₦airaland Forum

dalaman:
The ventriloquist in the video below does a far better job than the Osanyi doll in my opinion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL357BrwK7c

surely..

Ifeann:
I didn't intentionally cover ur texts I ruled over ur red with white to differentiate it from my own red maker..
Ur highlights are still in ur earlier post for all to see.

let me agree..

Ifeann:
Apparently u don't understand what u read about John. ..one theory is that he was a withness who documented the events, wrote it and died very old

And you fail to mention this theory didn't mention John the apostle was the writer huh?...

Ifeann:
The 2nd theory is that it was written by another converted scribe who belonged to Apostle John's community.. that said ..this is the opinion of a bible commentary on the gospels... different scholars have different opinions and NT scholars often have little consensus between them. U need to read more John.

Both hypothesis were proposed by new testament scholars...
Yet this particular hypothesis didn't mention John as the writer still..

I wonder why you still cling to this your traditional belief that John wrote it when clearly New testament scholars says the contrary..

Ifeann:
However if the gospels where fakes I would expect tonnes of differences between them.. however they are so similar in their narrative that the 4 are termed synoptic gospels.

The four synoptic gospels copied heavily from mark, with additional additions from the authors yet they succeeded in creating contradictions in my places.. 300 gospels (now referred as the Gnostic gospels) dismissed at the council of Nicene surely would have told a different story.

Ifeann:
This conversation is getting boring.
My intention is to point out holes in ur argument so that u don't decieve others just because u read a commentary on the gospels origin and became an atheist.

Am starting to search for the holes you pointed out
And then assuming i read commentary and became an atheist is another fallacy and a big flaw in your arguments.(BIG LIE) stop using assumptions when dealing with people..ok dude?

At the end you just sieve out the information you think is ok for your belief and dismiss others ...lol..

dalaman:
What does this Osanyi do? Does it have supernatural powers?

Just watched the video.. just some dude squishing one instrument, takes a dry gin and gives some to some idol he carrys around then resumes the squishing... lmao.. nothing spirity..

folaski:
haa yes.
well dreams are a miniature /kind of astral travel. which is an out of the body experienced. the soul/ spirit of man leaves the body and travel as an independent entity while the body is still living.

dont you know these things?

hahahahahaha so this your own definition of dreams?

woooow am short of words..

Can you quickly give me a definition of dream as defined in ur dictionary please?

folaski:
what are you referring to? what post?

check ur mentions..

DProDG:
The topic was on 'dreams' and not dream interpretation. Also, I wonder why you quoted mid-sentence...

"Dream Interpretation is the process of assigning meaning to dreams. In many ancient societies, such as those of Egypt and Greece, dreaming was considered a supernatural communication or a means of divine intervention, whose message could be unravelled by people with certain powers."

Well, you cited a source and didn't swap "was" for "is" so I'll give you credit for that.

And left my quote on that unattended... lolzzz.. i know he had nothing more to add.. lmao...

the code name 666 was a name the author of revelation potrayed the emperor Domitian who persecuted the christians so officials wouldnt understand whom he referred to as the anti-christ...

Why are christians and satanist making a big deal out of it...

[size=20] they were more than 300 gospels available during the council of nicene of which only 4 got voted into the bible by emperor Constantine and other church fathers.. most of the early now called gnostic gospels were not added cus it clearly contradicts each other just like even the four sypnostic gospels contradict themselves too but with similarities..[/size]

Ifeann:
Dude u have to understand that depending on one literature source is poor scholarship..ur captured screenshot mean little..

let me start by saying they agree with me as well see shots below.. look at what I said about mark and John. .the dates agree with me... including when I said the theory is that John died a very old man. Like is told proton above john is unconservatively estimated to be 90 years after Jesus. . It means at most 90+33 = 123 AD.. Even tho some people say it's as early as 90AD that is 57 years after Christ. Do u get the picture ..


2. I said mark is estimated to be 30 years after the fact...30+33 is 63 ad. .

Peter was was a fisherman and not a scribe,same as some other disciplines hence they may have had others write their stories it's possible or they may have written it themselves I don't know, I wasn't there but the truth remains the assumption that a second generation christain wrote it is pure conjecture and even if true does not make a difference. I think u mistake second generation to mean second century. .I can have someone write my own biography , I don't need to write it myself.

a generation is 30-40 years, hence if it is assumed that mark was written in 65 ad that is 32 years after christ then u can see why someone can also assume it was written by a second generation christian. But there is no evidence for that argument.

