₦airaland Forum

~Lady~, do your own research. There were crusades before launching crusade to Jerusalem. You will see there were many crusades against Musl.ims, before the one that you listed as your first in your response to me.

You're right, the crusades of the muuslims. Wait o how did the muuslims begin to occupy the land of Jerusalem in the first place, oh yeah that's right through invasion (war)

634 A.D. Muslim invasion of Byzantine Christian Empire
Arab Muslims attack, invade and occupy Christian Syria, Armenia, Egypt, North Africa, Asia Minor, Crete and Sicily, and attempt to conquer the Byzantine Christian Empire’s capital Constantinople in Christian Turkey, until 1169 A.D. Many of these remain under Muslim occupation.

634 A.D. Muslim invasion of Palestine
Caliphate Muslims attack, invade and occupy Christian Palestine. Jerusalem (which is mentioned 154 times in the Bible but exactly ZERO times in the Quran) falls to the Muslim occupiers in 638 A.D., until retaken by the Christian Crusaders in 1099 A.D.

650 A.D. Muslim invasion of Khazar - Arab Muslims attack, invade but fail to occupy Jewish and Christian Khazar (Ukraine and Russia), until 737 A.D.

652 A.D. Muslim invasion of Southern Italy - Syrian Arab Muslims attack, invade and occupy Christian Sicily and Italy, until 1091 A.D.

700 A.D. Muslim invasion of Nubia - Arab Muslims attack, invade but fail to occupy Christian Nubia, until 1315 when a Muslim king ascended the throne.

711 A.D. Mulsim invasion of South-west Europe - Umayyad Muslims iattack, invade and occupy Christian Spain, Portugal, Andora and Gibraltar, and tried to invade France, until 975 A.D.

846 A.D. Mulsim Saracen sacking of Rome - Saracen Muslims attack, invade and pillage Rome, the very capital of the Christian church at that time. The unholy, sacrilegeous robbed the sacred relics of the Basilica of Saint Peter and Basilica of Saint Paul, but could not breach the walls of the city.


1064 A.D. Muslim invasion of West Asia - Turkish Muslims attack, invade and occupy Asia Minor and Syria, until 1308. They remain under Muslim occupation today.

1095 A.D. The First Crusade - First Crusade begins. Campaign is limited to retaking formerly Christian lands. Today, all the territory reclaimed from Muslim occupiers durng the Crusades has returned to Muslim occupation - except for Israel, which has been returned to Jewish rule after 2500 years of occupation


So my dear as you can see the muuslims started any war that is going on now. But then again all these have been erased from the history of Islam.

Yeah all that you were told is that the western world came raining on Islam. The Christians are the ones that went around and killed people everywhere.

You missed the part where the muuslims provoked everybody and started the wars that are still existing today. Muuslims are fighting people for their own land. All that was taken from the muuslims never belonged to muuslims in the first place. Muuslims massacred and took over people's lands and then cried foul when the people fought back.

Since we're talking about Spain, Spain was a Christian nation before the muuslims invaded and then the Christians took it back.

@~Lady~: Rather, the period of Inquisition, is the last phase of Crusade in Continental Europe.

Really? I thought the crusades happened after the inquisition.

The truth is after inquisition, in Spain, it is then you have Crusade.

So now it has suddenly become the last phase of the inquisition?

@~Lady~: I was talking about Crusade, you concentrated mainly on Crusade to Jerusalem. And you only gave the first one. But there were many more to Jerusalem itself. Further, there were other places than Jerusalem/"Holy land" that the christians launched their many crusades. And it did not affect the M.uslims alone.


2.1 First Crusade 1095-1099
2.1.1 Siege of Jerusalem
2.1.2 Crusade of 1101
2.2 Second Crusade 1147–1149
2.3 Third Crusade 1187–1192
2.4 Fourth Crusade 1202–1204
2.5 Albigensian Crusade
2.6 Children's Crusade
2.7 Fifth Crusade 1217–1221
2.8 Sixth Crusade 1228–1229
2.9 Seventh Crusade 1248–1254
2.10 Eighth Crusade 1270
2.11 Ninth Crusade 1271–1272
2.12 Northern Crusades (Baltic and Germany)
2.13 Other crusades

No you were talking about the inquisition. I was talking about the crusades. Common man don't tell a fib. Everyone can clearly see that you were talking about the inquisition and not the crusades.

