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Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 3:26pm On Jun 15, 2018

Godpolymath:
i love mother earth,i think i will start worshipping her

Lol

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 10:44am On Jun 15, 2018

DeSepiero:
I won't argue that the exaggerations weren't intentional for specific purposes as it is very likely. However, my concern is on how we perceive the stories and discern the real ones from the imagined one.

In this case, your focus is on a portion of the revelation by John and as we see, it was really influenced by the times in which he lived.

Alright

So do you expect John, who supposedly walked the earth a couple thousand years to describe something he saw the same way a 21st century man would?
He described things he 'saw' by words available in his vocabulary.

No No No. Descriptions of unknown things are usually executed by employing a combination of near words available to discriber.

John's description did not show one that was alien to his knowledge, his descriptions were vivid and precise.

Example: In Igbo land when we first came in contact with bicycles, we called them Iron horse (inyinya igwe) this hints on both the material and animal we believe it mimicks. And to a 21st century mind, iron horse connotes a mechanical horse.

In John's case, his descriptions were direct and precise.

Let me put it in a different light.
The way my great grand father would describe a television when he saw it the first time (if at all he saw it) may sound ridiculous to me.

But your great grand father's discription of a TV would have an subtle inference to its mechanical nature.

The book of Ezekiel, he referred to a vision where he saw a living creature with eyes all over, wheels for legs that could turn in every direction.

Ezekiel 1.

When I looked, I saw a stormy wind coming from the north. There was a great cloud with a bright light around it and fire flashing out of it. Something that looked like glowing metal was in the center of the fire.

Now as I looked at the living creatures, I saw a wheel on the ground by each of the living creatures with its four faces. 16 The wheels and the way they were made were like this: They looked like sparkling chrysolite. All four of them looked the same, like one wheel crossways inside another wheel. 17 When they moved, they went in any one of the four directions, without turning as they went. 18 The rims of the wheels were high and frightening and were full of eyes all around.

19 When the living creatures moved, the wheels moved beside them. When the living creatures were lifted up from the ground, the wheels also were lifted up. 20 Wherever the spirit would go, the living creatures would go. And the wheels were lifted up beside them, because the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheels. 21 When the living creatures moved, the wheels moved. When the living creatures stopped, the wheels stopped. And when the living creatures were lifted from the ground, the wheels were lifted beside them, because the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheels.

22 Now, over the heads of the living creatures was something like a dome that sparkled like ice and was frightening. 23 And under the dome the wings of the living creatures were stretched out straight toward one another. Each living creature also had two wings covering its body. 24 I heard the sound of their wings, like the roaring sound of the sea, as they moved. It was like the voice of God Almighty, a roaring sound like a noisy army. When the living creatures stopped, they lowered their wings.

This discription was showing a technology that was alien to Ezekiel's culture and time. But he managed to discribe them using words that were attainable to his time but still exhibited a clear distinction between what was normal and his discription even though he used normal words.

John's visions and descriptions did not come in this format.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:06am On Jun 15, 2018

DeSepiero:
Hello Johnydon22,

I'd like to ask some questions.

Alright brother.

Do you think all stories in the bible are false?

No. But like every religious book there are two intents behind the biblical stories.

1. For theological purpose
2. A hint of history.

The stories that are intended as theological lessons both in Old and New testament are mostly false or exaggerated and they constitute a bigger part of the bible. Example, Job, Daniel etc.

The stories that attempt a hint at history have subtle truths in them even though largely exeggerated: E.G: Ezdras

Are all happenings imaginations?

No. Theological stories however are meant for one purpose, to impact spiritual edification and upliftment. E.G: The story of Israel being rescued from Egypt was written as a time of Babylonian exile trying to make the people strong and faithful that their salvation is at hand. It was for a theological purpose not historical.

Are all the characters fictional?

