₦airaland Forum

uvalued:
question have you heard all the known and extinct languages to conclude that what am speaking is not a language? no yet you insinuate that i am speaking gibberish. yes to your mind its gibberish but to God i might be speaking an extinct language because my known language might not capture the depth of what my spirit wants to express to God. that is why you fail to accept. dont stay on soulical level.

We all know the purpose of God for the event of Pentecost and those that follow; to preach the Word to unbelievers in their own very languages and dialects.
If I may ask you, of what purpose is to God for giving you the "gift" to speak an extinct language?
I hope you know why Paul prohibits speaking any unknown language in gathering if it won't be interpreted? And don't tell me "he speaketh unto God", for that's not the purpose of the gift.
I'm assuming what people call "speaking in tongue" today is a language. But we both know you can't utter three sentences in that your "language". It has always been a repetition of 2 to 3 sounds.

uvalued:
bros u wrong. my daddy God is happy to give me the Spirit how much more the gifts that is by the Spirit.

mhh sorry we are nit to be limited by human limitation...infact all things (via the atonement of Christ) are mine. so who says i CANNOT have all?
1cor 3

Yes, you can have all.
I guess Paul was expecting yes for an answer when he wrote in 1 Cor 12:29-30, "Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?"
Check your Bible, and read those verses again and again and come back here to tell me Paul ever alluled to the fact that any single person could actually be an Apostle, prophesy, teach, work miracles, have all the gifts of healing, speak in tongues and also interpret.
What's even the purpose of this epistle in chapter 12 if not to recognise the fact that there are divers gifts (vs 4) and that some have a certain gift, while some have others (vs 8-10)?
1 Cor 12:11 "but all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, DIVIDING (not giving the whole to any single individual) to every man severally as he will."

Oracle16:
Please, when you read the Bible ask the Holy Spirit for understanding. Stop misleading people. My people, Nairaland is the wrong place to get Biblical understanding.

This has nothing to do with understanding of the Bible. Anywhere you see a word being italicized in the Bible like the "unknown" in 1Cor 14, it means the word in question is never in the original manuscript altogether and was only inserted by translators. Many other translations do have footnotes disclaiming "unknown" in that chapter. In some translations of the Bible, "unknown" is absent. Don't just use a translation of the Scripture, buy some others. The Scripture does not start and end with KJV, you know?

vicardino:
No, I really won't wanna subscribe to your observation, though a somehow, somewhat valid one. To start with, there are diverse gifts of HOLY SPIRIT out of which speaking in tongues, vision, discerning of the spirit, words of knowledge, healing anointing and so on are all parts of, same as interpretation of tongues. And I wanna believe you know what these gifts are meant for, primarily for the advancement of the kingdom of God. Christians of nowadays are too shallow-minded, too carnal oriented and spiritual disoriented. There are very very very few Christians nowadays but uncountable numbers of just church goers. Our shallow mindedness is what is limiting the experience of the raw power of God and manifestations of the Spirit of God. Do u know that the least of the gifts of Spirit is "speaking in tongues"? That's like the entrance of a new world as far as the gifts of d Spirit is concerned. Speaking in tongues is like the key to open a room full of spiritual goodies and uncountable numbers of "Christians" have been speaking in tongues for years without gaining any other gifts, not because other gifts ain't available or accessible but because they aren't conscious of delving further to acquire other gifts. Apostle Paul had every gifts cos he was conscious, he spoke in tongues more than every other Apostles. Bro, if you can speak in tongues, long more for other gifts, keep longing, keep striving and you will get it. Be less concerned with happenings in the Christiandom but be more concerned with your status before God. Till date, I keep witnessing genuine, sound and raw interpretation of tongues but not in mega churches or happening churches (i believe u know what I mean). Those that are called into the Apostolic ministry have preference and every willing child of God.

You're wrong Bro. The Holy Spirit gives the gifts sovereingnly and not by us seeking (1 Cor. 12:4-11). And besides, nobody has all the gifts, not Paul, not any of the Apostles (1 Cor. 12:28-31). The Scripture is clear on this. And no where in the Bible was it stated that speaking in tongues is the gateway to other gifts of the spirit. If it is, it won't be the least of them, but the most important. Don't mislead anyone here. We have a standard by which we judge- the Scripture.

uvalued:
okay let me clarify issues here yuri stated the 10 assumed hard questions while d. steveson answered yuri assumed had questions. hope this helps you to keep it in perspective.

A missed up in name.

Oracle16:
1 Corinthians 14:2 For He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit He speaketh mysteries.


Please, you guys should quit saying what you don't know.

