@Mckren
I totally agree with you on "Presidential Order" sometimes am pissed off by comments on this forum, some posters often argued with strains on issues they know next to nothing.

The presidential system has a very powerful executive presidency, the president is the commander in chief of all the the security forces, in this sysyem one of the sources of law is a 'presidential proclamation or pronouncement' and for that matter the president can promote any officer in all the military and para-military forces by mere pronouncement. A General can promote any officer in his command by mere pronouncement how much more the C-in C

Again, Is Ribadu a political hunt dog? No I disagree,  he may have carried out his duty with much zeal and youthful excuberance but to say he's only against Obj enemies is insincerity, except somebody can convince me that Alams, Ibori, Dariye, Fayose,Lucky and host of others did not went away with public fund.

It is pathetic that the post-independence generation of Nigerian leaders have brought collateral damage to this nation, but I'am saddened that the mindset of majority of people in my generation is by far below average. I wonder what the future holds for Nigeria.

I also agree with a poster that say Yar Adua does not have "Dignity" I think he lack Character, Fortitude, Wisdom and Discreation.

God Save NIGERIA !

@poster,
If your current church did not make any positive impact in your life, you may consider changing church to where you can hear the undiluted living word of God. The word of God is Life to those who find it, and whatever that has life does not remain stagnant. It's obvious you re experiencing stagnation, it is either you re not connected to the source of life (GOD) or you re in a merchandise church.

There is no way you can be in Christ and life still remain boring for you, each day takes you into deeper experience and higher life in Jesus Christ.  John 15: 1-2, 5 " I AM the true vine and my Father is the husbandman. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit (YOU BEAR FRUIT) he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit (YOU BEAR MORE FRUIT). I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit (YOU BEAR MUCH FRUIT): for without me  ye can do nothing"

I think you need to worry if you re no longer derives joy in going to  church, Psalm 92:13-14 "Those that be planted in the house of the Lord shall flourish in the court of our God. They shall still bring forth fruit in old age, they shall be fat and flourishing" Psalm 69:9 " For the zeal of thine house has eaten me up, " I was glad when they said unto me let us go to the house of the Lord,

Please beware of those that said you don't need to go to church, funny enough they agreed that the bible says "we should not forsake the assembly of the brethren" if that's the case then what is church? Is church not assembly of the brethren?

Remember that church is a serious business of the kingdom of God, God invested His only son to win the world. just like any earthly investment or business. You ve been saved to serve, rather than been boring why can't you do something godly to address the problem that others like you are  experiencing in the church, isn't that an opportunity to be useful and make church what its suppose to be.

Church like every human organization employs and deploys physical and spiritual resourses to make profit for the kingdom of God (not for Rev/Pastors). God is not interested in an unprofitable servant/son. The early you re fully occupy for God the better it would be for you.

Above all, you will be judged for what you ve done with your life and you can not be excused on acount of any pastor or even your parent or church. Remember, you ve been saved to serve, and you can also be an agent of change that the church need today.

[b]@ all,

The idea of US military base in Nigeria is certainly a topic that will generate a lot of controversy for many reasons than one.
1. Many Nigerians are oblivion of issues of International politics or strategic security issues
2. Foreign policy issues is elitist in nature meaning that the rationale behind a foreign policy decision may be very strange to the ordinary man on the street, and most often than not do not enjoy the popular support of majority of the citizens
3. Again, Foreign policy issues is always shrouded in secrecy because it is herculean task for any govt to provide acceptable explanation to the public without jeopardising votes in the next election
4 . Nigeria is predominantly xtian & Islam which means American base may not court the favour of a segment of the society giving their exploits in muslim countries etc

I can go on and on siting many more reasons why a topic like this will always generate controversy

NOW LET USE LOGIC  HERE

FIVE REASONS TO REJECT US BASE:

1. Strategic: Can pose a security treat in the long run, especially if the two nations are traditional rivals or envious of each other
2. Can lead to interverence in the affairs of the host nation, especially if the in-coming president did not like the idea, the foreign troops may ensure emergence of president that will favours their cause
3. The host president may become a stoogy in the face of the most sophisticated army in the world
4. Intrusion of foreign culture can cause a sociological disharmony
5. The host country may suffer in silence as the foreign troops may become a burden rather than a blessing etc

FIVE REASONS TO ACCEPT US BASE:

1. Nigeria need US to secure a UN permanent seat at the security council, US is currently supporting Egpty, Nigeria can not afford it, Egpty holding that position will benefit Arabs more than Africa. Nigeria is the only hope of Africal in this millenium ( A loss to Egpty or South Africa will be a monumental loss)
2, US is the only surviving super power and can single handedly brings prosperity or poverty to any country, every nation that court with US get richer at their expense (Nigeria & US are not equal, so no need for any security palaba)
3. US can denied Nigeria a permanent seat at the UN, even if all the four others vote for Nigeria ( it has done it b4 to Butrous Ghali when he wanted to go for second term)
4. For strategic security in the Niger Delta, US base is not out of place
5. National Survival, you cannot be enemy of the US and survive in this more or less unipolar world etc

In International politics, there is no honour, no loyalty, no friends, the only permanet thing is "INTEREST" Every nation where US has its military base have tendencies to prosper and buoyant economy except a foolish country will host the US and still be poor.
Every nation is like a prostitute in the international system, with  visionary leaders that knows how to balance and re-align interests a country can record monument success in little time like the South Koreas (with about 100,000 US troops) You can host the US today, get the UN Security Council seat, get better economic packages from US to build your economy, benefit from their expertise, climb on the shoulder and move on, the truth is US will not forever remain a Super Power, empire rises and falls. Tomorrow you can pass a law not to allow foreign troops on your land but you would ve been better off by then.