U may ask ..why wasn't the gospels written earlier..well they were being persecuted by the jews and Romans and their was probably no time to sit down with scribes and write but Paul was very literate and wrote letters himself. This explains his many letters . Peter the ex fisherman was more into the ground work winning new converts to christiandom and was murdered. . Most of the apostles went to their bl.oody deaths believing in Christ. .

lmao.. after covering my marked texts...anyway... so quick to dismiss a snapshot even from a christian bible..

Do you now agree that the gospels were not written by the people they bear their names?

You keep arguing that John died a very old man even when its clear he wasn't the author of the gospel according to John..

about the gospel of john i marked to proposed hypothesis of how it was written, not surprised you overlooked the second marked space..

let me poste the pic again now take the two marked places into consideration...

Ifeann:
I see how u cleverly skip my other question on prophesies. ..anyway that's besides the point..

How quaint you chose to forgo the jewish talmud messiac prophecy i told you and dabble into misinterpreted prophecies... can you list one of those prophecies for me and all to see?

Ifeann:
Again Johnny there are things u say that shows ur naiveté.
For example

too bad you can never argue without employing unnecessary ad hominem.. **sighs** anyways..

Ifeann:
The jewish communities and lands have been attacked and destroyed hundreds of times throughout history..Google is ur friend....use it... I agree that one may say that there is little evidence to suggest jewish presence in egypt same as their is NO evidence to conclude that jews were never there.

If you are referring to the various attacks and destructions as seen in the likes of nehemiah and meccabeus, its all part of the everyday events of ancient world.. every civilization face wars and attacks so the jewish attacks is nothing special..

Ifeann:
But that said this one event doesn't mean that jews were or were not oppressed in egypt or elsewhere..besides you don't expect ancient records of Egyptians to contain significant information on a little slave tribe.. also bear in mind the Great Library of Alexandria which may have contained any such records was destroyed along with so many ancient secrets. Not to mention the destructions the muslims did to civilizations by annihilating records kept by scribes , monasteries etc after they took over...so much information has been lost.

lmao.

i love the excusses..

Ifeann:
U see ...the evidence to make absolute statements from an atheist perspective is lacking. The theists have concrete records informs of manuscripts no matter the perceived conflicts. Whereas the atheist has only conjecture.and assumptions. .


Hoold on.. I just saw u said that the gospels are second century write ups... tisk tisk tisk... who told u this Bart ehrman, Richard Dawkins,..for.bel? ?? Lol.. the latest gospel is John which is unconservatively estimated to be 90 years after Jesus.. the consensus and evidence point to the theory that apostle John died a very oldman.
.
The gospel according to mark is said to be 30 years after the fact..

Johnny boy u have a lot of reading to do.

For this their is nothing i can say to make you drop your belief about the authorship of the supposedly synoptic gospels..leme drop some snapshots for you taken from the New community Bible on introductions to the gospels.

Now dude i bid you to go dabble more and check how these tales were concorted then come back

Ifeann:
Thrive is very different word from beginning. timeline of Ancient Mesopotamian civilization is 5000-3500 BC: The first city-states gradually develop in southern Mesopotamia. This is the achievement of the Sumerian people. The jewish records go as far back as this..bear in mind the jews were an oppressed people who didn't THRIVE in anyone place for long.. so u are right to say the mesopotamians thrived before the jews but did they exist or begin much before the jews.. so u saying this and I quote , "It is possible they copied from the jewish fable just like it is possible that the bible copied from koran.. " is without credibility.

Abraham the jewish patriarch is from the land of Ur in ancient mesopotamia.
Bearing this is in mind the mesopotamians clearly were in existence before the very founding fore-father of the jewish race Abraham..
The issue of jews being an oppressed nation is not a historical fact, cus their is no record or external historical source that suggests jews were ever in egypt..

