₦airaland Forum

Emusan:
Sorry to cheap in this, I found those two @underlined statements contradicting because when you're satisfied with something you don't look else where.

Well becoming a JWs is your choice and you won't be the last person.

People will continue to change from one religion to another based on their personal view or direct encounter with the True God.

The good news is that all Biblical figures had this same direct encounter with the True God and Jesus said in John 14:21 that "whoever loves Him, He will manifest/reveal/show HIMSELF to him"

This is what I called knowing God beyond letters.

I am satisfied with what I have learnt and when I look else where for contrary answers I still haven't found any worthy yet, so I believe this is the way. I just need to fully commit to walking the way. It is a big decision, hopefully love of God will spur me into it.

MaxInDHouse:
With this post i can confidently, boldy, and wholeheartedly say you are already one of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES, nothing is delaying you again my brother so complete your study and get baptized!

The truth is you can NEVER found a better performing group anywhere else! So you've finished all critics of pure worship with that statement "something BETTER elsewhere"

What all enemies of pure worship just want you to do is worship anywhere and view all other forms of worship as good!

Hmmmm. I am feeling motivated. My lifestyle though. I need to work on it, that's the hardest part. The message is easy for me to understand.

Kobojunkiee:
Please carefully examine the passage below, paying close attention to the conditionals highlighted in the statements.
To say that any of the above implies that Jesus Christ encouraged His followers to gather(regularly at that) is a far stretch. Jesus Christ, in verse 20, states that instead that If his followers are gathered, He is there with them where this gathering could be in prison or even in the streets or in their homes or even at the gallows.
So, from your answer, the Helper coming on them on the day of Pentecost had nothing to do with their being gathered but instead that each of those gathered belonged to Jesus Christ(individually contracted with God through Jesus Christ), right?

Paul's letters were written to the Christians living in particular towns/cities which he regarded as churches. Same with many of the Apostles, but as for the book of Revelation, recall that it is a book written of a vision had by John the apostles.

But I need to stress that the contract we have with God is Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ did not give His followers commandments to gather regularly according to a schedule of any man's design or desire, given that He alone knows who His followers are. And we know that unlike Christ's Church, which is a gathering of only His followers, man's church gatherings, even those addressed by Paul in his letters, consists mostly of sinners whom many of your leaders pretend it is their place to sit and teach year after year after year.
Friends can help keep each other sharp, but in the Kingdom of God Jesus Christ declared that He alone is Teacher/Shepherd/Helper/Authority/Leader/Master/Counselor/Comforter ... over all those who belong to Him.
So, in what capacity does your "human" iron come in to this relationship between God and a follower of His?

I'm stressed this evening but I'll say this. I can easily counter all your arguments.

What I posted is easy and clear to understand.

But you are free to believe what you choose to believe.

What I am really interested in this evening with this stress I am experiencing is what I asked the OP in my initial post.

haddeylium:
Eh! Eh!
Wahala
This question is hard for someone that is still madly in love with with Jws organization.
You know when a breakup is not by mutual agreement and other other is still in love and his Ego is involved


That attitude reminds me of a divorce full of bitterness. An ex husband that is always alert to the last news about his ex wife; every word you say, every action she took, every move you make, every claim you stake, I'll be watching you. He speaks about her and bashes her every day, and tries to contact every date of her to air her dirty laundry, convincing himself he does it for the good of those poor guys.
Do that husband sounds like someone that has moved on or with alternative?(Check his thread).

