₦airaland Forum

Pls, can other members of naira forum help make sense what KAY 17 just put down?

There is the understanding that the univers is govern by laws,
My Quest is, who put those laws in place?

If the laws came by chance then that makes "chance" superior to the laws, if that is the case why has chance allowed the law it put in place to thrive those far? And has not eroded it? Or has chance develope an intelligence of its own? As to know when to stop?

I had expected that chance should continue being at work as it is blind, or is it not, did it know when to retire?
If chance has so developed an intelligence and know when to stop as not to erode the law it put in place, and it is said where there is intelligence then there is a mind and where there is a mind there is a person (brain) are we then saying that chance is a person?

@cyrexx
The most intelligent person i have ever red about is Jesus christ.
And i believe his genuine followers should be intelligent since they will learn from him.
I dont expect all so call born again to really have much to offer on this thread cus they easily loss their cool and start vibrating.
That said,
A want to commen mr anony. i read his defence on apostle paul on the thread concerning paul's role in christianity. I personally think he did a good job.

If Jesus christ was always lossing his cool and vibrating i wander how he would have been able to do the beautiful rational job he did during his ministry here on earth In front of opposition often.

That said, i dont expect any good job from this people exploiting people in buses and churches cause Jesus did say "a good tree produces fine fruit and a rotten tree produces rotten fruit"

It takes some one with his mind intact to patiently read through this thread and get the sense in it and after rational considerations he or she may decide to post or go back and think deeply on the issues covered.
Peace

Mr anony
i can not continue to haggle matters with u,
d bible that should be ur strenght u are watering it, are u trying to cover truth with blanket? For what purpose? To win argument, can u reward urself with everlasting life? Dont u know that peoples life are at stake? If God will Give the reward should we not stick to his word?
1. Imagine, Jeremiah 7:31 God says that d act of burning people in fire has not come to his mind.
A precedece was set and u said it does not matter or it does not relate.
Are u the one that sets the standerd that we should follow? If u are d head of a family and u are told that ur thought is not relevant how will u feel? Dont u know that the life of billions of people are at stake.

2. You said the bible book of ecclessiates should not be taken literally, that it is writen in poetry,
that is the real christiandom in u coming out. U go to pegan religion and borrow doctrin and wish to fit it into the bible when it wount fit u reject that part,
well, as u can see, God is wiser than man cause that is the way the bible is, it does not allow man to force falehood into it.
If the teaching is truth, it will fit into the bible perfectly from Genesis to Revelation without any need to select.
Besides, are u saying that God made a mistake for allowing ecclesiates to form part of the bible?
Am not the one that put it there, it been there for over 3000yrs, Jesus did not reject it, so christiandom cant be selective when it rejects immortallity of the soul doctrin.
Ecclessiates 9:5,6,10. The dead are unconsciouse. they Know nothing at all, they cannot feel pain or suffer. Their brain is dies.

3. How well does christiandom defend God?
God told Adam, the day that u eat from the tree u will die,
whose side did u take? Did u imagine u are defending God when u said that adam did not die literally that day but that he died s p i r i t u a l l y!
Did u not know what 2pet. 3:8 says, that a day = 1000yrs, that Adam lieved for 900and yrs, less than 1000yrs that is a day with God. Meaning that literally adam died withing the day, did not leave upto the full day
But what did u succeeded in saying? That spiritually God was right but literally God was wrong satan was right. What an envoy u and christiandom are to God?
(God leave out side our planet earth. On earth d sun determinds when is day or night, since christ left the earth to get to heaven, our sun will not be Gods own means of measuring time. So, his day =1kyrs)

O! U will even Quote immotality of the soul and tell God that he was wrong that adam did not die, that he went to where? Heaven or hell?
What does Genesis chapt 3:19 say?
God say to Adam from the dust u were taken and to the dust u will reurned.

Question 1:where was Adam befor he was created?
Answer = Adam was in the dust = no where.
Question 2: when Adam died where did he go to?
Answer = Adam went to the dust he was taken = no where. So, when died he want no where
O! U will then tell me that we they children were later given immotal soul.

