the name + origin its of the customs (attached to the celebration of Jesus resurrection long time after the celebration started)". Oga this is not what am asking you. tell us about the origin of the celebration itself!

There is nothing to prove. Kindly tell me how my prayers, praises and thanksgiving to God becomes a pagan act. cos i don't know.

Are you arguing blindly? Recall that the op wanted to know if Easter celebration is biblical or whether it's a pagan way of worship. So, prove that it is biblical, not a pagan way of worship.

what has egg and rabbit got to do with my faith?

What have eggs and rabbits gotten to do with what you claim you are celebrating?

Zikkyy: How do you prove that my prayers, praises and thanksgivings to God is pagan and directed at a goddess? did i sacrifice another human to God?

Do the trace and post your findings here. Just ensure your trace goes back to the very beginning. Don't bring evidence from the 8th century o!

i don't know anything bout that.

you see the problem am having with you. Instead of tracing the origin of the celebration of Jesus resurrectio[/b]n, you are tracing the origin of [b]colored egg and cakes. activities that were introduced after 700 years or more (i think) of peeps celebrating the Jesus resurrection.
The popular observance has babylonian character abi? all you need to do is show that this observances you refer to were also popular with the first set of celebrants. i don't think that will be difficult na?

Who introduced them, peeps? Who accepted them, non-peeps? Flimsy! I told you: name + traditions. Begin to trace them one after the other let see where they will take you to.

"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers : for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness ? and what communion hath light with darkness ? And what concord hath Christ with Belial ? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel ? And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols ? for ye are the temple of the living God ; as God hath said, I will dwell in them , and walk in them; and I will be their God , and they shall be my people . Wherefore come out from among them , and be ye separate , saith the Lord , and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you , And will be a Father unto you , and ye shall be my sons and daughters , saith the Lord Almighty . " 2 Cor 6:14-18


Those things originated with pagans, and were associated with Easter festival of spring and fertility. They are not new things as far as Easter is concern. Don't claim ignorance, you know these things. Why not put your question this way: 'instead of tracing the origin of the celebration of Jesus' resurrection, you are tracing the origin of Easter celebration'.

You did not answer my question. you set a question for yourself and answered it. We all know Christ instituted the Lord's supper, it is not an issue of "if". Please respond to my question. What happens after i add colored egg and rabbit to my meal, will my action change the origin of the Lord's supper?

"Easter. Originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre. As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."—The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.

The origin of Easter is pagan, and will not change. The name Easter remains Easter, and has not changed from birth. Eggs and rabbits were associated with Easter celebration from the beginning, and they have not changed, therefore, your question is not relevant in this regard. Eggs and rabbits are not foreign to Easter celebration, look for another question.

See the bolded for the origin of Easter. Note the word 'originally', has to do with origin. That remains its origin, pagan. Eggs and rabbits were there from the beginning. If you have a particular celebration in mind you want us to talk about, better open up and stop this rigmarole.

Zikkyy: We are saying the same thing. the problem i have with you is that you are not reading my posts. Read my question again below:

"If we change the name of the Lord's supper to 'sango' today, will that make the Lord's supper of pagan origin?"

and your response was.....

"The Lord's supper was divinely instituted, so nothing would change for those who would still observe it as was divinely given to them."

Nothing would change for those that observed as given by Jesus abi? so what are saying with response? are you saying the Lord's supper is now of pagan origin? maybe you don't know what it means to say something is of pagan origin. It means we can trace the root/beginning of that celebration to a pagan practice. so will changing the name of the Lord's supper to "sango" prove that Jesus adopted a pagan practice? i don't think so. What i read you say with your response is that it will not change the origin of the Lord's supper because it was divinely instituted. So no change of name can paganize a practice God recognize.

I want you to do the same the celebration of Jesus resurrection. prove that it started as a pagan practice (prove that it was not a variant of the Lord's Supper or some other celebration). and just like the the Lord's supper, you cannot prove on the ground that somebody change the name after 700 years of practice. you cannot prove it on the ground that some people modified the celebration 1,200 years later (i.e. easter egg and bunnies). You will have to go back to the very beginning and show the motivation for the first set of celebrants. To do otherwise will be to rely on hearsay or assumptions.

Notwithstanding the fact that religious leaders proclaim Easter as a Christian celebration - celebration of jesus' resurrection, it is still pagan. No matter when ester eggs and bunnies were introduced, they are still pagan. Easter celebration is pagan. It's you that have to prove that what you are celebrating is not pagan, not someone else.