Need answers,
I like the fact that you've been studying with one of us. But make sure to research extensively focusing on God's name 'Jehovah'

'My brothers may be imperfect cooks but they have the correct recipes '

Have a great day

Thank you. Have a nice day too.

rottennaija:
Thanks for your response. I'll get to respond to them as I make time for it. Meanwhile, there is this discussion forum I want you to have a look at. It discusses a lot about blood transfusion.

https://discussthetruth.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5533&sid=3aed593b3fa620caccb199338bd5bfc7

Okay, thanks

Kobojunkiee:
God is God of Laws and His Laws tend to have a name attached. The Old Covenant Law is called the Law of Moses or Mosaic law because it was given through Moses to the people of Israel. He has many names, but He gave them the name YHWH a the name of their God.
Similar to the way that Jesus Christ is the one we are called to trust and obey in the New Covenant, YHWH is the one the Israelites is the one the Jews are called to trust and obey in the Old Covenant.
The high priest was not a mediator in the Old Covenant agreement as Jesus Christ is the mediator in the New Covenant. Nothing in the job specification, some of it seen in the passage below, even hints at that. Yes, the high priest had a special job, as did the other priests, and those of the tribe of levi, but it becomes a stretch to suggest that the job was as a mediator between God and the people since God also had His prophets.

By the time of Jesus Christ, Ananias, I believe, was the High Priest and he was far from what one would call a holy or even godly man, yet there were many righteous men in the land at the time, all of them of the Old Covenant belief.

Given that the Priestly system has long been discontinued, Aaron and his descendants long forgotten in the land, does this then mean that the Covenant is over and done with? No, the mediator is eternal and separate from the high priests and the other priests in the system. A Mediator is instead the means by which the people are able to call on or reach God of the Covenant and YHWH is the name of God by which any Jew, even today where the priesthood is no longer in practice, can call on Him.
Yep! Different Laws, different mediators, different Kingdoms but the same God.
The clue to understanding what the disciples were saying is found in the same context. The disciples made their decision in order to inform the believers of rules they should live by in order not to run afoul of the Jewish Old Covenant laws in the land.
P.S The Old Covenant Law of Moses(YHWH) is an everlasting covenant between God and the people of Israel, so it is very much in place even to this day.
The letter they wrote, as a result, was also written to believers living in the land of Canaan at the time.
You are right that Jesus Christ said that of swords but the commandment He gave us was instead is that we love our enemies(implying we not even fight back at all).

I wish I had the strength to address you properly but I will try. Heb 4:15 draws similarities between jesus and the high priest.


Some things you said up there, I already showed your references. You didnt know they were there before.

I will address them later, notice my short concise reply, I am tired.

Kobojunkiee:
Jesus Christ did indeed have 12 disciples who were training under Him, but I am afraid I do not find anywhere in the Gospel were Jesus Christ commands them to meet regularly as you suggest. Again, this since, the contract itself is not for groups but for individuals and defines the direct relationship between them and God Himself, not others
Interesting! Are you implying from this that the Holy Spirit will only come upon those who are gathered together with others, but never on individuals in isolation of others?
How did God give the approval for the "opening" of this church in and after Antioch?
And how do you come to the belief that "Iron sharpeneth Iron" implies that God wants men to sharpen each other up in His New Covenant?
The only group specified in the terms and conditions of the contract is Jesus Christ's Church, not the church in Antioch or anywhere else. And according to Jesus Christ, His group consists of all of His followers, regardless of their geographical location, and Jesus Christ knows then and He alone gathers them since they all have Him living inside of them, no matter where they are located.

Your churches however are not the same gathering that Jesus Christ spoke of since they are gathered by and led by men - this kind is not found defined in the New Covenant, so?

Jesus encouraged his followers to gather together, Matt 18:20

No, but it is a fact the helper which is the holy spirit FIRST came upon them in pentecost when they were gathered together.

From the book of Romans-Thessalonians are addressed to churches. Some parts of the book of Revelations too. God gave his "approval" of those churches because Roman's-Thessalonians are part of the bible.

Proverb 27:17 answer the iron question.

Kobojunkiee:
And what was the importance of Jesus Christ's "sacrifice" as explained to you?
Jesus Christ is the embodiment of the New Covenant Law/Contract that exists between God and individual man. So, you go to God in the Name of Jesus Christ - the name attached to the New Covenant Contract.