Firstly, Paul didn't refer to what happened at pentecost or anything remotely like it, "unknown tongue". If you check your Bible, you'll notice that the "unknown" is italicized. It could only mean one thing; "unknown" is not in the original manuscript and was only supplied by Translators for emphasis sake. So the issue of an unknown tongue in the Bible does not suffice. In this chapter, as with chapter 12 and 13, Apostle Paul wrote this letter to the Church in Corinth to correct the abuse of the use of the gift of tongues.
How else do you want him to address the issue of believers addressing the congregation in a language unknown to them, without interpreting or anyone available to interprete?
If I started to address a group of Igbo men in Yoruba language. They don't understand and there is no one to interprete. Who am I speaking to? God, of course, because my audience can not understand my language. That's exactly what 1 Cor 14:2 is saying.
The abuse of this gift was so rife in the Corinthian church that everyone with this gift would show off their ability (self edification; 1 Cor. 14:4a- a selfish thing to do) to speak in other languages regardless if others understand or not (verse 23). Is this not why we read Paul in verse 9 saying " ...except ye utter by the tongue words to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? For ye shall speak into the air"?
If you really didn't stop reading that chapter in verse 2 and finish reading all with open mind, you will understand that Paul was seeking moderacy in the exercise of the gift of speaking other languages in the Church at Corinth, and not talking about the types of tongues we have today. The moment you imagine tongue in that chapter to mean human languages (which is what it is), everything will make a complete sense to you.

uvalued:
one thing i notice with your answer is you hardly take a point and trash it out but jumble mumbleeverything and that is not healthy in a discourse.. d.stevenson too points made by yuri and address it. you take his points and address it will make an interesting read. hope you follow my drift.

editted

now if i may ask you, with all you took time to address which of the 10 response by d.stevenson are you addressing.

I'm not addressing any Stevenson's point, I only responded to the response given by one of his readers, which you quoted here. He contended Stevenson's question about the variations in tongues among various groups/individual tongue-talkers and was trying to justify the variation. With the response I gave, I don't think I drifted from the main point.

uvalued:
finally,



One could ask the same question about the great doctrines of Sola Scriptura and Salvation by Faith being absent from Christian theology for 1000 years before the Reformers. Why are missionaries almost unheard of for the 1000 years before the Moravians? It was nearly 200 years after the Protestant Reformation before Protestants realized their duty to evangelized unreached peoples.

Altar calls (and their equivalent) were unheard of before the 1830s – should we forbid these as well? Indeed, the idea of a “sinner’s prayer” – a single prayer to mark a conversion-salvation experience – is hard to find in church history before the Great Awakenings in the United States.

Congregational singing of hymns is also a fairly recent development in church history. For how many centuries was it unheard of for individual Christians to have a copy of the Bible or to read it? For the middle half of church history – 1000 years – most so-called Christians did not read the Bible, did not understand biblical salvation, worshiped and prayed to Mary, and attended churches led by a corrupt, immoral hierarchy.

It is not at all surprising that New Testament spiritual gifts faded as the churches filled with baptized pagans – nominal Christians – after the time of Constantine. Once most of the “Christians” were unregenerate unbelievers, one would expect spiritual gifts and miracles to become extraordinarily rare, as they did.

After the Reformation, each generation went deeper in rediscovering biblical doctrines and practices. As I said, it took centuries before Christians rediscovered concepts like personal relationship with Christ, missions, evangelism, regular devotional reading of Scripture by individuals, and so on.

It is not that surprising that eventually, someone would fixate on the passages about tongues and prophecy in the New Testament and start praying for God to restore these experiences to the church. Sadly, most cultural Christians in every age are complacent with whatever form of Christianity surrounds them.

They not only fail to look in the Bible to see if there might be more, but even get defensive and reactionary when someone claims to have something more or different (or more biblical) than what everybody else is doing. If tongues occurred at any time in the 1500 years of church history before 1901, it would have been stomped out quickly and forgotten, just as many of features of modern Christianity were.

I will address when I have time. The reasons are biblical.

uvalued:
After reading 10 Reasons Why Every Believer Must Speak In Tongues https://www.nairaland.com/3984994/10-reasons-why-every-believer and the various responses from some Christians and most especially otr1 who tried to convince me of the otherwise of Speaking in tongues, I came across this excellent response to Ten hard Questions about Speaking in Tongues by one D Stevenson (in the comment section). Check the various questions raised which I believe covered most of the comments on nairaland and the following answers. Enjpy

http://yuriystasyuk.com/ten-hard-questions-about-speaking-in-tongues-glossolalia-and-xenoglossy/

I think the person who responded to the salient points raised by Stevenson is economical with the truth and only danced around the points, avoiding, or rather, ignoring some parts of it.
Tongue-talkers lay claim to speaking in some angelic/heavenly tongues, not some earthly languages. So the argument of whether tongue talkers are speaking in one of the thousands of existing and lost earthly languages does not suffice. So, with the claim of speaking the tongues of angels, variations in tones that seems to correlate to the language of the various speakers, should not come up. Or shall we say Angels do have different dialects in heaven?
More so, most tongue speaking I know and hear do not bear any semblance to any language, living or dead. They are mostly repetition of few phrases, all the time.

