OLAADEGBU:

Because they couldn't find the chemical weapons the mainstream media had no evidence[b] but those of us who are in the know [/b]have it on strong authority that they had been spirited to neighouring Syria before the UN inspectors arrived.

You mean those of you that are deluded and insane?. . .

Olusanya333: Brother do u believe the Bible?

Answering a question with another question, eh?. . .

krayzieklay:
I warned you,bro. Btw,my signature explains it all.

Roget that. . .

TheBigUrban2:

This man has lost it. . . . . .I thought I was the only one that could not make sense of his gibberish up there, not until i saw this. . .

OLAADEGBU:

The chemical weapons that are now used in Syria would have been used by Saddam on a large scale if not for the timely intervention of the US of A. It is on record by insiders that Saddam sent those weapons to Syria before the inspectors came in.

You are always deluded. . .They claimed Saddam had nukes(WMD). . .Had had non. . .Stop lying. . .The chemical weapons used in Syria are no different from some of the ones used by Israel in gaza or even the USA it self in some of their conflicts. . .America invaded iraq to rid saddam of his weapons of mass destruction which non was found any where. . .They claimed he had nukes, watch Collin Powell's presentation in the UN. . .

peterphd:
Mazaje, you're really owning this anony guy.Please I need to talk to you.could you drop an address? thanks

mazaje247@yahoo.com

MrAnony1:



You miss the point totally (even though I highlighted it in bold):

1. Asking Seun when he created Nairaland already assumes that Nairaland has a creator called Seun even before engaging with the data before you. This is begging the question.

How is it begging the question?. . .Seun has already made the claim. . .His trade mark is already on Nairaland. . .

2. Whether Seun chooses to answer or not tells us absolutely nothing about whether he is the creator of Nairaland. I hope you are not suggesting that if Seun decides not to answer your question then it proves that he didn't create nairaland.

He has answered already. . .

3. Asking for the sort of trademark that is on Nairaland to be on the universe simply shows me that you are not prepared to discuss rationally.

Why did you say that?. . .Why is god's irrefutable signature not written in any part of the universe so that people will know that the universe was created by him and leave no room for doubt?. . .I thought god wants people to know that he created the universe?. . .

4. You claim that how the universe works is not orderly. This seems weird to me because I know that you subscribe to a naturalist worldview and you reject anything which you believe goes contrary to the laws of physics, if the universe is chaotic as you claim, then you must hold that at least certain parts of it defy physical laws hence you would be contradicting your worldview.

I really don't know what to make of this, all i said was that the universe has equal amount of order and chaos. . .I don't know where you got the universe works is not orderly part. . .

So as I said, The questions you have asked do not in anyway lead us to the answers that you seek. If you think that knowing the answer to the age of Nairaland and the programming language of Nairaland proves that one is a creator, then you must also hold that if you know the age of the earth and that the sun is powered by nuclear fusion then you must have created the universe. How you can't see that your error in your questions beats me.

LOL!. . . .What am saying is that god can not be used to explain anything properly and objectively, god is nothing more than an assumption. . .People have used god to try to explain creation. . .The bible, koran, yoruba, greek, mayan, hindu etc religious scriptures all tried to use god to explain how the universe came about but failed. . .We see the sun and we assume it's god that created it, we see animals and plants then we assume that it was god that created them. . .We see the stars and assume its god. . .But the thing is you can not use god to explain how these things operate, you can only use god to make wild assumptions about things you do not know, if god created them, then god should also be used to explain how they operate. . .You can claim and assume that god created all living organism but you can not use god to explain specific details about the organism, you can not for example use god to explain to me why the DNA of some organisms mutate. . .You can only use god to assume that he created the stars but you can not use god to explain why super novas occur. ..God is just an assumption and the default position for "I don't know " for the theist, at lest that is what you guys have been able to show so far. . . .You want me to just accept that god created everything and set them in place( an assumption), but you don't want me to ask you about the specific mechanism he used to put those things in place if indeed he created them. . .

FOLYKAZE:

If Death is activeness, in what context do you think earth will ever die and become inactive?




Your wish. . . .keep deceiving yourself.





This guy is deperate mennnn.

Your lies has not been hiding here . . .you cannot cover it. Never. . . .

