₦airaland Forum

toba:
Dont try to stupidly cover up for your error. Answer my question&stop acting like an ignorant looser

emmmm, what error??

Dont blame your inability to comprehend written english on me pal.

You can copy and paste the whole quote and post it in the literature section, maybe they can explain it to you.


Anyway, thats not the issue of the thread, . . .I wonder why your ''more to come'' post is taking forever. . . . We cant wait!!!

toba:
I will ask u again to show me the said list.
Isnt there a difference between 'AIO suggested we draw up a list of attributes'&'pastor suggested a list of similarities and so on '?
Just show me what the list entails

toba:
u better keep quite. U said pastor AIO suggested the list of similarities and so on. Show me the list he suggested on this thread?

ooooh goodness, goodness. . . .

I was hoping, just hoping you werent this stoopid. Tahts why i requested you look and think again

Pastor AIO:

I think that the way to go about this is for both parties to draw up 2 [b]lists of attributes.


The list of attributes of Esu vis a vis the list of attributes of Satan. And then we'll see how many similarities or dissimilarities there are between them.

Toba: bayo, how are you gonna solve your birthday logistics problem

bayo: my wife suggested a list.

Are you telling me that the conversation above only implies bayo's wife wrote a list? Or it can also mean bayo's wife suggested bayo draw up a list?

This is just sad! Education in Nigeria is damn bad.

Tell me, seriously, did you attend any university?

toba:
on the contrary u're the uneducated chap. u only displayed lack of understanding

*Yawn*
If we were to conduct a poll and people read my posts and read yours there's no doubt who they'll consider uneducated i.e YOU.

i did made points, its your lack of understanding that have blindfolded u from seeing themode.

You made [b]POINTS[/B]? Wow!!
The spam bot must have eaten them up.

Ehmmm. . .kindly [b]POINT[/B] us to the [b]POINT[/B] where you made your [b]POINTS[/B]. . .infact to make life easier for you, just give us the post serial numbers.

Oh, maybe the singular quote ''esu= asutani= satan'' counts as 25 [b]POINTS[/B]

i asked a question on the kind of esu pple link there misfortunes to. u ignorantly termed it to something else

oooohhhh, there are different kinds of 'esu'?

Mehn! We learn new things everyday. Pls hurry up with your ''more to come'' post. I cant wait to read and learn more.

u bi proper mumu. someone who knows nothings about tradition,but based hs/hr understanding from religious angle cant discuss esu abi? he/she sti l needs to be a genius? i pity your reasoniing mentality

understanding from religious angle?
What religion, if I may ask?

If you know nothing about tradition, myth and divinity in yorubaland how are you gonna know what esu meant to the yoruba culture, its practices, principles etc in order to make a comparison with the mythical satan character??

I wouldnt sweat it, you are a ''genius'' you should be able to do it.

I cant wait!!

who are the we? i can see its only u that have challenged me since yestday. oh sorry, i see that u are 2 in one. a male, having the photograph of a female in his profile&also (f) inscription in front of his name no? better still she.male/papiwater

what is this?
There are many readers on this thread who'll be interested in the [b]POINTS[/B] to bemade made by toba the great dimwit genius.

It'll interest you to know that i already got a mail from a reader concerning this thread and the article I copied and pasted.

So, oga, dont disappoint us who are ready to learn.

We caint wait for your ''more to come'' posts!!!!

toba:
OMG
What kind of a pathetic slowpoke are u. Where on this thread did Pastor AIO suggest any list of 'similarities and so on'? He said both parties should draw up¬ that he suggested any list of attributes to either of us.learn to be scrupulous

Did this fool actually go to school??

Where did I imply pastor AIO suggested a list of attributes to us?

Here is the quote ;

. . . .''pastor suggested a list of similatities and so on, the onus is on you to provide them and show that esu = satan''

i suggest you read it again then come back to me.

Clue: read the bolded part and determine the implication on the meaning of that statement. Goodluck

^^^
bTW, your half-witted excuse wont fly as usual. . . Pastor suggested a list of similarities and so on, the onus is on you to provide them and show that esu = satan.