In my own opinion, the argument is not whether the tongues vary with speakers, it is about whether it is biblical at all. Our generation is witnessing the growing menace of satanic activity in the realm of the miraculous. Where the Devil does not succeed in taking the Bible from us, he works hard at taking us from the Bible. And he succeeds in getting Christians to focus their attention on the claims of men and women to some supernatural experience, and in so doing those seekers after the experiences of others have neither time nor interest in searching the Scriptures for God’s truth.
It would be an arbitrary and strange interpretation of Scripture that would make tongues-speaking in the New Testament anything other than known languages. There is no trace of Scriptural evidence that tongues were ever heard by anyone as incoherent, incomprehensible babbling.
All the usages of tongues in Paul’s treatment of the subject refer to foreign languages.
“So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into air” ( 1 Corinthians 14:9).
There is no reason for anyone to speak except to converse intelligibly. The Greek word laleo means “I speak.” The word is never used for mere sound or noise. Nor is it used for a mere muttering of unintelligible gibberish. The tongues-speaking in the New Testament was in the native languages of hearing people, and not some angelic/heaven tongues.
I think the gift of tongues is irrelevant past the time when the Bible was being written. "if there be tongue, it shall cease"..." that the imperfect may give way to the perfect".
We now have the written Word of God in almost all the languages of the world and anyone can evangelize in any part of the world speaking only the language he understands- we now have people who have learned one or more languages apart from theirs who can interprete. This is why we didn't hear or read of anything close to what happened at pentecost after the 1st century. That which is perfect "The Bible" is here. So no more need for gifts of languages, neither are we required to pray to God in an "unknown" tongues (assuming there is anything like it). Peace.

uvalued:
first of all, i want you to understand that as much as you want acts 2 to reflect intelligent language you refuse to see this




the hearers heard "them disciples" at once in EACH of their tongues speaking the wonderful works of God.. not that peter spoke in arab, john in medes, james in mesopathiam etc rather as they spoke in tongues at the same time the Holy Spirit brought forth interpretation to the hearers. And to further show that some heard gibberish which is why some said



so we have it a form of experiment speaking in tongues some heard by God's interpretation while some heard gibberish. deny all you want its as clear as water except you areprejudiced.


right up there you have sided with the pharisee who said Christ healed by the devil as you have insinuated that our speaking in tongue is not of Holy Spirit but of demons...i pray this is not held against you.

on miracles signs and wonders, am wondering when the Lord says thus saith the Lord, didnt He saith the things He did -miracles signs and wonders- we that believe shall do and GREATER than what He did shall we do because Christ has gone to the Father and when people are seeking you for the sigbs and wonders, you come up with unbelief and say they are an adulterous generation.

Take your bible, read Matthew 16:1-4, may be you'll understand what I'm saying. The pharisees and the sadducees wanted Jesus to show them a sign and he clearly told them "a wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign". Not my own words. Faith comes by hearing; and hearing by the Word of God, not by signs and wonders.
Bottomline, if pagan religion are performing signs and wonders through the deciet of satan, uttering unintelligible sounds, just like many christians do today, the only thing that satan can not fabricate is the miracle that took place at pentecost. Anyone, I repeat, anyone that base his faith on signs and wonders in this end time will fall prey to the deceit of the devil, because that will be his major tool to deceive, if possible, the very elect of God. If you read your bible, you will know better.

The greater works that Jesus mentioned, point to the power of the gospel to transform lives as it spread through the apostolic witness. Through Peter’s preaching on the Day of Pentecost, 3,000 were added to the fold, probably more than Jesus saw converted during His entire ministry! The Book of Acts tells how the message kept spreading, first around Jerusalem, and eventually to the Gentiles around the Roman Empire. J. C. Ryle succinctly observes “There is no greater work possible than the conversion of a soul.” and that's what happened at pentecost.

okay call my speaking in tongues blabber or gibberish, so were this that heard the apostles in acts 2



am glad am in the company of the apostles... keep mocking us...hahaha glory fall on us.


wow okay can you show from this verses how many souls were saved after the following




i think cornelius speaking in tongues was false since no sol was saved like during the acts 2 episode . abi

I wonder where you read me inferring that you are in the league of the Apostles. The gift they had was of speaking in human languages they couldn't, yours is stark contrast. The direct opposite of what the Apostles had. The bible is clear on the meaning of tongues, it's simply human languages.
And no, the languages spoken by the disciples was not simultaneously. They were speaking as the spirit led them, not that some were hearing gibberish and others hearing their native languages. They spoke in different languages as they were led by the Holy Spirit(Acts 2:4). Yes, they were all speaking in other languages as much as the Spirit gifted them. That's the biblical version, untwisted.
This was why Paul could say he speaks more languages than anyone of them. It's as if he blabbled while the people hear the message in their own languages, no he did really speak human languages.
Not everyone hearing their languages being spoken by the Apostles at once simultaneously. The verses didn't imply that and purely your personal opinion, which unfortunately runs contrary to the real events. It is evident that the disciples (about 120 at pentecost) used this new gift that enabled them speak multiple languages, to spread the gospel. If that's not the primary aim of Jesus promising them the gift, I wonder what else it is (Mark 16:15)

uvalued:
wow interesting piece my dear but you failed to acknowledge the original authorwhich is plagerism.