As I said earlier, this kind of wisdom is rare among Nigerian leaders, because the re not sincere and they come to power to exploits their poor masses. It will take a wise nation to benefit from US . America  is a generous cowboy, if you play soft and cool headed with her, you can climb thru her to stardom and if you re foolish, you can dare her and bring collateral damage to yourself and your people like Saddam.[/b]

@Skyblue & others,

A glance at your posts in this section reveals your analytical lacuna, infact your argument is lacking in emperical substance and defy logic. In short it brings to mind what we refers to in political studies as "bolehole theory". A scientific analysis of socio-economic and political phenomenon presuppose OBJECTIVITY, which means you keep your biases, personal indiosyncracies at bay- otherwise you will be no different from the everyday market woman analysis of political events. Why i do not want to query your disciplinary background but I would rather you not maintaining an authoritative stance on issues that you know next to nothing. It is obvious you re oblivion of the nature of Engineering projects neither are you grounded in dynamics of politics. I even doubt if you know the kind of powers that an executive presidency can exercise,

For your information, in the presidential system of govt that we practice,
(a) The president has wide discreationary powers- the implication is he can use his judgment on many issues, this raises the issues of if he has a sound judgment or not (discreational powers is difficult to prove in a court of law even though there re gazzet in exercise of such powers- this power is one of the limitation of the rule of law, however , it is for smooth administration & emergencies & for purpose of removing bottle necks that stiffle administrative efficiency, i.e waiver of due process in payment for contractors)
(b) Govt policies are immune against litigation- the implication is that you can not challenge govt policy and win in a court of law- reason- it is a political solution to public problems which is derived from the popular mandate from the electorate NIPP is one of such policy.
(c) The president mandate is equal & superior to the National Assembly- He/she is generally elected from every part of the country in a general election- the implication is that the whole country is his constituency whereas senators & reps represents their variuos constituencies-the meaning of this is that he (president) will always have his ways with regards to policy issues.
(d) Nigeria practices Anglo-American Jurispudence as against Continental European System- that is, an acused is presumed "INNOCENT" until otherwise proven by a court of competent jusrisdiction, whereas in some Europen state, an acused is guity until otherwise, hence some thread sayin OBJ is guity underscores high level of ignorance or hypocrisy or both.

I will contineu later.

@ halavoke

how did you establish OBJ's guiltiness? Is it by mere allegation? or by what? Comon sense is scarce on nairaland no be small.

This is an interesting thread, but what amazed me is the fact that some nairalanders are not interested in what Obj has to say but rather tried with much strain to assert that OBJ is guilty as charged. I sincerely believe that no one is above the law and no matter who is involved the law should take its course, however am always dismayed that in Nigeria, there is no difference btw allegation and being guilty, once you re alleged of wrong doin, it is the same as guilty in Nigeria.

Sometimes ago, i posted Special Report by Vangaurd and Guardian on the ongoing power sector probe on how the committee ask frivolous questions not relevant to discovering the truth, arriving project sites by 7:15pm in the night and leaving by 8pm, how on many occasions, it take persuation to get the honourable off their jeeps to inspect the sites. Nigeria is a complicated country, some honourable have  become millionairs just because of this probe, liitle wonder legislators are fighting to be a member of one probe panel or the other, i laughed yesterday when i see another probe panel probing the capital market, and i said to myself that very soon we will have panel that will probe dressing on the campuses.

The truth is if it is easy to construct a power station in a giffy, why has successive govt not invested in it in 20yrs? It is easy to condemn OBJ, funny enough most pple read about  allegation against him on the newspapers, but the first attempt by OBJ to defend himself is seen as a cover up, he's  guilty as charge, the question is if u don't believe OBJ, then why do you believe all the other unsubtantiated reports, well that's Nigerian factor.

The man has his faults but to be sincere, OBJ has done his best for Nigeria, again except we comprehend the level of decay in the system we may not be able to appreciate what he has done.

One thing i will remeber OBJ for is that he used some of the best brains to move Nigeria out of the wood irrespective of their ethnic backgrounds from debt relief and re-payment to sanitizing the stock market and bank consolidation, from heavily indebted nation to $45billion reserve ($58b), from 400 hundred thousand Nitel land lines to 60million GSM subscribers, from  a pariah state to a member of civilized nation, from less than 1% growth rate to 5% growth to   mention a few. Anybody can disagree with these, yes you ve the right to disagree, but time will tell if actually OBJ is as bad as he has been portrayed. In the meantime i join baba to say "I pity Nigeria"

Hi All,

Am 1st October.

@nonny2, guess we re two now, cheers!

@FMK,

As you can see, am not the writer of this report. This is a SPECIAL REPORT of the Vanguard Newspaper covering the ongoing power probe. I decided to post this report because of various frivolous allegations and disputations between the probing legislators and some of the contractors that leave most of us confused and perpelexed.

Though its long but I think its worth the information. thanks

Reps power probe: Serious business or damaging ego trip?