You defined Pantheism as:



Mother earth is defined as:



From your definition of pantheism, Nature is God.

From the definition of Mother earth, Nature is god.

Therefore, Mother earth is pantheistic God going by the two definitions.


Your balant lies exposed.

Also I have told you in many cases that pantheism can be fuse into polytheism. . . .something consistute nature and made it up. . . . .each of this thing is natural.


When viewed as each natural entities, it is pantheism fused into polythiesm. .

Viewed as a whole is pantheism . . . .fused into monotheism.

And again, Yoruba spirituality is pagan and at the same time naturalistic pantheism.



Your ignorance and pathetic lies exposed.



Define worship. . . . . .mumuni.

And with that, you would be able to know how worshipping natural entities evoke our aweness.

Even your co-atheist is spiritually awaken toward natural entities.

It is only a coward would think worship is all about going to church.





Put your brain into work, you will see that your definition fit in into natural entities.

What cloud your reasoning is that you daydream God as a nigga living behind the wind..

Think and think. . . .if you dont know, tell me and I WILL HELP.




Lol. . . . .

Do you disbelieve in god (defined pantheistically)?

Do you disbelieve in God (defined as adored, admired and revered person)?

Abeg answer. . . . . .I want to laugh at your . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Am tired of this endless back and forth. . .Just to make things clear when I say god you know exactly what I mean I clearly gave you the definition but you refused to accept it. . .When an atheist says he does not believe in god it means he does not believe in deities. . .

This is the definition of deity. . .

In religious belief, a deity (Listeni/ˈdiː.ɨti/ or Listeni/ˈdeɪ.ɨti/)[1] is a supernatural being, who may be thought of as holy, divine, or sacred. Some religions have one supreme deity, while others have multiple deities of various ranks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deity

You are just all over the place, firstly you started by defining god as energy, you even went as far as trying to claiming that the god of the bible is energy just to satisfy your ridiculous delusions. You tried to force the bible to agree with you that its god is a pantheist god which you called energy in your delusions . .When called out you jumped ship and claimed that god as just a label. . .I am not going to respond to you again. . .You have no definition for god. . .To you god means anything which is not what this topic is about, this topic is specifically about the theistic concept of god. . .If you want to discuss your energy god and stone god go create another topic pls and discuss it. . .I am not going to respond to you again. . .

Sorry forgot to mention it earlier MrAnony1, its really nice to have you back. . .

MrAnony1:
Actually that is not what I am saying at all.


Here you are asking the wrong questions i.e. questions that have nothing to do with the answers you seek.

You believe Seun is the creator of Nairaland. Yet if I asked you to use Seun alone to give me answers to specific questions you wouldn't. Example, use Seun alone to tell me the age of Nairaland.com. Or why Nairaland is written with python (or whatever programming language it is written in) and not another programming language? You just want me to believe that Seun created everything but you won't tell how or what he used in creating....doesn't that sound of the mark to you?

I can as Seun and he will tell me when he created nairaland and launched it, he will also tell me why he used the programming language he used, the reasons could range from ease, availability etc. . .Seun can answer all those questions if I ask him. . .God can not tell you the age of the universe or why he used nuclear fusion to power the sun. . .

You see the problem with your questions? I am sure that you'll agree that the fact that Nairaland is 9 years old or that it is written in python tells us nothing about whether Nairaland has a creator or not. What tells us that Nairaland has a creator is the fact that it works according to a specific order such that operating in it is intelligible. Same applies to the universe.

It does, we know python and Suen has already told us the age of nairaland. . .Nairaland already has Suen's label and trade mark on it and as such no body can claim owener ship of nairaland apart from Seun. . .The universe has no label or trade mark of any god any where, you are just jumping into conclusion. . .

The part in bold is exactly what I mean by the only logically consistent way to explain the universe is that it has a creator. Once you deny this fact, then you have no way to explain the presence of physical bodies or the order by which they function.

Does the universe behave intelligibly like nairaland?. . how so?. . .Nairaland has a very orderly way in which things flow, every thing leads to another thing which ultimately leads to interaction between the users, the universe does not have such order. . .Some laws that hold some parts of the universe do not even apply in others, there seem to be order but there also seem to be chaos in equal magnitude . . .