Ifeann:
You also said


Even tho there is evidence for sea shells on top of mountains whixh scientists have tried to explain..I won't try to convince u a great flooding may have caused this. ...Again ..Christains believe in a God that is all powerful ...if he could send all animals to a great big ark .. it is possible to make all of 2 species fit and not consume each other should he please. .this is far more believe literally than the garden and fruit and creation tale which I often view as allegorical. This is why your former church's Catholic universities teach evolution in their university..evolution is outrightly rejected by Muslims.

The same way the christians believe this, is the same way the mesopotamians believe it was the supreme god Ea and indian mythology attributes it to vishnu, they are all implausible fables but as you said all points down to BELIEF...

Ifeann:
Now to the last point ... apparently u misunderstood me... I am not talking about end time prophesies. Not revelations but more of Isaiah, genesis etc from the OT. .I am talking about prophesies that have already been fulfilled about the the Messiah. .christains, Arabs, Mohammed, turkey, syria, Babylon.. etc haven't u read anything on these..

The messiah prophecy as listed in the talmud quite contradicts the Jesus messiah tale thats why adherents of judaism rejects the jesus messiah claim till today and which is why the jewish scripture of talmud is missing from the christian bible..... the Christian bible being a work of emperor constantine and early christian fathers in Nicene..

The gospel being second century christian write ups (this you must have known) is still a debatable source since it contradicts each other and proves not to be first hand accounts but second century work based on oral traditions.

check out the debates in a thread created by frosbe.l a christian

https://www.nairaland.com/2072612/wrote-new-testament

https://www.nairaland.com/2042507/why-deny-virgin-birth-jesus

Ifeann:
Johnny , 3 questions

is it impossible that these other folks copied the jewish tales on this matter.. knowing fully well that several times in history jews tribes are often driven out from their hosts communities and their historical records, torah, tamuld and other manuscripts etc stolen, confiscated or destroyed..?

The mesopotamian civilization thrive thousands of years before that of the jews.. stories like the mesopotamian creation story, gilgemesh fable have been there thousands of years before the emergence of jewish civilization...
It is possible they copied from the jewish fable just like it is possible that the bible copied from koran..

Ifeann:
Is it also impossible that such an event or something similar occurred and tales of it got passed from generation to generation and hence variations occur in different records by different civilizations. ..be it jewish or otherwise?

It is wolrd wide knowledge that the mesopotamian flood story is myth, their are no archeological evidence to support a world wide flood, neither is it possible for millions of species to fit into one ark and live for a year (carnivores eating herbs ..lol) . . .The story itself clearly shows it's implausibility.

Ifeann:
I would like to know how a young atheist such as urself reconcile the possibility of these 2 scenarios.

I have thought about some of these things..
The biggest argument for the christain scripture is the accuracy of its prophesies. ..

This bring me to my 3rd question... have u read anything on biblical prophesies ?

Peace.

The prophecy of the end of the world is a very wide spread prophecy that we all have heard about, which is causing so much scare in christiandom as it stands today...

laniyi07:
mr oga! whet my appetite first before I do my own research ok. I am not impressed at what u put up already. give me links to the Gilgamesh original account of flooding so I can objectively read and get back to you. not some wikipedia write up (I fit edit article on wikipedia sef).




I cant do your wirk fir u sir

I even provided a snap shot of a biblical explanation seems you failed to see that too..

It obvious you never knew about any other flood myth before, you are just hearing it today... lolzzz..

This is the stage i tell people google.com.ng is your best friend..

laniyi07:
MY BELIEF IS MY REALITY.......hope this helps

I can see clearly now

what

woooooooooow and this is special.

nawa oo

folaski:
"dreaming was considered a supernatural
communication or a means of divine intervention" en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_analysis

the bolded already said it all... [size=20] was [/size]... lol ..now let me oblige you the definition of dreams since you purposely dont want to define dreams for me..

Dreams are successions of images, ideas, emotions, and sensations that
occur involuntarily in the mind during certain stages of sleep .
Dreams are just a figment of your mind, your brain to be precise so i wonder how you intend to make it help you say something like the spirit world exist.

now back to our discussion... How did you know the spirit exists?

5minsmadness:
And I told you my statement wasn't absolute. Stop being so desperate for points.

And your question is a rethorical one, son.

lol not absolute..

chai... !!!...smh

5minsmadness:

It's amazing how you select what you want to read and totally ignore the point being made

Here. Let me help you:


The difference in numbers is practically in the millions

Anti-God
Anti-Christian
Anti-Christ.