The Old Covenant Law of Moses between God and the people of Israel, for instance, is called the Covenant of YHWH. So those who call on God in the Old Covenant do so by the name YHWH - the name given by God to the Covenant.
If God does not forbid a thing, no man, woman or group has a right to forbid it. So if you choose to believe in this, it means your faith belongs in men, and their groups, and not God.
Recall that Jesus Christ is a contract between God and individuals, not a group contract.
That law is in the Old Covenant Law of Moses(YHWH). You are not a Jew and so you are not bound to that Law/Contract. Instead, as a gentile, Jesus Christ is the contract available to you through God, and nowhere in the Terms and conditions of the Contract, Jesus Christ, are you told that He who kills by the sword will perish by the Sword.

Each contract defines for those involved(the signees) what sin is and what is right and good and acceptable to God. What is sin in one contract may not be listed as a sin in another contract, and so it becomes very important for you, the signee, to be well aware of the details of the contract that you are in, so you can work towards fulfilling the deal you are a part of and not arbitrarily doing meaningless work. So, basically, you cannot lift conditions from one contract onto another contract - it is against the terms and conditions of each contract. And you certainly cannot include your own ideas either.

In addition, although our faith in jesus is personal the bible encourages those with similar faith to meet together regularly.

Jesus has 12 disciples.

God did not send the holy spirit as tongue of fire on Pentecost until all the apostles and disciples gathered together.

The first church was opened in Antioch for this purpose and the apostles were directing it under holy spirit.

God approved for other churches to open in the bible after antioch. God wants Christian's to fellowship together because iron sharpens iron.

So being part of a group is Christian and has always been.

Kobojunkiee:
And what was the importance of Jesus Christ's "sacrifice" as explained to you?
Jesus Christ is the embodiment of the New Covenant Law/Contract that exists between God and individual man. So, you go to God in the Name of Jesus Christ - the name attached to the New Covenant Contract.

The Old Covenant Law of Moses between God and the people of Israel, for instance, is called the Covenant of YHWH. So those who call on God in the Old Covenant do so by the name YHWH - the name given by God to the Covenant.
If God does not forbid a thing, no man, woman or group has a right to forbid it. So if you choose to believe in this, it means your faith belongs in men, and their groups, and not God.
Recall that Jesus Christ is a contract between God and individuals, not a group contract.
That law is in the Old Covenant Law of Moses(YHWH). You are not a Jew and so you are not bound to that Law/Contract. Instead, as a gentile, Jesus Christ is the contract available to you through God, and nowhere in the Terms and conditions of the Contract, Jesus Christ, are you told that He who kills by the sword will perish by the Sword.

Each contract defines for those involved(the signees) what sin is and what is right and good and acceptable to God. What is sin in one contract may not be listed as a sin in another contract, and so it becomes very important for you, the signee, to be well aware of the details of the contract that you are in, so you can work towards fulfilling the deal you are a part of and not arbitrarily doing meaningless work. So, basically, you cannot lift conditions from one contract onto another contract - it is against the terms and conditions of each contract. And you certainly cannot include your own ideas either.

Thanks for your comment.

The old covenant is called the LAW COVENANT or MOSAIC LAW and not covenant of YHWH, though YHWH is the source.

The high priest was the mediator in the LAW Covenant.
Jesus as the fulfillment of the law is the mediator as high priest in the new covenant.

Both covenants are from God with different mediators.

God forbid the taking of blood in both new covenant and old covenant, Acts 15:20.

Jesus himself said those who kill by the sword will die by the sword Matt 26:52

Emusan:
Ok

But based on your previous reply, I don't think you're doing any findings since you said you're already cool with most of the answers the elderly JWs gave you.

You are right, I am satisfied. I am not yet a JW, I believe examine if maybe there was something BETTER elsewhere. That part he said he doesnt know which is not helpful.

rottennaija:
This is an information age. Before joining any group, research about the group, from members and ex-members. A group that has no hidden skeleton will encourage you to research them. You should also read their old books, especially for a group claiming to be the only truth religion and has God's backing, take particular interest in how explain past errors. Their history and what has been publish will let you know if they really had God's backing.

