₦airaland Forum

Beaf: No, I am saying the "foreign" commercial stake in Lagos is way too high to be trifled with; it is humongous. There will be no bloodshed, strife or ethnic cleansing, because the place will collapse into nothingness.

Well, I hope it is that simple.
Lagos is the one city where Igbo have their biggest investment. My hunch is that they would try to have a peaceful resolution to issues of citizenship. They would want to stay there (at least initially), and would only leave willingly after Biafra or Alaigbo offers something better (which will happen in the future). The problem is that some Yoruba elements may attempt something funny before that peaceful departure.

Sam_Ikenna: Who wouldn't retaliate? Anyway, my concern now is that I hope our leaders are getting the message that this ship might sink earlier than expected. Woe betide you if you're caught napping in these times. Its like all the 1967-70 war to keep Nigeria one is now a fluke and the North has finally accepted that this nation is on the edge and might not make it - the question now is - are we napping? I hope not.

That is why I saying all I'm saying here.
I noticed that we don't talk much about our problems. It is a dangerous mindset to have in Nigeria.

Aigbofa: Whoa! You are unbelievable! After asking for Biafra all these years, now that you have it, you will rather burn down Lagos than to relocate to Biafra? You must really love Lagos, am I missing something?
I don't think there will be any violence. I think Ibos who decide to stay will simply get assimilated and become Odua citizens. If not, they can always go back to Biafra.

I don't love Lagos one bit, believe me. I can't stand that city. I lived there as a young man and swore NEVER to have much to do with it in the future, and I have avoided it like a plague ever since.
I am only speaking out of concern for my brothers and my tribe there.
History tells me that they won't leave, and they will remain IGBO complete with FULL citizenship rights (to survive there).

Sam_Ikenna: Look, the leadership of the West knows the East has a large chunk of their citizens in Enugu and PH. It'll be suicidal for them to try any BS - reasons being that (1) East has a substantial population that can put up stiff opposition eventhough they'll lose in the end because the turf belongs to Yoruba - meaning they'll be indirectly burning their beloved city down. (2) Cleasing a people portrays the cleanser-nation in a horrible light - who will come in and invest in that country again? (3) East can also extract their own pound of flesh by doing the same to SW citizens in Enugu and PH. You see, its a no win-win situation if we all go down the path of hate and violence. All these people here advocating for ethnic cleansing dont even know who'll be brought home to them in a box, it could be their brother or sister.

Touche, my brother.

About how ethnic cleansing nations appear internationally, history teaches me that that never stopped nations attempting it (especially in Africa and third world countries). Our best form of deterrence is to fight there. Simples

Katsumoto: Do you ever think that some of the unguarded comments you make on Nairaland about how the Igbo will battle the Hausa in Kano and the Yoruba in Lagos can actually get a man killed? You sit in the safety and comfort of your house in the US and you keep making noise about war and conflict. What really is your problem? You fan the embers of mistrust for absolutely no reason and you exacerbate the situation with unnecessary grand standing. If a man likes, let him have 200 houses, if he doesn't feel safe, his natural instincts will tell him to take off just like many Igbos did during the June 12 saga even when no one was targeting them.


@ Afam and Sam Ikenna

There will be no ethnic cleansing or witch hunt in Lagos or any part of the SW because there is nothing to suggest it. In all likelihood, Odua will embrace those who have made investments in Odua; naturally some others will prefer to move back to the east. Every man or investor will make the choice that suits him the most.

My friend sharap dia!
Your brother ekt-bear was the first to insinuate ethnic cleansing on this thread, and he did it several times before I decided to respond to him. I see you ignored his ethnic cleansing suggestions.
You are in the "safety" of your London 2x2 feet "apartment" spewing all manners of hate twisting history and inciting mass murder against hapless citizens by agents of state. I called you out and you disappeared for a couple of weeks only to return here to accuse innocent folks of your own crimes. Anuofia.

alj harem: Aboki for where, I be Awori-Egun man. Kete gbe o (proper awori for you)!

With that said, stop trying to create division between Lagos and her people. I know Afam real life and would not want him to get the impression of extreme views among Lagosians.