secomdly your points sounds valid but on closer scrutiny it fails to rubbish the glory and blessedness of speaking in tongues....*speaks in tongues*
permit me to quote one or two of the well answered given by stevenson and i will post the answer as a topic on nairaland enjoy.




sroll down to DStevenson
http://yuriystasyuk.com/ten-hard-questions-about-speaking-in-tongues-glossolalia-and-xenoglossy/

If there is anything that has never happened before, ever in the history of mankind, it is the event that took place at that upper room at pentecost which is recorded in the book of Acts 2. Believers spoke in intelligent human languages they never knew or understand before.
Here we are talking about speaking new languages as a gift, not some other miracles.
The purpose of this gift is for unbelievers, not believers. Raising the dead, healing the sick, baptism... Jesus performed miracles and that didn't make many people believe in him. Some even said he is possessed of evil spirit.
But some 3000 or more unbelievers were converted by that single event of pentecost. Your version of tongues -which pagans are familiar with and even manifested for hundreds of years before AD 31- can't achieve that. You have to live with the fact that your glossolalia was not what took place at pentecost and at any other of such. It's clear and simple..."and the Scripture can never broken".
On miracles being performed in other religions, well, as we know, satan can also perform signs and wonders. Such a big class of people today are swayed by 'feelings' and miracles. They base their faith on 'signs and wonders', rather than on a 'thus saith the Lord'. Jesus said Himself that 'a wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign' (Matthew 16:4). This is because our faith is to be founded first and foremost upon the Word of God, not experience of any sort. So if the bible teaches that the Apostle were given the gift of speaking in intelligible human languages at pentecost and you ignore that on the ground of the experience of blabbing gibberish- a practice prevalent in paganism- you are on your own.
Satan is capable of giving you your glossolalia experience, if you seek it (of course, he is the author of such confusion).

uvalued:
i did not read which cult speaks in tongue. give a name

In a journal article for the American Scientific Affiliation (an association of Christian scientists), Dr. Pattison summarizes the publications of numerous historians on this topic by saying
“Glossolalia had been practiced for many years along with other ecstatic phenomena by the prophets of the ancient religions of the Near East. Prophets and mystics of Assyria, Egypt, and Greece reportedly spoke in foreign tongues during states of ecstasy and uttered unintelligible phrases said to be revelations from the gods…The practice was known in ancient India and China, and ethnographies describe glossolalia in almost every area of the world”
He made the following conclusions:
“Glossolalia is practiced among non-Christian religions: the Peyote cult among the North American Indians, the Haida Indians of the Pacific Northwest, Shamans in the Sudan, the Shango cult of the West Coast of Africa(I can relate with this), the Shago cult in Trinidad, the Voodoo cult in Haiti, the Aborigines of South America and Australia, the Eskimos of the subarctic regions of North America and Asia, the Shamans in Greenland, the Dyaks of Borneo, the Zor cult of Ethiopia, the Siberian shamans, the Chaco Indians of South America, the Curanderos of the Andes, the Kinka in the African Sudan, the Thonga shamans of Africa, and the Tibetan monks”
There you have it.

Jesus warned: “And when you are praying, do not use meaningless repetition( battalogeó/ battalogēsēte) as the Gentiles do, for they suppose that they will be heard for their many words.” ( Mat 6:7)
The Greek word that was translated into “meaningless repetition” is translated by Strong’s Concordance and HELPS Word Study as “to blubber nonsensical repetitions; to chatter, using empty (vain) words.” and “to repeat the same things over and over, to use many idle words, to babble, prate.”
There are two logical understandings of this statement by Jesus, either battalogeo refers to the length of prayer in a known language, or else babbling and repeating glossolalic sounds.
If its literally referring to “nonsensical repetitions” this would mean Jesus specifically argued against the glossolalia of the pagans.
That appears to be one of the only two possible interpretations, and is the case Dr. MacArthur posits in his book Charismatic Chaos.
Pentecostals usually argue that battalogeo actually refers to repetitions of known words (such a praying by repeating the word “please” many times in a row).
Firstly, we must note that Bible scholars have a general agreement for the translation of battalogeo as ecstatic speech, rather than known human language.
“There is general agreement that the idea of babbling or stammering is meant in Matthew 6:7. We may conclude that Jesus spoke against prayer which consisted of unintelligible speech or babbling, similar to the pagan prayers.”
If this is the case, then Jesus clearly taught against glossolalia. How could it be that Jesus taught against glossolalia, then later gave it as a gift? It makes no sense!
Yet, for the sake of arguments, lets give this point of interpretation to the Pentecostals, and say battalogeo doesn’t specifically refer to glossolalia by name. Then we still have a great deal of unresolved tension. The whole point of Mat 6:7 is that prayers should not be long and repetitive, but very clear and intentional ( Mat 6:8-13). Are not glossolalic prayers exactly the opposite? They last for prolonged periods of time and they include hundreds of repetitions of the same phrases. They are exactly the opposite of the Lord’s prayer that is explicitly taught in the Bible! Christ teaches a short prayer without any repetitions, Glossolalia is a long-winded prayer with hundreds of repetitions; Christ teaches known and intentional words ( Mat 6:9-13), while Glossolalia includes absolutely no known words in the speaker. Why would Jesus teach a standard of prayer that is exactly the opposite of glossolalia and never mention glossolalia?

