Ken4Christ:


Messiah means Saviour. The whole human race was under the power of darkness on account of the sin of the first man, Adam. And the Bible says that the wages of sin is death. So, for us to be free from the power of darkness, someone has to die for the entire human race. And Jesus was the only person qualified to die for us. Three reasons he was the only one who could die for us are;

1. He was born of a virgin. So, the sin nature of Adam was not in him. In other words, he was born sinless. And it's only a sinless man that can die for the sinful world.

So, to even said he die makes a mockery of his birth. Why did God look for a virgin to carry that Saviour of the world and he didn't fulfil his mission.

2. He was subjected to the same kind of temptation the first Adam failed. But Jesus didn't fail.

3. He fulfilled all the prophecies of the Old Testament. He was a Jew. He was of the lineage of David. And every other prophecies concerning him was fulfilled.

So, for quran to say Jesus didn't die is to deny those deceived by such statement of their salvation.

It is faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus that saves a man. If you don't believe he died and rose from the dead, you cannot be saved - Romans 10:9-10.

But Jesus died and rose again. It is foolishness to believe the testimony of someone who was born over 500 years after the event happened and reject the testimonies of several eye witnesses some of which were his disciples.

Please, use your brain and don't be deceived.

Messiah, (from Hebrew mashiaḥ, “anointed”), in Judaism, the expected king of the Davidic line who would deliver Israel from foreign bondage and restore the glories of its golden age.

The Greek New Testament’s translation of the term, christos, became the accepted Christian designation and title of Jesus of Nazareth, indicative of the principal character and function of his ministry.

More loosely, the term messiah denotes any redeemer figure; and the adjective messianic is used in a broad sense to refer to beliefs or theories about an eschatological improvement of the state of humanity or the world.

Is there confusion or deliberate distortion of the actual meaning of the Hebrew word Mashia?

1. Isa a.s being born by a virgin is one of the signs manifested in him depicting the majestic ability of Allah the only creator.

2. Adam a.s was tempted not to eat from a tree where was Jesus given a command not to eat from a tree?

3. Did he really fulfill the prophecy revealed in Isaiah?

Was he king to the Jews and Israelites and seen as such?

John provides a different perspective on his trial detailing a preliminary inquiry before [b]Annas rather than Caiaphas?/b]

The emphasis is on private questioning rather than a formal trial setting.
When he was reported dead on the cross after a few hours was there surprise that he had died so soon? Good excuse not to break his legs?

Akell:
As Muslims know that it was a long time after Muhammad died before anything substantial was written about his life, but people did not cease talking about him.

For over two hundred years, stories about the Islamic 'prophet' were passed orally from person to person, and among the true accounts proliferated many fabrications. By the time a systematic effort was made to sort through them, over five hundred thousand (500,000) accounts of Muhammad’s life were in popular circulation, and it is commonly estimated that the vast majority of them were false.

HOW CAN WE KNOW WHICH ACCOUNTS OF MUHAMMAD’S LIFE ARE TRUSTWORTHY?

Let's assume the classical Islamic method for assessing the authenticity of hadith. In the field of uloom al-hadith, translated “the science of Muhammad’s sayings,” Muslim scholars grade individual accounts of Muhammad’s life based on criteria such as how well-known an account was and who the people relaying it were. The most trustworthy hadith are ultimately graded sahih, which means “true” or “authentic,” whereas the weakest hadith are labelled daeef (“weak”) or even maudu (“fabricated”).

Imam Bukhari and his student Imam Muslim were two highly respected scholars in the third century after Muhammad, and they collected only those hadith which they considered sahih and beyond dispute. Most Muslims consider their collections above reproach. In using only the hadith that they approved, Muslims were deluded to see Muhammad was the noble and peaceful man that they've always been taught, and that there were no problematic accounts in his life.
But this isn't the case. Problematic accounts existed even amid the sahih collections.

If you ask imams to resolve these problematic accounts found in the sahih, and also search online, you'll see how other Muslims responded to the criticisms. What I learned was that many were willing to accuse even the sahih collections of containing fabricated accounts, finding ways to dismiss those accounts that were considered authentic by the great Muslim scholars of old.

It was then I realized they were essentially finding ways to pick and choose from the ancient records which accounts were reliable and which were not, creating a Muhammad that they felt comfortable with.

If you want to know who Muhammad really was and whether you should follow him as your prophet, not to create a Muhammad in your mind that was worth following. I suggest you reconsider your approach and study Muhammad using the historical method instead of uloom al-hadith.

THE HISTORICAL METHOD

What were the earliest accounts written about Muhammad, and how soon were they written?

Here, you'll discover some shocking facts about early Islam. First, people were not writing books in Arabic during Muhammad’s time. The first Arabic book to have been written was the quran, and even that was turned into a written book only after Muhammad died. There was no such thing as written Arabic literature, only oral. This is because, second, people were still figuring out how to write Arabic. Arabic script was far from standardized, having been invented only a century or two before Muhammad’s time. For these reasons and others, third, no one wrote a biography of Muhammad’s life until about 140 years after Muhammad died. By that time, there were certainly no eyewitnesses of Muhammad’s life, and people were generations removed from the events they discussed. Could we trust such an account to be an unfiltered and accurate depiction of Muhammad?

The first biography, Sirat Rasul Allah, was written by a man named Ibn Ishaq, but the book itself has actually been lost. Ibn Ishaq taught a man named al-Bakkai, who made his own edition of Ibn Ishaq’s book, and al-Bakkai taught a man named Ibn Hisham, who edited al-Bakkai’s edition, and it is this edition that we have today. Why did these men each make their own editions? Ibn Hisham tells us in his introductory remarks: “Things which it is disgraceful to discuss, matters which would distress certain people, and such reports as al-Bakkai told me he could not accept as trustworthy—all these things I have omitted.”¹ In other words, the earliest biography of Muhammad’s life was reputed to contain fabrications, disgraceful material, and distressing facts.² What we have today has been filtered many times, both for fabrications and for difficult truths.

It is because of such intentional editing that historians do not consider late accounts as trustworthy as early accounts, all else being equal. The earlier accounts have not been as filtered, and therefore are more likely to be true. Also, people are more prone to forget information over time, especially information that does not fit with the narrative at large. When it comes to the records of Muhammad’s life, we simply do not have such early or unfiltered data. Everything has been filtered through multiple generations.

Even though the earliest biography went through layers of filtering, it still contains shocking material. Some of them are listed here:

Muhammad personally oversaw the beheadings of up to nine hundred men on a single day, digging trenches in the marketplaces so that their corpses could fall into mass graves upon being decapitated.³

He ordered the assassination of an old man who had composed poetry complaining about Muhammad.⁴

A woman lamented the old man’s death in poetry, so Muhammad ordered her assassination, and her blood splattered on her children as she breastfed.⁵

Muhammad ordered the torture of a city treasurer to extract the location of the money, so his men kindled a fire with flint and steel on the treasurer’s chest until he was nearly dead, ultimately beheading him;⁶

When Muhammad was about to execute a man, the man pleaded, “Who will look after my children?” to which Muhammad responded, “Hell!”⁷

Just by scratching the surface of the earliest biography we find many troubling accounts of Muhammad. By the time hadith were written under men like Imam Bukhari and Imam Muslim, many of these accounts were filtered out of Muhammad’s biography, just as Ibn Hisham and al-Bakkai had filtered the accounts that they received.

For this reason, selective filtration, the whole body of hadith is inherently flawed: They contain only those accounts that multiple generations of early Muslims each chose to save. As we have seen, even those that were kept are often considered flawed and fabricated.

WHAT CAN WE REALLY KNOW ABOUT MUHAMMAD?
For this reason, non-Muslim scholars of early Islam are very hesitant to trust the information about the life of Muhammad. Almost none accept the science of hadith criticism as it stands, most just hoping to extract historical kernels of truth from the hadith. Some scholars have even abandoned hope of that much success, saying virtually nothing can be known about Muhammad.
These scholars are from a variety of religious and nonreligious backgrounds. One Muslim scholar concluded that, given the nature of the evidence, Muhammad may not have even existed.

Muhammad Sven Kalisch completed his PhD in Islamic jurisprudence in 1997 and became Germany’s first professor to hold a chair in Islamic theology. When he arrived at Münster University in 2004, he struck some as too conservative on account of his zeal for sharia. But then, according to the Wall Street Journal, Kalisch “wanted to subject Islam to the same scrutiny as Christianity and Judaism.”⁸ At first he defended the historicity of Muhammad in print, but the more he studied, the more he realized there were significant problems with the record. The word Muhammad appears only four times in the quran, and it is unclear whether it is a name or a title. quran 61.6 appears to say that the Prophet’s name was Ahmad, not Muhammad.⁹ There is no other evidence of Muhammad’s existence until the turn of the eighth century, when coins bearing his name were produced. “The more I read, the historical person at the root of the whole thing became more and more improbable,” says Muhammad Kalisch.

Other scholars are coming to similar conclusions on account of the holes in the historical records. Their concerns are more than an argument from silence; if the traditional understanding of Islam is true, it is indeed very problematic that we do not find more about Muhammad in the earliest historical records. If Muhammad was the prophet of the Arabs, and if they were energized and motivated by his teachings, why is it that the Arab conquests of the Middle East, North Africa, and Persia never mention his name? These conquests occurred in the middle of the seventh century, immediately after Muhammad’s death, yet none of the contemporary records mention Muhammad. In fact, none mention a holy book or even the word Muslim. It is not that there are no records; considering the communications of the conquerors and the writings of the conquered, there are abundant records, yet Muhammad is never named, a holy book is never discussed, and the conquerors are never called Muslims.

Other evidence also has historians scratching their heads: Although Mecca is reputed to be a trade center, it never appears in any trade routes until the turn of the eighth century; none of the earliest mosques faced toward Mecca (all faced toward either Jerusalem or Petra until about the turn of the eighth century); Mecca is mentioned only once in the quran; the descriptions of the land in the quran sound very little like Mecca, much more like northern Arabia; and the list goes on.

For these reasons, not just one Muslim scholar but many scholars doubt the traditional origins of Islam and even the existence of Muhammad, at least as the early Islamic records describe him. According to them, the truth about the origins of Islam is unfortunately veiled. There is almost nothing we can know with certainty about the historical Muhammad.¹⁰

Why will you make blatantly false claims?

In the year 661, Sahl ibn Abī Ḥathma, Abdullah ibn Abbas, and Saʿīd ibn Saʿd ibn ʿUbāda al-Khazrajī wrote about Muhammad in various historical texts. These three writers were contemporaries of the Prophet Muhammad and played significant roles in documenting his life and teachings.

Does 661-632 =140 years? Please what form of maths is this?

Purpose of the moon according to the quran

“See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, and made the moon a light (noor) in their midst, and made the sun as a lamp (siraaj)?” [Surah 71:15–16]

“It is He who made the sun radiant, and the moon a light, and determined phases for it-that you may know the number of years and the calculation. Allah did not create all this except with truth. He details the revelations for a people who know.” [Surah 10:5)

Akell:


Name those legacies for me, then we can start from there. As you can see from my post, I have conversed with Muslim scholars from different countries and read widely on both sides of the divide. It's so pitiful that you could not even respond to footnotes 3-10.

At least Saudi Arabia is still an Islamic country! Close to 96% are Muslims. That's a legacy!
They don't require any response!
What you copied and pasted looks like a journal so the response to it should also be academic as well.

And i don't have such time!

How could someone who claimed to be inspired of God order people to be assassinatiom, enslaved, raped, etc.? Is that who Allah is? The name 'Mohammed' was not even mentioned in the quran you're holding. SMH

Are we talking about the historicity or there's a diversion to another topic?

I can also divert to the assassinations, enslavements, rape, etc in the Bible.
I have the records plenty!
And mind you no one should mention context here!

AbuTwins:


Na wetin you say make i come read be this?


The life story of Muhammad is clear to us and the fabrications are also clear!
No be Christians and orientalists go come dey tell us what we know!

How come Saudi Arabia still retain at least a little of the legacy of Islam from Muhammad as we read from the same texts you criticize but none of Jesus's so-called Christian legacies exists in Israel?

Abeg!

Name those legacies for me, then we can start from there. As you can see from my post, I have conversed with Muslim scholars from different countries and read widely on both sides of the divide. It's so pitiful that you could not even respond to footnotes 3-10. How could someone who claimed to be inspired of God order people to be assassinatiom, enslaved, raped, etc.? Is that who Allah is? The name 'Mohammed' was not even mentioned in the quran you're holding. SMH

As Muslims know that it was a long time after Muhammad died before anything substantial was written about his life, but people did not cease talking about him.

For over two hundred years, stories about the Islamic 'prophet' were passed orally from person to person, and among the true accounts proliferated many fabrications. By the time a systematic effort was made to sort through them, over five hundred thousand (500,000) accounts of Muhammad’s life were in popular circulation, and it is commonly estimated that the vast majority of them were false.

HOW CAN WE KNOW WHICH ACCOUNTS OF MUHAMMAD’S LIFE ARE TRUSTWORTHY?

Let's assume the classical Islamic method for assessing the authenticity of hadith. In the field of uloom al-hadith, translated “the science of Muhammad’s sayings,” Muslim scholars grade individual accounts of Muhammad’s life based on criteria such as how well-known an account was and who the people relaying it were. The most trustworthy hadith are ultimately graded sahih, which means “true” or “authentic,” whereas the weakest hadith are labelled daeef (“weak”) or even maudu (“fabricated”).

Imam Bukhari and his student Imam Muslim were two highly respected scholars in the third century after Muhammad, and they collected only those hadith which they considered sahih and beyond dispute. Most Muslims consider their collections above reproach. In using only the hadith that they approved, Muslims were deluded to see Muhammad was the noble and peaceful man that they've always been taught, and that there were no problematic accounts in his life.
But this isn't the case. Problematic accounts existed even amid the sahih collections.

If you ask imams to resolve these problematic accounts found in the sahih, and also search online, you'll see how other Muslims responded to the criticisms. What I learned was that many were willing to accuse even the sahih collections of containing fabricated accounts, finding ways to dismiss those accounts that were considered authentic by the great Muslim scholars of old.

