₦airaland Forum

Donzman:
You can advice but you cannot stick to your own advice, I didn't only get underneath your skin, I gained access to your bones!!

Hehehehe. . . .nah. . .you merely wish you did. Tsk, tsk Donzman you have been misled as usual, by your over-inflated ego.

Donzman:
@TerraCotta

You're terribly ignorant and like I adviced you before, quit reading books about your culture, go down and experience it for yourself. I know an old customs clearing agent that lives in PH, he's an Ichie, mind you this man is OLD, he has none of those marks.

TerraCotta:
A more honest and mature person would have already conceded that they're wrong. I've been down this road with you before so I'm not surprised that you refuse to accept your ignorance even when confronted with evidence. I've provided you with a link describing an old Ozo titled man with ichi markings on his forehead. This was formerly a common practice that is dying, so it's unsurprising that you have not seen someone with them before. Before, you swore up and down that ichie marks did not exist. Now you're telling me that you've seen "a lot" and that perhaps ichie marks are "isolated in some REMOTE Igbo community". You don't seem to have enough respect for yourself to humbly admit your mistake, so this discussion is over. We can't turn the whole thread into a "Help Donzman Learn About Igbo Culture" lecture

Would the writer being Igbo make the article more or less true? You are obsessed with ethnic issues, and yet you're plainly ignorant about basic Igbo culture. It's a funny combination.

This debate is getting interesting.

Donzman always tries to use his own perspective & his own experience, as the sole determinant of every other person's reality. If you go through his posts, you will find the same pattern runs through most of them. (i.e. just because he hasn't seen something, means that 'thing,' is invalid). It doesn't matter if others have seen that thing, or experienced it. The chap writes & speaks as if his views are the only standard, which everyone must follow.

@ Terracota,
The fact that a work of non-fiction was written about the tribal marks of old Ichies obviously means it must have existed at some point in time, even if it is dying out now. My maternal grandfather's elderly neighbour came from the Niger-Delta, and she had some tribal marks on her fore-arms. They were dark, concentric rings etched in an symmetric pattern. Till she died, I never knew what they were called, or what they stood for. Now I wish I had asked. So I understand your point. It has been made eloquently.

Some of us have learnt something new from the info. you supplied. Thanks so much, for your input. But don't wait for Donzman to apologise. It isn't likely to happen. When his errors are pointed out in such a glaring manner, he just goes all quiet, and drops further questions on the subject, without a whimper. That is more in tune with his style.

@ThiefofHearts,

WORD!! Girl. . . . .you are something else!!

Beline:
Our problem in Nigeria is giving appointment to those that knew little or nothing about the demands of whatever seat they occupied and when this happened they think of nothing else than to abuse the office. Most of the Ambassadors does not know their diplomatic functions and as such can not do anything to that effect.

Give the right person the right appointment and see if he/she will not perform well

What do you expect?  

The post of an Ambassador has now become something, that is used as a means of finding 'jobs for the boys'. In the past, you had to have some kind of foreign service training, or acted as a career diplomat, before you could be nominated to such a post. Before becoming an Ambassador, it is expected that you would have risen through the ranks, from being an immigration attache, to a Head of Chancery or a Consular official, or at least worked in a mission overseas, before being appointed as an Ambassador.

In most countries, the appointment of an Ambassador to any important country, is not left to chance. Neither is it seen simply as a reward for party loyalists. Even when the appointee is not a career diplomat, he or she is properly screened, briefed and trained in the art of diplomacy and international relations, before being posted to head the country's foreign mission, abroad. Even in those few cases, where the Ambassador is appointed outside the ranks of the foreign service, his background in business, law or any other field is taken into consideration, and he or she is given additional briefing, before he is sent out as an Ambassador.

In Nigeria now, what do we have?? Some party faithfuls or mediocres, are simply launched into the high-powered world of international diplomacy, without any training, or any idea of the jobs they are expected to carry out, on behalf of their country. And what do we get in return? Silly, inept performance. And even sillier, ill-advised comments, like the one this so-called Northern Ambassador has regurgitated.

What do I love about Nigeria?

Ah, plenty!

One: The 'never-say-die' attitude of our people. You see a man who ought to be down cast, because he has nothing to fall back on, pull himself up by the bootstraps, ready to give his next assignment his best shot, simply because of that gut feeling he has that, 'e go better!"

