₦airaland Forum

Blyss: Royal killed this ish. Physics, take a seat.

Why are you making this about me vs. him? If you think he "killed it", fine. I don't have any issues with him. But claiming that killings of gays is inherent to African cultures with no evidence (and even with evidence of some original toleration of gays provided) and something that makes all African cultures "more ghetto" than all the rest of the world even while gays are killed all the time in the West for no reason or claiming that civil wars are inherent to African cultures, or ignoring the role of America's "gun culture" in certain crimes and instead designating those crimes as "random" is ridiculous and an extremely skewed viewpoint. There wasn't much reason to try to drag this discussion out after that. I don't care who you guys think "won" or who decides to give my or Royal's comments 8 or 9 "likes" through alternate accounts. The debate was pointless because I can't re-explain my perspective more than I already have and our perspectives will never align, period.

From p. 5 of that learning pack document produced by the Horniman museum:

"Redisplaying the objects from ancient Benin

Since the Horniman Museum opened, more than 100 years ago, ideas have changed and the collections have grown. Now, the objects from ancient Benin are not displayed together. The musical instruments from ancient Benin are in the Music Gallery. Other objects are in the Centenary Gallery as examples from Mr Horniman’s original collection. The Benin brass plaques are in the African Worlds Gallery, which opened in 1999. This gallery celebrates Africa’s history, its creativity and its different cultures.

When the African Worlds Gallery was being created the curators wanted to change the ways the stories behind the objects are told. So they asked African people to work with them, to share ideas and to help understand the African objects. Joseph Eboreime, a museum director from Nigeria, studied the brass plaques so that they could be understood from the point of view of his own people.

Joseph Eboreime was an anthropologist: he studied people. Working in Nigeria, he was able to research the brass plaques by talking to the Edo people, including those from the Royal Palace. He recorded stories, watched ceremonies and festivals and read documents. He used this information to write the labels for the brasses in the African Worlds Gallery.

Joseph Eboreime’s work shaped the way the brass plaques are displayed. This way, Horniman Museum’s curators feel, the Benin objects and the Edo people are given a voice in the African Worlds Gallery. Joseph Eboreime also wrote booklets about the Benin objects and pictures and information were put on the Horniman Museum’s website. Museums in Africa were given computer facilities so that school children and researchers can access the information.

We now have lots of ideas and information about the objects from ancient Benin. But the objects were looted from the oba’s palace. They seem to have been taken at random, and the buildings they came from were burnt down. So we don’t know how or where the objects were kept; we don’t know if they belong together, or what is missing. We may never get to the bottom of the meanings of the objects from ancient Benin."

From page 28 of that learning pack produced by the Horniman museum:

https://img713.imageshack.us/img713/7238/captureanalysisofanothe.jpg

"The biggest figure on this plaque is the
commander-in-chief of the Benin army (known
as the Iyase). Ekpenede was the Iyase during
Oba Orhogbua’s reign and he was married to the
Oba’s daughter.
Once the Iyase left Benin leading an army he
could never go back. It made no difference
whether the army won or lost.
The Iyase Ekpenede is wearing all his formal
military clothes and weapons. These protect his
body in battle. He also wears a charmed bell so
that the ancestors will protect him.
The smaller figure is probably Iyase Ekpenede’s
horn blower. He is also wearing all his formal
military clothes. It seems that the horn is being
blown to celebrate one of the Iyase’s victories."



[I'm not sure whether they got the materials (lead and brass) correct for the body armor. But who knows? They might be right. I've seen contrary statements about the material from other scholars, but obviously the Horniman museum has their sources as well. So obviously there is some confusion in this area.]

https://img138.imageshack.us/img138/434/beninbronzeshornimanmus.jpg

Another Benin brass plaque at the Horniman museum in London.

A telling of the legend of Ezomo Agban by Ambrose Ekhosuehi:

http://nigerianobservernews.com/15052009/15052009/features/features4.html

From p. 29 of that learning pack from the Horniman museum:

"Ezomo Agban: Deputy commander-in-chief of the
Benin army"

https://img534.imageshack.us/img534/7238/captureanalysisofanothe.jpg


"The deputy commander-in-chief of the Benin
army was called the Ezomo. The Ezomo on this
plaque is probably a man called Agban.
In this plaque Ezomo Agban is wearing all his
formal military clothes. From the position he is
standing in we can guess that he is dancing a
victory dance at the victory parade after
defeating an enemy.
Ezomo Agban was sent by Oba Orhogbua to
stop a rebellion. The war lasted 2 years. Ezomo
Agban returned to Benin City in triumph,
bringing war booty and captured rebel chiefs."

https://img688.imageshack.us/img688/434/beninbronzeshornimanmus.jpg

Another Benin bronze from the Horniman museum in London.