MrAnony1:
Point of correction: I am not "using God to explain the said phenomena". I am saying that God is the explanation of the phenomena. The existence of specific principles that define the behavior of the physical bodies in the universe necessarily leads us to the existence of a creator that defines these principles. If atheism were true, i.e. "there is no God" then we don't have a way of explaining the existence of the principles that put the universe in order.

All you are saying is god is your default position for "I don't know". . .If I ask you specific questions about the earth and the universe and tell you to use god and give me the answers you wouldn't. Example, if i tell you to use god alone and tell me the age of the earth or the universe you wouldn't be able to do that or use god alone as an explanation for why nuclear fusion is what is powering our sun and other stars?. . .Why nuclear fusion and not something else?. . .You just want me to believe that god created everything but you won't want to tell me how he created, what he used in creating and when he created. . .doesn't that sound off the mark to you?. . . `

MrAnony1:
Hi BigUrban, good to see you.



To explain what I mean with regards to science; I don't have to invoke God to know that scientific knowledge is true. It is observable. However, it is impossible for me to have a logically consistent explanation of scientific truths without God.

How do you use god to logically explain gravity or the principle of flotation?. . .How do you use god to explain how the sun is powered by nuclear fusion?. . .

FOLYKAZE:


Like I remember in those days when I do follow my dad to farm, he will cut a tuber of yam to pieces and spread it on mothe earth. This is sacrifice but scientifically, it is application of manure. I do reason like you are doing now. . .but I know this is reality. . . .and Earth receives sacrifices. Are we not blessed? Is our land not green? This guy must be crazy.

When i say god you know very well that i am talking about the theistic definition. . .Now you are back to your nonsense, does this mother earth god of yours only make land green when people sacrifice things to her?. . .There are many green vegetation all over the world where humans do not even visit talk more of offering any sacrifice to any mother earth god there. . .So when I apply fertilizer i am making a sacrifice to mother earth, eh?. . .The problem is when you define your god, give it an attribute and a role, it will be shown to be false. . .The earth as it exist does not need any sacrifice, sacrificing millions of tubers of yam to a desert land like the sahara desert will never make it green. So what role does this yam sacrifice of yours do? how does it apply to the mother earth god, or is the sahara desert not part of the earth? Does your mother earth god only accept sacrifices in some parts and not in others, why or what not?. .Am tired of your mythical tales abeg. . .You are just jumping from one mythology to another. . .applying organic manure to make the land more fertile is now sacrifice to mother earth god abi?. . .

FOLYKAZE:

Death means many thing. It doesnt necessarily mean termination of life.

Yoruba would say knife has died. This doesnt mean it has lost it life but mean it is not sharpen. Same Yoruba would say Instead of the earth to die, it will become infertile. Commonsense would show you here that death in this context is not biological. . . . .I dont know why your brain can not be used expansively. There is nothing you debunk or false here, it is just not what you want to see.

You are just every where. . .You don't even know what you are saying, lets take death in what ever concept you describes a god and gave it an attribute that it can never die, what do you mean that mother earth can never die?. . In what context do you use the word the earth can never die?. . .saying the earth will never die means it will remain positively active, but that is false. . .A time will come when the earth will not be active meaning it will die, in what ever context that remains false, the earth will die, saying the earth will never die is FALSE. . .Just accept that the attribute you have given to your god has shown that it is false. . .Your mother god based on the attribute you have given it has already debunked it. . .

Paganism is polytheism and at the same time nature worship. Abeg is nature worship not pantheism? In this case Mother earth is pantheism.

Mother earth as god has been debunked. . .

Again, you defined pantheism as Nature worship. . . . .Venerating mother earth is same thing as worshipping nature. This mean Nature worship is pantheism going by your definition. And Mother earth is pantheistic God. It suprise me you can turn the table around with balant lies just because you want to disagree with me. Unfortunately, you keep deluding yourself.

You are theone actually lying. . .The link you posted does not in any way describes mother earth as a pantheist god but as one of the goddesses among many other gods in greek mythology and other mythologies. . .It even gives her roles and describes her actions. .