Take for example, if you had interest purchase a car, a particular model, what would you do? You ask the dealer about it and then would ask those who had driven the car and those who no longer. What were their experiences? What challenges did they face and for those who had abandoned the car, why? You will very likely have a broad view about what you are about to get yourself involved in.

Very likely, a car dealer, a group that does want you to ask questions should have raise your interest. Even more so, a dealer or group that has the list of approved questions and those you cannot ask should even be more concerning...

Nothing is certain in life. What happens if tomorrow you no longer want to be part of the group for any reason? How will they treat you? If you noticed something not right, would you be allow freedom of speech to express your views or you would be swore to silence? In particular, what happens if what the group believes does not agree with what you read from the bible? Would you be expected to be loyal to the group or be loyal to the Bible? And if you choose to be loyal to the Bible, how would you be treated?

These are some things to consider. You will have to carry out serious research and make an informed decision. You know you are accountable to God for the decisions you make. I cannot tell you to go ahead or not, it is a decision you are to make based on research you should make about them.

Let me be very specific... And that's especially why you need to carry out serious research.

As a Christian, the Bible belief is that Jesus mediate for all persons. Ask the elderly folks studying with you if after joining the group, Jesus would still be your mediator or you would be expected to abandon such belief (note. They may be unaware of such and will argue they don't have such belief)

Ask the elderly JWs why the religion forbids blood transfusion that saves life when the Bible forbids eating blood. Ask them why a symbol (blood) should be held more sacred than life (which the symbol represents). Most importantly, ask them where such precedence of sacrificing life for laws exist when throughout the Bible, it is shown that when life is in danger, laws were set aside to save life. ( research on PIKUACH NEFESH)

You make want to take a trip to FAQ on their official website.

jwfaq

Now, compare what they say to the public and what they actually practice internally if it holds up to the truth.

Ask them if in the future, you do not want to continue with them, if they will shun you (note... They will likely infer that one sin or another will be the reason) without any sort sin in your part.

I dont quite get that MEDIATE part. Do you mean in prayer, cause if its prayer, they end every prayer with JESUS NAME.

If it is also bible I know they study Jesus life and ministry with me, especially his kingdom message, even the Easter that just past they spoke about jesus and the importance of his sacrifice.

So I dont quite get the mediate part.



The blood part self i am very uncomfortable with it but the logic is sound after going through it myself but I can't quite imagine myself going through it. My faith hasnt reached that level yet.

The bible says that who so ever kills by the SWORD will perish by the SWORD. now its modern day, AK47 can kill multiple people in less than a minute, does killing by the SWORD apply to me killing with an AK47? they are obviously not one and the same but you get the point.

He gave me so many analogies like this and I get it for now, but that is where it ends for me.

Emusan:
Why the question when the thread didn't say anybody is bad?

His previous thread highlights that, I am only on a fact checking mission, to hear both sides of the story without bias and draw my personal conclusion.

rottennaija:
This is a good question... which group should I recommend or which do I associate with.

I can't recommend any, I don't belong to any. People's needs are many and different some are attracted to the level of recognition belonging to some group brings, some to power, to some, it's a feeling of belonging somewhere, anywhere. I don't feel those needs.

As a general rule, for me, the fewer the better. I generally avoid any organised religion, be it small or large. The reason is that when you area member of the organised religion, your attitude, your expressions of affection, how you see others, the black vs white thinking, us vs them mindset is always going to be inculcated in you.

And should you have the misfortune of belonging to a high control, manipulative group, you can be rest assured that your individuality will be replaced by what the group wants (what the group wants will always be polished as what God wants). These are my dissuading factors in relation to the organised religion.

I'm still on my journey, a search. But I am comfortable where I am.

Meanwhile, I'll recommend you read "Crisis of Conscience". It was written by a former member of the Governing Body, it provides an inside view of the organisation, it's structure and doings. "In Search of Christian Freedom" is his second book. You should take a look too.

JWfacts.com is an interesting site you can learn a lot about the group.

The summary is they are bad news.

