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 Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 10:49am On Apr 19 |
Fighttillvictory:in case you didn't read, getting a same sex partner is a sin in the catholic church and the documant release says that it is impossible to marry gay couples because marriage can only happen between a man and a woman. You seem to be really ignorant about the topic you are commenting on |
| Religion / Re: If A Mentally Ill Person Commits Suicide, Will He Still Go To Heaven? by Ubenedictus(m): 8:23am On Apr 17 |
Kobojunkie:you only read some passage of scriptures and you assume you know all. Culpability is something different, please go an read your bible and stop being half baked |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 8:22am On Apr 17 |
Fighttillvictory:You quoted me so I am going to quote you. Yes there was a complaint and an official question was sent to the vatican on this issue. |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 9:38pm On Feb 14 |
Fighttillvictory:You somehow think every LGBTQ person is the same and all are incapable of seeking forgiveness and be sorry for their sin? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 11:01am On Jan 10 |
Fighttillvictory:i am telling you that there are sinners who seek Christ. I also know sinners who are caught in their cycles of sin. I know cohabitings couples who some times come for mass and all kinds of sinners including myself who come to church. I don't know how each priest handled a homosexual couple who comes to them, but it was serious enough for cardinals to ask about it, hence the document. |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 2:29pm On Jan 02 |
Fighttillvictory:This is why it is good to read the document, because the document actually says that the couple has to come like "we have sinned and are addicted to this". Now let me quote the document 31. Within the horizon outlined here appears the possibility of blessings for couples in irregular situations and for couples of the same sex, the form of which should not be fixed ritually by ecclesial authorities to avoid producing confusion with the blessing proper to the Sacrament of Marriage. In such cases, a blessing may be imparted that not only has an ascending value but also involves the invocation of a blessing that descends from God upon those who—recognizing themselves to be destitute and in need of his help—do not claim a legitimation of their own status, but who beg that all that is true, good, and humanly valid in their lives and their relationships be enriched, healed, and elevated by the presence of the Holy Spirit. These forms of blessing express a supplication that God may grant those aids that come from the impulses of his Spirit—what classical theology calls “actual grace”—so that human relationships may mature and grow in fidelity to the Gospel, that they may be freed from their imperfections and frailties, and that they may express themselves in the ever-increasing dimension of the divine love. 32. Indeed, the grace of God works in the lives of those who do not claim to be righteous but who acknowledge themselves humbly as sinners, like everyone else. This grace can orient everything according to the mysterious and unpredictable designs of God. Therefore, with its untiring wisdom and motherly care, the Church welcomes all who approach God with humble hearts, accompanying them with those spiritual aids that enable everyone to understand and realize God’s will fully in their existence.[22] 33. This is a blessing that, although not included in any liturgical rite,[23] unites intercessory prayer with the invocation of God’s help by those who humbly turn to him. God never turns away anyone who approaches him! Ultimately, a blessing offers people a means to increase their trust in God. The request for a blessing, thus, expresses and nurtures openness to the transcendence, mercy, and closeness to God in a thousand concrete circumstances of life, which is no small thing in the world in which we live. It is a seed of the Holy Spirit that must be nurtured, not hindered. 34. The Church’s liturgy itself invites us to adopt this trusting attitude, even in the midst of our sins, lack of merits, weaknesses, and confusions, as witnessed by this beautiful Collect from the Roman Missal: “Almighty ever-living God, who in the abundance of your kindness surpass the merits and the desires of those who entreat you, pour out your mercy upon us to pardon what conscience dreads and to give what prayer does not dare to ask” (Collect for the Twenty-Seventh Sunday of Ordinary Time). How often, through a pastor’s simple blessing, which does not claim to sanction or legitimize anything, can people experience the nearness of the Father, beyond all “merits” and “desires”? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 2:23pm On Jan 02 |
Donedeal1:at least wwe know that blessing gay marriage has not happened and the document has said that the catholic church does not even have the power to bless such 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 12:08pm On Dec 27, 2023 |
blowjohn: Therefore, by giving this blessing to two people who spontaneously come forward to request it, one can legitimately ask God to grant them health, peace, prosperity—the things that we all ask for and that a sinner can also ask for. At the same time, since one can think that in the daily lives of these two persons, not everything is sin, one can therefore pray for them [to receive] a spirit of dialogue, patience, mutual help. But the declaration also mentions a request for help from the Holy Spirit so that this relationship, which is often unknown to the priest, may be purified of everything that does not respond to the Gospel and the will of God, and may mature along the lines of God's plan. https://www.pillarcatholic.com/p/cardinal-fernandez-same-sex-blessing 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 12:07pm On Dec 27, 2023 |
blowjohn:every sin is satanic, that is why it is called sin 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 12:06pm On Dec 27, 2023 |
blowjohn: Are you even aware that therapy can not be used to change an homosexual? That homosexuality is not considered a psychological issue in the western world and to even attempt such a thing will make the psychologist lose his licence? the document say the priest should be the one to proclaim the Keryma to the homosexuals because homosexuality is still a moral issue. 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 12:03pm On Dec 27, 2023 |