...and my conclusion does not imply that 'anyone' would do it under an idol's name. my focus was on the impact the name change will have on the origin of the Lord's supper. i.e. will the name change imply that Jesus adopted a pagan practice? because this is what you have been telling me with easter.

...again i ask that you prove that the first set of people that celebrated Jesus resurrection used easter bunnies and easter egg. also prove that the name easter was used by the first set of celebrant. is my request that difficult to understand?

Freksy: We cannot discuss the origin of Easter celebration without the origin of the name, "Easter". The origin of the name 'Easter' is very crucial to knowing what the celebration is all about and how it got started. For example, if Easter is the name of a pagan goddess, an idol, that will simply tell you that Easter is the name of a pagan goddess, and thus, the celebration is in the name of an idol.
After the above, we then begin to look at the origin of its customs.

Origin of the name + origin its customs. Is that not what the above implies? Which one will be your proof, can't you defend your faith? Are you afraid?

Zikkyy: Don't conclude yet. The issue of name is not something i have given serious consideration. my focus for now is on the origin of the celebration.

'Originally' here as used here is saying that the term 'Easter' referred to the 'spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring'. The name was later used to describe the Christian festival designed to celebrate Jesus resurrection.

Then, does it require a rocket science for one to know that 'Easter celebration' is carrying an idol's emblem? The origin of Easter celebration will always take you to pagan, if you like try it a million times. I have told you, those eggs and rabbits you see in Easter festival do not miss their way at a.......ll! They know where they belong! Why not we talk about celebration prior to Easter in Christianity.

It depends, which Easter are you referring to? the celebration of Jesus resurrection or the spring festival? If you are referring to Jesus resurrection, i will say i don't know. if you referring to the spring festival, the question is not necessary.

If i may ask, how many Easter do we have? Can you prove that the festival supposedly designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ was also called 'Easter'?

It depends. the goddess did not trademark the name. you can modify your question by being a bit specific. For the Babylonians Easter may be referring to a goddess.
BTW, you are yet to answer my question.

She did not trademark the name, but she trademarked her belongings, how can you reconcile that? The Catholic Encyclopedia tells us: "A great many pagan customs, celebrating the return of spring, gravitated to Easter. The egg is the emblem of the germinating life of early spring. . . . The rabbit is a pagan symbol and has always been an emblem of fertility."—(1913), Vol. V, p. 227.

Zikkyy: Good! What you stated here is that a name cannot 'paganize' a practice if that practice is acceptable to God. a practice is still pagan if it is not acceptable to God, even if you call it God's supper, it's still going to be pagan. You can see the issue of the name is not relevant in accessing the celebration of Jesus resurrection. So we can now drop the name origin issue and focus on the practice to determine if it's acceptable to God or not.

Freksy: It will surely make the name to be of pagan origin, if 'sango' is pagan. Worst still, if 'sango' is the name of a goddess, an idol, be 100% sure that worshiping the almighty, a holy being, in the name of an idol, will be futile. I am sure you knew this.

If there is such a change, many sincere worshipers of God who knows the implication of that will repudiate the change, and will not take part in worshiping God in the name of an idol.
Are you thinking the pagan traditions in Easter celebration crept in by chance? By the time we trace the origin of christianized passover, now known as 'Easter celebration', a lot will be revealing to you. If you have anything about the origin of the celebration, post and let discuss.

Freksy: The Lord's supper was divinely instituted, so nothing would change for those who would still observe it as was divinely given to them. There is no single sign of divine direction regarding Easter celebration, historically and scripturally.

None of my comments, in any way, supports the conclusion you have chosen to arrive. To observe the Lord's supper the way it was divinely given means you observe it the way it was. My comment does not imply that every one would do it under an idol's name, hence the expression 'for those who would still ...' Observing it under an idol's name would make it a devotion to an idol. Again, note that 'Easter celebration' was adopted, not just the name, 'easter' as you think. When you transfer its name and transfer its traditions, tell me what is remaining.

Why should i admit to something without evidence to support it. is that how you do your things? accept things based on hearsay? you are yet to provide proof that easter is rooted in pagan and you want me to just accept? no right thinking fellow will do that!

Not admitting does not mean you have not seen. Not seen does not mean they are not there for you to see. It does not also mean others may not see the facts and admit within themselves.

1. You have seen evidence that supports the fact that Easter festival originated from pagan.

"Easter. Originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre. As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."—The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.