First of all compare the number of christians that turn atheists to that of muslims, they greatly outnumber the later..

in my own words i told you

Most of the atheist you see here were once christians, so they argue with you based on what they know

so funny you ignored that and carried on with your anti-jewish deity crap..

Your early post stated that atheist dont attack other deities

5minsmadness:
Have you ever noticed how 'atheism' is not anti-Allah or anti-amadioha
or anti-buddah. Read all the websites on atheism including the threads
and posts here on naira land. Atheism is anti-God, specifically the
Christian God. All the sarcasm and jokes and jibes are not directed at
Allah or Buddha or Zeus, despite the former two boasting a very
substantial followership. You guys are fighting in an army you don't
even know you have been recruited in.
Atheism is supposed to mean Anti-theism but in reality it is anti-Jewish
God.
Anti-Jewish God
Anti-Christian
Anti- Christ.
Use your so called liberated minds and think for yourselves.

now when i proved you wrong, you resorted to comparing numbers... lolzz nice defence..


Christians turned atheist greatly outnumber muslims that turn atheistic by millions, so they attack what they know ....

Can you now rest it and answer my question boy...

which God are you afraid of..

laniyi07:
substantiate ur claims sir

a simple google search would have helped you but no you prefer blind belief of jewish mythology..

Wikipedia encyclopedia [b] Origins
See also: Panbabylonism
The Mesopotamian Epic of Gilgamesh, composed about 2500 BC, contains
a flood story almost exactly the same as the Noah story in the Pentateuch,
with a few variations such as the number of days of the deluge, the order
of the birds, and the name of the mountain on which the ark rests. The
flood story in Genesis 6–8 matches the Gilgamesh flood myth so closely
that "few doubt that [it] derives from a Mesopotamian account." [10] What
is particularly noticeable is the way the Genesis flood story follows the
Gilgamesh flood tale "point by point and in the same order", even when the
story permits other alternatives. [11]
The earliest written flood myth is found in the Mesopotamian Epic of
Atrahasis and Epic of Gilgamesh texts. "These mythologies are the source
of such features of the biblical Flood story as the building and provisioning
of the ark, its flotation, and the subsidence of the waters, as well as the
part played by the human protagonist." [12] The Encyclopedia Judaica
adds that there is a strong suggestion that[/b]

try and research more...

and below is a picture of the explanation as given by the New Community Bible ..

5minsmadness:
Oh yeah I forgot.
We are in the Google age where you can search anything even Atheism talking about ice-cream and it will pop up.


Of course my statement wasn't absolute. Definitely atheists have talked about Islam and other religions. But which belief do they primarily target?

Now kindly Google atheism and Christianity (12,900,000 results), compare atheism and Islam (8,550,000 results). Atheism and God (16,800,000 results), compare Atheism and Allah (665,000 results!), Atheism and Jesus(13,000,100), Atheism and Mohammed (438,000 ),

And finally, just to show you can actually get all sorts of nonsense links off the internet;
Atheism and ICE-CREAM(318,000).




Your Atheism is an army whose primary aim is to ridicule God, Jesus and the Bible.

You are fighting in an army you don't even know you have been recruited into.

Lmao... you just confirmed it boy... now say atheists don't redicule islam again

now back to the idea of God..

oya which of the God(s)
zeus?
horus?
osiris?
allah?
yahweh?
mithras?
sango?
amadioha?

which of them do you fear?

[size=16]"First cause
Argument" Something can't come out nothing, therefore everything that exists
must need a creator" lol...

Using a god that always existed doesnt solve this problem, it only postpones it.
Because you have to assume your god didn't need a creator (pops out of
nothing) and created everything out of nothing.. Failing in your own argument..

If you can assume your god don't need a creator then i can say such for the
universe.
But if something can't come and out of nothing then Your god cant exist on it's own

it must have been created by another god, who then must have been
created by another and the chain goes on resulting to a chain of infinite regress.
Bringing such a thing as "a god did it" is a huge stab in the intellectual curiosity

of man and drastically reduces your willingness and ability to acquire the
knowledge of how it happened.[/size]

folaski:
check this out: when you sleep in an air conditioned room and you had a dream that something is pitching you and you are running and sweating in the dream. when you wake up sweating, scared and tired. how do you explain what happened between the visible and invisible. between the physical and the superphysical. How would you explain the man that was running in the superphysical and the one sweating in the physical?

lets start from there.

lobatan so this is how you know their is a spirit world? i don die

Ok back to the questions.. Can you define dream for me?