No. There are many biblical characters I happen to think once walked this earth, even Jesus himself.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:42pm On Jun 14, 2018

CAPSLOCKED:

NAH.. EZEKIEL HAD TO ARGUE WITH GOD. THEN......

Oooooh

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:35pm On Jun 14, 2018

CAPSLOCKED:

HEY IZIKEL WAS THE GUY THAT WAS MADE TO LIE ON HIS SIDE FOR MANY MONTHS, AND EAT BREAD MADE OF SHĪT RIGHT? HAHA; D

I think that was Jeremiah..

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:35pm On Jun 14, 2018

CAPSLOCKED:

THE "SCROLL" PART GOT ME LAUGHING.

TRUTH IS, THOSE STORIES WEREN'T INSPIRED BY SOME DIVINE ENTITY.

THE BOOK OF REVELATION TALKED ABOUT "SCROLLS" BECAUSE THAT WAS THE MAIN RECORDS KEEPING MATERIAL AS OF THE TIME THE BOOK WAS WRITTEN.

IF IT WAS WRITTEN DURING THE TIME OF MOSES, ROCKS OR TABLETS WOULD HAVE REPLACED SCROLL.

THE STORIES ARE JUST MANS IMAGINATIONS. 7 HEADED BEASTS, TRUMPETS, CHARIOTS.. SKY DWELLERS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE SPIRITS, WHO DON'T NEED ANY MEANS OF TRANSPORTATION. LOTS OF THINGS ARE FUCD UP IN THE HOLY BOOK.

Man and God met each other on the road and both yelled "My creator!"

3 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:34pm On Jun 14, 2018

nwabekeyi:
anyways, I don't believe in revelations

I don't too. But I find the revelation of Ezekiel fascinating

Christianity Etc › Re: Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:21pm On Jun 14, 2018

nwabekeyi:
I think the answer should be God uses things that familiar to us in a revelation.

I don't believe in revelations though

Ezekiel had a revelation that was drastically different from things attainable to his time.

I think that contradicts this idea

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Gods Are Always A Reflection Of Man by johnydon22(op): 8:11pm On Jun 14, 2018

Revelation 19 : 11 - 14

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He [a]had a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

You may have come across this same line many times but everything seem in order but try and look at this from a different perspective.

The writer of Revelation was discribing the splendor of Christ's second coming. JESUS and his angels were coming riding on white horses

This was at a period when man's transportation technology was no more than horses, chariots, carriages.

It seems the technology of heaven are always of a reflection of that of man?

Why?

The book of revelation always vividly discribes the information technology of heaven.. Scrolls

The canon of the revelation is hinged on its status as a revealed truth of God but this profound realisation leads to these questions.

1. Today, we use cars, jets and motorbikes. Jesus and his angels are still riding horses?

2. If yes, does this show heavenly technology is a reflection of the times these books were written?

3. If No. Why? What changed? Why did it change?

If you have a critical look at these clues they mean one thing. These tales are human inventions. Every description of God and heaven bears the pawprint of human inspiration.

Gold is our favorite metal, heaven is literally made of Gold.
At a time we rode horses, heaven rode horses.

Gods seem to be a perfect mirror of man at each point in his life.

7 Likes 2 Shares

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 12:10pm On Jun 14, 2018

Blakjewelry:
Religion was created by the ancient to control population, control man's animality and as well as trying to explain the world in which they find themselves but as we grow mentally, we are expected to question all, but we in this part of the world are afraid to explore the unknown or rather we prefer someone to think for us.

It is not so difficult to understand why we make up such stories to comfort ourselves. Our intelligence makes our lives an existential horror because we are almost certainly the only creatures on this world that know that certainly we will die one day.

This knowledge of the inevitability of our end is a burden which we must find ways to manage properly. Other species just live in the moment, you don't see dogs or cats performing rituals to secure a life after this.

The knowledge of our fleeting lives, the knowledge of our limited time comes crashing down on us, our loses stare at us blankly in the face. We must derive a way to proper hold this weight, to comfort ourselves in our vulnerability.