2. You have seen evidence that supports the fact that Easter is celebrated in the name of an idol.
3. You have also seen evidence that supports the fact that many of its customs are of pagan origin.

In the book The Two Babylons, by Alexander Hislop, whe read: "What means the term Easter itself? It is not a Christian name. It bears its Chaldean origin on its very forehead. Easter is nothing else than Astarte, one of the titles of Beltis, the queen of heaven, whose name, . . . as found by Layard on the Assyrian monuments, is Ishtar. . . . Such is the history of Easter. The popular observances that still attend the period of its celebration amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now."—New York, 1943), pp. 103, 107, 108

i don't give God what am not sure of! meaning i don't give God the origin of easter celebration. If am to celebrate Jesus resurrection, i will render to God thanks, praises, prayers e.t.c that, am sure of.

Rather you are giving him pagan celebration, named after their goddess, an idol.

i believe we have agreed that the name change cannot 'paganize' a practice, if the practice is acceptable to God, so we can move forward beyond the issue of name change, abi?

Have I ever told you I can render any sacred service to God, however insignificant it may seem, in the name of an idol? No true keeper of Jesus' commandment about the love of God would do that. I will still ask you again; who inclined the church fathers on the same table with the pagans for talks on christianization of paganism, the Holy Spirit? You think those pagan practices in easter celebration missed their way? NO! They know where they belong.

"Do not become partners with those who do not believe, for what partnership is there between righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship does light have with darkness? And what agreement does Christ have with Beliar? Or what does a believer share in common with an unbeliever? And what mutual agreement does the temple of God have with idols? For we are the temple of the living God, just as God said, “I will live in them and will walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people .” Therefore “ come out from their midst , and be separate ,” says the Lord, “ and touch no unclean thing, and I will welcome you, and I will be a father to you, and you will be my sons and daughters,” says the All-Powerful Lord". 2 Cor.6:14-18

Who partnered the two parties up for worship agreement that led to adoption of an idol celebration and its customs, Easter, which was "Originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre..." - The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.

I can see you are a bit confused. okay another question; if i add bunnies and egg to the Lord's supper will that make the Lord supper of pagan origin?

Confused? Lol 1. You don't realize that Easter festival never originated with Christian, but pagan. Therefore, tracing its origin will always take one to pagan. 2. You don't also realize that the popular observances were not originated with Christian, but pagans, therefore tracing their origin will always take one to pagan. The following quote says it all about the origin of it popular observances. "...The popular observances that still attend the period of its celebration amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now."—(New York, 1943), pp. 103, 107, 108;

In answer to your question, if the Lord's supper was originated with pagan, like Easter celebration, adding eggs and co to it 'will amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character.'

Zikkyy: You did not answer my question. will the name change make the 'celebration' of the Lord's supper of pagan origin? don't dodge na! haba!

The Lord's supper was divinely instituted, so nothing would change for those who would still observe it as was divinely given to them. There is no single sign of divine direction regarding Easter celebration, historically and scripturally.

I don't have facts, that's why you don't see me condemning anything here. i work with facts. The thing is the celebrants told you guys the basis for their celebration, i think you can only condemn them or call them liars if you have facts to prove otherwise

And you continue to give God what you are not sure of. Your refusal to admit the fact that easter celebration is rooted in pagan/idol does not change it from being a fact. Anybody can refuse to accept anything. It's a matter of choice, as you said earlier.

But it was only the name that changed na! and the god of thunder did not trademark the name! that name probably mean something good in Chinese or Greek or Latin

The name changed to what? Who inclined your church fathers on the same table with the pagans that leads to the adoption an idol's name, the Holy Spirit? 'Do not become partners with those who do not believe, for what partnership is there between righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship does light have with darkness? And what agreement does Christ have with Beliar? Or what does a believer share in common with an unbeliever? And what mutual agreement does the temple of God have with idols?[/b] For we are the temple of the living God, just as God said, “I will live in them and will walk among them , and I will be their God , and they will be my people .” Therefore “ come out from their midst , and be separate ,” says the Lord, “ and touch no unclean thing , and I will welcome you, and I will be a father to you, and you will be my sons and daughters, says the All-Powerful Lord'[/b]. 2 Cor. 6:14-18

So you don't know that those pagan customs associated with Easter were also adopted. You have seen paganism written all over easter, and still claim there is no fact. Keep touching the unclean things! The quoted scripture is self-explanatory.

