₦airaland Forum

[quote author=jaephoenix post=119881697]The regular response christians give. When yhwh heals, he's a loving god. When he kills, he's just taking back what he gave.
But you conveniently forgot, he knows his creations would sin and knows the exact time they would sin, but he still went ahead to create them. In fact in the bibles confusion, it stated that god was searching for Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. You mean an omniscient god can't figure out where his creatures were hiding? ;

You keep forgetting that death is only temporal. And all that God does is for the good of mankind. You see death as the worse thing that could happen to man when in reality it's just moving from one phase to another. The good die, the bad die. No one would escape it. So when God takes someone's life.
Also, you know that your kids would misbehave at one point or the other so why would you still have kids?

MrPresident1:
iti, resort

This funny boy. One day you will grow.

NNTR:
Smh. Didnt I advise you not to mention me again on this thread ni?

You're being carnal, because 'read my lips' is a figure of speech, not something to be taken literally

Proverbs 25:2
'The glory of God [is] to hide a thing,
And the glory of kings [is] to search out a matter.'

John 14:26
'But the Helper
(Comforter, Advocate, Intercessor—Counselor, Strengthener, Standby),
the Holy Spirit,
whom the Father will send in My name
[in My place, to represent Me and act on My behalf],
He will teach you all things.
And He will help you remember everything that I have told you.'

God is praised for being mysterious, but the glory of kings to investigate them and are praised for explaining mysteries.

Now, watch this, flesh and blood cannot let you read the word of God with comprehension.

Please do not quote anymore on this thread. Thank you in advance for not quoting me on this thread

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

If you did not want me to quote you, you should not reply, you made some wrong assertions so I am bound to correct them. First, you don't say read my lips and claim I am canal for asking you to read your bible instead.
Secondly, I gave you the simple task, show where it is written that people would have the opportunity to accept Christ on judgment day. But then you dishonestly present John 14.26 as your defense. Your dishonesty is not acceptable. No need to reply to this if you are not prepared to hear from me.

NNTR:
Smh. Splash it on your body

1 John 2:1
'My dear children, I am writing this to you so that you will not sin.
But if anyone does sin,
we have an Advocate who pleads our case before the Father.
He is Jesus Christ, the one who is truly righteous.'

Read my lips. In the court of Heaven, the Just Judge would give everyone the opportunity to accept Jesus, as an Advocate who will plead people's cases before God

Now, please carry go and dont quote me on this thread again

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

Oga but the scriptures you provided says nothing about the opportunity to accept Christ at the courts of heaven.
I don't want to read your lips, I want to read the word of God. Show me where it is written.

Odebayo4010:
That is why I said earlier that they will use there Conscience to judge they,according to there doing whether they do Good or bad,because one knows in his mind what's right and wrong

You obviously are not understanding my question.
Let me see if I can make it any simpler.
So you are saying God would judge them using their conscience. My question is, does a good conscience give forgiveness of sin? Even if their conscience is ok, does forgiveness of sin come from a good conscience or from the blood of Jesus Christ? I hope this is now clear?

bobestman:
Sorry the jesus they gave you is an impostor and can't save anyone. The msg that brings salvation comes at endtime. Even your pastors will hear it cos they teach error. The dead you talked of will all reincarnate/reborn/born again to hear it bf the end. Without believing that msg you can't get into the kingdom. Your religions are all in error

Your opinion noted

NNTR:
There's nothing to answer in your rabbit hole of question



5. Are Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera saved without hearing about Jesus Christ?
Ans:
Yes, Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera are saved without hearing about Jesus Christ?

If Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera are saved from sin and death without hearing about Jesus Christ then, those that never heard of Christ, if on judgment day, they too accept Jesus as their Lord, Saviour and Advocate (i.e. SAN (e.g. Senior Advocate Numero Uno)), then absolutely they would be saved from sin and death

If Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera are saved without hearing about Jesus Christ and would enter the Kingdom of God, then, if they too, on judgment day, accept Jesus as their Lord , Saviour and Advocate (i.e. SAN (e.g. Senior Advocate Numero Uno)), then absolutely, they would enter on a red carpet, the Kingdom of God.

Smh, small yansh too dey shake

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

Finally you have been able to provide direct answers. So you answer is, on Judgement day, everyone would have a second chance to accept Jesus Christ. Do you have any scripture that says so or is this just your opinion.

The bible also revealed that at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess that he is Lord. So are you saying that everyone shall be saved?

NNTR:
I have more than one time, already answered your question, even Odebayo4010 too, has answered you question

You mean questions you half heartedly answer, and where you didnt half hearted answered you changed the questions to suit your manufactured convenient vested interest prepared answers.

I'll fill in the correct way answers with their matching questions

1. What in word, thats five letters, is Jesus saving from?
Ans:
Death (i.e. the wages of sin is death. We are saved from the second death, and Lake of Fire)

2. What does a judge check and plan to offer someone accused of a crime that carries a death penalty?
Ans:
Judges would ask if has a legal representative, if answer is No, then, will offer the accuser free legal aid, that comes with having a lawyer free

3. What should the accuse do, if he/she has no SAN to represent him/her
Ans:
The advantage of the free legal aid the justice system provides, accept the services of the available SAN (e.g. Senior Advocate Numero Uno

4. Did Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera hear about Jesus?
Ans:
No, Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera never heard about Jesus?

