₦airaland Forum

MrPresident:
he didnt fulfil any shiiit, jesus (if he even existed) left this place worse than he met it,

This thread is not for atheists.

MizMyColi:
Op.
What if I don't believe in Sky god. Am I an atheist? I believe in the life giving spirit within.
Am I in danger too?

you choose to rebel against God, you are risking your eternity.

A Creator God, if He exists, must,
by definition, exist beyond the limits of
the universe in order to have created it.
The laws of physics tell us that we cannot make measurements beyond the limits of this universe. Therefore, scientists can conclusively determine that we cannot ever detect God using any of our instruments.

Christians are far more likely than
atheists to be part of groups that work
hard to instill values about being good to other people, and having good
relationships. The teachings of the Bible
emphasize values such as honesty, love,
forgiveness, patience, and generosity.
Many of these values are not emphasized in social circles dominated
by atheists.

Ishilove pleased can you put this on the homepage? https://www.nairaland.com/2173054/what-jesus-meant-fullfiled-law

Firstly, what is the law, and what is its
purpose?
The law is a manifestation of the perfect
holiness of God, and was given to us
(humanity) to show how utterly unable
we are to meet God's standard by our
own means, strength or works (Romans
7:7).

When the law was introduced, it was
never intended to be the instrument by
which man would save himself, but it
was the instrument through which man
was to be saved. In a very real sense,
man is saved through the fulfilment
(keeping) of the law. When Christ fulfilled the law, he earned the privilege of life.

The law shows us our sinfulness as a
contrast to God's holiness. Old Testament
saints who were called righteous relied
upon the grace of God for their right
standing with God, not their success at
keeping the law.

When Jesus is said to have fulfilled the
law, it means that>>>>
HE PERFECTLY KEPT THE
LAW AND HE IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE TO FOLLOW, AND NEVER SINNED (1 Peter
2:22). This was therefore a manifestation
of and testimony to His deity.

Obviously
something no other man could possibly
do.
He didn't come to abolish the law means
that the law remains the law and is (still)
perfect (Romans 7:12). Even after we
enter the New Pact in Jesus' blood (Mark
14:24), which places believers under
grace not under law (Romans 6:15),
therefore in a sense abolishing the law
for believers, the law remains as a
testament of God's holiness and our
inability to meet His standard.

Something
that remains true even after conversion
(Romans 7:19).


It meant that He never sinned, and
therefore that He is God. As a result of
that, it also means His sacrifice was a full
(infinite) payment for sin, and therefore
that the just punishment for
transgression of the law (of all believers)
was fulfilled too. He fulfilled the law for
us, because we couldn't. He didn't come
to abolish the law, because He didn't just
say "the law no longer applies", He came
to pay the penalty for the breaking of the
law.

When Jesus came to fulfil the law (i.e.
obedience leads to life; disobedience
leads to death) he did just that. Notice
He didn't say, that old law's not good,
don't worry about it (i.e. abolish it); what
he did, instead, was to come saying the
law is good, and he is the fulfulment of
it.

truthman2012:
Very good of you. How could someone define a Book as Revelations? Besides, Jesus didn't receive revelations, he spoke with divine authority.

the guy is displaying his ignorance,he is the first muslims that have ever said this to me.

Empiree:
Listen, you don't get it. We talking about Revelation [size=5pt](revealed holy Books to messangers by God)[/size] here not any hocus-pocus.

don't quote me after this.

If it not a written material,how will the people get the message?
Quran Chapter 2, Verses 23 & 24: "And if you are in doubt as to what We have
revealed to our servant, Then
produce a CHAPTER like thereunto;
And call your witnesses or helpers
besides Allah, If you are true. But if
you cannot, and surely you cannot,
Then fear the fire Whose fuel is men
and stones, Which is prepared for
those who reject."

Here Allah is challenging men to produce word like the quran.