I will give you an assignment. Do it HONESTLY and come back to report your findings to us. Agree?
Here is the assignment.
Go to Alaba or tradefair or Idumota, Aguda Surulere, Satelite town, Festac, Somolu, Ikeja, Lekki or any other large concentrations of Igbo folks in Lagos and do a rough survey.
Ask them what they would do should Nigeria divide.
I have lived in Lagos and I know the place.

Sam_Ikenna: Nwannem, lets keep our fingers crossed. A new kind of drum is playing in Nigeria and we must be watchful and ready to dance. We'll not be cleansed from lagos, we'll sell our properties and go peacefully to our ancestral land. Lagos is strategic for SW and I believe they'll want to keep it that way so all this talk of killing X and Y is BS. For me, Igboland is sacred and thats where I want to be.

My brother the problem is that we have our brothers who are Lagosians. Born and raised there. There are also our brothers who want to stay there. We cannot throw them under the bus if anyone attempts any b/sheet with them.
But in all honesty I suspect they can fight for themselves there.
Of course, all these are worst case scenarios. It all depends on how Yoruba folks approach the issue.

alj harem: the more you read the crap Onlytruth writes the more he rubs off you.

Onlytruth is a well know craze man that sees nothing other than war, fight, etc

Aboki na, dat one na pure lie o. hehe!
I am a pragmatist.

afam4eva: Those who want to remain in Lagos with their investments can do so, but they will be doing that as foreigners. I don't believe anyone will chase them out forcefully as it's against international best practice. But they should strive to move their investments to the east.

A lot will move their investments to the East, but how do you move 10 houses of different types built under the One Nigeria belief to the East?
How do someone wake up to start being an immigrant with LIMITED rights in a land he has spent his life investments?
When you answer these questions, you'll see that it is even laughable to think that anyone (with houses) would move.
The Biafran war has skewed most of our world view, but I want you to remember that there will NEVER be a Biafralike war again. Everybody will have to fight alone.

Sam_Ikenna: Brother lets exclude Lagos from this convo 'cause you know its going. Lagos is for SW, let them do whatever they want to do with it - build it, chew it, love it, just whatever. The only thing is that non of the new nations will accept the killing of their citizens in a massive scale because Nigeria is breaking, if that is done then you know its obviously leading to war and ethnic cleansing. There are nearly as many Westerners in the East and PH as there are Easterners in Lagos. I think the leadership of both East and West will sort things out after all we're always going to be neighbours.

That is the the CORE of the point I'm making.
Of course there are people who would simply pick up and leave (mainly those without property or investments).
There also others who would not leave and who are entitled to be IGBO in Lagos and not be forced to become Yoruba.
I'm sure there will also be other tribes inside Alaigbo or Biafra.
When some mindless folks start ethnic cleansing(whether subtly or openly), you and I know that a war becomes inevitable then.

afam4eva: @onlytruth
I actually hope Igbos are chased out in droves should Nigeria disintegrate so that Igbos will grow sense for once in their lives. Yorubas should take Lagos and Hausas should take Abuja, i don't care. let's just fight to build our own little country that will be conducive for every easterners.

I say this your view is Machiavellian because I doubt that our brothers who have invested their whole lives would pick up and leave like our fathers did in Kano. Even some of our fathers are still in Kano today!
My problem with some of you is that you think you can create FUTURE heaven by abandoning what you ALREADY created.
I would repeat my advise: EJIGHI AKPATA ATUFUO ABA OGARANYA! (You can NEVER create great wealth or success if you keep throwing away what you have!).
However, I would gladly keep quiet if our brothers simply leave Lagos without a fight.
History says that is impossible though.

strangerf: Not true, Lagos belongs to everyone!

Sam_Ikenna: Nwannem I think Lagos will, by default, be part and parcel of Oduaa. [/b]The only thing I see is that its status as the financial center of West Africa will take a giant hit as all the new nations will be racing to the top. In the end things will level off and we all will be fine.[b] ekt_bear is very optimistic and there's nothing wrong with it. You know, the easiest way to fail is to fail before you begin.