blowjohn: because healing is not automatic, it begins with grace but the homosexual still has decisions to make and new ways of living to adopt. All the more reason why a priest should be willing to pray that God helps the homosexual to transform his life. 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 12:01pm On Dec 27, 2023 |
Nobody is blessing what God prohibits, did you read the document? fredie107: |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 11:59am On Dec 27, 2023 |
Fighttillvictory: Even the catholic church holds that homosexuality is a sin and homosexual marriage is null and void, so I wonder what you are preaching about when the catholic church agree with you. But also people come to priests and say pray for me, bless me. we are not perfect, we all sin, but the priest always blesses, I wonder what bigotry makes you feel that all kinds of sinners can be blessed in the church except homosexuals |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 11:55am On Dec 27, 2023 |
Donedeal1: Funny enough the document you people are shouting about and you refused to read it clearly says that the Catholic church does not have the power to impart blessing on a same sex marriage. but you won't read and are quick to critique 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 11:51am On Dec 27, 2023 |
blowjohn:Sinners do whatever sinners do It is not a crime for a gay couple to ask for a blessing from a priest to live better lives or for something they need. you can go ask them, but I know it happens. People can seek God in private, they can ask a priest for a blessing. Interestingly enough the cardinal who wrote the communique explained it clearly. [b] These kinds of blessings are simply simple pastoral channels that help to express people's faith, even if those people are great sinners. Therefore, by giving this blessing to two people who spontaneously come forward to request it, one can legitimately ask God to grant them health, peace, prosperity—the things that we all ask for and that a sinner can also ask for. At the same time, since one can think that in the daily lives of these two persons, not everything is sin, one can therefore pray for them [to receive] a spirit of dialogue, patience, mutual help. But the declaration also mentions a request for help from the Holy Spirit so that this relationship, which is often unknown to the priest, may be purified of everything that does not respond to the Gospel and the will of God, and may mature along the lines of God's plan. As I was saying, sometimes the priest, on a pilgrimage, does not know that couple, and sometimes they are two very close friends who share good things, sometimes they had sexual relations in the past and now what remains is a strong sense of belonging and mutual help. As a parish priest, I have often met such couples, who are sometimes exemplary. Therefore, since it is not a question of the sacrament of confession(!), but of a simple blessing, it is still asked that this friendship be purified, matured and lived in fidelity to the Gospel. And even if there was some kind of sexual relationship, known or not, the blessing made in this way does not validate or justify anything. Actually the same thing happens whenever individuals are blessed, because that individual who asks for a blessing — not absolution — may be a great sinner, but we do not deny a blessing to him. But clearly we have to grow in the conviction that non-ritualized blessings are not a consecration of the person, they are not a justification of all his actions, they are not a ratification of the life he leads. No. No. I do not know at what point we have so exalted this simple pastoral gesture that we have equated it with the reception of the Eucharist. [/b] https://www.pillarcatholic.com/p/cardinal-fernandez-same-sex-blessing 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:55pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
blowjohn:The introduction of a book is not the book, go and read the document biko. and the circular was released because certain cardinals asked about it, if there are questions about murderers, why not, a circular will be released. the practice of homosexuality is a sin. That one is clear even in the document. But blessing are not only for the morally perfect, even sinners are blessed |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:52pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
blowjohn:The pope and tha catholic chuch alread condemns homosexual sexual actions and relationships, what more do you want? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:51pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Fighttillvictory: Actually the document was not written by the pope, it was written by Cardinal Fernandez in charge of doctrine at the vatican and the pope approved it. and the document actually specifies the time of blessings to be given, a blessing for healing, that what is good in their life be enriched and that God helps them with grace to conform the lives to his will AKA repentance. The document clearly said that same sex sexual stuff is unacceptable and the church cannot bless their union, so it is certainly not a blessing to "multiply". Oga all these things were addressed in the document, if you bother to read it. Even the man who wrote the document when he saw the funny interpretation from people who refused to read, had to come out and clarify again, weytin human beings want. The document is there, read it |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:42pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
blowjohn:Of course we are with people created in the image and likeness of God and our job is to help them on a journey to repentance. Jesus came for the sinners not the righteous. I am proudly with the gays just as Jesus was with the prostitutes and tax collectors of his time |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:40pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
blowjohn:In fact a prayer for forgiveness is a blessing. When catholics go to request a prayer for forgiveness they begin with "bless me for I have sinned. Again all of this was well explained in the document if you had read it you won't be asking all this. The document stated clearly that God's will it for man and woman in exclusive union of marriage, anything apart from that is wrong. So when a gay couple come for a blessing, it is an acknowledgement that they too are sinner and a request to they are making to God to grant them healing and the grace they need to live according to his will it is a prayer for repentance for people who have started to feel the stirring of the holy spirit call them to conversion |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:35pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