uvalued:
@Otr1

haha hmm u writing another epistle...pls paragraph or itemise each reason you are addressing. its so jumble up.

lets get a grip of the topic using this question

1. you insinuated that cult speak in tongues, pls kindly share which cults.


2. can you justapose this verses acts 2:6-12 and 1cor 14:2 with respect to the audience the speaker was speaking to

3. you claim the tongue we speak started from 1900, and i gladly asked do you want to see how history on the side of tongues we speak... i will send you a pdf for you education.

If you read your mentions, you won't be asking those questions again. Go and read it first.
I don't really have luxury of time to order posts. I've more time on this topic already than I could afford.

uvalued:
Am getting your prejudice clearly! Should i pity you sure because you dont need to speak in tongues to get to heaven but surely you will get there quicker! Why because you dont know how to stir up power nor build up yourself to face the deception from our defeated foe



please can you share which cult group precisely... interesting


hello re read that post i mentioned "new tongues" not just tongues... "new tongues " means "kainos glossolia" an unprecedented language which has never existed! Halleluyah

Verse 13-14: "Wherefore let him that speaks in a language pray that he may interpret." For if[a supposition, not a fact, same as though] I pray in a language, my spirit prays, but my understanding[my mind] is UNFRUITFUL."
And Paul tells us to "have no fellowship with the UNFRUITFUL works of darkness" (Eph. 5:11.) So even if one had the gift of languages, he should NOT speak without an interpretation, because it is "unfruitful"(ver. 14,) it is just praying to "himself"(ver. 4,) it does not"edify, exhort or comfort"(ver. 3,) it is not "by revelation, knowledge, prophesying, or doctrine"(ver. 6,) it is not a"distinct sound,"(ver. 7,) for one merely "speaks into the air,"(ver. 9,) you are like a "barbarian" to whom you speak (verse 11,) therefore,"If there be no interpreter,let him keep SILENCE in the Church..."
And yes, we have a history of pagan cults and non-christians "speaking in tongues", so to say.
Go and read Richard Ganz's "20 Controversies that Almost Killed a Church" (p 212). It says that this kind of babbling is practiced by Mormons, Muslims and many others. Also Robert G. Gromacki's "The Modern Tongues Movement"(pp 5-10), documents the history of “speaking in tongues”.
Your type of speaking in tongues is new to the Church and it's not what unbelievers will hear and say "wonderful words of God.

uvalued:
Am getting your prejudice clearly! Should i pity you sure because you dont need to speak in tongues to get to heaven but surely you will get there quicker! Why because you dont know how to stir up power nor build up yourself to face the deception from our defeated foe



please can you share which cult group precisely... interesting


hello re read that post i mentioned "new tongues" not just tongues... "new tongues " means "kainos glossolia" an unprecedented language which has never existed! Halleluyah

Rev. 22:16b-"I am the root and the offspringgenos] of David..." Also "offspring" in Acts 17:28 & 29.
I Pet. 2:9-"But you are a chosen generation[genos], a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people..." Notice the company that geno skeeps in this verse "generation, priesthood, nation, people."
Phil. 3:5-"Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock[ genos] of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew..." Notice the company that genos keeps in this verse: the stock of the nation Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, of the much larger clan of Hebrews.
Surely a blind man can see that genos carries the primary connotation of that which deals with: "where we were born, our offspring, kindred, country, stock, countrymen, nation, and generation."
So just what "kinds," "diversities," and "kinds" (genos, genos, and genos) of languages is God telling us of in I Cor. 12:10b, 28b & 14:10? Is He speaking of gibberish in unknown tongues? OF COURSE NOT.
And surely a blind man can see that this spiritual gift was a gift of "GENOS LANGUAGES" -The real, working, every day languages dealing with genos which is translated throughout the New Testament as: "where one was born, offspring, kindred, country, stock, countrymen, nation, and generation."Which languages would also have to include different dialects and regional jargons. An impossible task for any human, but no problem for the Spirit of God.
This is why Paul boldly stated: "I thank my God, I speak with languages MORE than ye all" (I Cor. 14:18.) Paul traveled through dozens and dozens of villages, towns, cities and states, countries and kingdoms. He spoke with kings and peasants-among the very same "every nation under heaven" spoken of in Acts 2.