We cant wait!! South Africa 2010!

toba:
I ve always been willing to discuss intelligently like i always do.

Joke of the century. . . .

To think i will discuss with an unintelligent fellow like u is very unlikely.

If AIO returns i will do that with him

So now, this is your excuse??

This is just laughable. . . Days before pastor AIO came you didnt say any smart thing all of a sudden u want us to believe you'll magically bring anything of substance to the discussion? Pssf!

toba:
IF the nuissance act and touting language u display on NL is what u call intelligence and education, i really pity your soul and that of those that have trained you.
your brain is dead thats why u spew rants and insults here and there.

keep crying. . . . You are NOT educated, its pretty obvious.

Another example of retardation, In my post above, i gave an illustration of what i meant in my post above, yet a pathetic tout and rouge called tudor have refused to accept my point, What a same to your life

you made no point, dont kid yourself.
When asked to defend your position you ran and claimed it was your ''choice''. You are indeed dumb

what type of Esu do people say is responsible for their evil deeds? u slowpoke
U see armed robbers cry on TV ise esu ni, esu lotimi si, Which esu are t6hey referring to?

so this is your ''analysis'' to show that Esu = Satan?? What armed robbers say on TV??

And you complain when I call you dimwit?

.

How come u think i might be a genius after calling me all sorts of names? ITs either that u make your posts under cheap weed or u re unconscious whislt representing your self on line.

Go get a life

*BIG FAT YAWN*

any man who claims he can discuss/analyse 'ESU' without a ''recourse to tradition'' must be a genius. . . .

Like I said, we eagerly await the 'more' analysis that is to come from you. DONT RUN PLS

I certainly cant wait. . .

toba:
U re right pastor on the need to establish the attributes of both

Esu and satan some similarities.

Esu part of esu's attributes is to wrath evil, satan does likewise. More to come

GOOD. . . I'm glad we have gone past the Esu = satan QED rant. You are finally ready to discuss intelligently

Esu ''wraths evil''?
Please tell us how. . .

Mehn I cant wait for the 'more' to come. . . . Please dont keep us waiting.

This is goonna be fun!!!!!!!!!

toba:
The same way u feel about others is exactly how u tudor is being perceived by others. If U are intelligent u don't to degenerate to low level of insult and call others such as these Geez what a braindead fool. daft

No offense, calling YOU braindead isnt insult. . . Na TRUTH

like I said, you can keep crying. I myself will suggest you begin to educate yourself

And so u are as well mr miss tudor
I dont need to read a copied article of which u aren't the author

Quite sad, coz if only you read at all to educate yourself your pathetic intellect will prolly not be where it is today.

What a shame.

I gave my view based of 'theistic' aspect by which i mean 'as a theist what esu is to a Yoruba Muslim or a Christian theist.

oh, its no longer yoruba theism, se? I laugh

you gave NOTHING! All you did was state Esu = satan = asutani=bla ba. Thats just stoopid.

We await you to come tell us how Esu is the same as satan of the jews.

Keep quite guy u are not the author of this thread neither will i take instructions from whatever nonsense u trying to prove inhere

I seriously wonder what the rubbish above means

How is it your challenge if i choose to discuss Esu without a recourse to any tradition?

Oh, really?
eMmm what is 'ESU' if not part of yoruba culture and tradition?

Mehn you gotta wonder at the amount of stupidity on display here. . .

So you are gonna discuss ESU without any ''recourse to tradition''.?

You might be a genius afterall. . .pls be we await your discussion. . . This should be fun!!!

Missy B:
Dolemite and Tudòr are very annoying. 

Haba. . .no vex oo. You are cool though i no dey like vex cool pple.

spikedcylinder:
Ahhhh! Ya gotta love this dude and his witty comebacks. Carry on, Tudor.
Akin says hi, by the way.

LOL Say Hi to Akin too for moi

BTW, about your siggy did kosovo really say that, coz if he did it confirms my earlier suspicion of psychiatric issues going on there. . .