RapLawd:
thanks, I know something fishy was involved with them... but you know as normal Igbo dude, I never give it a second thought if these fellas could be trusted-cus I know they are full of deceit.

What I never knew is that Islam did find it fit to allow Muslims lie to Christians and Jews or the unbelievers as they normally call us till I came across that particular topic by Ifeann(Al Taqqiyya)-it was awkward and still yet an awesome to know the dark truth of my neighbours and friends.


and with this I will personally make sure that my Christian friends and families, school mates, business colleagues and the rest who deserve to know the truth about it(Al-Taqqiyya)will surely receive the message of truth in it!.


Thanks!.

God bless you.

Ifeann:
Really sorry to hear this..

More christains need to be educated about Muslims. The Igbos keep Goin to the north in the fate of one nigeria and are slaughtered for any small reason..

A muslim even told me he saw where muslims killed a southern man because he didn't greet the extremist Muslims in proper arabic..

It's crazy..

The al taqiyyah is a concept every non muslim should be aware of.

God bless you.

Empiree:
You don't understand anything at all. Do you actually believe religious Books descended from the sky? Man, you need elementary studies all over. And you are the same fellow quoting hadith and Qur'an like you are the custodian?. Chai, funny dude ! Yes, don't reply me. You peeps trying to be smart. You guys can't stand my argument NEVER.

Now that you have conceded defeat, stay off our religious text.

I ask you a simple question which you cannot answer, All thoes written on a three and baby born with quran, who is sending it? How is it written? Did muhammed recite it on the mother womb? Your argument is not making sense at all.

Empiree. All what you wrote are rubbish, the bible is clear, the word of God is God breath God inspired this men to wrote the bible.And,

"the grass withers and the flowers fall, but the Word of our God stands forever."

We need to ask ourselves, "Is God able to protect his word? Is God able to fulfill
these statements, that his word will
never disappear, never go unfulfilled?"
Is God capable? Yes, of course. This is
God's word to all people.
Are we accusing God himself by saying that He was not able to protect it from being changed?

Nothing has been changed. That is only a rumor. The Quran does not say the Bible has been changed. Just the opposite. It honors the Torah and the Bible. It mentions the Torah, and the "Zabur" (the Old Testament and Psalms) and the "Injil" (the New Testament) many times.

When Islam began in the 6th century,
600 years after Jesus Christ, the Bible
was accepted as true. So, you might ask, has the Bible changed since the 6th century? No. All you have to do is compare today's Bible with a Bible written long ago.

We can find complete Bibles, all the way
back to 300 A.D., hundreds of years
before the Quran. You can find one in
the London Museum, in the Vatican, and many other places. If you compare
today's Bible with the Bibles of 300 A.D.,
the Bible we have today is the same as
then.

Did you know that there exists today
nearly 25,000 hand-written copies of
portions of the New Testament? As
historians have compared these
manuscripts, they have concluded that
the New Testament we have today is at
least 99.5% accurate to the original. No
change. (The .5% differences refer to spelling, but no change in meaning.)

Also, you might be familiar with the more recent archeological findings of the Dead Sea Scrolls. These were found in caves of Qumran, just off the northwest corner of the Dead Sea.

Researchers have compared the Bible we have today with what they found, and they remained highly similar, nearly 100% identical.

Don't let anyone tell you that the New
Testament or the Bible has been
changed from its original writing. That
simply is not historically accurate.
The Bible has not been changed.

Ok, but what about having four
Gospels? Aren't those different
Scriptures, different from
each other? Yes, there are four gospels: Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, in the New Testament. These actually help show that the Bible has never been falsified. These are four witnesses, four accounts of Jesus' life, what he said, what he did.

Imagine if one or two, or let's say four
people, witnessed a car accident on a
corner of a street. And each one was
asked to write up their account, their
witness of the accident for the court. Do
you think that each one would give the
exact same description, exactly the same witness, word-for-word? Obviously not. Each one would write from his or her own perspective of what he or she saw.