Two: You see folks with even worse problems than yours', coming to give you something small, even out of their own penury, in order to alleviate your own suffering

Three: Your car breaks down along a busy road, and some sympathisers are ready & willing to push it off the main street, into a quiet corner, so that someone else does not ram into it or so that you can jump start it, if possible;

Four: The diffent types of unsolicited pieces of advice, that come flowing in your direction, the minute anything happens to you or anyone hears about your problem;

Five: Those neighbours who are ready to buy you free drinks and peppersoup whenever they have something to celebrate;

Six: The correct suya at Obalende and all those areas of town, where the seasoning & flavour are done in that special way that makes your taste buds come alive;

Seven: The mama-put joints that are tucked away in various parts of town where the correct mix of shaki, ponmo, ogufe, ofe nsala, edikainkong, amal, ewedu, pounded yam, isis ewu etc. are simmering at the right temperature, waiting for you to make your pick;

Ah. . . . the list is too long, o jare! Make I stop here, for now.

Dis Guy:
Y'all giving up already? remember this is just a rumuor by the way, he has to pass through the senate

Senate??! The same senate that popularised Ghana-must-go bags?

Anyway, make we siddon dey look sha. God has performed wonders using them, in the past. He can still do it again.

MILITIA:
Thank you my brother! We all have contributed to Nigeria's ailing state of affairs in one way or the other. I am with you because only few people have a reasonable outlook on what Nigeria should be. Instead of concentrating on what is important, they are busy whipping up tribal sentiments with extremely embarrassing sentiments! I do not blame you for defending you self and the north from attacks from forumites on this web page. When people have nothing to say they resort to personal attacks and name-calling.

Hmmn. . . . . . .

Afam:
My friend, better say your mind on the Igbos and stop this patronizing statements with subtle arrogance and nonsense.

What is your tribe if I may ask? Let the Igbos be as I don't remember reading where anyone was complaining to your about the Igbos not getting the presidency.

Is Utomi from the South East? What yardstick are you using to make a case for Utomi as representing the Igbos if not for mischief?

I have said my mind on the Igbo, times without number. What else is there to say? Chrisokw made a statement I found offensive, and my response was directed to him, in kind. Go through his previous posts on this site, he has complained about marginalisation. That's why when he started his next post on a rather rude note without any justification, by claiming I was 'crying more than the bereaved,' I replied him in kind, using a sarcastic tone.  

And if you don't remember anyone complaining about the Igbo not getting the presidency, ask adconline. He has asked me that question before, on another thread, even though the post he made at that time, is not what is being debated here.

Finally, we were talking about an Igbo presidency. There are Igbos in the South-East & in the South-South. The only thing is that in the South-South, the Igbo are just one of the several other ethnic groups that abound in that region.

That is probably why other South-South ethnic groups, initially opposed Odili's candidature for the presidential elections. If you go through the statement credited to J.P Clark, he made it quite clear that they would like some of the other indigenous tibes in the South-South to pick up that ticket, because if an Igbo candidate like Odili is fielded by the region, they would loose by the time the South-East fields its' own candidate.

So, there is nothing 'mischievous' in my previous post about Utomi. Read it again. And read all the ones I made from the beginning of this thread. If you do not understand the point I was trying to make, kindly ask. Yes, he is from the South-South, but he has never denied his Igbo roots. So what's the problem? If he gets into power, he will be there as a South-South Igbo man. That is pretty much obvious. I voted for him in the last election, and I would gladly vote for him again and again, if he comes out to campaign for the presidency a million times over.

In his campaign, he showed that he has wonderful ideas, and an enthusiasm to move this nation forward. Unfortunately he campaigned on the platform of a party that lacked a nationwide spread, as well as popular grassroots support.

Knowing his style, I am sure that he will not make that same mistake again, when the next elections come round. And I will be on the road, rooting for him.

I know there is a God in heaven. . . . . that is why people like Obanikoro will not become a minister. Minister of what, sef? Even if dem dey dash person, di bobo no qualify at all!

Bankole01,

I don't know what point you are trying to make, by calling Yaradua a crook.

So just because he is now the president, his daughter should not get married? Or she should wait until her father leaves power, before saying "I do?"

I don't get it o!

chrisokw:
Who the hell are you? Some tin god? Why do you overestimate yourself?

Tin god, ke? No-oo-ooo! Am just a Nigerian citizen. Is anything wrong with that?