5minsmadness:
Have you ever noticed how 'atheism' is not anti-allah or anti-amadioha or anti-buddah. Read all the websites on atheism including the threads and posts here on naira land. Atheism is anti-God, specifically the Christian God. All the sarcasm and jokes and jibes are not directed at Allah or Buddha or Zeus, despite the former two boasting a very substantial followership. You guys are fighting in an army you don't even know you have been recruited in.

Atheism is supposed to mean Anti-theism but in reality it is anti-Jewish God.

Anti-Jewish God
Anti-Christian
Anti- Christ.

Use your so called liberated minds and think for yourselves.

lmao i wonder which planet you are in... You have not seen atheists attacking Allah, lolzzz you really have not seen anything yet...

Most atheist you see here were once christians so they argue with you based on what they know.

i wonder how many atheist website you have visited ok let me just give you one example
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIur6akd0YQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
and this too
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEv3oRODkek&feature=youtube_gdata_player

and also check this website the-militant-atheist.org/quran-quotes.html

now get your facts straight and stop playing the victims card..

This desperate attempt of yours to say atheist dont ridicule muslims and their allah is so fallacious that i just fall flat and laugh at it...

btw atheism doesnt mean anti-theism it simply means non-theist..

please i ask again which God du fear.

Zeus,
Allah,
Horus,
yahweh,
osiris,
mithras,
sango,
amadioaha?

laniyi07:
when u say 'follow' wat exactly do u mean? are you sayin gilgamesh (or watever u call it) flood event happened before the bible's.
which account do u believe in gilgamesh or genesis(bible)

He is saying that the gilgemesh fable is a myth from whence the bible's account was copied and reworked ...

folaski:
i know that the spirit world exist

Interesting... i am going to enjoy this.


So How did you get to know bro?

The story of moses being put in a basket then set adrift in a river is just a reworking of a similar story of Sagon an ancient king of Akkad that has been told thousands of years before the moses fable found only in the bible and no other source... is that not strange..a story as juicy as moses tale have no other historical mentions except in the torah a jewish inspired conpiled mythology.. makes sense..

folaski:
let me ask you a question

does the spirit world exist?

Spirit world kwa... this is the type of fairy tales we find very laughable..

Do you think spirit world exist?

malvisguy212:
you can insults me,no problem. I assured you, very soon it will all end.
End mean, the world may end anytime or our life may end anytime and we will give account of our self.

The world have been ending for more than 2000years now...

Dead people give accounts? with pen and paper i guess..

it was pope leo X that said [size=20] It has served us well, this myth of christ [/size]

folaski:
it is education without the fear or reference of God that produces smart devils

which God... Amadioha?

DProDG:
Infidel!!!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-i3mX0YRrjM

hahahahaha abeg oooo make you no kill me like muslims ooo..

or brand me a devil like christians ooo...

chai...

#WeFuckingLoveAtheism

5minsmadness:
I swear I am not.
Well, wait a bit... Yeah a little. It is God you are talking about. You believe in your (whatever you believe in) so much that you are willing to ridicule and insult the MOST popular Immortal on earth... Just cos you learn to read and figured out the meaning of atheism or humanism from Google... You guys even carry it on your head more than the white folk, the same white people that preached Christ to your ancestors, the same white people teaching you atheism. You think you are now thinking freely but in reality even your thoughts on atheism are not originally yours. You are still following the same white folk. Even they are not as blasphemous in their write-ups but Nigerians being what they are will always want to outdo.

Darn. I hope you guys are right. Because then death would be the end of it and we will all have nothing to lose. But if you are wrong...

Royally Fvcked!

Lolzzz in every culture they have been skeptical people from the very beginning..

No one taught me anything like they are teaching you now..

I found religion to be implausible and that is it.. the label atheist is just a way people identify those who dont believe in fairy tales...

So please now which of the gods are you afraid of..

Amadioha?
zeus?
sango?
yahweh?
osiris?
allah?
horus?
mithras?
ikenga?
etc..