BraveGuy: #1. God has revealed Himself by His Son, yet you refused to believe. #2. I am a living proof that He fixes lives. He fixed mine! And He's fixed so many others who chose to put their trust in Him. #3. He's method of bringing peace is through individuals who would acknowledge Him in their lives .... "The Kingdom of God is not about partying and revelries, but righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit."
I guess you're a very angry man, angry at God and the world. You must accept that as agents of free choice and not preprogrammed robots, we are responsible for the evil we have caused the world. God did not make atomic or nuclear bombs; God did not make Bill Clinton cheat on his wife by committing adultery; and God did not invent Las Vegas; and certainly not Ebola!
But I can tell you that He has inspired not a few people to help humanity in no small way: George Washington Carver was inspired by God to give us peanut butter Sir Isaac Newton was a man of God who brought untold development to science and technology. Gary Keith Starkweather was inspired through the Bible to invent the Laser Printer (Listen to him in this short interview about another unique invention God helped him with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eFLQoBXMHI#t=116)
I will conclude with the words of Abdus Salam, winner of the 1979 Nobel Prize in Physics for his work in electroweak theory. He is here quoted in his article entitled Science and Religion: “A scientific discovery is also a religious discovery. There is no conflict between science and religion. Our knowledge of God is made larger with every discovery we make about the world.”
Don't you agree with the adage that "Evil happens because good men sit still and do nothing about?"
PastorAIO: The psychological question: What is it about uncertainty that makes it so unpalatable? Why do human beings need to fabricate so much fantasies in order to eradicate the feeling of ignorance? What is the difference between the mind of the guy that can just say "I don't know and I'm comfortable with that" and the guy that say "I've got it, I know all the answers and I'll coerce everybody into agreeing with me or I'll never find rest"?
The importance of life itself is undermined, everything seems to be at risk. That's what I understand.
ggrin: [b]BAMBOO One day I decided to quit…I quit my job, my relationship, my spirituality. I wanted to quit my life. I went to the woods to have one last talk with God. “God”, I said. “Can you give me one good reason not to quit?” His answer surprised me. “Look around”, He said. “Do you see the fern and the bamboo?” “Yes”, I replied. “When I planted the fern and the bamboo seeds, I took very good care of them. I gave them light. I gave them water. The fern quickly grew from the earth. Its brilliant green covered the floor. Yet nothing came from the bamboo seed. But I did not quit on the bamboo. In the second year the fern grew more vibrant and plentiful. And again, nothing came from the bamboo seed. But I did not quit on the bamboo. “In year three there was still nothing from the bamboo seed. But I would not quit. The same in year four. “Then in the fifth year, a tiny sprout emerged from the earth. Compared to the fern, it was seemingly small and insignificant. But just six months later, the bamboo rose to over 100 feet tall. It had spent the five years growing roots. Those roots made it strong and gave it what it needed to survive. I would not give any of my creations a challenge it could not handle. “Did you know, my child, that all this time you have been struggling, you have actually been growing roots? I would not quit on the bamboo.. I will never quit on you. “Don’t compare yourself to others.” He said. “The bamboo had a different purpose than the fern. Yet they both make the forest beautiful. “Your time will come”, God said to me. “You will rise high” “How high should I rise?” I asked. “How high will the bamboo rise?” He asked in return. “As high as it can?” I questioned “Yes.” He said, “Give me glory by rising as high as you can.” I left the forest, realizing that God will never give up on me. And He will never give up on you.[/b]
Why do we live at all, what is the purpose? Are these challenges set just for the sake of challenges? What is the value of life compared to the afterlife, and what is the use?
Emmalot121: This is my second account. Let's just say 'creature' was an human error . I don't need to view your link cos I've read stuffs like that. You call bible a fairytale? Come off it! Tell me which one is a fairytale, is it Nebuchadnezzar or crossing of red sea or the fall of the great wall of Jericho? History will explain better. Tell me a place in Bible that God told Istrael to fight for fun? Or maybe you really think God a small boy, cos his a three letter word. If he destroys the universe, what are you gonna do?