Written by Hector Igbikiowubo
Saturday, 12 April 2008

THE ongoing power sector probe embarked upon by the House of Representatives Committee on Power continues to unfold at a giddying pace which has left most keen observers lost in transit due largely to the theatrics that has characterised the whole process. This report reviews the committee's inspection of some power projects
NOT only has the Godwin Elumelu led committee disputed figures put forward by the Central Bank of Nigeria, it has been observed that the ongoing tour and inspection of some power project sites embarked upon by the Committee is devoid of any empirically verifiable approach. The nature and manner of questions asked and the refusal of the committee to inspect procured power accessories during these visits indicates a negative mind-set.

Electtricity generation, Can NIPP deliver?
Also, contractors, NIPP representatives and the government contracted consultant are subjected to the worst kind of heckling imaginable by the committee and allegations of demand for bribe levelled against the legislators continues to mount. Worst still, some project sites are visited at night, raising questions as to the motive(s) of the probing legislators who tell journalists accompanying them that there is nothing to see. Keen observers and industry operators have opined that at this rate, not only have the probing legislators made themselves the issue, Nigerians may never get the much desired answers they seek as to why the power sector despite the seemingly huge resource allocation remain in its current level of development.
The expectation is that the committee should have secured the services of a consultant who has a well established pedigree in the award and execution of power projects. Indeed such a consultant would have primed and adequately briefed members of what questions to ask and what to look out for during site visits. But this has not been the case.
All of the sites visited so far by the committee have witnessed a repeat of the same scenario - contractors, NIPP representatives, government consultants and journalists are kept waiting indefinitely and when the committee does decide to visit, they spend an average of ten minutes during which they ask frivolous and at best mundane questions. Indeed a members of the committee while reacting to a question regarding the need to secure the services of a consultant to help in their probe dismissed the notion saying they (committee) knew all there is to know. Perhaps this underscores their degree of conceit or otherwise.
In his submission before the House Committee, Senator Liyel Imoke, the governor of Cross River State and erstwhile minister of power disclosed that the NIPP was conceptualized on a fast track government funded initiative to add significant new generation, transmission, distribution and gas supply capacity to the system.

He said originally, the generation component of the NIPP consisted of seven power plants including Gbarain-Ubie, Omoku, Egbema, Sapele, Calabar, Ihovbor and Ikot Abasi adding that proximity to reliable gas supply and access to the national grid was the underlying criteria for choosing these locations. The NIPP was also designed strategically different from previous projects because the immediate host communities within a five kilometre radius are expected to be connected to electricity direct from the plants.
Imoke disclosed that government subsequently included ongoing projects of the Power Holding Company of Nigeria (PHCN) including Geregu, Omotosho, Papalanto and Alaoji to generate an additional 7600 Mw. He explained that the NIPP also included four gas supply projects and over 100 transmission projects designed to add 6,290 MVA of transmission capacity at 330/132Kv, and 5,418MVA increase at 132/33Kv among other areas of coverage.
He disclosed that the NIPP is an inter-ministerial committee which does not fall under the auspices of the ministry of power procurement. The NIPP draws its personnel from the Ministries of Power, Finance, Petroleum, Gas and the National Planning Commission. The accounting office is vested in the chairman SC (minister of power). Imoke explained that the NIPP TC exists to prosecute the execution of projects while the Niger Delta Power Holding Company (NDPHC) was conceived to inherit the facilities developed and fine-tune the best mode of operating the plant once in service - build and transfer.
He said the ownership structure of the NIPP makes it unique within the power sector, adding that it is actually owned by the three tiers of government, with the Federal Government owning 52 per cent, while the states and local government owns the remaining 48 per cent between them. He explained that the ownership structure of the NIPP mirrors the national revenue sharing formula due to the fact that at the commencement of the project, the three tiers of government agreed to the funding of the NIPP from the excess crude oil receipts.
The board to which the management of the NIPP should receive direction is made up of representatives of the federal government, the state governments and the local governments. Imoke said it was anticipated that as a part of the reform process, when the NIPP plants are ready to be commissioned, they would either be given out on concession or privatised rather than be operated by the NIPP or PHCN.
Interestingly, Imoke also disclosed that the total projected cost of the NIPP was about $4.5 billion out of which a total of about $3 billion have been committed in the form of payment to contractors and the establishment of letters of credit, adding that only funds that have either been secured by Advance Payment Bonds or as payments for certified works have left the CBN. It was gathered that as at March, 2008, NIPP letter of credit report indicates a 29 per cent utilisation of those denominated in dollars and 14 per cent utilisation for those letters of credit denominated in Euro, and all other monies are safely within the control of the Federal Government through the CBN. Undoubtedly, if the conduct of the probe is anything to go by so far, the committee members are either ignorant of this much or they have deliberately set out to create mischief with the line of questioning and their style of plant visitation.
Sunday Vanguard further gathered that in the execution of the NIPP contracts, the government and the contractor are protected from the spectre of a failed project because the government is contractually bound to post an Advance Payment Guarantee (APG), while the contractor is also contractually bound to post a performance bond to the tune of 10 per cent of the entire contract which stands forfeit in the event where there is a default on his (contractors’) part.
Further checks revealed that all NIPP contractors are only paid advance after submission of an advance bank guarantee such that if the contract defaults or if the contract is terminated the entire amount is collected from the issuing bank without any reason; the letter of credit from government is also opened with a government banker (that is CBN) such that government retains control over it and not the contractor.
Indeed since the letter of credit is not secured, checks revealed that the following conditions must be met before the contractor is paid by the bank: proof of shipping (that the material is on the ship) on its way to Nigeria; FAT by consultant and release form to ship indicating the equipment was inspected and approved to be as per contract in the factory before it is shipped; original invoice and documents to be endorsed by two government representatives among other conditions aimed at protecting government. Clearly, the House committee appears unaware of these safety nets – especially given their insistence that billions of dollars has been paid out with nothing to show for it.
Sunday Vanguard checks further revealed that indeed the House Committee may have conveniently disregarded the contract information on most of the ongoing NIPP contracts to the detriment of government’s contractual obligations and the hopes and aspirations of Nigerians for improved power generation, transmission and distribution. For instance, the contract information for the Alaoji Combined Cycle 1074 Mw power plant being handled by Rockson Engineering Company indicates that the completion date for the simple cycle is slated for 15 August, 2009, while that of the combined cycle is yet undetermined owing to accompanying variation. Similarly, the contract information for the 338 Mw Egbema Simple Cycle Power Plant has a contract completion date of July 17, 2009.
The contract information on the Gbarain-Ubie Simple Cycle power plant also indicates a contract completion date of August 22, 2009, while even though government has not met its contractual obligations to the contractor for the 256Mw Omoku Simple Cycle power plant and cannot determine the contract completion date, the contractor expects to achieve project completion by July 2, 2009.