The person I am studying with use to serve in 'Bethel', that's like a special place to them and he is quite knowledgeable on bible affairs and current affairs. I ask alot of questions even irrelevant ones and I'll say he has impressed me. That is what drew me to him, but I am not fully committed to the cause, I dont feel I am ready to change MY LIFESTYLE.

I hardly go to church before they came along, now our bible discussions are like church service to me. I didnt feel the need to associate with a church because I thought I can serve God personally as I like but he pointed an error in my thinking.

He said God since the beginning of creation always had a people set aside for him. He has in heaven and he has on earth. He organized the Jews as his people and separated them from the other people that didnt know him and he has continued in that pattern even now. He says God has an organized people today because he never changes, the same yesterday, today and forever.

So with that I saw the error of my thinking that I can serve God just on my own. So now I dont see organized religion as bad but rather I now know I must fit in to be a part of an organized religion. He also explained that part too.

The fitting has to do with meeting certain requirements expected of a Christian, the repentance and turning around part and maintaining it. He showed me that the love of God means I must from the heart obey his requirements and not just by lip service. As I speak currently I am yet to meet up with half of the requirements but I attend the meetings online as often as possible.

rottennaija:
This is a good question... which group should I recommend or which do I associate with.

I can't recommend any, I don't belong to any. People's needs are many and different some are attracted to the level of recognition belonging to some group brings, some to power, to some, it's a feeling of belonging somewhere, anywhere. I don't feel those needs.

As a general rule, for me, the fewer the better. I generally avoid any organised religion, be it small or large. The reason is that when you area member of the organised religion, your attitude, your expressions of affection, how you see others, the black vs white thinking, us vs them mindset is always going to be inculcated in you.

And should you have the misfortune of belonging to a high control, manipulative group, you can be rest assured that your individuality will be replaced by what the group wants (what the group wants will always be polished as what God wants). These are my dissuading factors in relation to the organised religion.

I'm still on my journey, a search. But I am comfortable where I am.

Meanwhile, I'll recommend you read "Crisis of Conscience". It was written by a former member of the Governing Body, it provides an inside view of the organisation, it's structure and doings. "In Search of Christian Freedom" is his second book. You should take a look too.

JWfacts.com is an interesting site you can learn a lot about the group.

I'll look up those books and see the knowledge they contain, but I doubt they will provide me any valuable information on organized religion, like which is the best, if anything like that exist.

I reached out to you mainly because I thought you must have found a better alternative by now. I'll appreciate that if you can, if not what are the alternatives?

I feel personal religion is living in denial, cause when it comes to religion, you are either fully into it or you are not into it at all. Those sitting on the fence should just be atheist and that has its flaws, many of them.

So now I am like this

rottennaija:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxSOHEDbafY

Hello, so I have this elderly JW couple studying with me for some months now, do you think they are a bad idea? If they are what religion do you associate with currently?

Analyst7:
The funny thing is that second scenario is almost impossible to happen, men rarely fight men and will now go to the extent of calling the wife, it’s only women that like all those headache kinda fights

Yeah, the keyword is RARE.

rita25:
its a very normal thing men have been choosing their mothers and sisters over us,the way our brothers do to other ladies...........its a circle......but las las women will be fine..........

Amen.

References:
https://www.thecable.ng/in-full-the-10-demands-by-striking-doctors-and-fgs-responses-so-far

Please what does point 10 mean?

rita25:
THE GUY HAS SUPPORTED HIS MOTHER OVER ME SEVERALLY I DID NOT DIE SO ANY OPPORTUNITY TO PAY BACK EH............E GO CHOKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wow, so this scenario has happened live to you . Hope you are fine sha? No vex o

gentleibraheem:
I think the second scenario Either doesn't happen or is very rare.
Men don't have time and Energy to waste on useless stuffs

Good observation

rita25:
omo my husband and father ke? my husband must give way oh............me and him will settle but NEVER disrespect my dad since i havnt done that to any of your parents.....then i will go inside and talk to my dad if its his fault but right there i will just beg for peace to reign and cry better cry for the both of them

What if it was the first scenario, what will you have your hubby do?

addictiv:
Wife: Which side are you on?
Me: I am on the Lord's side...