As for over-estimating myself, please in what way did I do that, sir? Is it a crime to say no one should disturb my peace? Or is 'peace' too much to ask for, as an ordinary Nigerian citizen? What really, is your beef?

olutomiwa:
abeg TOLD them,some people just dey gullible,anything them read for paper,them go believe,i tire for una o. Nigerian journalists una do well,why he be say na now wey obj commot for govt una come discover this una YEYE STORY,useless cowards

Truth is often stranger than fiction. Let us hope OBJ will subject himself to a DNA test and end the controversy, once and for all.

denex:
I do not believe this man is Richer Than Sir Richard Branson.

Anyway, the truth is that this man has put himself in a very tight corner.

He simply overinflated his word by adjusting for the amount of money he would steal from the Anambra state coffers in the next 4 years.

If this man has actually earned $8billion legally, then he should pay $2.4billion income tax.

If he actually hasn't got $8billion, then he should be charged with attempt to defraud the state.

But I'd rather he just be made to pay $2.4billion.

Hehehehehe. . . . . .good talk!

denex:
Yes. He's meant to be court martialled and tried in a military court which is much stricter than the regular courts. They should just get it done with jare. The guy deserves justice. Whether freedom, jailtime or capital punishment, the guy should have justice.

Those he killed, did they get justice? Or a summary execution? Please don't answer. It was meant to be a rhetorical question.

Am a believer in the rule of law, but Al-Mustapha hasn't helped his case one bit. Each time his case is called up, he gets his lawyers to place question marks on the integrity of the judge at the trial, or tries to call the court's impartiality into question, by saying the judge is biased.

Read the proceedings of what happened in his last appearance in court. The guy himself, is not interested in seeing justice done, in his own case.

chrisokw:
Quit crying more than the bereaved. Bury your own dead. Ok.

My brother, am not crying more than the bereaved, to use your own words. Why should I? No one should just disturb my peace with cries of marginalisation, or any talk that they have been schemed out of power again, when elections come round. Period!

ThiefOfHearts:
anyway I don't think it's that common anymore, I hope not anyway though you might find some "conc" traditionalist here and there.

More info. on this subject has been reproduced below:

[quote author=Tell, Nigeria]Attahiru Bafarawa, Sokoto State governor, needs little introduction. Aside from his status and attainments in life, one other thing that stands him out is his gobirci, his facial or tribal marks. Usually cut in an uneven style, the prominent craft, similar to an artwork, is an exclusive preserve of the people of Bagobiri, Isah Local Government where Bafarawa’s father is district head.

For Titi Olu-Akinremi, a school teacher in Lagos, nothing is more revealing than the pele (six tribal marks) on her face. Though she lives in Lagos, it is easy to decipher that she is not ‘a daughter of the soil’. A native of Iseyin, Oyo State, the pele on her face is peculiar only to children from the royal family in the town. “It is believed that they wouldn’t want to make the mistake of making a bastard an oba (king), and the easiest way that you can use to distinguish a child of the royal family is by looking  at their faces. "I can understand why my family had it done on me,” Olu-Akinremi said.

In Lokoja, Kogi State, Hussein Abdul, a commercial motorcyclist, is easily lost in the midst of his kinsmen. With eight tribal marks — four on each cheek — Abdul, like most people of his ethnic group, has this unique identity and is comfortable with it. But, whenever he travels out of his community, Abdul is usually the butt of jokes. And the funny thing is that the marks appear like a cat’s whiskers. Interestingly, Abdul insists he is proud of elili, his variety of the tribal marks among the Igala, an ethnic group in the state. “There is nothing to be ashamed of. This is the mark given to every first child of my family. If you don’t have it, then you are a bastard; it is even unthinkable not to have it,” Abdul told the magazine.

Unlike Olu-Akinremi, Naimot Adegbesan, a mother of two, has just two tiny horizontal tribal marks on her face. They are barely noticeable, but Adegbesan who lives in Ibadan, Oyo State, loathes the marks. “I wonder who asked my parents to give me the marks. Even though people say it fits me, my husband, I just can’t come to terms with it,” she told TELL.

While Abdul and Olu-Akinremi proudly wear their marks, Adegbesan, like thousands of other Nigerians, daily curses the ‘misfortune’ of it. This probably is largely as a result of the ridicule people with tribal marks experience daily. Tribal marks, a kind of practice associated with fratricidal wars in ancient times, were used to distinguish members of particular communities. But it has since been adopted as a kind of beautification and identification for different groups and classes of people.