For the lot six transmission lines and substa tions including: Owerri substation, Onitsha substation; Owerri-Onitsha transmission line; Owerri-Alaoji Transmission line; Omoku-Egbema-Owerri Transmission line are yet to be determined owing to a number of constraints. However, the contract completion date for the Alaoji substation was determined to be February 28, 2009. Sunday Vanguard checks revealed that among other challenges, work stoppage at the Owerri substation was caused by Egbu and Uuodu communities owing to non-payment of land compensation by the NIPP; there has been delay in handover at the Onitsha substation; delay in enumeration and non-payment of compensation on Owerri-Alaoji Transmission line by NIPP; delay in enumeration and non-payment of compensation on Owerri-Onitsha Transmission line by NIPP; delay in enumeration and non-payment of compensation by NIPP on Omoku-Egbema-Owerri Transmission line resulting in work stoppage by Obrikom Etekuru and Umudike communities.
Interestingly, although the NIPP has established letters of credit to the tune of N8.197 billion representing 75 per cent of the entire Lot six contract value, owing to the safety nets put in place by government, the contractor Rockson Engineering is yet to receive any payment from the CBN. Unfortunately, the House committee remains worrisomely ignorant of this fact.
Recently, a consortium, Cartlark/Payma Bargh was compelled to take out a paid advertorial to repudiate allegations and imputation of project abandonment which they attributed to Mr. Godwin Elumelu, the Committee Chairman. The consortium said it was of the belief that all Nigerians and indeed the House Committee will benefit more from the investigation if there is a better understanding of the nature and complexities of the project and attendant challenges. Subtle as this may be, it underscores the Committee’s degree of understanding and appreciation of the challenges associated with ongoing power projects
. Cartlak/Payma Bargh Consortium is handling the Ikot-Ekpene & Afam 330/132Kv and 132/33Kv substations and 330Kv and 132 Transmission lines (Lot four).
Recently also Pivot Engineering, the company handling Lot eight which includes construction of the double circuit Transmission Line (Benin-Agbor-Asaba) and associated sub-stations at Benin, Agbor, Asaba and Nkalagu (extension), Lot 21-2 including the 132Kv Double Circuit Transmission line (New Haven -Nineth Mile - Nsukka), as well as Lot 13 including the 330/132/33Kv Ajah, Alagbon and Lekki substations was compelled to take out a paid advertorial to put issues concerning their handling of ongoing NIPP contracts in proper perspective.
The company noted that the ongoing probe by the House had thrown up some sensational but inaccurate news reports relating to the company.
The company pointed out that while the contract for Lot 8 was awarded sometime in March, 2006, advance payment was not made till late August, 2006, while a letter of credit was not opened till March 2007. For Lot 13 while the contract was awarded sometime in October, 2008, advance payment was not made by government till April, 2007. For Lot 21-2, the contract was signed in June, 2006 advance payment made in October, 2006 while a letter of credit was not opened till February, 2007.
Other factors militating against the completion of the projects includes: slow pace of approval of engineering design by NIPP, right-of-way stoppages by some communities owing to non-payment of compensation by the NIPP; regular changes of scope of work by the NIPP; lack of access to project site, e.g Lekki and the uncertainty associated with project funding by the NIPP. Without a doubt, the House committee does not have a clue as to the issues bedeviling the sector.


Source: http://www.vanguardngr.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6599&Itemid=122

@poster,
the guy is just being diplomatic, i mean both of u re workin, he didn't want to hurt u or didn't know ow to tell u you re not his kind of girl. its an old logic to let things take a natural course, even if you re much more younger than 27 waitin for another 5yrs is not candy, ofcourse he know you can't wait that long. I'm a guy, if you don't want to hurt a girl all u do is tell her you re not ready for marriage & of course career is a good excuse. if a guy wants u to be his wife, he will go any lenght even to the extent of changin his plans.

my candid advise is talk to im and move on, if u do that and if he wants you he come after u.

There is a lot of hypocrisy in this country or maybe people just like to play politics with an issue that is of great concern to the country.
There is a wide gulf of difference between a university and polytechnic system of education, but in a country where the right hand can easily be mistaken for the left, one need not worry about the mixed up.