We must see the dead ones again
How can i not see my loved ones again?
How can i close my eyes and never open them again?

The darkness of our fate is encompassing and intimidating to our mind. That is where heaven came to be, paradise, earth without corruption, life after death.

We can finally say to ourselves 'Don't worry, this is just the beginning, after this we continue to bask in an eternal bliss that unlike this one, lasts forever'

Do i really blame us?

No.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 12:04pm On Jun 14, 2018

LightSpirit:
This transcendence is the harmony of duality. Take for instance a river flowing between two banks. The banks appear opposite, but at every depth, both banks unite as bed. Life is like a river with division into banks on the surface and the same banks merging as bed at the depth.

basically, the equilibrium of duality.

Imagine a concept where this equilibrium is lacking, there are no two sides to this river, is it still a river?

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Please Explain This by johnydon22(m): 9:38pm On Jun 13, 2018

Godpolymath:
guyv witch don sit down ontop my matter

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 9:37pm On Jun 13, 2018

dada01:
Actually, it does. You are trying to paint a perfect society by discrediting the beliefs of a perfect abode for believers, while at the same time neglecting the fact that the perfect society you are painting here could be a construct of human. And this construct could be altered. Say for instance a paradigm shift in the working of society/civilization as you know it, into a state of calipate, socialism, or what we dont know.

What

Christianity Etc › Re: Satanist Loses Suit To Strip Phrase ‘in God We Trust’ From Currency by johnydon22(m): 9:36pm On Jun 13, 2018

Jesutomisin:
http://naijachurchnews.com/33211-2/

A U.S. appellate court has ruled against a self-described Satanist from Chicago who had filed a lawsuit seeking to remove the motto “In God We Trust” from U.S. currency.

The ruling, released May 31, found that.... read more..http://naijachurchnews.com/33211-2/

its just plain idiocy. People take trivial things way too seriously.

does it matter if there is "In God we trust" on a dollar bill or not?

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Please Explain This by johnydon22(m): 9:32pm On Jun 13, 2018

Godpolymath:
i saw a cockroach,i said to myself i must kill this thing today..

before i went to take my shoe to hit it,it disappeared ..i was searching my room for it so that i will kill it.

i later saw it inside a narrow hole,so small even ant can hardly enter,so i said to myself today na today this thing must die...

i went to pick a broom so that i can use it to push the cockroach out,b4 i came back it disappear completly.

please atheist explain this

hahahahahahaha what exactly has atheist got to do with your insect problems at home?

Christianity Etc › Re: 'Religion Has Done More Harm To Man Than Technology' - Twitter User Says by johnydon22(m): 9:31pm On Jun 13, 2018

Anas09:
Who or what is God?

I fail the importance of this non sequitur premise to the discussion.

And atheism is not a call for religion to be eradicated? Am i missing something?
Butterflyleo pl come help me see how these guys are trying by all means to twist the obvious.

Perhaps you didn't see this part of my post Anyone can be antireligious though many atheists are. Some aren't.

Atheism is pro religion then?

Neither pro nor anti. You can be any of these when you are an atheist.

I'm yet to meet an atheist who is pro religion.

By pro-religion, what do you mean?

secondly, that you have not seen doesn't mean there is none.

Any atheist who is not anti religious is not an atheist yet.

wow.

You mean religions like Toism and the rest? Do these New Age philosophies have a supreme being to which they allude or venerate?

These are self worship religions. They are called religions because they worship themselves as gods, not a Supernatural Uncaused first Cause God.

They are atheist too because atheism is self worship and they worship themselves.

ok.

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 9:04pm On Jun 13, 2018

LightSpirit:
Sure, there is the yin and yang - the spokes of a wheel.

The pairs of good and evil, god and devil, light and shadow, mountain and valley etc represent polar end of the same energy. You cannot choose one without also inviting the other. This is the tragedy of man, he is always in tension - a rope drawn between two ends. He choses one end, the other pole draws him.