It was then I realized they were essentially finding ways to pick and choose from the ancient records which accounts were reliable and which were not, creating a Muhammad that they felt comfortable with.

If you want to know who Muhammad really was and whether you should follow him as your prophet, not to create a Muhammad in your mind that was worth following. I suggest you reconsider your approach and study Muhammad using the historical method instead of uloom al-hadith.

THE HISTORICAL METHOD

What were the earliest accounts written about Muhammad, and how soon were they written?

Here, you'll discover some shocking facts about early Islam. First, people were not writing books in Arabic during Muhammad’s time. The first Arabic book to have been written was the quran, and even that was turned into a written book only after Muhammad died. There was no such thing as written Arabic literature, only oral. This is because, second, people were still figuring out how to write Arabic. Arabic script was far from standardized, having been invented only a century or two before Muhammad’s time. For these reasons and others, third, no one wrote a biography of Muhammad’s life until about 140 years after Muhammad died. By that time, there were certainly no eyewitnesses of Muhammad’s life, and people were generations removed from the events they discussed. Could we trust such an account to be an unfiltered and accurate depiction of Muhammad?

The first biography, Sirat Rasul Allah, was written by a man named Ibn Ishaq, but the book itself has actually been lost. Ibn Ishaq taught a man named al-Bakkai, who made his own edition of Ibn Ishaq’s book, and al-Bakkai taught a man named Ibn Hisham, who edited al-Bakkai’s edition, and it is this edition that we have today. Why did these men each make their own editions? Ibn Hisham tells us in his introductory remarks: “Things which it is disgraceful to discuss, matters which would distress certain people, and such reports as al-Bakkai told me he could not accept as trustworthy—all these things I have omitted.”¹ In other words, the earliest biography of Muhammad’s life was reputed to contain fabrications, disgraceful material, and distressing facts.² What we have today has been filtered many times, both for fabrications and for difficult truths.

It is because of such intentional editing that historians do not consider late accounts as trustworthy as early accounts, all else being equal. The earlier accounts have not been as filtered, and therefore are more likely to be true. Also, people are more prone to forget information over time, especially information that does not fit with the narrative at large. When it comes to the records of Muhammad’s life, we simply do not have such early or unfiltered data. Everything has been filtered through multiple generations.

Even though the earliest biography went through layers of filtering, it still contains shocking material. Some of them are listed here:

Muhammad personally oversaw the beheadings of up to nine hundred men on a single day, digging trenches in the marketplaces so that their corpses could fall into mass graves upon being decapitated.³

He ordered the assassination of an old man who had composed poetry complaining about Muhammad.⁴

A woman lamented the old man’s death in poetry, so Muhammad ordered her assassination, and her blood splattered on her children as she breastfed.⁵

Muhammad ordered the torture of a city treasurer to extract the location of the money, so his men kindled a fire with flint and steel on the treasurer’s chest until he was nearly dead, ultimately beheading him;⁶

When Muhammad was about to execute a man, the man pleaded, “Who will look after my children?” to which Muhammad responded, “Hell!”⁷

Just by scratching the surface of the earliest biography we find many troubling accounts of Muhammad. By the time hadith were written under men like Imam Bukhari and Imam Muslim, many of these accounts were filtered out of Muhammad’s biography, just as Ibn Hisham and al-Bakkai had filtered the accounts that they received.

For this reason, selective filtration, the whole body of hadith is inherently flawed: They contain only those accounts that multiple generations of early Muslims each chose to save. As we have seen, even those that were kept are often considered flawed and fabricated.

WHAT CAN WE REALLY KNOW ABOUT MUHAMMAD?
For this reason, non-Muslim scholars of early Islam are very hesitant to trust the information about the life of Muhammad. Almost none accept the science of hadith criticism as it stands, most just hoping to extract historical kernels of truth from the hadith. Some scholars have even abandoned hope of that much success, saying virtually nothing can be known about Muhammad.
These scholars are from a variety of religious and nonreligious backgrounds. One Muslim scholar concluded that, given the nature of the evidence, Muhammad may not have even existed.

Muhammad Sven Kalisch completed his PhD in Islamic jurisprudence in 1997 and became Germany’s first professor to hold a chair in Islamic theology. When he arrived at Münster University in 2004, he struck some as too conservative on account of his zeal for sharia. But then, according to the Wall Street Journal, Kalisch “wanted to subject Islam to the same scrutiny as Christianity and Judaism.”⁸ At first he defended the historicity of Muhammad in print, but the more he studied, the more he realized there were significant problems with the record. The word Muhammad appears only four times in the quran, and it is unclear whether it is a name or a title. quran 61.6 appears to say that the Prophet’s name was Ahmad, not Muhammad.⁹ There is no other evidence of Muhammad’s existence until the turn of the eighth century, when coins bearing his name were produced. “The more I read, the historical person at the root of the whole thing became more and more improbable,” says Muhammad Kalisch.

Other scholars are coming to similar conclusions on account of the holes in the historical records. Their concerns are more than an argument from silence; if the traditional understanding of Islam is true, it is indeed very problematic that we do not find more about Muhammad in the earliest historical records. If Muhammad was the prophet of the Arabs, and if they were energized and motivated by his teachings, why is it that the Arab conquests of the Middle East, North Africa, and Persia never mention his name? These conquests occurred in the middle of the seventh century, immediately after Muhammad’s death, yet none of the contemporary records mention Muhammad. In fact, none mention a holy book or even the word Muslim. It is not that there are no records; considering the communications of the conquerors and the writings of the conquered, there are abundant records, yet Muhammad is never named, a holy book is never discussed, and the conquerors are never called Muslims.

Other evidence also has historians scratching their heads: Although Mecca is reputed to be a trade center, it never appears in any trade routes until the turn of the eighth century; none of the earliest mosques faced toward Mecca (all faced toward either Jerusalem or Petra until about the turn of the eighth century); Mecca is mentioned only once in the quran; the descriptions of the land in the quran sound very little like Mecca, much more like northern Arabia; and the list goes on.

For these reasons, not just one Muslim scholar but many scholars doubt the traditional origins of Islam and even the existence of Muhammad, at least as the early Islamic records describe him. According to them, the truth about the origins of Islam is unfortunately veiled. There is almost nothing we can know with certainty about the historical Muhammad.¹⁰

Ken4Christ:


Messiah means Saviour. The whole human race was under the power of darkness on account of the sin of the first man, Adam. And the Bible says that the wages of sin is death. So, for us to be free from the power of darkness, someone has to die for the entire human race. And Jesus was the only person qualified to die for us. Three reasons he was the only one who could die for us are;

1. He was born of a virgin. So, the sin nature of Adam was not in him. In other words, he was born sinless. And it's only a sinless man that can die for the sinful world.

So, to even said he die makes a mockery of his birth. Why did God look for a virgin to carry that Saviour of the world and he didn't fulfil his mission.

2. He was subjected to the same kind of temptation the first Adam failed. But Jesus didn't fail.

3. He fulfilled all the prophecies of the Old Testament. He was a Jew. He was of the lineage of David. And every other prophecies concerning him was fulfilled.

So, for quran to say Jesus didn't die is to deny those deceived by such statement of their salvation.

It is faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus that saves a man. If you don't believe he died and rose from the dead, you cannot be saved - Romans 10:9-10.

But Jesus died and rose again. It is foolishness to believe the testimony of someone who was born over 500 years after the event happened and reject the testimonies of several eye witnesses some of which were his disciples.

Please, use your brain and don't be deceived.

Mention just one messianic prophesy that he fulfilled, I will recharge your phone with 5k

Ken4Christ:


Messiah means Saviour. The whole human race was under the power of darkness on account of the sin of the first man, Adam. And the Bible says that the wages of sin is death. So, for us to be free from the power of darkness, someone has to die for the entire human race. And Jesus was the only person qualified to die for us. Three reasons he was the only one who could die for us are;

1. He was born of a virgin. So, the sin nature of Adam was not in him. In other words, he was born sinless. And it's only a sinless man that can die for the sinful world.

So, to even said he die makes a mockery of his birth. Why did God look for a virgin to carry that Saviour of the world and he didn't fulfil his mission.

2. He was subjected to the same kind of temptation the first Adam failed. But Jesus didn't fail.

3. He fulfilled all the prophecies of the Old Testament. He was a Jew. He was of the lineage of David. And every other prophecies concerning him was fulfilled.

So, for quran to say Jesus didn't die is to deny those deceived by such statement of their salvation.

It is faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus that saves a man. If you don't believe he died and rose from the dead, you cannot be saved - Romans 10:9-10.

But Jesus died and rose again. It is foolishness to believe the testimony of someone who was born over 500 years after the event happened and reject the testimonies of several eye witnesses some of which were his disciples.

Please, use your brain and don't be deceived.

It was you and your village people that was under darkness...

In my town, it was full of light...

honesttalk21:


Can you define or explain what Messiah means?

Does it mean one who doesn't die?

Therein is a big miracle?

How many councils were held and used to define Christianity?
A religion Yeshua didn't found or did he categorically say you should abandon the old ways and tradition of Jews in Judaism?

Did Ecumenical councils not hold from 325 to 1965 to edit and re-edit Christianity.

Didn't Pagan Emperor Constantine Use Christianity to Unify Church and State?

Messiah means Saviour. The whole human race was under the power of darkness on account of the sin of the first man, Adam. And the Bible says that the wages of sin is death. So, for us to be free from the power of darkness, someone has to die for the entire human race. And Jesus was the only person qualified to die for us. Three reasons he was the only one who could die for us are;

1. He was born of a virgin. So, the sin nature of Adam was not in him. In other words, he was born sinless. And it's only a sinless man that can die for the sinful world.

So, to even said he die makes a mockery of his birth. Why did God look for a virgin to carry that Saviour of the world and he didn't fulfil his mission.

2. He was subjected to the same kind of temptation the first Adam failed. But Jesus didn't fail.

3. He fulfilled all the prophecies of the Old Testament. He was a Jew. He was of the lineage of David. And every other prophecies concerning him was fulfilled.

So, for quran to say Jesus didn't die is to deny those deceived by such statement of their salvation.

It is faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus that saves a man. If you don't believe he died and rose from the dead, you cannot be saved - Romans 10:9-10.

But Jesus died and rose again. It is foolishness to believe the testimony of someone who was born over 500 years after the event happened and reject the testimonies of several eye witnesses some of which were his disciples.

Please, use your brain and don't be deceived.

AbuTwins:
All these theory are lies! God is not a man - Numbers 23:19.

Samson too was empowered by the same spirit to kill people. Jesus was simply a man!

The contexts of the verse is oneness of purpose and not oneness of persons! He did say the father is greater than him too!

So he is a worshipper!

But God was calling them son so why can't they call him father? So how did God born Jesus, is it by reproduction, adoption or what means?

He was speaking in parables and did confuse them!

John 16:25
"Though I have been speaking figuratively (paroimia), a time is coming when I will no longer use this kind of language but will tell you plainly about my Father.

Why wasn't Jesus speaking in a normal and clear way all the time? Why did Jesus then go and say that he won't 'use this kind of language' according to the Bible?

Well, here we find out why...

Mark 4:10-12
When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. He told them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that," 'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!'

So here we see that Jesus was deceiving certain people by speaking in parables so that they won't (and God forbid!) REPENT AND BE FORGIVEN!

This is part of the Nicene creed that was fixed for you in the council of Nicaea!

Is your Spirit separate from you? If your God has a Spirit then it should not be another person other than him!



So the father can send the son on errand! The Son can send the spirit on errand! How are they equal? Trinity is a flaw that you just have to believe by faith! The Bible scholars have tried to prove and explain it from the Bible and in reality but they've always failed!

So i need to be born again to understand God when the statement is clear?

Hear O Israel the Lord our God is ONE!

Your quran puts your Allah and your Jesus at the same level. Do you want me to show you?

FIRDAUS3:
Search for the truth, and the truth shall set you free.

This discovery might open your eye to more of fallacies in the book of God called bible.

Get a copy of English quran and Juxtaposed together.

See son of wickedness, and a member of religion with the title of the world's most rapist has come to market his own book of lies and wickedness. You will soon join Satan in hellfire!

https://www.nairaland.com/3744996/muslim-men-allowed-rape-non-muslim#55620286

https://www.nairaland.com/7131601/famous-egyptian-imam-explains-proper#112921482

https://www.nairaland.com/2655521/islamic-state-10-muslims-rape#38844976

Ken4Christ:


So your prophet is spiritually blind? This is strange. And you call him a prophet?

Prophets in the Bible in the Old Testament were called seer because they can see the unseen world. This is why they could foretell the events of the future even things that are to happen beyond their generation.

Prophet Isaiah for instance foretold of the virgin birth of Jesus Christ - Isaiah 7:14

He also foretold of his divinity and the throne he will occupy - Isaiah 9:6-7.

He also foretold of the death and his resurrection and the suffering he will go through;

Isaiah 53:1-12
1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? note

2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.

3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. note

10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Prophet Isaiah also saw the millennium reign of Christ. He saw the new world after this world is destroyed.

Prophet Daniel even saw the exact year Jesus would died. And he died exactly that year.

This is why we say that the Bible is the only inspired word of God because it reveals to us what science cannot find out.

Now, coming to your Mohammed, he doesn't know what will be done with him nor of you according to your translation. Is that not enough reason for you to renounce Islam and follow Jesus?

How can you be following someone who is unsure of his destiny?

But our Lord Jesus spoke differently. He knew who he is, where he came from, his mission on earth and where he is going.

He said that God gave his only begotten Son so that you will have everlasting life and not perish - John 3:16.

He said that he will go back to his Father and come back again to take us to the beautiful place of heaven - John 14:1-3.

He said that he is the way, the truth and the life - John 14:6.

He made so many other positive claims that space will not permit me to include here.

He gave us assurance of salvation. And he warned those who don't believe in him of their final destination - hell fire.

And he proved all he said by his death and Resurrection. He ascended to heaven before the very eyes of witnesses.