Though a widespread practice all over the world, Nigeria has a rich background in tribal marks or scarification such that, of the over 250 ethnic groups in Nigeria, only a few blacklist the practice. Interestingly, people with tribal marks are not restricted to a particular economic stratum in the society. They are real people presiding over boardroom meetings, members of the presidential cabinet, banks, mechanic villages and motor parks, among others. Respected Nigerians with tribal marks include President Olusegun Obasanjo, Richard Akinjide, lawyer and Senior Advocate of Nigeria, SAN, Mamman Magoro and Sani Sami, both retired generals. While some have faded with age, some are still bold and just screaming off the face of the hosts.

From the Igala to the Itsekiri, Tiv, Kanuri, Yoruba, Nupe and the Bini (ethnic tribes in Nigeria), tribal marks are an ingrained practice carried out for different reasons. Investigations by the magazine reveal that while there are special designs meant only for the first child of the family, there are some meant exclusively for children from royal families. Yet, there are amazing stories of children who are marked by two fathers because of the contention of the paternity. In this case, the dispute would be ‘settled’ with each ‘father’ putting his family mark on either cheek of the child.

In the North, particularly among the Fulani ethnic group, there is the bille and the chika Baki. Aside from Bagobiri, gobirci is also common among the Argungu and Magoro people of Kebbi State. Like the Bafarawa royal house, the Fakai people in Zuru Emirate council adorn gobirci. Kanberi are between 10 and 11 horizontal marks done exclusively for the Kontagora Emirate council, Niger State. 
But among the ethnic groups noted for tribal marks in Nigeria, the Yoruba, perhaps, stand out most. These marks include pele, gombo, abaja, keke, ture and so on. The abaja is three or four horizontal lines on each cheek, depending on the town in question. The pele is three vertical lines on each cheek, while ture is six on each cheek — three long vertical lines and three short vertical lines. The gombo is, perhaps, the most complicated — four long vertical lines drawn almost from the scalp and curved into four perpendicular lines on each cheek. This type, the magazine gathers, is more common in Oyo State.  For the Ondo, in Ondo State, it is one long vertical line on either cheek.

TELL learnt that almost each city or town in the South-west has a replica of the type of tribal marks from the next town. In their book, Awon Asa ati Orisa Ile Yoruba, Olu Daramola and A. Jeje write that though some towns in the South-west have the same types of tribal marks, the marks are different and can be easily distinguished. 

For instance, the facial mark, pele, of the people of Ila-Orangun, Osun State, is a bit wider than that of Abeokuta. So also is the gombo of the Egba, from Abeokuta, Ogun State, a bit shorter in length from those originating from Oyo town in Oyo State. The pele of the Ijebu, in Ogun State, is shorter and different from that of the Ekiti which is one vertical line on each cheek. The variety of the abaja of the Egba, Ogun State is also different from the usual type. It has three vertical lines sitting on the usual horizontal lines.

However, civilisation and globalisation have reduced the popularity of tribal marks. Notwithstanding the reasons and tradition attached to it then, it is apparent that it is ‘light-outs’ for the practice. For example, some of the respondents with facial marks who spoke with the magazine swore that they would never think of giving facial marks to their children. etc. . . .
Additional report by HARUNA SALAMI[/quote]http://www.tellng.com/news/articles/070208-6/news/bob_marks.html

The point being made here, is that different ethnic groups across Nigeria also have indigenes who carry different types of tribal marks.

Two, the practice is fading fast and falling rapidly into disuse;

Three, the tribal marks were mainly used as a means of identification in the past;

Four, the population of those who place such marks on their children has declined a great deal, and the practice, as said before, is no longer common;

Five, it hasn't been a major disadvantage to those who carry it. It hasn't stopped many of them from vying for public office, as can be seen from the list of those mentioned above.

Six, if it bothers anyone who has them, plastic surgery is the last resort for getting them removed.

Seven, those who are bothered about seeing people carrying various forms of tribal marks, need to be reminded that they don't have to look at them. Turn your face away, if it offends you so much!

@FACE,

You made your points eloquently and I see what you mean. It all depends on the perspective of the person, viewing the practice.

McKren:
laudate and sleekdote

We appreciate your concern, but what I can not understand is why you guys are worried that we don't want to struggle for your Presidency anymore Why can't you guys just let us be?

Nobody is holding on to you. So this talk of letting you be, e get as e be!

The Igbo have an abundance of resourceful people and ingenuity, which if harnessed, can be used to turn the fortunes of Nigeria around. So do other ethnic groups. It is sad, that time and time again, they have failed to get a shot at the presidency, because they keep doing things in the same way every time, while hoping for different results. Then they come back to say they have been marginalised, when they could cure all that once and for all, by being politically adept, playing their cards right, strategising, building formidable alliances, putting their money where their mouth is, campaigning etc. and getting the presidency.