And that's what happened when each of
these witnesses wrote their account of
Jesus, as eyewitnesses of Jesus.
For centuries judicial systems have
involved witnesses. And, on very
important matters, it cannot be one
person's word against another's. Often,
you need more than one witness. Here's
a statement in the New Testament,
quoting from the Old Testament, "Every
matter must be established by the
witness of two or three people."
Not only are there four witnesses about
Jesus who wrote the gospels, but there
are many more witnesses. James, Paul,
Jude, Peter, and others wrote the rest of
the books in the New Testament.
John said, "[We write] what our eyes have seen, what our hands have touched." They were eyewitnesses to Jesus.

Empiree:
So you also believe "Book" given to Jesus was literal?. If it was, then as a baby boy in craddle from the verse you quoted up there, Rabbis could have grabbed the Book from him. You people are so funny.

When he said he was given a Book means inspiration, message etc. It's like figurative exprssion. Geez! you fellas no go kill pezon

Clear example of this expression could be cited using Moses and Muhammad (PBUT). We know in Islam that God revealed a Book to Moses called Tawrat but Quran says that God spoke to Moses directly i:e inspiration http://quran.com/search?q=Allah%20spoke%20to%20Musa (4:164)
And we know Jubril(Gabriel) dictated God's words to Muhammad. Is that a Book with hard cover? You guys are so fantastic. You dont seem to understand figuratively

wonders shall never end, so only muhammed,when giving a book is not figurative? The quran has block you sense of reasoning.

Empiree:
Now you are professional literalist. Are you telling me that God threw down Holy Books from heavens to His prophets and messangers and these men looked up to the heavens to catch it?

You are funny man. Sahih International used "choice of words". Check others like Yusuf Ali, he used the phrase "Book". Shakir used "scripture". Khan also used "Book". If you think God sent down paper Books from heavens, then you would believe Cow jumped from the moon too. You are so amazing bro

you don't know what you are saying,you just choose to be ignorance,All the written your Allah is busy written on a rock tree and even a baby born with quran, is it lie or true?

You believe Allah send the quran to muhammed and he recite it,and he became written material, what make you think other book that was sent is not the word of God?and not a written material? I don't think I will reply you anymore, because you argue for argument sack.

Empiree:
When Quran said 'Book' revealed to Jesus, do you actually think Quran is talking about somethng tangible?. When Quran speaks of Book given to Moses, Jesus Muhammad(PBUT) it's talking about revealation that came down, that's, inspiration. It was never meant for sheet of paper. However, for preservation purposes, God Almighty knew that in the future words will transcribed.

So when Bible speaks of Jesus preaching Gospel, I dont expect him working around places with Book (shee of paper) in his hands. No that's not what it means. When Quran speaks of Books revealed to Jesus, it means the true message he was sent with to deliver to the children of Israel. That message is called Injil. That's the message Quran is talking about. When Quran talks about they tampered and distored it means they the people distorted his message which he was sent.

Now did Mathew, Mark, Luke and John write down Gospel in the lifetime of Jesus?. None was written down in his lifetime. Mark is said to be earliest and was written 65-75AD. Mathew and Luke , which were writeen independently using Mark and at least one other shared source(now lost) that scholars refer to as "Q". Both Mathew and Luke seem to have been written 80AD or more. The latest of the Gospel is John, which seems to have been written no earlier than 90AD judging from internal evidence, thought could have been as late as 120AD. So basically, the point is Jesus events were written down long after him. None, I mean none was written in his lifetime.

The writings in the New Testament which were closest in the time of death of Jesus was letters of Paul. Only seven (7) of these are considered genuinely written by Paul himself.

WHAT IS KNOWN OF THE AUTHORS? I:E Mathew and co

In all cases, very little.Much is known about Paul because he gave few details of his life in his letters. He seems to have been Jew from the tribe of Benjamiin who was born in Tarsus now known as Turkey and who studied in Jerusalem before converting to the Jesus sect as a result of kind visionary experience.