I read where after the Palestines had taken the ark of God, which slain a great number of people, they took the ark to a certain people, those people shouted and cried, their cries were heard in heaven and they were not slain. This shows you that it is sin that separates man from God. I'm sure you don't understand the story of Isaac or you're playing a fast one.
It is very sad that you don't know what is called theory and law, if you do, the law of matter(energy) is constant and as gone through all observable checks. Big bang is a theory because it still has a hell lot of questions to answer.
You say you believe in an Infinite being, who created the world, but that being is silly enough not to reveal himself. Faith is something extraordinary and scientific, if you have great faith, give it the most difficult of puzzles, it will unravel it.
I am not here to prove silly that God(of Bible) exist, but here to defend my FAITH .
As per bolded it means when God uses someone to tell you details about your past that no one knows. God uses it to touch lives and provide solutions to peoples problems.
Do successful cancer treatments count as miracles?
Does the construction of the pyramids count as a miracle?
Do our planes and space rockets count as miracles?
PastorAIO: To make it a product of any sort from our imaginations is to give too much credit to his postulation. Such a 'God' is UNimaginable even. He is merely assigning a term to the unknown and unknowable. However we don't even know how much unimaginable and unknowable stuff is out there. Is it all God? Or is God only a part of what is unimaginable and unknowable? What else can be found beyond our reality and beyond our minds?
A big epistemological problem indeed, Kay17.
Yes, and a necessary attachment to God is a strong faith, which ought to compensate for the epistemological trauma. It is almost impossible to talk about God without involving our very psychological constitution. Most of the believers, Deepsight inclusive; are adamant convicts in the existence of certainty. They can not live a life with uncertainties, a life without a destiny.
asalimpo: religion, speaking for the bible-only, places injunctions on morality not creativity. Infact, a person who obeys d dictates of the bible fully will b outstandg in his field.
I don't understand what you are trying to say here or how it relates to my post or the OP.
I don't see any atheist argument against God being criticized.
Before you make a reply to me, elect between which has a greater value, the truth or falsehood.
As regards your OP, there is an apparent in some parts such as a godless world (like a world without parents) can be chaotic, disorganised, with crumbled value systems, but there is one truth that emerges: the true nature of man. In a godless world, man's true will, desires, inspirations, his self emerges. Man can go as far as making himself God.
deepsight: "God would be that mind which is beyond our reality and beyond our mind and is as such considered the ultimate mind responsible for all things"
There is an epistemological problem in asserting the existence of a mind beyond our reality, comprehension, perception which compromises any knowledge of such a mind.
The bible has a very big issue with sin. In scriptures, sin is an abomination, it is an anomally, a disorder of fatal proportions, it is stupid...unnecessary...and deserving of death each and every time, it is to be avoided, discriminated against with extreme prejudice, condemned, hated and spat on. Infact with the picture scriptures paint of sin, one should be irritated by it, disgusted by it.
Now, what do you do when a friend or even a stranger sins? Are will to lump him together with his sins? Hate him, spite on him, discriminate against him, condemn him or probally kill him or anyone else each and every time they sin?
If the christian cannot differentiate the sinner from his sins, if he cannot see in the sinner one who is loved by God with a potential for goodness, greatness and love. Then all sinner will be dead (the world will be empty) or we will have a caste system of the righteous and the sinner, becos the so-called saints will be disgusted by the sinner and decleared him unworthy of friendship. That is what happen when the sinner is hated along with his sins.
Jesus on the other hand presents "goodness" as a call which we are all free to answer, righteousness doesn't happen in one day and God is interested in each and every one and wishes to accompany each person in his search for what is good, what is true, what is excellent, what is pure and what is beautiful. As such man isn't his sins even though he is responsible for them and they are associated to him, man first and foremost is a being with potential to goodness, to beauty, to all that is right.
The practical meaning is that when i discuss with the guy down the street or even when i examine my own life and see my sins, i do not discriminate against or hate him and myself for sins, i am ready to tell him and myself about all good thing trusting that God accompanies us all on our journey moving us from within to fulfilment.