Saw this in p. 24 of that "Ancient Benin Learning Pack" produced by the Horniman museum:

"The priest of Ugbor village and Oba Ewuare

The priest of Ugbor village was a trickster. He went Oba Ewuare’s palace
and told the Oba some fiendishly difficult riddles. The priest said that if
the Oba could solve any of the riddles, the Oba could take his life.
The Oba tried all the answers he could think of, but they were all wrong.
So that night the Oba sent a beautiful woman to visit the priest. She gave
the priest sweet, strong palm wine to drink and soon he told her the
answers to the riddles. In secret she sent the priest’s stepson to the Oba
Ewuare’s palace with the answers.
The next day, the priest went back to the palace. To his horror the Oba
reeled off the answers to his riddles and had him thrown into prison. The
priest could do nothing but wait for his execution.
Suddenly it began to rain. While the executioners waited for the shower to
stop they drifted off to sleep, lulled by the sound of falling raindrops. The
priest saw his chance and sneaked off.
Scared they would get into trouble for letting a prisoner escape, the
executioners smeared their swords with chicken’s blood. They showed their
bloody swords as proof that they had obeyed their orders and executed
the priest.
The Oba Ewuare was none the wiser until a few weeks later. To his surprise
the priest turned up at the palace, wearing his hair tied up in bundles. He
told the Oba what they meant":

https://img208.imageshack.us/img208/7213/captureanotheranalysiso.jpg

https://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5147/captureanalysisofabenin.jpg

Saw this in a document called the "Ancient Benin Learning Pack" produced by the Horniman Museum.

They labeled this image thus:

"Ohen N’ugbor n’ome eto ene:
the elusive priest of ugbor village"

https://img267.imageshack.us/img267/434/beninbronzeshornimanmus.jpg

This is one of the Benin bronzes at the Horniman Museum in London.

https://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6783/img20120515220336benins.jpg


This is kind of a bad quality picture, but I couldn't take a better photo than this.

I saw a full page image of this in the book Benin: Kings and Rituals: Court Arts from Nigeria that I've referenced before in this thread and decided to take a picture. The caption for this image in that book states that this warrior originally adorned one of the roofs of the palace.

https://img259.imageshack.us/img259/6961/plaquefromnigeriacourto.jpg

Plaque from Nigeria, Court of Benin, c. 1600, De Young Museum, San Francisco

https://img651.imageshack.us/img651/3474/134356050a68b7091headof.jpg

Commemorative head of an Oba of Benin.

https://img26.imageshack.us/img26/3449/captureaplaquewhichdeco.jpg

A plaque which decorated the palace of the Obas. Benin warriors are depicted in battle. Country of Origin- Nigeria. Culture- Edo. Period- Probably late 17th century

https://img27.imageshack.us/img27/9955/reliefplaqueshowingabat.jpg

Relief plaque showing a battle scene, Edo peoples, Benin kingdom, Nigeria, 1550-1650, Robert Owen Lehman Collection, Courtesy, Museum of Fine Arts, Boston

(I posted an image of this earlier, but it was a black and white low quality image from an old book.)

https://img819.imageshack.us/img819/844/plaquepossibly1500s1600.jpg

Plaque, possibly 1500s-1600s, brass, Benin Kingdom

This is at the Cleveland Museum of Art right now.

SmoothCrim: Back to Nigeria! It will never be allowed to split by ECOWAS. Look at Sudan after it was split. They are still fighting and now there are 2 failed states there.

Nigeria will have to split at least into 6 countries and if you do that only one of them would be a success. The one that inherits all of the oil!!

The rest will be in misery and landlocked. The Muslims will become lost and fall victim to foreign agendas and will certainly turn into a barbarian area. They may even start playing the Sunni vs. Shia games that are played in the Gulf region!!.

In the end, keeping things as they are now is what will bring the most success in the short term.

There is oil in the south west, south east, and the central part of the south.

On the north:

http://www.dailytrust.com.ng/index.php/other-sections/star-feature/156525-chad-basin-nigerias-next-oil-wells

http://allafrica.com/stories/201206051052.html

http://neftegaz.ru/en/news/view/95473

http://www.nigeriannewsservice.com/nns-news-archive/lead-stories/government-steps-up-search-for-oil-in-chad-basin

hhttps://www.indigopool.com/nigeria/channel/pdf/GEOLOGY_OF_NIGERIA.pdf


The first time they tried digging there in Nigeria, they didn't dig as deep as other countries that found oil in the Chad Basin.