"Follow after LOVE, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that you may prophesy [speak under inspiration of God's Spirit.] For he that speaks in a tongue speaks not unto men, but unto God: for NO MAN UNDERSTANDS HIM; howbeit in the spirit he speaks mysteries"(I Cor. 14:1-2.)
Paul told the Corinthians that [1] they should desire spiritual gifts, [2] for the purpose of prophesying, because [3] no one understands what he is saying if he speaks in a language. So is it a good thing to speak in a language if no one understands you? NO, of course not. Next Paul says,"BUT..."But what? If speaking in a language is not a good thing to do if no man understands what you are saying, then WHAT IS GOOD? Well, Paul answers:
"BUT he that prophesies [is inspired of God to speak in the language of the congregation] speaks unto men to EDIFICATION, and EXHORTATION, and COMFORT[consolation]" (Ver. 3.)
"I would that you all spoke with tongues, BUT RATHER[here is Paul's instructions as to HOW this gift is to be properly used] that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesies than he that speaks with languages, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying"(Verse 5.)
Now Paul gives us the one "exception" clause which will put "speaking in a language" on equal footing with "prophesying"-that is inspired teaching in our own language. And what is that one thing that is absolutely necessary for speaking in a language to be acceptable in the congregation of God's Church? Someone must be able to INTERPRET what the person said in a foreign language. What if there is no interpreter present?
"But if there be no interpreter, LET HIM KEEP SILENCE IN THE CHURCH"(verse 28.)
There you have it. Speaking in tongues is fine, IF, and only if, "except he INTERPRET" so that the whole church receives" edification, exhortation, and consolation."This teaching is clear. This teaching is simple. There is no misunderstanding Paul's admonition. Yet how many will OBEY Paul's admonition?
Notice what Paul instructs us in verse 6:
"Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with languages, what shall it profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?"
If your teaching is not by revelation, knowledge, prophesying, or doctrine,"what shall it profit you,"Paul asks? Nothing else is acceptable. But is this what the tongue-speakers of the world are actually doing? Are they speaking to the entire congregation by "revelation, knowledge, prophesying, or doctrine," or are they babbling gibberish into the air, in which case NO ONE IS EDIFIED?

uvalued:
Am getting your prejudice clearly! Should i pity you sure because you dont need to speak in tongues to get to heaven but surely you will get there quicker! Why because you dont know how to stir up power nor build up yourself to face the deception from our defeated foe



please can you share which cult group precisely... interesting


hello re read that post i mentioned "new tongues" not just tongues... "new tongues " means "kainos glossolia" an unprecedented language which has never existed! Halleluyah

You'll do a lot of Scripture twisting to justify your "unknown tongues".
It might interest you to know that the erroneous term "unknown tongue" is used but six times in the King James (I Cor. 14:2, 4, 13, 14, 19, & 27,) and in every instance, the word unknown is in italics,signifying that the original Greek manuscripts did not contain this or any such word. It was erroneously added by the translators and should be taken out. It only adds more confusion to this little-understood subject.
Where glossa is not a supernatural gift, it is clearly used to represent a known language, as in Rev. 10:11, 13:7 & 17:15 where some combination of"...peoples, and multitudes, and nations and tongues[Greek:glossa-languages]..."is used.
All remaining references to languages (as a gift from God) are discussed by Paul in I Cor. 12, 13, and 14, and nowhere else.
It is also clear that the Apostles did NOT speak with"NEW tongues 50 days later on Pentecost, because we have this undeniable statement of Scripture stating that:"...we do hear them speak in OUR languages the wonderful words of God".
Now we know that the languages of the Medes, Cretes, Asians, Elamites, Parthians, Egyptians, Arabians, etc., spoken on Pentecost were anything but "new tongues" as these tongues/languages are old as mountains. And we know that the Scriptures do not contradict, so it is absurd for any tongue-talkers to use this very questionable verse as justification for babbling something they may contend is a "new" or different kind of language promised by Jesus.
In I Cor. 12:4 we read of "diversities of gifts. In verse 6 we read of "diversities of operations. Both times the word "diversities" is translated from the Greek word "diairesis", and it means "variety." And so the word "diversities" is a perfectly fine word to translate it.
But in I Cor. 12:10 we read of:"diverse kinds of languages. In verse 28 we read of "diversities of languages."And in I Cor. 14:10 we read of "many kinds of voices[sayings, languages.]"
Now, all three words "kinds, diversities, & kinds" in the above three verses are from the same one Greek word (genos).
Here is how Strong defines this word-#1085:
"genos: kin, born, country, diversity,generation, kind,nation,offspring,stock."
Here is how "context" translates the Greek word genos in other Scriptures:
Mark 7:26-"The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation[genos]..." In this verse it could have just correctly been translated "birth," but "diversity" or "kind" would never suit.
Acts 4:6-"And Annas the high priest, and Caiaphas, and John, and Alexander, and as many as were of the kindred[genos] of the high priest..." Again, "diversity" or "kind" would not suit in this verse.
Acts 4:36b-"...The son of consolation, a Levite, and of the country[genos] of Cyprus. "Diversity" or "kind" could never be used here.