I am not able type too long on my phone now on this until i get back on my regular pc. There may be typo error above so bear with me

your lies is exceeding great, you are the first muslims that I ever chat with made this statement the books that was given to Jesus and Moses was not a WRITTEN document? My friend you are a very big liar
Quran16:44
Sahih International
[We sent them] with clear proofs and WRITTEN ordinances. And We revealed to you the message that you may make clear to the people what was sent down to them and that they might give thought.

It say with clear proof and written,if it not written document,then what is it?

Rilwayne001:
Mat 4:23 Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every.disease and sickness among the people.

‘ Mark 1:14-15 The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel’"

Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;

So jesus was preaching his life and deed according to malviguy212...hmm. wonders.




My point is what gospel was jesus preaching according to the verses of the bible above? is it what we have today according to mark and luke today?

Oh yes, its not possible for him to have written how he will die, but was he busy preaching is death and ressurection as recorded by his alleged apostle in ‘ Mark 1:14-15 The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel’"



So holy ghost was busy inspiring contradictions and inconsistencies as we have in the alleged gospel of jesus?



Are there contradictions and incosistencies in the bible or not?

lets start from here

Mat 4:23 JESUS WENT throughout Galilee,
teaching in their synagogues, preaching
the gospel of the kingdom, and healing
every.disease and sickness among the
people.

If Jesus write the gospel, no need to made mention of his name, the first word indicate, it was not Jesus that wrote it but mark. When someone is written your story, how will he wrote it? By writing your name ,but if you are the one writing the story of your life, no need for you to include your name because the readers know the book is about you .

Mark wrote what the holy spirit revealed to him. Jesus did not speak His own words, but the words that the Father gave Him (John 8:38-42; 12:49-50; 14:24). His message was not primarily about Himself, but rather the good news that the Father ordained to be announced on earth.

While Jesus Christ was categorically the
most important individual ever to walk
this earth, the Bible shows clearly that
the gospel that Jesus brought was not
simply about Himself. Read His
statements, and prove this for yourself:

» And Jesus went about all Galilee,
teaching in their synagogues,
preaching the gospel of the kingdom,
and healing all kinds of sickness and
all kinds of disease among the
people. ( Matthew 4:23)

If you are good in English language, you will understand what this verses mean.The inspired Word of God makes it abundantly plain: The "good news" that Jesus Christ brought was about the
Kingdom of God! The "gospel of Jesus
Christ" is simply the message of good
news that Jesus preached not a
message about Jesus. Understand?

RapLawd:
thanks, I know I already made a mistake by giving him money to obtain the charm, now it is a decision to make-not a tough one though... what do I do with the charm when he brings tomorrow,huh? I can't leave it with him cus I want him to have this impression of me believing fully in his crusade, I also thought of giving it to another Muslim friend Who will thank me for it, but I won't cus I'll be tossing him deeper into the hole of damnation that he's already in...


after reading the first comment, I realised that I wasn't fair to myself and to the guy, so I decided to take my time, thought deeply over it after my last post... like my signature portrays-I've made my irreversible decision to destroy the damn thing on arrival!.


and I also noticed that the post wasn't even really necessary, I could have handled it though,but I was really confused that I don't even know where to start to undo my deeds, but you guys Just made me realise that I can still say NO despite the fact that I've already said YES to a falsehood...



Thanks Ifeann... and thanks for the prayers and advice!... I'm glad that you did drop by.


Thanks!.

my brother, I live in kaduna too, during the first religion crisis, it was my neighbours who try to killed me ,for God so kind ,God saved me and my family(father and mother) they burnt down our house,this are the people that pretend they love me, if you live with hausa you will know what I am saying,at first when the crisis start they told us that nothing will happen to us, but when the fight reach my area , the same people sought to kill us, you live in kaduna, right? You know what happened in Rigassa ,this people will trick you and killed you.