Forgive me for being so blunt, but that is just the way I feel right now. No single ethnic group has a monopoly of knowledge or ability. All can contribute equally in this project of nation-building. But it is galling, to see a set of people (with the exception of a few like Utomi), doing very little in the scheme of things, in order to win the highest seat in the land, and then coming back to say they have been denied of a chance to rule. 'Nuff said.

Those who don't agree may throw brickbats in my direction, but I really don't care. I have said my own.

denex:
It is your father and your mother's heads that are in a failed state. Bloody liar!

Oh, na dis kind thing I no dey like! Educate the guy with facts and figures, instead of abusing him now-w-ww!

angel101:
ehen? u who were born in the '20's and u don't know that dangote is a family name. has Aliko been a billionaire since the '80's? Otedola nko? Dont even get me started silly!

Dangote has been a multi-millionaire from the mid-eighties. Even under Abacha & Abdusalam Abubakar, he was the nation's largets importer of rice and sugar. Then he turned to wheat. He was also a big-time importer of cement until he discovered that it would be far cheaper for him to set up cement factories, instead of paying through the nose to import the stuff. The Dangote family is closely related to the Dantata family, who are also multi-millionaire merchants, in the North. Them current head of the Dangote empire, Aliko Dangote has leveraged on his connections with the previous regimes in power, in order to expand his business empire and even influence government policies. In the past, certain items were banned which turned out to be a blessing in disguise for him.

As for Femi Otedola, he got into the oil business in 1991/2. Using miltary connections from retired generals, he went into the downstream sector of the petroleaum marketing business and carved a niche for himself. The terrain he chose was still unexplored, and had very few players. So he was one of the first indigenous business men to set up a tank farm or petroleum products depot, to import and sell fuel to the public. Initially, he started with diesel (AGO) and has now branched out to kerosene (DPK) and other products. He has been able to make a strong mark within such a short time, because he has vast connections both within the political class and the military, (since his father was a former governor of lagos state), and also because he chose an area of business with few competitors. From ownership of a petroleum depot, he has branched out into shipping and now onwns four ships, MT sir Michael Otedola, MT Lady Doja, MT Nana and MT Zenon Conquest, etc.

http://www.thisdayonline.com/archive/2004/10/30/20041030cov01.html

Despite all these achievements, I still believe our government made a major mistake in selling our vital refineries to them. The new owners could choose to refine our nation's crude in their refineries, and then sell it a cost that is way beyond the reach of the masses. Or they could choose to refine their products, and export it all, by claiming they have a better market overseas. It is called enterprise.

The government should have allowed private refineries to be set up, alongside the existing govt-owned ones, and then competition would have taken care of the whole issue, like it did in the case of telecoms.

chrisokw:
You have inadvertently answered the question on rotational presidency. The ND (Clark and Co.) knows Odili is Igbo, so would not allow him to usurp their own time to rule. Which means there is sometime like time existing for each zone to lead. Igbo's time will come when it will. We will not fight for it the way you keep insinuating. Period.

Nobody is insinuating that you should fight. All am saying, is that you should not fold your arms and sit back, thinking that someone will call you meekly to say, 'oya, come and take.' Do you remember the 2004 PDP primaries? What happened? After the primaries/elections had been won and lost, some folks came out to say there was an understanding or a gentleman's agreement that the presidential candidate would come from the South-East, because the South-West have already had a shot at it from 1999-2003. What happened? No one came out to confirm or deny if it was true, and OBJ had a free reign again, till 2007.

As for the rotational thing you keep talking about, some folks have said there is nothing like that. Others have said yes, it exists. There is a cacophony of voices on this issue, and very little proof on ground to support the statement. Until it is gazzetted or it becomes part of our constitution, I choose to keep an open mind about this rotation matter. Don't forget, it is easier to change an agreement within a political party, than to change a section of the constitution. Am sorry if it doesn't align with your views, but that is my own take, on this issue.

Please read this link. You will find two dissenting opinions about the rotational stuff. http://www.loccidental.net/english/spip.php?article25

Afam:
The content in bold refers, what exactly is your point? That an Ijaw/Kalabari person being selected instead of Odili will make the person a non Niger Deltan?

Is the issue of rotational presidency strange or new to you? Unless PDP goes under in the next couple of years I doubt if any political party can challenge it in any major election.