Don't believe the fairy tales in your book that Jesus didn't die.

Mohammed wasn't there. How can you believe the testimony of someone who was born about 500 years after Jesus death and resurrection and disbelieve the testimonies of those who were eye witnesses?

Even outside the witnesses of those written in the Bible, the witnesses of those who are not Christians confirmed that Jesus died.

There is not a single record in the whole world of the narration that Jesus didn't die apart from your book. And the witness of your book cannot stand as it doesn't have any other witness that says the same thing. And in the court of law, one witness is not enough to prove a case.

Jesus even predicted his death in your book. And this is a contradiction to the passage which says that he didn't die.

My friend, Jesus loves you. He died for you. As you are reading this article, you are feeling convicted inside you but you are fighting it. Please let go of the lies you have been told and receive Jesus today as your Lord and Saviour.

The good news is that you will have immediate transformation the very moment you receive Jesus. You will experience an inner peace you never had before.

Please accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour and save yourself from that terrible place called hell.

Everyone who die without Jesus go to hell. Please, don't waste this opportunity to be saved. So many Muslims have found this salvation and their testimonies are on the social media. You too can be one of them.

Don't follow the man who doesn't know the way. The man who is unsure of his destiny. The Bible says that if the blind leads the blind, they will both fall into a pit.

On educating you about the misinformation and misrepresentation of quran 46:9 you do not face the issues drawn up and divert?

What more spirituality do you want displayed? The revelations in the quran and discourse about things from centuries before and warning about what is to come? What else do you want?

Would you disobey your faith and biblical guide to follow a Shaman?

Deuteronomy 18:10-12 》 Let no one be found among you who sacrifices their son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, or casts spells, or who is a medium or spiritist or who consults the dead.Anyone who does these things is detestable to the Lord; because of these same detestable practices the Lord your God will drive out those nations before you.

This passage warns against divination, sorcery, interpreting omens, and consulting with spirits. Though these practices may have similarities with aspects of shamanism, it’s crucial to recognize the diversity and complexity of shamanic spirituality.


Exodus 22:18;Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live, Condemns witchcraft often associated with shamanic traditions. It’s important to differentiate between harmful manipulation of supernatural powers (witchcraft) and spiritual practices aimed at healing and harmony (shamanism).

Shamans and seers share commonalities in terms of their connection to the spiritual realm, role as intermediaries between worlds, focus on healing practices, use of rituals and ceremonies, and community roles.

Then Isaiah 9:6 refers to Hezekiah.


Isaiah 9:6 is not a reference to Jesus but points to someone from the time of the prophet Isaiah, who is King Hezekiah.

Hezekiah was a significant king in Judah who reigned during a tumultuous period and was known for his religious reforms and defiance against foreign powers like Assyria. The titles given to the child in Isaiah 9:6, such as “Mighty God” and “Prince of Peace,” could be understood metaphorically within the context of Hezekiah’s reign rather than as literal divine attributes.

Isaiah 9:7 refers to the enduring legacy of Hezekiah’s rule rather than a future divine Messiah.

Hezekiah was a prominent king in the Bible, who ruled over the kingdom of Judah for 29 years, from 715 to 686 BC. He emerged as a faithful and righteous king, who implemented significant reforms to restore the religious practices and traditions of Judah. He undertook ambitious building projects, including the construction of a tunnel that brought water into Jerusalem from the Gihon Spring, which is now known as Hezekiah’s Tunnel.

honesttalk21:


Surely you follow the misguidance of your group.


The verse you have mentioned is from Surah Al-Ahqaf, verse 9:

قُلْ مَا كُنْتُ بِدْعًا مِّنَ الرُّسُلِ وَمَا أَدْرِي مَا يُفْعَلُ بِي وَلَا بِكُمْ ۖ إِنْ أَتَّبِعُ إِلَّا مَا يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ ۖ وَمَا أَنَا إِلَّا نَذِيرٌ مُّبِينٌ

Transliteration: Qul ma kuntu bid'an mina alrrusuli wama adree ma yufAAalu bee wala bikum in attabiAAu illa ma yoo ha ilayya wama ana illa natheerun mubeen

Translation: "Say, "I am not something new among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow what is revealed to me, and I am not but a clear warner." (quran 46:9)

In this verse, the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) is instructed to respond to the disbelievers who questioned his authenticity as a messenger of Allah. The Prophet clarifies that he is not a novelty among the messengers of Allah, and he does not have knowledge of the unseen. He simply conveys the message revealed to him by Allah and clearly warns the people.


This warning is as all other prophets pbot had done clearly warning against disbelief and bad behaviour while encouraging to believe and trust God while doing what is right.

So your prophet is spiritually blind? This is strange. And you call him a prophet?

Prophets in the Bible in the Old Testament were called seer because they can see the unseen world. This is why they could foretell the events of the future even things that are to happen beyond their generation.

Prophet Isaiah for instance foretold of the virgin birth of Jesus Christ - Isaiah 7:14

He also foretold of his divinity and the throne he will occupy - Isaiah 9:6-7.

He also foretold of the death and his resurrection and the suffering he will go through;

Isaiah 53:1-12
1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? note

2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.

3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. note

10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Prophet Isaiah also saw the millennium reign of Christ. He saw the new world after this world is destroyed.

Prophet Daniel even saw the exact year Jesus would died. And he died exactly that year.

This is why we say that the Bible is the only inspired word of God because it reveals to us what science cannot find out.

Now, coming to your Mohammed, he doesn't know what will be done with him nor of you according to your translation. Is that not enough reason for you to renounce Islam and follow Jesus?

How can you be following someone who is unsure of his destiny?

But our Lord Jesus spoke differently. He knew who he is, where he came from, his mission on earth and where he is going.

He said that God gave his only begotten Son so that you will have everlasting life and not perish - John 3:16.

He said that he will go back to his Father and come back again to take us to the beautiful place of heaven - John 14:1-3.

He said that he is the way, the truth and the life - John 14:6.

He made so many other positive claims that space will not permit me to include here.

He gave us assurance of salvation. And he warned those who don't believe in him of their final destination - hell fire.

And he proved all he said by his death and Resurrection. He ascended to heaven before the very eyes of witnesses.

Don't believe the fairy tales in your book that Jesus didn't die.

Mohammed wasn't there. How can you believe the testimony of someone who was born about 500 years after Jesus death and resurrection and disbelieve the testimonies of those who were eye witnesses?

Even outside the witnesses of those written in the Bible, the witnesses of those who are not Christians confirmed that Jesus died.

There is not a single record in the whole world of the narration that Jesus didn't die apart from your book. And the witness of your book cannot stand as it doesn't have any other witness that says the same thing. And in the court of law, one witness is not enough to prove a case.

Jesus even predicted his death in your book. And this is a contradiction to the passage which says that he didn't die.

My friend, Jesus loves you. He died for you. As you are reading this article, you are feeling convicted inside you but you are fighting it. Please let go of the lies you have been told and receive Jesus today as your Lord and Saviour.

The good news is that you will have immediate transformation the very moment you receive Jesus. You will experience an inner peace you never had before.

Please accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour and save yourself from that terrible place called hell.

Everyone who die without Jesus go to hell. Please, don't waste this opportunity to be saved. So many Muslims have found this salvation and their testimonies are on the social media. You too can be one of them.

Don't follow the man who doesn't know the way. The man who is unsure of his destiny. The Bible says that if the blind leads the blind, they will both fall into a pit.

qbqetell:
Don't Masturbate: A Dogma from People You Least Want to Emulate

The saying, "Don't Masturbate", is a saying you must have heard by now. On this thread, there are countless instances. On YouTube, there are countless instances. Your pastor and imams must have also promised all masturbators hell. I could go on, but you get the gist.

Like many of you, I stayed away from this act for almost as long as I have been alive. I didn't want that disdainful look if I was ever known to be a masturbator, I stayed away from it. Many of us can't understand why it is wrong, but we all just stay away from it, to avoid disdain from society.

If you ask the people who espouse the idea, "Why is masturbation wrong?", you'd get one of the following answers:

1: God Frows At It
Holier-than-thous can't wait to espouse how their religion is against masturbation, yet they are never able to provide a reference in any of their Holy books.

Your pastor would say masturbators are going to hell, but if you ask for a reference in the bible, he would ask what authority you have to question him. In fact, you may become a scapegoat and an outcast in your church.

2: It Would Destroy You
This is another bullshit. You will see why I said this.

Religion and Masturbation
I have researched both Christianity and Islam countlessly, but have never found any valid argument against Masturbation. Just in case, I was the one missing the depth of available research materials, I decided to use one of these AI assistants.

Question
Is the quran against Masturbation?

Answer
The quran does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, Islamic scholars and interpreters have debated and discussed the topic, and some have derived guidance from related verses and hadiths (sayings and actions of the Prophet Muhammad).

Some scholars consider masturbation to be makruh (disapproved or reprehensible) but not haram (forbidden). Others view it as a minor sin or a sign of weakness.

The quran does encourage Muslims to maintain chastity and modesty (e.g., Surah Al-Isra' 17:32, Surah Al-Ahzab 33:35) and to seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires (e.g., Surah An-Nisa' 4:3). However, it is crucial to note that Islam prioritizes compassion, mercy, and self-awareness, and individuals are encouraged to seek guidance from qualified scholars or counselors if they struggle with sexual desires or behaviors.

Remember that Islamic interpretations can vary, and it's essential to approach these topics with sensitivity and respect for diverse perspectives.

Question
Is the Bible against Masturbation?

Answer
The Bible does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, some interpretations of certain passages have led to various perspectives on the topic. Here are a few examples:

1. Genesis 38:9-10: The story of Onan, who "spilled his seed on the ground" to avoid fathering a child, has sometimes been linked to masturbation. However, this interpretation is debated among scholars.

2. Matthew 5:27-28: Jesus teaches about lust and adultery in one's heart, which some have extended to include masturbation. However, this connection is not universally accepted.

3. 1 Corinthians 6:18-20: The apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body. Some have applied this to masturbation, while others see it as addressing sexual relationships and exploitation.

It's essential to note that the Bible's focus is on promoting healthy relationships, self-control, and respect for one's body as a temple of the Holy Spirit. Different Christian traditions and interpretations may have varying views on masturbation, and individuals often hold personal beliefs based on their understanding of scripture and spiritual guidance.

Just like our AI assistant has provided, the Holy books never directly or in a logically implied manner admonish against masturbation.

Islam talks about just chastity and modesty. But when asked about masturbation, because the quran didn't say anything about it, clerics would rather consider masturbation a bad act, based on their limited personal understanding. To an extent, I don't blame some, but the ones arrogant about the claim are the biggest problems.

Islam also asks, "... seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires ....". When someone says "Do X", it doesn't mean Y is forbidden.

The Bible referenced "Onan, who spilled his seed on the ground ...". This is nowhere close to a clear-cut admonition against masturbation.

In addition, the bible preaches against "lust and adultery". Anyone who tries to pass off masturbation as lust or adultery has likely never read the meaning of lust and adultery.

Futhermore, the Bible also made reference to, "... apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body.". Masturbation isn't sexual intercourse, and any attempt to classify it under sexual immorality is just outrightly dumb.

Dangers of Not Masturbation in this Modern World
Yeah, you read that title right.

You see, we live in a modern world, or maybe I should say, a world very distant from the past.

In past times, women dressed modestly. Muslim and Christian women were well-known for their modest dressings. Even the ones who were not so religious dressed impressively modestly.

In present times, the average woman at best, puts on tempting, semi-revealing, and tight-fitting dresses. We now see 10% of their bosom. We now see the delicate curves of their body. We now see how soft their boobs are. When they run, we now see how their soft and succulent boobs dance. We now see their elegantly shaped bums. We now see the perfect sizes of their cup breasts. We now see their pant lines. We now see the delicate skin of their neck. All that, just for the average woman.

It gets worse for the other 30 - 40%. We get to see their entire breasts, through a joke called (see-through) net. If you go to the beach, you see full bum bums. In fact, you now see a woman's completely stark underbody at places like the beach. The only thing you probably haven't started seeing publicly are the entrances of their vaginas. Every other thing is readily available everywhere you go?

Is this a good or bad thing? I don't know, and that is not what this article is about.

My point is, we now live in a vastly different world. We now live in a world, where the sexual desire of the average man is stimulated to its peak, continuously for almost through out the day. Even if you decide not to go outside, your TVs are now heavily sexualized. The internet is now heavily sexualized. Even our churches have become hotspots for satisfying our eyes with women dressed sexually temptingly. The mosques are not an exception. There isn't just anywhere to run to. Whether you like it or not, you will be sexually stimulated. Sexual tension (Boner/Konji) or whatever you want to call it, would be forced down your throat.

Unless for guys having regular sex, the average man on the road is a Hot he-goat, maybe just a quiet one. You don't believe me? Make a girl approach a random guy on the road, tell him, if he slaps anyone on the road, she would allow him Bleep her. Wait and see how many slaps would go around, and eventually how many guys would line up for Bleep.

If sexual tension was a mild feeling that can be easily subdued, this whole situation wouldn't have been a problem. If anything, sexual impulse is an extremely powerful force. That thing called konji has made countless men do things, even they could not believe. Ask men around the world, if they wouldn't be ashamed and sincere, 98% would narrate at least one experience of how konji made them do things they wish they never did.

Konji is real. It is real and very crazy. It is real as God (for those who believe in God). In fact, certain scholars go as far as saying sexual tension is what drives the world economy: every man just wants to Bleep - not entirely true, but significantly true. This thing is so powerful, the moment surplus starts to build up in a man, you have to get it out of your system as soon as you can. You try to control it, but like fire in a bedroom, you are in control until something crazy happens.

I could share my personal experience. I was a man trying to be a decent human being. There was a point in my life when I wasn't having sex. The women I was around then expected a man to bow to them to get the coochie. My ego wouldn't let me. I also didn't want to masturbate, I didn't want to be sneered for being a masturbator.

I stepped out every day, to carry out my daily activities, but I found I was always already sexually stimulated by the time I got back home.