Where is Afam the so called crusader against 'hypocrisy'. . . We dont see the dimwit beaf and cohomology to come rain curses and 'jehovah's punishment' on  the Turkish army.

Is it only a 'massacre' and 'outrage' when people die in israeli hands?

Pastor AIO:
I think that the way to go about this is for both parties to draw up 2 lists of attributes.

The list of attributes of Esu vis a vis the list of attributes of Satan. And then we'll see how many similarities or dissimilarities there are between them.

Pastor AIO:
I think that the way to go about this is for both parties to draw up 2 lists of attributes.

The list of attributes of Esu vis a vis the list of attributes of Satan. And then we'll see how many similarities or dissimilarities there are between them.

GBAM! Thats the thing any sensible person who want to prove ESU is satan will do.

The truth is they dont even know what esu means in the first place, rather than educating themselves they prefer to come argue blindly and scorn the traditional chief in the article.

toba:
Since this is the path u like, i will follow suitI hope u don't count your self as an intelligent person, cos your posts speaks on the contrary. this is your first post on this thread
I cant  understand how the so called intelligent person will call others mumu whilst trying to make a point

See the 2nd post of an intelligent person
Another post of mr intelligent tudor

your posts on this thread are not that of an intelligent person but that of a slowpoke and a pathetic fool. 'Its takes one to know one'

An intelligent man is one who identifies a dolt and tells him straight to the face. That I call you a mumu is not me trying to insult you but just telling it the way it is.

Keep crying. . .fool

Have you ever thought ; Oh this Tudor keeps calling me a dunce, am I actually this stoopid?


If you really look inwards at yourself, the answer will befuddle you.

U re very silly, my comment on this thread had nothing to do with culture. I expressed myself from a yoruba theistic view point, Which was why i said a yoruba muslim will say asutani= esu and the christian counterpart will say esu=satani. How it concerns culture i dont know

You are a capital iidiot for this statement and a PURE Illiterate.

Yoruba ''theistic'' view? Do you even know what that means? In yoruba theism and divinity, what does 'ESU' stand for? Did yoruba theism ever have a character like satan of the jews?
Clue: read the article I pasted, slowpoke

A yoruba high chief gives an Interview and declares to be an ESU worshipper and not a satanist. Then arrongant illiterates who feel they have the right to pass judgement declare that NO, he MUST be a satan worshipper and satan = ESU.

Prove and Defend your claim that satan is Esu you start running around like headless chickens claiming its your ''choice'' and ''opinion''.

Stop shouting just yesterday night (sunday) OBA sikiru Adetona was speaking on Tv condemning most of the so called cultures of the yorubas that they are against development. And the yeye esu culture u re strongly speaking for is among what the league of southwest OBAs are trying to repel.

Again, we are talking about the MEANING OF ESU in yoruba culture/language/mythology. Stick to the topic dimwit.

This thread is to discuss what 'ESU' meant to our forefathers and find out through fact based discussions if it has anything to do with the 'satan' of the judeo christian faiths.

If you have nothing intelligent to say other than the half-wit ''satan = Esu'' I suggest you take a hike.

spicyhoney:
Some day it will get to that and there is no need waiting for churches to that, u as an individual can do your own contributions to your community and u dnt need to be extremely rich b4 u can do so.

And your pastor who is 'extremely' rich, what has he done, besides purchasing 3 luxury jets one for each of his ba.lls and spare?

I can see from your write ups that u re a sick individual. So i wouldnt waste time xplaining anything to a low life. FYI am a girl, a chick, babe and not an 'Oga' if your brain can grasp that since u cant see the 'F' beside my username.
Mind u, u can respond but i promise not to reply.

Dimwit, who cares if you're a transexual? I dont give a damn. Stick to the thread and lets see how smart and fully grounded in christianity you are.

Keep thinking you'll be a millonaire if you continue giving your money to some pastor. Dont get off your lazy arse, use your brains and work. Mugu

Dolemite:
Commendable but I'm not moved, even Abacha gave to orphanages from time to time. . .with all these money they have I'm thinking free schools, road projects, medical care, not sending some bags of rice to some few people. . .