And if SS takes the slot when the presidency comes back to the South what's the big deal? Did the North fight for it before it was zoned to them this time around going by your suggestion that the Igbos should fight for it before they can see the presidency?

No, the Niger-Deltans believe that there are a lot of minority tribes in the ND, and a candidate to represent the South-south zone where they are located, should come from one of these tribes. They believe Odili is from the South-East, which is already a major bloc. And if the South-East also presents its' own candidate for the presidency, their own zone will be disqualified during the primaries, as Odili will be viewed by majority of the other ethnic groups more as a South-Easterner, rather than a South-South indigene. Kindly read J.P Clark's views on this matter, as well as those of other prominent ND politicians.

The North fought for it behind the scenes, schemed and strategised for it and ensured they did all they could, to make sure it went back to their region. Ask those who know, and do a quick search on news reports, prior to the elections. Read the commentary of those who were part of the political intrigue, during the PDP primaries.

All of una dey make valid points here, but please make una no turn am to fight.

I agree with all those who have said that increasing fuel prices and VAT in one fell swoop, was a hare-brained idea. In another country, it would have caused serious civil unrest.

But sha o, the government needs to realise that each time they raise fuel prices by 10-15%, prices of other commodities increase by as much as 70%. Inflation takes a galloping lead, and the gains are rapidly eroded. So why on earth do they keep repeating the same cycle?

As for Labour, there was no need to call a total strike. In the past when Oshiomole and his predecessors led such strikes, essential services were often exempted. Some banks would open, and essential medical personnel were also allowed to operate. Even fuel continued to be sold at the new prices, but would often revert back to the old price, after Labour might have won concessions from the government.

I agree that government has bent a bit. Labour too, needs to meet the FG half-way. And they need to hammer it down their throat, that we need a functional rail system powered by natural gas, to solve our transportation problems. Our whole economy revolves around land transport and petroleum products. So there is no point tinkering with it, because the consequences are that prices always go up, when fuel cost increases, and such prices always refuse to come down.

Something needs to change!

My friend, it hasn't been proven beyond reasonable doubt yet, that he is Igbo, _{even though I hope it is true!}

So why are you now starting a debate, that may never end?

sleekdot:
The Yoruba's fought for it remember June 12 even in 1999 The north conceeded but OBJ had to defeat Alex Ekwueme in PDP and Olu Falae had to defeat Chukwuemeka Ezeife in the AD not on a platter of gold and don't be too sure that it would get to your turn if you don't fight for it; you know what happened to Azikwe and Ekwueme who thought it would naturally get to their turn.

Thank you for telling it as it is, jare! This was what I was alluding to, when someone called me. . . a moronic spoiler, and advocated for 'turn-by-turn' presidency. It will suprise those who are waiting for turn-by-turn presidency, that the cup will pass them by again, when another election year rolls by.

If Abiola had not contested for presidency in June 12, 1993 and won a resounding victory which was anulled, only to die in jail while trying to reclaim his mandate, do you think OBJ would have profited from his goodwill when 1999 elections, came round?

It was because of Abiola's death, that other ethnic groups thought the South-West should be given an uncontested shot at the presidency. Even at that, the same South-West elctorate boycotted OBJ in 1999. It was the Northern establishment that put him in power. Like I keep asking, if OBJ had not formed alliances with them prior to 1999, would they have come together to put him in Aso Rock? Don't forget, that this was a man who had just come out of prison, and had little or nothing, to his name. Even when rumours were strong that he would run for presidency in 1999, he scoffed at the idea initially, by saying "How many presidents do they want to make out of me? Afterall, I have been a Head of State, once before." Again, when Yakubu Gowon initailly indicated an interest to run, OBJ said "Maybe there was something he (i.e. Gowon) forgot in Dodan Barracks when he was Head of State, that he now wants to go back and take." The rest as they say, is now history.

When 2004 came round,  the Northern oligarchy helped to put OBJ back in the saddle, again . This time around however, OBJ had appeased the South-West by placing some of their prominent sons in his cabinent, and trying to mend fences with them. He also struck a mortal blow at the AD, infiltrated their ranks and made sure the party went through so much squabbles, that their centre fell apart. So a lot of South-Western politicians decamped to the PDP and worked to give him victory, in their territory.

Now, someone believes that the presidency would rotate in a turn-by-turn fashion, when other ethnic groups have not gone to sleep and are busy strategising on how to rotate it, to their own region. Even the South-South, is not folding its' arms. Prior to the 2007 elections, when Odili was a strong contender for the presidency at the party primaries, some elders from the Niger-Delta objected to Odili being picked as a candidate from their zone, because they preferred a minority tribe like the Ijaw/Kalabari etc. to field a candidate to represent the zone.