Zikkyy: Naming does not equate to origin. we don't have enough facts for this. from information posted so far, it appears the name easter surfaced centuries after inception.

If Easter or eaostre is the name of a pagan goddess nkor, the goddess trademark the name abi? it's the same people that named the goddess eaostre that is also withdrawing that name and using it for another purpose?

Anyways joke aside,i told you already so long as it was introduced centuries after inception, the so called pagan rites cannot qualify as evidence to prove origin.

There's not much difference between what you call pagan custom and custom of God's people (especially in the old testament you are quoting). I don't understand you sha! which one be christianization of cake again? are you saying you don't eat cake i think you are taking this thing too far. haba!! Lets consider that bible verse again:

"The children gather firewood, the men build fires, and the women mix dough to bake cakes for the goddess they call the Queen of Heaven. They also pour out offerings of wine to other gods, in order to hurt me." Jeremiah 7:18 The Goodnews Catholic Bible (GNTCE)

If you take time to read the quote above, you will see that God is not angry that they gathered firewood, he is not angry that they build fires, he is not angry that they baked cakes, he is not angry that they poured out offerings of wine. The only thing annoying the Almighty is the fact that the actions were directed at other gods "in order to hurt God". the pagan activity in that bible quote is the worship of other gods. The theory that the use of any material is a sin because pagans used it cannot hold, unless the materials used is clearly forbidden by God.

Na wa ooh! it cannot be that bad na!

...and they were also not told to avoid such celebrations. Christians are not robots. we have freedom to do everything good and pleasing to God, and God did not tell you he is not happy with the idea of people celebrating Jesus resurrection. the theory of "they were not told to do" cannot hold. If there is an embargo on celebration or rejoicing, i will understand.

Now you are talking. you are stepping up to my level now. make i give you ladder to climb up

What I have learnt from your recent posts is that, it doesn't matter whether we are worshiping God in the name of an idol or not. Ok consider the bolded and and answer the following two questions. Also, check the meaning of the word 'originally' from your dictionary.


"Easter. Originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre. As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."—The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.

Originally = with reference to the origin or beginning; before now.

1. What is the origin of Easter festival? Is it from pagan, YES or NO.


In the book The Two Babylons, by Alexander Hislop, we read: "What means the term Easter itself? It is not a Christian name. It bears its Chaldean origin on its very forehead. Easter is nothing else than Astarte, one of the titles of Beltis, the queen of heaven, whose name, . . . as found by Layard on the Assyrian monuments, is Ishtar. . . . Such is the history of Easter. The popular observances that still attend the period of its celebration amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now."—(New York, 1943), pp. 103, 107, 108;

2. Is Easter the name/title belonging to a goddess, an idol? YES or NO.

When you answer the above two questions we will then look at how the dogma of celebrating Jesus' resurrection got started.

Zikkyy: I maintain that the origin of the name is not relevant to our discussion. The origin of the name can only be 'admitted' as evidence if that was the name given to the celebration at inception. If we change the name of the Lord's supper to 'sango' today, will that make the Lord's supper of pagan origin? i tell you forget the name unless we can use it to prove the origin, but this is not the case. it appears the celebration became known by that name centuries later.

It will surely make the name to be of pagan origin, if 'sango' is pagan. Worst still, if 'sango' is the name of a goddess, an idol, be 100% sure that worshiping the almighty, a holy being, in the name of an idol, will be futile. I am sure you knew this.

If there is such a change, many sincere worshipers of God who knows the implication of that will repudiate the change, and will not take part in worshiping God in the name of an idol.
Are you thinking the pagan traditions in Easter celebration crept in by chance? By the time we trace the origin of christianized passover, now known as 'Easter celebration', a lot will be revealing to you. If you have anything about the origin of the celebration, post and let discuss.

italo: Luke 24:41 "And while they still did not believe it because of joy and amazement, he asked them, “Do you have anything here to eat?” 42 They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 43 and he took it and ate it in their presence."

John 20:20 "After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord."

That is the account of the first Easter.

That is the root.

italo: We celebrate the resurrection of Christ, just like the apostles did.

Call it Easter, passover, pascha, pasque etc...

What matters is the essence of what we do.

The Encyclopædia Britannica comments: "There is no indication of the observance of the Easter festival in the New Testament, or in the writings of the apostolic Fathers. The sanctity of special times was an idea absent from the minds of the first Christians."—(1910), Vol. VIII, p. 828.