How can u wish i accept the teaching of immortality of the soul? A teaching that was borrow from pegan religion that warship satan and demons during the dark ages into christindom? The agiptian pharors that thier toms in the pyramid has a turnel for their soul to travel out are they christian?

Mmmmm! U cant change where u are beter take ur leave while u still can cause God is not happy with what christiandom has done to his word the bible.
No thanks.

@cyrexx and Ijawkid
its really a pity d dermage that has been done by christiandom, one wanders whose purpose does christiandom serves? God's? Mmmmmmm!

All over d world with bible in hand they course scandal and give d bible a bad name,
there is what we should note from d bible,
when doctrine is said to be from the bible and it does not have a smothe rid Genesis to Revelation without contradiction Just bear in mind it is not a bible teaching. Eg.
HELL FIRE
TRINITY
IMMORTALITY OF THE SOUL
PURGATARY
LIMBO
ALL RIGHTEOUSE PEOPLE GO TO HEAVEN, etc,
this are pegan doctrin brought into christiandom by the orthodox church during the dark ages.
Closely examine other Religion like hindu, budhist, shinto, muslim. U will find that this teachings is spread among them even though they dont use the bible, and this teaching has been there befor christianity went to their land of origin. Except for muslim that rejects trinity due to there having the first four books of the bible.
Even majority of celebrations are of pegan origin.

How can christiandom rightly represent the God of the bible?
Take a sample test of how well their followers know the bible u will marvel at how empty they are, though they have been going to chuch for years,
infact, they are blind to what the bible says, except when its about properity.

@anony
U and me agree that God is not stupid, infact his mind works at the speed of light, he is super wise,
if u do believe that d bible is the word of God then the first thing u should wish to accept is that his word should not contradict itself.
Someone quoted Jeremiah 7:31(Ijawkid or so) that said it has not entered God's mind to burn human in fire, if d bible is God's word do u think that a super intelligent God will 4got what he said earlier in Jeremiah? Even human can write books that dont contradict, are u saying God cant do that?
1John 4:8 says God is love, what kind of love will it be to burn people in fire for all eternity, (will he not get tired of seing it?)

if God said he is not even happy with the dead of a sinner then u are saying he will be happier tormenting them?

Christiandom have another fales teaching that aid and create more confussion,
IMMOTALITY OF THE SOUL, this teaching carried by religions that dont even carry the bible, u also teach,
did those religion learnt it from the bible, if Jesus said u are to teach all nation what they dont know something new will it be immotality of the soul that our great great grand perant carry and died as ancestor warship that u are teaching?
Did our ancestors learn it from the bible?
Read eccl9:5,6 and 10 and see d truth about d dead, that they are unconscious and cant feel pain or know suffering. Infact the brain perishes, finito.
Look, am really sick of christiandom.
Even this torment teaching is supporting satan that said Adam (human) wont die, this teaching said human will continue lieving, then who was d liar? God?
Do u realy thing God is stupid?

Gentlemen, take note off what Jesus was saying. Anything that will make u commit a sin meriting everlasting dead with no hope of a resurrection u should cut it off, does that means we will be perfect? Far from it, but there are sin peoplel committ that there will be no hope of a resurection, (eg, sining agains d holy spirit). And his caution was to avoid such kind sin. But If it was sin due to human imperfect nature, who is there that can stand perfect? "Let him cast the first stone" we all make mistake knowingly or unknowinly, but it should not be d kind of deliberate sin against God that satan committed.

D difference is that the bible uses fire to dipict such sin leading to dead without resurection. While d rest of mankind with hope of resurection are refered to being in regular grave. But those with fire reference will not come out again. Like d religiouse pherisees that kill Jesus, he said, "how can u escape the judgment of gehena" (a pit of fire outside Jeruselem) though they were not put into that pit, Jesus knew what he was saying, that he will not resurrect them.

Hell means grave and not a place of fire, that is why the reference to remove grave is refered to as hell meaning grave being cast into the lake of fire.
Translations that uses hell in generalize terms looses this sense.
So reading wide and many translation helps. Consider more closely this differences.