GBAM!
Even Osama Bin Laden gives to less unfortunate people. . .so no be today

Missy B:
Scared? No.
It's just unpleasant, on so many grounds, not to accord people the respect they deserve.  

ha ha ha RESPECT?

I still Loff You sha  . . . .God Loves You more.

lol tell god i dont need his love. . .he/she/it should concentrate on showing 'love' to those innocent children starving and dying  in ethiopia and congo.

spicyhoney:
And so what if they are rich? Must men of God be poor before they can preach the gospel or lead souls to heaven.

People should wake up and stop crucifying God's children. Remember the bible says 'Touch not my anointed and do my prophets no harm'

In my opinion, preachers of the word of God are supposed to live lives worth emulating and not live in poverty, you should be able to see the manifestations of God's blessings on your pastor. Moreover, the wealth gotten by these mentioned churches were not forced out from the church member's pockets they willingly gave out.
Though u ve a right to your own opinion but may God have mercy on u and  forgive u.

oga, its greedy people like you that fall for these scam artistes like Adeboye and Oyedepo.

You want to be 'rich' at all costs and think riches come from paying taxtithe and giving pastor royalties.

Here I was thinking the word is ''CHRISTian'' i.e live like and emulate CHRIST yet all we see is you jokers striving to be like Con men in suits like Oyakhilome. What a shame

Missy B:
Y'all should pay 'my' Tudòr no mind.
He's an atheist and therefore sees nuffin wrong in bad-mouthing men of God or God himself. Hand go meet am, someday. 

aaaah mehn not you too. . . .cmon, dont tell me you one of those scared of these self appointed men of 'god'?

bobby joe:
@ tudor, who is dis naughty woman,u r going to rot in hell 4 dis bullshit u writing.

And you will be accepted into ''heaven'' for this post above, right? and naughty woman is the censored form of ''bi*tch* no?

You gotta love this god and his/her/it's followers. . . .

[quote author=Aloy+Emeka link=topic=464089.msg6251019#msg6251019 date=1277062005]Since you are a true believer in Yoruba mythology, so you actually believe Oduduwa fell from heaven?[/quote]who cares if oduduwa fell from mars?

We are discussing what 'ESU' means in yoruba culture/mythology or did u miss that?

This article is for genuine people who want to know what ESU meant to our forefathers and not for iidiots who wanna debate using fantasies amd ''choices'' they invented.

What Really is Esu?
by Ebun-Oluwa Kumuyi

Due to Christian syncretism in Nigeria, the Deity or Orisa Esu has become synonymous with the Christian devil. There are many different reasons why and how this came to be so. Let us examine those reasons, and allow us to come to a better understanding of Olorun's messenger, aka Esu!

Esu has many different personalities and can do many things, as most Orisa. He is most popularly known as the trickster, the guarder of the crossroads, the gatekeeper of Heaven, the choice giver and justice maker. The latter task, in my scholarly opinion, is the main reason why the European decided to mask Esu as the "bad one."

In naming Esu as the trickster, let us refer to Odù Iwori-Ofun which says:

Owon so ibi di ire agba lo da'fa fun ogejan, elegbe Ifá. Owon so ibi di ire on li o da inu aye on li o ko gbogbo ire wa inu aye, oran ti ko ba dara ehin ni da si. Nigbati Esu gbo pe awon ore meji so pe awon ko ni ja lai-lai nigbana ni Esu lo da fila aliawo apa kan fun-fun, apa kan si dudu; o si lo koja larin awon meji ore, o si da ija sile larin awon.

This verse tells the story of two best friends who visited a Babalawo for a consultation. It was told by Olodumare through Ifá to the Babalawo that the friends needed to make a sacrifice in order to preserve their friendship. They had enough faith in their relationship that they refused to perform the sacrifice. Esu heard of this, and decided to put on a hat that was half white and half black and walked past the friends where one stood on the right, and the other at Esu's left. They both commented on the same man, but argued over the color of his hat; one seeing only the white side, and the other seeing only the black. It turns out that through this disagreement their friendship ended. Had they performed the prescribed sacrifice to God, they would have died best friends instead of having lived as enemies.