I mentioned the first year of the crusades to show that the crusades came before the inquisition. There was no need to talk about all the crusade because the first one already showed that the crusades started before the inquisition.

Even at that the crusades ended before the inquisition. Sir, you can certainly do better. I don't want to call you a liar out of respect, but you and I and others reading this thread that you have not told the truth.

YOU were speaking of the INQUISITION (Spanish), I was talking about the Crusades

LOLOLOLOL.

Pastor KunleOshob

tell me one ridiculous post i have made that is not backed by scripture. The problem with most christians is that they are lazy and they fail to study their bibles, they would rarther just go to church on sunday and depend on what pastor tells them. The truth is that the mordern church has been overtaken by doctrine of Men being presented as word of God. I don't expect you to understand anyway because judging from your posts, you are a weak dependant xtian who is yet to truly discover the real word of God. You can't decipher beween doctrines , biblical manipulations and the true Word of God.

Your posts on tithing. Yes I read.
Your posts on the history of the Church
Your posts on the missing books.

Sir you are a man looking for excuses, you can grant it yourself. Since I have a weak interpreation (because it doesn't support your view) of the Bible, that's cool. Besides it is between me and my God abi. I am sure you have the proper interpretation of the Bible na abi? RUBBISH.

Try that with a weakling of the Church, one who doesn't go off of just what one posts. It amazes me how your truth just happens to differ from other people's truth. LOLOLOL. Please stop trying to fool people.

I don't know about that. Again I say what will be the criteria and authority by which we include any "lost" books into the current canon?
Oga, the job of the Holy Spirit is to reveal and explain the scriptures to us. (1Jn) We don't need to put ourselves at risk by trusting and looking for the word of God elsewhere when we already have it on our hands. Again I repeat that God is more than able to sustain and retain the integrity of His word as we have it today. Chasing after anything else will only prove futile and extremely dangerous.

Thank you JeSoul for this. I don't know why people want to make things complicated. We have enough in the Bible.
Some of the books that he referenced in the New Testament, I have a copy of them and they honestly do not contradict what is currently in the Bible, so I don't see what the hoopla is all about.

Are you a Pharisee that Christ was referring to in the text above as in others? Who are the equivalent of Pharisees today?

Why don't you tell us?
So now we have a classification huh?

For instance if you read the book of genesis, you would discover that it is highly summarised and a lot of details were ommited. these details you can find in the "book of enoch" or "the land of eden" I believe if we had these books we would be able to understand the word of God better and all the fuzzy parts of our current bible would be better explained

again these books were not put together by the Church, this is Jewish history, take that up with the Jews. The books that are in the Torah are included in the Old testament. Constantine did not have a hold on the Jewish books. He had no influence on Judaism. Now why are these particular books that you have listed not included in the Torah?
That is a question for you to research on.

Who questioned the works Was it the Pagan constantine that compiled them or his scribe eusibus who implemented the compilation. What do you expect your priest to say ?? that the bible is not complete

did you not read the part about me reading the missing books myself. i haven't gone through all of them, but so far it is difficult to read most since parts of them are missing. Also the time in which they were written are questionable. The only thing I discussed with my priest are the existence of these books not the actual books myself. He told me not to take his word for it but to look myself. So I did and still doing. I never asked the Priest if the Bible is not complete I don't even know where you got that from. After reading your posts (not just this one) I see that you are constantly looking for an excuse not to do something according to the Bible and to you everything is a conspiracy. That is fine, you are entitled to your own opinion. The problem I have with that is that you come here and make ridiculous posts and interpretations about the Bible and its teachings and lead other weak Christians astray.

Go and learn the history first before you start nitpicking what you want to support your view. Indeed Religion with content is a gain.

Hey guys!

How is everything? Oby, I can’t understand what’s preventing me from praying my Rosary. Though, I try to make it as simple as possible to recite it, but not one bit simpler. Could it be the reason why Satan was able to build a Super-Soldier?

The truth is that I don’t enjoy missing my Rosary. However, if I’m going to continue to take my devotion time chasing shadows, I would be remiss to ignore the booby traps of Satan – that’s apply to each and everyone of us. Hope, we need more grace? I need o.

Oh, Lady, you too were once under this very attack? We thank God you came out alive. It only takes the grace of God to survive the attack. How's life with u?


Viee and Lindiwe - where are you guys? Spare and simplify your time for us here because the ability to simplify means to eliminate the unnecessary so that the necessary may speak. So, let the necessary speak here right away.