The powerful force kept building up inside of me and there was no way to dissipate it. Heat a wood enough, and it would burn. Heat a metal enough, and it will melt. Heat Diamond enough, and it will melt. Heat steel enough, and it would melt. And that is exactly what happened to me. I soon found myself in a spiral of events that almost led to a point of no return. I had grace and extreme luck, for my life would have been in a mess right now. It was at this point I decide things had to change and I couldn't keep going like this.

My story isn't unique. There is a sea of men who have gone through or going through similar experiences, with consequences of varying degrees. I'm not justifying any of these acts, but we have all heard of stories of grandpas abusing 5-year-old babies, stories of guys raping girls, stories of brothers sleeping with sisters, stories of fathers sleeping with daughters, stories of teachers sleeping with students, stories of guys whose careers were ruined because konji got the better of them.

It always doesn't manifest in just the form above. Sometimes, it manifests in the form of beaten-down husbands and boyfriends. The wife/girlfriend finds how helpless her man can be when he needs sex, then she weaponizes it. She gives him sex when he does something good and withholds the sex when she disapproves of something, like a dog trainer training a dog. The man, fearing the consequences or not even having an option, surrenders and becomes a docile sheep that does whatever madam says and wants. This is why you sometimes see strong men become caricatures of themselves when they get into relationships. Konji is real.

It sometimes manifests in the form of anger. Look at men (and women) who are always angry for no reason, you would often find they have never had sex or haven't had sex in a very long time. These are the kind who go ahead to shoot schools down, stalk and murder women, and troll on social media.

People would try to make you seem weak for being unable to control konji. They would try to make you seem less. These guys are hypocrites who are getting sex often and can not relate. Also, some chronically masturbate, and shame other men who do. And truly, some don't get sex often and also don't masturbate, but look at their lives, they are often the people you least want to be like. Will Smith is an example. The boy once made a video of how terrible masturbation is, but Will Smith should be the last person trying to be an example for other men.

Closing
Konji is real. It is a crazy force. Before it ruins you, get hold of it.

You don't want to lack it, but even more importantly, you don't want too much in your system for a prolonged period. Konji is an essential ingredient in a passionate man's system. It is what makes men work hard and grind the hell out of work. In other words, it is needed, but when you are done using it for what you need it for, you want to expel it from your system as soon as possible.

The frequency and time of expulsion would depend on you. Personally, when I wake up, I go to work, and grind the hell out. But as soon as I am back, I expel that shit out of my system, unless mama is coming over for the night.

When I sleep at night, my body secretes fresh one, and the cycle repeats.

The first step to becoming a man with great mental clarity is being able to manage your konji levels. You don't want to have an excess or stale semen in your system for a prolonged period.

If you have a girl or woman to help relieve you of this energy, great. But when a female isn't around, be proud to help yourself.

So brother, head over to that store, find the most refined cream you can lay your hands on, and konj/stroke konji out of your system.

Be proud. Don't let any mother fucker shame you for choosing to have mental clarity. If you can't afford a cream, a bar soap works too. Soaked detergent or even bare-hand also work, although not recommended.

This is my BUT, a big B BUT actually. Never use masturbation for pleasure. There is a difference between using it to maintain your energy level and just using it whenever you feel like. Like all addictions, masturbation addiction is also bad. When masturbation becomes a tool of pleasure (instead of being a tool to keep your mental clarity), you soon start doing it too often, and that is where the problem begins. Just like too much water can kill you, too much masturbation is also detrimental.

Usually, once a day, is enough. At times, you need it twice. Experiment to find out what frequency and time work best for you.

In closing, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every man looking to attain mental clarity and logical maturity. Even for men with relationships, it shatters whatever pussy power a woman thinks she holds over you. When she knows, your hand could do the job if she refuses, she would have less incentive to misbehave and think she holds any special power over you.

Once again, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every modern man. Your true moral, masculinity, career, or even life may never survive without it. Be proud to be a masturbator. I am proud to be a masturbator.

Can someone share us a GIF of that Ronaldo masturbation goal celebration? The man has been trying to pass you guys a message.

You are not correct sir.. I disagree with you.

qbqetell:
Don't Masturbate: A Dogma from People You Least Want to Emulate

The saying, "Don't Masturbate", is a saying you must have heard by now. On this thread, there are countless instances. On YouTube, there are countless instances. Your pastor and imams must have also promised all masturbators hell. I could go on, but you get the gist.

Like many of you, I stayed away from this act for almost as long as I have been alive. I didn't want that disdainful look if I was ever known to be a masturbator, I stayed away from it. Many of us can't understand why it is wrong, but we all just stay away from it, to avoid disdain from society.

If you ask the people who espouse the idea, "Why is masturbation wrong?", you'd get one of the following answers:

1: God Frows At It
Holier-than-thous can't wait to espouse how their religion is against masturbation, yet they are never able to provide a reference in any of their Holy books.

Your pastor would say masturbators are going to hell, but if you ask for a reference in the bible, he would ask what authority you have to question him. In fact, you may become a scapegoat and an outcast in your church.

2: It Would Destroy You
This is another bullshit. You will see why I said this.

Religion and Masturbation
I have researched both Christianity and Islam countlessly, but have never found any valid argument against Masturbation. Just in case, I was the one missing the depth of available research materials, I decided to use one of these AI assistants.

Question
Is the quran against Masturbation?

Answer
The quran does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, Islamic scholars and interpreters have debated and discussed the topic, and some have derived guidance from related verses and hadiths (sayings and actions of the Prophet Muhammad).

Some scholars consider masturbation to be makruh (disapproved or reprehensible) but not haram (forbidden). Others view it as a minor sin or a sign of weakness.

The quran does encourage Muslims to maintain chastity and modesty (e.g., Surah Al-Isra' 17:32, Surah Al-Ahzab 33:35) and to seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires (e.g., Surah An-Nisa' 4:3). However, it is crucial to note that Islam prioritizes compassion, mercy, and self-awareness, and individuals are encouraged to seek guidance from qualified scholars or counselors if they struggle with sexual desires or behaviors.

Remember that Islamic interpretations can vary, and it's essential to approach these topics with sensitivity and respect for diverse perspectives.

Question
Is the Bible against Masturbation?

Answer
The Bible does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, some interpretations of certain passages have led to various perspectives on the topic. Here are a few examples:

1. Genesis 38:9-10: The story of Onan, who "spilled his seed on the ground" to avoid fathering a child, has sometimes been linked to masturbation. However, this interpretation is debated among scholars.

2. Matthew 5:27-28: Jesus teaches about lust and adultery in one's heart, which some have extended to include masturbation. However, this connection is not universally accepted.

3. 1 Corinthians 6:18-20: The apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body. Some have applied this to masturbation, while others see it as addressing sexual relationships and exploitation.

It's essential to note that the Bible's focus is on promoting healthy relationships, self-control, and respect for one's body as a temple of the Holy Spirit. Different Christian traditions and interpretations may have varying views on masturbation, and individuals often hold personal beliefs based on their understanding of scripture and spiritual guidance.

Just like our AI assistant has provided, the Holy books never directly or in a logically implied manner admonish against masturbation.

Islam talks about just chastity and modesty. But when asked about masturbation, because the quran didn't say anything about it, clerics would rather consider masturbation a bad act, based on their limited personal understanding. To an extent, I don't blame some, but the ones arrogant about the claim are the biggest problems.

Islam also asks, "... seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires ....". When someone says "Do X", it doesn't mean Y is forbidden.

The Bible referenced "Onan, who spilled his seed on the ground ...". This is nowhere close to a clear-cut admonition against masturbation.

In addition, the bible preaches against "lust and adultery". Anyone who tries to pass off masturbation as lust or adultery has likely never read the meaning of lust and adultery.

Futhermore, the Bible also made reference to, "... apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body.". Masturbation isn't sexual intercourse, and any attempt to classify it under sexual immorality is just outrightly dumb.

Dangers of Not Masturbation in this Modern World
Yeah, you read that title right.

You see, we live in a modern world, or maybe I should say, a world very distant from the past.

In past times, women dressed modestly. Muslim and Christian women were well-known for their modest dressings. Even the ones who were not so religious dressed impressively modestly.

In present times, the average woman at best, puts on tempting, semi-revealing, and tight-fitting dresses. We now see 10% of their bosom. We now see the delicate curves of their body. We now see how soft their boobs are. When they run, we now see how their soft and succulent boobs dance. We now see their elegantly shaped bums. We now see the perfect sizes of their cup breasts. We now see their pant lines. We now see the delicate skin of their neck. All that, just for the average woman.

It gets worse for the other 30 - 40%. We get to see their entire breasts, through a joke called (see-through) net. If you go to the beach, you see full bum bums. In fact, you now see a woman's completely stark underbody at places like the beach. The only thing you probably haven't started seeing publicly are the entrances of their vaginas. Every other thing is readily available everywhere you go?

Is this a good or bad thing? I don't know, and that is not what this article is about.

My point is, we now live in a vastly different world. We now live in a world, where the sexual desire of the average man is stimulated to its peak, continuously for almost through out the day. Even if you decide not to go outside, your TVs are now heavily sexualized. The internet is now heavily sexualized. Even our churches have become hotspots for satisfying our eyes with women dressed sexually temptingly. The mosques are not an exception. There isn't just anywhere to run to. Whether you like it or not, you will be sexually stimulated. Sexual tension (Boner/Konji) or whatever you want to call it, would be forced down your throat.

Unless for guys having regular sex, the average man on the road is a Hot he-goat, maybe just a quiet one. You don't believe me? Make a girl approach a random guy on the road, tell him, if he slaps anyone on the road, she would allow him Bleep her. Wait and see how many slaps would go around, and eventually how many guys would line up for Bleep.

If sexual tension was a mild feeling that can be easily subdued, this whole situation wouldn't have been a problem. If anything, sexual impulse is an extremely powerful force. That thing called konji has made countless men do things, even they could not believe. Ask men around the world, if they wouldn't be ashamed and sincere, 98% would narrate at least one experience of how konji made them do things they wish they never did.

Konji is real. It is real and very crazy. It is real as God (for those who believe in God). In fact, certain scholars go as far as saying sexual tension is what drives the world economy: every man just wants to Bleep - not entirely true, but significantly true. This thing is so powerful, the moment surplus starts to build up in a man, you have to get it out of your system as soon as you can. You try to control it, but like fire in a bedroom, you are in control until something crazy happens.

I could share my personal experience. I was a man trying to be a decent human being. There was a point in my life when I wasn't having sex. The women I was around then expected a man to bow to them to get the coochie. My ego wouldn't let me. I also didn't want to masturbate, I didn't want to be sneered for being a masturbator.

I stepped out every day, to carry out my daily activities, but I found I was always already sexually stimulated by the time I got back home.

The powerful force kept building up inside of me and there was no way to dissipate it. Heat a wood enough, and it would burn. Heat a metal enough, and it will melt. Heat Diamond enough, and it will melt. Heat steel enough, and it would melt. And that is exactly what happened to me. I soon found myself in a spiral of events that almost led to a point of no return. I had grace and extreme luck, for my life would have been in a mess right now. It was at this point I decide things had to change and I couldn't keep going like this.

My story isn't unique. There is a sea of men who have gone through or going through similar experiences, with consequences of varying degrees. I'm not justifying any of these acts, but we have all heard of stories of grandpas abusing 5-year-old babies, stories of guys raping girls, stories of brothers sleeping with sisters, stories of fathers sleeping with daughters, stories of teachers sleeping with students, stories of guys whose careers were ruined because konji got the better of them.

It always doesn't manifest in just the form above. Sometimes, it manifests in the form of beaten-down husbands and boyfriends. The wife/girlfriend finds how helpless her man can be when he needs sex, then she weaponizes it. She gives him sex when he does something good and withholds the sex when she disapproves of something, like a dog trainer training a dog. The man, fearing the consequences or not even having an option, surrenders and becomes a docile sheep that does whatever madam says and wants. This is why you sometimes see strong men become caricatures of themselves when they get into relationships. Konji is real.

It sometimes manifests in the form of anger. Look at men (and women) who are always angry for no reason, you would often find they have never had sex or haven't had sex in a very long time. These are the kind who go ahead to shoot schools down, stalk and murder women, and troll on social media.

People would try to make you seem weak for being unable to control konji. They would try to make you seem less. These guys are hypocrites who are getting sex often and can not relate. Also, some chronically masturbate, and shame other men who do. And truly, some don't get sex often and also don't masturbate, but look at their lives, they are often the people you least want to be like. Will Smith is an example. The boy once made a video of how terrible masturbation is, but Will Smith should be the last person trying to be an example for other men.

Closing
Konji is real. It is a crazy force. Before it ruins you, get hold of it.

You don't want to lack it, but even more importantly, you don't want too much in your system for a prolonged period. Konji is an essential ingredient in a passionate man's system. It is what makes men work hard and grind the hell out of work. In other words, it is needed, but when you are done using it for what you need it for, you want to expel it from your system as soon as possible.

The frequency and time of expulsion would depend on you. Personally, when I wake up, I go to work, and grind the hell out. But as soon as I am back, I expel that shit out of my system, unless mama is coming over for the night.

When I sleep at night, my body secretes fresh one, and the cycle repeats.

The first step to becoming a man with great mental clarity is being able to manage your konji levels. You don't want to have an excess or stale semen in your system for a prolonged period.

If you have a girl or woman to help relieve you of this energy, great. But when a female isn't around, be proud to help yourself.

So brother, head over to that store, find the most refined cream you can lay your hands on, and konj/stroke konji out of your system.

Be proud. Don't let any mother fucker shame you for choosing to have mental clarity. If you can't afford a cream, a bar soap works too. Soaked detergent or even bare-hand also work, although not recommended.

This is my BUT, a big B BUT actually. Never use masturbation for pleasure. There is a difference between using it to maintain your energy level and just using it whenever you feel like. Like all addictions, masturbation addiction is also bad. When masturbation becomes a tool of pleasure (instead of being a tool to keep your mental clarity), you soon start doing it too often, and that is where the problem begins. Just like too much water can kill you, too much masturbation is also detrimental.