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 59,
Number 369:
Narrated Jabir bin ‘Abdullah: Allah’s
Apostle said, “Who is willing to kill
Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah
and His Apostle?” Thereupon
Muhammad bin Maslama got up
saying, “O Allah’s Apostle! Would you
like that I kill him?” The Prophet said,
“Yes,” Muhammad bin Maslama
said, “THEN ALLOW ME TO SAY A FALSE
THING (i.e. to deceive Kab).” The
Prophet said, “YOU MAY SAY IT.”

Ishaq 567:
Muhammad informed Umar (the
second Caliph), and he called the
Prophet a LIAR.

truthman2012:
Allah made provision for sorcery in the quran. Jinns are what we know as demons (evil spirits) in Christianity. But allah said there are muslim jinns and non-muslim jinns. He allows muslims to have dealings with the muslim jinns and they contact them for charms. Both muslim and non-muslim jinns are evil spirit (fallen angels). Because satan is the 'God' in islam, he introduced his demons to them as muslim jinns. The job of muslim alfas is charm making.

may God open there eye before it too late.

Rilwayne001:
Infact that is the major reason for this thread, since you believe the gospel of jesus is the bible according to mark mattew PAUL and co. Did jesus read all these gospel attributed to him?

the gospel details the life and deed of jesus,jesus did not write a book,if he did then provide it let read.how is it possible for Jesus to read in a book how he will die? Doesn't this mean he did not write a book ,mark,matthew,john and Luke were all inspired by the holy ghost but if you insist the bible is corrupt then answer this questions, I ask your brother but he couldn't answer it;

1.when was the bible corrupted?
If it was before islam, why would Allah
refer Muhammad to something that is
Corrupted to make confirmation?
2 If it was after Muhammad had died,
how was he able to receive the revelation that the Scripture (Torah and Injeel) had been corrupted ?
3. The quran confirms that the Scripture
was a clear proof in writings. This means
there were copies in circulation. How
possible all copies vanished without
anyone having a copy anywhere? You
should by now discover a lie is told.
4. Why would God be so weak as to allow man throw away His words before He would vow to protect the subsequent
revelations? Did He learn from experience?
I tell you the truth,if you answer this
questions properly you will discovered
sooo many lies. Thank you.

truthman2012:
One does not need indept knowledge to discover islam is not from God. The same allah enjoins temporary wife, another name for prostitution (Quran 4:24) The same allah according to Muhammad said man MUST commit adultery:

Abu Aahuraira reported Allah's
Apostle (may peace be upon
him) as saying: Verily Allah has
fixed the
very portion of adultery which a
man will indulge in and which he
of necessity must commit. The
adultery
of the eye is the lustful look and
the adultery of the tongue is the
licentious speech, the heart
desire
and yearns, which the parts may
or may not put into effect (Sahih
Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421
& 6422)

Who do you think could make such a statement, God or satan?

I tell you my brother, the different between Jesus and muhammed is like life and death. Muhammed takes life and Jesus gives life but this muslims honour muhammed more than anyone else, just yesterday a man lost his ring and was busy looking for it, a very rich muslim man,my friend ask him, why this ring was so special to him? And he say the ring was prepared for him on iran for protection ,will God who created you be happy for a man who seek help from Sorcerer? No miracle in Islam only magic.

joseph1832:
Is it a crime if Christianity is bashed? History is filled with the atrocities people committed all in the name of Christianity. Thousands slaughtered like sheeps with out shepherd! Even the Albegensian crusade readily comes to mind!.

I absolutely agree with
atheists and Muslims who say that many
atrocious things have been done in the
name of God, and even in the name of
Christianity. However, these atrocities
were not perpetrated by God, but by evil
human beings. If we look at the history of
democide (which includes genocide,
politicide, and mass murder, but not
war-dead) prior to the 20th century, we
find that millions of people were killed
by people groups who wanted the other
people groups eliminated. Infacte this thread supposed to be in the politics section.