If you can't see the sinner in a positive light then your teaching will be of no use to both him and yourself. He will pick the cues of your arrogance and self righteousness, your hypocrisy will be a block to the truth you teach.
Yet your and God's expression of love towards the sinner would be inhibited by the supposed sins. Look at the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, the people were punished by fire, and that's hardly an expression of affection rather a typical expression of hatred. My own contention is that it is difficult to contain two contrasting emotions for a person and his actions separately.
Dammyrosky: What is God? God is a spirit. Who is God? God is d creator of heaven nd earth.
1. I complain a lot whenever people say God is the creator of heaven and earth because that function is not an intrinsic quality of God, it is not what God's being is about. Theists would disagree that God has a readily purpose of creating heaven and earth (which would have implied he was created).
2. who is a spirit? most of our ideas and imagination of spirits are borrowed from folklore and myths. A spirit in my belief is as difficult as God to define.
Ubenedictus: now it seem you are argueing against urself.
I never said the sinner is not responsible for his sins, what i did say is that the sinner isn't the sin. As long as the sinner lives he has a chance to reject his sin and live a good life. You'll see this in the story of Jesus and maru magdalene, the law was clear on the wages of sin, but Jesus was more interested in the potential of the sinner to live a new life.
Love the sinner hate the sin, is a pastoral approach that encourages a new life thru mercy instead of thru fear. It ensures the sinner isn't discriminated against along with his or her sin.
What is the practical implication of loving the sinner, hating the sin have?
Misogynist2014: INCEDIBLE!!! Nothing can't spring out of nothing? Then our world shouldn't be in existence. That is flawed logic and fallacy. To certainly say you know something means you know everything about it. That you can't do something or that mankind can't do something doesn't make it impossible. Ordinary questions you can't answer, but you keep making general statements. Even the best of scientists can't display such arrogant conclusion. If they do, then the big bang is a big hoax. What you don't know is nothing is just the term we use in the absence of something. Scoring 0 in an examination is different from not having your name on the register. Just imagine it for once, if nothing doesn't exist, why does it have a name? The mystery of GOD is great!!!
I know my limits, that I can't prove to people like you that God exist, but you can easily prove to me that an all-knowing God does not exist, if only you will answer all my questions.
I know you will craftily dodge the questions. Your likers are waiting for you, don't betray them.
Misogynist2014: It is anti-wisdow to equate two independent situations which can't happen together(mutually exclusive). If the two situations can co-exist, sage, tell me how our INTELLIGENT world came into existence. Yet for the third time, you've evaded my question.
I know nothing can spring out of nothing. That's confirmed. Yet on the other hand, you believe everything is created out of nothing, it is in effect the same principle with nothing springing out of nothing.
Misogynist2014: HOW DID THE WORLD SPRING FROM NOTHINGNESS? IF THE WORLD CAN SPRING FROM NOTHINESS, THEN TELL ME THINGS YOU'VE SEEN THAT SPRANG FROM NOTHINGNESS SINCE WE SHOULD BE SEEING NEW THINGS AROUND US, POPPING OUT FROM NOTHING? YOU LIKE MANY ATHEIST THINK IT IS YOUR BIRTHRIGHT TO ASK QUESTIONS, ANSWER MINE, THEN ASK YOUR QUESTIONS. Don't chicken away. The guy liking your posts can help you.
So let's both agree that nothing can spring out of nothing AND no one can create out of nothing.
Misogynist2014: I was only trying to show you how powerful God is. As a sage once said, Little of science leads you away from God, but much of it draws you nearer to him. Lest I forget, you haven't answered my questions. God be praised!!!
Be specific to the points I raised. God is so powerful that he can create from nothingness, but the world can not be powerful enough to spring from nothingness?
Misogynist2014: 1) You asked the consequence of all designs have designers, I replied you that it means God designed everything. Since it is true that God created all worldly designers, then all their works ultimately belongs to him. I tripple-dog dare you to make something out of nothing, the tiniest grain of salt, sand, paper, water or anything you can see around you. Can you? Even sorcerers can't.