Usually, once a day, is enough. At times, you need it twice. Experiment to find out what frequency and time work best for you.

In closing, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every man looking to attain mental clarity and logical maturity. Even for men with relationships, it shatters whatever pussy power a woman thinks she holds over you. When she knows, your hand could do the job if she refuses, she would have less incentive to misbehave and think she holds any special power over you.

Once again, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every modern man. Your true moral, masculinity, career, or even life may never survive without it. Be proud to be a masturbator. I am proud to be a masturbator.

Can someone share us a GIF of that Ronaldo masturbation goal celebration? The man has been trying to pass you guys a message.

I get why you would hold this view and it’s completely valid but taking the easy way out continually would eventually mold it into a habit for you, you’d sooner begin to think that going out into the world to “hustle” for sex, intimacy and relationships is not worth it since you can just sit at home and satisfy yourself.

Don't Masturbate: A Dogma from People You Least Want to Emulate

The saying, "Don't Masturbate", is a saying you must have heard by now. On this thread, there are countless instances. On YouTube, there are countless instances. Your pastor and imams must have also promised all masturbators hell. I could go on, but you get the gist.

Like many of you, I stayed away from this act for almost as long as I have been alive. I didn't want that disdainful look if I was ever known to be a masturbator, I stayed away from it. Many of us can't understand why it is wrong, but we all just stay away from it, to avoid disdain from society.

If you ask the people who espouse the idea, "Why is masturbation wrong?", you'd get one of the following answers:

1: God Frows At It
Holier-than-thous can't wait to espouse how their religion is against masturbation, yet they are never able to provide a reference in any of their Holy books.

Your pastor would say masturbators are going to hell, but if you ask for a reference in the bible, he would ask what authority you have to question him. In fact, you may become a scapegoat and an outcast in your church.

2: It Would Destroy You
This is another bullshit. You will see why I said this.

Religion and Masturbation
I have researched both Christianity and Islam countlessly, but have never found any valid argument against Masturbation. Just in case, I was the one missing the depth of available research materials, I decided to use one of these AI assistants.

Question
Is the quran against Masturbation?

Answer
The quran does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, Islamic scholars and interpreters have debated and discussed the topic, and some have derived guidance from related verses and hadiths (sayings and actions of the Prophet Muhammad).

Some scholars consider masturbation to be makruh (disapproved or reprehensible) but not haram (forbidden). Others view it as a minor sin or a sign of weakness.

The quran does encourage Muslims to maintain chastity and modesty (e.g., Surah Al-Isra' 17:32, Surah Al-Ahzab 33:35) and to seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires (e.g., Surah An-Nisa' 4:3). However, it is crucial to note that Islam prioritizes compassion, mercy, and self-awareness, and individuals are encouraged to seek guidance from qualified scholars or counselors if they struggle with sexual desires or behaviors.

Remember that Islamic interpretations can vary, and it's essential to approach these topics with sensitivity and respect for diverse perspectives.

Question
Is the Bible against Masturbation?

Answer
The Bible does not explicitly mention masturbation. However, some interpretations of certain passages have led to various perspectives on the topic. Here are a few examples:

1. Genesis 38:9-10: The story of Onan, who "spilled his seed on the ground" to avoid fathering a child, has sometimes been linked to masturbation. However, this interpretation is debated among scholars.

2. Matthew 5:27-28: Jesus teaches about lust and adultery in one's heart, which some have extended to include masturbation. However, this connection is not universally accepted.

3. 1 Corinthians 6:18-20: The apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body. Some have applied this to masturbation, while others see it as addressing sexual relationships and exploitation.

It's essential to note that the Bible's focus is on promoting healthy relationships, self-control, and respect for one's body as a temple of the Holy Spirit. Different Christian traditions and interpretations may have varying views on masturbation, and individuals often hold personal beliefs based on their understanding of scripture and spiritual guidance.

Just like our AI assistant has provided, the Holy books never directly or in a logically implied manner admonish against masturbation.

Islam talks about just chastity and modesty. But when asked about masturbation, because the quran didn't say anything about it, clerics would rather consider masturbation a bad act, based on their limited personal understanding. To an extent, I don't blame some, but the ones arrogant about the claim are the biggest problems.

Islam also asks, "... seek marriage as a means of fulfilling sexual desires ....". When someone says "Do X", it doesn't mean Y is forbidden.

The Bible referenced "Onan, who spilled his seed on the ground ...". This is nowhere close to a clear-cut admonition against masturbation.

In addition, the bible preaches against "lust and adultery". Anyone who tries to pass off masturbation as lust or adultery has likely never read the meaning of lust and adultery.

Futhermore, the Bible also made reference to, "... apostle Paul writes about fleeing sexual immorality and honoring God with one's body.". Masturbation isn't sexual intercourse, and any attempt to classify it under sexual immorality is just outrightly dumb.

Dangers of Not Masturbation in this Modern World
Yeah, you read that title right.

You see, we live in a modern world, or maybe I should say, a world very distant from the past.

In past times, women dressed modestly. Muslim and Christian women were well-known for their modest dressings. Even the ones who were not so religious dressed impressively modestly.

In present times, the average woman at best, puts on tempting, semi-revealing, and tight-fitting dresses. We now see 10% of their bosom. We now see the delicate curves of their body. We now see how soft their boobs are. When they run, we now see how their soft and succulent boobs dance. We now see their elegantly shaped bums. We now see the perfect sizes of their cup breasts. We now see their pant lines. We now see the delicate skin of their neck. All that, just for the average woman.

It gets worse for the other 30 - 40%. We get to see their entire breasts, through a joke called (see-through) net. If you go to the beach, you see full bum bums. In fact, you now see a woman's completely stark underbody at places like the beach. The only thing you probably haven't started seeing publicly are the entrances of their vaginas. Every other thing is readily available everywhere you go?

Is this a good or bad thing? I don't know, and that is not what this article is about.

My point is, we now live in a vastly different world. We now live in a world, where the sexual desire of the average man is stimulated to its peak, continuously for almost through out the day. Even if you decide not to go outside, your TVs are now heavily sexualized. The internet is now heavily sexualized. Even our churches have become hotspots for satisfying our eyes with women dressed sexually temptingly. The mosques are not an exception. There isn't just anywhere to run to. Whether you like it or not, you will be sexually stimulated. Sexual tension (Boner/Konji) or whatever you want to call it, would be forced down your throat.

Unless for guys having regular sex, the average man on the road is a Hot he-goat, maybe just a quiet one. You don't believe me? Make a girl approach a random guy on the road, tell him, if he slaps anyone on the road, she would allow him Bleep her. Wait and see how many slaps would go around, and eventually how many guys would line up for Bleep.

If sexual tension was a mild feeling that can be easily subdued, this whole situation wouldn't have been a problem. If anything, sexual impulse is an extremely powerful force. That thing called konji has made countless men do things, even they could not believe. Ask men around the world, if they wouldn't be ashamed and sincere, 98% would narrate at least one experience of how konji made them do things they wish they never did.

Konji is real. It is real and very crazy. It is real as God (for those who believe in God). In fact, certain scholars go as far as saying sexual tension is what drives the world economy: every man just wants to Bleep - not entirely true, but significantly true. This thing is so powerful, the moment surplus starts to build up in a man, you have to get it out of your system as soon as you can. You try to control it, but like fire in a bedroom, you are in control until something crazy happens.

I could share my personal experience. I was a man trying to be a decent human being. There was a point in my life when I wasn't having sex. The women I was around then expected a man to bow to them to get the coochie. My ego wouldn't let me. I also didn't want to masturbate, I didn't want to be sneered for being a masturbator.

I stepped out every day, to carry out my daily activities, but I found I was always already sexually stimulated by the time I got back home.

The powerful force kept building up inside of me and there was no way to dissipate it. Heat a wood enough, and it would burn. Heat a metal enough, and it will melt. Heat Diamond enough, and it will melt. Heat steel enough, and it would melt. And that is exactly what happened to me. I soon found myself in a spiral of events that almost led to a point of no return. I had grace and extreme luck, for my life would have been in a mess right now. It was at this point I decide things had to change and I couldn't keep going like this.

My story isn't unique. There is a sea of men who have gone through or going through similar experiences, with consequences of varying degrees. I'm not justifying any of these acts, but we have all heard of stories of grandpas abusing 5-year-old babies, stories of guys raping girls, stories of brothers sleeping with sisters, stories of fathers sleeping with daughters, stories of teachers sleeping with students, stories of guys whose careers were ruined because konji got the better of them.

It always doesn't manifest in just the form above. Sometimes, it manifests in the form of beaten-down husbands and boyfriends. The wife/girlfriend finds how helpless her man can be when he needs sex, then she weaponizes it. She gives him sex when he does something good and withholds the sex when she disapproves of something, like a dog trainer training a dog. The man, fearing the consequences or not even having an option, surrenders and becomes a docile sheep that does whatever madam says and wants. This is why you sometimes see strong men become caricatures of themselves when they get into relationships. Konji is real.

It sometimes manifests in the form of anger. Look at men (and women) who are always angry for no reason, you would often find they have never had sex or haven't had sex in a very long time. These are the kind who go ahead to shoot schools down, stalk and murder women, and troll on social media.

People would try to make you seem weak for being unable to control konji. They would try to make you seem less. These guys are hypocrites who are getting sex often and can not relate. Also, some chronically masturbate, and shame other men who do. And truly, some don't get sex often and also don't masturbate, but look at their lives, they are often the people you least want to be like. Will Smith is an example. The boy once made a video of how terrible masturbation is, but Will Smith should be the last person trying to be an example for other men.

Closing
Konji is real. It is a crazy force. Before it ruins you, get hold of it.

You don't want to lack it, but even more importantly, you don't want too much in your system for a prolonged period. Konji is an essential ingredient in a passionate man's system. It is what makes men work hard and grind the hell out of work. In other words, it is needed, but when you are done using it for what you need it for, you want to expel it from your system as soon as possible.

The frequency and time of expulsion would depend on you. Personally, when I wake up, I go to work, and grind the hell out. But as soon as I am back, I expel that shit out of my system, unless mama is coming over for the night.

When I sleep at night, my body secretes fresh one, and the cycle repeats.

The first step to becoming a man with great mental clarity is being able to manage your konji levels. You don't want to have an excess or stale semen in your system for a prolonged period.

If you have a girl or woman to help relieve you of this energy, great. But when a female isn't around, be proud to help yourself.

So brother, head over to that store, find the most refined cream you can lay your hands on, and konj/stroke konji out of your system.

Be proud. Don't let any mother fucker shame you for choosing to have mental clarity. If you can't afford a cream, a bar soap works too. Soaked detergent or even bare-hand also work, although not recommended.

This is my BUT, a big B BUT actually. Never use masturbation for pleasure. There is a difference between using it to maintain your energy level and just using it whenever you feel like. Like all addictions, masturbation addiction is also bad. When masturbation becomes a tool of pleasure (instead of being a tool to keep your mental clarity), you soon start doing it too often, and that is where the problem begins. Just like too much water can kill you, too much masturbation is also detrimental.

Usually, once a day, is enough. At times, you need it twice. Experiment to find out what frequency and time work best for you.

In closing, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every man looking to attain mental clarity and logical maturity. Even for men with relationships, it shatters whatever pussy power a woman thinks she holds over you. When she knows, your hand could do the job if she refuses, she would have less incentive to misbehave and think she holds any special power over you.

Once again, Masturbation is an absolutely essential tool in the kit of every modern man. Your true moral, masculinity, career, or even life may never survive without it. Be proud to be a masturbator. I am proud to be a masturbator.

Can someone share us a GIF of that Ronaldo masturbation goal celebration? The man has been trying to pass you guys a message.

MaxInDHouse:

So what are you? A Muslim right?
Ọmọ you're deceiving yourself because i know Islam much more than you can think of.
You must go to the mosque as a mosque-goer and follow an Alfa as an Alfa follower in teachings otherwise you can't just study the quran on your own and remain in their midst that's why there are different schools of thought claiming Muslim groups!

As I said earlier, you are extremely ignorant as a Muslim. Males are to go the mosque for congregational prayer while women are mostly to pray at home!
The basis is to learn the religion as we learn life affairs in school or artisanship and not necessarily following any Alfa or school of thought!

Which different schools of thought claim Muslim groups?

God excommunicated and asked Israelites to kill whoever turn against the laws binding His worshipers together as one so it's biblical to excommunicate those who turn against Godly principles! Romans 16:17; 2John 1:10-11

Did God told you to excommunicate? Those verses where not referring to you! When the adulterous woman was brought to Jesus did she excommunicate her?

The Governing Body is not inspired so they're doing their best in interpretation of God's word to fulfill what God promised in the Bible at Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3 and Zephaniah 3:9
They have successfully achieved this by helping all obedient members to form a global family of peace loving worshipers. Isaiah 2:2-4

No, they have successfully created a cult that is now adapting to the realities of other Christians denominations! We'll see more of how you loosen up like other Christians based on your Governing bodies dictates!

The GB raised zombies that will worship them!

If you people can't produce such a thing with all your beheading and amputations of sinners among you then what exactly is the essence of your Allah, Prophet and quran?

We obey Allah and the messenger He sent to us!

Not Governing bodies!

AbuTwins:

Grandpa don't tell lies on me na!
I said when you call yourself a Muslim you were only a Mosque-goer or an Alfa Follower!

So what are you? A Muslim right?
Ọmọ you're deceiving yourself because i know Islam much more than you can think of.
You must go to the mosque as a mosque-goer and follow an Alfa as an Alfa follower in teachings otherwise you can't just study the quran on your own and remain in their midst that's why there are different schools of thought claiming Muslim groups!

AbuTwins:

Even among you Jehovah witness do you have peace? People amongst you commit sins wherein you excommunicate them! How is that Biblical?

God excommunicated and asked Israelites to kill whoever turn against the laws binding His worshipers together as one so it's biblical to excommunicate those who turn against Godly principles! Romans 16:17; 2John 1:10-11

AbuTwins:

Your Governing bodies have been changing your doctrines albeit that's your definition of peace right?
Eternal peace will be in Jannah!