5. Are Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera saved without hearing about Jesus Christ?
Ans:
Yes, Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera are saved without hearing about Jesus Christ?

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

As I said, you have not been able to answer my questions. Let me make it easy for you with simple questions.
1. Those that never heard of Christ, would they be saved from sin and death?
2. If yes, would they enter the Kindom of God?
Lets start from these simple questions

AntiChristian:
Same Law Jesus was referring to in Matthew 5:17-18
Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

Romans 5:13
To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone's account where there is no law.

Adam won't have transgressed if there was no law prohibiting him from that particular tree!

I think we are mostly on the same page. So Paul was talking about the law of Moses. My point is, even before the coming of Moses, men understood good and evil.

Odebayo4010:
What I observe in you is that,you're Talking out of Frustration

You observed wrong. But then, many Nigerians are frustrated so I see where you are coming from. I advise that we don't go off-topic and make this about ourselves. I understand that we don't always have all answers so it's okay to say you don't have the answers and allow others to share their opinions.

Odebayo4010:
You quote me wrong,when I said before the Jesus came,I mean during Moses time,when they haven't give birth to Jesus Christ

I perfectly understand you. Let's take a step back.

So you are saying that in the days of Moses, people found salvation through having a clear conscience right? Now my question is if a clear conscience could save in the days of Moses, then what is the purpose of the coming of Christ? So according to you, if Christ did not come, salvation would still be obtainable via the conscience path. Hence, according to you, Christ coming did not usher in salvation since it was already available through a clear conscience. So why did Christ come?

AntiChristian:
This verse was quoted earlier by xproducer.
This was brought by Paul. How can you sin without "the Law"?

Cc Tctrills

Which law was Paul talking about? Was it the law of Moses?
Since the time of Adam, all humans have an idea of Good and evil. This knowledge was the most important ingredient in building society as we know it. So even without the law of Moses, people could sin.

Odebayo4010:
Try to read vividly,I mean before the Jesus come,na Conscience they will use to judge them

I perfectly understand you but you are the one not understanding me.
If conscience could save men from sin before the coming of Christ, then why did Jesus Christ need to come. Since we could be saved without him by conscience then there would not have been any need for his coming.
That means if he did not come, we all would have been saved by conscience. Or let's say there are 2 saviours according to you, conscience and Jesus Christ.

NNTR:
I am on chapters and pages ahead of that you call same page

1. What in word, thats five letters, is Jesus saving from?
2. What does a judge check and plan to offer someone accused of a crime that carries a death penalty?
3. What should the accuse do, if he/she has no SAN to represent him/her
4. Did Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera hear about Jesus?
5. Are Adam, Eve, Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Moses, Elijah et cetera saved without hearing about Jesus Christ?

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

I see you don't want to answer the question. As for your questions:
1. Please reword question 1. It is not making sense to me.
2. Same goes for number 2.
3. You don't need a SAN to represent you, any lawyer would do.
4. Since the time of Adam, Jesus Christ was preached.
5. Only those who believe in Jesus Christ would be saved according to the bible. Except a man is born again, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

jaephoenix:
Right. Since death comes to all men, why not simply jump into a zoo filled with lions. Would even save your family funeral costs.
Oh, and why the flood was a bad idea? Why dont you stay under a swimming pool for 30 minutes. Lets see how you'll enjoy it

This is very different. It was the giver of life himself that chooses when and how to take away life.
So if I gave you my Play station for a while, would you tag me a bad person when I come to take it back?

jaephoenix:
Really? What was best for mankind was wiping out the whole world with the flood? Really?

If you read the bible, you would learn that death comes to all men and all men would live again.
Why do you think the flood was a bad idea?

xproducer:
+++++++++++

The response is highlighted in red text... enough stated.

"And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power" - 1 Corinthians 2:4

lol ok

xproducer:
++++++++

But for the grace of GOD in YESHUA, the CHRIST... all humanity would have been lost. Those whom HE saves from judgment are justified - GOD having stood in their place, but those who are not must pay for their own sins.

"For there is no respect of persons with God. For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law" - Romans 2:11-12

You really did not answer any of the questions.

jaephoenix:
Fine.
So he knew Adam would fall for the tree if evil, but he still went ahead and planted it by him?
He knew the devil would deceive humanity but he still went ahead and created him?
Answer these 2 and I'll ask some more

Exactly, he knew and he still went ahead because he does what's best for mankind.
The question you need to ask is what is God's plan for mankind.
Does he want us to live in a bubble outside the influence of sin, pain or Satan?

jaephoenix:
No. I'm asking if Yahweh is omniscient(all-knowing)?

God has all knowledge.

TheNiceGuy:
He has to still prove his UNPREPAREDNESS?

Who are those brainwashed people supporting this clown

You guys are funny. The same people that supported Buhari still have the guts to fault Obi supporters. Clowns.