People like you think it is easier to disprove the existence of God than to prove it. Big lie! Let's start by asking you my name, the work I do and the time(second, minute, hour, day, month, year) I was born. Tell me the exact number of galaxies we have and a very great disaster that is about to rock our world. Let's tussle over this for a start.
Do you have the answers ? To disprove that an all-knowing God exist, you have to be all-knowing.
Now, you are outrightly claiming God created the Universe as a matter of fact. How did you get to know that God is the immediate creator of the Universe?!
@bolded of course for God to create the Universe in the absence of everything, it is implied he built it from and on nothing.
Misogynist2014: i. Universe was created by God, without him was anything made in our complex universe that was made. The sinful and rebellious nature of mankind(including me) has made him look far from us, even though he is with us. All we need to have is Faith.
ii. Man is in the image of God(a plural word, signifying trinity) and not the other way. Without you, your shadow is meaningless. You actually know its not you, though it has the ability to do things you can do and resembles you, you control it, but you can't destroy it. That is why God won't destroy our soul, but has the power to put us in heaven or the otherwise. Fear not the one that can destroy the body, but he that can destroy the body and soul is to be feared.
i. Your argument has changed. You have left out the premise that all designs need a designer.
Misogynist2014: Your logic is logically flawed. All what I gained from this write up is that its possible that a design exists without a designer. You capped it up by using irrelevant examples. Science itself that accuses religion that God(an infinite creature) must have been created, argue that it is not LOGICAL to say matter cannot be created or destroyed, just because its impossible on EARTH, when justifying the Big bang. Can you see for yourself? Is this not synonymous to the Christian arguement that its impossible to compare human nature to that of a Spirit. In fact, does it not take much faith to believe that a complex universe like this has no designer? Look at yourself, and nature around you, look around again(if possible, go outside to view nature), are we not to complex to be a design without a designer? Science is searching for the cure of ebola and AIDs, how can a design without a designer guarantee a cure?
If God doesn't exist, how did magic come into existence? One guy was stüpid enough to tell me magic doesn't exist. Another fööl told me if magic exist, then its independent of gods. I laughed. I told them, go to sango worshipers, with them, your silly questions are easily solved .
The Bible is a very powerful historical record, telling us how mankind was created after the GAP THEORY http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evolution%20Hoax/gap_theorists_defended.htm to enjoy and worship God on earth and how sin came into the world, which created suffering and death both in human and animal world. It tells us how mankind went after gods, who tell them to do abominable things like human sacrifice and killing of twins. It tells us how men like Abraham, Istrael served God, which led God to prefer the Israelites and how God dealt severely with Egypt, how Israelites crossed the Red Sea, and how the great wall of Jerico fell(all of which are traceable in history.)
It tells us about how Israelites also went after gods, which made God angry, in which they were severely dealt with, from invasion of Egypt, to Babylonian siege, to Roman siege and finally the HOLOCAUST. It tells us about a wonderful event which happend over 2000 years ago, when God sent his Son to the world, the gory which he passed through and the promise of the second coming.
Many argue that there are many gods, but let me give you a simple method of eliminating these gods, their account of genesis(what are you building if your foundation is very weak), if they are made by hands(a true God can't be made with human hands), If they desire fetish things like blood(true God does not require the blood of his creatures), If their book is highly contradictory e.g. Islam's book is highly contradictory, from the use of We for a supposed monotheist God, to telling us that Jesus was neither killed nor crucified but another person was, even to tell us that Jesus did not call himself the Son of God(Muhammad was born 600AD), without telling us why people wanted to kill the one who healed and cured them of their sickness. You can read quran for yourself or check this incriminating link out http://www.answering-islam.org/authors/rogers/pronouns1.html . If they don't explain what caused the gap btw mankind and God. Now tell me which religions remain. I guess its Judaism and Christianity. Judaism is the religion and believe that hates Jesus the most, just like the pharesees and saducees of Christ's time, they are proud and arrogant. They constitute the largest religious believe in Istrael and believe that Christ is coming in future and not our Jesus. They discourage their children from reading New testament and encourage them to tear it off their Bible.