Am still waiting for more people to call me names, for chronicling this series of events that have dogged the outcome of attempts to vye for the presidential ticket. Every good student of Nigerian politics, knows full well that history often repeats itself. God dey!

Genevieve is one of my favourite actresses and am disappointed that she is involved in this kind of 'hide-and-seek' relationshsip with the athlete, Obikwelu. She needs to put her cards on the table & the guy also has to do the same. Pronto. Or else she will wake up to find that, the guy has just been using her, all along. If the chap knows she is dating someone else in Naija, why is he still with her? Why not confront the issue, and ask her to make a choice? Na wa o! Wetin person no go hear for dis world, sef??

tEsLim:
@topic
its not easy living with that type of woman. I've been patient all the way thinking she'll change. Putting a lot of my effort to making things work. But now I'm just afraid it might just continue for ever that way.

When I met her she was the type that never apologizes. I kept apologizing for her own mistakes for us to be in peace for months. Then later was explaining the essence of 'sorry's' and reconciliation to a 27yrs old woman. Thats how she learnt it.

My dad came visitin can't even offer him water to drink or entertain. And she finds it difficult to greet people. Some people stopped coming to the house. I had to do another tutorial on that for her.

Most of the teaching as been on skills a woman should have acquired naturally.

Initially I just taught she quite/reserved and didn't know it was going to be an unbearable attitude problem.

I didn't want a child or somethin. I just taught its cool when she explained she want to have. Then i decided to give her all the support. And I stood by her side. Do you know what stress a man can go through when a partner is pregnant too. Many sleepness nights. I wouldn't do all of that if I'm not patient.

Her family knows - I get a lot encouragement from her sister who must have been raised in that condition but adjusted to life better.

You knew all about her inadequacies, yet you went along with the idea to have a baby with her, just because you think it is[i] cool [/i] Are you serious? Do you know what it takes to bring a baby up, in this stressful world? Why on earth did you get her pregnant, when you knew you wouldn't be able to cope with all these issues or her moods? I weak o!  

Secondly, you said you had to teach her how to apologise and even serve some people drinks etc. That was a very good effort on your part. You deserve some commendation. But am interested to know, how was this teaching done? Was it in a romantic, gentle manner, or was it in a harsh, derogatory tone? Sometimes, in an effort to put our views across, we might come across as overbearing and aggressive. This would make an emotionally scarred person on the receiving end, withdraw deeper into his or her shell.  

From what you have said, she obviously didn't have a biological mother who could have taught her social graces or ettiquette, or human relations. Maybe she was bullied as a child by relatives or her step-mother. So she developed a thick skin, in order to cope with her inner turmoil. From what you have described, she obviously is going through some kind of mild sychological disorder (please, am not saying she is mad o!), or is still bearing some kind of emotional scars that have refused to heal.  

Take her to see a good counsellor or therapist, so that she can work through her problems. And show her a lot of love & encouragement. May the good Lord strengthen you, as you continue to help this poor, troubled soul.

Imani:
Maybe you mean Idiots like yourself.

I didn't address my post to you and spoke generally. You are not the only person on this forum that cares so much about his ethnicity.

Like i said before, you DON'T have to agree with my post. You can diagree and say what you like but i object to your choice of insulting words.

I have tried to be civil, but i think you want to make enemies, but i am not interested, please try the "next door".

Imani, your remarks above were addressed to Donzman. I wish you hadn't even responded to his earlier uncouth statement.

You ought to know him well, by now. 'Insult' is his middle name. If you go through most of his posts, you will discover a similar pattern of acerbic insults, running through most of them. Even when he doesn't know much about what is being said, or even when it is so clear that he is way off track, he will still insult you first, before making his views known.

Don't let him get underneath your skin.

McKren:
Thanks Chriskow you can not be more correct than that.

The Igbos should simply take the back seat in National Politics and spend more time developing our land. See the vigour which with Donald Duke governed his people? that is what I expect of the South East governors. Simple.

Yeah, Duke is a good example, and there is a lot to be gained by developing one's state or homeland.

McKren:
Presidency will come naturally at the appointed time and no one will stop it when the time comes.

Not wthout working for it, or strategising and planning for it, as well as building strong alliances with other ethnic groups, across different parts of the country. Why? Because politics is a game of numbers. Simple.

tpia:
@laudate

we're on different pages here.