In Greek mythology, Persephone, the daughter of Demeter, goddess of the harvest, was abducted by Hades, god of the dead, and taken to the underworld as his queen. Demeter was so distraught that no crops would grow and the "entire human race [would] have perished of cruel, biting hunger if Zeus had not been concerned" (Larousse 152). Zeus forced Hades to return Persephone to her mother, but while in the underworld, Persephone had eaten pomegranate seeds, the food of the dead and thus, she must spend part of each year with Hades in the underworld. Demeter's grief for her daughter in the realm of the dead, is reflected in the barren winter months and her joy when Persephone returns is reflected in the bountiful summer months.

In Inca mythology, Mama Pacha or Pachamama is a fertility goddess who presides over planting and harvesting. Pachamama is usually translated as "Mother Earth" but a more literal translation would be "Mother Universe" (in Aymara and Quechua mama = mother / pacha = world, space-time or the universe).[6] Pachamama and her husband, Inti are the most benevolent deities and are worshiped in parts of the Andean mountain ranges, also known as Tawantinsuyu (stretching from present day Ecuador to Chile and Argentina).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Nature

Others describes mother earth as a monotheist god with special abilities and super powers, no mention of mother earth as a pantheist god was made in the link. . .I really do not know what you are saying. . .

And what benefit does worshiping nature adds to any body that does that?. . .How does worshiping trees help humans?. . .What about worshiping rain, how does it help humans?. . .

What the pantheist call God is the presence of Divinity in the Totality. To them, there is presence of totality in the universe. . .therefore it is God.

What is divinity?. . .

1. of or pertaining to a god, especially the Supreme Being.
2.
addressed, appropriated, or devoted to God or a god; religious; sacred:
divine worship.
3.
proceeding from God or a god:
divine laws.
4.
godlike; characteristic of or befitting a deity:

What is divine totality?. . .You are just making things up. . .From wiki it simply says a pantheist describes all that exist as god. . .On these your play on words like divinity and totality brouhaha doesn't appear there. . .

Spinozist like to spell Nature as God. Nature is there own God. Maybe you would go on deluding with yourself that Nature is nature and not God. Meanwhile, God is defined as Nature to them.

Forget about the name, what we are dealing is God. . . . .then believe you have in it when defined.

So far you have just shown that god actually is nothing but a play on words and just a label, not actually something distinct. . .Sure nature is nature, there is no definition of god in nature labeling nature does not make it god unless i define what god is and how it relates to nature or what role it plays in nature. .Define god, give it a role and attributes and what how it will be shown to be false and non existent. . .What makes nature god?. . .Saying that nature is god means nothing because there is nothing like god in the definition of nature or are pantheist just redefining things and giving them new names?. . .

FOLYKAZE:

That is why I asked you to define God. . . . .the white beard nigga you hate to belief. . . .tell me who he is.

I have helped you and sited some conception of God pantheistical and also defined it as label (adored, admired and revered person). . .

So I need to know what and what you are disbelieveing in. And the same word holding another meaning that you refuse to disbelieve.

Are you defining god religiously or socially?. . .Hope that you know that a person who is referred to as god socially is not the same as a religious god? . . .The concept of god you sited pantheistically has already been debunked. . .The attributes you assigned to the god has already shown the god to be false. . .You can not claim god is the earth and also claim it has some separate roles the earth can not play or does not play like accepting sacrifice or eternal. . .What does the earth do with the sacrifices the Yoruba people offer to it?. . .Does it bless them with it?. . .Can We can study the Yoruba race and see if they are more blessed than others that don't offer sacrifice to the earth? the earth is not eternal it will die off some day. . define your god, give it attributes and roles and watch how it will be debunked. . Unlesss if you just change labels then that remains just nothing but play on words. . .

FOLYKAZE:

See how this old man is living in denial.


When you checked mother earth on wiki, is she not a goddess? Is she not at the same time personified nature? So who is speaking with double mouth when I am drawing my point from a source?

Nothing does not even exist. Been a label, it remains something. The universe and the natural entities are God not because I choose but because I see everything as Divine. Logicboy in his atheism and spirituality thread call the divinity feeling of awe. For been divine, it is God. An admired person is part of Nature defined as God in many dictionaries.

Going by your fallacy, universe does not exist because it just a mere tag of an entity. Word does not even exist. . . .including you mazaje because it is all mental construct. Nothing even exist. . . . This is how dumb your argument is.