Carlosein and Pamperme what has gone wrong that you don’t talk to each other for now? Lawyer, wetin dey happen?

How is mum? This is why we have to stay in prayer at all times. I too fall short on praying especially the rosary, but I thank God for his saving grace.

Oby and Pam thanks for the word and meditation. You are greatly appreciated.

[quotethe book of enoch( the bible tells us that enoch walked with God) he was very close to God waht happened to the book he wrote?? Other books are : land of Eden, book of jasher, book of Melchizedek][quote][/quote]Ask the Jews. This should be a part of their history if it's true.

I already know about the history of the books that were not included in the New Testament.
Now my brother have you read these books?
By the way the ones you listed are not the only books that have were left out there were more. Now once again have you read these books?
If you have do you conclude that they are saying anything different from what the ones in the New Testament already say or can you conclude the reason why they were not included?
Some of these works are missing parts in it, could that be the reason why they were not included or could it be that the credibility of these works are in question as in who the actual authors were unlike the ones we have and know who the actual authors are?

what we are examining in this thread is constatine's influence on how constatine influenced the mordern church through his compilation of the bible

Go and revisit the true history of the Council of Nicea and then revisit this statement of yours.

Idinrete

thanks for the link. I've visited it before. I also spoke to my priest about the issue.
Quite frankly after reading some of the works I see why they were not included, they were redundant to what we already have in the New Testament and are incomplete. The books in the New Testament are the complete works that existed and they were the ones that the actual origins were known as fact.

The others were very questionable.

Unfortunately, if you know the history of Mus.lims in Spain; Andallusia, Cordova, etc as its seat for Continental Europe, you wll not "boldly" wrote, as to remind me of Is.lamic history. The piece of History that did not happen, is what you just said I forgot. The truth is after inquisition, in Spain, it is then you have Crusade. Just imagine if the Mu.slims were killing non muslims at that time, would anyone who was not a Muslim exited? The Muslims ruled Spain for close to 8 Centuries! Where are you getting your informations?

ok every historian, non christian and non muuslim knows that the inquisition (1478) was after the crusades (1095)
now look at those dates which one came first?

ah na wa o.

Everybody keeps talking about deutoronmy this, leviticus that.

Ok to pay tithes is to pay one tenth of what God gives you. In those days it was goats, grains, and more. Today it is our income.

People the idea of giving one tenth to God did not start in leviticus or deutoronmy as everyone is arguing on.
Jacob himself gave tithes. It was not called tithes, but hey tithes are a tenth of what our blessings are.

Genesis28: 22

This stone that I have set up as a memorial stone shall be God's abode. Of everything you give me, I will faithfully return a tenth part to you.

The law of tithing was not giving then, but Jacob himself knew it was only proper and respectful and a way of showing gratitude to God, by giving a portion of it back to God. Notice he mentioned this after he set up a memorial for God's abode. God's abode is the altar, sanctuary.

If you don't want to tithe, don't. it's not b force, but it is only rewarding.

The reason is very simple "KNOWLEDGE IS POWER" Man as always wanted to dominate his environment and other men around him. The people / sects monopolizing this knowledge have used it to develop themselves spiritually at the detriment of others. You would be shocked how many so called cults and sects use this "lost" books to develop themselves spiritually.

LOLOL, there is always a conspiracy huh?

Why don't you give us a listing of these books, that were in existence that are now hidden. Surely since you hold the knowledge you can be able to prove it right?

Let us know if they are of the Old Testament or the New Testament.

Infact give us a detailed view of them.

You are wrong here the Scripture has that we worship the Lord of the Sabath and because he rose on Sunday that is why we meet on sunday to worship.

Ok let me be more precise.


Up until the beginning of the church, God's people were used to going to synagogue on the seventh day of the week (Saturday) which was called the Sabbath. This was a holy day to the Lord, the fourth of Ten Commandments God gave Moses. "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy" (Ex. 20:. This was, and will always remain, the official Sabbath. However, after Jesus rose from the dead on the first day of the week, Sunday, the New Testament shows that the early Christians began meeting together on this new day as a weekly commemoration of their new life in Christ. "Now on the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul, ready to depart the next day, spoke to them and continued his message until midnight" (Acts 20:7).