Zikkyy: You want me to leave comment under irrelevant references? well, if leaving comment will make you happy, find below my comments:

Okay some pagan customs ended up being part of easter celebrations. Is this reference telling us that the pagan customs listed above were part of the celebration at inception? No! is this evidence to proof that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? YES!

Okay people were hunting for colored easter eggs and it was not child's play. we don hear/read. Is the reference telling us that hunting for colored eggs was part of easter celebration at inception? No! Evidence that easter is of pagan origin? No! Discard? Yes

Okay, this one is saying that some Anglo-saxon guys migrated the Easter name to the Christian festival "designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ". "designed" being the keyword here. The Christian festival was "designed" to celebrate Jesus resurrection. All they moved was just the name. is this evidence to proof that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? YES!

Okay, the name easter is not a Christian name. no wahala. is this evidence to proof that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? SURE!

Hmmm. A quote from the book Jeremiah. Dem don begin celebrate easter that time? are you saying easter celebrant actually bake cakes for the goddess they call queen of heaven? How is this related to the celebration of Jesus resurrection? is this fact to prove that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? SURE!

Okay the hare has been a traditional symbol of Easter in Eurpoe and was a symbol of fertility in ancient Egypt. so how is this related to the celebration of Jesus resurrection? is this fact to prove that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? SURE!

Okay, some of easter customs are likely linked to pagan traditions. Your reference also says that egg decoration date back to 13th century. that's centuries after peeps started celebrating easter. Is the reference telling us that egg decoration was part of easter celebration at inception? No! Evidence that easter is of pagan origin? No! Discard? SURE!

Okay, the bible did not talk about rabbits delivering eggs to well-behaved children. so what is this telling us? Is the reference telling us that this custom was part of easter celebration at inception? No! Evidence that easter is of pagan origin? No! Discard? SURE!

Your reference is telling us easter candy started in the 1930s, can you also provide the date peeps started celebrating easter so we can compare? Is the reference telling us that this custom was part of easter celebration at inception? No! Evidence that easter is of pagan origin? No! Discard? SURE!

Parade date back to mid-1800s. okay we don hear

Freksy: "Easter. Originally[the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre. As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."—The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.

Zikkyy: Okay, this one is saying that some Anglo-saxon guys migrated the Easter name to the Christian festival "designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ". "designed" being the keyword here. The Christian festival was "designed" to celebrate Jesus resurrection. All they moved was just the name. is this evidence to proof that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? YES!

1. Originally, easter was the festival of sping in honor of the goddess of spring.
2. In 8th century Christians named their festival supposedly designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ after a pagan goddess, an idol called "Easter".
Summary: Easter festival originated from pagan. The celebration of christ's resurrection is named after a pagan goddess, an idol.[/quote]

Freksy: In the book The Two Babylons, by Alexander Hislop, we read: "What means the term Easter itself? It is not a Christian name. It bears its Chaldean origin on its very forehead. Easter is nothing else than Astarte, one of the titles of Beltis, the queen of heaven, whose name, . . . as found by Layard on the Assyrian monuments, is Ishtar. . . . Such is the history of Easter. The popular observances that still attend the period of its celebration amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now."—(New York, 1943), pp. 103, 107, 108;

Zikkyy: Okay, the name easter is not a Christian name. no wahala. is this evidence to proof that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? SURE!

1. Easter is the name of the queen of heaven, a pagan goddess, an idol........origin of the name.
2. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now...... Origin of some of its customs.
Summary: Easter is the name of a pagan goddess, an idol, "the queen of the heaven." Some of the easter rites, as shown in 2 above are of pagan origin.

Freksy: "The children gather firewood, the men build fires, and the women mix dough to bake cakes for the goddess they call the Queen of Heaven. They also pour out offerings of wine to other gods, in order to hurt me." Jeremiah 7:18 The Goodnews Catholic Bible (GNTCE)

Zikkyy: Hmmm. A quote from the book Jeremiah. Dem don begin celebrate easter that time? are you saying easter celebrant actually bake cakes for the goddess they call queen of heaven? How is this related to the celebration of Jesus resurrection? is this fact to prove that easter originated from pagan worship? No! We should discard? SURE!

Since Easter is the name of a goddess, the queen of heaven, are those making offerings and sacrifice of praises in her name different from the man at Jeremiah 7:18?
God's anger was kindled against his people whenever they adopted these pagan customs. But those who adopted the pagan Easter festival were not interested in following the Bible. They Christianized the pagan cakes, so they thought, by marking a cross on the top of them, thus the hot cross buns.