But there is a third alternative, and that is the transcendence of duality.

Does this transcendancy connote singularity of a dual concept?

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 9:02pm On Jun 13, 2018

dada01:
I think you are a little biase here. Society just like religion was also created to achieve order and avoid chaos. A society without law and order is better imagined thn experienced. My point here is, we lack the substantial knowledge to question the social order of the universe, religion included. Sometimes dont you just settle down to see that everything in the society revolves around money (which is being printed and minted by us)and hence economy, that sounds organize to me and nobody is questioning this order, we are all cool with it, but are quick to question religious order/belief.

I think the entire premise of the post is lost to you.

This post is entirely non sequitur to the point or argument raised by the post.

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 7:51pm On Jun 13, 2018

Blakjewelry:
One thing people don't realize is going to heaven is totally useless because that is living a life without purpose and it is the task of of trying to achieve something that makes life more interesting. In heaven it won't take long before someone gets tired and look for some damn apple to chop and let the circle continue lol

Hahahahaha paradise doesn't make one ounce of sense objectively.

It lacks meaning and substance.

Destroying earth to gain paradise is like abandoning substance to chase shadows.

1 Like

Culture › Re: I Am 25 And Doing Nothing With My Life, I Beg You - Help Me by johnydon22(m): 7:16pm On Jun 13, 2018

You will be all right.

Christianity Etc › Re: A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 7:09pm On Jun 13, 2018

Emusan:
All what you wrote would have been meaningful and true, had it been the Creator hasn't revealed Himself to people.

This applies for both a created and uncreated world with either a revealed or unrevealed creator. The premise is just as valid.

If people of old have actually imagined it the way you portrayed it then our generation can't confirm it.

Do you know any concept of paradise that have these negatives?

Christianity Etc › A Perfect World Or Heaven. Not Really As Good As You Think by johnydon22(op): 6:42pm On Jun 13, 2018

When we look at the things wrong with this world or more correctly, things we think are wrong we this world, we can't help but try to imagine, create our own perfect world.

Paradise
Valhala
Heaven
Earthly paradise

These are all our creations or maybe our attempt to conceptualize what a perfect world would be like.
No suffering, No pain, no sadness, no want, no tears, no cold, no anger, aggression, fear and so forth
These are negative experiences we come across every day on earth. We somehow create an utopia that would do a way with them.

Imagine a perfect world.

Try as much as possible to imagine such a world.

there is no death.
no worries
no wants
no tears
no sadness.

Do they sound good?
Or do you understand that such a world is inherently flawed?

We may bask in the euphoria of a heavenly bliss or an earthly paradise where nothing negative ever resides.

But is this really a good thing?

Opposing concepts derive meaning from one another.

Hot and cold
up and down
sadness and joy
tears and laugher

This is from whence the chinese philosophy derived the concept of Yin and Yang. Evil and good are forces that cannot do without the other. Without yin, Yang is useless and meaningless, vise versa, the only way they make sense is together.

If there is no up how does the concept of down make any sense?

So does a world where there are no suffering, pain, tears, needs, struggles make any sense?

No. it doesn't.

On earth, we are certain that we are going to die one day, that realizations makes the time we have precious to us.
We understand sadness and thus we appreciate joy
We understand pain, hence laughter is something we crave
We know suffering, success becomes soothing
We know lose, we appreciate opportunities.
We have wants and needs, we try as much as possible to achieve them therefore deriving a sense of purpose and fulfillment.

Take the negative sides of life away, nothing makes sense anymore.

You cannot understand happiness if there is no sadness.
the concept of success shatters if failure is out of the picture.

So imagine a world without these negative sides, it will be a world devoid of every meaning, devoid of every essence or sense of fulfillment.

Imagine yourself in a perfect world.

Build a perfect world, a paradise or a heaven and put yourself into this world.

And then ask yourself and answer sincerely.