blowjohn:You won't be asking all these questions if you actually read the document, because all of these points were well explained There is no issue with the word "couples" because the first part of what the pope said is that the church does not have the power to bless same sex union because it is against Gods will, it is only the people who are blessed. The relationship is sinful and the blessing is to ask God to heal them. Even a prayer for deliverance is a blessing, in fact the simple prayer "may the lord bless you and keep you" is a blessing, it is an invocation of God's grace on people. "May the Lord deliver you" is also a blessing as most invocations of God's grace upon people are blessings. And the blessing the priest should ask for the same sex people is the grace of healing and the grace to follow the will of God which is man and woman exclusive union. |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:25pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
drnoel: They did not read the document they are just talking rubbish 1 Like |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:25pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
ariesbull: Whaat madness do you not support biko, let me hear it? Is it today that priest started to bless sinners? Do fornicators and adulterers not go to priests for blessing for good health and get blessed? why the sudden cry because the sinners going for a blessing are gay people? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 4:21pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
bitbillionaire:Th quote I gave you is directly from what the pope said. He said the church does not have the power to bless any same sex union or marriage, However, Jesus is God's blessing to us while we were still sinners and that tells us that sinners can be blessed without blessing the sins or sinful relationship. Therefore if people in a sinful relationship come to a priest and say Fr. bless me, the priest should always be willing to open his hands and grant a blessing, just as any sinner can receive a blessing. however, that blessing is also a request to God to heal those people and give them the grace to live according to his will. That blessing can also be an opportunity to preach to them. However, the blessing should not occur with any sign, gesture, vestment, place or word that will make people think that the sinful relationship is being blessed. you can read the full document https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_ddf_doc_20231218_fiducia-supplicans_en.html |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:19am On Dec 26, 2023 |
drnoel: It is a matter of avoiding that “something that is not marriage is being recognized as marriage.”[5] Therefore, rites and prayers that could create confusion between what constitutes marriage—which is the “exclusive, stable, and indissoluble union between a man and a woman, naturally open to the generation of children”[6]—and what contradicts it are inadmissible. This conviction is grounded in the perennial Catholic doctrine of marriage; it is only in this context that sexual relations find their natural, proper, and fully human meaning. The Church’s doctrine on this point remains firm. 5. This is also the understanding of marriage that is offered by the Gospel. For this reason, when it comes to blessings, the Church has the right and the duty to avoid any rite that might contradict this conviction or lead to confusion. Such is also the meaning of the Responsum of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which states that the Church does not have the power to impart blessings on unions of persons of the same sex. |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:18am On Dec 26, 2023 |
Iamzik: Even the pope's document agrees with you that the bible is clearly against it |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:17am On Dec 26, 2023 |
bigcasava1:Did you read the document? This is what the pope saids It is a matter of avoiding that “something that is not marriage is being recognized as marriage.”[5] Therefore, rites and prayers that could create confusion between what constitutes marriage—which is the “exclusive, stable, and indissoluble union between a man and a woman, naturally open to the generation of children”[6]—and what contradicts it are inadmissible. This conviction is grounded in the perennial Catholic doctrine of marriage; it is only in this context that sexual relations find their natural, proper, and fully human meaning. The Church’s doctrine on this point remains firm. 5. This is also the understanding of marriage that is offered by the Gospel. For this reason, when it comes to blessings, the Church has the right and the duty to avoid any rite that might contradict this conviction or lead to confusion. Such is also the meaning of the Responsum of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which states that the Church does not have the power to impart blessings on unions of persons of the same sex. you want more? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:15am On Dec 26, 2023 |
Empresa: did yo even read the document in the first place? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:14am On Dec 26, 2023 |
Larryndelaw:the cardinal who wrote the document already defended himself https://www.pillarcatholic.com/p/cardinal-fernandez-same-sex-blessing |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:13am On Dec 26, 2023 |
Belafonte:https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_ddf_doc_20231218_fiducia-supplicans_en.html |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:13am On Dec 26, 2023 |
bitbillionaire:5. This is also the understanding of marriage that is offered by the Gospel. For this reason, when it comes to blessings, the Church has the right and the duty to avoid any rite that might contradict this conviction or lead to confusion. Such is also the meaning of the Responsum of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which states that the Church does not have the power to impart blessings on unions of persons of the same sex should I continue? |
| Religion / Re: Same-sex Couples: Pope Was Misquoted By Enemies Of D Church - Archbishop Kaigama by Ubenedictus(m): 3:12am On Dec 26, 2023 |
Belafonte: the pope did not give a speech, he approved a document written byy some cardinals. https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_ddf_doc_20231218_fiducia-supplicans_en.html |
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