I'm not talking about a child's inheritance rights or anything like that. Inheritance in these instances has to do with customary law, more than anything else. Remember- my point of reference is Igbo/Yoruba marriages.

Never said, you did. I was the one who brought up inheritance rights. I merely used it as an example to illustrate a point.

tpia:
As Nigerians, culture is very important to us, and culture as defined in Nigeria is directly enforced by tribe. or should I say directly related to tribe. Each tribe even has different major foods and ways of cooking them, for example.  A child of intercultural unions will be exposed to two cultures- one from each parent, to varying degrees.

True!

tpia:
What I was talking about was the common nationalism which defines tribal identity. A person may subscribe to both, but it doesnt mean he/she will be fully accepted by the hardliners of either tribe. There will still be a 'comma' of questionable loyalty, if push comes to shove. A tragic example is the Rwanda genocide, where even children who were half Hutu,with only one tutsi parent, were still murdered by the hutu extremists. An extreme example, and may we never see such in Nigeria. In most cases, cross cultural children don't see anything this extreme, and it also helps if the parents don't allow extremist relations to peddle their tribalism in the home. In cases where the extended family members have a major say in what goes on in a man or woman's home, you'll be surprised at what happens,

Am so sad to hear about the Rwandan case. And like you, I pray it doesn't happen here. People can use different things to cause mayhem and spread hatred. In the Rwandan case, ethnic identity was merely a weapon that was used to annihilate so many people. It is such a tragedy.

But hardliners or arch-conservative bigots exist, all over the world. They are the ones that say for example, "you can't be black if you are too fair-skinned, or you can't be Irish, if you don't hate the british etc." And they are kept in business, by those who choose to listen to them and act on their words instead of tossing it into the garbage heap. Such hardliners merely use 'identity,' as a way to spread more hatred, around the world. They would like to define each individual's personal identity, according to their own terms, and that is such a narrow-minded thing to do. If you remember Ali Mazrui's exchange of words with Wole Soyinka on identity, he objected to the fact that someone wanted to define his ethnic identity or make it sound as if, since he was one, he couldn't be the other.

When it comes to hardliners in the extended family, I guess they would have to be put in their place, wouldn't they?? To deal with such hardliners who are extended family members, you could always take a leaf from my uncle ,who never gave them any audience. He made it clear that his house was run by fiat. No one could come in from outside, to complain about his wife, her cooking or her cultural background. He would tell visitors who were less than polite, to shove off. "No be yah wife, na my own, and no be by force them dey visit person", was his favourite phrase.

tpia:
However, intertribal unions are one of the few feasible ways forward, in my opinion.

in any case, your observations are right. Your post was very interesting, by the way.

Gee, thanks! So was yours' too. Thanks for sharing.

Finally, what your family or your people have said about her, has obviously influenced your view of her. It is sad.

So na now wey she no dey compatible with you, abi?   When both of you were doing the. . . ehm. . 'intimate relations', that led to the baby's conception, una dey compatible. No be so?

First of all, how many times have you tried to talk to her and to find out what is on her mind? By being romantic, vulnerable, open and caring towards her, you might discover that she will open up to you, with time. 

You have already shown her that you are only interested in your kid, and you don't give a hoot about her. So how do you think she will open up to you? Why don't you show deep interest in her? Crack jokes. Make it clear to her that she matters to you. I bet you don't even know her favourite colour, or her favourite food. Maybe she was even scolded for being a talkative at a young age, so she withdrew into her shell. Who knows?

Some guys are so self-centred that they only talk about themselves, and want everyone to fall over them, in adoration. Maybe, there are things you have said in a hurtful manner to her in the past, that is making her sullen. Find out. Be romantic towards her. Afterall, it takes a little bit of caring, to get a woman to give you a whole lot of loving.

dayokanu:
Are you just knowing xtycod? Why don't you just do some more productive things than replying an slowpoke?

No mind am. I'm through with that cretin. Just wanted to send him back to the dunghill where he belongs.

MILITIA:
@Mohadana
Who teach you oyibo? Don't you see the long long letters ya mates dey write for up yonder?

Oya, I dey beg for Mohadana. Make una leave am alone. Na wetin? Haba, this yah assessment dey harsh o! I know say e misjive, but na only small mistake im make. Oya, make una forgive am abeg!

@Mohadana,

Take time o!  I dey yah back, dey plead for you, and you come dey render all my pleas, null and void. Which one be all this? Abeg, stop misjiving for there, jare!