The Governing Body is not inspired so they're doing their best in interpretation of God's word to fulfill what God promised in the Bible at Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3 and Zephaniah 3:9
They have successfully achieved this by helping all obedient members to form a global family of peace loving worshipers. Isaiah 2:2-4
If you people can't produce such a thing with all your beheading and amputations of sinners among you then what exactly is the essence of your Allah, Prophet and quran?

I completely understood what you said, but you cannot be mixing truth with false hood. The moment you mentioned that muslims pray to the holy black stone and there is a deity inside, That was where I understand that there is a problem someone and it can only be one. Ignorance of the religion Islam before you left. And it's not your fault when you were young it was ur guidance fault for not allowing you seek knowledge. But as you are of age now it is your fault.

Firstly, no Muslim worship the Kaaba or black stone, it's a point where Muslim must face to pray because the Proppet (Saw) knew there will be arguments after for the direct to face when praying so he made it clear. Imagine coming to a Mosque and see people facing different direction to pray.

Secondly; Muslim don't kill Muslim for religion, it was stated in The quran (5:32) says "Whoever kills one person unless it be for murder or spreading corruption it shall as if he killed whole of humanity and who ever save a soul is asif he has saved Mankind. Highlight humanity. This doesn't not apply to just Muslim. It applies to all humans so that point is a lie. Anyone that kills is for theirs selfish gain. Here on the attached, Christian killed Christian. See article here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians.


I Will employ you to seek knowledge of islam and not what the media says about it. Read the quran ursef bro. Peace

MaxInDHouse:

As a FORMER Muslim this is exactly how i think back then but today i know better it's not what people claim that makes them Muslims is it?
If not then you should know that there's a way to IDENTIFY the real Christians not just saying to yourself: "Christians are banting themselves" when you don't even know what it means to be a Christian!

For instance in Islam we were all bowing towards the black stone in Mecca throughout the world yet the deity inside the black stone failed woefully to help us settle our differences amicably despite our hypocritical greeting 'SALAM' which supposed to means 'PEACE'

If we're all believers in the same God (Allah) the quran supposed to be the supreme book with which all of us can settle our differences using the words of our supreme God, don't you think so?

But instead it's just to bow down towards that black stone that matters to the Allah the rest is not important even though Muslims are killing Muslims. The same applies to Judaists and this people claiming Christians that's why i began making research to figure out what is wrong until i met the real disciples of Christ whose line of thought are the same globally {John 17:22; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3} and they will never ever think of raising weapons against anyone talkless their own brothers in the faith as they're using the Bible to resolve all their disparities peacefully among themselves.

This is what the Bible says:


All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness. 2Timothy 3:16

The highlighted in blue is where the WISDOM is if the book you call the word of your Allah or Jesus or Jehovah or YAHWEH or Olódùmarè is not powerful enough to help you set matters straight among those believing in it then your god is either dead or never existed!

I completely understood what you said, but you cannot be mixing truth with false hood. The moment you mentioned that muslims pray to the holy black stone and there is a deity inside, That was where I understand that there is a problem someone and it can only be one. Ignorance of the religion Islam before you left. And it's not your fault when you were young it was ur guidance fault for not allowing you seek knowledge. But as you are of age now it is your fault.

Firstly, no Muslim worship the Kaaba or black stone, it's a point where Muslim must face to pray because the Proppet (Saw) knew there will be arguments after for the direct to face when praying so he made it clear. Imagine coming to a Mosque and see people facing different direction to pray.

Secondly; Muslim don't kill Muslim for religion, it was stated in The quran (5:32) says "Whoever kills one person unless it be for murder or spreading corruption it shall as if he killed whole of humanity and who ever save a soul is asif he has saved Mankind. Highlight humanity. This doesn't not apply to just Muslim. It applies to all humans so that point is a lie. Anyone that kills is for theirs selfish gain. Here on the attached, Christian killed Christian. See article here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians.


I Will employ you to seek knowledge of islam and not what the media says about it. Read the quran ursef bro. Peace [author=MaxInDHouse post=129552527]
As a FORMER Muslim this is exactly how i think back then but today i know better it's not what people claim that makes them Muslims is it?
If not then you should know that there's a way to IDENTIFY the real Christians not just saying to yourself: "Christians are banting themselves" when you don't even know what it means to be a Christian!

For instance in Islam we were all bowing towards the black stone in Mecca throughout the world yet the deity inside the black stone failed woefully to help us settle our differences amicably despite our hypocritical greeting 'SALAM' which supposed to means 'PEACE'

If we're all believers in the same God (Allah) the quran supposed to be the supreme book with which all of us can settle our differences using the words of our supreme God, don't you think so?

But instead it's just to bow down towards that black stone that matters to the Allah the rest is not important even though Muslims are killing Muslims. The same applies to Judaists and this people claiming Christians that's why i began making research to figure out what is wrong until i met the real disciples of Christ whose line of thought are the same globally {John 17:22; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3} and they will never ever think of raising weapons against anyone talkless their own brothers in the faith as they're using the Bible to resolve all their disparities peacefully among themselves.

This is what the Bible says:


All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness. 2Timothy 3:16

The highlighted in blue is where the WISDOM is if the book you call the word of your Allah or Jesus or Jehovah or YAHWEH or Olódùmarè is not powerful enough to help you set matters straight among those believing in it then your god is either dead or never existed!


[/quote]

Hamzaay:
As a Muslim, I cannot talk sef because Christians are already banting themselves. No wonder Christians are always trying to convert Christians. As Sunday business open so make sure you donate 30% to your pastorprenuer as on moniker mentioned 😀

As a FORMER Muslim this is exactly how i think back then but today i know better it's not what people claim that makes them Muslims is it?
If not then you should know that there's a way to IDENTIFY the real Christians not just saying to yourself: "Christians are banting themselves" when you don't even know what it means to be a Christian!

For instance in Islam we were all bowing towards the black stone in Mecca throughout the world yet the deity inside the black stone failed woefully to help us settle our differences amicably despite our hypocritical greeting 'SALAM' which supposed to means 'PEACE'

If we're all believers in the same God (Allah) the quran supposed to be the supreme book with which all of us can settle our differences using the words of our supreme God, don't you think so?

But instead it's just to bow down towards that black stone that matters to the Allah the rest is not important even though Muslims are killing Muslims. The same applies to Judaists and this people claiming Christians that's why i began making research to figure out what is wrong until i met the real disciples of Christ whose line of thought are the same globally {John 17:22; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3} and they will never ever think of raising weapons against anyone talkless their own brothers in the faith as they're using the Bible to resolve all their disparities peacefully among themselves.

This is what the Bible says:


All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness. 2Timothy 3:16

The highlighted in blue is where the WISDOM is if the book you call the word of your Allah or Jesus or Jehovah or YAHWEH or Olódùmarè is not powerful enough to help you set matters straight among those believing in it then your god is either dead or never existed!

excanny:
Muslims today believe in a fiction created by the Abbasid Caliphate.

1. Mecca didn’t exist in the 7th century
(a). No archeological evidence.
(b). No historical evidence.
(c). Lack of drinkable water sources in Arabia.

2. Mecca (only mentioned once in the quran) wasn’t on any historical map until the year 900.

The quran talks about a fertile place, which can not be Mecca.
(a). A stream
(b). Fruits
(c). Olive trees
(d). Fields etc.

None of which Mecca had in the 7th, 8th, 9th 10th, and not until the late 20th centuries when Saudi Arabia started to have water desalination plants built.

3. Medina was an insignificant little place.

4. The term ‘Muhammad’ (Praised One) was first found on a Christian coin in the year 661 referring to Jesus, which had Christian symbols.

5. The term 'Muhammad' was used by Arab Christians for Jesus until the mid-8th century.

6. The Muhammad that Muslims believe in today was an invention of the Abbasid Caliphate in the late 8th century or early 9th century.

Muhammad is mentioned only four times in the quran.

The Muslim/Abbasid Muhammad in the quran is the last of the four (Surah 33:40), is an Abbasid interpolation, and the first three refer to Jesus.

7. The Dome of the Rock was not a Mosque; it was built by Abdul al-Malik as an anti-trinitarian Christian building.

Both Abdul al-Malik and his brother were anti-trinitarian Christians and used Christian symbols on their coins.

8. Abdul al-Malik sent a directive throughout his Kingdom saying that the term ‘Muhammad’ should refer to Jesus.

9. The only original parts of the Dome of the Rock are the inner ambulatories and the Muhammad’s written on them refer to Jesus (in fact the term Jesus is on one of them), and they are decorated with lots of grapes, a Christian symbol.

10. There were no Islamic Qurans in the 7th Century.

The proto-quran was in fact Christian lectionaries written in Aramaic and old Arabic.

This has led to many mistranslations in the much later Islamic/Abbasid quran.

Conclusion: What Muslims believe today is a fraudulent story started by the Abbasid Caliphate when they came into power in 750.

The Abbasid Caliphate bastardized the Arab Anti-trinitarian Christian lectionaries (combined with the mistranslations) to form their quran to suit their agenda.

Please where can these anti-trinitarian lectionaries be found today? I need to lay hands on them for a comparative study of the books with the quran to confirm your claims.

MaxInDHouse:


Jesus is the chosen servant among Jehovah's Witnesses as mentioned in the below verse:

“You are my WITNESSES,” declares Jehovah, “Yes, my SERVANT whom I have chosen, So that you may know and have faith in me And understand that I am the same One. Before me no God was formed, And after me there has been none...." Isaiah 43:10

All worshipers of the true God are His WITNESSES including Jesus His chosen one or Messiah! Revelations 1:5

Are you joking?

Where was Muslims mentioned before your quran was written?

The name Jesus means Jehovah is Salvation it can't be found before his birth nah what he's saying is exactly the same thing you claimed: he has come to fulfill the laws of the God of Israel!

There were mentioned many times but you won't understand it.
Where do you want me to show you? From the corrupted Bible that even translates name to English? Of what use are the name translations to English?

If your name is Isho in Aramaic why can't they leave it so in other languages? They will keep translating it till it becomes latinised then "English"!

Muslims today believe in a fiction created by the Abbasid Caliphate.

1. Mecca didn’t exist in the 7th century
(a). No archeological evidence.
(b). No historical evidence.
(c). Lack of drinkable water sources in Arabia.

2. Mecca (only mentioned once in the quran) wasn’t on any historical map until the year 900.

The quran talks about a fertile place, which can not be Mecca.
(a). A stream
(b). Fruits
(c). Olive trees
(d). Fields etc.

None of which Mecca had in the 7th, 8th, 9th 10th, and not until the late 20th centuries when Saudi Arabia started to have water desalination plants built.

3. Medina was an insignificant little place.

4. The term ‘Muhammad’ (Praised One) was first found on a Christian coin in the year 661 referring to Jesus, which had Christian symbols.

5. The term 'Muhammad' was used by Arab Christians for Jesus until the mid-8th century.

6. The Muhammad that Muslims believe in today was an invention of the Abbasid Caliphate in the late 8th century or early 9th century.

Muhammad is mentioned only four times in the quran.

The Muslim/Abbasid Muhammad in the quran is the last of the four (Surah 33:40), is an Abbasid interpolation, and the first three refer to Jesus.

7. The Dome of the Rock was not a Mosque; it was built by Abdul al-Malik as an anti-trinitarian Christian building.

Both Abdul al-Malik and his brother were anti-trinitarian Christians and used Christian symbols on their coins.

8. Abdul al-Malik sent a directive throughout his Kingdom saying that the term ‘Muhammad’ should refer to Jesus.

9. The only original parts of the Dome of the Rock are the inner ambulatories and the Muhammad’s written on them refer to Jesus (in fact the term Jesus is on one of them), and they are decorated with lots of grapes, a Christian symbol.

10. There were no Islamic Qurans in the 7th Century.

The proto-quran was in fact Christian lectionaries written in Aramaic and old Arabic.

This has led to many mistranslations in the much later Islamic/Abbasid quran.

Conclusion: What Muslims believe today is a fraudulent story started by the Abbasid Caliphate when they came into power in 750.

The Abbasid Caliphate bastardized the Arab Anti-trinitarian Christian lectionaries (combined with the mistranslations) to form their quran to suit their agenda.

TenQ:
My Question:
1. Is it TRUE that the quran was compiled/collected during the Lifetime of Mohammed? Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
Your Reesponse:

This seem to contradict
Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
Narrated Qatada:
Anas said, "The Qur'an was collected in the lifetime of the Prophet (ﷺ) by four (men), all of whom were from the Ansar: Ubai, Mu`adh bin Jabal, Abu Zaid and Zaid bin Thabit." I asked Anas, "Who is Abu Zaid?" He said, "One of my uncles."

Was the quran partly collected by these four men?
Dont forget that Mohammed himself recommended these four experts in the quran?



My Question:
2. If it was true that the quran was completely collected during the lifetime of your Prophet,
a. What happened to the quran of Muhammad that necessitated Abubakr to issue another instruction for collection of the quran to Zaid? Sahih al-Bukhari 4679
b. Why did Zaid not just copy the quran of Mohammed but rather choose to start his collection from the scratch?
Your Response:

If this was true, did Ubai, Mu`adh bin Jabal, Abu Zaid and Zaid bin Thabit record the collected quran on parchments, scapula, leaf-stalks of date palms and they stored the remaining to the the memories of men (who knew it by heart). I found with Khuza`ima two Verses of Surat-at-Tauba ?

Sahih al-Bukhari 4679
Narrated Zaid bin Thabit Al-Ansari:
who was one of those who used to write the Divine Revelation: Abu Bakr sent for me after the (heavy) casualties among the warriors (of the battle) of Yamama..... So I kept on arguing with him about it till Allah opened my bosom for that which He had opened the bosoms of Abu Bakr and `Umar. So I started locating Qur'anic material and collecting it from parchments, scapula, leaf-stalks of date palms and from the memories of men (who knew it by heart). I found with Khuza`ima two Verses of Surat-at-Tauba which I had not found with anybody else, (and they were):-- "Verily there has come to you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty He (Muhammad) is ardently anxious over you (to be rightly guided)" (9.128) The manuscript on which the Qur'an was collected, remained with Abu Bakr till Allah took him unto Him, and then with `Umar till Allah took him unto Him, and finally it remained with Hafsa, `Umar's daughter.