uvalued:
yes tongues means glossolia but "new" in " new tongues " in mark 16:17 means
"of a new kind; unprecedented, novel, uncommon, unheard of” (317).




friend you are not the first to acknowledge that speaking in tongues is unintelligent to your mind, paul also acknowledge same in

1cor 14




so what gives? my spirit is praying/speaking in tongues but my understanding is unfruitful. however paul did not forbide speaking in tongues as you and others are trying so hard to reason ...pray tell me why would paul say "forbade not speaking in tongues" if its a mere language we are expected to speak

again i ask you how will my spirit speak in known language such as hausa and my mind cannot understand it?


1cor 12 is not contradicting speaking in tongues but emphasising it. but prejudice has blinded you to that fact that there is public and private speaking in tongues. in the public, when in church speaking in tongues should also have an interpretation but speaking/praying in tongues in private is used for edification and building up. but unfortunately the prejudice ones are condemning both. paul in 1 cor 14 was calling for orderliness in usage and he said forbade not speaking in tongues.

You're not getting it and it's a pity.
It might interest you to know that pagan cults also "speak in tongues" so to say , the same way and manner you're trying hard to defend.
You asked me the meaning of the original greek word translated as tongues, I told you it means languages. Now you're telling me the definition of "new".
If I started speaking Russian, German, Chinese, French, Japanese e.t.c. Fluently suddenly without being trained, what do you call that?
New, wonderful work of God, uncommon gift, right? So how does that change the fact that the speaking in new languages as mentioned in the bible is has no other hidden interpretation that simply speaking new intelligible languages? Acts 2 adduces this fact, but you chose to ignore it.
And I never said Paul was against speaking in new tongues, but trust me, he will weep if he hears you mumbling and you call it speaking in tongues.
And besides, your version of speaking in tongues only came to be known after 1900.

uvalued:
no need for confusion my friend...on the deutoronomy stuff.. what was the end result..was it for edification or what? but praying/speaking in tongues edifies and builds me up spiritually. furthermore how can merely speaking a language edify and build me up? It must be something beyond mere language.

infact check the greek word for "new tongues" which Christ said in mk 16.


marvellous, before vs 18, in v2 paul said that what he spoke more than them all cannot be understood by NO BODY but God because paul was speaking mysteries.

granted one can speak in tongues to preach the gospel but speaking in tongues one can edify and build one self spiritually.

now remember somethings of God are intelligently known but there things which are unintelligent to the human mind and speaking in tongues is one of such.

First, the greek word interpreted as "tongues" (glossa) means nothing else but languages. In fact, it should be translated as speaking in languages. Now that makes sense and coherent with what I've said so far. Tongues as used in the bible simply means languages. For whatever reason, you should not read Acts 2:7-11 and still argue that speaking in tongues is mumbling unintelligible words, even words the speaker can not understand.
And yes, the sudden ability of say, a Hausa man to speak all manners of new languages glorifies God. Who would unbelievers say of you if they hear you repeating same gibberish every time? There's nothing wonderful about that as anyone can just wake up one morning and start to utter rubbish and will convince you he's speaking in tongues.
May be if you read 1 Corinthians 12:10, you'll understand that "diverse kinds of tongues" means "different kinds of languages".

talebearer123:
Well I got this notion from the fact thst i know satan dont know my thoughts as a child of God untill i say it out. How do i know it I havent come across where it is written " And satan haven known what they think in there hearts" but rather " and Jesus knoeing what they think in their hearts" The heart of man belongs to God and he alone has access to it.

Now speaking in tongues is from the heart also and its not untlll I say my intention with the tongue of man that satan understands me.

Now who says Satan posseses all his angelic powers also. He was releaved of some powers when he fell same reason why every Christian is not under his control and touch anymore except we fall. Same reason he can not ascend back to the kingdom of God like any other holy angel. He lost some powers after the fall and understanding the mind of God is part of it. Speaking in tongues is speaking the mind of God to your life issues. Its a mystery satan has no more inheritance in.