To know the real christians read;

Jesus Himself addressed the issue of
"Christians," performing evil deeds in a
rather chilling prophecy:
"MANY will say to Me on that day,
'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in
Your name, and in Your name cast
out demons, and in Your name
perform many miracles?' And then I
will declare to them, 'I never knew
you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO
PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'" ( Matthew
7:22-23)

The verse say "many" meaning not ALL who called him Lord will be condemned only thoes who pretend to be His followers will be rejected by Jesus when at the judgment when they attempt to
claim that they are His disciples.

the Bible describes the nature of a person who is indwelt by the Holy
Spirit (which happens at the point a
person accept Jesus as Lord and Savior):

" But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy,
peace, patience, kindness, goodness,
faithfulness, gentleness and self-
control. Against such things there is
no law. ( Galatians 5:22-23)"

In addition, the true believer does what
is right and demonstrates love toward
others. Even non-believers can readily
see who the true Christians are.

Ultimately, the behavior of those who
claim to be Christians but practice evil
should not be a consideration in
determining if the claims of Christ are
true or not.

This answer the claimed by the op.

There inspiration comes from the quran." Muhammed did the same thing why can't I?"

tola9ja:
islam the complete way of live

islam religion of peace

islam the true way to paradise

islam the religion practice by all prophet including prophet jesus

islam the religion that malvisguy212 will revert to

if you know who I am, you will never say this things.

Rilwayne001:
1. Did Jesus read the bible? provide your proof

2. Was he given the bible or the gospel?







3. Did he read the bible or book of Esaias?

The Septuagint was the first translation
of the Hebrew Bible; and was made in
the third century B.C. by Jewish scribes,
who were direct descendents of those
trained in Ezra's Great Synagogue of
Jerusalem. They were complete experts
in the text, being very well versed in
Hebrew and Greek.
http://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/tips/what-bible-did-jesus-use-11638841.html
Matthew 21:42
Jesus said to them, "Have you never
read in the Scriptures: "'The stone the
builders rejected has become the
cornerstone; the Lord has done this, and
it is marvelous in our eyes'?

Here,Jesus was quoting the psalm
Psalm 118:22
The stone the builders rejected has
become the cornerstone;

the same psalm which was used on the day of triumph when Christ was saluted with cries of "Hosanna!"

"These are My words which I spoke
to you while I was still with you, that
all things which are written about
Me in the Law of Moses and the
Prophets and the Psalms must be
fulfilled ." (Luke 24:44)

All the prophecy were fullfiled in the gospel.

Jesus referred to Psalm 82:6 as "Law": "Jesus answered them, "Has it not been
written in your Law, 'I said, you are
gods'?" John 10:34.


Why this major prophet were not in the quran? Isaiah,jerimaih ezekiel elijah hosea,this are the prophet that confirmed the coming of the messiah.

9jaforlife:
[size=20pt] Is there coercion in religion?? Why is your own 'salvation' by FORCE IT IS YOU WHO NEEDS TO SET YOURSELF FREE!!![/size]

[/quote]did I force you to accept christ? I quote the deed of a man, a man who you delighted in him, you are the one who need to proved me wrong, all the hadith and quranic verses I quoted is right there in your quran, open the verse and read it then falsified my claimed. Did you think I just woke up one morning and concluded" ISLAM is false"? No my friend,the catholic rosary and Islamic rosary are identical, when I was young, in the mosque ,when ever they start using the rosary to pray, if they reach where Jesus name is mention, they will say in hausa "saleke" meaning jump that place, my points is let you know how deep I was in this religion. My father gives his life to christ around 1994 to 95 uptil today he was a devoted christians. Infacte, my friend whose mum was a devoted muslim when she read the life of muhammed and Jesus outside the bible and quran, she see the different is like LIFE AND DEATH, he confessed christ and became a christian. There are many thing you guys need to know about ISLAM which I,truthman and ifeann want you guys to know.