This is an example of Esu being the trickster, as well as him being a dealer of justice. Not performing a sacrifice is a slight to God, a suggestion that you have more power than He to control your own destiny and deny His advise. Neither God, Orunmila nor Esu appreciate this type of arrogant behaviour. When this happens, humans are punished. Esu's role as the "punisher" is what lead the Europeans to convince our own people that God's messenger is really the devil!

Let us now compare Esu and the devil according to the Bible and verses of Ifá. The Bible says that the devil was cast out of Heaven for competing with God. This is not true of Esu, nor is there any historical/ mythical evidence through Yoruba text to back this assertion. The devil makes his home in hell-fire and is the antithesis of anything Heavenly. Esu resides between Heaven and Earth, serving as God's messenger to man and carrying sacrifices from Earth to Heaven. He is also the gatekeeper of Heaven, which the devil certainly is not! Esu does not wait for humans to die so that he may carry them off to hell. Esu does not encourage evil, nor is he the father of evil. These are attributes of the Christian devil that are non-existent in traditional Yoruba culture.

Many times Esu will force us to look at the ugliness within ourselves so that we may see who we are in true light, recognise the wrong and change it so that we are better able to please God. It is Esu that makes us remember: S'otito, s'ododo, ma s'ika - Orisa gbe iwa pele O! This basically means to do good, and perform well without doing harm - the Orisa support good character!

This is not to say that the Yoruba are naive enough to have a disbelief in evil and evil forces. That would be foolish - especially of a culture that strongly believes in a balance of nature. Where there exists good, there must also exist evil and our ancestors understood this clearly. It has been misunderstood, however, that Esu is the master of this evil when in fact he is not. The Yoruba do have a belief in evil forces that parade around during the dark hours and cause harm to humans and nature. These forces work with those with iwa buruku (bad character) and help them achieve evil goals on earth; it should be noted that those forces are not Orisa. It is strongly believed that Olodumare ni idajo - meaning that God is the owner of ALL judgement. Those who intentionally perform evil acts on Earth will eventually be judged by God and will have to answer for their acts. May the blessings of God be upon you forever and always, Ase!
Reprinted with kind permission from Ebun- Oluwa Kumuyi, For more articles by this author, please visit Naija Mall. Copyright © Ebun-Oluwa Kumuyi 2000. All rights reserved.

http://www.awostudycenter.com/Articles/art_what_is_esu.htm

aileru:
May God Almighty forgive you

You can tell God to kiss my arse. . . .

mydreamz:
No one has the right to condemn his fellow human

so going by your logic, i see a paedp.phile defiling your 7 year old daughter I just keep quiet and move on because ''
No one has the right to condemn his fellow human
'' Are you fkcing serious?

toba:
Say whatever u like, thats your problem&personal challenge&how my choice  affects u,i still dont know.
esu is satan thats its.
If u not satisfied with my conclusion u may hang yourself. I ve the right not to believe in any cultural dictate,that add no meaning to me.
U are a pathetic&complicated guy&u cant be taken seriously.Scarcely will u make any post with adding insult to butress your riduculous point. How long will this nuissance act of yours last? Just because i refuse to accept your so called culture, you degenerated to such a low level? Very pathetic

*BIG FAT YAWN*

so why dont you keep your daft opinions to yourself instead of coming here to challenge intelligent people who are here to discuss the etymology of the word esu.

You came here claiming Jentwemi was talking ''nonsense'' feeling smart with yourself YET you cannot in any way refute his claims intelligently. Isnt it obvious you are way out of your league when all you can say to butress your point is ''Esu = satan''? Then when asked to defend it you claim its your ''choice''. Are you a fool?
We deal with facts here not ''choices''. Keep your damn ''choices'' to yourself!

You are free to invent your own culture and belief BUT We are talking about the yoruba culture and mythology here and if you're going to barge and start running your mouth anyhow we are gonna need facts and valid points not rubbish you invented in your head.