To be sincere, Nigeria is a certificate oriented country with little regard to dignity of labour, that in part is responsible for our backwardness, we glory certificate at the expense of skill and ability, that is why a footballer weekly pay in UK earns sometimes a year salary of some masters holders in some field of endearvour. What am trying to say is that if a street sweeper is good and deligent he/she should be well paid, sincerely, if people are well renumerated and compensated in their various profession, better still if the so-called poly graduate who are suppose to have technical skills are well equiped, they would ve been creating jobs to employ the so-called graduates that they re envious of today. In essence, if there is a level playing field for everyone, there will be less emphassy on HND/BSC dichotomy.

However, as I mentioned earlier on, there is a wide different between the two system, the philosophy,design, and purpose of a university education is different from that of polytechnics, for one the university system is for higher learning, the hieght of human intellectual emancipation and reasoning, at the early days of the creation of the university system, it is assumed that the university system is the highest hieght of human ideas and enlightment. That is why it was written in front of the senate building of one of the oldest university in the world (sweeden) "HOUSE OF SCANDAL" This simply means that any ideas, reasoning or enlightment that is above the university system is a scandal, in other words the university system is the Alpha and Omega of higher learning.

Now, a classical example of modus operandi, of polytechnic and university, the university system hires lecturer to teach and research while the plytechnic teachers are hire to teach alone, in essence if such a lecturer has no program to further his/her education he contineus to dish out the same knowledge year in year out, that account for why there is no research grant for polytechnic lecturers.

It is also worthy of note to mentioned here that the idea of polytechnic education was introduced in Nigeria as a result of shortage of technical skills in Nigeria immidiately after iindependence when all the expartriate left, Poly education was introduced to train Nigerians in vocation skills (not research based) to provide immidiate technical skills and employment to bridge the gap left by the colonialists.

Until recently in the early 90s, you only need three credits to gain admission to any polytechnic and then you don't need to do any Jamb nor go for NYSC service. Infact the earliest polytechnics in Nigeria Yaba, Ibadan & Kadpoly etc were referred to then in the west as "Ile Ikose Gbogbonise" meaning vocational skill college". All these reasons and many more are responsible for the unnessary and celebrated dichotomy between the two HND/BSC.

In short,in an ideal situation, the two system suppose not to be in rivalry but should complement as they have different purposes. Also, the military mentality of superior and inferior coupled with the exploitative nature of business owner that use this to their advantage in term of salary policy.

well, I disagree with you guys and I believe you ve carried the logic too far. If your assumptions are right then soldiers are laws unto themselves, but i will not blame you people most of us Nigerians have lived better part of our life under military rule, your ignorance of the issue at hand may be pardonable anyway

I considered the two opinions above as an assumptions that have no theoretical premise, first, as a student of military-civil relations and political theory, the military institution is not above the state nor any of its officer no matter how famous, a soldier is a state weapon trained to kill to protect the state and not against the state, he's trained and equiped with tax payers money, must subject to the constitution of the land if not he's not a soldier but a mercinery. Just imagining a soldier that have no respect for the people's charter-constittion, no state will maintain an instrument of corecion it has no control over, but if a soldier must obey every order even the one against the state then the state and its people are in captivity, infact that is while the president (a civilian) always holds the title of commander in chief.

However if anybody is proved to be the enemy of the state, then the state has a legal system to address the culpability of such but not shooting a defenseless citizen.

the line of reason above always make me wonder if democratization process is having any impact, becos if the younger generation believe that a soldier can kill for whatever reason then if such people get to place of power what they will do to their percieved enemy can be best imagined

In civilized states, a soldier cannot fights with a civilian except in self defence, because he's suppose to be a state weapon and should not be unleashed on a defenceless citizen.

Even international laws protect a armless or defenceless enemy soldier in the field of war (the Geneva and Alamo convention). Infact it is a war crime to kill a defenseless enemy soldier if it can be proved in any international war tribunal not to mentioned a defencelss citizen.


Anyway, i did not have enough time to trash this issue but any nation where the general or the army can do and undo is doom, that;s why we re in this mess in Nigeria.

@Coolier,
am sure if you re familiar with basic state and int'l law, you will no that the man is as quilty as those that sent him to kill fellow citizens. First as "officer and men" he swore allegiance to the constitution and not to a particular officer or a General in the army, when the general is no more the constitution remains, and as such if he was given an order to kill a citizen he swore to defend in the constitution then he has breached that sacred document, even if a citizen will ve to be denied his right to life it must be within acceptable legal procedures.

I agree that it may be difficult for him as a subordinate becos he may be implicated becos of that and sent away from the force, but the essence of it is that you can disobey order if the ranking officer is violating the constitution of the state.

This was the reason why some Hitler officers and agents were convicted of carrying out illegal order against the state. For a General to take the life of a citizen unlawfully is treason against the state.

The General will go, even government go another one come but the state remain and the state is above all, it is a social contract. The only reason why anybody can be deprived of his life is when in the exercise of his rights he undermines or threatens our collective security and aspiration, and since state is the basis of order and perpectuation of society it must have a final say over indidvidual and even government

@ Ono,
Can you tell me a reason why Danjuma should not go to jail with Obj, or is it becos he's latter day convert?

@poster,

a job well done, i commend your insight.

Is OBJ Nigeria's problem? Are the problems confronting Nigeria now different from those we had b4 he came in? Was electricity supply better in 1999 than it is now? Was corruption less prevalent then than now? or Or do we have better roads then than we have now? In short , what was better then than it is now? I hadly could remember, or maybe we all had short memories.