If someone, after a careful look at the above, says you are a proud idolater, how would you convincingly prove that you are not?

Zikkyy: Mr. Freksy, i hope you are happy now can we go back to discussing the origin of the easter celebration? or we can conclude that we don't know much about the origin. If you agree to this conclusion (meaning i don't expect to read you shouting that easter originated from paganism), maybe we can move on to discussiing the issue of the ADD-ONs you listed.

Far be it! Freksy is not happy with you, the reason is obvious. However, we can go back prior to the time your church fathers adopted an idol name for their christianized Passover supposedly designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ - a thing they were not told to do. The said celebration did not originate with the tag 'Easter' on its forehead, it was later adopted by your church Fathers. So we can talk about how it got started prior to the tag 'Easter' on it forehead.

Zikkyy: Oga freksy, please make up your mind! I don't like discussions without focus. What exactly is your issue with easter? is it the origin of the name "Easter"? or is it the origin of the celebration itself? my initial understanding was that we were discussing the origin of the easter celebration. wetin concern this discussion with the origin of the name "Easter"? that's a totally different topic sir.

We cannot discuss the origin of Easter celebration without the origin of the name, "Easter". The origin of the name 'Easter' is very crucial to knowing what the celebration is all about and how it got started. For example, if Easter is the name of a pagan goddess, an idol, that will simply tell you that Easter is the name of a pagan goddess, and thus, the celebration is in the name of an idol.
After the above, we then begin to look at the origin of its customs.

Zikkyy: Again you get it wrong. It is not about seeing anything wrong in freksy's post; my response to any post is usually based on the purpose or objective of the poster. He is trying to prove that easter is of pagan origin and to achieve this he provides evidence that trace easter bunny, egg & candy to pagan practice. he did not achieve his aim of proving the origin of easter because his post is not saying that easter egg, bunny e.t.c were incorporated into easter from the very day people started celebrating. If it came as add-on centuries later, how does that make easter of pagan origin. it is a totally different thing if he comes here and say the celebration of easter has been corrupted with pagan practice, then we can begin to look at that post as trying to support that line of argument.

Your comment shows you did not read through my post from top to bottom. Has it occurred to you that i made, at least, four quotations, each with references before those online links? Are you saying not even one of them talks about the origin of the name "easter" in christianity? Like i told you before, your failure to see does not mean others do not. Leave your comments under each of those references, starting from The Catholic Encyclopedia (1913), Vol. V, p. 227.

Zikkyy: You are not saying anything. If your church group have something against Easter celebration, i expect you should be able to do your research and come up with your conclusions especially when your church did not provide info on how they arrived at such conclusion.

There are things i would consider before asking if these customs can be found in the bible. one is first asking the nature of people adopting these customs as part of their celebration. Are you going to consider a pagan that sacrifice a goat on Easter day to his god (e.g. sango), and prays to his god as celebrating Easter? Before you begin to condemn a practice first separate those actually performing that practice from those that uses the opportunity to do their own thing.

..and you are afraid of posting facts from these sites?

what exactly are my counterclaims? no need me leaving comments on each of these references cos the references are not relevant to the discussion.

What truth? are we discussing origin of easter egg and bunny or we are discussing origin of Easter? if somebody decides to incorporate atilogwu dance in his celebration of the Lord's supper, that makes the Lord supper of pagan origin abi?

You think it's not obvious who is afraid? What prevents you from commenting under each of those references you claim is not true and stop this 'circle dance'?

Zikkyy: Reading this your long post, i don't see anything here that says easter celebration (celebration of Jesus resurrection) is of pagan origin. abi you don't know what it means to say a celebration is of pagan origin?

What have you seen, those customs as originating from the bible? Can you point out to us how any of them is related to the resurrection of Christ? There are numerous online sites that discusses the origin of various Easter customs you see today, of this you know. I intentionally restricted my online references to that provided by italo, to minimize argument. Can you please leave your comments under each of those references to enable others examine your counterclaims, and know who is telling the truth?