Is there any question you wish to ask?
This was a very long epistle that does not address my post. I'm not saying that God must be created but I'm uprooting your own general premise that "all designs must have designers"
i. of what consequence is the general premise "All designs have designers"
Misogynist2014: Pls is it possible for a design to be without a designer? How?
asalimpo: mister, your arguments are not only logically unsound they are extremely foolish. There is simply no simple or complex functioning system that has no designer. None.
If you appeal, to "nature" to make your case,you're floored because, it is not universally believed tht nature has no creator. Christians for one,believe differently.
There can be no general premise that a design necessitates a designer because it will end up being circular. It would mean everything must be designed (even the designer), and in the worst cases self contradictory. Imagine a premise that all letters must be preceded and succeed by a letter. Letters will run ad infinitum without an end. Same with this case too.
My second problem is that the "design argument" is an observation of man's creativity, and transposing that creativity with the Universe. We as humans see a human form equally responsible for the Universe. We say Man creates boats, cars, buildings and rocket why not a greater form of man create the Universe. In other words, Gods are anthropomorphic. In fact all Gods are.
Bobbysworld28: It has an origin but dt origin is uncaused? I still dont agree with u. Read up on articles regarding what even scientists have found out the universe's origins. It will change ur views
Misogynist2014: Interesting. Pls elaborate on that, cos what you just said is worse than magic. At least we see the magician and his bag. Pls elaborate, pls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I didn't make any conclusions as to the origin of the Universe. And I don't know where/how you drew the conclusions. We, time, space, physical laws, causality, the entirety of the Universe is said to have a beginning, a starting point. All our reference points are unavailable at the beginning of the Universe, there is a fundamental shift in how we are able to conceptualize this beginning. All the basic assumptions we normally/naturally make are displaced.
Pls if you don't understand me, ask the necessary questions.
Bobbysworld28: Crazy talk. U hv sounded a bit intelligent... until now. If this is d consensus amongst atheist, then ur lot is far worse. The universe has an origin. I wont even bore u with d physics of it all. All in all, it is safe to say dt u r r.etarded because of this statement
I didn't say the Universe has no origin, rather that it has no originator. There might be a fine line between the two and you must appreciate that.
RealAlfranco: I wanted to skip this topic because I was so sure it'll get me angry. I opened it and I wasn't disappointed... I got angry! Jay Jay Okocha over-hyped? Who even thinks like this? 1. Can someone show me,with hard facts,top clubs that came after Okocha's signature and he shied away?Okocha was just unlucky. Despite his awesome talent,he was never given a look at. You'd think other 'great' players are better than him until you see him play against them. There you'll see the class difference oozing out of Okocha's play. Take Nigeria Vs Italy in '94-probably the guys calling Okocha over-rated never watched it or even a replay. 2. Never ever,everrrr say Okocha benched Ronaldinho,it never happened. Just as Giggs never benched Ronaldo at Man United.Okocha played as the number 10 at PSG,Ronaldinho skimmed from the wing(inverted left winger). Instead,the formed a deadly patnership together,its a shame they didn't win much together. Ronaldinho inherited Okocha's No10 jersey after he left for Bolton. Okocha mentored Ronaldinho and Mikel Arteta. Ronaldo slotted directly as Man nited's no7,because David Beckham left the club before Ronaldo came. Giggs and Ronaldo never crossed path. Thank You! Abeg,I take God beg una. 'Mediocre' and 'Average' should not be used to measure Okocha as a player.The teams he played for(if una wan put Nigeria,you're on your own),yes,but not him! This niqqa was named as one of 125 living footballers of ALL TIME. That's no mean feat! Y'all should take a chill pill... In summary, Okocha is not,was not,and will never be overhyped.Niqqa was unlucky!!!