What exactly would i be doing in such a world?

Throw in the idea of forever as the case is for heaven. A billion trillion billion years, you have not even started. That is when you will understand that it is just void.

Imagine a perfect world?

I'd say, we are already in a perfect world.

12 Likes 4 Shares

Christianity Etc › Re: 'Religion Has Done More Harm To Man Than Technology' - Twitter User Says by johnydon22(m): 11:52am On Jun 13, 2018

Anas09:
An Atheist is someone who lacks a believe in anything he can not see. e.g Spirits.

Incorrect

An atheist simply do not believe in God.

Doesn't matter what other things you believe in, seen or unseen. As long as you don't believe in God, you are an atheist.

An Anti Religious person is someone who is against someone who believes what he cannot see, eg, Spirits.

Wrong.

Antireligious just is against the institution of religion, often believes it is important for religion to be eradicated.

Atheism isn't same thing with Antireligious.

Anyone can be antireligious though many atheists are. Some aren't.

An atheist can also be religious, there are in fact religions that are formed on a fundamental atheistic assumption (No God or indifference to God).

Who then is an atheist? An atheist is an anti religious person who is against anything which can not be seen or proven by an empirical study.

Someone who lacks belief in God. Q.E.D

Christianity Etc › Re: Christinsanity by johnydon22(m): 8:19am On Jun 13, 2018

Anas09:
I'll find time to check them out to see how they connect to the subject under discourse here.

I will help you: They don't exist. But they made $1.9billion world wide and are being talked about too.

1 Like 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: Christinsanity by johnydon22(m): 10:20pm On Jun 12, 2018

Anas09:
Jon, it bits me why a smart ass guy like you will spend a life time talking something which does not exist. Isn't that madness?

You have never heard of Thanos and Tony Stark then. Infinity wars grossed $1.9billion world wide

Christianity Etc › Re: Christinsanity by johnydon22(m): 8:44pm On Jun 12, 2018

Anas09:
Na me head dey ache, na you want dey take Para. for why nah?

Livam for me.

Belief is often not personal but shared. People who believe in Jesus often talk about it, people who trust Muhammed often do too. Why can't someone who don't often say 'this is bullshhitt" too?

Christianity Etc › Re: Christinsanity by johnydon22(m): 4:04pm On Jun 12, 2018

Anas09:
I'm here to let you know you don't need to worry about our delusion. Live your life Free of Christ.

Stop talking about another person's delusion, that in itself is a mental issue.

Why?

Christianity Etc › Re: Members Being ‘forced Out’ Of Church Of England For Being Gay by johnydon22(m): 12:11pm On Jun 12, 2018

Ubenedictus:
yeah, they were wise, after they got acceptance now they are sending out those who disagree with them.

the Church of England seem to be dying two times faster than the average European Church, closely followed it seems by the Lutherans.

This is due to flexibility of tradition.

The Catholic church is traditionally more rigid and strong. Must it too will be caught in that drift

Christianity Etc › Re: Hypocrisy And Irony Of The Christian Religion by johnydon22(op): 8:59pm On Jun 11, 2018

HardMirror:
i wonder why topics like this dont make it to the front page.

Seun ooo !!!

Christianity Etc › Re: Members Being ‘forced Out’ Of Church Of England For Being Gay by johnydon22(m): 8:58pm On Jun 11, 2018

Ubenedictus:
the Anglican Church has already decided to welcome gay and lesbians, that is their rule.

the gays are going to the conference to ask those who can't keep the rules to get out of the Church.

That is some take over shiit.. grin

Christianity Etc › Re: Hypocrisy And Irony Of The Christian Religion by johnydon22(op): 8:54pm On Jun 11, 2018

Ubenedictus:
that is certainly hypocrisy

Thank you. It certainly is.

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheism Is Stupidity by johnydon22(m): 5:59pm On Jun 11, 2018

Ibart:
are you ready to discuss?

About what?

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