So far you claim to be an atheist disbelieving in God, you are entitle to tell us what God is. . . . . . And if at all I am to inform you what God is, I have done that defining God pantheistically and borrowing a definition from the dictionary, I have the right to ask you if you disbelieve in God defined in some concept. The choice is yours. . . .but all you have done is dodge and run away from question. All the way, you shot yourself many times.

Disbelieving in God defined pantheistically is not making sense. . . .this is your words.

Pantheists have defined God as Universe. . . . . You have play the dice and lose completely. . . .this patching helps not. God's particle is a label givin to a particle, you cannot dictate to them for the romoval of God from the label because it doesnot fit to the imaginary being you created out of your head.

God is god until you you define what you disbelieve in and the rest you would believe or until you define god and prove how you disbelieve in all definitions.

Or better stop making joke of yourself

You keep deluding your self, the mother earth example you gave was not defined as a pantheist god but as a god in polytheism. . . One of the attributes you gave such a god is that it does not die means the god is false the god does not exist because the earth will die, you can not claim the earth is god and give it attributes the earth does not posses. . .define your god and see how it will be show to be false. . .The universe is not god, the universe is the universe. . .changing the name of the universe to mean the invisible pink unicorn doesn't mean it is the invisible pink unicorn it just means you just gave the universe a new label. . .define how the universe is god, its attributes and the role it plays as god and watch how it will be debunked. . So far you have just been tying with out knowing what you are saying. . .The universe exist on its own and it is not any god. . .changing its name to god means nothing. . .

FOLYKAZE:

You never wasted your time. And this is not a joke.

God is nobody's name. . . .there is even a particle called God. This is mere label.

Actually you kmow what I mean when I mention God. . . .the nigga you want to disbelieve in

What do you mean when you mention god?. . .So far you have been jumping all over the place. . .You just said god is just a label. . .A name you give things. . .That's what you said your self. . .

FOLYKAZE:

Lol

Let me use this logic pls.

Oppoutunity is an idea. . . .when it came knocking at my door, I welcome him in.

^^^oppourtunity here has role, attribute and defined. This you know unless you want to deny.

Oppourtunity does not walk. . . This is mere personification. Does this make my statement false?

Why is it false?

If it not, why do you choose attributes of pantheist god as false?





Let me deal with death here.

Agagu other name is kokumo (meaning 'wont die again), does this mean that featured name is false?

I think you would tell me poet are are liars. When they pen down there mind, they include personification, figurative expression and sometime turns love to funny things. . ,making it have roles and ttributes. Does this make love false?




Pantheism is not about universe alone. It about TOTALITY. You are right just like Eledumare does not relate with the human race.

Despite, we are part of the whole. . . .ALL IS DIVINE.

This is attribute shey? Lie?

Dont you know the role played by the sun?






From the dictionary, an admired, adored, influencial person is GOD.

To me Fela fits in. . . .can you ask those silly questions when I call fela god?

It is not valid. . .





Logicboy logic. . .lol

God is not ones name but a title.

People call Car god (ogun).
They call gun, cutlass, knife god (Ogun).

They call palm kernel god (Ikin).

Plants have god name. . . .

Even your mouth is God. . . .

If you go by 'god does not stand independent', then mazaje does not exist because this is a tag and not independent.

Name does not even exist. . . .it is not the something or someone refer to.

Nothing even exist including house.






Living in denial. . . .lol

The one that said disbelieve in pantheist God is not making sense. . . .

He is here taking the path of logicboy he look away from initially.

Pantheist define God as Everything or Totality.

When a pantheist ask if you believe in God, common sense should let you know he is referring to NATURAL ENTITIES, and not some imaginary being. You are not the one that should dictate what God should be. . . .

Do you disbelieve in God (universe)?

Yes or No?

The only thing you have done here is just claim that god is NOTHING but a label. . .The universe is the universe if you chose to label it as god then that is your problem, it is NOT god but the universe. Natural entities are what they are natural entities, a stone is a stone, a tree is a tree. . .You just seem to be speaking from both sides of your mouth, in one sentence you describe the mother earth as a god that accepts sacrifice and never dies, after showing you how false that is you now claim god is just a label. . . . .Now you have shifted god to mean just a tag or a label you give things. . .You are really a joke . . .