MrPresident1:
iti

Lol. When you catch them in their foolishness, they result to insults. Funny child.

NNTR:
You obviously dont understand

1 John 2:2
'He himself is the sacrifice that atones for our sins—
and not only our sins but the sins of all the world.'

Romans 3:25
'whom God displayed publicly [before the eyes of the world]
as a [life-giving] sacrifice of atonement
and reconciliation (propitiation) by His blood [to be received] through faith.
This was to demonstrate His righteousness [which demands punishment for sin],
because in His forbearance [His deliberate restraint]
He passed over the sins previously committed [before Jesus’ crucifixion].'

I'll repeat again that, Bible 101, lets every believer, baby or not, know that God's primary aim for incarnating as Jesus, is for the atonement of sin

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

Good we are on the same page. Christ died for all sins. Now to the next part, do we need to accept Jesus Christ to he save? If yes, what about those who did not hear about him? Or are there 2 standards for salvation?
Again if people can be saved without hearing about Jesus Christ then what is the purpose of preaching if not to save souls?

jaephoenix:
IMPORTANT QUESTION
Is your god Yahweh omniscient?

Is there a difference between Yahweh and Yahweh omniscient?

NNTR:
Reread what I earlier typed and return back to correctly and fully quote me

Bible 101, informs every believer, baby or not, that God's primary aim for incarnating as Jesus, is for the atonement of sin

You are conflating apples with oranges.

Conscience comes into play at time of judgment. Like for like, took away sin.

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

I am not sure I even understand you. So let me ask a direct question. For those who did not hear of Jesus, how do they obtain forgiveness of sin?

MaxInDHouse:
Only Jehovah's Witnesses can answer this with the Bible but since you feel there are others who also qualified as Christian groups i'll leave you alone with them!

I see you came here to boast, well this is social media, anyone can claim anything. It's a free world. But when I remember that you claimed the house of Israel are God's slaves, I am just so sure you don't have a better answer than anyone here

Dtruthspeaker:
I see you already know that you are hellfire bound so now you are looking at other people's cases to see those who shall join you there.

Christ went to preach to them too, so don't worry about them.

Lol

NNTR:
1a. Experience life and express themselves as best or worst as they are capably able to
1b. God follows a process, and took God 4000 years, following the process to incarnate on earth
2. Odebayo4010 has beautifully answered this

Romans 2:11-15
'11For God does not show favoritism.
12When the Gentiles sin, they will be destroyed,
even though they never had God’s written law.
And the Jews, who do have God’s law,
will be judged by that law when they fail to obey it.
13For merely listening to the law doesn’t make us right with God.
It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight.
14Even Gentiles, who do not have God’s written law,
show that they know his law when they instinctively obey it,
even without having heard it.
15They demonstrate that God’s law is written in their hearts,
for their own conscience and thoughts either accuse them
or tell them they are doing right.'

Good call.

Jesus had to come because it was fitting, to fulfil all righteousness

The parable of the King and His Servants and His Son, is about the Pharisees and not to do with those created without an opportunity to hear about Jesus Christ

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

You say Jesus Christ came to fulfill rightousness agreed. But you seem to forget that he came to take away our sins. So does conscience take away sins or does Christ take away sins?

MrPresident1:
Iti, I already explained these things in one of my threads

1. Colossians 1:23 KJV
If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;.

All creatures under heaven have heard the gospel, no excuses. You have to realise that the NT was written in Greek and the Greeks were noted for their exact tenses

2. Romans 2:13-15 KJV
(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. [14] For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: [15] Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

The people who will be justified are the keepers of the law, not the hearers

This boy again. As usual, you don't know what you are saying. Not everyone has heard the gospel of Jesus Christ and definitely not everyone since the time of Jesus Christ.

jaephoenix:
Lol. So yhwh changes his commandments and laws according to the prevailing culture and society. So maybe yhwh should edit the Bible to reflect the current society and laws, so as 'to meet the needs of the times'. And then in 500 years or so, version 3.0 should be out

No he does not need to edit the bible. He has continued to reveal. Revelations did not end with the bible.
You should know that the bible is not just one book rather, it is a collection of God's revelations over a period of time.
God's revelations show the evolution in human society. To the first humans, the only commandment he gave was don't eat the fruit.
Then as man progressed, He continued to add laws and commandments cumulating in the ten commandments.
Then came Jesus Christ with more laws and commandments.
And when Jesus left, he promised to continue to teach through the Holy Ghost.

Moh247:
No I won't vote for Obi because he is the least qualified... My comment has no tribe referenced yet your myopic self still called me a tribalist

Are you guys always this ridiculous

Your comments were clear, you don't believe Obi should be voted for because someone bullied Seun. You have always been one of the top tribalist on Nairaland.
And as for bring myopic, every tribalist is myopic. You can see beyond your tribal lens. You are pitiful.

Odebayo4010:
It depends,those people that came before Jesus,they we use there Conscience to judge them

So are you saying that people can be saved by conscience? If conscience is enough to save then why did Jesus have to come? We all could have been saved by conscience then?