Obj like any of us has his own weaknesses and strenghts, but as a General in a coup infected developing state like Nigeria, I wonder if he could ve done better than subverting and bulldozing his way through the ever slow and prolong process of law and due process.

Today, it amuses me to see every Tom, Dick & Harry that served in Obj govt condemning the man at every giving opportunity, funny enough none of them have the decency to voluntarily retired from his govt except those that were forced out when they lost relevancy. It is the same people that conspired against us all to impose a General on us, yet they want him to be as civil as possible.

Do people like Atiku, Soloman Lar, Ogbe, Nwodo, Anyim, Rimi, Danjuma,Kalu,Anineh, Adesanya and host of others not served or provided one kind of assistance or the other to Obj? Leaders of course must take the blame for everythin, but does that means the man has not done anything good apart from his dictatorial means of subverting democracy? Yet his regime has some of the best brains in the country that tried their best to put the economy on track, even the world attest to the significant progress of the econmy at about 5% growth rate in the few years compared to the past. I still remembered that Nigeria used to service our dept with about #300b annually b4 he came in or the over $45billion saved as reserve?.

To me while Obj is not a saint or a devil neither is he different from all other typical Nigerian politician, I think he has contribute his own little effort to this country.

Today, all you need to sell any worthless publication is to make OBJ your headline, even anything that does not directly related to him is made to carry his name for commercial purposes. I believe every nation deserve the leader it gets at every point in time. Just as no nation can be holier than its women, no nation can rise above the ideas of its political elites or leaders.We did the same to IBB, even Abacha at death, and am very confident that we will do the same to Yar Adua as soon as he leaves power, it is the nature of Nigerian political elites, not quite ago, we heard that Obj was the best thing to happen to Nigeria but today all you hear is "crucify him" by the same set of people that promoted his dictatorship so much that some of them had forgotten that they ever served in his govt.

Everybody is embracing and adoring Yar Adua, infact the New PDP chairman said he will give the president 101 % loyalty as if a party chairman that is suppose to provide guidance to the president with relation to party manifestos and ideology is an appendage of the president.


Most Nigerians today like the callm personality and disposition of Yar Adua as opposed to the bully and all-wise Obj, but nobody seems to pause for a moment and give credit to the man that offers us such a cool headed leader loved by many. Leadership without successor is a failure. Now that every body is charmed by Yar Adua's essential goodness yet Obj risked enemity with so many political associates to give us Yar Adua, it is too simple for us to think about that now as all political jobbers will do anything to warm their way to the heart of the new President and thereafter shout "Crucify him" We seem to have a band wagon mentality in this country. Obj is so hated now that IBB considers himself a saint despite plugging us into debt,SAP & 419, am sure Abacha too would ve beeen vindicated if he were to be alive. What an irony? But time will tell every man's place in history.

Other view welcome!

@poster

I wantto thank God for you that you re a christian, and i also believe that anybody can be in the situation your woman has found herself, but not many will admit that here. Just remember that all the people that have given the above advices may not share your faith, as a matter of fact some of them may not share any faith.

Also, you will agree with me that it take God to make a woman confess to such things that may ruin her relationship and possibly her life, but its better that way than going ahead with so much guilt, but remember that if she decide not to tell you, you probably would not know. I will say there fore that it will do you a lot of good to forgive and forget but ensure you know the reason while she did it and she should severe the relationship with other guy. However this is not as easy as it sounds but it is possible. Personally, i ve seen several of such cases and it turn out to be wonderful relationship thereafter.

It is a test of your faith, besides to err is human, please forgive, i ve realised that forgiveness heals the heart though painful but forgiveness is better than unforgiveness, you might just saved a soul and turn alife around, just remember it could happen to any one of us,it may just be the begining of her own true conversion, and you would ve played important role in her life.

You and I know as christian we ve obligation to forgive no matter how painful, if you love her, pls forgive her, and carrying on with your life and don't ever tell that story to anybody becos it will do you no good if you still want her as your wife to be. She has her blame but some guy could really be bad, he took advantage of the closeness in the office and besides she may not be experience to know the limit to go with guys, how ever you may also have your faulth in this matter that you may not really understand now, so, pls be sensitive to the need of your woman, everythin good needs prayer and vice versa, don't think because you have o good partner and then go home to sleep, your have a role to play, forgive, afterall if she didn't tell you you would not ve known and that may not be the first time she is having sex anyway, so what difference does it make.
take heart, its not the end of the world.

@ poster,

Usually i do not dabble into this kind of discussion, but i just feel like chip in something because i see you don't understand the issue at hand.

Look at it from this angle, men and women are different specie , why a woman will do almost anything for romantic relationship a man may not. This becomes very critical when it affects his job, my experience giving lecture to youth shows that while most ladies considers their wedding day their happiest day, most guy considers their greates moment the day they hit it big---menaing their job, contract, success etc.

So, dating your manager who has been trusted with the exercise of sound judgement to take the business to greater height may not really seems bad from romantic perspective, but in the business world, such weakness has led to the fall of many corporate giants, the recent example was the case of the formal world bank president that favours his girlfriend a strategic position that threatens the world body despite her lack of experience. It is a bad busniess ethics for your manager to date you and he knows it because if there is a clash of interest, he may not exercise sound judgement and discreation.

Therefore, your request for more intimacy may have caused him to re-evaluate the whole relationship, and naturally, most men will prefer their job to an unethical relationship since job =income, and with a good income they can afford to go out with any lady.