Historians indicate that the earliest Christians not only met together on Sunday, but also came together regularly with their Jewish community in the synagogues on the Sabbath. This was their traditional heritage and where most of their neighbors, friends and family would congregate — a great place to witness. However it seems about A.D. 135, there was great upheaval in the synagogues. The influential Rabbi, Akiba, proclaimed the leader of the Jewish rebellion in Palestine, Bar Cochba, as the Messiah,¹ and the Jewish Christians were quick to refute this. Such hostility arose against the believers that a curse against "sectarians" (which referred to the Christians) was introduced into the synagogue services. Thus, anyone who would not pronounce the curse with other worshipers would be ejected. This effectively ostracized the Christians from participation in the synagogues on Saturday, but they continued with their meetings on Sunday.


Although they were no longer bound to a rigid code of laws or Sabbath keeping (Gal. 3:10-11, Col. 2:16), it is believed that the early church probably came to view Sunday as a combined observance of the Sabbath and the resurrection day of Jesus (Acts 20:7, 1 Cor. 16:2). This day of Christian worship came to be called the Lord's Day (Rev. 1:10), a day to fellowship in celebration of the resurrection, to worship, pray and study the Word together.


There.

Ok um well from my knowledge, muuslim ladies are not allowed to marry non muuslims. So u'll have to convert, if ur not the kind that cares for religion, b if u do? leave her alone.

I told him, “if you are her boyfriend I’m not disturbing you guys o”. He now said “ok, I’m her boyfriend who are you”

Isn't this enough for you to know?
If it's a joke, it's a childish one and you need to let her go to mature.

@Poster

Yes I was in that situation and woke up really quickly.
I moved on and got blessed.

Love yaself first sister, then you can truly be loved.

Well laid out,i cldn't put more eloquently myself.It is an incontrovertible fact that christian doctrine was greatly distorted to absorb most of the pagan festivities of the Roman Empire who were ruling the world at the time.The tru sabath of the Lord as it was in the beginnin was jetisond for the Sunday worship which coincided with the worship of their Sun god.Christmas,Easter.Valentine were fruadulently introducd into d xtian faith.A lot of xtians today just go 2 their churches mechanically witout knowing why or d truth about their faith.

Dude the reason why the sabath for Christians is on Sunday is because of the persecution. . Instead of meeting on saturday they secretly met on Sunday. Saturday was deemed as sabath for Jews and they were very intolerrant of Christians.

anyway do more research. I will be back to read through what Kunle wrote, unfortunately after reading a part of it, I see he is truly blind to the truth.

You are from Benin. Tell me how many swords were put against the ancient city? I hope you have heard of the history of what the English man did, with his Bible on one hand and gunon the other?

I know of my history. I also know that while the British justified slavery with the Bible, it is not because of the spread of Christianity that they invaded. While with Is'lam it is because of the spread of Is'lam that they murdered people. The British did not say choose Christianity or die. The spread of Christianity was not the heart of the invasion. But the spread of Is'lam was the heart of the invasions. Big difference.

If the Arabs had said to the Arab, choose I.slam or death, would there remain any significant, non Mu.slims in that part of the world?

At that time there was none. Now it is a bit permissible, but at that time, there was none.

I already know that you are just making a religious talking points. The substance behind it, is zero. How did Is.lam pilaged Malaysia and Indonesia, etc, except by just good human to human relationships? How did Isla.m entered Ibadan, Ijebu Ode (my home town), Abeokuta, etc and indeed lagos? How many people killed by maurading arabs or yoruba on yoruba killings? Muy mother's homtown of Owo, a mere 77 miles to Benin, how did is.lam enteed it?

Is'lam had already spread enough. It still doesn't change the fact that the main purpose of invasions was the spread of Is'lam. Christianity was spread because they were beinf persecuted, that's how it got to the english in the first place. So at the beginning it wasn't about violence, that cannot be said for I'slam.

I think You had taken I.slam for Christian Spain, under Queen Isabella and King Ferdnand, in the period of Spanish Polgrom dubbed Spanish Inquisition. Was there a mu.slim spare to remain alive in this madness of the Christian elites? Go and study the history of the world and then come back for good dialogue on this.

I believe this was after the muuslims had brutally invaded and killed many Christians and Jews and the Christians started fighting back. Maybe this continued because of that. Ofcourse you will forget that piece of history.

Do I condone the killings, absolutely not, but it still remains that from onset the spread of Christianity wasn't by force. The spread of Is'lam from onset was by force.


I will be back, have to go now.

Can you please show me the trinity concept in the Torah?