Also, will there be need to resurect those God will kill at d end of this system? NO, so, d bible rightly use fire.
Those that will be resurected during judgment day, if they still continue without faith and continue with what is bad there dead from God will also be without resurection, God also uses fire to show this, etc.
(reseach what judgement day is. Note. Roman6:7) wages sin pays is dead. If some one should still a cow and is caught sent to court and sentence for a year in prison, on coming out will he still pay for d cow he stole?
Judgement day (day =1000yr 2pet3:8,)
judgement day Rev chapt20 note verse 1 to 3,4

No thanks to christiandom for spreading faleshood.

@anony
what u are describing at Rev20:10 "tommented day and night" has to follow what we said earlier.
does satan has a material body that will be burnt with literal fire? Is the wield beast literal?
We have already seen what fire stand for, permanent removal of the subject.
Why, not try forever and ever being the subject. Since fire is the symbolic word here how then do the expression for them loosing there lifes for ever and ever be put? I thought that since we know what fire stand for, when we come accross references with fire we apply or substitute what we know fire to stand for? Is that not the way keys or formulars are use?
Hope u dont have an interest of contradicting the bible?
I dont have ur problem since i simply apply what the bible shows to be d truth,

since i naver claim to be inspired i still dont have pros adjusting my thinking to suit what d bible says. Can i give myself life?

@cyrexx
well, its rether unfortunate that christiandom has serve this purpose to the bible. Well, befor the council that they claim they cananonise the bible what was the early christians using? Is it posible that those christian that even died for there faith had no reason to keep the holy writings together? I saw were apotle paul ask a congregation in galatia to read the leter he sent to corinth, if they where not gethered as holy writings how would that be possible? Catholics claim they put the bible together, how much lack of faith on God then do u want them to show on God's ability to protect his word? Meaning without them it would have been lost. Hahaha.

U are already affected by this act of christiandom so i can hadly say much to u than to say that a second open mind examination devoid of christiandom dogma should be attempted.

pauls leter to the theselonian at 1thess 2:13, the brothers receive the word from paul as God's word, why then will they not keep the laters as such? Why would words as important as that be left unattended to till about 5 century later?
D fact that u are here shows how important dis issues are to u, just dont let christiandom lead u to abandon the bible.
Peace

@area_boy
u b area boy through through, u will here christiandom teach trinity that is not a bible base teaching and u let it confuse u what then the use of the fine brain u have?
Men, read more of the bible urself and ask questions. Quoting wrong teaching does not say well of u. Christiandom is d problem of this world.

@anony
Good, thats good of u atleast u wish to use the bible as ur reference point, which i think should, the bible should speak and not motals that are here today and 2mrw are no more.

Now, have u ever ask what happened to hedes (hell) and dead when they are thrown into the lake of fire? It means there will be no more "dead" and no need for hedes (grave) what did d bible use to represent this action of no more dead? = fire.
If fire is use to represent a permanent removal of dead and grave why not get the sense thereof of how fire is use in d bible? Permanent removal. That is why after that Rev21:4 "said and dead will be no more" meaning if there will be no more dead then there will be no need for grave and fire was use for this removal of dead. Using fire as permanent removal clears away all the confussion that has been created by christiandom. Also, those that God will not bring back to life he always simply us fire reference to them = gone permanently. Ask yourself, hell, hedes, grave,can it be literary tormented in fire? Is it possible? Also dead that will be cast into fire is it a material substance that literal fire can born? Does it exist as an entity or it is a condition?
Peace.

@ cyrexx
i believe with more facts u will find out that u are really taking side with d bible (God) on dis particular issues of eternal punishment.

pls, read Rev 20:13,14 right away,
did u notice in vers 13 that hell gave up all d dead in it? Then while hell was still empty of dead person in vers 14 hell was then thrown into fire? Destroyed? D question, with empty hell put in fire were would dis bad people b burnt eternally? Dis is in agreement with Jesus words at John 5:28,29, "all the dead shall come out"
U see, God is not sadistic afterall.

D problem is with dis people opening churches and d othodox church at d start.
God is super intelligent and thinking person cant just accept d lies spread by christiandom off d bible.
Peace.

Sincerely, i wish d bible has not been misrepresented d way it has been then most of the comment here would not be necessery.

As it is, greedy miracle, prosperity seekers who have naver really love God will pick a line from d bible completely out of context and use it and others will follow through.