So, essentially, it may not be because he did not like you but because there is a higher necessity to allow reason to prevail against emotions,, he knew he hurt you but to him its better than being jobless. Ofcourse, in most organisation your relationship could get both of you sacked. So understand the peculiar situation he's in, except one of you will leave the job.

This issue is not wether he loves you or not, it has to do with survival, self preservation is the first law of nature---- most men understand this law instinctively than most ladies because without job a man has no ego, no honour ! He will rather sacrifice the relationship than get sacked for dating a subordinate.

take heart sister, and think about this.

Texazzpete,

it is a waste of valuable time discussin with an incurable critic like you, you re always in every section proving and disproofing, anyway, inability to respect others opinion and temptation to criticize to the point of calling fellow landers "IDIOT" speaks volumes of your personality and reflect a weakness of character and a negative mindset. Intolerance of others opinion itself betrays a deep rooted character problem that stems from inner insecurity and selfishness, and consequently a defensive and destructive attitude that never see good thing about other people.

Everything is learnt, am sure you can learn through conscious effort to upgrade your mind from the realm of mental negativity to a realm of mental positivity. I actually would ve disregard your reply if I know that's what you do in every section of this forum.

I promise, I won't take you up on this again, but I leave you the word of a great thinker Socrates:

"He who knows not and knows not that He knows not is a Fool !
He who knows not and knows that He knows not is a wise Man !

A word is enough for the wise !

@texazzpete,
what is more than intellectual shallowness and bankcruptcy other than for you critizise a write up when you could not substantiate it or take the pain of presenting a contrary and enlightened view, you might as well hold your peace forever, since you lack basic fact or perhaps you re too lazy to embark on necessary intellectual exercise to disproof my post. A sweeping comdemnation is least expected of any scholar that worth its salt, you sound more like a borehole theorist.

As for the catholic church, i don't think you re more of a catholic than myself,, even a beginner iin Reformation history will no doubt attest to the facts.

@seabiotic,
thats what it was meant to be, if not, i mean if it was glarin for discernin American public you can be sure those behind the "unwritten rule" would ve been challenged long time ago or atleast their strategies nuetralised by now, i hope this happens as Obama is now on the threshold of history

@ texazzpete

rather than blowing hot air, atleast this forum offers you the opportunity of free speech to air your view on this issue, perhaps we can learn from your extensive knowledge of American presidency or history.

By the way callin fellow N/landers "Idiot" may look like an insult to you all because they don't share you point of view and everybody must share your view.

Maybe you can update yourself by reading what Bolaji Akinyemi and Oyebade said in the Gaurdian of Wednesday 13 Feb, with regards to the WASP criterion as a condition of American presidency, atleast the opinions of the two gentlemen who are professor emeritus of political science and International law respectively could serve as a guidiance for us. just two days ago a British nobel laurete made a statement about possible assasination of Obama should the man go ahead and win in the US presidential election, maybe she is cracy too, or is she an idiot as you would say? Maybe you re unaware that historical antecedent has a way of shapin socio-economic and political phenomenons.

Well, since you re timid enough not to present a contrary and logical arguement other than a sweeping condemnation of my post, I think I better not dissipate valauble time joining issue with you,

Obama is my man rght, but have you guys ever heard of the acronym WASP, it simply means:

W= White
A= Anglo
S= Saxon
P= Protestant

WASP = White Anglo-Saxon Protestant is the unwritten rule of American presidency.
That is to say for you to have a shot at American presidency, you must be WHITE, OF ENGLISH- IRISH ORIGIN AND YOU MUST BE A PROTESTANT meaning YOU MUST BE A BAPTIST OR ANGLICAN OR METHODIST, ALL THIS CHURCHES ARE THE OFFSHOOT OF THE CHURCH OF ENGLAND, THE PEOPLE THAT FOUNDED THE AMERICAN NATION.

It will surprise you to know that the first ever President to break that unwritten rule was JF Kennedy, however he qualified for greater part except that he was a Catholic, meaning not a Protestant and he was assasinated for that, despite the fact that he rejuvinated the American Dream and was well beloved by all but the powers that be believed he did not meet the criteria of an American presidency and as such all investigation into his death to date has been shrouded in mystery.

Am not saying Obama cannot win a US presidency but if he did he may be assasinated. That was what Colins Powell the former chairman Joint Chief of Staff of the United States Armed forces feared that made him chicken out despite his popularity above Bush then and in the Army with all the heroics of a war veteran.

Again, why did you think Algore was rigged out of the presidency despite the impressive performance of their admninistration (Clinton/Algore presidency) ofcourse Clinton administration was one of the best if not the best in American history, do you think people did not want the good work to contineu, Bush came in now American economy is heading for recession and everybody is now looking for a bail out.

Algore was robbed in broad day light in what has become has become a watershed in American History. But he was not robbed becuase he wasn't good but because Algore is Greek and not the Anglo-Saxon . Anglo-Saxon is the projenitor of the English race.

This hostory is dated back to the middle age, when the Catholic church persecuted the reformers and Martin Luther and his followers and because of the Episcopal powers of the Papacy then that made the like of Britain, France, Russia to liberate themselves from the Vatican, the fall out was the creation of the church of England and the Anglican Communion, the reformers that protest against the Vatican were protected by the governments of the mentioned nations , infact the protestant later converged in Britain where the English government sponsored their trip to the New World as America was popularly known then, it was the escape from Vatican or Catholic church that made US to be refers as the Free land from whch the concept of American freedom was derived from, A Freedom to serve God unmolested by the machination of the Roman Catholic Church, these protestant are sometimes reffered as the Puritans and are highly conservative people.