Pronouns, where God speaking, uses "us" and "our": Genesis 3:22 Genesis 11:7 Isaiah 6:8. The most important reference is Genesis 1:26-27; it is here where the plurality is used in connection with the very nature of God. This last reference is the most important (and compelling) one because here God uses plural forms in the context of his own "image and likeness."

Genesis 3:22
And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

The plural form for "Lord" used frequently in the Old Testament:'adonai ("Lord," literally, "my Masters". The vowel in the last syllable of 'adonai was apparently lengthened by rabbis in the post-New Testament period. This is thought to have been done to sharpen the distinction between earthly lords and the Lord God

The Old Testament had a singular term for God, Eloah, which they occasionally used, but the vast majority of the time the plural form of God, Elohim, is used throughout the Old Testament. Had there been only be two persons within God, the Hebrews could have used a dual form Elohiayim, which was typically (although not always) used of things that occured in pairs

(Don't try to use Elohim to define the "we" in the Qu'ran)

Even though the Old Testament teaches that God is "one," (Deuteronomy 6:4) this does not conflict in any way with Trinitarian beliefs. On the contrary, it actually helps to affirm them. One of the most compelling examples in the Old Testament of the composite sense of "one" is found in Genesis 2:24. Two people (created in the "image" of God) become "one flesh" in the marriage union (and thus a sense of the "image" in a composite sense). The use of the Hebrew word for "one" (eXad) in other passages similarly demonstrates that this word means "one entity" rather than a strictly single, solitary thing.

Genesis 2:24
For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh

The Old Testament presents striking examples of a Being who, although He appears in the form of a man, acts and speaks like God and is referred to as God. Mysteriously, He is both identified as God and distinguished from God. We find this in passages such as Genesis 16:7-13; 18-19; 22:11-18; Exodus 3:2-6; 23:20-23; Judges 6:11-14, 20-22; 13:21-23). Note also how Zechariah 12:8 equates God and the Angel of the Lord. These Theophanies were prepartory for the incarnation in that they anticipated the coming of a Heavenly Visitor who would one day be both truly God and man

Genesis 16:7-13
The angel of the LORD found Hagar near a spring in the desert; it was the spring that is beside the road to Shur. 8 And he said, "Hagar, servant of Sarai, where have you come from, and where are you going?"
      "I'm running away from my mistress Sarai," she answered.

9 Then the angel of the LORD told her, "Go back to your mistress and submit to her." 10 The angel added, "I will so increase your descendants that they will be too numerous to count."

11 The angel of the LORD also said to her:
       "You are now with child
       and you will have a son.
       You shall name him Ishmael, [a]
       for the LORD has heard of your misery.

12 He will be a wild donkey of a man;
       his hand will be against everyone
       and everyone's hand against him,
       and he will live in hostility
       toward all his brothers."

13 She gave this name to the LORD who spoke to her: "You are the God who sees me," for she said, "I have now seen the One who sees me."

Exodus 3:2-6
There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. 3 So Moses thought, "I will go over and see this strange sight—why the bush does not burn up."

4 When the LORD saw that he had gone over to look, God called to him from within the bush, "Moses! Moses!"
      And Moses said, "Here I am."

5 "Do not come any closer," God said. "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground." 6 Then he said, "I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob." At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.

Isaiah 9:6 He is a son and child, but also the "mighty God."
For to us a child is born,
       to us a son is given,
       and the government will be on his shoulders.
       And he will be called
       Wonderful Counselor, [a] Mighty God,
       Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Daniel 7:13-14 This passage forms the background behind Christ's use of the Messianic title "Son of Man." Note that the contexts of Psalm 2 and Daniel 7 have identical strands of thought: the inheriting of all the kingdoms of the earth. The word "Son of Man" does not here mean "a mortal man"--one from among the "sons of men." The point here is not that the Person is perfectly human. The significance of the title "Son of Man' in this passage is fourfold:


His exalted personality as the One who comes from heaven and opposes the beastly human powers, which come from earth (Daniel 7:3)

His advent in conjunction with the reappearance of the theophanic glory cloud (7:13),

His free access to the 'One who is an ancient of days' (God the Father, 7:13), and

His universal and everlasting reign (7:14).

Daniel 7:13-14

"In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

Psalm 45:6-7

Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
       a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.

7 You love righteousness and hate wickedness;
       therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
       by anointing you with the oil of joy.