Please note that your failure to see the truth regarding the origin of those aforementioned customs associated with Easter celebration today, does not mean others have not.

italo: "The exact origins of this religious feast day's NAME are unknown. Some sources claim the word Easter is derived from Eostre, a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. Other accounts trace Easter to the Latin term hebdomada alba, or white week, an ancient reference to Easter week and the white clothing donned by people who were baptized during that time. Through a translation error, the term later appeared as esostarum in Old High German, which eventually became Easter in English. In Spanish, Easter is known as Pascua; in French, Paques. These words are derived from the Greek and Latin Pascha or Pasch, for Passover. Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection occurred after he went to Jerusalem to celebrate Passover (or Pesach in Hebrew), the Jewish festival commemorating the ancient Israelites' exodus from slavery in Egypt. Pascha eventually came to mean Easter."

http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter

Some sources claim the word Easter is derived from Eostre, a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility.
For the above to be true there must be remnants of paganism in Easter celebration today. Interestingly, the last paragraph from the link provided by italo shows that over the centuries various folk customs and pagan traditions, including Easter eggs, bunnies, baskets and candy, have become a standard part of this holy holiday.


Do other sources agree with the evidence provided by italo's link that pagan traditons have become a standard part of Easter? The answer is, YES!

The Catholic Encyclopedia tells us: "A great many pagan customs, celebrating the return of spring, gravitated to Easter. The egg is the emblem of the germinating life of early spring. . . . The rabbit is a pagan symbol and has always been an emblem of fertility."—(1913), Vol. V, p. 227.


"Everywhere they hunt the many-colored Easter eggs, brought by the Easter rabbit. This is not mere child's play, but the vestige of a fertility rite, the eggs and the rabbit both symbolizing fertility."—Funk & Wagnalls Standard Dictionary of Folklore Mythology and Legend (New York, 1949), Volume 1, page 335.


"Easter. Originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre. As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."—The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia, 1944), by John D. Davis, page 145.


In the book The Two Babylons, by Alexander Hislop, we read: "What means the term Easter itself? It is not a Christian name. It bears its Chaldean origin on its very forehead. Easter is nothing else than Astarte, one of the titles of Beltis, the queen of heaven, whose name, . . . as found by Layard on the Assyrian monuments, is Ishtar. . . . Such is the history of Easter. The popular observances that still attend the period of its celebration amply confirm the testimony of history as to its Babylonian character. The hot cross buns of Good Friday, and the dyed eggs of Pasch or Easter Sunday, figured in the Chaldean rites just as they do now."—(New York, 1943), pp. 103, 107, 108;


"The children gather firewood, the men build fires, and the women mix dough to bake cakes for the goddess they call the Queen of Heaven. They also pour out offerings of wine to other gods, in order to hurt me." Jeremiah 7:18 The Goodnews Catholic Bible (GNTCE)


Easter Bunny
In Europe, the hare has long been a traditional symbol of Easter. (In North America, the animal is a rabbit—a close relative of the hare.) Yet The New Encyclopædia Britannica explains that the hare was "the symbol of fertility in ancient Egypt." Thus when children hunt for Easter eggs, supposedly brought by the Easter rabbit, "this is not mere child's play, but the vestige of a fertility rite."—Funk & Wagnalls Standard Dictionary of Folklore, Mythology and Legend, volume 1, page 335.


"The Bible makes no mention of a long-eared, short-tailed creature who delivers decorated eggs to well-behaved children on Easter Sunday; nevertheless, the Easter bunny has become a prominent symbol of Christianity's most important holiday. The exact origins of this mythical mammal are unclear, but rabbits, known to be prolific procreators, are an ancient symbol of fertility and new life... " http://www.history.com/topics/easter-symbols (Through your link, http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter)


Easter Eggs
"Easter is a religious holiday, but some of its customs, such as Easter eggs, are likely linked to pagan traditions. The egg, an ancient symbol of new life, has been associated with pagan festivals celebrating spring. From a Christian perspective, Easter eggs are said to represent Jesus' emergence from the tomb and resurrection. Decorating eggs for Easter is a tradition that dates back to at least the 13th century, according to some sources. One explanation for this custom is that eggs were formerly a forbidden food during the Lenten season, so people would paint and decorate them to mark the end of the period of penance and fasting, then eat them on Easter as a celebration...."
http://www.history.com/topics/easter-symbols (Through your link, http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter)


Easter Candy
"Easter is the second best-selling candy holiday in America, after Halloween. Among the most popular sweet treats associated with this day are chocolate eggs, which date back to early 19th century Europe. Eggs have long been associated with Easter as a symbol of new life and Jesus' resurrection. Another egg-shaped candy, the jelly bean, became associated with Easter in the 1930s (although the jelly bean's origins reportedly date all the way back to a Biblical-era concoction called a Turkish Delight)...."
www.history.com/topics/easter-symbols (Through your link, http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter)