Why? Who knows. But I wish they had found out whether there was oil there even back then. By now it will probably take until 2015 to find out.

Wow.

Is this thread going to degenerate into more Ghana vs. Somalia troll wars?

TerryCarr: you can always split Nigeria

He's Ghanaian. He already said he opposes it because "we can't have another failed state in the region."

I would split Nigeria. Best to keep things simple.

@ TerryCarr

http://globalpressinstitute.org/global-news/africa/rwanda/rwanda-changes-school-language-again-seeks-preserve-culture-increase-brain

"Just 8 percent of Rwandans speak French, and 4 percent speak English, according to the government."

Kinyarwanda (the indigenous language of Rwandans) is in use there officially.

Eventually they will probably broaden the scope of this initiative.

bright007: You are å big fool without inquiry!Å bool written by University of Benin on Benin history is now fake?
Inferiority complex must run in your family for u to have debunked d works of reputable indigenous historians.

The actual indigenous historian of Benin is Jacob Egharevba.

If Professor Nzemeke did actually claim that a school was built in the palace and you're not the one just making that up, let him actually prove it.

(edited: what I wrote in this post originally was unnecessarily rude)

A trading post is not a fort by any stretch of the imagination and building more than one church in the city is not the same as building a school in the palace. You think that meaningful and significant trade could only be carried out between European and African groups by Europeans building a school because you seem oblivious to the concept of an interpreter. Go do some actual reading and get a reality check.

Do whatever else, but don't deliberately bungle things to make your point.

bright007: Must u show ur ineptitude all because you are ignorant of basic facts?I reply u without having to throw insults at u yet u show how bad-tempered u are.
Now listen:Those professional nonesense you read were part of the HAMITIC HYPOTHESIS which were formulated by racists and quack historians.
I had my Bsc in University of Benin and all students in year one take some basic courses including history and culture of Nigeria.
The history department in Uniben wrote å book titled"Nigerian Peoples and culture"It was written by Professor (Rev) Å.D Nzemeke and others in d history department.
All the lies just like d one you are propagating were debunked,exposed and d truth written.
So dump all those crap u may have read and simply go to Benin and read any of d books written by d University of Benin.

Man, will you just be quiet already?

I don't get my history on Benin and European interaction from a book written by some random Reverend Nzemeke because I'm not a fool.

The same Alan Ryder was invited to and did write the Forward for the book Dusk Till Dawn: Folk Tales from Benin by Iro Eweka, a member of the royal family of Benin, and Ryder's research is unrelated to the "Hamitic hypothesis". Stop blindly regurgitating terms you came across in your history class and leave Benin history out of your trolling.

I commented harshly on your posts because they annoy me and contain some false statements. Until you can prove that Jacob Egharevba or anyone else important to Benin history claimed that a school was built in the palace you remain a liar.


[edited: what I wrote here originally was unnecessarily rude]

Royal-VII:

But then your mentality would be no different than the ruthless murderer's

I don't think so. Vengeance can be ugly, but it's not exactly crazy or unjust.

Royal-VII:
I don't even support the death penalty...but if i did, i believe there are allot more "civilized" ways to end a murder's life...

Yanno?....

....cuttin off heads....Is Uhhh Pretty Savage.

If a murderer kills innocent people in the most gruesome and savage way imaginable, I wouldn't care if the murderer was beheaded.

Of course, there are other ways to execute that person which may be preferable.

Royal-VII:
Aye man, I don't believe anyone can commit a crime evil enough to deserve a beheading...

I guess it's our "cultural" differences and upbringing which leads us to differ on such a horrific act of irrational Lunacy...LmL

Yeah, well with a strong guillotine, beheading can be almost as swift as death by injection. I don't see what difference it makes. In both cases there is still an executioner.

Or are you against capital punishment all together?

Royal-VII:
Lmfao@nobody in the thread besides you and Myself and Pleep can't help but alt account like comments

Lol this short Ugly guy hates my soul....


I have yet to even see another name enter the thread...LoL


Pleep it's ova fam ya boy wrote his concession speech...let it go...

Africa taking a L on this one....Lmfao


Now go alt account Like all of his comments that constantly agree with me


{{{{~Royal~}}}}

Well I've seen one other name on the thread today (Rgp92) and multiple other names yesterday. I'm not sure pleep is even on nairaland or on this section right now.

Well, we don't really agree where it actually matters, hence our totally different views.

On getting one's head chopped off, if someone murders a child, I have no problem with that person being beheaded.