All three Persons of the Trinity can be seen in Isaiah 63:8-10, but most importantly we see here the personality of the Holy Spirit. He is "vexed, grieved" by disobedience. This verb in Hebrew is always used in conjuntion with persons (or God and gods); never of inanimate things

He said, "Surely they are my people,
       sons who will not be false to me";
       and so he became their Savior.

9 In all their distress he too was distressed,
       and the angel of his presence saved them.
       In his love and mercy he redeemed them;
       he lifted them up and carried them
       all the days of old.

10 Yet they rebelled
       and grieved his Holy Spirit.
       So he turned and became their enemy
       and he himself fought against them

I am not God sister Efeosa but I gave you verse from your book and if you care, I can give you Q uranic verse butressing the above quote lifted from your bible. You can go to Chapter 3, 5 etc of my Holy Book and educate yourself and tell me your (Christian) position before God.

Sir you stated that we put everything into our religion and we have nothing to show for it. So that must mean that you have something to show for your own religion and I am asking you to show it.

A verse in the Qu'ran is not proof of it. Certainly you can SHOW. Promises is not showing. Making a promise to me is not showing me, fulfilling that promises is showing.
It is promise that you will make heaven, well have you made heaven yet? WHy don't you show us what heaven is, since you have made it?
It's a promise right, so that means it is there for show?

One thing I want you to understand is God has no son. It is a mere deceit, and God Himself doesn't like to be referred to has a father of any

Have you called him Father and he threaten you? It amazes me how people know what it is God likes to be called as if they've actually spoken to him. Your prophet is still very questionable. I have asked for answers but all I have received is the Bible is false. For the sake of making a point, if the Bible does in fact ahppen to be false, how does that make the Qu'ran true?

I have clearly called him Father and Son and Holy Spirit and time and time again he answers my call, there is evidence.
So I will continue to call him Father, Son, Holy Spirit

What makes me very interested in this gospel is that it shows the way of christ himself.

But Christ called Muhaamad themessiah and the Qu'ran calls Christ the messiah, my dear how then does this gospel tell the true way of Christ himself?
There are obvious geographical errors in it, how then is it the true ways of Christ. The story of Mary's birth contradicts the Qu'ran how then does it show the true ways of Christ.
Please open your eyes. If this gospel is true then the Qu'ran is false.

By the way you have no idea what Christ means do you?

That will make you have the monotheism belief in God and you'll further engage in the reading of the Glorious Kor'an.

Christians do have a monothiesm belief in God, screaming that Christians have three Gods does not make it true, sorry but it doesn't. The Trinity is still ONE GOD. like it or not, it is. Stop making claims that the Christians don't make and claiming it's a Christian belief. Stop professing the wrong belief of the Christians.


You advise people to analyse their faith, have YOU analysed yours?
One more time, hoe does the Bible being false make the Qu'ran true?

@A K O: Thats why, my brother you should be careful about something you do not know its origin. What if the Origin or Original is different from others?

But I know it  

I actually own a Bible translated directly from the original. Yup there have been many translations of the Bible, but it still remains the general consensus of it that Jesus is Lord.

Translated in French, SPanish, German, English, Latin, Portugese, Chinese, Japanese, and much more, it is still the same message. Red is rouge is rojo is rot is ruber is erythros, it is still the colour red.

It still has the general consensus. That is why it is important to have guidance, from the Spirit when you meditate on the word in private and from the ordained Priest when you are gathered in Bible study or the regular reading of the liturgy at mass or Sunday service.

Better yet, its like accepting Chinua Achebe's novel as if its 100% the account of some person's life., or a religious book.

Um not true. Chinua Achebe's book is not a translation of a previous book. It is the original copy of it's own story. Use a different analogy.

My point is, in arrogance we could really do harm to ourselves. A person who gets punished by God in the day of judgement because of not turning to the right path, while he was warned while he was on earth, deserves all the punishment he/she will receive.

Yet there are different translations of the Qu'ran, I know I've read them don't make me post them for you, so then would you conclude that the translated Qu'ran has the same "lost message" effect?
If so, then there are a lot of confused muuslims out there.

And in any case do you expect me to drop my bible and become a mus.lim? You've got to be kidding me!!![/

I like this, permission to use it PLEASE!!!

hahahaha

Luke.3:16…John said…, "I baptize you with water; but he who is mightier than I is coming, the thong of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie; he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.

Matthew 3:11…. "I baptize you with water for repentance, but he who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry; he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.