Easter Parade
"In New York City, the Easter Parade tradition dates back to the mid-1800s, when the upper crust of society would attend Easter services at various Fifth Avenue churches then stroll outside afterward, showing off their new spring outfits and hats...." http://www.history.com/topics/easter-symbols (Through your, link http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter)

italo: "The exact origins of this religious feast day's NAME are unknown. Some sources claim the word Easter is derived from Eostre, a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. Other accounts trace Easter to the Latin term hebdomada alba, or white week, an ancient reference to Easter week and the white clothing donned by people who were baptized during that time. Through a translation error, the term later appeared as esostarum in Old High German, which eventually became Easter in English. In Spanish, Easter is known as Pascua; in French, Paques. These words are derived from the Greek and Latin Pascha or Pasch, for Passover. Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection occurred after he went to Jerusalem to celebrate Passover (or Pesach in Hebrew), the Jewish festival commemorating the ancient Israelites' exodus from slavery in Egypt. Pascha eventually came to mean Easter."

http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter

Many have argued that Easter replaces the Jewish festival, "Passover", but ignor the fact that Jesus replaced the Passover, not with Easter, but with his memorial supper. Though the word "Easter" appears in the King James Bible, however, this was later admitted as an error of the translators. The original Bible word pascha simply means "passover," and that is the way modern translations (including the NKJV) render it.

If Easter means Passover, it implies that what you people are celebrating is, in fact, the commemoration of Isrealites' exodus from Egytp, and not the resurection of Christ, as you claim. Based on this and the returning of the word "Passover" to statusco in the NKJV, Pascha or Passover does not mean "Easter", as your church fathers earlier claimed and taught. Easter remains what it is - Easter/Eastre/Eostre/Ishtar, the goddess of spring and firtility, the Queen of heaven. Easter is rooted in pagan traditions. - See the last paragraph in the link you provided. http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easterr compare Jeremiah 7:18.

italo: "The exact origins of this religious feast day's NAME are unknown. Some sources claim the word Easter is derived from Eostre, a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. Other accounts trace Easter to the Latin term hebdomada alba, or white week, an ancient reference to Easter week and the white clothing donned by people who were baptized during that time. Through a translation error, the term later appeared as esostarum in Old High German, which eventually became Easter in English. In Spanish, Easter is known as Pascua; in French, Paques. These words are derived from the Greek and Latin Pascha or Pasch, for Passover. Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection occurred after he went to Jerusalem to celebrate Passover (or Pesach in Hebrew), the Jewish festival commemorating the ancient Israelites' exodus from slavery in Egypt. Pascha eventually came to mean Easter."

http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter

The exact origins of this religious feast day's name are unknown. Some sources claim the word Easter is derived from Eostre, a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. Other accounts trace Easter to the Latin term hebdomada alba, or white week, an ancient reference to Easter week and the white clothing donned by people who were baptized during that time. Through a translation error, the term later appeared as esostarum in Old High German, which eventually became Easter in English. In Spanish, Easter is known as Pascua; in French, Paques. These words are derived from the Greek and Latin Pascha or Pasch, for Passover. Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection occurred after he went to Jerusalem to celebrate Passover (or Pesach in Hebrew), the Jewish festival commemorating the ancient Israelites' exodus from slavery in Egypt. Pascha eventually came to mean Easter.

Easter is really an entire season of the Christian church year, as opposed to a single-day observance. Lent, the 40-day period leading up to Easter Sunday, is a time of reflection and penance and represents the 40 days that Jesus spent alone in the wilderness before starting his ministry, a time in which Christians believe he survived various temptations by the devil. The day before Lent, known as Mardi Gras or Fat Tuesday, is a last hurrah of food and fun before the fasting begins. The week preceding Easter is called Holy Week and includes Maundy Thursday, which commemorates Jesus' last supper with his disciples; Good Friday, which honors the day of his crucifixion; and Holy Saturday, which focuses on the transition between the crucifixion and resurrection. The 50-day period following Easter Sunday is called Eastertide and includes a celebration of Jesus' ascension into heaven.

In addition to Easter's religious significance, it also has a commercial side, as evidenced by the mounds of jelly beans and marshmallow chicks that appear in stores each spring. As with Christmas, over the centuries various folk customs and pagan traditions, including Easter eggs, bunnies, baskets and candy, have become a standard part of this holy holiday.

http://www.history.com/topics/history-of-easter (Link provided by italo)