The only power satan lost is his place beside the throne of God. He still communicates with the Most High (the book of Job is a hint). Now I wonder if he now speaks yoruba to God. Lol. See bros, even the Bible tells us we are up against powers and principalities (Ephesians 6:12). And the armor of God (verses 13-17) is our protection.
Read Daniel 10 and you will understand that the devil do not need to listen to your prayers to delay the answer.

talebearer123:
IT ALSO KEEPS SATAN AND ITS DEMONS IN THE DARK of what we are asking for from God so to go and conner it is imposible

This is purely your own opinion, not backed by the Scripture. And who told you Lucifer, a formal Cherub who was covering the Throne of God doesn't have the ability to understand the tongue of Angels (I'm assuming your ecstatic utterance are heavenly), himself being an Angel?

uvalued:
v6 states this



contrast it with this v13



it means that yes some heard but not all heard but said they were drunk becauseto such they spoke gibberish..besides do you notice thatat the same time all people present heard their language... not that they finish one language then stop then start the next language ..no it was simultenously done

Stop confusing yourself. Tongues as used in the Bible means languages, not gibberish you utter.
What did God say to Israel in Deuteronomy 28:49? ...'The LORD shall bring a nation against thee from far, from the end of the earth, as swift as the eagle flieth; a nation whose TONGUE thou shalt not understand.'...
Now we know that "tongues" in the Old Testament meant language. So God was basically saying that He would bring a nation against them whose LANGUAGE they would not understand. This also applies to
And look at what Paul said on in this chapter:
1 Corinthians 14:18 .....'I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all.'
We know that Paul could speak in a number of different languages of the earth. He wasn't speaking in ecstatic tongues like many Christians do today, but simply different languages of the earth.
So the argument of drunkeness does not hold water. Our God is not a God of confusion.
He gave the disciples the gifts to speak in different languages for the sake of the gospel.
Now, what purpose does uttering unintelligle sounds serves for the glorification of God if unbelievers think you are mad? None.

uvalued:
to your mind yes...its gibberish but not the spirit man

Read Acts 2:1-11 and you will realize that the biblical speaking in tongues is the gift of suddenly speaking fluently in a different language that people can understand, not gibberish that even the speakers don't understand as we have today.

Mark 16:15-17 .....'And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues.'

This is the great commission from Jesus for His followers to go into the world and preach the good news of the gospel message. Now we know that the world is full of different nations, with people speaking different languages, so what gift would the disciples need in order to preach the gospel to these different nations? They would need the gift of tongues, to be able to speak the various languages of the world. Now were the disciples trained in speaking different languages? No, they would need to be filled with the Holy Spirit to start speaking in tongues (languages) to preach the gospel. And Jesus told them to wait in Jerusalem for the power of the Holy Spirit, which would empower them to start speaking in tongues (different languages).
The gift of speaking in tongues was given on pentecost up in that room where they were gathered, as we can see in the following Bible verses:
Acts 2:1-4 .....'And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.'

This is where taking in the WHOLE council of God is very much needed. Now many Christians will take these couple of Bible verses above and apply it to the gift of tongues as being able to speak in ecstatic "heavenly" tongues, the way millions do in churches throughout the world today. But we cannot just take Bible verses out of the context in which they were written. And if we carry on reading in Acts 2, we will find out the truth about speaking in tongues and what the gift of tongues was for:

Acts 2:5-11 .....'And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.'
What a glorious God we have. He always exlpains His truth to us in a clear way, so that there be no need for misunderstanding. We can clearly see that the purpose of the gift of tongues was so that the people from other nations who spoke in different languages (tongues) could hear the good news of the gospel of Christ Jesus.

The issue of speaking in tongues as described in the Bible is the ability to communicate in different languages, and not gibberishes we hear in Churches today. How else do you think the Apostles were able to spread the gospel to places where the people speak different languages if not the gifts they received at Pentecost?

The Ooduas are Children of the Most High.

My lot.

Dino is a pain in the a**. Who cares if he is recalled? Not me!

Too many animals using the internet. Just imagine some of the comments on this thread!

Whether we like it or not, Nigeria will be divided through force. This is a matter of a very short time.
No restructuring will ever take place.

Who still listen to news these days?

sekem:
On the contrary. I think the Jewish establishment a.k.a illuminati will be scared now because they backed the wrong horse Hillary

But then again knowing what the Rothschild's can do. I'll say they also backed Trump.

So both ways, they still win.

"Now whether he kills Cassio or Cassio him, or each do kill the other, every way makes my gain"

The real people in control of things in the US always win in any contingency.
Republicans or Democrats, they own them both. Forget the labels

don4real18:
He's self employed. How many ICT lecturers can do what the Alaba boys and computer village boys are doing.
He went there just for knowledge and may know more than people claiming BSC graduate.

He'll do better being self-employed.
Or why is he now interested in the credentials now, all of a sudden? To go get his own credentials in the school, it's a burden to him. We have to assume that he will approach his duties the same way