Anyway, for us in the East it'll be good riddance to bad rubbish, we've not benefited anything from this nation since 1967 so who cares if Nigeria breaks into 1000 tiny bits. What I do know is that in the end people who're culturally compatible will make alliances and do their thing while those that are incompatible will go their separate ways.

At first bolded, my brother that is not the vibe I've been getting from our people in Lagos, and I mean even from early 1990s (after the Abiola riots). My closest friend who is from Imo state (who had lived in the Ikeja area of Lagos for MANY YEARS) told me point blank that they were making plans to quote "burn down Lagos" should the Yoruba try any nonsense there. This was in 1993 o!
Now,fastforward today, I have MANY brothers who own properties there, and others telling me the same thing (actually sometime worse should a war come).
There have been an explosion of the number of our people who own houses in Lagos in recent times.
All I see is a SURE war there unless sanity prevails. I wouldn't take the ekt-bears of that zone seriously though, because I don't even know whether he has ever lived in Nigeria. lol

@ Second bolded. I don't think you understood what ekt-bear is saying. Go back and read again. He is implying (openly), they they should enthnically cleanse Lagos of non-indigenes(actually non-Yoruba, since he is from ekiti state and not even a Lagosian) , using subtle strategies.

IMHO, that can only lead to war there. Simples.

ekt_bear: You missed the point. It isn't about best or worst. It is that neither will happen.

Anyway, not much profit in me bloviating about this subject (at least with you). At some point, if/when Nigeria splits, we will see.

Heh

Sure of course! Wasn't trying to convince you or something. Just laying out reality as it is.
When some Nigerians threaten war in case of disintegration, it is because of dumb schemes that may come from really dumb people.
I personally know that Nigeria can disintegrate peacefully. I'm just telling smart folks out there that there is a peaceful way, because I know that is what they are scared of most. Sarajevo would be a child's play should anyone attempt any ethnic cleansing in Lagos.
Nuff said.
I'm out.

ekt_bear: Sarajevo first. Now Vatician.

You must be high as a kite, lol.

Sarajevo = WORST CASE SCENARIO
Vatican = BEST CASE SCENARIO

Think for once dude! chei!

So, let me call a spade a spade.
Any forced ouster of residents and property owners, whether by hook or crook in Lagos or Abuja, will certainly lead to a war.
I know that most people would want to avoid war.
The smartest way to avoid war is to remind kids that you cannot drive large populations out of their areas of domicile in the broken up pieces of Nigeria. Somehow I think that educated and MATURE people know this already.
So no point over-emphasizing it.

Let me predict what would most likely happen in Lagos after Nigeria's disintegration.
IT DEPENDS ON A LOT OF THINGS.

My quickest guess is that Lagos would become a special separate country like The Vatican. In all, all Lagosians ( residents, owners of land and buildings/investments) would have EQUAL and FULL citizenship rights in the nation of Lagos. The nation of Lagos would relate with all other nations that came out of Nigeria as she may want depending on the political persuasions of Lagos citizens.

The same would likely be Abuja's fate.

Anything short of these will LIKELY lead to conflict, for sure. The conflict may be short lived, or endless depending on how interest groups play the game.

shymmex: Bradford is just a small city, and it's of no use to the UK.. Lagos on the other hand, is where most of the new Oodua republic's money would come from - [size=14pt]and how can you put people who are about 50% of the population combined in check - without infringing on the rights of your own citizens[/size]?

Great question with a very simple answer: PARTITION INTO ENCLAVES LIKE IN SARAJEVO.

ekt_bear: Bro, chill. [b]We got this. Ain't a thang. Seriously. [/b]Your energies would be better invested in worrying about other aspects of this proposal

Talk is always cheap. lol

Welcome back bro!
I thank God for your life.

naijaking1: My brother, I was in Nigeria, oh, almost got knocked off by robbers in Abuja

Whaat
Abuja of all place? Chei naija sef!