A more practical approach will be to quickly deescalate the situation by separating warring parties. Take wife to the bedroom and listen to her version, from her version, praise her for what she did right and point out what she did wrong. Then listen to Mum's version, praise her for what she did right and point out what she did wrong... Then bring them together and have them apologize to each other for the areas I told them they went wrong, then do something I know will make them happy, maybe gifts, outings, a stroll in the park, etc, according to their individual preferences. Luckily I have a great mother, even Jezebel herself won't be able to have issues with her.

Lol....you're on the lord's side. Wahala for who marry MOG

EmekusTHEgreat:
All these questions are relative, my momsy and current babe get along very well, they are both really calm people that don't like confrontation, the likelihood of such happening to me is slim


But if it does then I don't mind being the villain to both of them. How dare they try to confuse me after a hectic day at work. Both of them dey ment!!! I would castigate them, and query them for trying to make me pick sides to spite the other person. I would then go on to guilt trip the heck out of them.

"Mom, this is your daughter why are you trying to hurt her"

"Wife, is this how you would treat your biological mother "

"If the two of you don't make up and stop bickering like silly prejuvenile children right now, you'll both go back to your husband's and father's houses and never hear from me again"

Option G, guilty trip them , that scope go work o

kingemaker:
Ko ni da fun wife yen

Your ONE and ONLY, your LOVE

bluefilm:
I'm sure you must have been watching I'M IN LOVE WITH A MAMA'S BOY on DSTV of lately?

Am the wrongest person to be caught watching nollywood movies either on mnet or Rok.

The story lines are too simple for me

McSquishi:
F. mostly but mixed with B. and some A.

Only you FBA...

Erojepromise:
she can't cook and so? is that a pre requisite to what makes a lady a wife material or valuable? l don't think so .. cooking is an art and comes naturally to some people , that are naturally talented because they are drawn to that art.. l would advise men to learn how to cook and stop being liabilities themselves because the modern age has come and the days where women were just limited to the kitchen has gone. if l can cook it is because l need that skill to prepare my own meals and not wait on somebody else to do what is essential for my living for me as an adult.


for some of you that might what to quote know this, " the only quality you should look for in a lady is her "character" . Majority of you guys will definitely choose a bad cook with good character over a lady with very bad character who's a good cook because you know the art of cooking can be learnt from self - teaching or tutoring by an individual... cooking isn't a quality that is difficult for someone to have. pen down.

I agree with you a little, I follow you also because you have sense.

Have you thought along this line though, that is what makes a man a 'husband material'?

Is it ONLY because he has a 'good character'?

Will you marry a man just because he has a 'good character' like a woman with a 'good character' is a wife material without considering other IMPORTANT FACTORS?

Do you think 'good character' is enough to build a successful home and marriage?

I will answer no, even him having LOVE and GOOD CHARACTER is not enough to build a successful home.
You need EXTRA SKILLS to compliment your 'good character' either as a man or a woman. One of such skills is the ability of a man to be financially capable for marriage and to foot the responsibilities of the marriage whether his wife works or not.

A woman likewise should search herself and improve in areas where her skills are poorly developed to have additional things to bring to the success of the marriage in addition to her 'good character' and love. 'Good character' alone isn't enough.

fattprince:
I didn't say this oh. I only said I wouldn't put my wife over my mum. They curse me pass 1 thousand times. Including mummy's boy but I still no care. Mum over anything.

Your choice.

pansophist:
There should be an option G, which is that at the heat of the moment, tell my wife to go inside the room, so I can have a conversation with my mum first. Afterwards, see my wife later to hear her own part. When things are calm, bring them together and iron things out. Simple.

Lol...I will think about it

Stephenmoka4:
I go look their two, I go just say "na who don chop dey settle wahala"

Why you heartless now

omaclarry:
my first statement will be 'everybody go to ur house, we go talk later'

Lol...so where your wife go go?

BronzeMajik:
I respect my mom a lot, I expect him to do same...

Wow, you really no send your hubby