Later on Britain colonised American which consequently altered the the economic and political power equation in favour of the English-Irish nationalities among numerous European settlers in America, this group grow to be come what General Esienhower called Military Industrial Complex otherwised known as the Republican Party. This people see themselves as the custodian of the American nation, check out the most advantaged groups in America today and you will suprise what you see. That is why US and great Britain goes hands in hands on any issue whather negative or positive at the international level.

there were many struggle throughout American history between the Catholic church and the Church of England that necessitated the need for that unwritten rule as American earliest settlers were the Protestant people that protested against the Vatican Spiritual Apostasy during the middle age and the period of the Inquisition that got many Protestant burnt at the stake as heretics, hence the WASP code was aimed to ensure that nobody except white Anglo-saxon Protestant will have a shot at the American presidency as it is obvious that whoever among the various European nationality or settlers will influnce the whole world.

You can have Italian in big hotels buz, German, Russian Americans etc everywhere but when it comes to the White House beware , its for the Anglo-Saxon , you can check history of the American Presidency. That is why it is possible for a father and his son to rule a counntry of almost 300million people and we re now closer to see husband and wife repeating the same thing.

Well, am not an historian but i ve an inquisitive mind that made me read books about everything and anything. Please don't mind the long story, i felt people should understand where American is coming from and how it got to this stage in history.

NB: I initially sent this post as a reply but I felt i should post it as a new topic as it may interest some people that have interest in American presidency.

Obama is my man rght, but have you guys ever heard of the acronym WASP, it simply means:

W= White
A= Anglo
S= Saxon
P= Protestant

WASP = White Anglo-Saxon Protestant is the unwritten rule of American presidency.
That is to say for you to have a shot at American presidency, you must be WHITE, OF ENGLISH- IRISH ORIGIN AND YOU MUST BE A PROTESTANT meaning YOU MUST BE A BAPTIST OR ANGLICAN OR METHODIST, ALL THIS CHURCHES ARE THE OFFSHOOT OF THE CHURCH OF ENGLAND, THE PEOPLE THAT FOUNDED THE AMERICAN NATION.

It will surprise you to know that the first ever President to break that unwritten rule was JF Kennedy, however he qualified for greater part except that he was a Catholic, meaning not a Protestant and he was assasinated for that, despite the fact that he rejuvinated the American Dream and was well beloved by all but the powers that be believed he did not meet the criteria of an American presidency and as such all investigation into his death to date has been shrouded in mystery.

Am not saying Obama cannot win a US presidency but if he did he may be assasinated. That was what Colins Powell the former chairman Joint Chief of Staff of the United States Armed forces feared that made him chicken out despite his popularity above Bush then and in the Army with all the heroics of a war veteran.

Again, why did you think Algore was rigged out of the presidency despite the impressive performance of their admninistration (Clinton/Algore presidency) ofcourse Clinton administration was one of the best if not the best in American history, do you think people did not want the good work to contineu, Bush came in now American economy is heading for recession and everybody is now looking for a bail out.

Algore was robbed in broad day light in what has become has become a watershed in American History. But he was not robbed becuase he wasn't good but because Algore is Greek and not the Anglo-Saxon . Anglo-Saxon is the projenitor of the English race.

This hostory is dated back to the middle age, when the Catholic church persecuted the reformers and Martin Luther and his followers and because of the Episcopal powers of the Papacy then that made the like of Britain, France, Russia to liberate themselves from the Vatican, the fall out was the creation of the church of England and the Anglican Communion, the reformers that protest against the Vatican were protected by the governments of the mentioned nations , infact the protestant later converged in Britain where the English government sponsored their trip to the New World as America was popularly known then, it was the escape from Vatican or Catholic church that made US to be refers as the Free land from whch the concept of American freedom was derived from, A Freedom to serve God unmolested by the machination of the Roman Catholic Church, these protestant are sometimes reffered as the Puritans and are highly conservative people.

Later on Britain colonised American which consequently altered the the economic and political power equation in favour of the English-Irish nationalities among numerous European settlers in America, this group grow to be come what General Esienhower called Military Industrial Complex otherwised known as the Republican Party. This people see themselves as the custodian of the American nation, check out the most advantaged groups in America today and you will suprise what you see. That is why US and great Britain goes hands in hands on any issue whather negative or positive at the international level.

there were many struggle throughout American history between the Catholic church and the Church of England that necessitated the need for that unwritten rule as American earliest settlers were the Protestant people that protested against the Vatican Spiritual Apostasy during the middle age and the period of the Inquisition that got many Protestant burnt at the stake as heretics, hence the WASP code was aimed to ensure that nobody except white Anglo-saxon Protestant will have a shot at the American presidency as it is obvious that whoever among the various European nationality or settlers will influnce the whole world.

You can have Italian in big hotels buz, German, Russian Americans etc everywhere but when it comes to the White House beware , its for the Anglo-Saxon , you can check history of the American Presidency. That is why it is possible for a father and his son to rule a counntry of almost 300million people and we re now closer to see husband and wife repeating the same thing.

Well, am not an historian but i ve an inquisitive mind that made me read books about everything and anything. Please don't mind the long story, i felt people should understand where American is coming from and how it got to this stage in history.