naijaking1: Your jaundiced view of the southern law practioners is quite alarming. So, let me try to understand what you meant: northern lawyers patiently wait for judgeship in the civil service while their money-crazy southern rush into self-gratifying law private law practice?
How about the fact that for over the past 25 years in question, northern military rulers laid the cock-eyed constitutional arrangement that has favored the promotion, growth, and selection of half-literate northern judges like this Aloma lady, through a lopsided state creation that favored the north?
Either Imo or Delta state alone graduate more lawyers than the whole of the NW, yet layers from the south are denied federal appointments, promotion, and opportunities at an alarming rate all in the name of federal character. Worse still are people like you coming here to falsely explain it away based on some form of norther virtousity.

naijaking1, where have you been, my brother?
I missed your many wise comments here.

obo_man: Let's ask ourselves this question;

If Nigeria divides, will each region be more peaceful? If the answer is YES, then let's divide. You cannot have development and progress without peace and tranquillity.

Why should I ( a Yoruba Man, Igbo or non-fulani) be in the north, and be thinking that at any slightest provocation ( Americans burning Koran in 8000 miles Afghanistan, A Danish man depicting a sacred prophet , e.t.c), that I might be slaughtered?


Its correct that 'true Federalism' is being practised in America, but all these American States share the same belief, identity, language, passion, ideology, e.t.c, Whereas, Nigeria is quite the opposite.

Separation will also put the destinies of every Nigerian in his/her own hand. The regional 'blame game' will forever be gone.

My friend you are a very wise man.
Sometimes we talk about "true federalism", only to forget that no amount of true federalism would stop Fulani "herdsmen" for example from slaughtering "fellow Nigerians" in ignoble hours of the night. No amount of One Nigerian confederation would stop horders of mass murdering marauders from attacking hapless southerners in the North, spun by the flimsiest of religious misunderstandings.

If ever a Nigerian "true federalism" would see the light of day, all mass murder suspects must be brought to justice as part of the setting up of the new regions and healing the past.

If that doesn't happen, then there is no guarantee whatsoever that Islamic clerics won't continue their wicked pasttimes of inciting millions of minions to mass-murder fellow citizens without any repercusion whatsoever.

For now, it looks like the only true solution is total disintegration. We can reconstitute agreeable regions and groups after the initial disintegration (if ever necessary), with clearly spelt out and agreed terms and conditions.

alj harem: Yes we all talk of Nigeria splitting but come to think of it, would you be happy if Nigeria split ?

Yes I would! lol
As things are today, I would want it to split.
The only time I may drop that wish is if the core North stays FAR AWAY from Nigerian presidency for at least 12 years from 2015.
Why? Because I fear that they would set Nigeria back again if they take over too soon.

We have not recovered from their many years of misrule.
As much as people can hate Obasanjo and GEJ, both are still far better than Yar adua or Shagari.

Because they are no longer ruling. lol
Well, let the conference begin already because I'm tired of mortgaging my future and that of my children to a hopeless system.
EVERYTHING should be on the table; from true federalism to total disintegration.
The outcome must be acceptable to all stake holders in Nigeria, and the process should be supervised and enforced by the UN if necessary.
Aburi is still very fresh in my mind.
All these talks are not deceiving anyone.
These types of talks proceeded Aburi. Heck the conference itself held in the most cordial atmosphere. Yet, the North (led by Gowon) flushed it down the toilet after signing it.

So, when are we starting? Thank God almighty for a time like this.

I'll like to add Gov Sullivan Chime of Enugu state. I don't know whether he has to guts to embark on National politics though.
Nigerian politics is for men with BALLS of steal.

alj harem: Mazi eze, it situation is simple and you are just making it complex.

1. demand for an international airport from the FG (standard airport not an air strip)

2. Demand for a new Niger-bridge

3. The governor should build a good transport system

4. More traders should used the port harcourt seaport.

That is the solution to "your" problem. really, or o buru na o bu asi.

On a serious note we should not demand anything from the FG. We should just build them!
Yes we can!

alj harem: Yawns

Nwokem why are you yarning?
You'll be there yawning your jaws off and we will leave you FAR behind! lol

^^

I have to add that we should not rely on the FG totally, even for the Enugu one because we need WORLD CLASS international airports!
The FG may try to just build a shabby one to avoid rancour from jealous folks.