If the quran was collected at the time of Mohammed, where was it written: except the quran was never collected during the time of Mohammed

You did not answer:
Why did Zaid not just copy the quran of Mohammed but rather choose to start his collection from the scratch?

My third Question:
3. According to Zaid when he was compiling the quran of Abubakar, he found the last verse quran 9:128-129 with an Ansar.
a. If we assume that the quran of Abubakar was complete, how come that quran 33:23 was NOT found in the quran of Abubakar but with Khuza`ima bin Thabit Al-Ansari? Sahih al-Bukhari 4530


Your Response:

*I think I have shown you that the [highlight]quran was collected[/highlight] during the Lifetime of Mohammed in Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
*Then the quran was collected during the time of Abubakr
*Then the quran was collected collected again during the time of Uthman

Except the quran was not collected during thr time of Mohammed.
Dont forget that mohammed re-arranged or ordered the sequence of the Surah of the quran.
Recall that the Qur'an was not arranged in chapters and verses based on revelation and this arrangement was done by Mohammed himself.

This can only be done when the quran was written! Do you disagree with this?

My Question 4:
4. Is it true that even after the final collection of the quran by Uthman,
a. Umar said: "We do not find the Verses of the Rajam (stoning to death) in the Holy Book" ? Sahih al-Bukhari 6829
b. Where then is the verse on Rajam?
Your Response:

1. The verse of stoning and breastfeeding of adult males were eaten by a goat/sheep as reported by Aisha.
2. The verse on Breastfeeding was not abrogated. It was reduced from ten times breastfeeding to five
Neither the 10 or 5 exist in the quran of today.
3. Mohammed actually gave judgement of stoning in the hadiths followed by the Sahabas
*Jami` at-Tirmidhi 1435 (A woman from Juhainah)
*Bulugh al-Maram 553 (the Ghamidi woman)
*Sahih al-Bukhari 2314, 2315
*Sunan Ibn Majah 2555
*Musnad Ahmad 978 Sharahah (Ali)
*Sahih Muslim 1672c
*Musnad Ahmad 1317

Do you need more evidence of stoning by Mohammed and the Sahabas?

When a football match is going on and commentary is being made from the beginning is the commentator from the beginning not making comments about the match despite the match not yet completed?
You must have a severely warped mine.

Almighty God has spoken to man since the creation of man and he completed all that was needed to know by man for his existence on Earth in the quran how many years after man came to earth.

How many years after creation of the heavens and the worlds was mankind created? Is this part of the information revealed to mankind or not? The revelations should have just started after man was created without any reference to the creation part or shouldn't it?

Did slight changes occur with Jesus permitting some things forbidden to Israelites to them? Did Muhammad pbuh have revelations that were later replaced with better? A clear example Jesus on the first biblical miracle of turning water into wine not say there were better things to come and also say the people couldn't bare some things? In the time of Muhammad pbuh alcohol was initially allowed then a stopping of those who had consumed same from attending congregation prayers then totally forbidden.

When these things were written were the recorders writing and memorizing other than the recitation; the quran? Were these not written in small bits and collections from bone pieces, animal skin, tree barks etc.?

Was there a collection of the bones, skin, tree barks etc. in one place?

Show me where this was.

Of course it's obvious that whatever the four men independent of each other leatnt they learnt and memorized exceptionally well.

Say in graduate school you do well all through and always had a cgpa of around 4.5 on the average. If you had a cgpa of 5.0 in the 1st year, 4.47 in the second, 4.98 in the 3rd and 4.88 in the 4th will you be said to have not been an exceptional student throughout your college years?
Did you or did not have an average of 4.83 at the end?

You rely so much on the hadith and I ask which came first of the two?

Which was divinely revealed?

Didn't Zaid not copy of what was revealed? He ensured he found documented evidence hence the search for the last verse of Surah Tawbah.

[size=18pt]A declaration of immunity from God and His Messenger to the polytheists with whom you had made a treaty[/size]

Tenq persistently lies that I am a friend when I am not. We disagree on nairaland.com which is the only avenue of address. How can we be friends?

[size=14pt]Tenq the Polytheist through a Trinitarian belief is of those Allah has declared immunity from[/size].


Nothing happened to the quran revealed to the prophet which was fully memorized by many and was written in parts in several seperate writing materials. The death of many of those who had it fully memorized necessitated the collation into a single book and duplication for distribution in later times ti ensure uniformity.

As unanimously reported Abu Bakr told Zayd not to rely on his memory ever and to demand two witnesses with written copies for each verse as evidence.

And (it is) a Qur’an which We have divided (into parts), in order that you might recite it to men at intervals. And We have revealed it by stages”. Q17:106.

“And those who disbelieved say: “Why is the Qur’an not revealed unto him all at once?” Thus (it is sent down in parts), that We may strengthen your heart thereby. And We have revealed it unto you gradually, in stages” Q25:32.

Angel Jibril used to present the Qur’an to the Prophet (May the peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) during the month of Ramadan once every year. However, he presented it to him twice in the last month of Ramadan of his life.  

Jibril used to descend on prophet Muhammad pbuh and say to him: place so and so verse in so and so place, as narrated by Ahmad.

The verse on breast feeding adult males was never part of the quran otherwise both it and the verse abrogating it will be found in the quran. The exception in just the case of Salim derives solely from hadith.

Breastfeeding is only for babies/infants. It is tiring on a mother breast feeding a baby not to imagine a grown man. Be realistic and deliberately stop the delusion you are in and if it's drugs and alcohol please stop these.

Dicoomoba:



As for you you are just a stupid human with shallow brain , of course ask yourself who’s worthy of worshiping God alone without attaché anything with him , mh brother. Let’s assume bible is of God how come it’s tampered, corrupted and edited that can not be from God but as for quran THE REAL WORD OF ALLAH WILL NEVER CONTRADICTS LIKE YOUR FAKE BIBLE TALKLESS OF ERROR AT ALL MY BROTHER you can proclaim Saadat today and get salvation in order. To stop worshiping ungodly connections …. Did you know YESHUA IS not a Christian then what he’s .. a Muslim what makes one. Muslim belive in ones of God without any attachment

Answer my fuvkin question you retarded degenerate.

I have told you how I operate, you are still trying to involve same Jesus that your useless mohammed is waiting in hell to come and save him.

Didn't your prophet kill his adopted son to steal his wife?

Didn't the paedophile drag Aisha at 6 years playing with her doll to rape?

Didn't he instruct you vagabonds to marry 4 wives, whereas he snatched 11 women from their owners?

Didn't he meet his death by a Jewish woman who gave him rat poison in lamb meat, he died like a bingo eating shit in the dustbin?

Didn't pigs exhume his petrifying carcasses and ate all?

Out of anger, didn't Aisha's father wipe out the idiots family leaving only the grandsons Hussein and hassan whose descendants rule Jordan today?

Did any of his biological sons get to adulthood?
Can we say he was cursed too?

many weird things about the worthless idiotic prophet you follow,


no wonder you follow an slowpoke prophet Mohammed that can best be described as:

1. Villain
2. Scallywag
3. Cad
4. Knave
5. Blackguard
6. Rapscallion
7. Renegade
8. Mischief-maker
9. Malefactor
10. Roque
11. Swindler
12. Charlatan
13. Charlatan
14. Fraudster
15. Cheat
16. Con artist
17. Trickster
18. Mountebank
19. Schemer
20. Scammer
21. Grifter
22. Deceiver
23. Cheat
24. Fraud
25. Impostor
26. Faker
27. Pretender
28. Deceitful
29. Unscrupulous
30. Dishonest
31. Untrustworthy
32. Corrupt
33. Crooked
34. Shady
35. Devious
36. Sneaky
37. Cunning
38. Crafty
39. Underhanded
40. Sly
41. Dodgy
42. Sleazy
43. Shifty
44. Slippery
45. Slick
46. Wily
47. Astute
48. Guileful
49. Machiavellian
50. Treacherous
51. Perfidious
52. Betrayer
53. Backstabber
54. Traitor
55. Double-dealer
56. Turncoat
57. Judas
58. Sellout
59. Miscreant
60. Cad
61. Ruffian
62. Thug
63. Bully
64. Bandit
65. Gangster
66. Mobster
67. Lawbreaker
68. Criminal
69. Felon
70. Outlaw
71. Desperado
72. Highwayman
73. Brigand
74. Pirate
75. Marauder
76. Plunderer
77. Brigand
78. Hooligan
79. Vandal
80. Terrorist
81. Anarchist
82. Insurgent
83. Rebel
84. Revolutionary
85. Dissident
86. Agitator
87. Provocateur
88. Troublemaker
89. Aggressor
90. Antagonist
91. Provoker
92. Adversary
93. Opponent
94. Foe
95. Enemy
96. Nemesis
97. Foeman
98. Adversary
99. Frenemy
100. Oppressor

My Question:
1. Is it TRUE that the quran was compiled/collected during the Lifetime of Mohammed? Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
Your Reesponse:

Explore2xmore:

The quran was revealed over 23 years with the last verse revealed not long before the death of Prophet Muhammad pbuh.

At different times along with revelation some of these verses were written in parts. As a book the [highlight]quran was not fully written and compiled during the lifetime of prophet Muhammad.[/highlight] How many people could read at this time?

This seem to contradict
Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
Narrated Qatada:
Anas said, "The Qur'an was collected in the lifetime of the Prophet (ﷺ) by four (men), all of whom were from the Ansar: Ubai, Mu`adh bin Jabal, Abu Zaid and Zaid bin Thabit." I asked Anas, "Who is Abu Zaid?" He said, "One of my uncles."

Was the quran partly collected by these four men?
Dont forget that Mohammed himself recommended these four experts in the quran?



My Question:
2. If it was true that the quran was completely collected during the lifetime of your Prophet,
a. What happened to the quran of Muhammad that necessitated Abubakr to issue another instruction for collection of the quran to Zaid? Sahih al-Bukhari 4679
b. Why did Zaid not just copy the quran of Mohammed but rather choose to start his collection from the scratch?
Your Response:

Explore2xmore:

2. The quran fully written as 1 Mushaf was not done in the lifetime of the prophet

If this was true, did Ubai, Mu`adh bin Jabal, Abu Zaid and Zaid bin Thabit record the collected quran on parchments, scapula, leaf-stalks of date palms and they stored the remaining to the the memories of men (who knew it by heart). I found with Khuza`ima two Verses of Surat-at-Tauba ?

Sahih al-Bukhari 4679
Narrated Zaid bin Thabit Al-Ansari:
who was one of those who used to write the Divine Revelation: Abu Bakr sent for me after the (heavy) casualties among the warriors (of the battle) of Yamama..... So I kept on arguing with him about it till Allah opened my bosom for that which He had opened the bosoms of Abu Bakr and `Umar. So I started locating Qur'anic material and collecting it from parchments, scapula, leaf-stalks of date palms and from the memories of men (who knew it by heart). I found with Khuza`ima two Verses of Surat-at-Tauba which I had not found with anybody else, (and they were):-- "Verily there has come to you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty He (Muhammad) is ardently anxious over you (to be rightly guided)" (9.128) The manuscript on which the Qur'an was collected, remained with Abu Bakr till Allah took him unto Him, and then with `Umar till Allah took him unto Him, and finally it remained with Hafsa, `Umar's daughter.



If the quran was collected at the time of Mohammed, where was it written: except the quran was never collected during the time of Mohammed

You did not answer:
Why did Zaid not just copy the quran of Mohammed but rather choose to start his collection from the scratch?

My third Question:
3. According to Zaid when he was compiling the quran of Abubakar, he found the last verse quran 9:128-129 with an Ansar.
a. If we assume that the quran of Abubakar was complete, how come that quran 33:23 was NOT found in the quran of Abubakar but with Khuza`ima bin Thabit Al-Ansari? Sahih al-Bukhari 4530


Your Response:

Explore2xmore:

3 As verses were written in line with revelation and not collected as a book despite quite a number haven memorised it was important to get both written verses as well as oral recall to ensure authenticity.

*I think I have shown you that the [highlight]quran was collected[/highlight] during the Lifetime of Mohammed in Sahih al-Bukhari 3810
*Then the quran was collected during the time of Abubakr
*Then the quran was collected collected again during the time of Uthman

Except the quran was not collected during thr time of Mohammed.
Dont forget that mohammed re-arranged or ordered the sequence of the Surah of the quran.
Recall that the Qur'an was not arranged in chapters and verses based on revelation and this arrangement was done by Mohammed himself.

This can only be done when the quran was written! Do you disagree with this?

My Question 4:
4. Is it true that even after the final collection of the quran by Uthman,
a. Umar said: "We do not find the Verses of the Rajam (stoning to death) in the Holy Book" ? Sahih al-Bukhari 6829
b. Where then is the verse on Rajam?
Your Response:

Explore2xmore:

4. The verse on stoning to death is said to have been abrogated from the quran due to specific circumstances or divine wisdom. The view maintained is that its practice is based on authentic Hadiths and established legal principles within Islamic jurisprudence.

However some scholars question the authenticity of the Hadiths supporting stoning to death and argue that without a clear Quranic mandate, such punishments should not be implemented. They advocate for a more lenient interpretation of Islamic law that prioritizes mercy and justice over harsh penalties.

Mention 3 persons and on which this was pronounced by Prophet Muhammad.

1. The verse of stoning and breastfeeding of adult males were eaten by a goat/sheep as reported by Aisha.
2. The verse on Breastfeeding was not abrogated. It was reduced from ten times breastfeeding to five
Neither the 10 or 5 exist in the quran of today.
3. Mohammed actually gave judgement of stoning in the hadiths followed by the Sahabas
*Jami` at-Tirmidhi 1435 (A woman from Juhainah)
*Bulugh al-Maram 553 (the Ghamidi woman)
*Sahih al-Bukhari 2314, 2315
*Sunan Ibn Majah 2555
*Musnad Ahmad 978 Sharahah (Ali)
*Sahih Muslim 1672c
*Musnad Ahmad 1317

Do you need more evidence of stoning by Mohammed and the Sahabas?