First of all, I thought the gospels were conflicting, how then do they match?

this is the better who among you like to baptize with fire, any want of you like to grill

Not physical fire silly. Baptising with fire is receiving the Spirit, like when the "tongues as fire" rested upon them. Basically you have received the Holy Spirit.

The Lord God Jesus was saying those people that Claim they gave their TITHES, TIME AND SERVICE TO CHURCH WITHOUT HOLINESS WILL GO TO HELL.

Chei backslider, correct.

@Cayon: This goes to the heart of the matter. Who call Jesus, lord, lord, but Christians? Even Jesus is condemning a portion of this very religion. Please, fear the fire of hell. Jesus has already made his position known. Take heed, people!

Your interpretation of that verse is FALSE!!!!!
This is why I won't take you seriously on the interpretation of the Bible. You cannot apply your muuslim interpretation on the Biblical interpretation (as in if "this" is false then "that" must be true) I hope you understand.

My darling Cayon, you told me by your very first post to begin this thread. Please read it, above. Rather you presented a verse from the Bible that says that Jesus said that not all persons who called him, lord. lord will enter the kingdom of heave. I guess it is clear that he, Jesus is talking about the Christians here. That some of the Christians will not enter Paradise.

What Jesus is saying is that just because someone walks up and says I am a Christian, does not mean that the person is actually a Christian.
Olabowale, I have told you many times, that there are those that claim to be Christian, but are false, that is why you see false prophets. Just because someone says that he loves God does not mean that he actually loves God.

Don't come up with oh well this man says he's a Christian therefore he must be telling the truth. A lot of people claim to be graduates but indeed are not, this is a fact, we see it in Nigeria.

Oh yes perfect example "419" just because a man says he's abank manager does not mean that he's a bank manager does it? Evidence has to be provided (fruit) this goes in saying with the verse that "by their friut you shall know them.'
To know a true Christian? Well let them produce evidence. Just because they say oh Jesus is Lord does not mean that they truly believe that Jesus is Lord, not truly believing that Jesus is Lord grants no entrance to the Kingdom of heaven.

I hope that is a better explanation of it for you.

If you truly want to know the "true" interpretations on the Bible, ask, rather than reading something and screaming "wolf"

This is what I tell you about understanding the Bible. You want to understand the Bible, go to those who study it well and they will give you the real answers, not what your Imam told you and asked you to pass down to the little ones. Because of your lack of understanding of a book you call false, I won't convert to Is'lam.

Jagoon,

lolololol, I see you just want someone to agree with you, sorry no true Bible believer will agree with you.
This is why I guidance is needed in studying the Bible.

Since you've stated that you have given your life to Christ (I really hope the Spirit is upon you) then by all means consult the Spirit on the matter and see where he leads you.

You don't want to take what people have told you, so go and define for yourself, WAIT!! you did, yet you dismiss your own definition.

My man, I understand o, bodi no be wood, AIDS is real, HELL is real too. All these are related, can you trace the dots?

lololol, this is funny

Hello Lady, goin to all those thread makes me sick.

Oh dear I really do understand, but I thank God for the challenge that I have received. It has forced me to put more focus on my religious studies and I have learned more than I ever knew and so much more has been revealed to me, I thank God. I will never stop being a Catholic. Glory to Jesus, Honour to Mary.

We will continue to read from that thread and see where it would lead us to. Truth they say, is always bitter

I would greatly appreciate it if you do not rear your head here as I do not rear my head in the muuuslims thread. I have shown enough resepct I expect you to do the same.

I understand why you and Olabowale and the others are chasing me around, but just to let you know the more I learn of your belief, the more I appreciate mine.

Thank God that you said there were two comforters; The former existed and departed before the another. How can these be the same? Is it feasible that my former wife be the another wife? Is it possible that a wife be the other wife of the same husband? Hardly! And please remember that Jesus was talking in the Physical. He was talking as a physical person

But he was speaking of a spirit. It amaxes me how you still use physical things to explain the spiritual.
If so, please tell me, how is it that Muhaamad is still with us, because I can't see him anywhere. You must explain with the physical in this situation too.

And no he did not say there were two comforters. He said the "another comforter" and " the comforter" was the same name, as in "the student" and "the christian student" is still ----- ~Lady~

Stop planting things.

I understand. But what did the holy spirit who could not talk said, taught, reminded and glorified? How did this invisible being did each and everyone of them? Afterall, he was expected to do each, exceptionally wel, right? Show us each one of them. We are not talking about what Jesus did. That went with the former. We are not talking about the future, the another.