A look at Isaiah 46:9,10 and considering also Isaiah 45:18 gives the sense of what d context is about, the mention of telling d future is about d future of planet earth, that God created d earth from d beginning to be inherbited and that from d begining he God is telling the end that the earth will be inherbited. Here d issue was planet earth begining and end.
When reference are made on issues in d bible without taking the context into consideration then d sense will b lost,

however, dat is not to say that God can not tell d future if he wants to, but does d fact that one is skill in music means dat u will play music 24hrs a day, 7days a week, 30days a month, 365days a yr? If that is to be so, what time will u have to do other things? If God were to ensure we follow a destiny, of what use then does giving us a brain like ours serve? In what way are we then in Gods image if not in freewill? Who tells God what to do? Why does the bible say that there are two options befor a man if he has no option of choice and is destin?

When God has an interest he sure do follow it through like in the case of Jesus coming about 30 prophercies were given and he ensures they all came to past.
So, God can foretell d future if he so desires, but i cant see d logic in giving human a mind to make decission and at d same time not allow them to use it, of what use will it be?
Consider, u build a mobil toycar with a remote control and decided to control it into a pit after which u fetch the toycar and smarsh it for entering d pit.
First, who controled d toy car? Will it not be considered insanity to smarsh d toycar since u control it? But if d toy car was equip to make rational decission like human brain can do and be able to avoid pits, then for Good reason that toycar poor use of it freewill in making Good decission should be look into and even smarshing it can be considered rational.

I then find it defficult to reconcile freewill and destiny, someone bein destin and later being judge for the action he is being programme to perform, not to mention destiny and eternal punishment by God. Who is fooling who?
If my brain was design by God i sure believe that he is super wiser than i am to make such blonders, nature shows he is too wise for such error. D error is Human.

Are u then attributing all this sort of statement posted here to him?

D bible does not say that human in General are destin,

About satan, i thought people get a second name due to there occupation? A law man = lawer, a wood man = a carpenter, God naver created satan but rather he created a powerful angel with freewill, the names he is called are a narative of what he did (opposer, slanderer = satan and devil) how freewill agent uses there freewill is up to them, but there will be an accounting

One thing u all will help to put me through is this.
When d bible said that God drove adam and eve away from d garden of Eden, did he later went after them outside the garden and embrace them and there children or that it ment they were abandon? If it ment abandonment why are u attributing blame to God for all d bad that has taken place?
If it was not abandonment why was it necessary for Jesus christ to come for reconcilliation and show d way?

If only those carrying the bible will teach or get the sense of what d bible says then d issues we haggle about will not be necessary, but lots of evil has taken place in d name of d bible by greedy humans dat only remember God when they are in need of money or in trouble. God is wiser. Selfish people.

Ur friend is alread mad but he is not awear cus he is attributing extra ordinary power to d paper and not d words therein, u are also mad cus u believe d same thing with him,
secondly, it is said, show me ur friend and i will tell u who u are, so, now dat i know ur friend i now do know dat u are a mad fella, thinking that paper made of wood have power. not wise anough to know it is d writing on it.