Jeez, What an illiterate slowpoke.

toba:
U this guy called tudor,its as u re under a spell to insult people in order to express your self proper.
See your life. U are here ranting&making a case for esu as not being satan,yet u dont believe in the existence of either,not to talk of God no?

How has this empty barrel rant addressed issues?

Do I need to believe in Esu before I know what the concept means in my culture? Were you born daft or wat?

Its a matter of belief. Some will refer to God as a seen object eg cow, while others will say,hes an unseen being. Whatever u like pick&how my choice/affects your life personally i dont know.U chose not to believe a God,thats your choice&others have contrary view.So let it be. Esu=satan.

Mr man, this thread is NOT about belief in god or non belief so stop blabbing off point.

Esu translates as satan is a matter of belief? Soon you'll say rat translates as ekute is a matter of belief. . dont tell me you dont see how pathetically stoopid your posts are.

toba:
Emeka i can see the similarity&agree with u 100%
a yoruba muslim will say asutani=esu, the yb christian will say satani=esu.
I prayed a prayer today 'olorun yami ya esu' i.e God should separate me from esu/satan.
As a yoruba man, i dont see any good esu have done for me&my generation.As long as God lives i will never have any pact with esu/satan

Its as if your brain is not working?

A yoruba man says satan = esu, so what?

The question youu should ask is when did the term 'esu' come into yoruba language, was it before or after christianity came and if it was before, what did it mean then?

Rather than intelligently looking at the issue by analyzing what 'ESU' meant in yoruba culture before christianity and comparing it with the 'satan' concept of the jews like a sane man will do to justify if the two concepts relate at all, you're busy ranting 'a yoruba man will say esu= satan, muslim say asutani and bla bla'.
That people use a concept does that automatically make it right?

Geez what a braindead fool.

They are all Rogues. . . . I wonder why the chief thief Adeboye isnt on the list.

^^
I agree with you. . . What is it with these useless Hot aszholes trying to score some puunani on an online discussion forum?

[quote author=Aloy+Emeka link=topic=464089.msg6245264#msg6245264 date=1276963000]So what is satan in Yoruba if not Esu?[/quote]Mofo, in yoruba mythology we do not have any black magical being who carries a fork, has a tail and rebelled against a white bearded man called jehovah.

Esu is Esu and the term existed even before the christian myth arrived our shores.

If you are dying to give satan a name why not use ''Sat`ani'' the way we translated bread a totally new concept as ''buredi''.

Isnt it obvious that this is just a publicity stunt by the luantic to gain more attention?

Kosovo is not about to forego his life ambition of being a moderator on nairaland. Infact now that debosky has been kicked out the dude sure has his eyes on being a supermoderator in place of debosky.

I wonder why seun just loves psychiatric patients who start THREADS LIKE THIS

Travelista:
*picks up mic*

Oprah is a fat pig in a frock.

Just thought that need clarification; let's get back to the previously scheduled program.

*drops mic*

Thank you. . . I thought I was the only one.

Now you all can go after Oprah who ACTUALY makes the billions and not Lalla Diakite who is prolly a housewife.

jennykadry:
@tudor

This is a list of what cheap really is amongst others

a cheap shot
a criticism of someone that is unfair
She dismissed his comments as a cheap shot, saying that he was only concerned to defend himself.



cheap   adjective ( DRESSED SEXILY )
adj
disapproving If you describe the way a person is dressed as cheap, you mean that it is very obvious that they are trying to sexually attract other people.


cheap   adjective ( LOW PRICE )
•
costing little money or less than is usual or expected




cheap adjective ( UNKIND )
adj
disapproving unpleasant and unkind
I wish you'd stop making cheap jokes about my friends.


How come your dictionary talked abt the money aspect alone?

My dictionary is actually Cambridge Advanced Learners. . .na so I for just fail exam and to think I paid good money for this incomplete shiit.

Its all good. . .so tell me, which of the above ''cheap'' applies to Drogba's wife?