Are you expecting to hear a voice? Does God speak to you?

Sir, are you telling me that people around the world after so many centuries did not know how to wipe their yansh?
It needed Muhaaamad to come and say this is how a tissue should be used? This is how soap should be used? This is how water should be used? Surely he had to show those people how they were supposed to have sex so that they could procreate, that's why people weren't having children before Muhaamad came and showed them the proper way. RUBBISH.
Nonsensities like this is why I will never become a muuslim. I would belong to the secular world first.Yeah put your hand on your head and scream A'llah all you want. But rubbish like this is why I won't. Oh yeah and honour killings are also why I won't be a muuslim. Oh yeah lack of freedom of choice is why I won't be a muuslim. Oh yeah and the constant twisting of things, is why I won't be a muusim. Oh yeah the inaccuracies of history (not through the Bible or Torah) is why I won't be a muuslim.

How did a theoretical relationship between wife and husband could be compared with practical, real life experience?

By love. You love your wife as Christ loved the Church. As in you do not harm her, physically, emotionally, mentally, socially. You sacrifice for her, you take the good and the bad. You forgive her if she wrongs you, you comfort her when she is at low moments. Just as Christ does for us.

He spoke about recovering the body of the Pharaoh who perished in the sea, as a sign of how evil is punished. You Bible does not have a statement about this. The body of this evil Pharaoh is today a specimen that has been seen by billions of people.

Which Pharaoh?

He predicted that the arabs will be competing with themselves for building of lofty buildings, they are today doing just that. i guess the arabs are making paradise on earth for the disbelievers! This earth is the paradise of the disbelievers, anyway.

This was already predicted in the Bible.

I hope you keep a good hygeine, my man. I trust you. We Ijebu people are fashion plate people. We are very clean.

When did the Ijebu people become clean?

And God promised he will forgive himhis sins. We did not read that he committed any sins. Sure Jesus is sinless. Thanks to the AlQur'an which states that. If we go by the bible, temptation is sin, hence when Jesus was tempted 3 times, what will you call them other than Christian sins? Jesus cursed a fig tree to wither, while the tree follows the natural laws that God at given it to fruit in the seasonal time that is accorded it. What will you call that, but christian sin

The Bible states that Jesus is sinless
The Bible does not state that temptation is sin, stop planting things

M.uhammad's followers by faith walked on water while every one of them was riding on their horses. This is a big deal for you? The followers entered a jungle and they yelled to the animals: Oh you animals, we are followers of M.uhammad, the Prophet of God, we need this land (Jungle), we now ask you to vacate this jungle for our use, you and your offsprings! The sahabahs saw the lions and all the wild animals with their family leaving out the jungle as they were commanded

proof of this. Harry potter performed miracles too you know

And if M.uhammad (AS) could not fight off the poison, at least he survived it for many years

it was the cause of his death, even he attested to it. It bothered him for years.

I employ you to read. God is not the Author of Confusion. LOL. I have to amuse you. God will not want to tell us about the future and bring us confusion. A human prophet who called himself a spirit and comforter could not be talking about another spirit and comforter to come after him, unless it is exactly like him: Prophet and human comforter. Exactly of the same kind but never the same. How can anyone in his right sense that Jesus was telling his disciples that he will be back, but then as an invisible thing, to teach them now, new information he did not teach them while he was man like them. To remind them of what he had said to them while he was a man among them. To now glorify himself when he was a man, but doing the glorification as an invisible thing!

The descriptions that Christ gave about who to come doesn't fit muhaamad and I'm not just talking about the "spirit" issue. I will be back for more on this. I have to go now.

They have everything to put into the religion but nothing to show for it on judgment day hence Jesus' saying that 'what would it profit a man who gain the whole world and lose his soul. ?

This is because you are God and you know what is going on with every single one of us?

Oya tell what we have not gained by putting everything into the religion.

Since muuslims have so much to show for what they've put in the religion, show me.
Show me what you have gained. Show what muuslims have gained.

@~Lady~: Post my rebuttal. When am through with david, I will handle your initial post and whatever you will post later. God willing

I've been posting your rebuttals you however have been skipping my questions.

I could go through this whole thread and bring up issues that you never answered and then did ring around the rosy as if I wouldn't notice.

You still haven't provided me with the answers I requested.

Superstition is when you said something silly and far off human rationale. Something like, "I am immensed and being protected by the blood!"

Or something like the existence of God.