AbuTwins:


New testament abi

1CO 11:3-10
A woman is to keep her head covered while praying or prophesying.

1CO 14:34-35
Women are to be silent in church. If they have any questions, they are to ask their husbands at home. It is a shame for women to speak in church.

1TI 2:9, 1PE 3:3
Women should not braid their hair, or wear gold or pearls or costly attire.

1TI 2:11-12
Women are to learn in silence (from men) in all submissiveness.

1TI 2:12
Women are not permitted to teach or have authority over men.

OGA QUOTE WHERE MEN WERE COMMANDED TO BEAT THEIR WIVES LIKE YOUR quran SAYS

AbuTwins:

The laws are to be followed by Muslims till death! The Qur'an mentioned Muslims!
Where was Jesus mentioned in the Old Testament and how did he fulfil any law therein?

Jesus is the chosen servant among Jehovah's Witnesses as mentioned in the below verse:

“You are my WITNESSES,” declares Jehovah, “Yes, my SERVANT whom I have chosen, So that you may know and have faith in me And understand that I am the same One. Before me no God was formed, And after me there has been none...." Isaiah 43:10

All worshipers of the true God are His WITNESSES including Jesus His chosen one or Messiah! Revelations 1:5

Are you joking?

Where was Muslims mentioned before your quran was written?

The name Jesus means Jehovah is Salvation it can't be found before his birth nah what he's saying is exactly the same thing you claimed: he has come to fulfill the laws of the God of Israel!

AbuTwins:


You don't need to separate the old testament from the New as Jesus said in Mathew 5:17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

So in essence he came to fulfil the old testament laws from his father! Or are you saying the New Testament corrected the errors of God in the old testament? It is the same God of the Old testament that is the same God of the New Testament or has He changed?

I copied this one from someone here.

1) Capital Punishment Crimes:

Kill People Who Don’t Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

Death for Cursing Parents
1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

Death for Adultery
If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

Death for Fornication
A priest’s daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 NAB)

Death to Followers of Other Religions
Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

Kill Nonbelievers
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

Kill False Prophets
If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, “You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord.” When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. “The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him.” (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night
But if this charge is true (that she wasn’t a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father’s house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB)

Kill Followers of Other Religions.
1) If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)

2) Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 NLT)

Death for Blasphemy
One day a man who had an Israelite mother and an Egyptian father got into a fight with one of the Israelite men. During the fight, this son of an Israelite woman blasphemed the LORD’s name. So the man was brought to Moses for judgment. His mother’s name was Shelomith. She was the daughter of Dibri of the tribe of Dan. They put the man in custody until the LORD’s will in the matter should become clear. Then the LORD said to Moses, “Take the blasphemer outside the camp, and tell all those who heard him to lay their hands on his head. Then let the entire community stone him to death. Say to the people of Israel: Those who blaspheme God will suffer the consequences of their guilt and be punished. Anyone who blasphemes the LORD’s name must be stoned to death by the whole community of Israel. Any Israelite or foreigner among you who blasphemes the LORD’s name will surely die. (Leviticus 24:10-16 NLT)

Kill False Prophets
1) Suppose there are prophets among you, or those who have dreams about the future, and they promise you signs or miracles, and the predicted signs or miracles take place. If the prophets then say, ‘Come, let us worship the gods of foreign nations,’ do not listen to them. The LORD your God is testing you to see if you love him with all your heart and soul. Serve only the LORD your God and fear him alone. Obey his commands, listen to his voice, and cling to him. The false prophets or dreamers who try to lead you astray must be put to death, for they encourage rebellion against the LORD your God, who brought you out of slavery in the land of Egypt. Since they try to keep you from following the LORD your God, you must execute them to remove the evil from among you. (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NLT)

2) But any prophet who claims to give a message from another god or who falsely claims to speak for me must die.’ You may wonder, ‘How will we know whether the prophecy is from the LORD or not?’ If the prophet predicts something in the LORD’s name and it does not happen, the LORD did not give the message. That prophet has spoken on his own and need not be feared. (Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NLT)

Infidels and Gays Should Die
So God let them go ahead and do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. Instead of believing what they knew was the truth about God, they deliberately chose to believe lies. So they worshiped the things God made but not the Creator himself, who is to be praised forever. Amen. That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. And the men, instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved. When they refused to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their evil minds and let them do things that should never be done. Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, fighting, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They are forever inventing new ways of sinning and are disobedient to their parents. They refuse to understand, break their promises, and are heartless and unforgiving. They are fully aware of God’s death penalty for those who do these things, yet they go right ahead and do them anyway. And, worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too. (Romans 1:24-32 NLT)

Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle
For the LORD had said to Moses, ‘Exempt the tribe of Levi from the census; do not include them when you count the rest of the Israelites. You must put the Levites in charge of the Tabernacle of the Covenant, along with its furnishings and equipment. They must carry the Tabernacle and its equipment as you travel, and they must care for it and camp around it. Whenever the Tabernacle is moved, the Levites will take it down and set it up again. Anyone else who goes too near the Tabernacle will be executed.’ (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT)

Kill People for Working on the Sabbath
The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: ‘Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. I repeat: Because the LORD considers it a holy day, anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death.’ (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)

What do you think about all these?

Just like I expected, I actually told you not to quote Old Testament passages, as the practices there ONLY APPLIES to the JEWS, they DO NOT APPLY to we CHRISTIANS because we are followers of CHRIST in the dispensation of GRACE. But you went ahead and dug up Old Testament passages, something that Jesus Christ came down to earth to change!

You can ONLY use these passages against the JEWS, because they are still observing most of those passages under Mosaic Laws.

I'm sure you know that the Laws of Moses and the teachings of Jesus are not the same, right?

For instance, in the book of MATTHEW 5:21-24, Jesus said:

“You have heard that it was said to the people in the PAST, ‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable to judgment.’ But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire. So if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there before the altar and go. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift".

Under the laws of Moses, the Bible says in the book of EXODUS 21:24-25:

"EYE FOR EYE, TOOTH FOR TOOTH, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise."

In the same light under Mosaic laws, the Bible in the book of LEVITICUS 24:17- 21 says:

“Whoever takes a human life shall surely be put to death. Whoever takes an animal's life shall make it good, life for life. If anyone injures his neighbor, as he has done it shall be done to him, fracture for fracture, EYE FOR EYE, TOOTH FOR TOOTH; whatever injury he has given a person shall be given to him."

The above passages are all in the Old Testament, and they used to be the general practice under Mosaic laws.

However, since Jesus Christ came in the New Testament, he brought a different teaching which is now the position of Christians, we are Christians because we are FOLLOWERS OF JESUS CHRIST and not MOSES, we acknowledge the Prophets in the past, but their teachings and Laws DO NOT apply to CHRISTIANS, as Jesus Christ has changed all that, Jesus taught about forgiveness and love.

Let me quote a few of the New Testament teachings of Jesus Christ.

LUKE 6:27-28:
"But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you".

1 PETER 3:9:
"Do not repay evil for evil or reviling for reviling, but on the contrary, bless, for to this you were called, that you may obtain a blessing."

ROMANS 12:14, 17-19:

"Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse . . . Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everyone. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” says the Lord.

Also, in the book of ACTS 17:30, the Bible says:

“God overlooked people’s ignorance about these things in the PAST, but now he commands everyone everywhere to repent of their sins and turn to him".

The teachings of Christ are those of love, forgiveness, peace, tolerance, kindness e.t.c.

The reason why we are CHRISTIANS and not JEWS is that Jesus Christ came to fulfil the Mosaic laws, all those passages you quoted were operational during the days of Moses, David, Jacob, e.t.c, and they first applied to the children of Israel in their journey to the promised land.

Jesus Christ came and made the difference!!

Islamic teachings are just like Mosaic Laws, violence is all you lots know, that is why the JEWS too are as violent as you Muslims, just that the Mosaic laws did not permit the JEWS to kill unbelievers, nor perform any form of JIHAD, unlike the quran!!

This is the reason why the CHRISTIANS are peaceful and non-violent towards unbelievers, it is the reason why you hardly see any CHRISTIAN fighting for YAHWEH, Jesus taught us to leave vengeance for him..

TenQ:

No sir.
Can anyone enter paradise against the will of God?

I said everyone enters paradise only by the will of God!

This is what Jesus meant
A. Who are those outside in Mark 4:10-12?

He was talking to th disciples. So those outside are not the disciples but others!

Can you show me if those on the outside are NOT the spiritually Blind?

They may be spiritually blind or not.

B. Jesus was speaking of the Place of Elevation in paradise, not those who will enter paradise in Matthew 20:23

The context doesn't say this.

Those who enter paradise are those who have DONE the WILL of the Father with Respect of Entering Paradise according to
John 3:14-15
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes (in God's Solution) may have eternal life in him.”
[/i]This is the WILL of the Father!

Following the LAW does not save BUT following the prescription of the Father in Heaven for entering Paradise does save.

This is false. Jesus told the rich ruler to obey the commandments, sell his properties, distribute it and follow him. And this is what will grant him eternal life. And if it is to believe in Jesus, that is part of the article of faith in Islam i.e. to believe in all Prophets from Adam to Muhammad. He who does not believe in Jesus or any other Prophet is not a Muslim.

Show me just one place where Moses asked the Jews to Follow him.

Is it untrue that Jesus said:
[i]John 14:6
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Tell me if any human being in history said this about himself

You know the answer. Moses and Noah practically saved their people in real time. They don't need to say it. Those who didn't follow Noah to the ark perished. Those who were against Moses when crossing the red sea lost. Moses and Noah were the link between the people and God. This is the same as what Jesus said.

You guys will just be inputting trinity everywhere in the Bible where Trinity does not exist all. Jesus was 100% human and depended t on God just as Arius the Christian Priest from Alexandria claimed in the 4th Century!

Can anyone who copies Mohammed enter paradise?
The answer is NO!

This is ignorance from you. Stop saying what you don't know.

I quoted this earlier
Allah, may He be glorified and exalted, says in His holy Book (interpretation of the meaning):
He who obeys the Messenger (Muhammad SAW), has indeed obeyed Allah, but he who turns away, then we have not sent you (O Muhammad SAW) as a watcher over them. Qur'an 4:80

Allah, may He be glorified and exalted, says in His holy Book (interpretation of the meaning):
“And whoso obeys Allah and the Messenger (Muhammad (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him)), then they will be with those on whom Allah has bestowed His Grace, of the Prophets, the Siddiqoon (those followers of the Prophets who were first and foremost to believe in them, like Abu Bakr As-Siddeeq), the martyrs, and the righteous. And how excellent these companions are!” [an-Nisa’ 4:69].

According to Allah, is this a safe person to follow?
quran 46:9
Say, "I am not something original among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow that which is revealed to me, and I am not but a clear warner."

Jesus too said something similar that shows he is not omniscient as you claim!
Matthew 24:36
But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Mark 13:32
No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Jesus had no authority of himself
Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Matthew 28:18

I can do nothing by Myself; I judge only as I hear. And My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. John 5:30

So Muhammad does not know anything in Islam till it's revealed to him. We believed same as Jesus.

Most contemporary Muslims are more righteous than Mohammed: this can easily be proved!

On a serious note:
Please compare between quran 46:9 and John 14:6 and think of who you should follow

Righteousness is subjective.
Surfing through the old testament i can say your changed and became merciful and what have not! I can say Jesus was more peaceful than his father. There can be many talking points so don't divert.

I think I have compared it for you with adequate verses from your Bible!
Jesus is human and not God!

And there's no Trinity anywhere in the Bible.
God is only one!

AbuTwins:

Everyone enters Paradise by the will of Allah. This is what Jesus may have meant when he said these statements:

A. As soon as Jesus was alone with the Twelve and those around Him, they asked Him about the parable. He replied, “The mystery of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to those on the outside everything is expressed in parables. so that, ‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven. Mark 4:10-12

B. “You will indeed drink My cup,” Jesus said. “But to sit at My right or left is not Mine to grant. These seats belong to those for whom My Father has prepared them. Matthew 20:23

No sir.
Can anyone enter paradise against the will of God?

This is what Jesus meant
A. Who are those outside in Mark 4:10-12?
Can you show me if those on the outside are NOT the spiritually Blind?
B. Jesus was speaking of the Place of Elevation in paradise, not those who will enter paradise in Matthew 20:23

Those who enter paradise are those who have DONE the WILL of the Father with Respect of Entering Paradise according to
John 3:14-15
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes (in God's Solution) may have eternal life in him.”

This is the WILL of the Father!

Following the LAW does not save BUT following the prescription of the Father in Heaven for entering Paradise does save.

AbuTwins:

No! Jesus didn't ask them to follow Allah! Jesus never even spoke Greek that the new testament was written in! He spoke Aramaic!
So Jesus told him to follow him the same way our Prophet told us to follow him.

Same way Moses told his people to follow him!
Same way Noah's people told his people to follow him!

That is the way of the Prophets!
Allah says what means: He who obeys the Messenger (Muhammad SAW), has indeed obeyed Allah, but he who turns away, then we have not sent you (O Muhammad SAW) as a watcher over them.

Jesus was right to have said his people of Israelites should follow him!
But did he ever say he was God or that they should worship him or God is trinity?

Show me just one place where Moses asked the Jews to Follow him.

Is it untrue that Jesus said:
John 14:6
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Tell me if any human being in history said this about himself

Can anyone who copies Mohammed enter paradise?
The answer is NO!

According to Allah, is this a safe person to follow?
quran 46:9
Say, "I am not something original among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow that which is revealed to me, and I am not but a clear warner."

Most contemporary Muslims are more righteous than Mohammed: this can easily be proved!





On a serious note:
Please compare between quran 46:9 and John 14:6 and think of who you should follow