I sicerely wish dat d bible has not been misrepresented then most of all what is said here about God would not be. Greedy miracle prosperity seekers who have naver realy have love for God will pick a line from d bible out of context will use it and others will simply follow through, a look at Isaiah 46:9,10 and considering Isaiah 45:18 give the sense of what d context telling d future was all about. When references are made concerning issues and lines are not drawn as to d start of d issue and d end it is wrong, here d issue was planet earth that it was created to be inherbited dat from de begining he God is telling how the earth will b in the end dat it will be inherbited. Yes, God can foresee d future if he wants to, but does d fact dat u are skill in music means dat u will have to play music 24hrs a day 7days a week 30days a month 365days a yr? If dat was to be what tym will u have to do other things what then d use of a brain like ours? What does it mean to be in God's image if not free will? Who tells God what to do? Destiny Yes, When God has an interest he can see to it, like in the case of Jesus coming that about 30 prophercies was given concerning his coming he saw to it that it came to past. Free will, what use is it giving human a mind to make decission if u will not let them use it? Who is there that will design a mobil toy car with a remote control and decided to control d car into a water ditch and den decided to smarsh the toy car for entering d ditch? Who controled d toy car? It will be an insanity to smarsh d car since u control it, but if d toy car was equip with d capacity to make rational decission like human brain and avoid ditches den for good reason that toycar poor use of it freewill in making decission should be look into den smarshing it can be rational. How den can i reconcil free will and destiny? One being destine and later judge for the action he was programme to perform? How den can i reconcil destiny and purnish by God? Who is fooling who? If my brain was design by God i sure believe that he is super wiser than i am, are u den attributing all dis irrational statement to him? D bible does not say dat human in general are destin. About satan, I thought people get a second name due to there occupation? A law man = lawer, a wood man = carpenter. God naver created satan but rather a powerful angel with free will, the names he is called is a narative of what he did (opposer, slanderer = satan and devil) how freewill agent use there freewill is up to them, but there will be an accounting. One thing all of u will have to put me through is this, when the bible said that God drove Adam and eve out of d garden of Eden did he later meet them outside d garden and enbrace them? Or that was abandonment? If d later was d case (abandon) why do u still blame God 4 all d bad things taking place? If it was not abandoment why was it necessary for Jesus christ to come for reconciliation? If only those carrying d bible will teach or get d sense of what d bible says then d issue we haggle about will not be necessery, but lots of evil has taken place and is still taking place in d name of d bible by greedy humans dat remember God when i need or in trouble, God is wiser. Selfish people.

On this issue of d existance of God i just cant pass it bye.
Its rether unfortunate what greedy human has done to christian religion, teaching philosophies of men as doctrine teaching in effect doctrine off the bible, with dat d efficacy of what is contain in d bible is lost to most people.

Though no man at any time has ever seen God but from things seen and from creation we can use it to prove d existance of God. I marvel at my brain as a circuit designer and what i can do with it dat i cant even imagine thinking it came by chance, but dat is relative since all brains dont perform in d same level, 4 those, chance? Maybe.

Some part of d bible is 3500yrs old,
and i found some info contain therein that got me asking my self a lot of question.
Isaiah 40:22 3000yrs old, Job 26:7 3500yrs old, Deuteronomy 23:13 3500yrs old.
If 3000 yrs ago Isaiah leaving in tent on a desert with enemies all around was able to be spot on in passing terms give d shape of d earth as a circle when well known philosophers got it wrong? i cant help but ask how did he come to know dat? We know how recent that knowledge is in secular quarters.
Isaiah said it was God who ask him to write what he wrote so if he was ask to prove or give reason why he wrote dat d earth is a circle he will have none but dat God ask him to write.
Same also with Job 3500yrs ago dat said dat d "earth is hanging on nothing" suspended, if i was with him den i would have said dat he is insane cause dat statement defies d law of gravity but how right he was 3500yrs ago,
ofcouse he did not need to prove anything since he said he was inspired, though i know he would have been unable to prove anything since such knowledge was beyound human knowledge then.

I dont believe dat dis fact contain in d bible came by chance but that though human den did not know > THERE EXIST ONE THAT KNOWS. Since such knowlegde was above human 3500yrs and they said God told them what to write, that means >God EXIST.
How then did they come to have such knowledge? See also laws on hygiene meant to protect from bacterial infection when human knew nothing about bacterial transmission then. The bible is so replicated with such info, water circle galaxies, etc dat i wish i had started earlier.

Most of what is use as a basis for argument in dis forum are realy not base on what d bible teach but rether slogans that this church owners carry. D bible has realy been misrepresented and d foolishness in that is seen in forum like dis where it is use against those misquoting d bible.
D bible does not need assistance from human knowledge to defend itself. Infact, when science get it right as a fact it always rhyms with the bible. Note, d bible is not a science text book, but all this on the line of describing God.

Devid, bible writer who also claim to be inspired wrote that in the belly of his mother (womb) he was screen, and that all his body parts details where down in writings, that in a wanderful way he was made by God befor be was born.
If scientist had not got DNA sorted out rightly, how would we have come to know that by inspiration david got it rightly described 3000yrs ago in the psalms? (a bible book)