TheBigUrban2:

hehe...

no long thing.

nature is nature. Referring to nature as God just makes God a title

He himself admitted that god is just a tittle. . .

FOLYKAZE:


God is a name or simply label.

Now tell me how logic boy or other name like God does not exist . . . . .

So now god is just a label, and I have wasted all my time discussing with you?. . .What a senseless joke this is. . .

TheBigUrban2:



Let me mirror your foolish argument

The pink Unicorn is nature.......is there no evidence for nature?



Saying God is nature is a lazy man's argument. What is God?

We can define nature independently of God ie without God.

However, you cant define God without nature. God has no objective existence

You have just ended this endless back and forth with this statement. . .saying that the universe is god is just nonsense since the universe already exist as the universe. . .For it to exist as god it must be shown unless if god is just a tittle. . .

FOLYKAZE:

Good Monday morning. . . . .

We are saying the same thing. . . .but it seem you are doing everything to avoid a crucial point here which is 'God'. Case of definition is exceptional. Atheist who disbelieve in God is confused. . . . .this is when God is defined. That is the whole point which you have been avoiding.

When god is defined and given attributes and roles then it can be shown that all gods are false. . .

God under pantheism has meaning. . . .it is simply DIVINITY. It has role and attributes. . . .I have shown you Iyale in Yoruba and referenced you to wiki where Mother Earth is been defined with her role. I seriously do not know what else you are looking for.

Not true god under pantheism has no role, isn't defined and has no attributes. .. The mother earth you showed was part of other gods in various polytheistic god concepts. . .Even if I am to agree with you on that the attributes you ascribed to such a god shows that it is false and is non existent. . .Example you said mother earth god you said she can not die. . .This is obviously false because the earth will die away in the future. . .The earth exist but not as a god. . .The attributes you have ascribed to your earth mother god shows that it is false and not to be believed. . .Once you ascibe attributes to any god it can be shown to be false. . .

Paganism is practically nature worship. . . . .deity worship here is pantheistic, bringing us to scientific or naturalistic pantheism. So it like saying naturalistic pantheism is the same thing as nature worship or paganism. This is the bell I, macof and pagan9ja have been ringing into your ears. When God is mentioned in paganism, we are not referring to some imaginary beings but natural entities. You cant fuse pantheism into pagainsm. . .it essentially constitute part of pagan system. Being a pagan is naturalistic or scientific pantheism. . . . . .which God/god in it system you can not disbelieve in.

god in naturalistic pantheism has no role, isnt defined and has no attributes. . .What are the attributes of the universe as god?. . .What role does it play?. . .The to the naturalist pantheist everything that exist is god, no proper definition, no role and no attributes. . .The universe exist as the universe, doesn't exist as any god. . .List the attributes of your universe god, the role it plays as god and define it properly and i'll show you that it is non existent. . .

Th questions you asked are irrational. It has nothing to do with being God. This is some of the fictional attachment you tag to the imaginary being you created out of your brain for the purpose of disbelieve.

The questions I ask are very valid, that is the only way to separate god from nonsense. . .When you claim god, you must define it, state its attributes and role so that it can be known and differentiated from other things. . .

God could mean different thing to different people. It pains me that someone like you could be beaten blue with A concept of God. . . .do you mind if I bring in branches of this concept like Panpsychism. Here everything is conscious and God, meaning consciousness is define as God. Would you throw those your incoherent questions to consciousness too? In Egypt, kings are refer to as god, would you throw those unthoughtful questions about this God who is a king?

Consciousness is consciousness, it is NOT god. . .God should be shown to exist on its own independent of other things. . saying that your house is god means nothing unless if you define how your house is god, the role it plays as god and its attributes. . .Youir house is your house, it exist as your house and not as any god. . .

If you can believe in God (pantheist concept), then you are no more an atheist. . . . .

This is my point exactly.

I do not believe in any pantheist god. . The universe exist, but it does NOT exist as god. . .It exist as the universe. . .The earth exist, but it does NOT exist as any god it exist as the earth. . .If you claim the earth exist as god then it is up to you to describe how the earth exist as god, the role it plays as god, its attributes and why you chose to claim it exist as god and not as the earth. . .