Okocha was a central midfielder, not a 10 as Totti, Baggio, Maradona, Riquelme and should be judged as same. He should be compared with Scholes, Rijkaard, Essien, Yaya Toure, Viera in terms of both his attacking qualities and defensive qualities. I don't think he was really able to boss the midfield in the manner Yaya Toure does.
ROSSIKE: PELE KNOWS 100,000 TIMES MORE THAN YOU ABOUT WHAT MAKES A GREAT FOOTBALLER. He played alongside the likes of Jairzinho, Rivelino, Tostao, and Carlos Alberto. These are some of the greatest talents to have ever graced the game. Pele considers Okocha among the world's top 125 living players. The Brazilian coach, Mario Zagallo, who played alongside Pele, Garrincha, Vava, and Didi, and is credited with popularizing the bicycle kick ''shangallo'' in his heyday, ran across the pitch to salute Jay Jay Okocha after their game against Nigeria in Abuja in 2003, (some reports said he knelt and wiped Okocha's boots), saying that Okocha must be a Brazilian not a Nigerian. Now, YOU are a little kld who has probably NEVER heard of Zagallo, but these are the creme de la creme of football we're talking about. Football royalty. DO YOU THINK OKOCHA WOULD NOT HAVE STARTED IN ZAGALLO'S SIDE HAD HE BEEN BRAZILIAN? 100% definitely. SO WHAT ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? ZAGALLO CLEARLY WISHED HE HAD JAY JAY IN HIS SIDE. SO YES, JAY JAY WAS A GREAT PLAYER. HE WAS A MASSIVE PLAYER. JUST LIKE PELE, IF THE GREAT ZAGALLO SAYS YOU ARE A GREAT PLAYER, YOU ARE A GREAT PLAYER.
PROVE THAT JAY JAY ''shied away'' from the 'big clubs'. Do you even know how offers and transactions are made with regard to player transfers? Show us where Jay Jay was offered a deal by a major club and he refused or STFU.
The same Pele that said Neymar is a better player than Leo Messi.
mankand: There are tons of them. I do not know where to start from. To be honest, the first spiritual writing to be written was on stones and it is found in Egypt, in the tomb of Khufu, without these first spiritual writing, there will be no bible, koran, or torah.
There is a book titled "Osiris and the Egyptian Ressurection" There is a particular chapter that talked and emphasized about African spirituality and how it was all copied, plagiarised into all other religions. Why did you think the pope said that that all religions are true?it is simple, because they were stolen from Africa and Egypt
You still didn't prove anything, you just made a general statement, put up archetypal pictures of mother and child. None of which satisfies an ordinary curiosity. It is natural for a people with the ability to write, to write down their religious adventures. The Chinese, Aztecs, Mayans, all wrote down their religious literature in their own languages. The fact that I write a diary does not mean I plagarised it from you who had an earlier diary.
mankand: Christianity, Islam, Hindu, and all other forms of religion all stole their stories from African spirituality. Islam as a religion is not older than 500 years old,
Can you prove that?! What are the elements in the respective religions that are found in African spirituality?
paulGrundy: You have to understand sir, that there are two forces at work in the earth today, forces of Good and Evil. The forces of evil dominates our world today, it is responsible for the epidemics, flood, violence and wickedness in the world today. Although I do not seem to have the explanation as to why bad things happen to good people, but I believe our creator has a good purpose for allowing that. In time his grand design will unfold and then we would see that he is the extra-ordinary strategist.
The appropriate question is whether God has power over Evil; if yes then he is responsible for the Evils because he has the paramount power to prevent and stop Evil on the other hand, if you answer no, then God is not omnipotent and must be equivalent to the Devil.
asalimpo: atheism fries ur brain. So that u actively resist d truth even though it's glaring. Even History recognises tht Jesus lived on earth. The roman style of execution-crucifixion was real.
The Gospels were not written with an intention to serve as a record or history book. The purpose is a religious experience of the Christian community. It is largely allegorical and therefore not too valuable as a historical reference.
Christianity Etc › Re: Read This & Claim Atheism! by Kay17: 11:04pm On Oct 24, 2014
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