AtheistD:

I beleive moderate Islam was 60-70% and radical Islam 30-40% up until the 50s/60s. Now it is more like 30/70

The moderates are still more than the radicals, the radicals are mostly in the middle east, some parts of Africa like Northern Nigeria and very few parts of Asia like India, Malaysia and Philippines.. . .Above all there are more moderate muslims than the radicals but the moderates are sympathetic to the radicals and hardly condemn them. . .Example take a look at a topic on the islam section where the topic of ISIS and their establishment of the Islamic caliphate was discussed, some were even sympathetic to the ISIS and trying to say if they abide by what the Koran says and do right they will succeed. . .I was astonished when i read such comments. . .How can anything go come out of such a useless and evil organization?. . .

AtheistD:

Even in Secular Islamic countriess the radicalists are pushing for sharia laws aand an abolishment of the secular society. The great Ottoman empire went into 300 years of decline due to radicalists pushing for a reduction in secular and advanced learning and a revival of Islamic education side-by-side with non tolerance of other religions. This allowed the European Christian nations to advance. While Christian nations were going towards globalisation, empires and untapped/unhindered learning the Ottoman empire was slowly disintegrating due to these internal pressures.

The once great Islamic empire became a weak state and was eventually devoured in WWI by the European powers.

The real islam is fanatical and dangerous, the moderate islam isn't actually the real islam, moderate islam is actually an aberration. . .Take a look at the middle east and see the rubbish that is going on there, islam refuses to accpet the reality which is that humans must evolve and advance. Look at the middle east, non muslims are not tolerated and are always treated as pariah, or second class individuals. . .Instead of islam growing and taken over the world( a very useless and stupid dream and imaginations of the muslims that will NEVER happen) islam will self destruct and implode if these radicals keep acting foolishly. . .

TheBigUrban2:


Atheism is exploding in Saudi Arabia. It is just a matter of time

It's inevitable, as people become wiser and as technology advances, atheism will become prevalent, there will be no need for ancient mythology and superstition any more, reason and reality is what will rule not belief in ancient mythology that has nothing to offer humanity beside stagnation and strife, it's either the religion evolves or loses out. . .See christianity, it has evolved sooo much and embraced change just within my life time alone, else most westerners would have abandoned it long ago if it had refused to evolve. . .

AtheistD: I think what is being said is that Christians are more accepting of differences than Muslims.

Over the centuries, Christians have slowly adapted to living with other religions. This has allowed their societies to develop. Secular societies are the most peaceful and have the least religious tension.

If I had to compare both religions Christianity is doing so much that is right whereas Islam is going in the other direction.

Every major issue is on the table and being debated within the Christian world. This shows an evolution and a response to society. With Islam there is still a lack of modernisation and a willingness to address issues relating to the modern society.

Homosexuality
Women and rights
Secular society vs sharia
Other denominations (Islam's treatment of other Islamic denominations is horrendous). There will always be differences. Why cant they be worked out?
Apostates
Atheists
Education (western vs Islamic)

So many issues. They are not being addressed. They are just being pushed under the carpet.

In Saudi Arabia for example criticizing sunni islam is a capital offence. . . Islam refuses to adapt or change or adapt to modern way of life, refuses to accept modern psychology and human behavior ,modern science, refuses to move forward on the grounds that the religion is complete and can not change. . .See them killing themselves in the middle east like animals and always wanting to kill others as well. . .

I will always prefer to live in a society that is majority christian than muslim. . .islam is a dangerous religion when practiced in full. . .

Image123:
Thank God.

There are so many Gods. . .

Image123:

sit there and observe. Even the research people would above all thank God for giving them the needed wisdom and breakthrough. Open your eyes and bask in His wonder.

which god will they thank?. . For Fashola Allah is the god he will thank and not your dead jew man/god that died over 200 years ago according to some stories written about him much later. . .

FOLYKAZE:

Dude I think we are getting somewhere. . . . .though you might not agree with me but it seem I can lead you there, and we are getting there.


You defined patheism as nature viewed as god. . . . . Mother earth is nature personifed as God. One thing is when I stated that Mother Earth is pantheistic God, you declined this but your definition is here showing I was right. One thing you failed to realise is that pantheism is interwoven with and has a strong effect in polytheism and monotheism.

Pantheistic God on it own has no basic ground but when it is moved to other form of theism, you will find answers to many meanings it has tied to it. All those attributes of God you have enlisted in your description of theism God are mere mental creative attachment to the God meant. . . . .these are just figurative expression.


Now let go down a little. Pantheism from what I have learnt stands not alone. It is system of some religion, pagan especially. . . .well I might be wrong though.

Considering the role of Pantheist God, it is abundant on the wiki page where Mother Earth is explain. She is meant to nurture lifes. That is her primary role. There might be other roles in other spirituality but in Yoruba, she is Iyá Ilè or better put iyálè. She is known as the mother of everything on earth, she guides person to blessing which she stored in her house, her children plays on her and her wrath could lead to eating them.

Here is an excerpt of prayer dedicated to Iyale

Iba ta pebe owo
Iba apebe ese
Iba akoda
Iba aseda
Iba ojiji ateleni mo dehin ti o se mu so
Ile ogere afoko yeri , alapooka je kaye o tu wa, ka gbe ori re se rere o
Ero ni tigbin
Ero ni ti koko lagbala
Ero pese ni ajo aye gbogbo wa yio je o
KO TU 'BA, KO TU 'SE
IRE

Macof and PASTORAIO could pls help with translation. There are some words I cant get direct english for there.

But this is what I could make from it.

Praises to palm
praises to underfoot
Praises to the first mother to be
Praise to the mother of all creatures
Praises to shadow, ones escort that cannot be tie down
Praises to Mother Earth who direct nature, combing her hair with hoe, who owns a large store, grant us life to prosper
People of Igbin

. . . . .

She also stands witness between two or more parties making covenant.

When an oath is made, there is this common saying, ' we have eaten with Ile, we have drink with her, we must not stand on her belly and backslide, those who betray would be punish by Ile.


She cannot die

she receive sacrifices.

These are what I can remember, I will mention Macof to help me more on this.

These are roles, you can pick her attribute there.

On the question of if Mother earth is supernatura, it depend on what you mean by supernatural. In Ikale, they believe Mother earth beats person. . . .'ilelu'. They also believe Ile can be prayed to or manipulated for a course. I don have explanation for this though.

My point exactly, god under pantheism has no meaning, it isn't well defined, has no role, no attributes and does nothing. . .If you take the pantheistic idea of god and fuse it into another form of theism say polytheism, it makes sense but it no longer becomes pantheism in my opinion. . .Again, if you say the universe is god what does it mean?. . .What role does the universe play as god?. . .What are its attributes?. . .Is it eternal?.. Was it un-created, does it requires worship?. . .Does it give special treatment to those who worship it?.. Is the universe conscious. . .Can the universe perform wonders that are beyond what we know to be natural?. . .What role does it play as god?. . .God under pantheism isn't well defined, has no attributes, has role and does nothing, but when the idea of god under pantheism is put into other form of theism then it makes sense and then can be shown to be true or false, can be believed or disbelieved. . .

In your example with mother earth I can say that such a god can be believed or disbelieved based on the attributes you have ascribed to the god. For example the earth will die some day, the earth is not eternal(even the sun that is responsible for the earths existence will die away someday). So your mother earth god is not to be believed . .atheism can apply here because you have given god a role, which can be studied, verified and a conclusion can be drawn. . .In this case, I can say that even though the earth exist, it doesn't exist as god based on the attributes you have given such a god. . But when you say that the earth is god without any defined attributes and role then I can't disbelief in it or say that atheism applies to it. . ..Hope you get what am saying here?. . .

Image123: Psalms 85:12 Yea, the LORD shall give that which is good; and our land shall yield her increase.
Rest on the promise in God's word.

If all the mythology and fiction you are typing is true, ebola would since have been defeated. . .The thing is after the Lagos state government and the FG succeed in their war against ebola, deluded people like you will come and be dishing out more mythical passages about how some jew that died 2000 years ago defeated ebola. . .if the government refuses to take any step and share your delusion that a jew that died 200 years ago has already defeated ebola do you think that Nigeria would not have been suffering from an ebola epidemic by now?. . .You are lost in delusion my friend. . .

ooseven: [img]http://scene.sg/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Awkward-Silence.jpg[/img]

The silence is deafening. . . . .